PSU-Item: Wartecher: Wands

[PALRAPPYS]

A wand for a Wartecher.

Well today my brother was deciding upon which advanced class he wanted to choose for his alternate character. Now, Wartecher is a class that should revolve around using all the things it can. Melee, ranged, and teching. Now I think most of you would say my brother isn't suited for Wartecher. He using one wand. One. For resta and reverser. He hates the attack TECHNICs... lol.

How do you manage with the wands for your Wartechers?

Poll question: How many wands do you carry with you generally?

[Rizen]

When I was playing Wartecher, I carried around 3. One for buffs, one for healing, and one mixed one.

[Wallin]

I don't see a problem at all with only using one wand.

[RedX]

Technically i carried 3. I had 2 for a 4 buffs and a Resta & Reverser one. But i'm a CAST so my attack tech wouldn't do much.

[Ffuzzy-Logik]

A WT must have at least 3 wands.

I use:

1. Cometarac (Shifta/Deband)
2. Cometarac (Zodial/Retier)
3. Lidra (Resta/Reverser)
4. Lidra (backup R/R and occasionally used for attack techs/debuffs when those are actually useful [i.e. almost never])

Number 3 never leaves my palette. Numbers 1 and 2 are always there when there's no fT. Number 4 usually replaces number 1 after it runs out of PP.


But no, a good WT cannot carry only 1 wand.

[DaRkWoLf30]

3-4, 2 for resta and reveser, 1 for shifta and deband, other for resta and giresta.

[Ffuzzy-Logik]

A WT doesn't need Giresta. >_>

[Android18]

I use 2 with my Wartecher Human. One has Foie/Gifoie and the other has Resta/Shifta. Then I use Twin Daggers, Cards, Twin Sabers, etc.

I like the class, but I'm gonna have to say though that Acrotecher looks far more appealing with all of the S-Ranks and boosts to tech spells and what not.

[Kent]

I use three.

One for area-appropriate attack techniques, one for situation-appropriate buffs (usually Shifta/Deband or Shifta/Retier), and one for Resta and Reverser.

[Fure_Rakune]

Three for me.
One with Resta/Zodial, other with Shifta/Deband and the last with Zalure/Jellen.
If there is a fortetecher in the party however, I switch out zodeel for zodial and focus on debuffing.

[HaydenX]

3:

1. Resta + retier
2. Foie + jellen
3. Diga + Gidiga

[Powder Keg]

I carry three. One heal, one support, and one attack. If a FT is in the party who buffs, even better because then I can switch the buff wand to another attack one.

[Ffuzzy-Logik]

On 2007-08-04 22:48, Kent wrote:
I use three.

One for area-appropriate attack techniques, one for situation-appropriate buffs (usually Shifta/Deband or Shifta/Retier), and one for Resta and Reverser.

All four buffs are always appropriate in all situations. If you're going to support, support; no sense in half-assing it.

[Powder Keg]

When I'm a Wartecher, you either get half support, or you don't get shit. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif

[Android18]

Hehe, I can't stand some people who complain about not getting the full buff-down. It's annoying, i just wanna say 'I'm not a Fortetecher, and I'm definately not your personal buffer, go change to fT if you want buffs.' Then again I only buff for self-benefit (while attempting to get others in the ring) I use shifta only.

[Xaeris]

I carry six wands with me. To be fair though, there's rarely ever more than three on my palette, and ideally, there's only two. The extra wands are just backup buff and heal sticks to conserve my photon charges for my weapons.

[Cz]

Equipment:
1. Twin Daggers - that spining skill (forgot name)
2. Dagger - also that spining skill
3. majimra with handgun - diga and resta (3 extra majimra with similar skills just in case it ran out of pp)
4. cometerac with handgun - resta and reverser
5. cometerac with card - red and yellow buffs
6. cometerac with card - white and blue buffs

Armor:
Yamata senba
head: sori/force
body: mega/rainbow
arm: mega/power (i think...the one that give 25 atp and 15 ata)

I like to use magic more than meleeing...i am more of a supporter and prefer to play in the back.
that is all for my wartecher. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif

[SolomonGrundy]

I carry:
1 majirmra
2 lidra
2 cometara (+4)
1 cometarac
2 w'gacros (+8)
2 batons (+10)

the batons are for buffs (740pp, cheat to recharge)
the w'gacros are for cheap back-ups when I am using a lot pp
cometara is for resta
Cometarac is when I am debuffing (pretty pp intensive)

lidra, and majimra are my bread and butter wands.

I have 4 wands on my pallete, and sometimes 5.
(female newman WT).

Example set up - Labs:
empty, Majimra(diga, gidiga)
ice card, lidra (barta, dambarta)
empty, cometarac (jellen, zodial)
empty, baton (shifta, deband)
card, cometara (resta, retrier)
Twin sabers - ground

[Umberger]

Not to mention that the W'Gacros+10 has the same TP as a Majimra+6 (576). That's basically the same damage you would get from a Mayrod (575 base TP). It also, of course, costs much much less to recharge. The only problem is it may take a few to get one to +10, and they cost 35,000 a piece from the NPC. You might be better off player shopping those. =p

[Fleur-de-Lis]

Back when I played one, it was 4 low-grinded Tenora for me. Shifta/Deband, Retier/Zodial, Resta/Reverser, Diga/Damufoie. Bow and Spear to boot. Only made it to WT2 before retiring though.

One wand sounds like a pretty offensively-oriented portfolio, but I don't think I could play it that way. I say good on him if he can.

[mvffin]

handgun / Shifta / Deband
kikami / zodial / zalure
kikami / resta / reverser
(empty) / Buten Shurenzan
(empty) / Buten Shurenzan
bow or twin dagger or twin claw

this is generally what I use.

[Kismet]

I think that 3-5 wands is a good number to have, depending on the technics you have, the quality/kind of those technics, how strong the wands are, etc.

I personally have a healing wand, buff wand, and two attack wands.

[Sinue_v2]

I carry three wands on Neika, three on NM.

Neika:
- Resta & Reverser
- Shifta & Deban
- Jellen & Zelure (Ocassionally with Foie)

NM-3084
- Resta & Reverser
- GiBarta & GiFoie
- GiZonde & Rammegid

My WT's are focused on different aspects of teching. Neika obviously for support - and NM for offense. Don't expect me to cast offensive techs with Neika, and with NM - don't count on support.

I may start offensive casting just a bit more with Neika when Megistar (or whatever that tech is that holds all the buffs in one) is released. Not sure yet.

[BanF]

1. Rafoie-Shifta

2. Rabarta-Deband

3. Resta-Reverser

I used to have one wand for the attack techniques and one for the buffs, but then I tried them as above and the wand becoming "colored" provides a noticeable difference for all spells, so I use it like that now.

The other three weapon slots are taken by a two twin sabers, and either a twin dagger or a bow, depending on what I expect to face.

I've yet to find anyone demaning "the full buffing". The day I do I will either mock the guy all over the mission, or kick him if it's my run.

[Sekani]

I carry anywhere from one to four wands.

resta/reverser
shifta/zodial or retier
jellen/zalure
attack techs

And despite what others claim, the full four-buff setup is not a necessity.

[Shiro_Ryuu]

My female Newman has her pallete something like this:
Saber + Kikami
Saber + Pistol
Longbow or Wand [Nukes] + Pistol or Saber + Pistol
Wand [Resta and Reverser] + Pistol
Wand [Nukes] + Kikami
Wand [Nukes] + Pistol

Wartecher is more of a placeholder job for her though since I really want to make her into an Acrotecher when AoI comes out. I don't really use support other than heals because its tough on my pallete and I don't think that anyone would want my tier 2 buffs when Fortetecher can cast higher level buffs, and in AoI, all other techer types can cast better buffs. That isn't to say that I won't level my buffs, but I won't use those as a Wartecher. I think its pretty mandatory for a techer to at least have resta and reverser on their pallete at all times, even if fT can use better resta, at least have resta for yourself if the fT doesn't want to heal or if they can't for some reason.

[Realmz]

right now i just use two wands, one for healing, and one for attacking.
having pretty much all the attacking techs is a bit of a help cause then i can just change the wand for whatever run i'm doing. (character was gonna be a FT until i said "i like hitting stuff too")
I'm looking into getting another for Jellen and Zoldeel tho as with my cast as a WT i saw that those gave me the best results even at low levels.

so yeah two (and eventually three i hope) wands other slots are dagger/gun, twin daggers, and a melee weapon of my choice (claws, fists, spear, that sorta thing)

[Kent]

On 2007-08-04 23:21, Ffuzzy-Logik wrote:

On 2007-08-04 22:48, Kent wrote:
I use three.

One for area-appropriate attack techniques, one for situation-appropriate buffs (usually Shifta/Deband or Shifta/Retier), and one for Resta and Reverser.

All four buffs are always appropriate in all situations. If you're going to support, support; no sense in half-assing it.



Your name fits you well.

Not all situations call for all buffs to always be active, and there's no sense in giving people a buff that they won't/can't use.

[DonRoyale]

Shifta/Zoldial
Diga/Dambarta
Resta/Reverser

Duh...>.>

[Shiro_Ryuu]

Wouldn't it be a better idea to put another ice spell with Dambarta and the same w/ Diga? Blue and orange wands do more damage than green ones if I'm not mistaken.

[Xaeris]

It's a 4% bonus to the total TP of the tech with a link bonus. It's not worth using a fourth space on the palette if you don't really need the techs you've linked for the bonus if you're not actually using them.

[Realmz]

On 2007-08-05 11:20, Xaeris wrote:
It's a 4% bonus to the total TP of the tech with a link bonus. It's not worth using a fourth space on the palette if you don't really need the techs you've linked for the bonus if you're not actually using them.



true, i find myself using mostly Foie and Diga so right now those two are my defaults

i hear Dambarta is the only damu spell to get, what about damdiga?

[Ffuzzy-Logik]

On 2007-08-05 10:40, Kent wrote:
Not all situations call for all buffs to always be active, and there's no sense in giving people a buff that they won't/can't use.

The only person who cannot use a buff is Shifta on a fT, and if they are using a bow or card, then they can use Shifta.

Otherwise, extra DFP/ATA/EVP//TP/MST is never a bad thing for any class.


If you can use buffs, it is your obligation to use all of them. No exceptions.

[Xaeris]

On 2007-08-05 16:18, Ffuzzy-Logik wrote:
The only person who cannot use a buff is Shifta on a fT, and if they are using a bow or card, then they can use Shifta.

Otherwise, extra DFP/ATA/EVP//TP/MST is never a bad thing for any class.


If you can use buffs, it is your obligation to use all of them. No exceptions.



Erm...no. I mean, nevermind the fact that Deband entirely is questionable given the sheer worthlessness of DFP as the game calculates damage, but Retier's MST boost is useless as enemy technic users are few, far and between. Shoot, even when they do pop up, shaving 10 points of damage off an Olgohon's Barta or a Gaozoran's Foie ain't doing jack when it's hitting for 600 to start with.

And if I'm buffing, I'd imagine there are no fTs that'd need the TP boost. And if for some crazy reason *I* want it, I'll save the palette space and eat a Retaride instead.

Shifta and Zodial are the only two buffs a WT has any real obligation to cast when he or she is on buff duty. Deband goes up because blue is a pretty color and that's it.

[Powder Keg]

On 2007-08-05 16:18, Ffuzzy-Logik wrote:
If you can use buffs, it is your obligation to use all of them. No exceptions.



Fucking lol @ this. Is your PSU Guideline in stores?

[Kismet]

Like it has been said, it depends on your personal needs/wants/preferences (and budget in some cases) when it comes to how many wands you need and what you should put on those wands. How much you use technics on the wand, let alone that wand in general, is entirely up to the user.

If you want to argue about using buffs and what techs are appropiate for what situations, make a topic pertained to that. Don't flood up this person's help-seeking thread with your irrevelant quandaries. He's trying to make an educated guess based on feedback from the PSOW forum community. Not pick the opinion of winning debater to heed to.

(Besides, Ffuzzy-Logik you need to stop trying to sound like what YOU know about WT is the way WT should be played by everyone. What's good for you isn't good for everyone. A wartecher's job is dish out melee and magic. Leave it up to the conditions of the mission and the player to decide what purpose that WT should serve. Okay? :3)

[Kimil]

I use three ATM:

Lidra + 6: Resta/Reverser
Cometarac + 5: Retier/Giresta ( soeone said WTs don't need, I beg to differ )
Cometara + 3: Shifta/Zodial

But in AoI, with the addition of Mags and lvl 30 attack spells, which can implement SEs:

Wand (Resta/Giresta) / Card
Wand (Megistral/Ramegid) / Mag (Jellen/Foie)
Dagger / Mag (Deband/Gibarta)
Dagger / Mag (Zondeel/Gizonde)
Saber / Mag (Reverser/Digaz or Rentis)
Twin Dagger



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Kimil on 2007-08-05 18:17 ]</font>

[Ffuzzy-Logik]

On 2007-08-05 17:52, Kismet wrote:
(Besides, Ffuzzy-Logik you need to stop trying to sound like what YOU know about WT is the way WT should be played by everyone. What's good for you isn't good for everyone. A wartecher's job is dish out melee and magic. Leave it up to the conditions of the mission and the player to decide what purpose that WT should serve. Okay? :3)

Don't get me wrong, you can go ahead and play however the hell you want. I'm simply explaining the most efficient way to play WT.

Here's the roles of a WT, in order of importance:

1. Keep everyone healed and buffed at all times. If a fT is present, just make sure everyone is healed and move to step 2.
2. Kill things. In about 95% of situations, this is best done with melee.



And no, Giresta is silly on a WT. It uses way too much PP, is rarely needed, and is bested in every way by Moon Atomizer+Resta.

[Kimil]

Lets see your importance in the role of Buffing in AoI, when there are 3 classes that have better buffs than you

[Xaeris]

Except, that's not the most efficient way. Actually, casting Retier and Deband, more often than not, is the exact model of inefficiency.

[Ffuzzy-Logik]

On 2007-08-05 19:27, Kimil wrote:
Lets see your importance in the role of Buffing in AoI, when there are 3 classes that have better buffs than you

Right.

In AoI, WT roles will look like this:

1. Buff and heal, unless a GT/AT/fT is present, in which case just heal.
2. Kill things.


For any class that can support, that role is always most important if better support is not available. The party will thank you.

[Ffuzzy-Logik]

On 2007-08-05 19:30, Xaeris wrote:
Except, that's not the most efficient way. Actually, casting Retier and Deband, more often than not, is the exact model of inefficiency.

Really? I quite like the +100 HP boost to Resta I get with Retier.

I don't know what it is with PSU and lazy support players.

[Kimil]

The only Buff I'm keeping in AoI is Shifta =/
I'll be getting Megistral to be set for myself
And the 3 Debuffs... because NO ONE else uses them! Come on! When a Monster Casts lvl 30 Shifta on itself, you can bring its attack capacity down by 25% with even lvl 20 Jellen!

[Ffuzzy-Logik]

Just watch, people will use debuffs much more readily when we get Madoogs and can afford to have debuffs on the palette without sacrificing damage ability.

EDIT: I'll be keeping all 4 buffs, of course. I'll also ridicule WTs who can't buff the party when there's no GT/AT/fT. Might as well be a Fortefighter.

If I get rid of any techs on my WT, it will be stupid things like Barta and Zonde (and various other attck techs) to make room for new melee PAs and maybe bow/card bullets.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Ffuzzy-Logik on 2007-08-05 19:45 ]</font>

[Xaeris]

I like having Resta's recovery strength boosted as well. That's why I use a Retaride when I want the boost. For you see, exchanging an idle inventory slot for a valuable wand slot is, say it with me now, efficient.

The question the thread has posed has been more or less answered sufficiently so I think we can afford to make this little detour. Come on, give me your best shot.

[Ffuzzy-Logik]

You're right, it's more efficient, However, part of the reason I'm a WT is so I never have to use any items. Sure, I'll pop a Trimate at a boss and use Moons, but if I wanted to use buff items instead of techs, I'd play my Figunner.

[Xaeris]

So you eschew efficiency for convenience? Hmm, hmm, hmm...now who's the lazy support player?

[Ffuzzy-Logik]

On 2007-08-05 19:49, Xaeris wrote:
So you eschew efficiency for convenience? Hmm, hmm, hmm...now who's the lazy support player?

You are. That Retieride doesn't work on your party members.


You see, the problem is that we have different notions of support.

[Xaeris]

Good, good, I was worried your common sense might be kicking in and convincing you to back down. Silly me.

Let me point you back to one of your earlier posts. You said "If you can use buffs, it is your obligation to use all of them. No exceptions." Tell me, what's the purpose of using Retier over a Retaride in Plains Overlord? Desert Goliath? Mind you, these are just levels that have no technic casters whatsoever. If you consider that most enemy casters have technics that hit for far more damage than Retier can prevent, the tech's MST boost becomes utterly worthless for all practical purposes.

Your free to have your own notion of support. But claiming that it's "the most efficient way to play a wartecher" when you've clearly never taken a moment to observe the effect two of your buffs are having is an outright joke.

[Shiro_Ryuu]

On 2007-08-05 19:43, Ffuzzy-Logik wrote:
Just watch, people will use debuffs much more readily when we get Madoogs and can afford to have debuffs on the palette without sacrificing damage ability.

EDIT: I'll be keeping all 4 buffs, of course. I'll also ridicule WTs who can't buff the party when there's no GT/AT/fT. Might as well be a Fortefighter.

If I get rid of any techs on my WT, it will be stupid things like Barta and Zonde (and various other attck techs) to make room for new melee PAs and maybe bow/card bullets.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Ffuzzy-Logik on 2007-08-05 19:45 ]</font>


Why get rid of attack techs on a Wartecher? Wartechers get level 30 attack techs, I think its a good idea to take advantage of that. Also, Fortefighters can't heal or do attack spells, so people choose Wartecher even if they don't buff. Madoogs also get shit PP, so support spells would drain those things like crazy, especially when you don't get reduced PP usage like Fortetecher.

[Birchum]

If you've got a wand set for shifta/deband I say abandon deband for zalure for the extra damage increase. the DFP of even a lvl 30 deband is still almost insignificant.
For the few haters that still exist, its more efficient to kill monsters faster and take less hits than to let it live longer and dumb down the damage.

[Shiro_Ryuu]

^
Yeah, I agree. Monsters can't hit you if they're dead. Another reason why I support attack tecnics for Wartechers. This class has three different ways of killing things, mind as well use all three of them.

[Ffuzzy-Logik]

On 2007-08-05 20:09, Xaeris wrote:
Your free to have your own notion of support. But claiming that it's "the most efficient way to play a wartecher" when you've clearly never taken a moment to observe the effect two of your buffs are having is an outright joke.


You're right, of course. I'm just anal about things like that and always keeping everyone at max HP. That, and I think any player with the ability to support has an obligation to do so.

Using a Retieride is probably more efficient, but then I have to go buy more of them after each mission. If I'm going to buy items more than once a day, I might as well be playing my Figunner.
On 2007-08-05 20:13, Shiroryuu wrote:

Why get rid of attack techs on a Wartecher? Wartechers get level 30 attack techs, I think its a good idea to take advantage of that. Also, Fortefighters can't heal or do attack spells, so people choose Wartecher even if they don't buff. Madoogs also get shit PP, so support spells would drain those things like crazy, especially when you don't get reduced PP usage like Fortetecher.

1. Surely you realize that melee does far more damage on WT than techs, even with Newmans. AoI will only widen this gap, given level 30 skills. Diga 20 vs 30 might mean 650 damage versus 1000, but Dus Daggas 20 vs 30 will mean 500x2x5 (5000) versus 550x2x8 (8800). Think about it.
2. Madoogs have high PP recharge rates (judging from the beta, that is). Furthermore, they recharge while you are using that single dagger or whip in your right hand. PP shouldn't be a problem on Madoogs unless you are spamming techs for damage. And if you run out, just recharge it or switch in a fresh Madoog. It's not rocket surgery.

[Xaeris]

On 2007-08-05 20:54, Ffuzzy-Logik wrote:
You're right, of course. I'm just anal about things like that and always keeping everyone at max HP. That, and I think any player with the ability to support has an obligation to do so.

Using a Retieride is probably more efficient, but then I have to go buy more of them after each mission. If I'm going to buy items more than once a day, I might as well be playing my Figunner.


You still don't get it. Someone not casting Deband or Retier isn't skimping on their support duty. Comparing the maintaining of those techs to maintaining everyone's HP is a joke, and putting them in the same sentence is a poor attempt to make someone who's not doing the former out to be selfish.

Deband and Retier have effects so minimal in the hands of a WT, that calling them placebos would be an extreme kindness. If you wish to defend your statment, you'll need to prove me wrong. Cheaply backpedaling into the notion that a wartecher's main strength is being light on the wallet is just insulting to the type.

Or you can just shut up and stop speaking with any sort of authority on the subject of wartechers. Honestly, I'm not picky.

[Tita]

On 2007-08-05 19:41, Kimil wrote:
The only Buff I'm keeping in AoI is Shifta =/
I'll be getting Megistral to be set for myself
And the 3 Debuffs... because NO ONE else uses them! Come on! When a Monster Casts lvl 30 Shifta on itself, you can bring its attack capacity down by 25% with even lvl 20 Jellen!

amen

went back to WT recently, and here's what i carry around wand-wise:

1 foie/jellen or shifta or resta x2
2 resta/reverser x2
3 diga/gidiga or resta
4 buff or debuffs (mission appropriate)

[Ffuzzy-Logik]

Yeah.

This is one of those issues where my obsessive compulsive OMFG MUST USE ALL 4 BECAUSE I CAN nature and my irrational cheapskate hating to buy any item ever nature combine to make me look like a dumbass.



You are correct that there's often very little need to cast Deband and Retier. I don't care, I'm doing it anyway.
I am correct that there is often very little use in casting attack techs on a WT compared to melee. Many people don't care, and will do it anyway.

Sad as it is, one of the main strengths of WT is that it is cheap to play (minus the ungodly price of decent melee equipment). Wartecher has that going for it, and versatility, and enough HP to almost never die. Other than that, WT does nothing remarkable. Now don't try arguing that WT is not statistically inferior to just about every other class, because that's not even worth debating.



You probably won't believe me, but I'm actually very good at what I do. The way I play WT might not make sense to you on paper (with the Deband and Retier and all), but I know from experience that it works very well in practice. I do almost as much damage as some Figunners, and keep the party healed and buffed, which makes everyone happy. Now, if the way you play WT is working out well for you, then great, keep at it. Maybe we should play together sometime and compare notes.



Oh, and whatever I post is clearly my opinion and not law. I shouldn't have to throw "in my opinion" into every post to make that clear.

[PJ]

On 2007-08-05 21:47, Ffuzzy-Logik wrote:
Oh, and whatever I post is clearly my opinion and not law. I shouldn't have to throw "in my opinion" into every post to make that clear.


"lol, PSOW"

Yeah, you do with this audience.

[Ffuzzy-Logik]

On 2007-08-05 21:50, PJ wrote:
"lol, PSOW"

Yeah, you do with this audience.

orite lawl

[drizzle]

My pallette usually looks like this:

1. Melee weapon
2. Lidra (Rest + Reverser)
3. Melee weapon
4. Majimra (Attach techs) + Mira-Kikami
5. Cometarac (Zodial + Deband)
6. Cometarac (Shifta + Retier)

And I usually swap out at least one weapon every block, and a Ulteri for most bosses o.O

[SolomonGrundy]

melee weapons are NOT the best for damage as a WT. At east, not for a female human WT.

I can gidiga 6 volfu for ~500 damage/cast for 30pp. there are ZERO weapons in my aresnal that deal that kinda damage.
ditto for diga on polhavora. 1000 pts for 10 pp.
In linear line, damfoie deals 300pts of damage to 4-6 enemies + SE3 burn. Foie hits for 700.

this is so far where I spend most of my time as a WT. YMMV.

[Xaeris]

On 2007-08-05 21:47, Ffuzzy-Logik wrote:

This is one of those issues where my obsessive compulsive OMFG MUST USE ALL 4 BECAUSE I CAN nature and my irrational cheapskate hating to buy any item ever nature combine to make me look like a dumbass.



"Look like a dumbass?" ...Yeah, okay.

You should watch your words. If you wish to communicate an opinion, you'd be better off avoiding absolutes like "no exceptions," not using terms like "most efficient", and most importantly, not attempting to insult people when they disagree with you.

[Sekani]

On 2007-08-06 00:27, SolomonGrundy wrote:
melee weapons are NOT the best for damage as a WT. At east, not for a female human WT.

I can gidiga 6 volfu for ~500 damage/cast for 30pp. there are ZERO weapons in my aresnal that deal that kinda damage.
ditto for diga on polhavora. 1000 pts for 10 pp.
In linear line, damfoie deals 300pts of damage to 4-6 enemies + SE3 burn. Foie hits for 700.

this is so far where I spend most of my time as a WT. YMMV.


Those are some very specific situations (except the Foie thing, I can pump out more damage than that with Gravity Strike or Buten Shuren-zan). The majority of the time melee is gonna outdamage techs on anything that's not resistant. There may be some other advantages to using techs, but overall they're not the most powerful thing in your arsenal.

I also play a female human WT, just so you know. I thought you were a newman though?

[BanF]

On 2007-08-05 16:18, Ffuzzy-Logik wrote:

If you can use buffs, it is your obligation to use all of them. No exceptions.



Oh man, I dub thee loser of the week!

That's just my opinion, obviously, and not "Law".

[Shardio]

I carry 1... with Resta and Reverser XD... I don't like attack techs either.
Guess I'm a sucky WT? Hell no! WT is about being versatile, like you said. If that means you want to melee/ranged combat and heal at the same time, well then... WT is your thing!
WT is the 'dowhatyawant'-class XD

[_Wolf_]

I say play how ever he feels like playing. That probably isnt much help but im a beast FT and i play the way i want to so if he only wants to use resta and reverser i say go for it. He is the one paying for it so he can do what he wants to.

[fumatanera]

On 2007-08-05 19:43, Ffuzzy-Logik wrote:
Just watch, people will use debuffs much more readily when we get Madoogs and can afford to have debuffs on the palette without sacrificing damage ability.

EDIT: I'll be keeping all 4 buffs, of course. I'll also ridicule WTs who can't buff the party when there's no GT/AT/fT. Might as well be a Fortefighter.

If I get rid of any techs on my WT, it will be stupid things like Barta and Zonde (and various other attck techs) to make room for new melee PAs and maybe bow/card bullets.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Ffuzzy-Logik on 2007-08-05 19:45 ]</font>


i don't see why people don't use them now. everyone just wants to see their damage increase. debuffin is where its at. much more efficient. do you want to lower the mobs accuracy and defense and take less damage yourself, so you use less PP/mates (meseta) healing yourself. or you just want to see your damage increase with shifta and retier. though i do like the resta increase with retier as well.

[Realmz]

On 2007-08-06 10:44, fumatanera wrote:

On 2007-08-05 19:43, Ffuzzy-Logik wrote:
Just watch, people will use debuffs much more readily when we get Madoogs and can afford to have debuffs on the palette without sacrificing damage ability.

EDIT: I'll be keeping all 4 buffs, of course. I'll also ridicule WTs who can't buff the party when there's no GT/AT/fT. Might as well be a Fortefighter.

If I get rid of any techs on my WT, it will be stupid things like Barta and Zonde (and various other attck techs) to make room for new melee PAs and maybe bow/card bullets.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Ffuzzy-Logik on 2007-08-05 19:45 ]</font>


i don't see why people don't use them now. everyone just wants to see their damage increase. debuffin is where its at. much more efficient. do you want to lower the mobs accuracy and defense and take less damage yourself, so you use less PP/mates (meseta) healing yourself. or you just want to see your damage increase with shifta and retier. though i do like the resta increase with retier as well.





putting debuffs on a madoog wouldn't fair very well, too much pp use if you ask me. My madoogs would have my attack techs and i'd still use a wand for healing debuffs and buffs. the buffs and debuffs depends on if theres a techer in the group with me..

[Ffuzzy-Logik]

On 2007-08-06 00:27, SolomonGrundy wrote:

I can gidiga 6 volfu for ~500 damage/cast for 30pp. there are ZERO weapons in my aresnal that deal that kinda damage.Get a dagger with good earth percent, and you'll do 400x2x4 in the time you did the Gidiga. Get a really good percent, and we're looking at each hit being over 500.

ditto for diga on polhavora. 1000 pts for 10 pp.In the same time your Diga hits for 1000, my Daggas will have hit 2500, and that is with a 12% earth Mugungri. Imagine the numbers on a higher percent Muktrand with some grinds.

In linear line, damfoie deals 300pts of damage to 4-6 enemies + SE3 burn. Foie hits for 700.And my 44% light Asami-zashi will hit 500x2x6+500x3x2 with Buten.

[Realmz]

i find that on enemies with multipul hit boxes melee works out best but on one hit box mobs that are resistant to melee *cough*Tengohg*cough* magic is best on those kinds...

[drizzle]

Attack techs have their uses, even if they don't have the highest theoretical damage output. Vanda are a lot less painful to take out with Rabarta, Kamatoze get owned by Foie, Diga is nice on Polavohra and Ra & Gizonde take out robots faster than any melee will. These are just some examples.
A good amount of Buten's 400x2x4 will be misses, and the total won't be that much more than a Gi spell if you're hitting 4 or more, and constantly getting frozen or knocked down also doesn't do much good to your damage output.
I used to go without attack techs for the longest time but recently I've been learning more of them because after experimenting some I find them quite useful.

[Realmz]

On 2007-08-06 11:35, drizzle wrote:
Attack techs have their uses, even if they don't have the highest theoretical damage output. Vanda are a lot less painful to take out with Rabarta, Kamatoze get owned by Foie, Diga is nice on Polavohra and Ra & Gizonde take out robots faster than any melee will. These are just some examples.
A good amount of Buten's 400x2x4 will be misses, and the total won't be that much more than a Gi spell if you're hitting 4 or more, and constantly getting frozen or knocked down also doesn't do much good to your damage output.
I used to go without attack techs for the longest time but recently I've been learning more of them because after experimenting some I find them quite useful.


well said, i think one plus that WT's have is that weither you use techs or melee, most of the time you'll be doing about the same damage either way (one may edge out another, but unless you're a min/maxér what does it matter?)

fortunatly some of the short commings (low ata D:) can be made up with buffs lol

[Kismet]

WT's general output depends on the player. Not on 'what's most efficient' or 'what is limited' for/by WT.

But as it was said, go make a WT debate topic if you want to debate over WT! DX This guy's asking about wands. Not WT guidance.

[haruna]

I've got 2 Wartechers now.
Female, Newman, ex-Fortetecher
Male, Beast, ex-FighGunner

I kept 2 on my Beast since he only has 4 techniques: Shifta/Deband on a high grinded Batnara
Resta/Reverser on a Lidra

My Newman has many level 20+ techniques, plus she's got a healthy stock of Cometaracs at her disposal.
Her current wand stash is:
Dambarta/Zalure on a Mijimra
Pair of Elemental Attack Spells on Mijimra
Secondary Pair of attacks on Cometara
Resta/Reverser on a Cometarac. If it's a long mission, I carry 2 of these. Might even have Giresta hooked up to one.
Shifta/Deband on a Batnara

The 2 attack wands depend on the mission. On Neudiaz, it's usually Foie/Damfoie or Gifoie. On Parum, it's usually Nozu/Gidiga. On Moatoob, Nozu/Razonde.

[LS_Aksion]

I carry 6 wands so i dont have to worry about wasting photon charges. 6 wands have enough PP to last me the entire mission even if there was no cube.

Cometaracs have low power but insane PP - good for expensive TECH like GIZONDE. As long as Gizonde SHOCKS then its worth the lower damage.

Majimra have superior TP power - good for strong hits like DIGA and NOSDIGA while i close the gap to get into Melee Range.

Lida - I use one lidra because due to a glitch in the inventory - every time i play my wands and techs are mixed up. It should be listed as fire, ice, lightning, earth, darkness and light. But each time i play its mixed up. Sure i could spend a few minutes re-linking tech but i like the Lidra grinded +10 so that i know where my Healing wand is.

[SolomonGrundy]

First, I should say that I am a newman (rather than human) WT, and level 66 at that

I can gidiga 6 volfu for ~500 damage/cast for 30pp. there are ZERO weapons in my aresnal that deal that kinda damage.


Get a dagger with good earth percent, and you'll do 400x2x4 in the time you did the Gidiga. Get a really good percent, and we're looking at each hit being over 500.

maybe. I have a 28% fire dagger and do not do that much to ageetas though (low dfp). With gidiga vs volfu, there is no chance of missing due to low ata, either.

ditto for diga on polhavora. 1000 pts for 10 pp.


In the same time your Diga hits for 1000, my Daggas will have hit 2500, and that is with a 12% earth Mugungri. Imagine the numbers on a higher percent Muktrand with some grinds.

that's a very tounge in cheek reply.
A. I belive your WT is a Beast
B. you are wrong. I took my beast fF for a test run, level 80, using an 18% mukfet (better than your 7* by percent, and raw ATP). on a 'mere' level 65 polhavora, it hit for 250x4 (1000), and 250x6 (1500). While that IS 2500, that was with a level 80 BEAST FORTEFIGHTER.
C. I think I can squeeze off 2 diga's in the time it takes to do the first and second part of dus daggas - or maybe 1 and a half.

In linear line, damfoie deals 300pts of damage to 4-6 enemies + SE3 burn. Foie hits for 700.


And my 44% light Asami-zashi will hit 500x2x6+500x3x2 with Buten.

Great, so with your UBER weapon, you can compete with my majirma +2, and damfoie 18. Did I mention I'm only level 65?


Your reasons NOT to use techs, end up being compelling reasons TO use techs - at least for TP heavy race types.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: SolomonGrundy on 2007-08-06 23:17 ]</font>