new u pas for guns r thay good

[xgp]

and what do thay do

[Golto]

rifle amd laser is sleep so thats a big no. Grenade is good if you have a healer in your party since it relfects back 15% damage you do with it back to you.

[xgp]

ty

[Rashiid]

sleep could be more of a double-team move!

Fighter: 'KNOCK EM OUT D00D!
Ranger: 'I GOT THIS!' *puts enemy to sleep*
Fighter: 'DIEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE *uses new Axe PA 'From Behind!'*

Both: 'BWHAHAHHHAHHA!!'

[Zorafim]

Capricorn.

[pikachief]

On 2007-09-28 16:31, Rashiid wrote:
sleep could be more of a double-team move!

Fighter: 'KNOCK EM OUT D00D!
Ranger: 'I GOT THIS!' *puts enemy to sleep*
Fighter: 'DIEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE *uses new Axe PA 'From Behind!'*

Both: 'BWHAHAHHHAHHA!!'

Fighter: Wait WTF I missed one...
Ranger: whoops sorry shot them 1 more extra time by accident, didnt notice he was asleep XD



FIXED http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif

[Midicronica]

I used Maisei-sou and was disgusted.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Midicronica on 2007-09-28 16:58 ]</font>

[9lotus]

The grenade PA has incredibly good damage, I'd say it's the best bullet PA out of this batch.

[Mayu]

Anymore opinions on Maisei-Sou would be nice

Thank you http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif

[HFlowen]

From what I know of masei, it has the range of a shotgun, and horrible reload time. I'm not getting it anytime soon.

[xgp]

whats te new grenade u pa calld

[HFlowen]

Boma Duranga.

[xgp]

ty

[Rashiid]

ne tng els u ned?

ok ok sorry dont kill me all at once now....

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Rashiid on 2007-09-28 20:57 ]</font>

[Mayu]

On 2007-09-28 17:17, HFlowen wrote:
From what I know of masei, it has the range of a shotgun, and horrible reload time. I'm not getting it anytime soon.

OH FAIL -.-

Ty http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

[Powder Keg]

I got Masei sou......I'm kinda disappointed. The knockdown just about always happens which is pretty neat, but the stun only starts at lvl 1, it's REALLY slow at firing and the range is also worse. I somewhat regret getting it....maybe it would prove useful in some situations so I guess I will hold onto it and seal it away in the expansion later.

[stukasa]

I have a couple questions about the new bullet UPAs:

1) Using Boma Duranga, how often do you have to heal yourself? Are we talking every 5 shots? 10 shots? 20 shots?

2) Does anyone have experience with the new shotgun PA (charm)? Would you recommend it?

3) How's the damage for Twin Penetration? Do you really need to hit 3-4 mobs just to match the damage of elemental bullets?

[xgp]

can someone mack a lest of what the new gun u pas do plz

[Golto]

1. Since you take 15% of each hit you land it can really add up. Against De Ragan lvl 100+ I was doing 450-500 a hit at lvl 1-2. So if all four hits land that could be 300 damage per shot. I'm guessing at lvl 30 the damage done will be 850-900 w/o shifta so that could be 540 damage to you if all four hits land.

2. I have it not really sure about it yet. My friend says it makes the monsters even dumber than usual. It has low pp cost for being an ult pa and can if leveled do decent damage. Still element shotgun bullets will outdamage it though.

3. This pa just doesn't seem worth it. I might try it out once we get AOI's pa to disk conversion. 90% atp at lvl 30 won't cut it at almost double the pp cost of an elemental lvl 21+ bullet.

Sleep just isn't a good se, freeze is much better. Lvl 4 se freeze can last for up to 13 bullet hits but with sleep at any se lvl only remains for 1.

[Shadow_Wing]

Out of all of em, yea only the nade one seems good. I'm already hitting ragan type mobs for about 770 dmg a hit @ lvl 11 <<;

[Pulpy]

On 2007-09-28 17:25, Rashiid wrote:
ne tng els u ned?



I was going to say something along those lines and you beat me to it. Is that guy serious with his spelling?

[Syl]

Seems not a lot of people went for the xbow one >_>

Well, i only have it at lvl 16 atm, but it's doing good damage kind of like it's dualies counterpart Twin Mayalee. The PP is pretty bad considering it's an xbow and the firing rate.

Another downer is its range. Seems shorter and might take some getting used to. And if I remember correctly, it caps out with ATP down lvl 2.

[stukasa]

On 2007-09-28 18:05, Golto wrote:
1. Since you take 15% of each hit you land it can really add up. Against De Ragan lvl 100+ I was doing 450-500 a hit at lvl 1-2. So if all four hits land that could be 300 damage per shot. I'm guessing at lvl 30 the damage done will be 850-900 w/o shifta so that could be 540 damage to you if all four hits land.
540 damage?! That means you'd have to heal every few shots! Is it really worth it? Trimates cost 500 meseta EACH. That's as much as a G trap! Some people might say, "Just have a dedicated healer!" Well, there is no White Mage class in this game. That means in the time that person spent babysitting the grenadier, they could have been attacking the De Ragan themself. Does the extra damage from the grenade UPA outweigh the damage LOST from the healer babysitting the gunner? I have my doubts about that.



On 2007-09-28 18:05, Golto wrote:
2. I have it not really sure about it yet. My friend says it makes the monsters even dumber than usual. It has low pp cost for being an ult pa and can if leveled do decent damage. Still element shotgun bullets will outdamage it though.
Makes monsters dumber? That DOES sound interesting. I wonder if anyone can explain exactly what it does...


On 2007-09-28 18:05, Golto wrote:
3. This pa just doesn't seem worth it. I might try it out once we get AOI's pa to disk conversion. 90% atp at lvl 30 won't cut it at almost double the pp cost of an elemental lvl 21+ bullet.
I was really hoping this PA would be good. Oh well. :/

[Retehi]

On 2007-09-28 18:15, Pulpy wrote:

On 2007-09-28 17:25, Rashiid wrote:
ne tng els u ned?



I was going to say something along those lines and you beat me to it. Is that guy serious with his spelling?



He has dyslexia, chill out.

[Sophia]

Making fun of people with dyslexia = ultimate fail.

[Shadow_Wing]

On 2007-09-28 18:21, stukasa wrote:

On 2007-09-28 18:05, Golto wrote:
1. Since you take 15% of each hit you land it can really add up. Against De Ragan lvl 100+ I was doing 450-500 a hit at lvl 1-2. So if all four hits land that could be 300 damage per shot. I'm guessing at lvl 30 the damage done will be 850-900 w/o shifta so that could be 540 damage to you if all four hits land.
540 damage?! That means you'd have to heal every few shots! Is it really worth it? Trimates cost 500 meseta EACH. That's as much as a G trap! Some people might say, "Just have a dedicated healer!" Well, there is no White Mage class in this game. That means in the time that person spent babysitting the grenadier, they could have been attacking the De Ragan themself. Does the extra damage from the grenade UPA outweigh the damage LOST from the healer babysitting the gunner? I have my doubts about that.


Yes, with the usual group, which includes high damage hitters like my friend pre and DJ, DJ might have to heal a bit more often, but it reduces our ragan time in half pretty much. When I'm dealing close to 3000dmg a shot it tends to work out pretty well... Throw a few digas and heal, though DJ has to beat me eating a trimate in the process.

[omegapirate2k]

On 2007-09-28 18:31, Sophia wrote:
Making fun of people with dyslexia = ultimate fail.



Well, how are they supposed to know they're dyslexic?

[Aralia]

On 2007-09-28 18:04, xgp wrote:
can someone mack a lest of what the new gun u pas do plz

no, I refuse to mack it with a man named lester...

And so far I've seen

Rife- sleep
shotgun- charm
bow- paralyze and knockdown
card- more damage with longer reload? (guessing from other posts)
laser- sleep
crossbow- attack down/jellen
handgun- penetrates
twinhandgun- penetrates
grenade- more damage to enemy and you take 15% dmg

[xgp]

ty retehi and sophia for looking out for me

[Aralia]

bah... stupid lag...
double post syndrome hits again


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Aralia on 2007-09-28 19:15 ]</font>

[stukasa]

On 2007-09-28 18:41, Shadow_Wing wrote:
Yes, with the usual group, which includes high damage hitters like my friend pre and DJ, DJ might have to heal a bit more often, but it reduces our ragan time in half pretty much. When I'm dealing close to 3000dmg a shot it tends to work out pretty well... Throw a few digas and heal, though DJ has to beat me eating a trimate in the process.


Really? Wow, that IS a lot. Out of curiosity, if the UPA does 3000 a shot, how much damage do your Ice grenades do? (My fG is only level 50 so it's hard to compare the damage)

[Sophia]

On 2007-09-28 18:58, omegapirate2k wrote:

On 2007-09-28 18:31, Sophia wrote:
Making fun of people with dyslexia = ultimate fail.



Well, how are they supposed to know they're dyslexic?


If you're unsure, here's a tip: simply refrain from making fun of their spelling. That way you won't end up looking like an idiot.

I know it might be a strange concept for you but it works.

[Shadow_Wing]

On 2007-09-28 19:07, stukasa wrote:

On 2007-09-28 18:41, Shadow_Wing wrote:
Yes, with the usual group, which includes high damage hitters like my friend pre and DJ, DJ might have to heal a bit more often, but it reduces our ragan time in half pretty much. When I'm dealing close to 3000dmg a shot it tends to work out pretty well... Throw a few digas and heal, though DJ has to beat me eating a trimate in the process.


Really? Wow, that IS a lot. Out of curiosity, if the UPA does 3000 a shot, how much damage do your Ice grenades do? (My fG is only level 50 so it's hard to compare the damage)



At lvl 30 I speculate around 2200dmg/shot give or take. I'm getting really close to the 4000dmg/shot range right now, I'm starting to hit around 810s on ragan =/. I crunched some numbers on it, at lvl 30, assuming the ATP mod has a consistant growth it'll end at 350% ATP, I will hit with lvl 30 buffs, around 1300+/hit getting me near the 5000/shot mark

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Shadow_Wing on 2007-09-28 19:29 ]</font>

[stukasa]

On 2007-09-28 19:27, Shadow_Wing wrote:
At lvl 30 I speculate around 2200dmg/shot give or take. I'm getting really close to the 4000dmg/shot range right now, I'm starting to hit around 810s on ragan =/. I crunched some numbers on it, at lvl 30, assuming the ATP mod has a consistant growth it'll end at 350% ATP, I will hit with lvl 30 buffs, around 1300+/hit getting me near the 5000/shot mark
2200 vs. 5000... Hmmm, yep, that is a PA worth getting! xD I didn't realize it did that much more damage. In that case, time to buy another UPA... http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

[bloodflowers]

I got the shotgun and laser ones. It's been tricky to find PA space lately, I had to erase L30 Burning Fury to make space for the shotgun, and overwrite my only recently started Rising Prism for the laser one.

The shotgun I really like - I was convinced in minutes that it was worth investing in - see topic on that PA for why.

The laser I haven't really tried much yet - from figures I saw elsewhere the damage output should mostly make up for non-elemental, and while sleep is fairly useless, it did make the monsters flinch. I need to play around with it a bit more tomorrow.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: bloodflowers on 2007-09-28 20:20 ]</font>

[omegapirate2k]

On 2007-09-28 19:18, Sophia wrote:

On 2007-09-28 18:58, omegapirate2k wrote:

On 2007-09-28 18:31, Sophia wrote:
Making fun of people with dyslexia = ultimate fail.



Well, how are they supposed to know they're dyslexic?


If you're unsure, here's a tip: simply refrain from making fun of their spelling. That way you won't end up looking like an idiot.


I tell people to spell correctly because they look like an idiot, not me.

If the person is dyslexic (a one in god knows how many chance) I'm sorry, but even they can spell well if they try, I've seen it happen before, and not to speak for them, but I bet they'd feel pretty happy about themselves if they tried hard and it paid off.

[xgp]

dood plz sit up i am tring ok

[Wallin]

On 2007-09-28 20:23, omegapirate2k wrote:

On 2007-09-28 19:18, Sophia wrote:

On 2007-09-28 18:58, omegapirate2k wrote:

On 2007-09-28 18:31, Sophia wrote:
Making fun of people with dyslexia = ultimate fail.



Well, how are they supposed to know they're dyslexic?


If you're unsure, here's a tip: simply refrain from making fun of their spelling. That way you won't end up looking like an idiot.


I tell people to spell correctly because they look like an idiot, not me.

If the person is dyslexic (a one in god knows how many chance) I'm sorry, but even they can spell well if they try, I've seen it happen before, and not to speak for them, but I bet they'd feel pretty happy about themselves if they tried hard and it paid off.



Originally posted in the General section: http://www.pso-world.com/viewtopic.php?topic=150479&forum=9

He's been here over a month now, this is not new.

And you're being way harsh about this. It's a disability and it doesn't matter how rare it is, it's not like he's got a cold and can't get out of bed to boil himself some chicken soup. You may not look like an idiot, but your arrogance is going off like a flashing red light. Just let it go. -_-

[xgp]

ty wallia

[Sophia]

On 2007-09-28 20:23, omegapirate2k wrote:
I tell people to spell correctly because they look like an idiot, not me.

If the person is dyslexic (a one in god knows how many chance) I'm sorry, but even they can spell well if they try, I've seen it happen before, and not to speak for them, but I bet they'd feel pretty happy about themselves if they tried hard and it paid off.

I doubt hes not trying to get better at it so stop being such a jerk =/

[Rashiid]

My friend has dysle- however you spell it; and he reads stuff mixed up if i recall; but all the letters are still there.

you just seem like you are sleep deprived and have no idea whats going on.

but he's one of the only ppl that got an A in our Chemstry class; so i guess theres some benefits....

[omegapirate2k]

On 2007-09-28 20:30, Wallin wrote:

On 2007-09-28 20:23, omegapirate2k wrote:

On 2007-09-28 19:18, Sophia wrote:

On 2007-09-28 18:58, omegapirate2k wrote:

On 2007-09-28 18:31, Sophia wrote:
Making fun of people with dyslexia = ultimate fail.



Well, how are they supposed to know they're dyslexic?


If you're unsure, here's a tip: simply refrain from making fun of their spelling. That way you won't end up looking like an idiot.


I tell people to spell correctly because they look like an idiot, not me.

If the person is dyslexic (a one in god knows how many chance) I'm sorry, but even they can spell well if they try, I've seen it happen before, and not to speak for them, but I bet they'd feel pretty happy about themselves if they tried hard and it paid off.



Originally posted in the General section: http://www.pso-world.com/viewtopic.php?topic=150479&forum=9

He's been here over a month now, this is not new.

And you're being way harsh about this. It's a disability and it doesn't matter how rare it is, it's not like he's got a cold and can't get out of bed to boil himself some chicken soup. You may not look like an idiot, but your arrogance is going off like a flashing red light. Just let it go. -_-


I wasn't even talking about xgp, I know he's dyslexic, I was talking about pointing out spelling mistakes in general. Personally I'm genuinely annoyed when perfectly capable (note, I say capable, if it's really that hard for you xgp then it is, I'm sorry, or if its someones secondary language then it's understandable as well) typing butchered English, these people take classes for this, I'm sure, we all have, spelling errors, but sometimes it just needs to be pointed out.

But whatever, I seem to only be digging myself a deeper hole, so I'll leave it alone.

[Rashiid]

i had no idea he was either; i have 4 friends w/ dyslexia; and they write just fine.

so the whole 'see how they type thing' isnt always clear.

sorry for making fun. i guess.

[xgp]

ty

[xgp]

ty rashiid for the opalge

[Omega_Weltall]

so um.. bout them Ult Bullet PA's?

[Gryffin]

On 2007-09-28 22:23, Omega_Weltall wrote:
so um.. bout them Ult Bullet PA's?



... they stay crunchy in milk.

;D

[SolomonGrundy]

Here's a question.

for the pistol, and twin handgun. do they hit enemies with more than one hit area in each hit area?

for example - do they hit a strateria 3 times?

[HFlowen]

They act by the same rules lasers do.

[Gryffin]

On 2007-09-28 23:10, SolomonGrundy wrote:
Here's a question.

for the pistol, and twin handgun. do they hit enemies with more than one hit area in each hit area?

for example - do they hit a strateria 3 times?


If it pierces all 3 of those spots, yes. They hit all spots they cross through... at least, thats what I heard... I haven't gotten the 90 frags for my TwinPen yet.. though I do the PenShot offline ;D

[Syl]

On 2007-09-28 18:58, Aralia wrote:

card- DEF down (just like Twin Mayalee)



Just a quick fix.

Also, the xbow PA is turning out to be really strong. It's % mod is practically the same as Zagenga, just without the HP SE.

[Mayu]

o.0 wait really? http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

[Arika]

all penetration effect seem FAIL..
all sleep effect also the same...
all Force range new ult bullet blah

so now.. the remain are somewhat useful

grenade : for dps boss
shotgun : for PT (?) just wonder..
xbow : in the future if enemy has higher and higher atp, u might use it when fG solo

[Sophia]

On 2007-09-28 23:28, SylviaEspada wrote:

On 2007-09-28 18:58, Aralia wrote:

card- DEF down (just like Twin Mayalee)



Just a quick fix.

Also, the xbow PA is turning out to be really strong. It's % mod is practically the same as Zagenga, just without the HP SE.


Strong? 160% atp at level 30, no additional modifier, its the weakest crossbow PA.

Oh yeah, usuk etc.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Sophia on 2007-09-29 00:07 ]</font>

[Syl]

Obviously you're a player that emphazises on DPS rather than the importance that comes from SE's. It's doing as much damage as using an opposing element right now. It also helps out with ATP down lvl 3, thus not only weakening the enemies for myself but for the rest of the party. You can't always go by numbers given =/

[Sophia]

On 2007-09-29 00:08, SylviaEspada wrote:
Obviously you're a player that emphazises on DPS rather than the importance that comes from SE's. It's doing as much damage as using an opposing element right now. It also helps out with ATP down lvl 3, thus not only weakening the enemies for myself but for the rest of the party. You can't always go by numbers given =/


You were giving out bad information by saying its "really strong" when its actually the weakest one, opposite element does a little bit more. I never said it sucked cause of that either, its obviously to be used mainly for jellen.
Its also SE level 2, not 3.

[Syl]

On 2007-09-29 00:25, Sophia wrote:

On 2007-09-29 00:08, SylviaEspada wrote:
Obviously you're a player that emphazises on DPS rather than the importance that comes from SE's. It's doing as much damage as using an opposing element right now. It also helps out with ATP down lvl 3, thus not only weakening the enemies for myself but for the rest of the party. You can't always go by numbers given =/


You were giving out bad information by saying its "really strong" when its actually the weakest one, opposite element does a little bit more. I never said it sucked cause of that either, its obviously to be used mainly for jellen.
Its also SE level 2, not 3.



Oh really? Well thats a mistake that I've made on my part. But to undermize a PA which is obviously NOT meant to be spammed for damage but for it's SE is just not seeing why it was made. I didn't imply it to be OMG LOL ZAGENGA strong, I just said it's strong. And yes, it does a little bit more, like 20 more? Not a whole lot.

But like I said, for a PA that isn't obviously meant to be used for DPS, it's damaging Gram Grams.

[Sophia]

On 2007-09-29 00:30, SylviaEspada wrote:
But to undermize a PA which is obviously NOT meant to be spammed for damage but for it's SE is just not seeing why it was made.

What? I already said the low damage doesnt make it bad. I know how to use it, you obviously have a harder time understanding how to use it tho.


On 2007-09-29 00:30, SylviaEspada wrote:
I didn't imply it to be OMG LOL ZAGENGA strong, I just said it's strong. And yes, it does a little bit more, like 20 more? Not a whole lot.

You said it was "really strong". It's kinda bad to say that when all the other crossbow PAs do more damage, and the point of it is to jellen things then switch to another PA.

[Scion]

Your attitude is starting to piss me off. If you have a response, just say it. You don't have to stick your nose so far up in the air while doing it.


On 2007-09-29 01:11, Sophia wrote:

On 2007-09-29 00:30, SylviaEspada wrote:
But to undermize a PA which is obviously NOT meant to be spammed for damage but for it's SE is just not seeing why it was made.

What? I already said the low damage doesnt make it bad. I know how to use it, you obviously have a harder time understanding how to use it tho.


So quick to judge there, aren't we? Considering that you haven't even seen the way he's played, you already seem to know what he does and doesn't understand. That's fair.




On 2007-09-29 00:30, SylviaEspada wrote:
I didn't imply it to be OMG LOL ZAGENGA strong, I just said it's strong. And yes, it does a little bit more, like 20 more? Not a whole lot.

You said it was "really strong". It's kinda bad to say that when all the other crossbow PAs do more damage, and the point of it is to jellen things then switch to another PA.



Strong, really strong, what the hell is the difference? I think most of us have grasped Syl's point by now but you're beating a dead horse. And for what?


On 2007-09-28 23:56, Sophia wrote:

Oh yeah, usuk etc.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Sophia on 2007-09-29 00:07 ]</font>


Was that really necessary?

[Sophia]

Hikaru-kun, I already know that you and your crew dislike me and think im an elitist bytch, which is why i keep up the "attitude" around here(im not like that in-game, or to cool people here).
You reacting so strongly is also quite amusing.

Anyway, i was just pointing out that it wasnt really as strong as mr Sylvia made it out to be. He makes a big deal out of it and starts rambling about unrelated stuff instead of just accepting what i said etc.

[Syl]

On 2007-09-29 03:07, Eleina wrote:
lolol http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif



LOLZ

Anyways, your pride is what is highly disliked. I made a simple statement and you are obviously still holding a grudge from our past arguments and beating it down to a point of stupid senselessness. I don't hate you, but I highly dislike your attitude. Even the "cool" people think it's quite annoying (inb4WHO?!) =/

In game or not, you keep arguing in a blind circle that it's just become utterly pointless. You made your point as I made mine, but you just won't give up. You're as stubborn as a deaf wall.

And as I said maybe more than 3 times already... Strong=/=UBER LOL DAMAGE, but rather it's usefulness. Maybe a little word comprehension would help eh Granny-chan? Instead of going ON AND ON about the same pathetic argument that you keep bringing up, how about making a decent statement rather than recycling your argument? (also I bet all this "rambling" will be disregarded and you'll just keep saying the same garbage eh Obaa-chan?)

[Hrith]

Sophia, if Yak Maga has 160% ATP, it has same/higher ATP than regular crossbows, since they have either 155% or 160% (element included).

I agree that the PP cost and Lv2 Jellen for SE make it worse, though.


As for my input, Mayalee Shot is great.
Sleep is a rather bad SE, but Mayalee Shot is a boss killer.

Frozen Shot has 155% ATP + 23% ice damage, that's 178% to fire monsters.
Plasma Shot has 155% ATP + 23% thunder damage, that's 178% to earth monsters.

If Mayalee Shot really has 180% (to all monsters, since it has no element), it beats Frozen Shot and Plasma Shot for both Onmagoug and Dimmagolus.

[Kimil]

Learn.... English.... Now

[Arika]

ST shoudl just banned this xbow weapon, because this weapon alway cuz problem http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif (LOL joking http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime2.gif )
reduce the hot blood on you guys please~ and be nice to each other! http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Arika on 2007-09-29 03:24 ]</font>

[relentless]

On 2007-09-29 03:22, Arika wrote:
reduce the hot blood on you guys please~ and be nice to each other! http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif

Got the knack. o.0 http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif


IMO(!)

I think Yak Maga isn't that useful to fG since they do more damage with the oppositional elements / Yak Zagenga. (or.. am I mistaken? http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime2.gif )
As for the SE.. I guess since fG don't get hit so often anyways it isn't that helpful.
Sooo, not worth the Frags, no? http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

I'd say this PA is better for GT.
They're more for supporting to begin with.
Twin Mayalee DEF down.
Yak Maga ATP down.
Poison / Burn Trap
Additional damage.
etc. GT actually doesn't suck at all if they can combine the above mentioned, they're not for heavy damage I assume.

(You suck if you complain about my own opinion now ;P..... j/k XD)

[Syl]

On 2007-09-29 03:22, Arika wrote:
ST shoudl just banned this xbow weapon, because this weapon alway cuz problem http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif (LOL joking http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime2.gif )
reduce the hot blood on you guys please~ and be nice to each other! http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif



Probably not going to happen sadly due to someone's blind pride =/


On 2007-09-29 03:36, SeKaI wrote:

I think Yak Maga isn't that useful to fG since they do more damage with the oppositional elements / Yak Zagenga. (or.. am I mistaken? http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime2.gif )
As for the SE.. I guess since fG don't get hit so often anyways it isn't that helpful.
Sooo, not worth the Frags, no? http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

I'd say this PA is better for GT.
They're more for supporting to begin with.
Twin Mayalee DEF down.
Yak Maga ATP down.
Poison / Burn Trap
Additional damage.
etc. GT actually doesn't suck at all if they can combine the above mentioned, they're not for heavy damage I assume.

(You suck if you complain about my own opinion now ;P..... j/k XD)



You make my point more clear. Obviously I'm a GT while she's a fortegunner. The PA is pretty vital to a Guntecher's job since that's what we're all about.

Gah, PSOW brings out the worst in people >_>

[xgp]

the Boma Duranga pa has someone got it to lv 20 if so how much damg das it do? das it kill u on inpact

[Sophia]

On 2007-09-29 03:16, Hrith wrote:
Sophia, if Yak Maga has 160% ATP, it has same/higher ATP than regular crossbows, since they have either 155% or 160% (element included).

Actually they would have 168% and 174% since the elemental mod is multiplied after.(15% +5% unshown)

And mr Sylvia is just a gimp noob GT that has no idea what hes talking about.
He even has to come up with insults that dont make sense, wow hes so useless xD
And if you meant usefulness instead of strength you should probably have said that instead. Usually when people say something is strong they mean its powerful, as in damage.


On 2007-09-29 03:43, SylviaEspada wrote:
Probably not going to happen sadly due to someone's blind pride =/

You're one to talk.

[Hrith]

Ah yeah, you're right, +160% is not the same as +145% then +15% (that also foils my Mayalee Shot plan http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif).

But 5% unshown? I doubt that, it's just that crossbows have very variable ATP.

[xgp]

plz stop have the posts on this r pll ruging i mead this topic so pll can till one anather what the upas do not rug over ho is riet or to bicer over what the pas do so plz stop and jast post about the pa

and yes i no some of it was over my prabolm but it out of haed now

[Syl]

On 2007-09-29 03:52, Sophia wrote:

On 2007-09-29 03:16, Hrith wrote:
Sophia, if Yak Maga has 160% ATP, it has same/higher ATP than regular crossbows, since they have either 155% or 160% (element included).

Actually they would have 168% and 174% since the elemental mod is multiplied after.(15% +5% unshown)

And mr Sylvia is just a gimp noob GT that has no idea what hes talking about.
He even has to come up with insults that dont make sense, wow hes so useless xD
And if you meant usefulness instead of strength you should probably have said that instead. Usually when people say something is strong they mean its powerful, as in damage.


On 2007-09-29 03:43, SylviaEspada wrote:
Probably not going to happen sadly due to someone's blind pride =/

You're one to talk.



lol, you just proved a lot of my points about you in just that post. And your reply is rather useless because you didn't contribute anything to our debate.

Anyways, I'm not bothering with this anymore. You're obviously an asshat that needs to use things besides LOL ZAGENGA.

And lol @ you for calling me and/or the Guntecher class gimped. (Hey isnt xbow a GT gun? Oh and guess who's going to be wanted more in a party? http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_eek.gif)

Have a good day, Granny. Don't let your face age anymore http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif


Also, apologies to XGP for thread derailment. You can thank the Granny caseal for that http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: SylviaEspada on 2007-09-29 04:05 ]</font>

[Sophia]

On 2007-09-29 04:01, Hrith wrote:
Ah yeah, you're right, +160% is not the same as +145% then +15% (that also foils my Mayalee Shot plan :().

But 5% unshown? I doubt that, it's just that crossbows have very variable ATP.

Ive tested it with not so variable weapons too and its somewhere around 5% hidden :O


On 2007-09-29 04:04, SylviaEspada wrote:
Anyways, I'm not bothering with this anymore. You're obviously an asshat that needs to use things besides LOL ZAGENGA.

Lol, i barely even use zagenga.


On 2007-09-29 04:04, SylviaEspada wrote:
And lol @ you for calling me and/or the Guntecher class gimped. (Hey isnt xbow a GT gun? Oh and guess who's going to be wanted more in a party? :o)

Fortegunner does everything a GT can do with crossbows but better, and yes i am very wanted in parties xD


On 2007-09-29 04:04, SylviaEspada wrote:
Have a good day, Granny. Don't let your face age anymore :P

Also, apologies to XGP for thread derailment. You can thank the Granny caseal for that ^^

You simply have no arguments so you have to come up with ones that make no sense. If anything, YOU are the old looking caseal xD

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Sophia on 2007-09-29 04:11 ]</font>

[Arika]

GT will get high lv support tech in the future, consider
debuff with wand and damage by your S rank xbow
or
debuff with you S rank xbow and damage by wand
or
debuff with wand alone, then change weapon to do damage
or
debuff with S rank xbow then change weapon to do damage

choose what u like .


consider you can't use ur rigth hand weapon to do good damage (wand with low lv atk tech, or melee with low lv ) I would rather leave right hand slot for support and do damage on left hand.

In otherhand, you might leave 1 slot to do all the support eg. xbow with debuff atp and wand with debuff def/ata that si also good choice. but I don't think I like this choice http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime2.gif cuz I rather debuff atp with wand .so that it is lv 3 atp debuff

[Hrith]

Fortegunners will still be better in every way, even on their own.

FG + A grade crossbow + Twin Mayalee + Agtaride > GT + S grade crossbow + Zalure Lv30 + Shifta Lv30.

Actually, Fortegunner does not even need Twin Mayalee to surpass Guntecher in that equation.

But Guntehcer is a totally different role, it's a very good class. It will never come close to Fortegunner in terms of DPS, but it has versatility.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Hrith on 2007-09-29 07:54 ]</font>

[Sophia]

Kef is the best <3

Fortegunner will have much better melee capabilities than guntecher in AoI as well, Dus Majarra level 20 hehe :3




Also wanna apologize to xgp for getting so off topic before, im really sorry x_x



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Sophia on 2007-09-29 05:48 ]</font>

[Eleina]

On 2007-09-29 04:09, Arika wrote:
GT will get high lv support tech in the future


This and this alone makes yak maga obsolete lol (as it also make twin mayalee and the debuffing cards useless on a GT).


As for the other pa's
Mayalee shot : not very useful seeing as sleep is pretty lame on a rifle (high firing rate will often cancel out the inflicted SE)
Boma Duranga : awesome pa but requires a healing slave (but a fG with this will outdamage a fG with regular nade + fT with diga on ragan type bosses)
Barada Chamga : Haven't used but don't see the point
Phantasm Prism : It's a laser nuff said (The Raised SE on the elemental ones in the future will make this useless lol)
Twin penetration : haven't used but well might as well use a laser lol
Long Bow pa : Haven't used
Card Pa : Check comment after yak maga
Penetrating Hit : Who doesn't like one? But seriously i'll let kef give his point of view on this xD


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Eleina on 2007-09-29 05:58 ]</font>

[Kuya]

On 2007-09-28 18:25, Retehi wrote:

On 2007-09-28 18:15, Pulpy wrote:

On 2007-09-28 17:25, Rashiid wrote:
ne tng els u ned?



I was going to say something along those lines and you beat me to it. Is that guy serious with his spelling?



He has dyslexia, chill out.



lol - Rashiid was just playing around. Besides, that's not even dyslexia. If anything - I woulda said he was just being lazy http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

[Golto]

On 2007-09-29 03:16, Hrith wrote:
Sophia, if Yak Maga has 160% ATP, it has same/higher ATP than regular crossbows, since they have either 155% or 160% (element included).

I agree that the PP cost and Lv2 Jellen for SE make it worse, though.


As for my input, Mayalee Shot is great.
Sleep is a rather bad SE, but Mayalee Shot is a boss killer.

Frozen Shot has 155% ATP + 23% ice damage, that's 178% to fire monsters.
Plasma Shot has 155% ATP + 23% thunder damage, that's 178% to earth monsters.

If Mayalee Shot really has 180% (to all monsters, since it has no element), it beats Frozen Shot and Plasma Shot for both Onmagoug and Dimmagolus.



If that is how elemental % damage was calculated that would be true but its not.

The %'s are not added but multiplied. 155% * 1.23% = 190.65%.

So the sleep shot lvl 21+ will only do more damage against neutral monsters using the same level elemental bullets but it will cost more PP. In the long run elemental bullets of the same level would outdamage the Sleep shot against neutral monsters if you use the same amount of PP. But if you were really concerned so much with damage you would be using elemmental twin hanndgun bullets against Onmagoug and Dimmagolus.

[Gen2000]

Phantasm Prism is kind of interesting because it gives you a look at how Lasers will be in AoI. It has SE2 Sleep and causes flinching. Because of no element bonus mod though it seems kind of weak just going off it's own ATP mod but if you're one of the Gunners getting hyped up for Lasers in AoI you may want to get it just to mess around with it if you have extra space (it's only 25 frags).

So far in party situations I've seen people using it can have range great crowd control. Horrible damage but at least the enemies didn't move heh. Good PA to use in a Nuking FO heavy party or a melee party that isn't all knockback happy (which is rare) I guess. If Laser can control mobs that good then flinching Shotgun/Xbow in AoI will be boss.

[Hrith]

Yeah, Golto, I realised that after posting it >_>

But it's still a good bullet for me because I do not have the space to learn so many rifle bullets x_X

[Golto]

On 2007-09-29 08:03, Hrith wrote:
Yeah, Golto, I realised that after posting it >_>

But it's still a good bullet for me because I do not have the space to learn so many rifle bullets x_X



Yes you do have a point there, same could go for the charm shotgun bullet. But the charm shotgun bullet has the same PP usage as elemental shotgun bullets.

[Hrith]

On 2007-09-29 05:52, Eleina wrote:
Penetrating Hit : Who doesn't like one? But seriously i'll let kef give his point of view on this xDSucks, I do not see the point to use a weaker laser with no SE, at all.

The firing rate may be better, we're comapring totally different figures, here.

270 ATP (Python) x 100% ATP (Penetrating Hit) = 270 ATP

541 ATP (Thunder Cannon) x 165% ATP (Light/Frozen/Plasma Prism) = 893 ATP
+16% (element) = 1036 ATP

541 ATP (Thunder Cannon) x 170% ATP (Dark/Burning/Grav Prism) = 920 ATP
+16% (element) = 1067 ATP

So despite the firing rate of single handguns, there is no way 270 ATP will compare to 1036/1067 from lasers >_>

[PJ]

All I know is, Snickerman spamming Boma Duranga is hilarious.

Does great damage, it's only level 3, and he only uses it in two situations

-To piss me off
-When my attacks will be pretty useless anyways so I'm better off healing him


And he thinks he has a way to quick level it. Running De Ragan A/S, then dying on boss after emptying some grenades, repeat. Since we assume bosses restore to full HP after you die.

[Pillan]

Hrith, you should really redo that calculation taking base ATP and the firing rate into account. To me it looks like both the Penetrations are on par with lasers if you’re ATP is more than 740, but they suffer from the issues of draining more PP/time and shorter range as a penalty for not using lasers in addition to not doing that much damage since they still need to hit 3+ targets to keep up with any of the moderate damage/time guns.

Out of the batch, the only 2 worth getting are the bow and grenade. Get the grenade because it’s 4 targets with a 350% ATP mod and the bow because it’s the only bullet with stun.

The laser has a high accuracy mod, so it could be worth considering (all lasers get buffed to the same ATP mod as that bullet soon). Yak Maga is worth it if you’re an fG or FG, but, since we know enemy STA is going to be nerfed, you’re better off sticking with Yak Riga/Inga to completely stop their attacks. The card bullet is only useful as AF, unless it gets DFP down 4 at 31 (Twin Mayalee gets nerfed to DFP down 2 at 21 pretty soon). The rifle has more power and accuracy, but do rifles really need more power or accuracy?

The others I’d say are only worth considering as replacements for the elemental bullets because your out of PA space or don’t really care about the weapon.

[Gen2000]

And he thinks he has a way to quick level it. Running De Ragan A/S, then dying on boss after emptying some grenades, repeat. Since we assume bosses restore to full HP after you die.

That's how you quickly level any Grenade (and Shotgun if not AFK'ing it) or Melee PA since Ragan is a slow target with multiple hitboxes. Yeah bosses gets all their HP back when you (or whole party) die and return to lobby.


Edit: to include quote since someone posted ahead of me.


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Gen2000 on 2007-09-29 09:14 ]</font>

[Fure_Rakune]

Yak Maga and Twin Mayalee are not obsolete BA's for a Gun Techer, having those available on our weapons saves us palette space for other weapons or techniques.
There are other factors that can influence a person to choose what PA's they choose.
Since I am on the PS2, I cant always rely on my wands to deliver since Im going to have to deal with lag issues and tech loading, this is where the BA's come in handy do deliver quick debuffs while not getting melee-rape if I were to run around waiting for a technique to load, stand there vulnerable while im casting and also run the risk of missing any enemies who run out of range.
GunTechers will only get up to lvl 30 support techs in AoI, so Twin Mayalee is a viable option while I will use Yak Maga for the sake of efficiency and mobility.
Hope my two cents cant lend something to this unnecessary argument, there are different playing styles and some people like to play this game for fun, not to have the biggest e-penis here.

[Hrith]

On 2007-09-29 09:10, Pillan wrote:
Hrith, you should really redo that calculation taking base ATP and the firing rate into account. To me it looks like both the Penetrations are on par with lasers if you’re ATP is more than 740Okay o_o


740 (base ATP) + 270 (Python) = 1010
1010 x 100% ATP (Penetrating Hit) = 1010 ATP

740 (base ATP) + 541 (Thunder Cannon) = 1281
1281 x 165% ATP (Light/Frozen/Plasma Prism) = 2114 ATP
2114 x 16% (element) = 2452 ATP

740 (base ATP) + 541 (Thunder Cannon) = 1281
1281 x 170% ATP (Dark/Burning/Grav Prism) = 2178 ATP
2178 x 16% (element) = 2526 ATP


How is that different?

1010 ATP vs 2452/2526 ATP, Penetrating Hit cannot win.

Also, Lv2 SEs from lasers.

[Pillan]

On 2007-09-29 11:19, Hrith wrote:
How is that different?

1010 ATP vs 2452/2526 ATP, Penetrating Hit cannot win.

Also, Lv2 SEs from lasers.


2.4 bullets from a handgun per laser cannon shot and 3 bullets from a twin handgun. So that's slightly less (I was doing a quick estimation with 2.5 instead of 2.4 and then the extra shots obviously subtract more DFP), but the point is when you're in the situation where base ATP > 1.5 x laser ATP, the Penetrations win. (That will always be the case with the ATP buff we'll be getting in a month or so.)

And, yeah, you can always argue the SE, range, and slower PP drain make lasers the better choice.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Pillan on 2007-09-29 11:28 ]</font>

[Weeaboolits]

But handguns can fire while moving, unless this PA changed that, so it'd have its uses additionally, it'd be like pairing a weakened laser cannon with a melee or wand, or give laser cannon fire to classes that don't have laser cannons. Sure there's no element and it wouldn't be as powerful, but I could see it being useful. But I'm offline, what do I know? http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Ronin_Cooper on 2007-09-29 11:30 ]</font>

[Shadow_Wing]

On 2007-09-29 03:46, xgp wrote:
the Boma Duranga pa has someone got it to lv 20 if so how much damg das it do? das it kill u on inpact



No it doesn't, I'm still under the 5 hits and I'm dead point still <<;. The dmg it'll do varies from player to player I'd think cause it's a direct fraction of the damage you do.


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Shadow_Wing on 2007-09-29 11:44 ]</font>

[Kion]

with penetrating hit; it's more the princeple of using it. any fortegunner that picks it up now because "zomg, more damage because it hitz moar targets," is an idiot. that person could have easily picked up laser cannons a long time ago under the same rational. so it's kind of incompetent to pick up the PA, just because the effect is on dualies now.
but what ever floats their boat i guess.

as for the gun debuffs, i see them working more for forteguner than GT. with GT, two debuffs can be equipped to the same wand with level 3 debuffs and a much larger area of effect. in terms of lag and waitign more weapons to load, i still think wands are much faster then switching weapons and then having to tag each enemy for for the effect.

fortegunners on the other hand, can't use techs, so having effects like this tied to their weapon gives addtional abilities to the class. aditionally twin handgun and crossbow are moble weapons, so being able to strafe the room hitting targets before following up with a higher dps weapon allows FG to do more damage.

[ThEoRy]

Good?
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t193/RickTheory/tonythetiger.jpg

[Complex_Jao]

new ult PAs for guns:are they good?...thats how it should be

[Pulpy]

On 2007-09-29 21:26, Complex_Jao wrote:
new ult PAs for guns:are they good?...thats how it should be



Read through the thread a little bit...

He knows...everyone else knows...give him a break.

[Vickie]

all of the bullet pa's have they're uses especially when you solo alot for instance i find that the shot gun pa is Really good when your using you NPC's where as the enemies don't go after them no matter how much damage they're doing sort of like "provoke" in ff11

[Arika]

1 Force can heal both Cast with grenade + Beast with nanoblast together, so it is for boss!!

[9lotus]

How much more ATP% do lasers have in AoI?

Currently, Phantasm Prism has 190% ATP at lv. 30, which makes it almost as strong as the other lasers.

from the AoI screenshot thread: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lxO0t6jbbLk

around 1:10, it seems sleep now lasts for more than 1 hit? Can someone confirm if that's true in online play?

If so, then sleep is no longer a bad SE.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: 9lotus on 2007-09-30 01:13 ]</font>

[Hrith]

On 2007-09-29 11:24, Pillan wrote:
[quote]On 2007-09-29 11:19, Hrith wrote:
2.4 bullets from a handgun per laser cannon shot and 3 bullets from a twin handgun. So that's slightly less (I was doing a quick estimation with 2.5 instead of 2.4 and then the extra shots obviously subtract more DFP), but the point is when you're in the situation where base ATP > 1.5 x laser ATP, the Penetrations win. (That will always be the case with the ATP buff we'll be getting in a month or so.)

And, yeah, you can always argue the SE, range, and slower PP drain make lasers the better choice.You have no idea how ATP works x_X

The difference in damage between 500 and 700 ATP is not the same as between 700 and 900.

Lasers with 2500 ATP will deal so much more than handguns with 1000 ATP, there is no contest at all.

[Golto]

Lasers get up to 165% and 170% at lvl 30 with the update patch. So with the proper element the damage will be similar. But elemental lasers get a good pp reduction so you'll be able to fire almost 2 lvl 21+ elemental laser shots for 1 lvl 21+ sleep laser shot. But since they get SE lvl 2 fire and dark will outdamage sleep.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Golto on 2007-09-30 07:23 ]</font>

[Sophia]

On 2007-09-30 07:22, Golto wrote:
Lasers get up to 165% and 170% at lvl 30 with the update patch. So with the proper element the damage will be similar. But elemental lasers get a good pp reduction so you'll be able to fire almost 2 lvl 21+ elemental laser shots for 1 lvl 21+ sleep laser shot. But since they get SE lvl 2 fire and dark will outdamage sleep.

170/165 is what they have now, supposedly they get 190/185 in the patch, and 18(14 fortegunner) pp cost.