Random vs. Set in Order.

[Rashiid]

No arguement about fairness in rares is worse then debating on who got what.

What do yall prefer?

[Rashiid]

Personally, i hafta say random.

reason is its less fustrating.

set in order example;
3 rare items appear in this order:

Olpad
Kubara Wood
Junaline

Bob gets olpad
Jan gets Kubara Wood
Smith gets Junaline

Jan yells at whoever picked up Kubara Wood.
now, is it fair Jan gets this instead of Junaline?
would it be fair if they skipped that item, and Jan gets it, but Smith gets nothing?
is it also fair that Bob was stuck w/ an Olpad from the start?

too many questions.

Random is a fair way that everyone gets the same % chance of getting anything.

[dudeanonymous]

ok I voted the don't care option and heres why, If you really want certain rares there is only one thing you can do and that is solo the damned mission plain and simple I only do a party if I'm lvling up.

[SabZero]

random, because when it's set in order, people start not picking stuff up -_-

[Natrokos]

With friends? I don't care. With random strangers? SIO only. I ran a random party with 2 other people on SW S and I got the first 6 rares...

[AC9breaker]

Jan is stupid then. Kubara wood is good stuff and always sells. If not useful in making Kubara weapons. If I was smith of Bob I'd telll her to stfu and we'll trade with the item they got for her wood after quest was done. Even though Junaline is a higher rank item we can't use them in syths yet unless your a hacker.

[Natrokos]

^ Kubara wood drops off of basically any level and is super cheap in player shops. I will trade anyone here a kubara wood for a a junaline......lol I will trade kubara wood for upteline...>.>

[jayster]

Set in order always. Maybe random once in a while to shake things up.

[Akaimizu]

I say it really depends on who you have and where.

I mostly party with those from my sizable friends list. But in general, with them, I go in-order when there's only a few of us and there's a decent amount of average drops in a level.

I tend to make rares random in a large party due to the factor of one or two people who get nothing while the first few or so pick up everything.

I also think Random is a little safer in large parties where you're dealing with random people. This helps eliminate that whole argument some people get about picking up *not-so-great* rares. In that case, picking it up or not picking it up means nothing. Take note, this is not an issue with friends, but with random people....well.....you don't know them.

I'm more likely to make rares random, if the level is notorious for a small number of drops. (Valley of Carnage, for instance).

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Akaimizu on 2007-02-26 13:53 ]</font>

[jayster]

I find that people can be very greedy if you do give finder. Even with friends lol.

[JAFO22000]

Random for exactly what Rashiid said. All rares get picked up and it's random as to who gets it. No whining about fairness and such. I've gone through runs where I didn't get a single rare out of 16, then I've gone through runs where I got 8 rares in a row.

[Sychosis]

Set in Order. I prefer not having one person getting all the rares in a run. Which oddly enough, seems to happen a LOT in Random games.

I do think having to be "stuck" with a certain rare until the order resets is lame, but you have to remember that the order is random, as are which rares you will find in a given run. I personally believe there is just as much randomness in SiO as Random, but with SiO people don't start getting 4,5,6 rares in a row.

If someone in the party has been getting shortchanged however, I do always offer to give them something better than Groovy Juice boards. "Share with Friends" > SiO and Random combined.

[Ffuzzy-Logik]

Order.


Random, at its very best, is just as good as order.
Order, at its very worst, is just as bad as random.



Also, Kubara Wood is far from being worthless. Just wait until we get some of the Kubara melee boards, then people will pay a small fortune for the wood.

[Rashiid]

Kubara Melee boards usually are monster parts, just considered Kubara

its transfering Guns to Kubara that needs wood

edit: its not that Kubara woods worthless, its just theres not much room left to store it all lol



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Rashiid on 2007-02-26 14:33 ]</font>

[Itchee]

Either works just fine, although, I usually set my games to In Order.

[PALRAPPYS]

Give Finder. But that's not an option, though.

Set in Order.

That way everybody gets things, and I don't have to care when I pick up tons of meseta and only get cold berries instead. -_-

[Yuicihi]

I just do Give Finder...

[Hustler_One]

Random, because with order you get too many whiny babies that go "OMG! I DIDNT WANT THAT RARE! /pout" *leaves party*

[9lotus]

Random.

If/when item drama happens, it's because of luck and that's it

With give finder or set-in-order, people either get greedy or they selectively pick up rares.

[Ffuzzy-Logik]

On 2007-02-26 14:51, Hustler_One wrote:
Random, because with order you get too many whiny babies that go "OMG! I DIDNT WANT THAT RARE! /pout" *leaves party*

Good, you don't want people like that in your party anyway. Unless, of course, an imbecile picked up a Scape Doll board, in which case he should be booted for stupidity above and beyond the call of duty.

[ljkkjlcm9]

In order

the order is completely random, and random is annoying seeing the same person get multiple rares, or going an entire mission with 12+ rares and getting none. Even if some of these rares are crap, I'd rather get one then get nothing, just for the sheer fact that one person gets a ton in a row, and I get nothing. That's really annoying.

Whoever does give finger... I don't understand that. Then you end up with an entire group that stops attacking to go run and get an item. This is especially annoying to those that believe killing is priority, and won't get items til afterwards. They earn items just as much as the next guy, but because they aren't greedy, they don't get anything? Hardly fair. Course, then you have the people that always complain, "I saw it and picked it up, so it should be mine!" Screw you, you picked it up because you watch for items instead of fighting.

Set in Order seems to be the most fair to me.

THE JACKEL

[NPCMook]

Set in Order simply because it works if you understand it

First person in the map start of the order
First person on the next block start of the order

Rare drop already assigned get over your Ego of thinking otherwise

Occasionally getting double rares when on same block Haven't figured it out yet

Give Finder = Noob Finder

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: NPCMook on 2007-02-26 15:38 ]</font>

[MrFortegunner]

Set in orders much better cause no one's attackin cause they're tryin to get the items and everyone goes ahead to break boxes. It's even better when soloing because you'll get more items ^_^!

[Ffuzzy-Logik]

On 2007-02-26 15:37, NPCMook wrote:
Set in Order simply because it works if you understand it

First person in the map start of the order
First person on the next block start of the order

Rare drop already assigned get over your Ego of thinking otherwise

Occasionally getting double rares when on same block Haven't figured it out yet
Wrong, wrong, wrong.

Say you have 6 members. The order is randomly determined when you start a mission. The order will be something like 5-2-3-4-6-1. The first rare that is picked up (not the first one dropped, it must be picked up to count) goes to player 5. The next goes to player 2, then the third to player 3. Let's say player 4 disconnects, and another rare drops before he rejoins. In this case, that rare goes to player 6, skipping the spot of player 4 (this also occurs if a member is outside the mission [e.g. at a PP Cube] when his/her turn comes up in the order). Once the order has been completed, a new random order is determined. It is possible that the last member of the old order could be the first member of the new order, which explains why some people can get two rares in a row (though it is uncommon).

Order has nothing to do with which block you are in or whatever.

Order is reset only when the old order finishes, or you start a new mission. Nothing else resets the order.

[NPCMook]

then I guess I'm just lucky, because every time I'm the first in I get the first rare... and when we switch blocks its the person who got into the block first

And when someone leaves/disconnects/goes to Recharge and its their turn they get skipped and get thrown to the end of the line

of course we can argue this back and forth till the day after the we die, but I think I'll just let you be with your way, and I'll be with my way



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: NPCMook on 2007-02-26 16:38 ]</font>

[Ffuzzy-Logik]

If you are the only person in the mission when the first rare is picked up, you are the only valid recipient, if that is what you mean.


Anyway, the system I have posted is generally held to be true, and has never been proved false in any way.

[nooblet]

i prefer set in order. But I generally dont care if its set in order or random. I rarely join any game that uses give finder.

[Ffuzzy-Logik]

On 2007-02-26 16:34, NPCMook wrote:

And when someone leaves/disconnects/goes to Recharge and its their turn they get skipped and get thrown to the end of the line
Yes and no. They do get skipped, but they don't get thrown to the end of the line. Their rare is forfeit for the duration of that order.

[NPCMook]

All I'm saying is my theory has held pretty stead fast since I tend to run with the same group every time

Random is a pretty big word to throw around since well when the group first enters the mission isn't it always random since everyone piles in as fast as they can?

[Ffuzzy-Logik]

The party leader is generally the last in the mission (since he/she is stuck at the mission screen for a few seconds after he/she starts the mission), yet I cannot count the number of times the party leader has gotten the first rare in order.

[PALRAPPYS]

On 2007-02-26 15:37, NPCMook wrote:
Set in Order simply because it works if you understand it

Give Finder = Noob Finder

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: NPCMook on 2007-02-26 15:38 ]</font>


No.

Give Finder is not for noobs. I love Give Finder. Something wrong with that? I don't see why it would be (if it is... doubt it would be with you though). But really, Give Finder takes skill. It's up to you to get the items you see on the ground. If you know a Polty can drop item X, then maybe you should get near each polty in the area! So what if you get a little hurt? You can carry 20 monomates, dimates, and trimates. Plus, if you are decent enough you should be able to dodge a lot of their attacks.

Yeah yeah Give Finder is for noobs. I don't care.

Say whatcha want. >>

[Ffuzzy-Logik]

It never ceases to amaze me how many retards play games on give finder. I do order/order even solo, just because playing a finder game feels.....dirty.

[omegapirate2k]

I like random for rares sometimes when I'm with a party full of good friends, it just adds to that "treasure hunt" feel in rare packed levels.

Otherwise, set in order works fine.

[Yaoguai]

Mook and I have gone through over 900 missions together where we calculated beyond a shadow of a doubt who is going to get what and in what order. I'm not gonna explain it cause too many people with thick skulls ask too many stupid questions so i'll leave that to Mook.

[Sychosis]

Give finder only works amongst friends. Like, people in the same room on another TV type friends. For randoms, it's a horrible choice. Ninja looters begin staring at the ground rather then the monster sticking a claw up their ass. It's a hindrance to XP, MP, and Meseta accrual through mission completion.

[Inazuma]

oh i didnt know that you had to pick up the item for it to count in "set in order". that changes everything for me. random ftw

[Umberger]

For those wondering about Kubara Wood's worth, just wait until we get the Dulk Fakis mission...the lobby after him sells Kubara weapon boards if I remember correctly. The demand for them will probably go up, and once everyone has got rid of their initial stacks of the stuff, it will become rarer.

Anyway, I do set in order.

[GunnerGoddess]

as long as it's not set on give finder I don't care much (a lot of players pick stuff up like they're vacuum cleaners). I don't even mind getting kerseline I can use just about any rare I get to synth anyways and what I can't I store or sell XD

[necman]

On 2007-02-26 14:32, Rashiid wrote:
Kubara Melee boards usually are monster parts, just considered Kubara

its transfering Guns to Kubara that needs wood

edit: its not that Kubara woods worthless, its just theres not much room left to store it all lol



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Rashiid on 2007-02-26 14:33 ]</font>


you can store as much as you want. Just make it into a gift. you can stock pile many that way. and as long as you don't drop the gift it will always tell you what it is.

[Ryo_Hayasa]

Umm i'm not sure if it was state but Set order, is already decided the moment you start the mission. as are drops. For example.

Item order is: Moon X, Scape Doll, Junaline, Moon X. (they appear in this order) There are three players. (John, Dole, Bob) in this order.

John gets the moon X
Dole gets the Doll
Bob gets the Junaline
John gets another Moon X.

Just because you skip (don't pick up) the moon X, doesn't mean Jon gets the Doll or the Junaline. Bob will STILL get the Junaline, and Dole the Doll Because that's how order is, it's pre-set, as are orders afterward depending on the drops. it's all predetermined.

Infact, if later in the mission you went back and picked up those skipped moon X's. John will get BOTH. Appearing as he gets two rares in a row.

Yes this was tested.
Personally. i like order, atleast i'm going to get something right?
Random, i just have terrible "luck" and never get anything, yet my friend gets two or three 10 star items. in a row.
Example: we find two relic edges within two runs. There are 4 players. things are set to random.
She gets them both. what do i get? A moon X....board (When they were still rare)

It's not going to kill me. but damn it's a fustrating.

[NPCMook]

I know how the drops work, the issue we were going on about is how the order is decided

[Krans]

People who defend picking up Kubara wood, trying to equate it to other rares like say Neu Ebon.... are well in my opinion "stupid"

[Jaden_Korr]

I usually have rares set to random,normal items set in order. Keeps things fair and at the end of the run you can haggle over rares if you want

[ljkkjlcm9]

On 2007-02-26 23:57, Krans wrote:
People who defend picking up Kubara wood, trying to equate it to other rares like say Neu Ebon.... are well in my opinion "stupid"


I would prefer Kubara wood because I can buy Neu Ebon from the NPC...

THE JACKEL

[Rashiid]

On 2007-02-26 21:14, necman wrote:

On 2007-02-26 14:32, Rashiid wrote:
Kubara Melee boards usually are monster parts, just considered Kubara

its transfering Guns to Kubara that needs wood

edit: its not that Kubara woods worthless, its just theres not much room left to store it all lol



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Rashiid on 2007-02-26 14:33 ]</font>


you can store as much as you want. Just make it into a gift. you can stock pile many that way. and as long as you don't drop the gift it will always tell you what it is.



i kno that, it was a joke meaning it just drops so damn much http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

[Eleina]

I dont really care who gets the numerous barfelines, chicotites, cyral etc......So random is good for me, order works well and even give finder is fine by me. Who cares who gets the rares? It's a game!!!! Just play it!!! (and if u really want to get rares just solo things i'm sure you'll get plenty of useless synth items just for u...)

[Garnet_Moon]

Random. If you want my rares when they all start dropping to me and not you, then go solo. Nobody will miss you.

[SuperRygar]

they should have put in another item dist. option. give to person-who-killed-the-monster. that would be > all

[CAST-Sapphire]

I prefer Set in order. Everyone at least get's somthing. The only bad thing is when people grap juck rares, but even with that you get SOMTHING.

[CyarVictor]

Set in Order for me. I usually party with friends, but i do party with randoms also. Most know or should I say, pick up what they want. most of the time, people just ask for an item someone else got and it's traded.

[pionear]

I dunno, it seems with random, whoever joins the party late usually gets the rest of the rares.

From my experience.

[Ravennittes]

Random for rares most of the time, but if I'm in a charitable mood, I go in order, even though i get the short end of the stick (ALWAYS) -.-' .

SIO for non-rares is a must though ^.^