PS2/PC: The economy [Archive]

Kura-X

Feb 4, 2007, 05:32 AM

So, I've been lurking around for a while and I see a lot of people complaing about the PS2/PC economy and how there's so much meseta. So, I've come to a simple and easy way to try to fix it.

Throw it away.

The amount of hacked money on the PS2/PC market inflates prices and causes people to get bored really quickly and leave the game. Why? because instead of playing the game like they're supposed to, they buy everything they want for millions of worthless meseta and then they're done.

So why not just throw it away? Use the inflated prices of photons to get tons and tons of money, then abandon it on a feild. I've done this several times, but one person doing it isnt going to make a difference. If more people do this, we can offset the number of meseta generated and give meseta back it's value.

I want to see affordable prices in player shops again. So if you want the economy back to how it was, get up and do something about it.

Weakness

Feb 4, 2007, 05:36 AM

And then the "hackers" can just go get 99,999,999 more and the world back to where it was except you are poor now.

Economies thrive off of greed, getting people to throw away their money isn't going to solve anything. In my opinion just let us PS2 players go live with the 360/JP players and let the PC rot. They are the ones who are ruining it.

Kura-X

Feb 4, 2007, 05:40 AM

considering I'm on the PC and have no intention of starting an entire new account and wasting $900 of REAL money to get the game on x-box, i cant just leave this alone. As far as i know, the gameguard update stopped the hacking of meseta a while ago, therefore this plan can work if it is put into effect.

Itsuki

Feb 4, 2007, 05:41 AM

On 2007-02-04 02:36, Weakness wrote:
And then the "hackers" can just go get 99,999,999 more and the world back to where it was except you are poor now.

Economies thrive off of greed, getting people to throw away their money isn't going to solve anything. In my opinion just let us PS2 players go live with the 360/JP players and let the PC rot. They are the ones who are ruining it.

The problem is, its only easier to hack on the PC. Given a little bit of time, it could be just as easy to hack on the PS2. Just nobody has put the effort into it because they can much easier accomplish their goals using PC.

Its already been proven that you can even hack on 360. But hacking on 360 can get your entire live account banned, and from what I hear, even your hardware banned. And most people wouldn't dare risk that.

EDIT: And GG was rolled back. They're hacking meseta again fine. Don't ask me why they did that, defies most people's logic.

[ This Message was edited by: Itsuki-chan on 2007-02-04 02:45 ]

Weakness

Feb 4, 2007, 06:13 AM

On 2007-02-04 02:41, Itsuki-chan wrote:

The problem is, its only easier to hack on the PC. Given a little bit of time, it could be just as easy to hack on the PS2. Just nobody has put the effort into it because they can much easier accomplish their goals using PC.

Its already been proven that you can even hack on 360. But hacking on 360 can get your entire live account banned, and from what I hear, even your hardware banned. And most people wouldn't dare risk that.

EDIT: And GG was rolled back. They're hacking meseta again fine. Don't ask me why they did that, defies most people's logic.

[ This Message was edited by: Itsuki-chan on 2007-02-04 02:45 ]

Indeed you can hack on the other systems, but at least PSU uses DNAS (I guess you could include GG as an anti cheating device... but yeah) which should prevent any script kiddies from using a gameshark/AR/whatever it is called now. They could very well just use an ISP ban for PS2 players who break the rules.

The meseta hack is actually a part of the software, which PC players can more freely access. Tossing the PS2 over to the 360 servers wouldn't really harm much, not allowing you to keep meseta/items, but maybe just your character levels and such, or maybe even a complete restart.

In all honesty I would be perfectly willing to start over my character if it meant a more reasonable economy.

And as far as the GG roll back I believe there were problems with the new version. So they went back to the old version (which obviously doesn't do much) because it was "working".

Jae

Feb 4, 2007, 06:32 AM

Sure you can throw away your money for the greater good. That doesn't mean the next guy will. You'll just be shooting yourself in the foot if you threw all of your money away.

I wanted the economy to succeed too, but it's already beyond help IMHO.

Kimil

Feb 4, 2007, 07:00 AM

sega could just wipe everyone's messeta above 1-5 mil

Shinzakura

Feb 4, 2007, 09:38 AM

I'd love for the economy to become reasonable, but until Sega dumps GG like a bad date and gets with a real anti-cheat service, it's never going to happen.

That being said, to do a meseta wipe for any amount would nuke the hackers, but would also penalize those who made their money legitimately (like me), and while I wouldn't quit, I can guarantee that will probably be the last straw on the Ollaka's back for more than a few people.

[ This Message was edited by: Shinzakura on 2007-02-04 07:00 ]

Ooga

Feb 4, 2007, 09:42 AM

On 2007-02-04 04:00, Kimil wrote:
sega could just wipe everyone's messeta above 1-5 mil

Of course, that would fuck the people that got that much legitimately. Sure, the origin of most of it probably wasn't legit, but if people could get five million by just playing and earning it or selling things for fair, reasonable prices, why punish them by taking it away?

R2D6battlebot

Feb 4, 2007, 10:24 AM

the only real thing we can do is wait it out. The economy will stabilize once GameGuard gets itself together, and meseta hacking is permanently fixed. Once that happens, the meseta will gradually dissipate itself going into PMs and NPC stores on Boards and such. We can only watch and wait at this point.

SolomonGrundy

Feb 4, 2007, 10:51 AM

Why blame Sega for not being able to stop the hackers? Even if game guard was up and running in the correct version I can guess that the hackers find another way.

I blame the hackers. And by the way, I chose Xbox360 over PS2 when I found out PC/PS2 were playing on the same servers. And it meant I had to shell out $400 for a 360.

Wheatpenny

Feb 4, 2007, 12:21 PM

On 2007-02-04 07:51, SolomonGrundy wrote:
Why blame Sega for not being able to stop the hackers? Even if game guard was up and running in the correct version I can guess that the hackers find another way.

I blame the hackers. And by the way, I chose Xbox360 over PS2 when I found out PC/PS2 were playing on the same servers. And it meant I had to shell out $400 for a 360.

why my friend it is quite simple, Sega used Game Guard before on PSO BB ( if i am not mistaken) and it got hacked all to crap. Thus meaning Sega knew that Game Guard was not very good security to use. hence knowing this in advance they still used Game Guard to protect the PC version of PSU. So in conclusion it is Sega's DIRECT FAULT for not taking their buisiness to another security provider.

PrinceBrightstar

Feb 4, 2007, 12:34 PM

Everyone keeps talking about using something other than game guard. Can anyone name a program that could work without requiring sega to completely reprogram the game? The reason being that could completely unsynchronize the PC and PS2 versions and make them incompatible. (Or PS2 owners would have to swap their disks)

Randomness

Feb 4, 2007, 12:42 PM

Actually, I'd rather see all meseta get set to something like 10k. Not a total wipe, but it leaves enough for PP charges and healing items.

Not that Bruce B wouldnt get everyone back up to a decent sum.

Oh, and delete every S rank other than released ones, of course. And, rather than straight out fixing meseta hacks, make a trap. Get something set up where when the hack occurs, it logs thier name and wipes all thier meseta!

DonMakaveli

Feb 4, 2007, 12:52 PM

Ya know what, im tired of that "economy is @!$&" bla bla bla, i've played till almost lvl 40 without any money on my pockets, cuz everything gone to feed my pm's, i had roughly any money till lvl 50 cuz i kept it for boards!, now im almost lvl 70 and with all those sacrifices i made my shop, made lots of weapons, and today i got more than 1 stack of 99 Mil, so stop with that "u got 99mil u hax0r" bullshit, cuz there's lotta ppl that worked really hard for that!

ljkkjlcm9

Feb 4, 2007, 12:54 PM

10k? I can get that in two S rank runs. Come on people. I've legitly got millions doing runs over and over again. Wipes are just stupid, and I honestly don't see how it ruins anything. Why does some other guy having a 9* weapon that he spent lots of money on trying to make it, ruin your game? Honestly I don't get what all the fuss is about.

THE JACKEL

PMB960

Feb 4, 2007, 01:18 PM

I honestly just ignore it. I just charge 360 prices in my shop like other people I talk with on PSU. It doesn't really matter if it is hacked or not since getting 50 meseta for photons is perfectly reasonable. Even if it is hacked does it really matter? I just basically ignore the whole thing. I still manage to get good equipment for my chars, although not as much as some people. It is still fun to play and whatever. I can still join random parties and keep up with everyone. So does it really matter that I only have 50K between all my chars.

Feb 4, 2007, 02:21 PM

On 2007-02-04 03:13, Weakness wrote:
In all honesty I would be perfectly willing to start over my character if it meant a more reasonable economy.

Problem being, not everyone would.

Randomness

Feb 4, 2007, 02:46 PM

On 2007-02-04 09:54, ljkkjlcm9 wrote:
10k? I can get that in two S rank runs. Come on people. I've legitly got millions doing runs over and over again. Wipes are just stupid, and I honestly don't see how it ruins anything. Why does some other guy having a 9* weapon that he spent lots of money on trying to make it, ruin your game? Honestly I don't get what all the fuss is about.

THE JACKEL

The point is to wipe all the hacked meseta out, and to get the prices on stuff back in line with 360/JP, where stuff costs reasonable amounts.

And you can get 14k in two b rank runs of bruce, about 30 min, but thats not the point.

CelestialBlade

Feb 4, 2007, 03:03 PM

All hackers are going to get bored once they see that they're bored with the game because they have everything, and that they're not getting other people to quit. Sure, more will come and hack, but not in the great influx like we've seen. They will get bored and leave, and won't affect you anymore. Not a big deal.

Also, let's not forget that GameGuard *did* fix the meseta duping problem, and just because all the bugs aren't worked out with it doesn't mean we're never going to see it again. In time it'll be implemented once again. And when it does, sure it won't get rid of all the already duped meseta, but in time it will disappear gradually. It'll be like a fountain with the pump shut off. Slowly we'll return to equilibrium and while I'm sure other hacks would be found, I doubt we'll see anything as extreme as meseta duping again. Another flaw that big would've been spotted by now, with how heavily we've been hit by hackers.

On the economy: Shop around, there are plenty of stores with good prices. It doesn't take all that long to hunt around for 7* stuff that's about 45k. I don't think I've paid over 60k for any of my 7* stuff. It's like shopping for things in the real world, you can try to find electronics at Circuit City for much higher than you're going to find them at some online emporium like Newegg. It's how it's always worked. Persistance pays off.

panzer_unit

Feb 5, 2007, 11:56 AM

It's not like you need anything besides NPC shop equipment anyway. With a decent level and good PA skills you'll do fine even with green weapons.

If you want bling beyond that raise a PM to manufacture it, in fact this is pretty much required since the elemental photon market's gone dry and it's almost impossible to find elemental melee weapons (well, anything under 9* at least) in player shops any more.

_Deliverance_

Feb 5, 2007, 11:59 AM

lmfao @ "throw it away". Get real.

Garnet_Moon

Feb 5, 2007, 12:09 PM

Uh no. I will not throw it away. I mass produce alot of high star items, and this free meseta I get in my shop funds it all. Throw it all away? Yeah. You need brain surgery.

'sides, if you use your shop to your advantage you can get max meseta in all 9 slots you have. 4 Chars, 4 PM's, and storage. Being able to afford all your synths and as many tries as it takes is great. The stuff that costs the most can be easily farmed.

Yamata-senba took me 9 tries. 8 failed, the final worked... with a gimpy 14% fire. I don't know if you've all looked at the NPC price on thos resins, but it cost a ton to do that. Since my meseta is most likely duped and I have so much of it from my shop, I didn't cry as much as I would have if it was my money. I cried, sure, but not too much.

EDIT: PSO was a great game because you could afford everything easily because of how much meseta dropped. I loved my Charge Mechguns, and in all honesty, I don't see how that ultimate PA will work when we get it with OUT this abundance of meseta lying around. I really don't see how it'd work.

All you had to work for in PSO was rares. Same thing in PSU, except, you have to work for everything now. THAT is what is turning people off. NOT inflation. Inflation is helping us, believe it or not.

I, for one, rue the day that duping meseta can never be done again.

[ This Message was edited by: Garnet_Moon on 2007-02-05 09:13 ]

Sychosis

Feb 5, 2007, 12:22 PM

On 2007-02-05 09:09, Garnet_Moon wrote:
Inflation is helping us, believe it or not.

I, for one, rue the day that duping meseta can never be done again.

http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_lol.gif

That is some backwards thinking you have there.

Garnet_Moon

Feb 5, 2007, 12:24 PM

On 2007-02-05 09:22, Sychosis wrote:

On 2007-02-05 09:09, Garnet_Moon wrote:
Inflation is helping us, believe it or not.

I, for one, rue the day that duping meseta can never be done again.

http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_lol.gif

That is some backwards thinking you have there.

Well, considering I farm all of my items that I need(photons, copernia, etc) this inflation helps me. It's nothing but profit. The people whoa re too lazy to farm deserve to pay the price. Because THEY are the reason stuff is so high. They abuse the system.

Errorrrr

Feb 5, 2007, 12:38 PM

Uh.... not like other games don't have inflation... FFXI's inflation was 20X before SquareEnix banned the gil sellers... same with WoW... and every single other MMORPG... actually this is good because it keeps the RMT away...

Since meseta is so easy to get, RMTers dont' see a reason to get into it.... now if Meseta is sacred, you'd see mass RMTers in PSU.... it'd be the same thing all over again. since there always rich people who can afford these virutal currency at premium price. It doesn't take EVERYONE to buy at inflated price. Only a few need to buy at inflated price and EVERYTHING will be inflated.

As for banning... Isn't Sega banning credit cards for the PC users? if not, they should start doing that... also... all the meseta on ebay seems to be gone now.

[ This Message was edited by: Errorrrr on 2007-02-05 09:41 ]

rvzero

Feb 5, 2007, 12:41 PM

It'd would the best if current meseta was wiped after they FIXED the duping... and each player would get a fixed amount of money based on their level... <.<

McLaughlin

Feb 5, 2007, 03:04 PM

JAFO22000

Feb 5, 2007, 03:51 PM

On 2007-02-05 12:04, Obsidian_Knight wrote:

On 2007-02-04 09:52, DonMakaveli wrote:
Ya know what, im tired of that "economy is @!$&" bla bla bla, i've played till almost lvl 40 without any money on my pockets, cuz everything gone to feed my pm's, i had roughly any money till lvl 50 cuz i kept it for boards!, now im almost lvl 70 and with all those sacrifices i made my shop, made lots of weapons, and today i got more than 1 stack of 99 Mil, so stop with that "u got 99mil u hax0r" bullshit, cuz there's lotta ppl that worked really hard for that!

Yeah, I can see how selling 10 Ray photons for 500k could be so back-breaking.

LMAO! I was thinking the same thing. Just like all the people who think they "worked hard" for their synth items. It cost them next to nothing to raise all four of their PM's to pure and the mats basically cost them nothing. MAYBE they have to do 10 or so runs to get mats that they can't find in the NPC shops. That is not "working hard". And if you think that way, you'd find the 360 version too "hard" for you....

Try failing 4 Phantom Lines on 360. Or 7 Phantom rifles in a row. That's heartbreak right there!

Rooroo

Feb 5, 2007, 04:56 PM

On 2007-02-05 12:04, Obsidian_Knight wrote:

On 2007-02-04 09:52, DonMakaveli wrote:
Ya know what, im tired of that "economy is @!$&" bla bla bla, i've played till almost lvl 40 without any money on my pockets, cuz everything gone to feed my pm's, i had roughly any money till lvl 50 cuz i kept it for boards!, now im almost lvl 70 and with all those sacrifices i made my shop, made lots of weapons, and today i got more than 1 stack of 99 Mil, so stop with that "u got 99mil u hax0r" bullshit, cuz there's lotta ppl that worked really hard for that!

Yeah, I can see how selling 10 Ray photons for 500k could be so back-breaking.

Yeah, people's idea of 'hard' work is completely skewed. Of course, there is no question that work is required; 99 million isn't just going to magically appear like that (unless you hacked it). But the fact is, the work/reward ratio is waay off the scale, and it has been that way long enough for people to start getting used to it. So if things were suddenly to return to normal, there'll be lots of complainers too. It's a no win situation.

Rooroo

Feb 5, 2007, 04:58 PM

On 2007-02-05 13:56, Rooroo wrote:

On 2007-02-05 12:04, Obsidian_Knight wrote:

On 2007-02-04 09:52, DonMakaveli wrote:
Ya know what, im tired of that "economy is @!$&" bla bla bla, i've played till almost lvl 40 without any money on my pockets, cuz everything gone to feed my pm's, i had roughly any money till lvl 50 cuz i kept it for boards!, now im almost lvl 70 and with all those sacrifices i made my shop, made lots of weapons, and today i got more than 1 stack of 99 Mil, so stop with that "u got 99mil u hax0r" bullshit, cuz there's lotta ppl that worked really hard for that!

Yeah, I can see how selling 10 Ray photons for 500k could be so back-breaking.

Yeah, people's idea of 'hard' work is completely skewed. Of course, there is no question that work is required; 99 million isn't just going to magically appear like that (unless you hacked it). But the fact is, the work/reward ratio is waay off the scale, and it has been that way long enough for people to start getting used to it. So if things were suddenly to return to normal, there'll be lots of complainers too. It's a no win situation. Well, I'd still prefer it if things went back to normal

Soukosa

Feb 5, 2007, 05:16 PM

On 2007-02-05 09:09, Garnet_Moon wrote:
EDIT: PSO was a great game because you could afford everything easily because of how much meseta dropped. I loved my Charge Mechguns, and in all honesty, I don't see how that ultimate PA will work when we get it with OUT this abundance of meseta lying around. I really don't see how it'd work.

All you had to work for in PSO was rares. Same thing in PSU, except, you have to work for everything now. THAT is what is turning people off. NOT inflation. Inflation is helping us, believe it or not.

I, for one, rue the day that duping meseta can never be done again.

[ This Message was edited by: Garnet_Moon on 2007-02-05 09:13 ]

I agree with this alot. Part of the reason why I tried out PSU was in hopes of finding another ORPG that didn't eat up all of my time to get what I want in it. I just want to be play to enjoy the game without having to dump a ton of effort into it. If I really wanted to waste my life away on a game like that I'd have stayed on RO. It's just a pity that ST didn't feel this same way while making the game.

Itoshi

Feb 5, 2007, 05:22 PM

Sadly, I've miss used the Economy here. I've seen photons for 200k and I seel mine for 80k and have made a decent profit. I'm starting to feel bad, but most people I saw were REALLY over pricing, and I needed the money.

Meh. I really don't know.

Sinue_v2

Feb 5, 2007, 05:34 PM

All hackers are going to get bored once they see that they're bored with the game because they have everything, and that they're not getting other people to quit.

Yeah, like TMG who have been around pretty much since DC v.1? Yeah, they got bored and moved on... TMG is just a urban myth. = /

Even if a cheater does get bored and moves on, there's always going to be two more who take their place. Waiting them out is simply going to leave you waiting.

but at least PSU uses DNAS (I guess you could include GG as an anti cheating device... but yeah) which should prevent any script kiddies from using a gameshark/AR/whatever it is called now.

DNAS is a bigger joke than GameGuard. It was cracked way back when Socom II hit and still hasn't been updated. It's really nothing more than an anti-piracy check at this point.

The amount of hacked money on the PS2/PC market inflates prices and causes people to get bored really quickly and leave the game. Why? because instead of playing the game like they're supposed to, they buy everything they want for millions of worthless meseta and then they're done.

Actually, it would be somewhat the other way around. Most of PSU's customers (at this point) are old PSO players who aren't used to having the meseta grind, weapon synth failure after failure, ect. They just want to jump in and play. Many of the MMO fans who switched over to PSU have gone back due to the recently released expansion to WoW, or were simply dissatisfied with the lack of content. Adding "S-Rank Difficulty" to already released areas does not hold one's interest the same way that new and diverse areas do. Compaired to many of the MMO's which people moved from to play PSU - PSU is a pretty sorry competetor.

Feb 5, 2007, 05:44 PM

On 2007-02-05 14:34, Sinue_v2 wrote:
Compaired to many of the MMO's which people moved from to play PSU - PSU is a pretty sorry competetor.

Opinion.

Sinue_v2

Feb 5, 2007, 05:52 PM

Yes, obviously, but one apperantly many people share since the userbase of PSU has dropped steadily since it's release.. expecially since the Burning Crusade has come out.

So yes.. many people share the opinion that PSU is a far lesser game than other MMO's/MO's.

Of course, we could make this a factual point-by-point analasis of the more well known MMO's/MO's compairing such things as customer support, glitches, patches, economy, ect... but I have a feeling that PSU would still come up short.

[ This Message was edited by: Sinue_v2 on 2007-02-05 14:55 ]

JAFO22000

Feb 5, 2007, 05:52 PM

On 2007-02-05 14:16, Sounomi wrote:
I agree with this alot. Part of the reason why I tried out PSU was in hopes of finding another ORPG that didn't eat up all of my time to get what I want in it. I just want to be play to enjoy the game without having to dump a ton of effort into it. If I really wanted to waste my life away on a game like that I'd have stayed on RO. It's just a pity that ST didn't feel this same way while making the game.

Yes, it's a pity that they wanted to make the game last longer than 2 months. I hate them for that because I want everything NOW! I need S ranks NOW! I want 99 kajillion meseta NOW! Maybe then I can "work hard" and have one of each weapon with each element at 50%.

ORPG's are not casual games. At least, I can't think of one that is (I haven't played all of them, so I don't know.

JAFO22000

Feb 5, 2007, 05:57 PM

...while 360's userbase is steadily climbing. Perhaps ST should concentrate on making this franchise console only. It started as an offline console franchise (SMS and Genesis), became the first ORPG on a console (DC) and gained it's largest following on another console (GC).

I don't think this franchise is appealing enough to the PC gamer. I mean, with ALL of the other choices for ORPG's on PC, PSU is at the bottom of the barrel. However, on PS2 and 360, it's one of only a few choices.

Ffuzzy-Logik

Feb 5, 2007, 06:09 PM

On 2007-02-04 09:52, DonMakaveli wrote:
Ya know what, im tired of that "economy is @!$&" bla bla bla, i've played till almost lvl 40 without any money on my pockets, cuz everything gone to feed my pm's, i had roughly any money till lvl 50 cuz i kept it for boards!, now im almost lvl 70 and with all those sacrifices i made my shop, made lots of weapons, and today i got more than 1 stack of 99 Mil, so stop with that "u got 99mil u hax0r" bullshit, cuz there's lotta ppl that worked really hard for that!

And there are other people like myself who have arguably "worked" harder, and only have 1.5 million, because we refuse to sell 300 Meseta items (i.e. elemental photons) for 100 times the price they should be.

On 2007-02-05 14:57, JAFO22000 wrote:
...while 360's userbase is steadily climbing. Perhaps ST should concentrate on making this franchise console only. It started as an offline console franchise (SMS and Genesis), became the first ORPG on a console (DC) and gained it's largest following on another console (GC).

I don't think this franchise is appealing enough to the PC gamer. I mean, with ALL of the other choices for ORPG's on PC, PSU is at the bottom of the barrel. However, on PS2 and 360, it's one of only a few choices.

Hell no. They should really do the exact opposite, and make it PC only. I feel sorry for all the PS2 players who will never be able to prove their rares are legit with pictures.

[ This Message was edited by: Ffuzzy-Logik on 2007-02-05 15:16 ]

Sinue_v2

Feb 5, 2007, 06:13 PM

...while 360's userbase is steadily climbing.

There's a few explanations...

1. Some PC/PS2 users have switched over to get away from the "OMGWTFHAX". It's been seen as somewhat of a "safehaven". :rolleye:

2. Sega recently re-released the online demo for the marketplace which is drawing in new customers. The population of the demo is easily 2-3x the population of the 360/PC/PS2 servers combined.

3. The X360 doesn't have the direct competition of WoW, Guild Wars, and many other MMO's/MO's on a seperate gaming platform. They have FFXI, however, who's userbase has grown much more over the holiday season than PSU's has. However, I'm not sure how many of those players are solely attributed to the X360 and how many of them are from the PC.

It started as an offline console franchise (SMS and Genesis)

It was also released for the PC after a time, with Phantasy Star IV actually having it's own dedicated PC release. Of course, PSIV was a big game - and was even pirated onto the NES and sold on the black market in Hong Kong.

Also.. the Dreamcast had the largest userbase of any recent online Phantasy Star title. When it first launched, server populations as high as 12,000 at off-hours, whereas PSO for the NGC could barely top 8,000 at peak hours. The Xbox version sold far less due to the perception of "paying twice" (Live, an the HL). Neither Ep III or Blue Burst reached even half of those numbers IIRC. Phantasy Star Universe, with both the 360 and PS2/PC combined, still couldn't top PSO's Dreamcast v.1 debut.

Ffuzzy-Logik

Feb 5, 2007, 06:29 PM

On 2007-02-05 14:16, Sounomi wrote:

On 2007-02-05 09:09, Garnet_Moon wrote:
EDIT: PSO was a great game because you could afford everything easily because of how much meseta dropped. I loved my Charge Mechguns, and in all honesty, I don't see how that ultimate PA will work when we get it with OUT this abundance of meseta lying around. I really don't see how it'd work.

All you had to work for in PSO was rares. Same thing in PSU, except, you have to work for everything now. THAT is what is turning people off. NOT inflation. Inflation is helping us, believe it or not.

I, for one, rue the day that duping meseta can never be done again.

[ This Message was edited by: Garnet_Moon on 2007-02-05 09:13 ]

I agree with this alot. Part of the reason why I tried out PSU was in hopes of finding another ORPG that didn't eat up all of my time to get what I want in it. I just want to be play to enjoy the game without having to dump a ton of effort into it. If I really wanted to waste my life away on a game like that I'd have stayed on RO. It's just a pity that ST didn't feel this same way while making the game.

I cannot disagree more. It is easy enough to get by without selling things for crazy inflated prices. I don't sell stuff for crazy prices, yet I have successfully synthed about 15 7* weapons, with elemental percent somewhere in the 10-24% range.

Sure, you won't have an arsenal of 25 9* weapons all with at least 44%, but you don't need to have that. Going by the original intent of the game, you shouldn't have nearly that much yet.

It's no wonder why people complain about a lack of S-Rank weapons, when they've already got the equipment they shouldn't be able to afford for at least 2-3 more months. I'm not concerned with S-Ranks yet. I'd be overjoyed to get some more 8-9* weapons.

The game is not fun when you have everything you want. The entire allure of PSO and PSU is having some weapon or other item that you really, really want, but not being able to get it. It's why we hunted rares with crazy droprates on PSO, and it's why we should be doing 20 S-Rank missions just to be able to afford one 7* weapon from the NPC shop. With infinite money, there's no reason to do missions. With no reason to do missions, there's no reason to play the game.

I want to have to work for every single good item I get. By work, I do not mean solo Linear Line C and sell the photons I find for a total of 20 million. I mean doing Bruce B 250 times. In other words, I do not want the game to be easy. I'm content with how difficult it is, but I'm also pretty damn frustrated when I see people with ten times better equipment than me who didn't do a hundredth as much work.

Jife_Jifremok

Feb 5, 2007, 06:43 PM

Having to do Bruce 250 times or whatever doesn't make the game hard, it just makes the game time-consuming and the players burnt out on Bruce. This game isn't fun enough to be spending so many hours on JUST for earning meseta through gameplay, since even megid dodgeball becomes mindless and dull after a short time. If it weren't for the inflation, I'd be playing this game a lot less. Of course, if it weren't for some of the people in this game, I probably would have gotten bored and quit anyway.

But thanks to the inflation, I am having fun using this inflation to help my gun shop that sells 3* to 8* weapons that beat NPC prices so that newbies don't have to grind so damn much just to get another weapon.

My 9* weapons are another story. I have to keep jacking up the prices to avoid operating at a loss...they're still below 1 mil though and I never bothered to look at the typical 9* price. I'm probably STILL operating at a loss. (I'm too lazy to do the math. That's BORING!) Thanks to the inflation though, I am able to sell something for a stupid high price and negate this loss.

Errorrrr

Feb 5, 2007, 06:43 PM

FFXI's new population is just as pitiful as PSU if not less. By now, FFXI's newbie area are deserted... most of the "new" FFXI population are coming from RMT (Real money Trade) accounts, on ebay, markeedragon, ige, etc.

Soukosa

Feb 5, 2007, 06:52 PM

On 2007-02-05 14:52, JAFO22000 wrote:
Yes, it's a pity that they wanted to make the game last longer than 2 months. I hate them for that because I want everything NOW! I need S ranks NOW! I want 99 kajillion meseta NOW! Maybe then I can "work hard" and have one of each weapon with each element at 50%.

ORPG's are not casual games. At least, I can't think of one that is (I haven't played all of them, so I don't know.

Never played PSO I take it? Only 4 versions (ignoring ep 3 which was pathetic) that lasted quite awhile and never had any issues with it drying out. It was also much more casual than other MMOs. You didn't have dedicate alot of your time to get some where but there was still quite a bit to it that kept things interesting.

Ffuzzy-Logik

Feb 5, 2007, 06:58 PM

On 2007-02-05 15:43, Jife_Jifremok wrote:
Having to do Bruce 250 times or whatever doesn't make the game hard, it just makes the game time-consuming and the players burnt out on Bruce. This game isn't fun enough to be spending so many hours on JUST for earning meseta through gameplay, since even megid dodgeball becomes mindless and dull after a short time. If it weren't for the inflation, I'd be playing this game a lot less. Of course, if it weren't for some of the people in this game, I probably would have gotten bored and quit anyway.

But thanks to the inflation, I am having fun using this inflation to help my gun shop that sells 3* to 8* weapons that beat NPC prices so that newbies don't have to grind so damn much just to get another weapon.

My 9* weapons are another story. I have to keep jacking up the prices to avoid operating at a loss...they're still below 1 mil though and I never bothered to look at the typical 9* price. I'm probably STILL operating at a loss. (I'm too lazy to do the math. That's BORING!) Thanks to the inflation though, I am able to sell something for a stupid high price and negate this loss.

PSO and PSU are all about grinding the same missions thousands of times. You don't have to do that, sure, but you'll never have the best equipment then. Rather, you shouldn't have the best equipment.

In my opinion, due to the high prices of materials and boards, items 7-8* and up were never inteded to be sold for profit, but merely traded for other similar items.

Furthermore, I'd glady do 250 runs of Bruce B, since it's by far the best way to get money (A is a little too difficult without a very good party). If you do not like repeating the same missions over and over, then you should accept that you will never have the really good items. I had some pretty uber rares on BB, but only because I ran PoD a few thousand times. If you don't want to put the time into doing the same missions again and again, just realize you shouldn't have the best weapons.

On 2007-02-05 15:52, Sounomi wrote:
Never played PSO I take it? Only 4 versions (ignoring ep 3 which was pathetic) that lasted quite awhile and never had any issues with it drying out. It was also much more casual than other MMOs. You didn't have dedicate alot of your time to get some where but there was still quite a bit to it that kept things interesting.

Right, you didn't have to put in a bunch of time, but you never got the really, really good rares if you didn't spend lots of time hunting them (or were obscenely lucky).

[ This Message was edited by: Ffuzzy-Logik on 2007-02-05 16:01 ]

JAFO22000

Feb 5, 2007, 07:01 PM

Hell no. They should really do the exact opposite, and make it PC only. I feel sorry for all the PS2 players who will never be able to prove their rares are legit with pictures.

Your name fits this quote well, as this really is fuzzy logic. "ST should keep PS on the PC because you can take pics on your PC". Actually, that's not fuzzy logic, it's weak logic. I'm not sure if this was supposed to be a joke or not. Sorry if it is a joke.

On 2007-02-05 15:13, Sinue_v2 wrote:

...while 360's userbase is steadily climbing.

3. The X360 doesn't have the direct competition of WoW, Guild Wars, and many other MMO's/MO's on a seperate gaming platform. They have FFXI, however, who's userbase has grown much more over the holiday season than PSU's has. However, I'm not sure how many of those players are solely attributed to the X360 and how many of them are from the PC.

All the more reason to keep it on the console. Harder to hack, no competition from other (better) ORPG's....more chance to "stand out".

Releasing this game on the PC in the wake of the WoW expansion (among other things), would be similar to releasing a 1st person shooter on the 360 around the time Halo 3 is released. You could have a great game, but nobody will play it for any extended period of time.

Here's another example: If you were opening a McDonald's, would you open it in a city which already had 6 McDonald's there already? Or, maybe find another city (even if this other city is smaller) with NO McDonald's and open it there (considering that relocating is a non-issue)? Business sense would tell you not to compete against the established entitites unless you KNOW you have a better product. It would make more sense to try and open in the market with no McD's instead of the market that already has 6 of them.

Ffuzzy-Logik

Feb 5, 2007, 07:09 PM

On 2007-02-05 16:01, JAFO22000 wrote:

Hell no. They should really do the exact opposite, and make it PC only. I feel sorry for all the PS2 players who will never be able to prove their rares are legit with pictures.

Your name fits this quote well, as this really is fuzzy logic. "ST should keep PS on the PC because you can take pics on your PC". Actually, that's not fuzzy logic, it's weak logic. I'm not sure if this was supposed to be a joke or not. Sorry if it is a joke.
I want to be able to play online without buying extraneous shit like a console modem and keyboard. I want to have logs of all the chatting, mails, etc. I want to save pictures of interesting things. I want to be able to troll the forum while playing the game.

Look, regardless of what platform it's on, it'd get hacked eventually. With the PC, legit people can at least take pictures of "Ubar Legat Player received ZOMFG UBAR RAR 15*" going up the side of their screen to prove, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that their item is legit. Other people will hack. On the PC, at least you can take pictures of their hacked items, and send in chat logs (which you can use to get their ID number) to report them. Recent events have shown that they will actually ban people.

Those just a few of the reasons why it'd be a terrible idea to take it off PC.