Condoning Piracy

[Johann]

Have read through some of the comments regarding the fact that PSU does not come with CD Key. It seems that players have been able to go online with a copied version of PSU for both PC and PS2 just by paying the Hunter's License.

It seems that many players here are ok with this fact with the justification that SEGA is still earning money through the Hunter's License.

Somehow, I still feel that it is quite unfair to those of us who bought the original version.

Would like to see further comments on this issue.

Thanks.

[Johann]

Sorry, wrong section. Please move this to the PSU General.

[Parn]

I agree with the sentiment, but there's little one can do about any of it. It really comes down to the integrity of the individual. After all, they're the ones that have to deal with the fact that they stole a $50 game. I wouldn't worry too much about it.

[AL1ST0R]

lol now you guys are complaining about piracy is there no ave you guys will venture ? did you pay for your copy of psu if so then sega got your 50.00-60.00 so why do you even care what some1 else does to get there copy my god you guys are very funny

[Parn]

I don't care, actually. You're OK with being a thief, and that's cool! Just don't be upset when someone robs your valuables someday.

[foamcup]

I would have had no problem pirating the game. Imagine my surprise when I get it home and see there is no protection. Oh well, if I had downloaded it, I wouldn't have been able to get on as early as I did and get my sexy low ID number. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_lol.gif 1404 baby!

[Sinue_v2]

Somehow, I still feel that it is quite unfair to those of us who bought the original version.

How is it unfair to you? What have you really invested into the game? What do you really lose by having people pirate? If you don't like that some people get things for free while you have to pay for them, then you might just want to buy a cabin in the woods and become a hermit for the rest of your life right now - because you're going to see a lot more of it. (and not just in the oh-so-obvious form of piracy)

In short - life isn't fair. Deal.

I could understand being upset at piraters if Sega had even bothered to make a modicum of effort to keep the game from being pirated - but no, they couldn't be bothered with it - which means either one of two things. 1. They were asking for it, and this lesson may serve to lessen their incompetancy in the future - or 2. Sega was counting on piracy to spread the game since they had no faith in it going the retail market.

Personally, I paid for the game. Twice, in fact, for two different versions. (Well, a copy for a friend - who when he pays me back is just going to get me the X360 version) Do, and should I, care that someone else is just pirating the game for free? No... absolutely not, at least, no farther than Sega themselves care. I already gave my money to Sega to support a franchise I love. I've done my part.

[McLaughlin]

On 2007-01-31 01:29, Johann wrote:
Have read through some of the comments regarding the fact that PSU does not come with CD Key. It seems that players have been able to go online with a copied version of PSU for both PC and PS2 just by paying the Hunter's License.

It seems that many players here are ok with this fact with the justification that SEGA is still earning money through the Hunter's License.

Somehow, I still feel that it is quite unfair to those of us who bought the original version.

Would like to see further comments on this issue.

Thanks.



I in no way condone piracy. There's no way to justify it. You may be paying the Guardian's License but you've still cheated them out of 50 bucks.

50$ + (9.99 x X) will still always be greater than 9.99 x X.

* X represents the number of months you pay for.

[Parn]

On 2007-01-31 10:53, Sinue_v2 wrote:
What do you really lose by having people pirate?
I'm not sure if you meant this in regards to PSU alone, or in general, but I'm assuming in general.

I know a lot of people here really liked the Dreamcast including yourself, and it would have stuck around longer if piracy had not been so easy and rampant like it was. Just about every individual I know in person who owned a Dreamcast at some point had pirated the majority of the games on the console. It in turn, helped destroy a company whose games I thoroughly enjoyed.

Just a thought, anyways.

[VanHalen]

if it gets more people to join im fine with it http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif

[Sinue_v2]

I'm not sure if you meant this in regards to PSU alone, or in general, but I'm assuming in general.

You assumed wrong. I was refering to PSU in particular. I'm well aware of the negetive effect of piracy on a large scale within the game industry. PSU however HAD anti-piracy measures built into the game, and they were deliberately taken out when localised to NA (and perhaps other regieons)

If Sega didn't want piracy to occur with PSU - then they should have damned well known better, and I personally don't care what kind of financial loss this game causes Sega of America as a result of that decision.

It's not like seriel #'s and AK's are really an effective means of piracy control - but at least it's an effort. If they don't even want to make an effort to keep their game from being pirated, then I have no sympathy for them when exactly that happens to their game.

If they didn't intend for the game to get pirated, then that decision was beyond the acceptable level of incompetance - even for Sega.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Sinue_v2 on 2007-01-31 11:16 ]</font>

[Parn]

Alright then, I retract my earlier post since I assumed incorrectly.

[Axel3792]

I don't know anyone irl, other than my PS2 version, who has a legit copy of PSU.

Sad.

Well, wait a minute. Three guys at my local Gamestop have it. Other than us, that's it >.<

[rvnscarlet]

I know someone that plays a pirated copy. I personally bought it cause I'm not cheap. But hey, "whatever's clever".

[ShinMaruku]

That Japanese version most certianly never had any protection it was funny. In Short ST don't care much bout that just subcriptions or they are daft. Want changes? Go to ST and grab them and go, "ARSORBI NO WA, NAKE, SAKABABE, MUSHNI SHINE SHINE!SHINE!SHINE!SHINE!"
(Watch somebody not get shine) XD

[jizaboz]

I gave SEGA 50$ for the game. I'd feel stupid if it was EA Games I gave it to though...

[4]

When it comes to a game with monthly costs, whatever can get more people to play is usually more lucrative in the end. Regardless of the initial $50, I'm sure there are plenty of people (like myself) who downloaded the game to check it out, and are now paying monthly fees, but wouldn't have given the game a chance if they had to buy it.

SEGA is also probably smart enough to know that they wouldn't have a fighting chance competing with World of Warcraft if it required everyone $60 ($50 game+$10 online) as the only option to start playing. IMO, it seems like a real smart move by SEGA.

On another note, the whole "I paid for the movie but he snuck in so now I'm mad" thing is so lame. Worry about your own deal and stop whining because in the end it doesn't affect your gameplay.

[bob02]

Walmart in canada (quebec) sell psu PC version for 20$can

and i didnt buy my copy... you really think it cost 10$ month for a server? lol... AND NO GM ONLINE!

[pineapple]

On 2007-01-31 05:41, Parn wrote:
I agree with the sentiment, but there's little one can do about any of it. It really comes down to the integrity of the individual. After all, they're the ones that have to deal with the fact that they stole a $50 game. I wouldn't worry too much about it.



Which is nothing compared to what many owe Adobe and maybe Corel and portalGraphics >.>

Personally I paid $60 for the 360 version though. I would encourage people to pay for a boxed copy of PSU because sales are going to be a factor in whether they decide to release expansions or other actual updates. They'll learn from their mistake if they notice more people are playing than actually bought the game though.

[Mattardo]

So I paid for my copy the full amount. I also bought a wireless keyboard to use with the PS2. I also bought my girlfriend a copy to play in the other room. In addition, I pay a monthly fee for both of us. The offline mode is laughable (who the fuck cares about Ethan Waber?) and can't be interchanged with the online mode. You pretty much HAVE to pay the fee to level your own character (and no I don't care about attaining extra mode). When version 2 came out on the Dreamcast, I refused to start paying because there was still cheating. Lo and behold, I decide to pay for this version and there's.... cheating! So steal copies all you want! Until Sega starts caring about me, I can't bring myself to care about Sega. And like it's been said, it's to their benefit to have the copies pirated. The offline game is NOT where they are going to make their money, obviously.

[jizaboz]

There's cheating in every damn game. And if they can't cheat... they can always buy currency on E-Bay or whatever for 10$ and buy anything they want.

[Mewn]

I imported both JP and US versions, but downloaded US while I waited for my copy to arrive so I could play. In that sense I pirated it still, but since I paid for a copy regardless I don't really care~

I was honestly surprised at the lack of a CD-key, but I can only reason that Sega thought the money was in Guardians Licence fees. I think it was stupid on their part, and wouldn't really blame anyone for pirating a game when Sega practically invites you to.

[Soukosa]

I doubt there'd be as many people playing the game if it wasn't piratable the way it is. 50 bucks is quite a bit to pay for something you aren't sure you're gonna like. I ended up downloading it myself to see what it's like but eventually bought a copy to be legit with it. If I wasn't able to do that I probably never would have bothered.

You should also realize that most of the money you payed to get the copy of it doesn't even go to Sega. Sega merely sells copies of the game to retailers at a fraction of the price you payed. The rest of the price is merely the retailer jacking up the price to make a profit. So in the end, Sega isn't losing as much as people are making it out to be. Besides, I'm sure that if weren't for the console versions or so big, they'd probably just put it up for download, like how Blue Burst was. Getting a legit copy is probably more of just getting it on a nice shiny disc with cheapishly made manual.

[Sephlock]

It's not like seriel #'s and AK's are really an effective means of piracy control


Automov Kalashnikovs?

[zanotam]

you do realize sega CHOOSE to not make pc/ps2 usa edition be hard to pirate. 360 requires teh disk in at all times and the JP ps2/pc HAS a cd key but the us doesn't.

[Shiro_Ryuu]

ok, I'm gonna admit that I also pirated the PC version, although I did buy the original copy of the PS2 version.

[ShinMaruku]

I'm sure many did to try this out as I had the JP version to get above the curb and then I did some crazy stuff once I shanked GameGuard. But now on the US I have the PS2 version and I'm quite happy with it. XD

[Tengoku]

It is obvious Sega didn't care about the piracy issue, in fact, it appears that they expected it. The complete lack of a CD key isn't just unusual, it's obviously abnormal. That doesn't happen by accident. The accusations of stupidity of SEGA's part are nothing short of silly. There is a huge decision-making process with checklists and points that must be met before a product is shipped. Not including a CD key is something that would be left out on purpose seeing as how it is virtually the industry standard.

I could be wrong, but not based on the evidence we have now.

On a side note, SEGA will make more money from me with my monthly dues than they would have from me buying the game. To be brutally honest, I would never have bought the game as I am not a PSO player in any way, shape, or form. The game didn't interest me, the idea of the game didn't interest me, and the pictures of the gameplay didn't interest me. A buddy said, "Here, you're tired of WoW, try this out and see if you like it." I loaded it up, ponied up my $10US, and went to town.

I do like it. The game is much more accessable than WoW and I'm happy to pay for it and pay for WoW at the same time. In fact , I play this more that I do the new WoW expansion. In short, my "piracy" is making SEGA more money than they would have made without it.

Was SEGA stupid for not including a CD key? I don't think so... after all, they're getting my money.

[Gamemako]

Considering the huge success of many F2P MMOs, it makes business sense sometimes to use your software as a loss leader and get the cash back elsewhere. Since they get FAR MORE cash for selling you a subscription, the only reasons they don't just give it away are the bandwidth costs (which would be HUGE) and the offline mode (but this less than the other, I'd wager).

[Sephlock]

F2P?

[DarkSeph]

......frankly........i find this kinda cool.........not the whole pirating crap cuz I am gonna buy the actual pc game......but 2 years from now when everything shuts down and I'm sad.....I'm gonna be able to hack the pc version and have EVERYTHING! and play by myself when I feel like it.......or setup a network and play with some friends..... Totally harmless seeing as I will do it when it's all shut down.......what do you people think about doing that? I seriously want to know if someone finds that wrong........it's like I say about hacking in any form.....as long as it doesn't involve ANYONE but YOU it's ok......right?

[DarkSeph]

....OR....I will just move on to the next PSU-PSO PS Whatever....installment http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif....yeah, I'm thinking that is what wil happen

[THERAPIST]

On 2007-01-31 17:30, Sephlock wrote:
F2P?

[Gamemako]

Short for Free to Play. Many, many new Korean RPGs are F2P games, meaning they don't charge a monthly subscription. They make their money by selling "premium" items to their customers. Some F2P MMOs are:

Rappelz
Infinity Online
Gunz
Monato Espirit
Travia Online
Fly for Fun
Rakion
Silkroad Online
Space Cowboy
Nostale

There are quite a number of them now, it seems -- this is by no means a complete list. You just have to know where to look.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Gamemako on 2007-01-31 19:07 ]</font>

[Schubalts]

And more F2P games are on the way from China, too. But that's a bit off-topic.

[BahnKnakyu]

On 2007-01-31 12:02, ShinMaruku wrote:
Want changes? Go to ST and grab them and go, "ARSORBI NO WA, NAKE, SAKABABE, MUSHNI SHINE SHINE!SHINE!SHINE!SHINE!"
(Watch somebody not get shine) XD



Being someone who competitively plays King of Fighters in the arcades, I'd like to correct this quote.

"Asobi wa owari da! Nakabe, sakabe, soshite, SHINE!"

[Meep]

On 2007-01-31 14:13, Sounomi wrote:
I doubt there'd be as many people playing the game if it wasn't piratable the way it is. 50 bucks is quite a bit to pay for something you aren't sure you're gonna like. I ended up downloading it myself to see what it's like but eventually bought a copy to be legit with it. If I wasn't able to do that I probably never would have bothered.

You should also realize that most of the money you payed to get the copy of it doesn't even go to Sega. Sega merely sells copies of the game to retailers at a fraction of the price you payed. The rest of the price is merely the retailer jacking up the price to make a profit. So in the end, Sega isn't losing as much as people are making it out to be. Besides, I'm sure that if weren't for the console versions or so big, they'd probably just put it up for download, like how Blue Burst was. Getting a legit copy is probably more of just getting it on a nice shiny disc with cheapishly made manual.



Have you worked in retail? Retailers don't make THAT much on a video game sale. Retailers have to pay their employees. No... they are not there because it's cool to hang out behind the counter at EB.

Yes a CD/DVD costs less than a buck to make, but you have to pay the people who made the game. It takes many months of man hours to produce a game. Video games are a business, if it loses or breaks even, it's not reasonable to assume they'll keep making games out of the kindness of their heart (and own wallet).

Sure you can look at it as the retailer already paid the game makers, so you're not keeping money from the people who make games right? Wrong. If the retailer can't sell the first shipment, they won't order more, so it is a loss for the game maker. Further more, if one game did horrible and lost the retailer money, would they order future games of the series? No.

Just expanding on the things already said.

And simply put... Piracy is wrong, anyone who says otherwise either doesn't understand that it costs money to produce a game, NOT JUST THE COST OF A CD, or is simply lying to themselves because they'd rather steal it.

If everybody pirated, video games would not exist... or the one retail copy would cost the million dollars it took to make the game...

[DarkSeph]

First off....Piracy of video games is.....BAD!.....there, final word! Note: I said Video Games....Music files can go to #$%^ cuz I aint paying no $1 a freaking song.....Go #$%^ yourself Apple http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_lol.gif ok, now on to what I need to know....

Ok, I'm gonna post this in 2 places to make sure I get an answer one way or the other....

My question is.......I have seen the Hacked Clothing for example for the PC version of PSU....and....it seems like it was done offline Right?..... The reason I want to know this is....I want to pick up a copy of the PC PSU game and keep it mint for the next couple years (or at least until I change my mind possibly and sell it)....but when these servers actually shut down someday....I want to be able to have my STUFF! As I'm sure everyone does....and I just don't see that happening unless SEGA has a Heart and lets us somehow save our data....which, is actually a possibility........but what I want to know is if they dont and they screw us out of all the really FUN stuff in PSU by only being able to play story mode.....can we hack Everything OFFLINE so we can still have our Chars and play with everything we want to? Or aside from the Missions and obvious server changes to things, are their certain weapons, clothings, etc that we cannot get off the CD alone?

Cuz if say the Pumpkin Head Rod or other certain weapons, clothes, etc are only available with their servers then.....I am not gonna buy the PC version at all and I guess...just enjoy it while it lasts...... I have a feeling it might end up being like my chromehounds game where I got EVERYTHING online and when SEGA shuts down the server I am screwed cuz the offline version just plain sucks!

Ok......hopefully people will stay level headed and give me straight answers instead of viewing me as bad for wanting to hack the game someday.......just KEEP IN MIND I want to do it ONLY when they shut down the servers YEARS from now..... And hey, they did it to the Gamecube so don't say it wont happen

[Deja_Vu]

I think the waiting 50 hours for it to download with a DSL connection is punishment enough. A lot of things are pirated these days and it's not really a big deal anymore.

[AlieNxxxxxxxx]

cry? I am 100% sure that you download music illegally, just like EVERYONE else in the world.
Downloading / rewriting a game onto a CD is the same thing. It is just like downloading limewire PRO on the shitty limewire. Or downloading paintshop PRO which costs like 120 bucks for FREE on ares or limewire.
Nothing you can do about it.