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View Full Version : question about kubara weaps i.e svaltus sword, bear claws,et



majan
Jul 16, 2007, 11:13 AM
ok so we've established that melee kubara weapons that you can buy and synth and the whole 9 yards have a (~20%?) damage output reduction while using photon arts. does the same apply to kubara weapons such as crea doubles?bear claws?svaltus sword?etc etc etc...

if so,then that sucks even more than buying kubara weaps and grinding them just to find out they still suck...kinda like spending all that time running sleeping warriors to get a svaltus sword to find out it really isnt that strong either and it just looks thug,which is cool,but for my rare weaps,I want slightly more than looks.

RegulusHikari
Jul 16, 2007, 11:49 AM
I would assume that it applies to all Kubara. But I have to say I haven't seen a big drop in the damage from my Doubles and Halp.

But wouldn't the -20% damage done during PAs kind of NEGATE the big PP bonus that Kubara weapons have going for them? I mean, yay I get to use a full PA once, MAYBE two more times... but if I'm dealing 20% less damage overall, what's the point?

The theory behind Kubara weapons is nice, but when all of the benefits of them are outclassed (oooh they grind well, but most only beat their standard counterparts at +5 and above, and EVEN then a +5 standard is still easier to obtain) by normal weapons, where's the incentive to use them? They're gray/black? That's seriously the best answer I can come up with.

I think Kubara weapons need a more noticeable affect when grinding. Actually... Kubara weapons shouldn't lose a max grind counter if they fail in AoI. O_o That would be nice.

McLaughlin
Jul 16, 2007, 11:51 AM
I'm fairly sure that the reduction is 10%, not 20%.

Mayu
Jul 16, 2007, 11:52 AM
It's 10%

Ryoki
Jul 16, 2007, 11:57 AM
Then don't create bootleg copies of stuff if you don't like it.

ljkkjlcm9
Jul 16, 2007, 12:13 PM
it's 10% reduction, and yes it applies to all Kubara, including my crea doubles. But you know what, I don't care because doublesabers are meant for the melee attack that hits 4 enemies anyways. Either way they're still doing good damage with the PAs

THE JACKEL

Rashiid
Jul 16, 2007, 12:17 PM
even Kubara guns? (i.e; Maggac, Raihoc)

McLaughlin
Jul 16, 2007, 12:18 PM
I think it only applies to melee weapons.

Rashiid
Jul 16, 2007, 12:21 PM
schweet. kubara 6*s are made of win. =]

so this is Pure Kubara (monster weaps n such) or for Kubara-varients? (Two-Headed Ragnic or sumthin)

or both?

Wash
Jul 16, 2007, 01:18 PM
Sorry to change the subject, but I have another question regarding Kubara weapons (namely guns, because I'm a Fortegunner). Do they recharge faster; as in more PP more per charge (as you can see I have almost no Kubara weapons...)?

majan
Jul 16, 2007, 02:56 PM
On 2007-07-16 09:51, Obsidian_Knight wrote:
I'm fairly sure that the reduction is 10%, not 20%.


right.thanks.wasn't entirely sure about the exact number.can we perhaps propose that this is submitted to the PSOW database?





On 2007-07-16 09:49, RegulusHikari wrote:
I would assume that it applies to all Kubara. But I have to say I haven't seen a big drop in the damage from my Doubles and Halp.

But wouldn't the -20% damage done during PAs kind of NEGATE the big PP bonus that Kubara weapons have going for them? I mean, yay I get to use a full PA once, MAYBE two more times... but if I'm dealing 20% less damage overall, what's the point?

The theory behind Kubara weapons is nice, but when all of the benefits of them are outclassed (oooh they grind well, but most only beat their standard counterparts at +5 and above, and EVEN then a +5 standard is still easier to obtain) by normal weapons, where's the incentive to use them? They're gray/black? That's seriously the best answer I can come up with.

I think Kubara weapons need a more noticeable affect when grinding. Actually... Kubara weapons shouldn't lose a max grind counter if they fail in AoI. O_o That would be nice.



indeed. the PP bonus isnt always all that great,either. Al sevacs, the moatoob derived kubara twin sabers,get a lot of atp(which of course is negated a little bit) but get very cruddy PP bonuses.so for people expecting the weapon to live up to the healthy ATP number on the screen,they will be disappointed,much like I was.

but yeah,this only seems to apply to kubara melee.other weaps such as tech and range apparently are really gangster, or so Im told.who knows whatll happen in AOI though,maybe theyll get rid of the 10% penalty.

thanks for answering the question though,whether or not the 10% reduction applies to other 'rare' kubaras.

if you are just tuning in, we have established that there is a 10% damage penalty for melee kubara weapons when using a photon art.this applies to all *melee* kubara weapons.

majan
Jul 16, 2007, 02:58 PM
On 2007-07-16 11:18, Wash wrote:
Sorry to change the subject, but I have another question regarding Kubara weapons (namely guns, because I'm a Fortegunner). Do they recharge faster; as in more PP more per charge (as you can see I have almost no Kubara weapons...)?



I'm not entirely sure beucase I dont use mechguns THAT much,but I think my machineguc does recharge faster than a normal one.that's all I got,Im sure someone will drop by with a better answer sooner or later.

XenithFlare
Jul 16, 2007, 03:04 PM
Kubara guns don't recharge FASTER, in the strictest sense; they charge MORE at a time. For example, the Shigga Bines recharges 12PP every five seconds. The Shigga Bomac recharges 16PP every five seconds (if I remember the numbers correctly, that is)

drizzle
Jul 16, 2007, 03:23 PM
These weapons recharging more is a feature of that individual weapon, not of the Kubara brand. Some Kubara weapons recharge slower than their brand counterparts.

Zorafim
Jul 16, 2007, 03:26 PM
So, it's confirmed that all kubaras do less damage during their PAs than their counterparts, along with being harder to make? What's the point of them, then?

Mayu
Jul 16, 2007, 03:28 PM
They grind well lol <.<

and most of them higher PP then normal

Zorafim
Jul 16, 2007, 03:31 PM
They'd need to grind 10% better than a non-kubara to be worthwhile, or have so much pp that you'd never put it down. Ah, so much for me wanting svaltus sword...

majan
Jul 16, 2007, 03:58 PM
On 2007-07-16 13:26, Zorafim wrote:
So, it's confirmed that all kubaras do less damage during their PAs than their counterparts, along with being harder to make? What's the point of them, then?




On 2007-07-16 13:28, Ryuugu-Rena wrote:
They grind well lol <.<

and most of them higher PP then normal





well,the guns and tech weaps are better than their counterparts.but remember,the damage penalty only applies to the melee weapons.the melee ones dont always get much higher PP than the others,and their damage sucks,so even with the extra pp on some of them,its negated by subpar damage.

Kion
Jul 16, 2007, 04:24 PM
I think the kubara melee go along with ultimate PA's. My neutral gudda brebac +10 does aout the same damage as a 20% weapon of the correct element on the ultimate PA (normal damage was slightly lower). In addition The brebacs have higher acc, so a lot more hits land resulting for higher damage.
I think the stats grind to fit their individual ultmita PA's for that weapon as I heard a range of things of how they grind. I would test this with ryo misakics, but they keep breaking.

XenithFlare
Jul 16, 2007, 04:35 PM
I need damn kubara wood to synth the rest of mine. D: It's not cool

Wash
Jul 16, 2007, 06:31 PM
On 2007-07-16 13:04, XenithFlare wrote:
Kubara guns don't recharge FASTER, in the strictest sense; they charge MORE at a time. For example, the Shigga Bines recharges 12PP every five seconds. The Shigga Bomac recharges 16PP every five seconds (if I remember the numbers correctly, that is)



Yeah, that's what I meant; not recharging faster, but when they do charge it's worth more PP. Thanks for the answer.

Niloklives
Jul 17, 2007, 07:11 AM
On 2007-07-16 13:31, Zorafim wrote:
They'd need to grind 10% better than a non-kubara to be worthwhile, or have so much pp that you'd never put it down. Ah, so much for me wanting svaltus sword...



a lot of them have lower atp requirements, or have better PP regen rates, or more PP or a combination of those. though you have to grind them to see these benefits. the big difference being a slight change in play style.

Kubara guns tend to offer more bang for your buck. they usually have high PP, much lower ATA reqs and good ATP. the best excample being and Alteric. At +10 it has about 660 atp, almost 1300 PP and only requites 83 ata to equip iirc. ths makes it stronger than even an Ulteri + 6 or +7, with only a bit less pp at that point. and while it takes over 140 to equip that ulteri, even a lower level newman FT can equip it. in the hands of a Guntecher or a Protranser, that Bow is useful to even a lvl 90 with only and ulteri at a high grind able to compete and lets face in, B rank weapons are easier to grind, B rank grinders are easier to make. PLUS the Alteric just looks cool.

the only downside to this weapon is its lower PP regen. Yohmei regen rates being what they are, Yohmei regen beats ouy the kubaa regen rate for bow in general. Still...I only hung up my Alteric +10 when I made my Ulteri +10. that weapon is nothing to sneeze at.

Similarly, the Riflic is a fantastic Kubara rifle, the kubara mockups of GRM brand mech guns have great pp which is one of the most if not THE mos important stat on a mech.

Even some kubara melee gets high scores in good places. the bil de axe has high atp and insanely high PP. so what if you do 10% less damage on a PA. you can perform roughly three more combos with your axe and the higher atp makes the 10% drop very hard to notice. The Carriguine Rucar has over 600pp. about 200 more than even the crea doubles. that's 4 more times I can perform a full combo with my PAs and think how much more use each photon charge gives me in that case.

I'm not saying all kubara weapons are made of win, but neither are all weapons of any one brand...you just gotta figure out what works for you and go with it. but any kubara weapons you don't want, just send em my way.

majan
Jul 17, 2007, 11:01 AM
On 2007-07-17 05:11, NIloklives wrote:

On 2007-07-16 13:31, Zorafim wrote:
They'd need to grind 10% better than a non-kubara to be worthwhile, or have so much pp that you'd never put it down. Ah, so much for me wanting svaltus sword...



a lot of them have lower atp requirements, or have better PP regen rates, or more PP or a combination of those. though you have to grind them to see these benefits. the big difference being a slight change in play style.

Kubara guns tend to offer more bang for your buck. they usually have high PP, much lower ATA reqs and good ATP. the best excample being and Alteric. At +10 it has about 660 atp, almost 1300 PP and only requites 83 ata to equip iirc. ths makes it stronger than even an Ulteri + 6 or +7, with only a bit less pp at that point. and while it takes over 140 to equip that ulteri, even a lower level newman FT can equip it. in the hands of a Guntecher or a Protranser, that Bow is useful to even a lvl 90 with only and ulteri at a high grind able to compete and lets face in, B rank weapons are easier to grind, B rank grinders are easier to make. PLUS the Alteric just looks cool.

very true.ive heard rave reviews about the alteric(hence their sillyness prices,on the 360 servers.search for alterics for a good laugh every once in a while.)

the only downside to this weapon is its lower PP regen. Yohmei regen rates being what they are, Yohmei regen beats ouy the kubaa regen rate for bow in general. Still...I only hung up my Alteric +10 when I made my Ulteri +10. that weapon is nothing to sneeze at.

grats

Similarly, the Riflic is a fantastic Kubara rifle, the kubara mockups of GRM brand mech guns have great pp which is one of the most if not THE mos important stat on a mech.

I'm very impressed with my machineguc,which is only at (5)
Even some kubara melee gets high scores in good places. the bil de axe has high atp and insanely high PP. so what if you do 10% less damage on a PA. you can perform roughly three more combos with your axe and the higher atp makes the 10% drop very hard to notice. The Carriguine Rucar has over 600pp. about 200 more than even the crea doubles. that's 4 more times I can perform a full combo with my PAs and think how much more use each photon charge gives me in that case.

O.O I did not know that about the rucar.get me one please?nah,but damn that's pretty good stuff.good point though.

I'm not saying all kubara weapons are made of win, but neither are all weapons of any one brand...you just gotta figure out what works for you and go with it. but any kubara weapons you don't want, just send em my way.

already got rid of my al sevacs http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif sorry

Kion
Jul 17, 2007, 12:45 PM
Alll B rank kubara weapons tend to have insane power and faster regeneration. I think thy're for basic classes to be able to use a powerful weapon. At +10 they reach some where in between about a normal 8 and 9 star weapon. With the faster PP regen and sexy style, they make their way one to many people's pallets.

Rashiid
Jul 17, 2007, 12:50 PM
yeah i left my controller idle for liek 40 seconds and i had my empty Maggac out; then i come back and its practically full again

XenithFlare
Jul 17, 2007, 12:51 PM
I have to make the obligatory comment about the Rucar's horrible PP regen and ATA. Noooooooooot worth it, unless you like using a TON of Photon Charges to make up for missing half your targets, and to compensate for your points not naturally returning mis-use. =P

SolomonGrundy
Jul 17, 2007, 01:47 PM
I also would like to see an example of this. I have a 20% ground set of deljagnus's blades Twin sabers (+2). Does this mean a set of 20% deaths dancers (+3) will do more damage?

pics please...



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: SolomonGrundy on 2007-07-17 11:48 ]</font>

drizzle
Jul 17, 2007, 03:14 PM
Huh.

Each weapon has its own attributes. Just because Alteric+10 rocks doesn't mean all Kubara weapons grind well. And in fact most do not.

Kion
Jul 17, 2007, 04:52 PM
I've been playing around with A rank kubara weapons and they grind very differently from B rank kubara weapons. B ranks tend have tons of power and PP while they tend to lack on acc and other attributes. The A ranks seem to grind in many different variations.
My tengoh bow has low power but TONS of pp and acc. It's perfect on my beast wartecher the only bow PA I use with her is chousei-sou. The firing rate is about the same as the pp regen so the bow almost never runs out of PP and the attack % combined with the atp from my character makes up for the low stats on the bow.
And my gudda brebacs +10 have ballanced stats with an exception towards really good acc. The ultimate PA hits alot more and does alot more damage over all than normal knuckles.

So it all depends on how you use them


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Kion on 2007-07-17 15:52 ]</font>

Niloklives
Jul 17, 2007, 06:05 PM
which just goes back to why kubara's have that "mileage may vary" sticker.

Playstyle has to be taken into account with them.

Xenith you can bash the rucar all you want. the low ATA is of little consequence to me as a cast especially since i tend not to attack from the front. the PA i use is spiral dance and I use it to stunlock large enemies. as a result I'm behind them at all times, so the ata could be 0 and I wouldn't care.