PDA

View Full Version : For u PSO vets out there.



Fecesbot
Jun 4, 2007, 12:07 AM
I dunno if im the only one who thinks this (and im sure im not) but to me PSU just lacks that PSO feeling.

I guess i should give the game more time to update and all but i just wanna know if any of u think it has this feeling or not. Some of u dont know what im talking about and i cant really explain it either but if u think u know then post if u think it has the feeling or not and y u think it does or doesnt. Also post suggestions that u believe will bring this feeling back if u have any.

I also dunno if a thread like this has been made or not so ill apologize if it has.

i guess ill just make this into a poll actually.

Retehi
Jun 4, 2007, 12:08 AM
On 2007-06-03 22:07, Fecesbot wrote:

I also dunno if a thread like this has been made or not so ill apologize if it has.



Only about a few thousand times.

Fecesbot
Jun 4, 2007, 12:11 AM
On 2007-06-03 22:08, Retehi wrote:

On 2007-06-03 22:07, Fecesbot wrote:

I also dunno if a thread like this has been made or not so ill apologize if it has.



Only about a few thousand times.



Sorry.
I havnt been here in a while.

Soukosa
Jun 4, 2007, 12:19 AM
It's not gonna have the feel of PSO because it's not PSO. It's an entirely different game, just in the same series.

Fecesbot
Jun 4, 2007, 12:22 AM
On 2007-06-03 22:19, Sounomi wrote:
It's not gonna have the feel of PSO because it's not PSO. It's an entirely different game, just in the same series.



Ya i guess ur right.
Now i feel stupid for posting this.
Close this thread if u want i dunno what i was thinking. Just trying to vent some frustration is all i guess. I just keep looking back on mah PSO days and i keep forgetting this isnt the same. Thnx for reminding me.

Mayu
Jun 4, 2007, 12:29 AM
Meh feels the same to me -_- Doing the same thing again and again http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif
- Combat wise





<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Ryuugu-Rena on 2007-06-03 22:30 ]</font>

Fecesbot
Jun 4, 2007, 12:31 AM
Heh well uve got that right.
I just miss the items, mags, section IDs, etc.
Got so used to them.

Xenogamerx
Jun 4, 2007, 12:34 AM
What I miss about PSO:

1. Mags
2. Mag's SUV (forgot what its called)
3. The bosses on every level

Everything else PSU is better IMO.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Xenogamerx on 2007-06-03 22:35 ]</font>

Fecesbot
Jun 4, 2007, 12:35 AM
On 2007-06-03 22:34, Xenogamerx wrote:
2. Mag's SUV (forgot what its called)


Its Photon Blast.

Weeaboolits
Jun 4, 2007, 12:41 AM
I miss having tons of stuff to do offline. ._.

Also, having enemies with names I could remember and that were actually cool.

VanHalen
Jun 4, 2007, 01:00 AM
On 2007-06-03 22:41, Ronin_Cooper wrote:
I miss having tons of stuff to do offline. ._.

Also, having enemies with names I could remember and that were actually cool.



Aww come on. Saying Kajihabarofa isn't that bad. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif

Powder Keg
Jun 4, 2007, 01:02 AM
I think I had a better time on PSO, because hunting rares that weren't going to disappear on you was always cool.

I don't like to compare the two games though, if this was supposed to be like PSO they would have called it Episode 4.

Zorafim
Jun 4, 2007, 01:11 AM
It always happens, a game that defines a series. Despite the company's best efforts, they cannot top the one masterpiece that they created. Compared to that one game, the others just seem cliche, dull, and uninspired. It's seen in all videogame series, the one game that just can't be beat.

Isabella
Jun 4, 2007, 02:33 AM
But these characters are a lot better looking http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif

RFB
Jun 4, 2007, 02:36 AM
On 2007-06-03 23:00, VanHalen wrote:
Aww come on. Saying Kajihabarofa isn't that bad. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif



Kaji..ha..bar... *head implodes*

I cant barely remember any mob name from PSU =S
It's like ST thought "Hey, lets make the names unnecessarily complicated so it all looks cool, new and professional, although half of it is a revamp of PSO mobs".

Disclaimer: "half of it" might be an exaggeration, or might not be. RFB may not be held responsible for any of the opinions shown in this post.

Isabella
Jun 4, 2007, 02:39 AM
Pfff...ALL of it. xD
They just gave hilde...types a spinning move :3

Korokodo13
Jun 4, 2007, 02:44 AM
On 2007-06-04 00:36, RFB wrote:

On 2007-06-03 23:00, VanHalen wrote:
Aww come on. Saying Kajihabarofa isn't that bad. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif



Kaji..ha..bar... *head implodes*

I cant barely remember any mob name from PSU =S
It's like ST thought "Hey, lets make the names unnecessarily complicated so it all looks cool, new and professional, although half of it is a revamp of PSO mobs".

Disclaimer: "half of it" might be an exaggeration, or might not be. RFB may not be held responsible for any of the opinions shown in this post.

its Kagajibari lol, its one of the monsters that I remember cuz its Just fun to say, Kagajibari...

ShadowDragon28
Jun 4, 2007, 02:47 AM
The awesomely fun FireBreak mission on Moatoob brings back the good ole' "PSO vibe" for me. It reminds me of Endless Nightmare quests and that's massive coolness IMO.

Isabella
Jun 4, 2007, 02:47 AM
yea...Like as much fun as saying AIDS HEAD...
not so much fun now huh? >;D

GreenArcher
Jun 4, 2007, 06:04 AM
Well I've been playing since launch, and for anyone who has done that and played from the launch of Blue Burst, you definatly have that same lack of updates feeling http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif

Niloklives
Jun 4, 2007, 06:37 AM
On 2007-06-03 23:02, Artea wrote:
I think I had a better time on PSO, because hunting rares that weren't going to disappear on you was always cool.

I don't like to compare the two games though, if this was supposed to be like PSO they would have called it Episode 4.



Blue Burst was ep 4...but that's just me nit picking

in regards to games being like other ones in the series...*cough* episode III *cough*

Anyway...no I don't think this feels anything like PSO...but while PSO had certain aspects that make PSu feel inferior...the new combat system and character creation/customizarion are so far beyond PSO that (to me) it more than makes up for the short commings...well besides synthing...and grinding...and percents...and caps...and gimped casts and uninspired weapons and...ok yeah PSU blows in a lot of ways, but I still like it...

Mystil
Jun 4, 2007, 06:50 AM
Somehow I played every PSO version..even craptastic epIII. PSU is not "missing" the PSO feeling, it has it's own feeling. This isn't PSO >.<. I just wonder...am I the only vet who doesn't compare PSU with PSO???

Niloklives
Jun 4, 2007, 07:13 AM
xD it's hard not to compare them since while they still are not the same series, they clearly had PSO in mind when they made this...hell even the titles are similar.

But in case you couldn't tell I was making a half assed joke. personally I enjoy PSU quite a bit, but I thought it funny to list all the common comparissons we see.

Honestly, this game is intended as the new PSO...its a simple fact fortified by the PSO servers being left for dead and no new PSO titles announced. Comparissons are inevitable. I look beyond PSU's shortcomings because it's damned fun to play. But i still and will forever miss my beloved snow queen.

Saphion
Jun 4, 2007, 07:59 AM
On 2007-06-03 23:11, Zorafim wrote:
It always happens, a game that defines a series. Despite the company's best efforts, they cannot top the one masterpiece that they created. Compared to that one game, the others just seem cliche, dull, and uninspired. It's seen in all videogame series, the one game that just can't be beat.



Best thing I've read on here for a while. Too true.

huntlyon
Jun 4, 2007, 09:35 AM
"you can't go home"

hell, I enjoyed PSO greatly AND still thought it didn't have that "old Phantasy Star quality" I remembered growing up with.

Nuclearranger
Jun 4, 2007, 10:42 AM
On 2007-06-03 23:02, Artea wrote:
I think I had a better time on PSO, because hunting rares that weren't going to disappear on you was always cool.

I don't like to compare the two games though, if this was supposed to be like PSO they would have called it Episode 4.



They accualy made an Episode 4 on Blue burst....

ljkkjlcm9
Jun 4, 2007, 10:46 AM
I just want to know how many people can play PSU and go back to PSO and not be bored out of their mind. It's so tediously slow and just gets on my nerves. AS addicting as it was, I could never go back and play PSO... I've tried, but it was just way too slow. Way way way too slow.

THE JACKEL

Niloklives
Jun 4, 2007, 10:52 AM
I can still play it just fine, but you're not the first person to say they feel that way. It really is a clumsy game by comparison...it might just be the nostalgia keeping me interested...*shrugs*

fumatanera
Jun 4, 2007, 11:50 AM
On 2007-06-03 23:00, VanHalen wrote:

On 2007-06-03 22:41, Ronin_Cooper wrote:
I miss having tons of stuff to do offline. ._.

Also, having enemies with names I could remember and that were actually cool.



Aww come on. Saying Kajihabarofa isn't that bad. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif



PSU names seek like a bad Star Wars immitation

amtalx
Jun 4, 2007, 12:09 PM
Half the fun of PSO was rare hunting. Now its board hunting, followed by synthing ingredient hunting, searching playing shops for the ones you can find at less then 3x the NPC price, waiting 12/24 hours, being disappointed, starting all over.

Serephim
Jun 4, 2007, 12:49 PM
PSU has the potental to overlap PSO tenfold by the time Sonic Team gets the forumla right the same way they did PSO.

You people cant disagree that eventhough getting rares in PSO was fun and they looked cool, you rarely ever used them really. (I have about 200 Yellow Bold Names in my PSO bank, and only really have about 20 different rare weapons, 3 of which ill ever take into serious battle.)

Even though PSO had better level design, now that i HAVE a psu subscription i can safely say that the Online mode is a COMPLETELY DIFFERENT GAME from Extramode/storymode. The only difference between the feel of PSO and hte feel of PSU is that in PSO you were on a set storyline quest, and on PSU you are on seperate missions. Although PSU Network mode improves the forumla really well.

PSO Level branching

Forest 1, 2
(boss)
Caves 1, 2, 3,
(boss)
Mines 1, 2
(boss)
Ruins 1, 2, 3,
(final boss)

Same thing with Episode 2, and it only changed with Episdode 4 (as it only had 1 boss but was fun nonetheless, although a tad dissapointing)


While i agree a few PSO bosses we're cooler, PSU bosses are T O N S more fun to fight. I dont remember ever facing a boss as challenging as the first time i fought De- Ragan on Network mode. (Unlike on PSO and PSU Extra Mode, where i can destroy the dragon under a miniute) He flys, he blows fire, he shoots fireballs, he tail swipes people behind him, he shoots a Enegry-Fire beam, he flys at you, and he takes very different damage depending on where you hit him for different strageties...Hes the PSO Dragon MUCH improved. The only thing they diddnt do was put him Underground. (but who needs to when he flys?)

Most of the bosses are improved, its just the stages.


I ASSURE you, if Each Block in PSU had a different overall look (just like PSO), then you would see waht im talking about. The level design is already improved, its just the Atmosphere thats not clicking.


And the only thing i really blame for that is Music. They can change atmosphere anyway they want. In all truth they dont need to change the look of ALL the blocks, simply because their alot shorter than idivisual pso levels.

The reason they diddnt take that approach with PSU is because the level pattern can be slightly shifted from where you choose to go after the first mission from the field. Since there are alot more levels in PSU, they just couldnt do it that way.


All i really want them to fix on psu is the music. I would enjoy PSU alot more than PSO if it was for the music.

That, and Synthesis is way too hard to get an S - rank weapon. Some of them should simply fall already finshed.

fumatanera
Jun 4, 2007, 01:01 PM
On 2007-06-04 10:49, Serephim wrote:
PSU has the potental to overlap PSO tenfold by the time Sonic Team gets the forumla right the same way they did PSO.

You people cant disagree that eventhough getting rares in PSO was fun and they looked cool, you rarely ever used them really. (I have about 200 Yellow Bold Names in my PSO bank, and only really have about 20 different rare weapons, 3 of which ill ever take into serious battle.)

Even though PSO had better level design, now that i HAVE a psu subscription i can safely say that the Online mode is a COMPLETELY DIFFERENT GAME from Extramode/storymode. The only difference between the feel of PSO and hte feel of PSU is that in PSO you were on a set storyline quest, and on PSU you are on seperate missions. Although PSU Network mode improves the forumla really well.

PSO Level branching

Forest 1, 2
(boss)
Caves 1, 2, 3,
(boss)
Mines 1, 2
(boss)
Ruins 1, 2, 3,
(final boss)

Same thing with Episode 2, and it only changed with Episdode 4 (as it only had 1 boss but was fun nonetheless, although a tad dissapointing)


While i agree a few PSO bosses we're cooler, PSU bosses are T O N S more fun to fight. I dont remember ever facing a boss as challenging as the first time i fought De- Ragan on Network mode. (Unlike on PSO and PSU Extra Mode, where i can destroy the dragon under a miniute) He flys, he blows fire, he shoots fireballs, he tail swipes people behind him, he shoots a Enegry-Fire beam, he flys at you, and he takes very different damage depending on where you hit him for different strageties...Hes the PSO Dragon MUCH improved. The only thing they diddnt do was put him Underground. (but who needs to when he flys?)

Most of the bosses are improved, its just the stages.


I ASSURE you, if Each Block in PSU had a different overall look (just like PSO), then you would see waht im talking about. The level design is already improved, its just the Atmosphere thats not clicking.


And the only thing i really blame for that is Music. They can change atmosphere anyway they want. In all truth they dont need to change the look of ALL the blocks, simply because their alot shorter than idivisual pso levels.

The reason they diddnt take that approach with PSU is because the level pattern can be slightly shifted from where you choose to go after the first mission from the field. Since there are alot more levels in PSU, they just couldnt do it that way.


All i really want them to fix on psu is the music. I would enjoy PSU alot more than PSO if it was for the music.

That, and Synthesis is way too hard to get an S - rank weapon. Some of them should simply fall already finshed.





that's be cool if Boards and finished rares dropped, maybe the boards would have a better chance at higher %s

Seira7
Jun 4, 2007, 01:02 PM
I am one of those people that still plays PSO w/o being too too bored. I just dick around offline/legit in PSO +. Whenever I get that "oh I miss PSO feeling" I turn on my gamecube ( I plan on getting a Wii for the progressive scan eventually)

Then, I get bored eventually, and turn on PSU. Both games have good qualities, in terms of level design and music and rare hunting, PSO wins. I also liked how story mode was a bit more fun/wacky. But I like a lot of things about PSU. When AOI comes, you can actually make a Fonewearl that isnt ugly! j/k, I love the room decos, PAs, races/classes, customization, firebreak...many things. If they add timed combat with AOI I may, just may drop PSO like a hot potato, forever ^-^



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Seira7 on 2007-06-04 11:04 ]</font>

chibiLegolas
Jun 4, 2007, 01:22 PM
On 2007-06-04 10:09, amtalx wrote:
Half the fun of PSO was rare hunting. Now its board hunting, followed by synthing ingredient hunting, searching playing shops for the ones you can find at less then 3x the NPC price, waiting 12/24 hours, being disappointed, starting all over.



Exactly. The synthesis/grinding system adds more detail and custimization to the game, but killed the fun factor for me.

I want to find a rare, and not PARTS of a rare. There were only a few exeptions in PSO where you had to farm/hunt for parts. But it was not REQUIRED for ALL rares in the game.

IMO, PSU doesn't even have enough rares to satisfy my tastes like it did in PSO. We all know and cry over the lack of unfufilled [b] hunts in PSU. But if only they just give us more various rares to hunt in various grades (more common C and B rank rares, like the flurescent bulb, harisen fans), I would be happy. Once we even find and successfully make those, we STILL have to worry about getting good % AND grinding them?! Come on....

The bosses from PSO had more thought and work go into them IMO with minor puzzle elements thrown in if you wanna hurt them effeciently. Or you not get hurt....

Costume design in PSO was more varied/wacky and better IMO. *cough* FOmar *cough* FOmarl *cough*
Because of the costume/class design, you can generally tell by sight what that person is. In PSU, nearly EVERYONE could look similiar to each other if they pass you by. You gotta squint and stare to make out certain ears, nose, android lines, accessories, etc. to see what they are at times. You gotta choose certain options to make yourself truly stand out by sight.

The timed attacks in PSO was more fun for me than what PSU has to offer me now. PA's in PSU feels like I'm in less control and letting some animation take over in general. It's taking more of the "action" out of the action-rpg I luv about PSO/PSU. And the way PSU's set up now, I'm practically forced to rely on PA's ALL the time. While I find the normal animated hits more fun to use. But it's not efficient to play with them exclusively.

And I miss some of PSO's level design. I loved the confusion of the map layout of that last stage of Dark Falkis in ver.2 (dam, forgot the name already).
Getting lost and seeing some of your party members on the upper tier bridge while you're on the 1st floor and them shooting down is really fun to me. The rising water in certain spots. And poison rooms where the switch is ALL the way on the other side and on 2nd floor to turn off...
Things like this just gives more depth to the level design, no?

Weeaboolits
Jun 4, 2007, 01:46 PM
On 2007-06-04 11:22, chibiLegolas wrote:
And I miss some of PSO's level design. I loved the confusion of the map layout of that last stage of Dark Falkis in ver.2 (dam, forgot the name already).
Getting lost and seeing some of your party members on the upper tier bridge while you're on the 1st floor and them shooting down is really fun to me. The rising water in certain spots. And poison rooms where the switch is ALL the way on the other side and on 2nd floor to turn off...
Things like this just gives more depth to the level design, no?My sentiments exactly, from playing offline (I'm sure it's a bit better online), the levels are just big empty blocks with enemies, you kill enemies, they drop key, you go open door, sometimes you need two or three keys.

Granted, PSO had a lot of rooms where you just kill everything to advance, but then it'd have you running around the entire map to find switches to another room, branching paths, hidden areas, and diablolical traps. Also remember the sinows in ep2 (specifically Zoa and Zele) that turned invisible? out of nowhere this big robot appears punches you in the face and teleports away, then it freezes you, or the belras that fired their arms at you, the pan arms seperting into two enemies and attacking individually, and the dubchics. There was some crazy stuff. ;]

Niloklives
Jun 4, 2007, 01:49 PM
you mean the seabed on the way to olga flow?

The maps and enemies in EP II were just amazing...by the time you were in the seabed it felt like PSO on crack. My younger brother hates PSU and wasn't excited about PSO ep I...but when he saw ep II he was sitting there shaking "why isn't the rest of the game like this?" he was just too excited by the maps and the enemies and the challeng as he ran around with me at lvl 24 surrounded by Gees and Sinows and oversized carnivorous poisonous plants. by the time we got to Olga Flow, even with my lvl 64 force I had to chase him all ove rthe place to try to keep him alive while he were surrounded by Del Depths, getting rushed down by Del Biters and being sniped by Morphos. Olga Flow took him for a trip just like the rest of ep II. for him, that made PSO. and that was a month ago.

I agree...PSU didn't get my attention the way PSO had when I first made my way through the mines...or the way All of ep II grabbed my brother...honestly I can't rightly say what it's missing...but the more I think about it...the more uninspired PSU seems...

But...again...I also feel that PSu is much more advanced than PSO on a lot of levels too...so it's hard to say one way of the other...heh...ah well...

Akaimizu
Jun 4, 2007, 01:51 PM
I guess. But I can certainly do without PSO's Cave and half of the Mines arrangements. Yeah, they were a bit more mazelike, but felt more like old-school lego-piece contructed rooms, that looked the same. Outside the rare *unique background item* rooms that break up the monotony. (oh, there's a computer here. Hey, there's a rainbow here)

kazuma56
Jun 4, 2007, 02:04 PM
You forget though chibi, by the time one reaches level 100 they SHOULD (emphasizing should) already know the 2 (or 4) different map "layouts" the game has and it's not as "confusing" anymore then it is monotonous.

I did like the "timed attacks" in PSO, but it did break the games system IMO, A ranger with a god/battle and a spread needle (regardless of percents) could own everything in ep.1 (besides mines to an extent) and almost the same in ep.2... timed attacks are great if they are implemented correctly in PSU (appearantly ST is thinking about adding it AoI).

I'm not sure about the Boss bit, Spread needle/charge shot/slicer owned most multiple hit bosses given the wielder has good atp and ATA.... hell charge vulcans where on of the MOST broken weapons in the game given to any character... you could destroy any enemy in a matter of seconds just doing an extra X3 attack and even bosses died as easily given the dmg output.

I'm not taking away anything from PSO, the game was/is still one of my favourites... but glorified nostalgia isn't going to overcloud my judgement on what problems that game has/had (not to take anything from PSU's problems either... but i'm not going to go into that).

Mutt12
Jun 4, 2007, 02:04 PM
Aside from the button mashyness and the new feature, the game's pretty much PSO.

Niloklives
Jun 4, 2007, 02:07 PM
I dunno...after the first two weeks of any given versin of the game the maps I hadn't seen before I had memorized. heck caves ruins and mines if I got lost it meant I needed to take a nap. and as soon as ep II hit, I familiarized myself with the temple spaceship, CCA and seabed...it wasn't that complicated and it was fun haviing everyone quickly just following me around so they didn't have to bother doubling back to the starting point from a wrong turn. for whatever reason, the rooms looked different enough to me.

Sinue_v2
Jun 4, 2007, 02:26 PM
PSU should lack that "PSO Feeling". It's not PSO.

However, "Lacking" is a good way to describe PSU though.

gambit04
Jun 4, 2007, 02:29 PM
On 2007-06-04 12:26, Sinue_v2 wrote:
PSU should lack that "PSO Feeling". It's not PSO.

However, "Lacking" is a good way to describe PSU though.



Agreed we should not have a the PSO feeling. I want my moneys worth...they are just giving it to me a lil too slow though. Which is nice...but it seems that the economy gets worse week by week that new content isn't released. >.<

Weeaboolits
Jun 4, 2007, 02:31 PM
I'd much prefer a "PSO Feeling" over the current, "It Kinda' Wants To Be Like PSO, But Not Really" kinda' thing it has now, sure there are some cool things, but it just doesn't have the same kind of style as PSO (by this I mean one of equal quality, not a similar one). http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif

Saphion
Jun 4, 2007, 02:40 PM
Oh go on SEGA, give us a new PSO.

*in the style of Mrs. Doyle from Father Ted*
G'wan, g'wan, g'wan, g'wan, g'wan, g'wan, g'wan, g'wan, g'wan, g'wan, g'wan. G'wan.

Will ye be wantin' any tea der, Fahders?

Akaimizu
Jun 4, 2007, 02:41 PM
Not me. But that's mainly just opinion. I just can't go back to the precise feel of combat in PSO, after PSU. Not as my primary gaming experience, that is. Even the timed button things were all the same in PSO, so while it initally seemed cool, you pretty much automatically did it after a while. It didn't even feel like a skill thing, at that point. In this game, you have a little bit of that in things like Bows.

Going back, everything just feels clunky in comparison. The free movement and pacing in this game just works for me. I also appreciate the extra variety you do have in character creation. I certainly feel I can make a unique character much more easily with this system. In PSO, I got lucky. Someone could've easily come around with a clone of me, but back then some obvious choices people never seemed to pick. Like dark-skinned characters at all.

KiteWolfwood
Jun 4, 2007, 02:49 PM
At first PSU's combat was exciting and innovating with its photon arts making you fly all across the screen hitting everything. But after a while you realize you pretty much are just spamming your PA over and over again just to kill stuff. Now it is less like PA are some extra special attack to just an attack needed to kill. Where as in PSO each weapon actually did have a special. S-reds had Shifta deband, Dragon claw had foie, Heavens Punisher had Beams of death from the sky. Now those were special. Some may argue that they were not very effective. Sure some weren't but then some were. Bringers rifle cut enemies hp by 1/2 or 1/4? something. Get it to hit once an mobs fell much quicker. Insta death specials didn't hit often but when they did was it sweet.

Another thing I liked about PSO was that it was easier to find people to play with. Choose a universe with people, choose a block with people and then just go to the npc an pick a game. Now with PSU you gotta pick your Universe and then go through missions just to find a lobby that has people. If it has people then you are good to go but if it doesn't you have to go through a whole different mission set to get to another lobby.

Anyway PSU=/=PSO. So oh well.

chibiLegolas
Jun 4, 2007, 02:50 PM
On 2007-06-04 12:04, kazuma56 wrote:
You forget though chibi, by the time one reaches level 100 they SHOULD (emphasizing should) already know the 2 (or 4) different map "layouts" the game has and it's not as "confusing" anymore then it is monotonous.

True. And I always thought that after Blue Burst, PSO/PSU would most definately have total random boards. I've seen them done in other games. And I thought it's one of the most complaints PSO players had with the game by the time you're high leveled.
It was a huge shock to me when PSU wasn't.
O_o

I wouldn't say PSU is horrible either. There's obvious improvements throughout the game with comparing the 2. But I'd like to see AoI to be a mash of the good pionts from BOTH games.

For those who say PSU shouldn't be PSO. Well, then I guess I really wanted PSO ver. 4.
Where is it ST?!
http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

Sychosis
Jun 4, 2007, 02:55 PM
On 2007-06-04 12:50, chibiLegolas wrote:
For those who say PSU shouldn't be PSO. Well, then I guess I really wanted PSO ver. 4.
Where is it ST?!
http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif



http://psobb.com/guide/pregame/dl.php

Have fun!

chibiLegolas
Jun 4, 2007, 02:59 PM
On 2007-06-04 12:55, Sychosis wrote:

On 2007-06-04 12:50, chibiLegolas wrote:
For those who say PSU shouldn't be PSO. Well, then I guess I really wanted PSO ver. 4.
Where is it ST?!
http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif



http://psobb.com/guide/pregame/dl.php

Have fun!



Well, when I say ver. 4, I meant after BB. That dam card game doesn't exist in my world...

Esufer
Jun 4, 2007, 02:59 PM
I like PSU.
So I voted yes.
PSU is good for making friends that you can actually play with again and again, rather than PSO which was just like "Hi again!" and they'd be like "lolwut?"

Niered
Jun 4, 2007, 03:01 PM
On 2007-06-04 12:59, chibiLegolas wrote:

On 2007-06-04 12:55, Sychosis wrote:

On 2007-06-04 12:50, chibiLegolas wrote:
For those who say PSU shouldn't be PSO. Well, then I guess I really wanted PSO ver. 4.
Where is it ST?!
http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif



http://psobb.com/guide/pregame/dl.php

Have fun!



Well, when I say ver. 4, I meant after BB. That dam card game doesn't exist in my world...



Get your facts straight. Episode 3 is the card game. Episode 4 is Blue Burst, and its the closest thing to a "ver 4" you'll ever get.

Sychosis
Jun 4, 2007, 03:02 PM
Well, there was Ver 1 DC, Ver 2 DC, Ver 3 (EP I+II) GC/Xbox, and Version 4 Blue Burst :/

But yeah Ep 3 = crap.

RedX
Jun 4, 2007, 03:03 PM
I don't get how so many could play PSO over PSU. I was just playing it a few days ago, and so much of it is terrible compared to PSU, the camera/targeting system for one. That pissed me off so much when i went to go play it again. I just couldn't get used to it. It was hard to properly move around, and dodge enemies. The camera just kept jumping all over the place.

chibiLegolas
Jun 4, 2007, 03:10 PM
On 2007-06-04 13:01, Niered wrote:

On 2007-06-04 12:59, chibiLegolas wrote:

On 2007-06-04 12:55, Sychosis wrote:

On 2007-06-04 12:50, chibiLegolas wrote:
For those who say PSU shouldn't be PSO. Well, then I guess I really wanted PSO ver. 4.
Where is it ST?!
http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif



http://psobb.com/guide/pregame/dl.php

Have fun!



Well, when I say ver. 4, I meant after BB. That dam card game doesn't exist in my world...



Get your facts straight. Episode 3 is the card game. Episode 4 is Blue Burst, and its the closest thing to a "ver 4" you'll ever get.



That's what I meant from my past statement. Perhaps I wasn't clear enough.
In MY mind, the card game doesn't exist to me. Hence skipping it and moving the ver.3 title to BB. Therefore, ep. 4 doesn't exist. Again, in MY mind.
I just plain disbelieve the card came's existance.
http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif'

I guess I've always confused (EP I+II) as just being plain ver.2. *shrug*
Anyways, you all get the point right? Some of us want PSO, not PSU. *shrug*


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: chibiLegolas on 2007-06-04 13:12 ]</font>

Niered
Jun 4, 2007, 03:19 PM
Lets get one thing straight:

PSU>PSO. Lets say some crazy temporal vortex happens, and SEGA releases PSU right after they release PSO.

Everyone playing PSO would have dropped it like a sea urchin.


Now dont get me wrong, PSO was great. Anyone saying that it sucks obviously has no clue how amazing it was to be able play online with 3 other players back in 2000. On a console no less, with a combat system that didnt come down to clicking. It truly was the DC's greatest game.

So SEGA did the smart business thing and milked it for every penny it was worth, and then some. And then they realized with BB...that that wasnt working anymore.

So once again, SEGA did the smart thing and made a sequel. This time, they tried to make it more like a MMO, adding synthesis, player shops, race/class combinations, everything youd expect.


But it wasnt PSO. And that was the fanboys problem.

Now Im not saying it doesnt have its problems, PSU is by no means perfect, in my book its got a score of around a 6.5/10. But its still got enough going for it that I love it, and its easily the most engaging online game available.

Serephim
Jun 4, 2007, 03:20 PM
They should simply give each weapon alone a Drop rate (the full weapon), but limit it's stats so that if you want a good Elemental %, you have to create one.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Serephim on 2007-06-04 13:31 ]</font>

Garnet_Moon
Jun 4, 2007, 03:22 PM
Things I hated in PSO:

Delsabers; especially in packs of 2 or more.
Mags completely breaking the game in the hands of the wrong person.
Overpowered weapons.

Since PSU has none of those, it is superior. The lack of Delsabers alone puts PSU at such a colossal advantage over PSO.

Weeaboolits
Jun 4, 2007, 03:30 PM
On 2007-06-04 13:22, Garnet_Moon wrote:
The lack of Delsabers alone puts PSU at such a colossal advantage over PSO.Delsabers are actually one of the things I'd like to see return, if only as an enemy that behave similarly. ;]

Serephim
Jun 4, 2007, 03:31 PM
The only reason you fanboys are stuck on PSO is because you've been spamming it for so long.

It was what it was when it came out : The First Online game ever to hold someone like it did (hell, first online game peroid i believe)

But that time is over. It has been lapped in its own department. And on top of that, PSU is out, the improved "Up-to-date" version of its masterpiece.


From this point on, the only people with a PSOBB subscription are those who are just so hooked on the game they cant let it go. If your still PAYING for a PSOBB subscription instead of just getting PSU, you need to be shot.

You people dont understand PSO has been being improved upon over and over for at LEAST 8 years now. PSU hasnt even been out 8 months and your complaining about a Lack of Content. Do you SERIOUSLY believe PSO had a better start than PSU? Once again, if you do, you need to be shot.


Get over it. PSO is dead. It wont be brought back to life, and im almost positive they wont be adding an Episode 5. You all can continue to spam the SAME old boring Forest cave mines and ruin runs all you like, complaining about PSU's Obviously more expansive and complex-layed out stage design like its worse or something.

The reason most people peffer PSO to PSU is the same reason most people peffer PSO Ep1 to PSO Ep2.

You hate change.

Stop hating it, it's already happened, and when Sega get's rid of its BB servers in a few years and PSU has gone through its "pso Ep2" equivilent, you can sit in your corner and bitch about it with all your longtime friends on a Private Server.

Garnet_Moon
Jun 4, 2007, 03:32 PM
On 2007-06-04 13:30, Ronin_Cooper wrote:

On 2007-06-04 13:22, Garnet_Moon wrote:
The lack of Delsabers alone puts PSU at such a colossal advantage over PSO.Delsabers are actually one of the things I'd like to see return, if only as an enemy that behave similarly. ;]


Oh god... the... the evasion... the thwack that always knocks you over... the... the... the super jump... oh god... THE NIGHTMARES ARE RETURNING!

Niloklives
Jun 4, 2007, 03:36 PM
Nilok > Delsabers. 2 or 2 hundred I felt bad if I got hit. but then again I played that game too much. again I'm not saying I like one more than the other, but PSO captured me...PSu didn't...I still play the shit out of PSU, so I can't really knock it

Garnet_Moon
Jun 4, 2007, 03:37 PM
PSO captured me too. Of course, i've been playing it for several years and PSU hasn't even been out one year yet, I think...

Calibur
Jun 4, 2007, 03:45 PM
On 2007-06-04 13:02, Sychosis wrote:
But yeah Ep 3 = crap.


How dare you!!?


Episode 3 > you

Weeaboolits
Jun 4, 2007, 03:50 PM
Episode III was awesome.

Akaimizu
Jun 4, 2007, 03:57 PM
While Episode III was completely out of genre, I thought Episode 3 was a pretty nifty idea for a card-game style game. I don't think any other Card Game system attempted 2 completely different card systems into 1 game. The fact that, for the most part, it actually worked was a bit of magic in itself.

Garnet_Moon
Jun 4, 2007, 04:10 PM
Episode 3 had some decent art, but that's all it had. Oh, and the soundtrack sucked. Big time. Worse than the game.

Sychosis
Jun 4, 2007, 04:13 PM
On 2007-06-04 13:45, Calibur wrote:

On 2007-06-04 13:02, Sychosis wrote:
But yeah Ep 3 = crap.


How dare you!!?


Episode 3 > you




Meh, I prefer my card games to have, you know, actual cards.

Weeaboolits
Jun 4, 2007, 04:27 PM
On 2007-06-04 14:10, Garnet_Moon wrote:
Oh, and the soundtrack sucked. Big time. Worse than the game.Bite your tongue!

RFB
Jun 4, 2007, 04:53 PM
Personally I bought EPIII simply because it was PSO. No other reason. But still, I found it to be an amusing play for a while, much better than I expected. I've never really liked card video games, but EPIII is the best I've played for me.

And the OST wasnt that bad! Tower of Caelum rocks! ¬_¬

Saphion
Jun 4, 2007, 05:07 PM
The main reason I liked PSO so much was the community (well, if you steered well clear of the hackers like I did). Probably the same reason I enjoyed Episode III too.

So many good times.

Which reminds me, I miss the EU servers. Not that I'm knocking the US servers of course, just that it's not particularily easy to find fellow UK players on PSU's and BB's shared servers.

CeasOne
Jun 4, 2007, 05:08 PM
things i miss: the bosses , section id's and ofcorse the dreaded booma cluster F*ck. =)

DurakkenX
Jun 4, 2007, 05:20 PM
*runs in with a dog, but then realizes it's not that kinda vet they were talking about...* oh... well this sux *cries as his dog dies due to being hit by a fleeing hedgehog holding lots of coins*



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: DurakkenX on 2007-06-04 15:24 ]</font>

VanHalen
Jun 4, 2007, 05:22 PM
On 2007-06-04 14:13, Sychosis wrote:

On 2007-06-04 13:45, Calibur wrote:

On 2007-06-04 13:02, Sychosis wrote:
But yeah Ep 3 = crap.


How dare you!!?


Episode 3 > you




Meh, I prefer my card games to have, you know, actual cards.



Yeah but EPIII was like Yu-Gi-Oh......except it was fun.

KiteWolfwood
Jun 4, 2007, 05:35 PM
PSU now has more things that you can do and has been turned more into an online game instead of just a multiplayer game. If you like online games better then multiplayer games then of course you will think PSU is better. But the fact is that most of the people that picked up PSU played PSO and enjoyed PSO because of what it was.

PSO was more casual player friendly. Some examples would be that in PSO I don't think I knew anyone that "grinded". In PSO we would just go play to play and levels were just something to show how long you have played pretty much. Then if you wanted a certain weapon or piece of gear you would just play until it dropped or trade with someone that had it.

PSU has been adapted to be more of an mmorpg to keep up subscriptions. The evidence of now people grinding to gain levels. An actually economy based on meseta, and now you have to craft weapons to get them. There are still a few that actually drop but now it is just collecting items to make the weapon instead of hunting the weapon itself.

Is one better then the other? Of course one is better then the other, but it just depends on the person. There is no right answer when it comes to someones opinion.

Sinue_v2
Jun 4, 2007, 05:49 PM
So SEGA did the smart business thing and milked it for every penny it was worth, and then some. And then they realized with BB...that that wasnt working anymore.

So once again, SEGA did the smart thing and made a sequel. This time, they tried to make it more like a MMO, adding synthesis, player shops, race/class combinations, everything youd expect.

Actually, PSU was in development (pre-production/conceptualization at least) at around the same time v.2 came out for the Dreamcast. A few months before Ep I & II released for the NGC, I heard rumors out of the Japanese ships of a "Realtime combat PS MMORPG" which was set in Algol, had vehicle transportation, and a strong offline single-player storyline in addition to a multiplayer online game. This did come true, but since the rumor started in pre-production it got a lot of the details wrong. (There were three planets, but it was not Algol - for example).

Sega kept PSO going for so long because it was selling. It was easy money... and much of that money they funneled right into the development of PSU.

Fun Fact: IIRC PSO v.2 was initially supposed to be a dual release title for both the DC and the "Nintendo Dolphin". Players from both versions were supposed to be able to share the same servers. However, after their cheating safeguards failed on v.2, Sega decided to scrap the streight port and instead focus on a port with Ep II expansion.


But it wasnt PSO. And that was the fanboys problem.

No. The problem was that the game failed to meet people's expectations. It sucked. It's not that PSU wasn't PSO - it's that PSU isn't a very good game on it's own right. Otherwise it would have taken off in popularity and the voices of the disgruntled PSO fans would have been drowned out. Most painful of all is that so many people can SEE the potential PSU has - it's almost tangable at times. It's a classic case of Sega snatching defeat from the jaws of victory. I think that's why you see a lot of PSO vets complaining about PSU. Because it could have been so much more than what it was. Than what we were hoping it would be.


You people dont understand PSO has been being improved upon over and over for at LEAST 8 years now.

Some people don't understand that. I was there for v.1, and you're right - PSU stomps it from a technical standpoint. It was tragically unbalanced, glitchy, and dominated by cheaters. But PSO v.1 also had something vital that I think PSU lacks in spades. Inspiration. People were willing to forgive PSO v.1's faults, not just because it was a novelty for it's time - but because people found it enjoyable.


Do you SERIOUSLY believe PSO had a better start than PSU? Once again, if you do, you need to be shot.

In terms of userbase. Yeah, PSO did have a much better start. Then again, at the time, PSO was also free to play online. v.2 lost a lot of players, or at least, didn't see them convert upwards because of the monthly fee. Ep I & II only saw about half (or less) of the userbase online that v.1 & 2 did. Though that could also be attributed to the lack of modems, the lack of other games to justify the purchase of said modems, and the implimentation of offline multiplayer.


complaining about PSU's Obviously more expansive and complex-layed out stage design like its worse or something.

PSU's level design is worse. Geography varrys very little between many stages, and almost not at all within the level itself. In PSO, stages varryed widely between Forest, Caves, Mines, ect. Sometimes they varried within a stage itself - such as Ruins 1 to Ruins 3, or CCA. You had a lot of little nuances as well which really added to the experience. Waterfalls, Lava Flows, Chasims, Scaffolding (mountains), ect which really made the levels come alive. PSU doesn't have that. It's almost, sterile, in many places.



And as for Episode III. It was decent for what it was. I'm not card game afficiando, but I could see that (aside from the randomness of the dice system) it was a pretty quality title, and I enjoyed the storyline mode of it. However, card games just aren't my thing.

Garnet_Moon
Jun 4, 2007, 05:54 PM
I loved my limited edition Blue-eyes White Dragon card, but the in-game form was lame. Sure, same thing only digital, but it was lame.

Now, Pokemon... god how I loved my cards and how I still love the games...

Fecesbot
Jun 4, 2007, 06:30 PM
One more thing i miss is trading.
No one does it anymore thnx to shops not to mention anyone can get any item since section IDs are gone.

VanHalen
Jun 4, 2007, 06:37 PM
Would you rather....

A. Get the item you want cause you can, and not force yourself to name yourself something dumb?
or
B. Completly miss out on the item because you didn't name yourself JIm instead of Jim?

Choose wisely now.

Tigerram
Jun 4, 2007, 06:38 PM
PSO was one of a kind at it's time, and it seems many people were expecting this game to take another step further. Unfortunately, it wasn't the case. I think PSU is cool the way it is, we just need the content. I respect Sega for keeping PSU different, and adding PSO things are nice, this doesn't matter to me anyway, but over the course of the year, the game will have a lot more than launch, along with the expansion hopefully this year. I also admit, there are a few things I miss, and PSU does not have the feel PSO once had, but to me, I just like what PSU is doing now. if we obtain the content, it will only get better to me http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif

DurakkenX
Jun 4, 2007, 07:28 PM
PSU seems like...

imagine if PSO/U was a person and when it was first launched it made a 10ft leap easily and landed perfectly...when it tried make another 10ft jump, mid jump, Bruce Lee kicked him 5ft behind the original 10ft line on it's back...with a few broken ribs.

Dragwind
Jun 5, 2007, 12:03 AM
People fail to realize, psu isn't pso. It's not the same system, at all. Get over it. It's the next PS series online title. If you still crave that pso feeling, wait until AoI. You'll feel it a bit more then if you chose to.

Alisha
Jun 5, 2007, 12:46 AM
i think comparing pso to psu is sorta like comparing castlevania 1 or 3 to symphony of of the night or any of the metroidish versions. while sotn seems technically superior many prefer the simpliciy of stage>boss stage>boss. a lot of times when a mission ends in psu it can be anti climatic.

Kimil
Jun 5, 2007, 12:56 AM
PSU is built on a much better battle engine... but there is somethings I miss fro PSO:

- The Backround Music
- The lack of Synth... I HATE synthing
- Epic Boss Battles
- The Darker feel... everything seems serious in PSO, dark and sinster... PSU? Everyon'es a skater kid and we kill little backflipping pannons type enemies and a dragon that likes to spin very, very slowly



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Kimil on 2007-06-04 22:57 ]</font>

Alisha
Jun 5, 2007, 01:00 AM
On 2007-06-04 22:56, Kimil wrote:
PSU is built on a much better battle engine... but there is somethings I miss fro PSO:

- The Backround Music
- The lack of Synth... I HATE synthing
- Epic Boss Battles
- The Darker feel... everything seems serious in PSO, dark and sinster... PSU? Everyon'es a skater kid and we kill little backflipping pannons type enemies and a dragon that likes to spin very, very slowly



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Kimil on 2007-06-04 22:57 ]</font>



how is it better when you can do a combo with an autofire controller?

Powder Keg
Jun 5, 2007, 01:03 AM
On 2007-06-04 04:37, NIloklives wrote:

On 2007-06-03 23:02, Artea wrote:
I think I had a better time on PSO, because hunting rares that weren't going to disappear on you was always cool.

I don't like to compare the two games though, if this was supposed to be like PSO they would have called it Episode 4.



Blue Burst was ep 4...but that's just me nit picking

in regards to games being like other ones in the series...*cough* episode III *cough*

Anyway...no I don't think this feels anything like PSO...but while PSO had certain aspects that make PSu feel inferior...the new combat system and character creation/customizarion are so far beyond PSO that (to me) it more than makes up for the short commings...well besides synthing...and grinding...and percents...and caps...and gimped casts and uninspired weapons and...ok yeah PSU blows in a lot of ways, but I still like it...


Totally agree about the ocmbat system and customization making it superior in a way. If synthing was made a little more friendly, or just done away with period I don't think PSO would even be involved in any discussions at all.

And whoops....at times I tend to forget that BB even existed. >_>

RFB
Jun 5, 2007, 02:28 AM
One thing I dislike about PSU is... faces.

Every freaking character (and unfortunately mine too) smiles like an idiot, or has a sad face like an emo about to cut him/herself.

I love the character creation, but the faces just... you dont go head on against a pack of vicious mobs with a silly "I'm happy to be alive" smile on your face, or with a face that seems like you want to commit suicide. Meh. *shrugs*

AnnabellaRenee87
Jun 5, 2007, 03:53 AM
At the end of the day I don't play PSU 10-30 hours on the weekend like I did PSO.

God forbid they have some decent music in this game (I liked the calm music when you are just standing there, then the revved up something is coming music when a monster is near)

I just hope they add a new planet, RAGOL!!! I WOULD DO ANYTHING TO BE BACK AT THE CCA, AND JUNGLE(hell i even play the music from those areas on my iPod)

Truly unique weapons would be nice in PSU, like a double cannon, (everyone knew what I had when I used it)(its like havening a bunch of light bulbs in PSU)

Now here is the hopeless fan boy talk, I feel home sick in PSU, it was like I moved from New York to California. I actually connected with those 3-4 variation levels and could almost tell you the exact location of every box,barrel,and rock!!!

I'm not going in to how bad the Graphics Engine is in this game (I thought the sequel was supposed to look better) guess this is the down side of being designed for the PS2 (I would have just set the hardware bar at GameCube and higher because most of the people they are trying to get are on the cube)

All I could do is hope and prey that some things that I loved from PSO will be in AoI--sorry if this seems like a rant (very tiered)



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Neoistheone on 2007-06-05 01:55 ]</font>

Synyster
Jun 5, 2007, 06:20 AM
IMO PSU is too centred on money. In PSO you'd max out your bank account n never touch it. The fun was in finding the rares. In PSU I struggle to get the money together to buy rares... that I can't synth for love NOR money. Just not the same...

Sinue_v2
Jun 5, 2007, 06:44 AM
- The Darker feel... everything seems serious in PSO, dark and sinster... PSU? Everyon'es a skater kid and we kill little backflipping pannons type enemies and a dragon that likes to spin very, very slowly

I agree. Phantasy Star as a series has long been marked by it's darker (almost Chtulian) storylines, often oppressive atmospheres, and penchant for tragedy and bittersweet endings. Phantasy Star II remains to this day perhaps the most tragic storyline in the genre. This element is sorely lacking in PSU. I find PSU to be annoyingly upbeat and optimistic, drawing on cheap cliche anime dogma such as "Believe and together we can overcome anything!"

Compair PSU's ending lyrics:


The light of hope
Will be shining on us
It will lead us to a brighter day
The road of hope
Will be found someday
I know I have you beside me

To even PSO's ending lyrics...


Now I can still see the light
You're saved
And I think of you tonight
Soon the dawn will come again
But What have I got ?
What has it cost me ?

And you see a stark contrast between the two.

However, I'm not quite ready to give up on PSU just yet. I'd be willing to be that there will be four installments of the PSU storyline (PS and PSO both had four sequels or episodes) and unlike PS or PSO - the storyline for all four titles will revolve around a set group of characters - namely Ethan and company. We've only gotten 1/4th of the storyline thus far, so there's a lot of room to turn things around and lead into the darker storylines which traditionally mark the Phantasy Star series.

LadyMoon
Jun 5, 2007, 06:46 AM
When I first started playing this I felt that. But the more I played PSU is a separate entity all its own. It has a few things that are similar not quite the same and many things that are an improvement, I am sorry I cannot cast a vote to your poll because there is no choice on how I feel I could not go one way or the other on your choices.

LadyMoon

ZEO_X
Jun 5, 2007, 07:54 AM
On 2007-06-04 22:56, Kimil wrote:
PSU is built on a much better battle engine... but there is somethings I miss fro PSO:

- The Backround Music
- The lack of Synth... I HATE synthing
- Epic Boss Battles
- The Darker feel... everything seems serious in PSO, dark and sinster... PSU? Everyon'es a skater kid and we kill little backflipping pannons type enemies and a dragon that likes to spin very, very slowly



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Kimil on 2007-06-04 22:57 ]</font>


Agrees.

i think AoI will bring back a little bit of that special feeling. *Hopes for classic music*

Garanz-Baranz
Jun 5, 2007, 07:57 AM
Sigh....

I'll admit, I do want to see just a bit of PSO in PSU... but only like 3%.

1- SMALLER rooms.
2- more Traps, with status effects.
3- more variety of weapons, liek there were say, 400 weapons in PSO, but, theres so few now...
4- easyer drop rates on rare enemyies, like 10-30x easyer... mabye on 10*s too...
5- A mechanical boss thats stationary, like Vol opt, but it'd have like 1million HP.

Thats really it, but, I'll say, PSU is vastly greater than PSO, the enemies can actually have a big defence, say Jarbas, Melee resistant, so that forces fighters to use Handguns. yadda yadda yadda, it's hard to stay alive in masses, even with Trimates, the only survival token is a FT's resta...

I have only a sparse complaint...
on PS2---
SEGA screwed the loading sessions on weapons... A saber loads faster then a handgun, and it's 'style' can load first, and you'd be able to attack with the weapon while it's graphic is unloaded. Guns can't fire without the gun it'self loaded... the 'style' and weapon must load for guns... And now Force weapons are royally screwed... The weapon 'stlye' must load, then the weapon itself, AND then the technique for it... and if the style is loaded, and you swap to the same rod[which doesn't need to load graphic as it's preloaded] with an unloaded tech, if timed correctly, you can use the Tech , and get a PP useage drain, but get no effect... even on resta...

The sound effects also load slowly... after the weapon loads, it still takes about 10 second for he soundeffect to come up... the enemies also take an eternity to load even after the weapon loads...

Players load very slowly, their like 'blue photon men' for 20 seconds...

Weapon disloads are VERY annoying.. I'll be fighting say, 4 Delsaban, i start of a basic combo with twin claw, and right when it ends, the thing disloads it's style... I mean, come on... why does that happen??? Lag? my foot... Why can't this stuff load properly? PSU probably would be better on GC...

Then theres this graphic slowdown that eventually removes graphics from grenade bullets and some techs... I blame Sony's PS2 for this...

And once a few weapons have been loaded, the past few do a 'memory disload'...

If SEGA[and Sony] fixed that blunder, then I'd be happy...

Serephim
Jun 5, 2007, 12:57 PM
Well, my further input:

Q- PSU is more based on grinding
A- not so much as you think. PSO was easier to level in because it had more levels. Since PSU only has 100, getting to 100 will most likely be like getting to 200, just alot quicker though. It feels so bad because your stats arnt constantly raising.

Q-PSO had better level design
A- No, pso had better Level Detail. I believe the main thing PSU lacks with level detail is the idea of ROOMs. The expansive feeling is only really good when it doesnt happen so ofted. But ITs been proven PSU has the ABILITY to be like PSO in terms of level design/detail.

For instance, i thought it was really awesome in Crimson Beasts when your traveling through the Ruins, then come out in the plains to fight the dragon. They could give that the PSO feel by making it so when you come out the Ruins into the plains, it could be cloudy and you hear Rolling Thunder in the clouds, and when you go to fight the dragon it just starts POURING raining.

But the day PSU adds in a level like Seabead from Ep2 will be the day i spam it until it gets old. (water and elevating rooms)


Q- PSU Combat is a failure to PSO
A- Untrue, but the PSU combat still needs to be improved on. They REALLY need to add in a timed combo system, or simply have the Combos do more damage. (Like with a sword, have the final hit do more damage than the first & second, so that you just dont spam PA's all day. That way you can do more damage over time than just spamming PAs and neglecting combos alltogether)

Aralia
Jun 5, 2007, 01:23 PM
To me the game feels more like Xenosaga with PSO chars..

Esufer
Jun 5, 2007, 01:25 PM
On 2007-06-05 11:23, Aralia wrote:
To me the game feels more like Xenosaga with PSO chars..


Harsh =/

DreamLocke
Jun 5, 2007, 01:27 PM
The issue I agree on with you guys about PSO was the tone. It's not something I thought about really but when brought up in this post it hit home.

PSO was dark. The storyline about Rico...the millions of people wiped out in seconds on Ragol, the mutation/corruption of the native creatures...and of course a sucker punch of a plot twist leading into the final showdown with Dark Falz.

Remember the fear and hesitation right before the boss gates? I mean at low levels before we were all uber with hacked rares and suped-up MAGs. We all would pipe back up to stock up on the stuff we needed, and even then it was a rush knowing that an epic battle was coming.

Every boss had a pattern to memorize and everyone knew their role. If you went off to do your own thing, you were dead.

PSU's bosses are nice, but they don't have the same "oh crap, here we go..." feel. And the SEED don't really seem that much of a galaxy-ending threat. Dulk Falkis didn't really put the fear of God in me like Dark Falz or Olga Flow.

AoI seems to be taking a darker turn in the story, however. I know you guys want Ragol back even though we have no idea how ST is going to work that into the PSU story line. We just want that "OMG" feeling back. And another field of flowers fading into a sea of skulls...

AweOfShe
Jun 5, 2007, 01:27 PM
PSO was full of nitpicking crybabies... PSU is full of nitpicking crybabies...

Feels like the same game to me. Heh... http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: AweOfShe on 2007-06-05 11:29 ]</font>

Garnet_Moon
Jun 5, 2007, 01:37 PM
On 2007-06-05 11:27, DreamLocke wrote:
Every boss had a pattern to memorize and everyone knew their role. If you went off to do your own thing, you were dead.


Really? 'cause, I remember not being a team player and being the only one who didn't die when that boss; who can't even be completely on the screen, stomped one guy and took everyone else as well.

Memorizing a Boss is the lamest thing ever. Sure, PSU has a few instances of memorizing bosses; usually before they get to their 3rd or 4th attack when the party is full of firepower. There is also, however, an even greater number of instances where people have gone "WTF!" or "XD wasted ur nanoblast!" or "Why did he do it so early?" or "He nevr teleported this much before!" or my personal favorite; as well as one that was on one of my macros in the past... "GOD! STOP TELEPORTING IN AND OUT! STOP PORTING IN FRONT OF ME AND ONE-SHOTTING ME AND NOT EVEN HITTING ANYONE ELSE, THEN TELEPORTING OUT BEFORE ANYONE CAN HIT YOU! YOU'RE NOT FUNNY! OR CUTE! GDI!".

I like bosses that are random from run to run.

DreamLocke
Jun 5, 2007, 02:44 PM
lol are you talking about Flow?

I was just reminiscing and saying the bosses were more memorable in PSO...

Saphion
Jun 5, 2007, 02:50 PM
Serephim, you needn't have bothered with that last post. Both the questions and replies are all opinion and vary from person to person.

Anyway, I have nothing against PSU. It's a good game. It just isn't for me.

I'm just holding out for the day the next installment comes along (seeing as ports or expanded versions of PSO are out of the question), and hope that one is more my cup of tea.

Skuda
Jun 5, 2007, 03:01 PM
On 2007-06-05 11:23, Aralia wrote:
To me the game feels more like Xenosaga with PSO chars..



Even Xenosaga was a lot darker than PSU.

As stated may times before, PSU really lacks that serious tone. Even when they're trying to be serious, it's still goofy and casual.

PSU had some very serious events and attitudes going on, but they were implimented so casually, it really seemed like a cheesy cookie cutter anime. Just look at all the racism in PSU. They touch on it a lot.. but it rdoesn't seem like the big deal that it really is.

I have high hopes for AoI though. ST seems to be pulling it in that dark direction that we all want and need.

Kylie
Jun 5, 2007, 03:02 PM
It's missing something, and I don't really care. =P I don't know much about PSO because I only played it briefly, but I never expected them to be the same game because they aren't. *shrug* Maybe if I played more of PSO, I would have a different perspective.

ljkkjlcm9
Jun 5, 2007, 03:14 PM
If you don't like PSU, don't play it, that's all I have to say to all you people crying about it. I certainly won't miss you.

I loved PSO, but I honestly can't understand half your arguments holding any validity, except for that PSO was darker than PSU is.

OH, and everyone complaining about music, I never have it on anyways, I just listen to my own music. That's true with any game that I would play for thousands of hours. I'd definitely get sick of the music, and I did get sick of PSO's music.

THE JACKEL



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: ljkkjlcm9 on 2007-06-05 13:15 ]</font>

Kylie
Jun 5, 2007, 03:19 PM
On 2007-06-05 13:14, ljkkjlcm9 wrote:
OH, and everyone complaining about music, I never have it on anyways, I just listen to my own music. That's true with any game that I would play for thousands of hours. I'd definitely get sick of the music, and I did get sick of PSO's music.


I tried that, and I nearly went crazy. T.T

I don't have the attention span to enjoy a game without its music.

ljkkjlcm9
Jun 5, 2007, 03:25 PM
On 2007-06-05 13:19, Kylie wrote:

On 2007-06-05 13:14, ljkkjlcm9 wrote:
OH, and everyone complaining about music, I never have it on anyways, I just listen to my own music. That's true with any game that I would play for thousands of hours. I'd definitely get sick of the music, and I did get sick of PSO's music.


I tried that, and I nearly went crazy. T.T

I don't have the attention span to enjoy a game without its music.


are you kidding? I couldn't have kept playing this game listening to it's music over and over. Few games have that good of music. And those that do, I have on my computer and I listen to as I play this lol

THE JACKEL

Kylie
Jun 5, 2007, 03:28 PM
Well, that's you. =P I've always kept the music on. I guess it's just neat to go to each area and hear different background music; it sets a mood. Granted, I'm not crazy enough about it to go buy a soundtrack or something.


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Kylie on 2007-06-05 13:30 ]</font>

Skuda
Jun 5, 2007, 03:31 PM
I don't think the problem lies in the music itself, but more so the lack of music. You do so many different missions in a similar area, but the music is always the same. Slight variations of the area music could make things a lot more interesting.

RAFA
Jun 5, 2007, 03:59 PM
i just started playing psu offline and its kinda cool. But it will never be the same has playing pso. Btw until now i havent found 1 rare item oO if it was in pso i would had found at least 1 within 6 hours -.-



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: RAFA on 2007-06-05 13:59 ]</font>

Jonty
Jun 5, 2007, 04:31 PM
I'm a big grumbler when it comes to psu. A big grumbler. Music, style, rare items (and rare boxes), level design, levelling up (techniques and in general), the class system, the weapons, the fighting, the enemies... You name it, I'll grumble about it. Unfortunately, that won't get me anywhere. Bah.

Luno
Jun 5, 2007, 05:53 PM
The only thing that makes me want to keep playing PSO instead of PSU is the items...I hate synthing...so much. If we could actually find usable weapons in PSU, I would be so happy.

SolomonGrundy
Jun 5, 2007, 06:41 PM
PSO is/was a great game. I have 7 characters over 140. PSU is definely modeled after PSO, it is NOT a 'totally different game.." There are things PSU does better:
1. Meseta now has a use
2. people actually trade (via shops), I no longer have an inventory FULL or 10% varista's that I could sell for...10
3. There is more weapon variety
4. Think you made a mistake in your job? Change it!
5. a LOT of tiny things like buff items for non casters

and more...

that being said, there are also a lot of flaws, and they are deep.

1. combat system is even MORE monotonus than in PSO.
2. Enemy attacks, while better in not being formulaic (ie. booma, go booma, giga-booma), have hitboxes that are far to generous, and speeds that are not enjoyable. I would be happier fighting a slower, more deadly enemy, then one that bounces all over the place, giving me little choice but to exchange blows. Consider ollaka - it is a few meters away, and targets you. You move right, andticipating it's charge. it SWIVELS right. So, you move left, hoping to throw it off. It swivels left. Finally, you back up, and cut an angle when it charges, avoiding it's rush...then BOOP the damage appears on your character anyway, due to lag and large hitboxes. Also, every enemy does not need a status inflicting attack. why does every freaking enemy in this game shoot fireballs or barta??

3. Bosses: flying isn't a defense, it's an annoyance. Neither is teleporting. While there are bosses I enjoy fighting much more on PSU (the dragons, though easy, at least have variable attack patterns, and don't soley rely on flying as a means of defense.


4. things like level design/detail are a given. WHY IS MOATOOB SO FREAKING BIG? System Defense is completely annoying. I've basically given up on moatoob. It combines the worst of the two other planets, without rewards that are commensurate.

5. tons of little things, like armor problems: and high element being too good, and there no being multi-element armor, or add slots, or more choices for 4 slots armor. Or tenora armor being worth anything, or armor syth rates being acceptable. And that's just armor.

zandra117
Jun 5, 2007, 06:44 PM
It's Phantasy Star's "Curse of 3"

Phantasy star 3 was the oddball of the classic PS series and alot of past PS fans didn't like it.
PSO episode 3 was the oddball of the PSO series and alot of PSO fans didn't like it.
PSU is the 3rd incarnation of the PS series and alot of people dont think it is as good as PSO was.

But then Phantasy Star also has the "Blessing of 4"

Phantasy Star 4 is the best of the classic PS series but it is very hard to find because for some reason Sega hasn't re-released it, it is only available for sega genesis and sega saturn.
PSO episode 4 is sometimes considered the best episode of PSO but alot of the PSO fans never played it because it is only available in PSOBB and players feel that PSO is most comfortably played as a console game.

Going by this theory:
Being the 3rd incarnation of the PS series, PSU will probably be labled as the worst PS series. Ambition of Illuminus will probably be the only expansion for PSU before Sonicteam decides to move on into the next generation with the PS series.
The 4th incarnation of the PS series will be Next Gen and will probably be labled as the best PS series of all time but poor marketing or consumer loss of interest in the PS series will cause the Next Gen PS series to have a small community.

Fecesbot
Jun 5, 2007, 07:02 PM
On 2007-06-05 13:14, ljkkjlcm9 wrote:
If you don't like PSU, don't play it, that's all I have to say to all you people crying about it. I certainly won't miss you.

I loved PSO, but I honestly can't understand half your arguments holding any validity, except for that PSO was darker than PSU is.

OH, and everyone complaining about music, I never have it on anyways, I just listen to my own music. That's true with any game that I would play for thousands of hours. I'd definitely get sick of the music, and I did get sick of PSO's music.

THE JACKEL



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: ljkkjlcm9 on 2007-06-05 13:15 ]</font>


if all the people that liked PSO more then PSU left PSU then u would miss us! this is cuz the community would be even redonkulously smaller than it already is. Also i liked the music more in PSO, Spaceship was always so catchy.

Niloklives
Jun 6, 2007, 02:30 PM
On 2007-06-05 10:57, Serephim wrote:
Well, my further input:

Q- PSU is more based on grinding
A- not so much as you think. PSO was easier to level in because it had more levels. Since PSU only has 100, getting to 100 will most likely be like getting to 200, just alot quicker though. It feels so bad because your stats arnt constantly raising.


>_> you DO know PSO v1 ondreamcast capped us at 100? Lvl 200 wasn't until v2. And getting to 100 from 1 tooke me about 4 days. You just spammed EN 3 or 4. I was one of the first people to hit 100 back then and I was called a hacker for weeks to come as a result. The difference is in THIS game, they keep stopping progression thinking that will keep us around longer. The fact of the matter is many people view this as a cheap trick seeing as how if the game were as captivating as it should be, gimmicks like this would be completely unnecessary.

What ends up happening with all the capping and waiting and whatnot is it makes the "universe" seem much smaller and less interesting. yes there are a lot more stages, but these stages don't present a challenge and they don't keep you on your toes. most mobs are just annoying. They have simple patterns that require very little work until the missions are timed.

I'll expand on that:
The most hated planet in PSU is Moatoob. for the most part with small fry are just reskins of parum and cylez monsters with elements switched up a bit. Zoona for example are very similar to shagreece except they spit zonde instead of an advancing damfoie. Jishagara are Seldainians(or whatever they're called) that are ice instead of dark. Naval are Badira. Kogg Nads Are polovohras with a slight twist (and no melee resistance). and for Variety they borrowed Goshin from Neudaiz and made them earth elemental. the major differences come from Bil de vears, Dru Gora and Vanda.

Now even Dru Gora are very much like Kogg Nads...thogh they spit foie rather than charge...so we'll skip them.

Bill De Vears are interesting enemies, but too easy to stun lock with either a good Melee PA or Mayalee Fury. they become a non threat as soon as you figure out how to do that.

This leaves Vanda. What makes vanda so different from other bipedal midsized mobs is that they not only stay in groups like golmon...but they have two different elements they are capable of unleashing at you. point blank melee combat becomes difficult because they don't stagger easily and will either use their damfoie like attacks or hit you with diga. And even if you DO take one on, the others quickly surround you and unleash hell upon any one character. Simple solution: Shoot them. Problem: lots of these guys like to appear with shield/sword icons. bullets are more or less ineffective in these situations. still not a big deal in most cases...just plink away at them longer. however in timed combat scenarios, you HAVE to kill them quickly so in these prssured situations one tends to resort back to melee combat since it would clearly be faster, but you get pounded which gives way to a greater challenge.

Aside from that, everything is just a minor annoyance that take you to a boss that is genrally not very melee friendsly, though some you can just wail on til they die (any form of dragon, even still shooting it is easier).

This game just doesn't apply pressure to even small cparties and these S ranks we all hunt rarely lend themselves to the cause. The few places we do find challenging, bullets and traps are the easy solution...gone now are our 10*-12* weapons that meant anything.

I rememeber I used to get mail constantly from people in PSO on GCN.."WE NEED YOU AND THAT DAMN SNOW QUEEN...THIS SEABED IS TEARING US UP" or S red blades that let even casts buff themselves..or panzer fausts and nug2000s..these new S ranks just don't have that same kind of WTF is that?! appeal. I mean a few inflict status ailments..but silence lvl 1? Freeze lvl 2? these things are only mildly effective even on smaller mobs...

Now don't get me wrong I like PSU...but that word people keep passing around..."uninspired"...that's not some passive agressive way of saying bad. this game lends itself more to eye candy for most things rather than intrigue. I have yet to see anything in this game that instilled the same sense of urgency in me as a del biter. the story in this game is much more involved and yet, I was far more interested in the little peices PSO gave us. I mean when I found out about Olga Flow and what led up to his birth...what had happened to Flowen and what was waiting for me at the bottom of Sea Bed 2...I was freaking out well before I got there. Nothing about this game does that...that's fine...but you can't look at PSU and say it's flat out a better game.

I maintain what I said before:
This game's strong points are in it's character creation/customization, class system and in loose terms its combat system. The rest of the game is very lackluster.

I look at AoI...and i see something that grabs me way more than this one. more variety(weapon types and brands, classes, customization), better maps, larger worlds...it just seems so much more expansive...making that Universe in the title seem so much more true.

I think the only things I would love to see and haven't yet...are something along the lines of rare bosses...and full weapon creation/customization. i mean rather than synthing, why not find parts and assemble your weapons, then add things to them to change their appearances and stats...but that's for anther topic...and I'm rambling...haha

anyway...there's my overly inflated 99999999 meseta on the matter.

Serephim
Jun 6, 2007, 04:16 PM
Im sorry, but the only PSO boss that gave me that extremely Epic feeling was Gal Gryphon, Gol Dragon, and the 2 Final bosses.


PSU bosses Win completely to PSO bosses. I seriously dont remember such an epic feeling as when me and 3 other lvl 10 partners went up aganast De Ragan for the first time on Network mode.

We fought valiantly until he finally finshed us off.

There is NO boss on PSO that can stand up to De Ragan (if hes a higher level that is) except Gal Gryphon and the final bosses.

Even so, ive never fought such a hard boss on PSO.

PSO's bosses were easy because if you could survive his strongest attacks, there's almost no way you can ever lose. The ONLY difference is if the boss Freezes you, which was almost unfair entirely.

PSU on the other hand, if a boss gets you with a powerful attack, it STILL has the ability to kill you. Even if it doesnt OHKO you like on PSO, the attacks still have the ability to pwn your ass simply because the battle engine is better. (Like De-Ragan's Fire Stream Breath still owns me. Its like getting cought in the way of Sil Dragon's Ice Breath. I was trying to Revive one of my partners while he was flying, and he blasted me with that fire beam and the rapid damage killed me before i got the chance to retaliate.)


I agree with some things, but saying something like "PSO bosses were better" is just retarded. I judge bosses on Difficulty, not how cool they look before i completely rape them in 5 seconds with my charge mechguns.








EDIT






By the way, if ANYONE in this conversation doesnt play the Network mode, you seriously need to leave the entire conversation. Before i played Online this game seemed retardedly dull, but the Online version seems to be a completely different experience.




<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Serephim on 2007-06-06 14:19 ]</font>

Akaimizu
Jun 6, 2007, 04:32 PM
For me, AOI has a nice chance to trounce all the previous Phantasy Star Online games. A good feeling everybody will feel a bit powered up with the new goodies; but that also means we can hopefully look forward to monsters that indeed scare all of us. Not just 1 class while it's super simple for another, but just an A-class monster ready to tear everybody to shreds.

Niloklives
Jun 6, 2007, 04:35 PM
I've logged 2k hours or more in network mode...i know my way around. and I have soloed the de ragon in network mode at lvl 6/1 as a cast ranger. and I walked away from it. I'm not talking about difficulty though...I'm talking about atmosphere...honestly in PSO Gizonde > Just about every boss aside from a very select few. but I killed the gol dragon in PSO on Vhard online mode by myself in 10 seconds with a lvl 64 FOmarl...but damn that was a cool boss..not just for looks, but just what he did..variable element, shadow clones...carpet bombing (also variable element)....that is before you knew what you were doing and opened up a can of whoopass with multi part targeting techs...but there were gimmicks and tricks to PSO bosses...in PSU it really feels like you can just stand back and shoot it til it's dead...dragons you can use cards or fifles of bows or nades and just run around and lay into him at no risk. the degahna types you just stand back and shoot them in the center...the gougs you shoot them in the wings. falkis even...stand in the safe spot and shoot him in the head. then in his second form...find a safe spot and shoot him in the head. "oh noes! Meteor!!" if you have enough hitpoints you live and and heal easily enough. if you don't you die...simple as that...can't even try to avoid it...it's silly.

I'm not saying the better number of PSO bosses were harder...because for the most part they weren't...but they felt more intense...they felt more threatening...even if they weren't.

Serephim
Jun 6, 2007, 05:24 PM
Okay your arguements dont make any valid sense.

@ NIloklives

I KNOW you arnt complaing about enemy types on PSU.

PSO Enemy variety:

Boomba Ai = used in every stage in Ep1 except for the Mines, which is basicaly the exact same thing with the ability to be knocked down. (walk to you RELENTLESSLY and hit you. Wow, lots of Variety here) Hell, it was even used in Episode 4 on those things like resemble the Seed forms on PSU , just with mroe range.

Savage Wolf AI = Used only in Forest in Ep1, but Ep2 reused it for almost all of the monsters in the Seaside/Mountian/Jungle area. (all Gues used Savage Wolf AI. Walk around in circles and attack you from behind.)

Canadine AI = Used for the Canadines and Bees in Ep2. (annoying as hell. simple.)

I know i missed a few, but you get where i proved you wrong.




Again, with the Bosses.



Yes, each boss had a nice little gimmick that forced you to swich it up. Sadly, they arnt as awesome the first time you see them as the 900th.

Dragon goes underground

De Rol Le turns off the lights

Vol Opt is a gimmick in itself

Dark Falz uses grants (Equivilent of Falkis using the Meteor. i dont get why you all dont see that. there was NO way to dodge grants. If you think Falkis meteor is cheep, then im sure you HATED Falz's last form.)




You can run away and shoot at ANY pso boss without a risk. Only Exception again is Vol Opt.

Hell, when me and my best friend used to play PSO offline and challege eachother in who can find the most rares/get to the highest level, he would always get higher than me and do things i couldnt with his Ranger because he could shoot from a distance and NEVER get hit.

Hell, when we got to Ultimate Mode, he said the only reason he couldnt take Dark Falz is because in his Second Form he heals quicker than he could snipe off his HP.

Niloklives
Jun 6, 2007, 06:10 PM
o.O did you play episode 2? if all you're going to talk about from ep 2 is the gees...maybe you didn't.

But hey let me list off some interesting enemies

Sinow Zoa and Zele - enemies that could cloak themselves, hit and dissarm you, or freeze you then pummel you to death.

Indi Belra - the standing auto turret that would tag you, knock you down, and confuse you. Then after you got up, keep shooting forcing you to attempt to work your way to him so he could clobber you.

Del Depths darted around in the shape of a thin disk, nearly impossible to hit in this form, but they could sure as hell hit you. Then they'd take a more human form, drop an ice trap and start darting around again. sounds simple, but they had super high evasion, and tended to not stand around just to get beat on.

Delbiters: these guys are what Polavohra should be...I'll leave it at that.

Morphos: they had two sides. one could be hit easily while the other had super high evade. they'd constantly spin and shoot beams that decked you, making it difficult to hit the more vulnerable side while the other enemies closed in on you and put you in stasis.

Marilla..or whatever they were called...giant flowers that could easily oneshot even a lvl 200.

Oh..here's something you didn't mention. Gilchics were unlike the other standard midsized mobs. They were the only enemy in the game that you could knock down for one. but they were much harder to deal with in large numbers epecially if you got surrounded due to their basic attacks inflicting slow, while they also had an unblockable ranged attack. their ultimate form was next to impossible to knock down at lower levels, but they hurt like crazy.

even the candines you didn't give any real credit to. not to say that they were hard, but unlike gees, they actually spawned in clusters sometimes; where they traveled as a unit and surrounded you controlled by a central unit that had very diferent resistances than their drones. if you killed the control bit first the rest of the cluster would close in on you and self destruct.

There's not one enemy in PSU that is as interesting as those enemies. and going out of your way to pick the PSO equivolent or a vahra and a volfu is a clear sign of your shortsightedness. all you proved is that you can't pay attention.

and dark falz had a few other tricks you forgot to mention. the homing shots he would fire...the little blue balls? remember those? if the party ran off in different directions or grouped themselves wrong when he did that, someone was getting tagged and someone was gonna die. I can't tell you how many times I saw someone die on that move just cause they ran clockwise instead of counter clockwise.

or maybe you forgot he made it so you shared damage with him. so if crazy people just started beating on him...once again...someone was gonna die.

You didn't mention olga who had a similar trick..but he didn't even take damage while doing that unless you guessed which attack he was vulnerable to at the time. and it wasn't as simple as melee/ranged/tech. he could pick any one tech to be vulnerable to...all the others were ineffective. standing back and shooting was not an option.

hell..the hit detection is PSO was better. how many times have you been tagged by gifoie from a tengoh when you were 5 meters out of the blast radius?

I'm not even neccesarily talking about difficulty. I'm talking about interesting enemies. most everything in PSU thinks it's a goddamn flea and just jumps at you biting and clawing. or just stands still and throws barta or zonde or whatever the elemental flavor of the month is for that planet. But what may lend itself to the lack of intrigue is that in this game you can knock down or stun lock just about everything. the enemies in PSO required that you time attacks and coordinate your movements with the team just to avoid taking damage. PAs...the right PA in this game bails you out every time...

now I want to clarify. I'm not talking about the way the combo system worked in PSO because the timing system was a bit clumsy. I'm talking about delaying your attacks while you still could time the next strike to keep an enemy stunned so they didn't retaliate.

But hey...deny all you want. my point is I'm still not tired of Olga today. I don't play PSO that often anymore...but Olga is still interesting, creepy and fun. I've fought Falkis 20 times at most and he's already boring.

So...why the hell are you jumping to the aid of this game? are you a game designer in disguise? Is this the game you had been dreaming of since the first time you held a control pad? I'm entitled to to my opinion. I have the right to say "y'know...I like this game and all...but I don't love this game...here are my thoughts as to why" without you saying I should be murdered in cold blood.

And since your most imaginative arguments aside from "you need to get shot" was "boomas were easy" you've grown as boring to me as those boomas are for you. Let me know when you have something genuinely inspired to say.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: NIloklives on 2007-06-06 17:55 ]</font>

Saphion
Jun 6, 2007, 07:33 PM
Actually, NIloklives' argument makes a lot of sense.

A2K
Jun 6, 2007, 08:19 PM
Hmm, he does have a point. A lot of the enemies did have their unique tricks to them, but... a Booma with an unblockable laser and can be knocked down is still a Booma, unfortunately. All the monsters listed are remixes of previous enemies in one way or another; arguably, PSO was simply better at not making this ridiculously obvious.

- All the Sinows had similar patterns, although were faster or slower than others, and had different tricks to them.
- An Indi Belra is a Dark Belra on crack.
- Deldepth: this is where we get to the "not so obvious" part of it. These were essentially, Poufuilly Slime with Barta and the ability to actually hit you in transit.
- Delbiter: A faster and arguably scarier, Chaos Bringer. Later retooled to Episode IV's Dorphon.
- Mericarol and its ilk: Unique when they first emerged as a miniboss, but later rehashed. Further down this line you'll find Girtablulu, along with PSU's SEED-Vance, SEED-Vitace, and Dilla Griena.

A good example of where PSU actually gets this right is with an enemy like the Kog Nadd. It's similar to Polavohra and its ilk, yes, but the defensive spines on its back give it a unique touch--something you just don't see enough of in the various other classes of creatures (especially the smaller ones).

Parn
Jun 6, 2007, 08:46 PM
As I mentioned before, the expansion is probably going to do for PSU what Episode II did for PSO. I think PSU is going to get really fleshed out once the expansion ships.

AweOfShe
Jun 6, 2007, 08:55 PM
PSU is missing NOL'ings, and Character Killing. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif

Niloklives
Jun 7, 2007, 03:19 AM
I mean...if you wanna argue it that, yuo would say golga was falz who walked and the gold drgaon was vol opt with flight mode and bad camera angles.

of course there were similarities. but some of them were not as obvious as others and some were unique fun qualties that made them what they are.

But you missed my point in rgard to gilchics. I didn't mean that being able to knock them down made them these amazing new kinds of creatures. but they seemed to have a slightly diffrent AI and you have to admit. 4 of them surrounding you after you got knocked down by one of their lasers and have them use their double swing to keep you locked in place, and breaking down your evasion, while slowing you and another of them hung back and shot you while you were stuck getting beat on, was a whole lot crazier than a shark man running pu and swinging once or twice then running off.

But I also was me alluding to my comment about how much PAs have changed combat...and how fighting as a hunter doesn't take the same kind of planning as it would in ultimate

The point of listing those enemies was not to say they were unlike anything the PSO players has seen before. the point was to say that those enemies were fun and engaging and your first response when seeing them was "what the hell is that?" and your second response was "RUN AWAY!!!" PSU has never made me feel that way about the enemies. And the unique weapons we saw in PSO in many cases made themselves quite useful in the right situations. these new s ranks feel cheap by comparison.

combine these two factors and I think it starts to explain why PSU feels so uninspired and empty. Especially in combat

pixelsofdeath
Jun 7, 2007, 03:25 AM
polties and pannons ruined the game! wtf, mate

Weeaboolits
Jun 7, 2007, 03:43 AM
Bel Pannons are pretty fun, the nasty little ninja blighters...

Mayu
Jun 7, 2007, 03:47 AM
They are not -_- Barta - Barta - Barta FIGHT ME!!! <.< Stop freezing me

oh booma is the best enemy ever, http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif

Or even Delasabers http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif

DurakkenX
Jun 7, 2007, 04:14 AM
i dislike the battle system of PSU...

Sure PAs are nice and flowing attacks are as well, but the enemies are immune to your attacks. They don't flinch, they don't get knocked back, and they all employ the same type AI (every so often block, if the opoonent is ranged use megid or barta, if they are close up strike, dambarta, or poison you) And everything has an immunity to striking weapons practically. All this is only compounded by a bad permanent camera angle (the firggin thing should not move back to default the moment you are done mnaually moving it.) All this together makes it so you don't have to have the slightest bit of skill because nothing you do will really have a different effect. The best you can do is sit back and dodge and wait for a large opening to show up in all the AIs at once, other wise you'll just be thrown across the room, frozen, or megided.

in PSO you need a little bit of skill to know when and how to make stuff flinch. There was a very different play style involved with light light hard vs light hard light attack pattern. Sure later on when everyone became invincible they did hard hard hard, but that doesn't mean it wasn't an integral part of the game. I don't understand why they even allow you to have 6hit combo in this game when you can't even get the most of them out cuz the MOBs simply don't react to you hitting them. The closest thing to something reacting to you is when you shoot the wings out from the one boss. Every other mob and Boss simply doesn't care whether you are there or not for the most part and the PA hit backs and such are more like as if it came out of nowhere than as really part of the game.

PSU really feels empty and soulless. The game literally looks like a ghost town and it makes you feel unconnected from that world in so many ways that are easily fixed and that should be have been in there and they aren't going to improve upon in the forseeable future.

PSO only really died because Sega let it and because people had seen and did everything. Not because it was time to be put out to pasture. If it's still compatible with the system that i have years down the line more than likely I'll pop it back in and continue adding to that 20,000+ hours i have logged on that game and I'm not talking about ep4 as that is trash and has been since it's release. I'm talking about ep1 and 2 and possibly 3 if I ever get a ROM of it. PSU though, sure I'll prolly buy all the expansions and play it on and off till it dies out, but more than likely Once the servers are dead, I won't ever pop back in the game or have fond memories of the characters and considering I'm prolly the one currently knows and cares the most about the characters in the game that's gotta tell you something when not even someone like me will miss them.

Niloklives
Jun 7, 2007, 04:37 AM
yep...that's how I feel...

Niloklives
Jun 7, 2007, 05:33 AM
PSO was pay to play ever since v2...kinda a moot point there...

but the point is PSO felt alive..bad graphics or not...PSU doesn't.

But on the subject of graphucs...it's not hard to retune graphics...heck they already remade boomas and grass assassins(which by the way the latter ones have me ready to start importing by themselves)

A2K
Jun 7, 2007, 10:48 AM
On 2007-06-07 01:19, NIloklives wrote:
I mean...if you wanna argue it that, yuo would say golga was falz who walked and the gold drgaon was vol opt with flight mode and bad camera angles.

No, Gol Dragon was basically a Dragon that had an electric attack and could clone itself. Olga Flow was a different boss entirely from Dark Falz.

of course there were similarities. but some of them were not as obvious as others and some were unique fun qualties that made them what they are.

But you missed my point in rgard to gilchics. I didn't mean that being able to knock them down made them these amazing new kinds of creatures. but they seemed to have a slightly diffrent AI and you have to admit. 4 of them surrounding you after you got knocked down by one of their lasers and have them use their double swing to keep you locked in place, and breaking down your evasion, while slowing you and another of them hung back and shot you while you were stuck getting beat on, was a whole lot crazier than a shark man running pu and swinging once or twice then running off.

The point of listing those enemies was not to say they were unlike anything the PSO players has seen before. the point was to say that those enemies were fun and engaging and your first response when seeing them was "what the hell is that?" and your second response was "RUN AWAY!!!" PSU has never made me feel that way about the enemies.

Olga Flow is an entirely different boss from Dark Falz with its own form and unique patterns. Gol Dragon, on the other hand, as its name suggests, was (yet another) dragon, except this one had the occasional electric attack and a clone effect.

Gilchics had the laser they would occasionally use, other than that, they were mechanical Booma and nothing more. Their combination of short- and long-range tactics is no different from, say, an Olgohmon using Barta, and alternatively, Gibarta when you've closed in.

As for nothing that made you go "RUN AWAY," have you never fought a sword/shield variant Go Vahra or hit that last room of Lab Recovery with the two groups (and sometimes three) of four Jarba at once? Granted, about the millionth time running missions with them they don't seem so scary anymore... but then again that was the case for PSO as well.

Saphion
Jun 7, 2007, 12:06 PM
I dunno, Ultimate mode was always pretty terrifying regardless of level.

Well, to me anyway http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

Niloklives
Jun 7, 2007, 01:02 PM
I've never felt like i was in danger of anything after I hit lvl 15 in PSU.

you and and seraphim keep arguing AI...I'm not talking about AI. I'm talking about enemies that figuratively jumped out at me. they don't have to be completely unique. they don't have to be completely original. they just have to strike a cord somewhere that gets your attention and makes you say "ah crap, not more of these freaks!"

of course there are similarities. i mean heck, pan arms and grass assassing and rappies are nothing new. we'd seen them all before...but the environments the creatures, the ambiance in its entirety. Del Biters cornering you in a narrow hallway. Sinow Zoas dropping down from the ceiling. hitting you immediately and then cloaking. walking into a dark room and getting gunned down by indi belras, getting confused and being unable to see. howlinng monkies springing around and making you chase them about as their friends started hitting you from behind with their fists and techs. even hildebears which on higher difficulties jumped at you so fast you barely had time to be suprised. it just felt like you had to work to get to the end.

it's just a lot of litte things. indi belras may not have seemed as big a deal if someone could easily sneak up behind them and kep them stun locked with spiral dance. del biters would probably have seemed tame if you could just tip them over. The bosses in here might seem threatening if they actually chased you rather than just sit there and make you move on occasion. like i said. it's not about difficulty, it's not really about AI...it's just the enemies back then made you feel like there was a sense of urgency as you fough them. it got you worked up. when you got one of those nice 10* 11* 12* items, you felt like it was gonna help even the score. in this game, PAs do it all for you...so now our biggest worries are if the weapon that we just synthed will make it to +5 so we can squeeze another 20-50 damage out of it per hit.

you can keep driving the gilchics are mecha boomas point as much as you want. to me, being the only enemy you could knock down, the only enemy you could while they were down, they way they lumbered toward you, the way they got back up...they way they crowed around you...it was weird and creepy and a pain to fight them when they were in large groups. - the difference here being you never see 4 or 5 olgamon close in on you and start wailing on you while two more stand back and shoot out barta. they just stand there, pretictable and boring. I can stand there and shoot them from out of their range and never have to look to my sides or try to hold off the ones closing in on me. just stand there and shoot.

but in this game...I was lvl 76 fighting lvl 105 go vahras in groups of 3-4...lvl 85 buffed go vahras in groups of 3 or 4...Meleeing them...as a guntecher...with a low % shiratsuno zashi. and I only had to heal once in any of those instances...heck if I wanted to use my xbow I probably never would have gotten hit. how can I feel a sense of urgency when I feel practically invincible?

There's no sense of accomplishment in this game, no sense of purpose. just run these same missions over and over with no challenge factor...the only reason most people want these special weapons now is because they look cool or have slightly better stats, but even the ones with status effects tacked onto them are nothing to get excited over. because all bullets have status effects on them, all weapons can use PAs which all stagger or launch or wipe out or knock back anything they touch...even techs don't have the same flare as before...

But...hey...at least no more booma AIs right? >_>

DurakkenX
Jun 7, 2007, 01:52 PM
PSO - Wolf AI = walks around you and attacks from behind
PSU - Wolf type AI = charges and then runs around in a circle for no particular purpose

PSO - Booma AI = Groups together and sometimes moved around so that they are on both sides of you.
PSU - Booma type AI = Walks towards you and hits you... if you hit it, it just hits you again... when you walk towards it, it blocks till you walk away.

PSO - Dragon AI = Breathed fore, walked on you, sometimes took off flying to reland a second later right on top of you, while in air breathed fire...went underground, spiraled in and then made three attacks towards an individuals.
PSU - Dragon AI = walks forward, randomly breathes fire, charges at whoever has is attacking it the most, usually a gunner, sometimes rears up and stomps the ground, turns swiftly sometimes, flys back and forth between 2 points and breathes a fire beam or a fire ball, then sometimes flies in a circle.

PSU has more stuff attacks and such added, but the better AI is clearly PSO's and if not the AI just the set actions the enemies take are just better... The reaction and the actions of the mobs make you drawn into the game more. In PSO the mobs had no aggro function...in PSU they do... but it is badly utilized and PSOs attack whatever's closer is far better.

PSU overall just has no life and doesn't draw you in... Sega was just hoping we were blinded by the faster pace and we were but then we all realized there was no substance. PSU is like going to McDonalds', ordering a cheeseburger, and when you get your order you get a bun, but no cheese or burger ^.^

Niloklives
Jun 7, 2007, 02:13 PM
well at least someone sees it.

Weak
Jun 7, 2007, 02:41 PM
Allow me to briefly describe my reactions to PSU, by month:

October - Launch: Wow, this is freaking awesome. Oh man, battle system is so cool. Hmm.. that character lag is kinda odd but whatever. This is so amazing. Synthing is great too, doesn't take too long to make stuff.

November: Hm... alright, there really aren't many missions but it's still pretty fun. Almost level 50... wait, that's the max? Bah..

December: Okay, so we have new classes now, increased level cap finally. But why do I feel so damn bored? This is starting to just feel like a grind. It takes so long to do anything.

January: Lord, are they going to release any rare weapons? It's been months and I'm still bumbling around looking like everyone else. I want to advance my character.

February: These S missions are just annoying, it's like we're just beating up on each other, I can't dodge these ridiculously fast and unfair attacks. Okay, I can't take this anymore. I really can't.

May (Stopped playing for a while): Heh.. S2 missions, eh? Jesus christ, this level grind is just absurd. This isn't even fun. Where did this go so wrong?!

June: Hey, maybe I'll just pick up that expansion when it comes out. Maybe then I'll feel like logging on.

To avoid going off on a tangent about the PSO to PSU transition, I'll just say this.

PSU vastly improved many aspects of PSO, but completely ruined half the fun of it. The part that kept me playing. Most people would say this is just nostalgia, but no, it's not. There are some big things they left out.

Fecesbot
Jun 9, 2007, 04:22 PM
On 2007-06-07 12:13, NIloklives wrote:
well at least someone sees it.



Its not hard to notice.
I felt the same as u when i played PSO, especially when i fought Falz and Flow. (Olga Flow is still mah favorite boss).
Even though PSU has the upgraded graphics and combat system, etc... it just lacks the environment, weapons, enemies, and music that gave PSO such a great atmosphere.

(i love the new weapon types its just the rares need to be a little more unique.)

Niloklives
Jun 9, 2007, 06:05 PM
xD I was mainly just saying that because it seemed like drakken and I were the only ones arguing those points the last few days. but yeah...PSU is clean...so clean it's sterile.