rumors of PvP/what you think of it [Archive]

Garnet_Moon

Oct 11, 2007, 06:36 PM

It would be broken.

Melee vs Ranged: Melee one-shots the guy when he gets to him. Little to no contest. Bullets would be like mosquito bites on a Fortefighter. Don't count on Status Effects to save you, either. They'd be nerfed for PvP and you'd be screwed.

Melee vs Wizard: Melee side-steps everything and one-shots the Wizzy with a massive overkill on th every first strike. The additional PA hits are just for flavor and "pwnage".

Ranged vs Wizard: Ranged kites the Wizzy and effortlessly dodges everything. Nos techs would never catch him before you died as a sittign duck while holding your tracking button.

I don't see an effective way to balance it, especially with the nature of some of the PA's, so no. Not gonna happen. Ever.

[ This Message was edited by: Garnet_Moon on 2007-10-11 16:43 ]

VanHalen

Oct 11, 2007, 06:38 PM

On 2007-10-11 16:17, Zorafim wrote:
I remember Battle Mode. How did anyone manage to enjoy it?

To be honest I have no idea. It was like some kinda turn based crap http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif.

If there was PvP in PSU I'd play it. After fighting those Humanoid shaped enemies you can't help but to think that sending/being sent 50 feet across a room would be fun.

Garnet_Moon

Oct 11, 2007, 06:47 PM

On 2007-10-11 16:17, Zorafim wrote:
I remember Battle Mode. How did anyone manage to enjoy it?

Easy. I just sat there letting my friends kill me, then I hunted down the Delsaber for even more deaths. When I was 20 levels over my rival, I chased him down and raped him.

Then the vicious suicide cycle repeated...

Gazetti

Oct 11, 2007, 07:00 PM

On 2007-10-11 16:36, Garnet_Moon wrote:
It would be broken.

Melee vs Ranged: Melee one-shots the guy when he gets to him. Little to no contest. Bullets would be like mosquito bites on a Fortefighter. Don't count on Status Effects to save you, either. They'd be nerfed for PvP and you'd be screwed.

Melee vs Wizard: Melee side-steps everything and one-shots the Wizzy with a massive overkill on th every first strike. The additional PA hits are just for flavor and "pwnage".

Ranged vs Wizard: Ranged kites the Wizzy and effortlessly dodges everything. Nos techs would never catch him before you died as a sittign duck while holding your tracking button.

I don't see an effective way to balance it, especially with the nature of some of the PA's, so no. Not gonna happen. Ever.

[ This Message was edited by: Garnet_Moon on 2007-10-11 16:43 ]

well then how did it work on pso? being roughly the same game. psu is just alittle faster.

Garnet_Moon

Oct 11, 2007, 07:03 PM

On 2007-10-11 17:00, Gazetti wrote:

On 2007-10-11 16:36, Garnet_Moon wrote:
It would be broken.

Melee vs Ranged: Melee one-shots the guy when he gets to him. Little to no contest. Bullets would be like mosquito bites on a Fortefighter. Don't count on Status Effects to save you, either. They'd be nerfed for PvP and you'd be screwed.

Melee vs Wizard: Melee side-steps everything and one-shots the Wizzy with a massive overkill on th every first strike. The additional PA hits are just for flavor and "pwnage".

Ranged vs Wizard: Ranged kites the Wizzy and effortlessly dodges everything. Nos techs would never catch him before you died as a sittign duck while holding your tracking button.

I don't see an effective way to balance it, especially with the nature of some of the PA's, so no. Not gonna happen. Ever.

[ This Message was edited by: Garnet_Moon on 2007-10-11 16:43 ]

well then how did it work on pso? being roughly the same game. psu is just alittle faster.

Tornado Dance > PSO
Dus Daggas > PSO
Boga Zubba > PSO
Etc, etc.

EDIT:

Busou Renkinzan or w/e it is > PSO
Gravity Break > PSO
Rising Crush > PSO
All the Claw PA's > PSO
Boga Riga > PSO

EDIT #2:

Splendor Crush > PSO
Rising Strike > PSO

[ This Message was edited by: Garnet_Moon on 2007-10-11 17:06 ]

Ffuzzy-Logik

Oct 11, 2007, 07:06 PM

lol, PvP

Ibuka

Oct 11, 2007, 07:18 PM

I would like to see PVP in PSU... It would be a good reason to master "Just Attack" and "Just Counter" ... But knowning ST they just make another PSU ver of PSO Ep3 o.o

[ This Message was edited by: Ibuka on 2007-10-11 17:18 ]

VanHalen

Oct 11, 2007, 07:39 PM

On 2007-10-11 17:18, Ibuka wrote:
I would like to see PVP in PSU... It would be a good reason to master "Just Attack" and "Just Counter" ... But knowning ST they just make another PSU ver of PSO Ep3 o.o

[ This Message was edited by: Ibuka on 2007-10-11 17:18 ]

If they made that I'd buy it right now.

AzureBlaze

Oct 11, 2007, 07:40 PM

Obviously there's no one left over here from the 'old guard' besides possibly Ibuka and maybe the original poster.

Yes, you could do PvP (and enjoy it) on PSO, it's just that it was very bizarre and hard to learn. And if you DIDNT know and tried to do it vs someone who did, they murdered you and let you know 83457 times. (thus, making it seem 'horrid' to anyone who wasn't in that 'inner circle' type thing)

I broke the hell into it for the sole purpose of punching out the few nastier members who tried to stamp out anyone 'attempting' BA. Though, I ended up enjoying it for the entertainment value, whether or not I succeeded. It was indeed possible to learn it and get into it. It was actually very complex with people recording their sessions on VCR, using cellphones (to talk), and making actual plans (!) away from PSO.

But if you didn't know about all this stuff going on, and simply tried to button mash or go vs anyone else who also didn't know BA, you'd think it was bad. It gets a bad rap because it's not something you're excellent at instantly, you actually have to work at it to get into it, which no one will casually do.

Also, being under the mistaken impression that "Hax weps" are in there. Yes, rule 1 had hax and you got nutty kills from spread needle or whatever, but PvP was popular on 'rules' (not 1) where you DIDNT use your own weps, mags, traps, etc. They rebalanced your level and you had to use what you found in the small map.

If there was to be PvP in PSU, it'd probably include similar rules where people get rebalanced, and it takes place in an arena or small level--to prevent exactly what the nay-sayers of this topic are saying would spoil it. Hopefully.

I'd actually LIKE to see it, because it's one more thing to draw people into the game, to keep it entertaining, and if anyone was on the game who didn't like it/want it, it wouldn't be mandatory to any other portion of the game--ie no exclusive prizes etc. The more modes the merrier, (unless they're mandatory) I say.

Complex_Jao

Oct 11, 2007, 07:52 PM

I like my MMORPGs to be...well...an rpg if i wanted to kill someone id play Halo

Gazetti

Oct 11, 2007, 07:58 PM

very well put

On 2007-10-11 17:40, AzureBlaze wrote:
Obviously there's no one left over here from the 'old guard' besides possibly Ibuka and maybe the original poster.

Yes, you could do PvP (and enjoy it) on PSO, it's just that it was very bizarre and hard to learn. And if you DIDNT know and tried to do it vs someone who did, they murdered you and let you know 83457 times. (thus, making it seem 'horrid' to anyone who wasn't in that 'inner circle' type thing)

I broke the hell into it for the sole purpose of punching out the few nastier members who tried to stamp out anyone 'attempting' BA. Though, I ended up enjoying it for the entertainment value, whether or not I succeeded. It was indeed possible to learn it and get into it. It was actually very complex with people recording their sessions on VCR, using cellphones (to talk), and making actual plans (!) away from PSO.

But if you didn't know about all this stuff going on, and simply tried to button mash or go vs anyone else who also didn't know BA, you'd think it was bad. It gets a bad rap because it's not something you're excellent at instantly, you actually have to work at it to get into it, which no one will casually do.

Also, being under the mistaken impression that "Hax weps" are in there. Yes, rule 1 had hax and you got nutty kills from spread needle or whatever, but PvP was popular on 'rules' (not 1) where you DIDNT use your own weps, mags, traps, etc. They rebalanced your level and you had to use what you found in the small map.

If there was to be PvP in PSU, it'd probably include similar rules where people get rebalanced, and it takes place in an arena or small level--to prevent exactly what the nay-sayers of this topic are saying would spoil it. Hopefully.

I'd actually LIKE to see it, because it's one more thing to draw people into the game, to keep it entertaining, and if anyone was on the game who didn't like it/want it, it wouldn't be mandatory to any other portion of the game--ie no exclusive prizes etc. The more modes the merrier, (unless they're mandatory) I say.

Ffuzzy-Logik

Oct 11, 2007, 08:04 PM

On 2007-10-11 17:40, AzureBlaze wrote:
long post
Uh, no.

The only mode I found even remotely "fair" was Rule 6, and even there, the force just killed everyone with Zonde from behind a wall.

SO FUN

Gazetti

Oct 11, 2007, 08:08 PM

On 2007-10-11 18:04, Ffuzzy-Logik wrote:

On 2007-10-11 17:40, AzureBlaze wrote:
long post
Uh, no.

The only mode I found even remotely "fair" was Rule 6, and even there, the force just killed everyone with Zonde from behind a wall.

SO FUN

no one EVER beat me in rule six.

Sgt_Shligger

Oct 11, 2007, 08:13 PM

On 2007-10-11 17:52, Complex_Jao wrote:
I like my MMORPGs to be...well...an rpg if i wanted to kill someone id play Halo

RPG. Role Playing Game. You are playing the role of your character. Whether you're hunting monsters, searching for treasure, or battling the forces of darkness, it's still an RPG. If you're bettering your combat skills as a guardian through the use of a virtual reality chamber (or similar means) it's still an RPG. Some people play RPGs for the PvP aspect alone. If you "kill" someone in, say, World of Warcraft versus killing someone in Halo you're still killing them. The methods may be altered but it's the same result.

On the topic of PvP, I'm all for it if it does show up. Player rules would probably be set up like Azure mentioned. Forcing players to use equipment they find, for example, would mean each combatant is fairly balanced.

Forces can one shot most players, but they have a hard time aiming (though certain spells like the Gi- series or the Dam- series could be used at close range while they have a decent arsenal of ranged weaponry.)

Rangers can inflict status effects from a great. . . range but lose out on physical strength along with health. They can dodge projectiles since they should [generally] be far away. They can kite hunters (but they will need space and will have limited damage with most offhand weapons.)

Hunters can deal great damage but need to be relatively close to land a hit (which is balanced out by high HP.) Forces (as well as most rangers) won't last long [or at all] if the hunter manages to hit them/

Ibuka

Oct 11, 2007, 08:13 PM

rule 6 is the reason i made a HUnewearl so i can fight with techs and no techs. I can see how it was unblanced fighting RAmarl, RAcaseal, HUcaseal, HUmar and HUcast with a force, But a HUnewearl had no problem fighting a Force in R6

Genoa

Oct 11, 2007, 08:29 PM

The players weren't meant to fight eachother, therefore, PvP would fail. Just like PSO, players were meant to fight the games enemies >_>

If there was any kind of PvP, it should be like... missions where you all play together, and start off in different areas (each area's different depending on job) and your goal it to beat your area before the other players, you all fight seperate bosses that's determined by your job. Even if you have the same job, you get your own similar area.
Slap level requirements on their so it's fair, give like... some silly rewards, ... yeah, that would be neat
Put a bunch of traps and switches (farther switches for Forces/Rangers to shoot), I don't know... Just not PvP that involves contact with eachother <_>

Dragwind

Oct 11, 2007, 08:29 PM

This game isn't designed to have a PVP system in place. I wouldn't place any bets on PVP ever at this rate.

Sgt_Shligger

Oct 11, 2007, 08:32 PM

On 2007-10-11 18:29, Dragwind wrote:
This game isn't designed to have a PVP system in place. I wouldn't place any bets on PVP ever at this rate.

It doesn't have to be a great PvP system, just a PvP system. Most PvP systems in RPGs aren't great anyways, it's just something to mix it up, add variety.

F-Gattaca

Oct 11, 2007, 08:40 PM

PVP's a real nightmare for MMO balance, or at least, a perceptual balance. What might work out great versus the mobsters of the world might suck against other players.

I wouldn't mind a virtual reality/sparring-style PVP mode, though I think if Sega does decide to include one they ought to make a third ruleset that would take effect within PVP, so that types could be balanced against eachother in there and not affect the rest of Waldo.

Garnet_Moon

Oct 11, 2007, 08:57 PM

A PvP system would completely screw with the Gurhal Peace throughout the galaxy. Especially considering the events of the final Episode 2 mission. I won't go and spoil it, but after what happens at the end, the chances of any kind of "Battle Competitions" is less than zero. It's negative.

How would they explain it? Combat training? No, the training Guardians take is through missions with instructors, not fighting each other. Friendly competition? Again, Episode 2 Final pretty much screws that idea. At least until the conclusion of the events of the AoI story mode.

Any conflict between races that isn't political ain't gonna happen. The only conflict system we'll see is what we currently have. Eliminating terrorist organizations like ENDRUM, the extremist groups within the Communion, and the Illuminus.

It's not gonna happen because the events of the story mode(As well as the transition from PSU to AoI itself) simply do not allow it to happen. Ever. It was never even possible before the game launched. That whole peace treaty between all the races and such.

Believe it or not, we're apart of a universe currently in the grip of fear, terror, paranoia, etc. Maybe if there is another expansion it'll happen there, if they can find a way to explain it so it sounds right for the universe. But in AoI? Haha, no.

Personally I don't see how a Casino fits into the story, but i'm sure I won't care when i'm spending my time and money there...

http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif

[ This Message was edited by: Garnet_Moon on 2007-10-11 19:05 ]

F-Gattaca

Oct 11, 2007, 09:16 PM

How would they explain it? Combat training? No, the training Guardians take is through missions with instructors, not fighting each other. Friendly competition? Again, Episode 2 Final pretty much screws that idea. At least until the conclusion of the events of the AoI story mode.

As all players are Guardians, we're all mercenaries under the same corporate banner, so I think any PVP would be 1) virtual competition and 2) restricted to such scenarios, since I don't think the GUARDIANS would tolerate their employees openly slitting eachothers' throats in populated cities or during missions (despite the clamor I've heard from a few who want open and unrestricted PVP ... *shudder*).

I've avoided looking at Episode 3 information but I was under the impression that the GUARDIANS were forced to rely more on their planetary branches while G-Colony undergoes reconstruction, which MIGHT be partially the reason why we can move our rooms to the three planets now.

Regardless, what happened in Episode 2 was a nasty blow to the GUARDIANS, but I don't think they're entirely on the ropes yet. It's certainly going through a crisis, but at the same time I don't think things are so apocalyptic that it would prevent employees from enjoying a casino or some sort of virtual sparring tournament to vent stress from the dark days they're going through.

Garnet_Moon

Oct 11, 2007, 09:24 PM

Well, yeah, but a Virtual On type thing to hit the Gurhal System at a time like after what happens at the end of EP2? I don't know about you, but i'd be too busy crapping my pants for years after witnessing such an event and have little to no time to play a virtual game. The Universe needs rescuin', and we're going on overtime. No time for Vacations... unless your kind of vacation involves hunting wild game, terrorists, and poaching big things in strange new areas.

F-Gattaca

Oct 11, 2007, 09:49 PM

On 2007-10-11 19:24, Garnet_Moon wrote:
Well, yeah, but a Virtual On type thing to hit the Gurhal System at a time like after what happens at the end of EP2? I don't know about you, but i'd be too busy crapping my pants for years after witnessing such an event and have little to no time to play a virtual game. The Universe needs rescuin', and we're going on overtime. No time for Vacations... unless your kind of vacation involves hunting wild game, terrorists, and poaching big things in strange new areas.

Well--this kind of thing gets touchy to talk about because in many ways it's folly to compare real life to a sci-fi world written for a video game, but sociology should be okay to talk about. I'd say it'd be instructive to look into the lives of soldiers during a time when their nation was in a crisis or devastating war. Examining the lives of soldiers at a camp, base or fort, those on leave, etc.

Guardians aren't actual conscripted or recruited soliers, of course, but I think that underlines it a bit more--we do this thing for the money more than for the cause, although admittedly having the entire AMF turn into minions of Illuminus kind of makes us the only army Gurhal's got ...

Except maybe for CASTs (and even then, because there's a lot of subtext in the game saying we're more like synthetic humans than the Terminator or Data) I don't think a lot of people could have a machine-like dedication to the cause without some downtime.

Dre_o

Oct 11, 2007, 09:55 PM

On 2007-10-11 17:52, Complex_Jao wrote:
I like my MMORPGs to be...well...an rpg if i wanted to kill someone id play Halo Rainbow Six 3

Fixed for my sake, but I still agree.

Yusaku_Kudou

Oct 12, 2007, 03:46 AM

Take out PAs and it's entirely feasible. In PSO's Battle Mode, the players got knocked down after they took a critical hit and had a short period of invincibility. It could work and it was fun.

Nyreal

Oct 12, 2007, 03:47 AM

PvP would be fun. And Battle mode in PSO was actually really enjoyable. I can see the possibilities. Even if it is implemented, it's not like you have to take part in it.

Syl

Oct 12, 2007, 04:05 AM

Bleh, PvP is exciting, but at the same time it's just stupid. You could be arguing to someone that the sky is blue and it'll come down to "HUR I CAN PWN U IN PVP NOOB"

Gen2000

Oct 12, 2007, 04:16 AM

On 2007-10-11 18:32, Sgt_Shligger wrote:

On 2007-10-11 18:29, Dragwind wrote:
This game isn't designed to have a PVP system in place. I wouldn't place any bets on PVP ever at this rate.

It doesn't have to be a great PvP system, just a PvP system. Most PvP systems in RPGs aren't great anyways, it's just something to mix it up, add variety.

Yeah, I wouldn't be expecting Viruta Fighter depth or balance, just something else to do for shits and giggles besides grinding random mission 35390 times in a row or sitting in lobby and watch people spam trade ads nonstop.

[ This Message was edited by: Gen2000 on 2007-10-12 02:17 ]

LightBreaker

Oct 12, 2007, 04:58 AM

No thanks. :| PVP in this game would be horrible. Not to say pvp is awful in most games as it is anyway.

[ This Message was edited by: LightBreaker on 2007-10-12 03:00 ]

amtalx

Oct 12, 2007, 06:24 AM

No.

PvP = Auto-fail

ljkkjlcm9

Oct 12, 2007, 06:37 AM

this game was not designed for PvP

It must be purposefully designed for, or it'll never work. Even WoW has problems with some classes being complete BS during PvP, and that's basically a PvP game!

THE JACKEL

XDeathX

Oct 12, 2007, 09:53 AM

You people seem to forget in PSO, you can choose preferences.

Weapons, map, lvls, techs, etc.

Not that I care though.

The_Gio

Oct 12, 2007, 10:42 AM

I say, they make an arena,where teams fight each other, where people can bet on themselves but only bet once a day on the same person(and if its a team battle, then u cant bet on the party the persons in)and people can watch ur fight, having tournaments with good prizes like rare weapons. Everything seems fairly balance to PvP, everyone seems to disagree but if you think about it, Hunters have to get close to you to hit you, well if if a hunter goes against a force, then it depends on the persons skill to aim with the spell, if its a ranger vs a hunter, if your forgetting, rangers actually have pretty good constant damage which would eventually kill the hunter and since rangers have range,they can do it. Personally, the only person I see getting screwed is the hunter because of the distance, but thats why we would have team games, to add stategy to the fight, and I used to have a lot of fun on PSOs battle mode, especially when someone started talking crap to me and challenge me. I agree with Gazetti about having another reason to level up, cuz to me, killing monsters is getting really dull. And if you dont like fighting then stay away from assholes simple as that. If you cant, then just live with it, its how people are, not everything has to be nice and dandy ;D

[ This Message was edited by: The_Gio on 2007-10-12 08:43 ]

princejake2

Oct 12, 2007, 10:47 AM

Im all for it but I do agree it would be broken

Gazetti

Oct 12, 2007, 11:53 AM

someone said it before. you dont HAVE to play pvp if they made it. and regardless if it was crappy or too unblanced, thats where strategy would come in. most people see it in the prospective of one on one. you can have 6 people in a game. making it possable tor 3v3 or any other possiblity. you can tell me that it would be broken and unblanced right now, but the moment you get into a game with a few of your friends i'm willing to bet you cant tell me that you didnt have a good time.

[ This Message was edited by: Gazetti on 2007-10-12 09:54 ]

panzer_unit

Oct 12, 2007, 12:35 PM

Some people will get off on anything where they can show off some game-destroying trick or class or equipment. These are the people who love PSO's battle mode. The gameplay was crap, character balance in ALL modes was crap, and the only "skill" you needed was Nut-Cupping 101.

Gazetti

Oct 12, 2007, 09:43 PM

On 2007-10-12 10:35, panzer_unit wrote:
Some people will get off on anything where they can show off some game-destroying trick or class or equipment. These are the people who love PSO's battle mode. The gameplay was crap, character balance in ALL modes was crap, and the only "skill" you needed was Nut-Cupping 101.

what in the hell are you talking about? did we even play the same game?? you must have been one of the people who could never win in any battle quest and are just ventng.

AzureBlaze

Oct 13, 2007, 12:43 AM

Yes, PSO's BA did have probs.
Ffuzzy logic picked one out right away. FO's were seriously overpowered. ST gave way too much weight to techs. I didn't get into it in my original post, because no one had yet asked for depth in the experience of BA.

BA was conducted in such a way (with specific team-names governing who could join---it actually ended up as a type of code in the end) Such as RU6 NOFO. Meaning, only forces were allowed to fight eachother, and only hunters could fight hunters. If any FO were to enter such a game, it would be shouted at until it left.

So you basically had all these humars running around fighting only other humars. And on rules (like 2, 3, and 6) they all had exactly the same gear, exactly the same stats, and all the same 'space' to work in. The only thing that varied was skillz, which was where the fun came in, and that other stuff from my first post. This 'extra user set rules' solves ffuzy logic's, and panzer unit's problem.

**Should you have had to have all these extra rules? No. ST should've taken care of it. But did the extra user-made rules make it work, and make it fun? Yes. Did they prove PSO BA was broken? In a way, yes, but in that same way they served to help fix it.

There weren't really any 'tricks' avialable in such tight circumstances, except shooting ice traps, faster ice-wiggle, (damm you psu bring back my ice wiggle) self-kill and team-mate kill (KM! KM!) with damg traps, and the ability to unequip before you died, all of which are considerably easier said than done.

But it will never solve the maniacs who want to 'bring the argument into the ring'--but they're here anyway proving their point by "having more haxeta then u" because I don't think you can stop them by simply not having or having a mode. They'll always try to front to prove their point.

(oh boy another long post. Press button: get history lesson. wheee)

panzer_unit

Oct 13, 2007, 07:00 AM

On 2007-10-12 19:43, Gazetti wrote:
what in the hell are you talking about? did we even play the same game?? you must have been one of the people who could never win in any battle quest and are just ventng.

... or maybe Combat for Atari2600 was a better fighting game.

I played Battle Mode for a until I got tired of polishing a turd. It wasn't and never will be enjoyable unless you're one of those people who would have fun watching paint dry as long as someone told you YOU WIN at the end. It even lags on hits and plays like crap in multi-player offline for GameCube, which is baffling. HOW DID THEY DO THAT?!

Guildenstern

Oct 13, 2007, 09:08 AM

PVP?

No thanks. :/

Indica

Oct 13, 2007, 11:26 AM

I doubt there will ever be a PvP, unless you are fighting against the same class.

Foretecher vs Fortefighter or any other character would be suicide. My force would wipe you out in a heartbeat.

Force vs Force is the only fair way to properly play PvP

ThEoRy

Oct 13, 2007, 11:38 AM

Pvp sucked, was boring and pointless.
"Oh wait, I think I won. No, I think you did. Here wait, let me revive you so we can fight again? Wait theres a dragon. Do we fight him or each other? "

Now Challenge mode on the other hand, that was fun, and had a point.

Bomber The Cosmonaut

Oct 13, 2007, 12:07 PM

On 2007-10-13 09:38, ThEoRy wrote:
Pvp sucked, was boring and pointless.
"Oh wait, I think I won. No, I think you did. Here wait, let me revive you so we can fight again? Wait theres a dragon. Do we fight him or each other? "

Now Challenge mode on the other hand, that was fun, and had a point.

Yeah... A challenge mode would be nice. :/
You really think we'd get one?

CyarVictor

Oct 13, 2007, 01:03 PM

PVP on PSU, ha. Doubt it will work. Maybe people should try an actually mmo's pvp and then realize why it's not possible on here. Maybe more runs similar to Bruce; timed, hard, and with some kind of actual objective. Or Endless nightmare.

ShadowDragon28

Oct 13, 2007, 01:06 PM

Old topic is old.

This is like the 12th time this has been brought up and argued about. The forums do have a search function... *face palm*

DavidNel

Oct 13, 2007, 01:11 PM

I personally think it would be fun. Somehow, though, the stats would need to be balanced, and so should the weapons. Do I think it will be horribly skewed if a PVP is made? Yes. Do I think it would be fun anyway? Yes.

I say that it just wouldn't hurt anyone or anything if there was a PVP. No player would be forced to play it, but it would be availible for those who want it. I'd probably use it a few times, just to break the monotony.

F-Gattaca

Oct 13, 2007, 01:25 PM

On 2007-10-13 10:07, BomberStrife wrote:
Yeah... A challenge mode would be nice. :/
You really think we'd get one?

I imagine if they do something like that, it'd be a special party mission involving the purification of a HIVE or an infected AMF base or something, however ... either:

1) Your G-Flyer/PPT Shuttle is shot down or badly damaged on the way in, causing you to lose the nanotransformer with all your stuff. You get it back at the end of the mission, but you have to make do with supplies you find on the way to your objective.

2) You are paradropped/inserted somehow, but your gear suffers from a misdrop, resulting in the same problem. You'll get your original equipment at the end of the mission.

And for some reason you find yourself back at level 1.

It's a kind of a Metroid Prime/Metal Gear way of explaining how it'd happen, but it could work. If your mission is to clear out an AMF base, you could string together a mission with the locales in this order:

Denes Lake field (nightfall) -> Lakeshore field (twilight) -> Raffon Meadow field (daytime) -> Field Base (as a mission zone, like in online story missions) -> "Mellvore" area (actual underground base)

panzer_unit

Oct 13, 2007, 02:46 PM

Actually Battle Mode did provide one of the more entertaining ways to play PSOv2... start a battle mode game, but skip the hunter's guild desk and start trying to clear areas with friendly-fire turned on. You can watch your teamwork or spam a lot of moon atomizers lol.

I also miss being able to bank all my equipment and money and start in Forest entirely un-equipped except for the mag. From there you start equipping yourself off of random drops. I've never been so glad to see a Launcher with 15% native in my life.

biggabertha

Oct 13, 2007, 10:14 PM

I've never been so glad to see a Launcher with 15% native in my life.

Ha ha ha! Actual LOL! (Not fun for housemates at 4am) I'd imagine that PvP would make some classes better than others one on one but in teams? I wonder how well a team of six players would do against another six..

Can you imagine how good abilities like Barada Chamga would be? Or Chousei-Sou with it's REALLY long range (same or longer than a Rifle) and I DON'T CARE IF YOU HAVE A 50% 12* ARMOUR. You'd get good team work I bet, PAs like Tornado Dance and Anga Jabroga would be awesome to use to split a tight knit of players apart and it'd be so awesome for those who can use the twin claws' third PA's third combo to "sneakily" approach a group of players. Heh heh..

(I know it doesn't last long enough or get much travel but it'd still be cool!)

I wonder how well Grenade Launchers and Mayalee Prism would do as well.. Heh, you can expect a LOT of lag-time for those bad boys to work!

Gazetti

Oct 14, 2007, 12:03 AM

On 2007-10-13 05:00, panzer_unit wrote:

On 2007-10-12 19:43, Gazetti wrote:
what in the hell are you talking about? did we even play the same game?? you must have been one of the people who could never win in any battle quest and are just ventng.

... or maybe Combat for Atari2600 was a better fighting game.

I played Battle Mode for a until I got tired of polishing a turd. It wasn't and never will be enjoyable unless you're one of those people who would have fun watching paint dry as long as someone told you YOU WIN at the end. It even lags on hits and plays like crap in multi-player offline for GameCube, which is baffling. HOW DID THEY DO THAT?!

yeah, we deffently arnt talking about the same game. and if we are, then its just a fact that your no good at it. look, i'm sorry pso battle really did take alittle TALENT that you didnt have. but thats no reason for you to just knock it that much. but i guess you have the right to speek your mind. lets just agree to disagree.

MrNomad

Oct 14, 2007, 12:20 AM

On 2007-10-13 22:03, Gazetti wrote:

On 2007-10-13 05:00, panzer_unit wrote:

On 2007-10-12 19:43, Gazetti wrote:
what in the hell are you talking about? did we even play the same game?? you must have been one of the people who could never win in any battle quest and are just ventng.

... or maybe Combat for Atari2600 was a better fighting game.

I played Battle Mode for a until I got tired of polishing a turd. It wasn't and never will be enjoyable unless you're one of those people who would have fun watching paint dry as long as someone told you YOU WIN at the end. It even lags on hits and plays like crap in multi-player offline for GameCube, which is baffling. HOW DID THEY DO THAT?!

yeah, we deffently arnt talking about the same game. and if we are, then its just a fact that your no good at it. look, i'm sorry pso battle really did take alittle TALENT that you didnt have. but thats no reason for you to just knock it that much. but i guess you have the right to speek your mind. lets just agree to disagree.

*looks at your sig* PvP on an ORPG is not street fighter, or any FIGHTING game in general, so let's agree that it would be far unbalanced, and yes I know what I'm talking about...

TranceZiggy

Oct 14, 2007, 01:46 AM

PvP on PSO awesome, IF you followed a rule. Forest battles had to be the most boring thing ive ever seen. Rule 6, no techs. THAT was a real battle. But, I can't see it happening very well on PSU, so tbqh, I'd rather they not ruin the Ba6 name by trying to recreate any form of it on PSU.

Reipard

Oct 14, 2007, 03:12 AM

*looks at your sig* PvP on an ORPG is not street fighter, or any FIGHTING game in general, so let's agree that it would be far unbalanced, and yes I know what I'm talking about...

You know you're talking about a universe where Ultima Online, Dark Age of Camelot, WoW, Shadowbane all don't exist?

[ This Message was edited by: Reipard on 2007-10-14 01:13 ]

Remius

Oct 14, 2007, 05:18 AM

PVP would be great.

It just wouldnt be the balanced Guilty Gear you fools expect it to be. It would be a more "RUN IN WITH UR FORCE AND NUKE THE WORLD", with 30 life matches instead of "heated 1v1 gameplay of skill".

Because we all know that doesnt exist.

Kylie

Oct 14, 2007, 11:22 AM

http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_confused.gif I can see it being a bit unfair in some aspects, but I also think it'd be pretty fun. I mean, I have a weakness for making bets, and I can see myself putting meseta or whatever on the line for a fight. Heh, REO had a deathmatch (PVP) feature, and I think I was pretty good at it.

Nobo

Oct 14, 2007, 03:35 PM

On 2007-10-11 16:18, Mayu wrote:
Hell no

Pvp OWNS DUDE wtf! http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_argh.gif

[ This Message was edited by: Nobo on 2007-10-14 13:35 ]

Anduril

Oct 14, 2007, 03:48 PM

I wouldn't want full PvP, just the option to kill people on your team. I would be a happy camper if I could kill some of the annoying people I've played with.(Though of course as it stands I let them die by not healing them....)

Nyreal

Oct 14, 2007, 03:52 PM

Lots of asshats need to die. I'll agree with that.

Especially people who think that I can't play. Goddamit, I've been playing this game's clone for half a decade. Don't tell me how to freaking attack a mob.

HUnewearl_Meira

Oct 14, 2007, 04:27 PM

I think that PvP could potentially work in PSU, provided that it's implemented differently from the method used in PSO. Personally, I would like to see characters be a part of different factions. For example, instead of requiring a character to be a Guardian, you might have the option of joining the AMF, COG or the Rogues. At the very least, I'd like to see an option to be a Rogue; this would provide a decent framework for both open PvP and organized PvP. As it is now, it'd be Guardians fighting Guardians, and that just doesn't work.

Sgt_Shligger

Oct 14, 2007, 07:59 PM

On 2007-10-14 14:27, HUnewearl_Meira wrote:
I think that PvP could potentially work in PSU, provided that it's implemented differently from the method used in PSO. Personally, I would like to see characters be a part of different factions. For example, instead of requiring a character to be a Guardian, you might have the option of joining the AMF, COG or the Rogues. At the very least, I'd like to see an option to be a Rogue; this would provide a decent framework for both open PvP and organized PvP. As it is now, it'd be Guardians fighting Guardians, and that just doesn't work.

The only way to justify Guardians fighting Guardians would be a V.R. training room, which would seem like a lame excuse to throw PvP in.

VanHalen

Oct 14, 2007, 08:02 PM

Or a Tournament http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_eek.gif

physic

Oct 14, 2007, 10:42 PM

Pvp is an option, not a way of life. It was far from perfect on pso, but sometimes it could be pretty entertaining. I dont know why people hat e options so much, as if the mere fact that it exists in the game will kill your desire to play. Now challenge mode was greatness to me, i would love to see that back, but i bet there are some who are like hell no challenge sucks/wastes my time blah blah. just cause you dont like it doesnt mean it serves no purpose, the more options the better

Jife_Jifremok

Oct 14, 2007, 11:47 PM

On 2007-10-11 19:49, F-Gattaca wrote:

On 2007-10-11 19:24, Garnet_Moon wrote:
Well, yeah, but a Virtual On type thing to hit the Gurhal System at a time like after what happens at the end of EP2? I don't know about you, but i'd be too busy crapping my pants for years after witnessing such an event and have little to no time to play a virtual game. The Universe needs rescuin', and we're going on overtime. No time for Vacations... unless your kind of vacation involves hunting wild game, terrorists, and poaching big things in strange new areas.

Well--this kind of thing gets touchy to talk about because in many ways it's folly to compare real life to a sci-fi world written for a video game, but sociology should be okay to talk about. I'd say it'd be instructive to look into the lives of soldiers during a time when their nation was in a crisis or devastating war. Examining the lives of soldiers at a camp, base or fort, those on leave, etc.

Guardians aren't actual conscripted or recruited soliers, of course, but I think that underlines it a bit more--we do this thing for the money more than for the cause, although admittedly having the entire AMF turn into minions of Illuminus kind of makes us the only army Gurhal's got ...

Except maybe for CASTs (and even then, because there's a lot of subtext in the game saying we're more like synthetic humans than the Terminator or Data) I don't think a lot of people could have a machine-like dedication to the cause without some downtime.

In dark times like this, GUARDIANS could use some fun and games every now and then. Gawik's Pub better get some damn drinks soon so we can all get drunk as we celebrate victories over the forces of evil. They may have hit us hard, but we're fighting and surviving, and we're gonna win! (And beating the crap outta each other, say, through some tacked-on VR simulations, might get our skills up as we have fun. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif I'd bet there'd be some horrible imbalanced and general gameplay flaws keeping that from being fun though.)

KaiNova7

Oct 15, 2007, 09:00 AM

Heh. Too many pvp haters in here. Im all for it WHEN battle mode comes out. Probably next exspansion. Just a matter of time.

Gazetti

Oct 15, 2007, 09:23 AM

there was no back story on pvp in pso, and that worked. who says there needs to be one here? some people dont listen to the main story, but yet some do and live by it. i've met people who dont even know who ethen waber is, and people who dont let lou or Laia out of their party. but really as far as pvp on psu goes for story... i really could care less i just wanna kick some ass.

the fun factor on pvp FOR ME would be building my stats so that i can beat my friends. its nice to see whos the best, and the little solo mission races arnt cuttin' it...

panzer_unit

Oct 15, 2007, 10:04 AM

On 2007-10-13 22:03, Gazetti wrote:

yeah, we deffently arnt talking about the same game. and if we are, then its just a fact that your no good at it. look, i'm sorry pso battle really did take alittle TALENT that you didnt have. but thats no reason for you to just knock it that much. but i guess you have the right to speek your mind. lets just agree to disagree.

It's not about my lack of talent. I've lacked talent in all kinds of other fighting / online games that I would still say were awesome. PSO battle mode sure as hell isn't one of them.

If Sonic Team tries anything like that again they should work on it until it's actually good instead of utterly halfassed, or drop it and put the effort into something else that doesn't suck like more regular missions or rare equipment.

amtalx

Oct 15, 2007, 10:41 AM

On 2007-10-14 20:42, physic wrote:
Pvp is an option, not a way of life. It was far from perfect on pso, but sometimes it could be pretty entertaining. I dont know why people hat e options so much, as if the mere fact that it exists in the game will kill your desire to play. Now challenge mode was greatness to me, i would love to see that back, but i bet there are some who are like hell no challenge sucks/wastes my time blah blah. just cause you dont like it doesnt mean it serves no purpose, the more options the better

I think people (and by people, I mean me http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif) are complaining more that it won't be properly implemented. It was poorly implemented in PSO, and unless ST does something magical, it will be the same in PSU.

Also, the side effect of building jackassery is pretty high. I know I had my fair share of people spouting "wutevar, ill pwn u newb" for no reason in PSO.
PvP = Swedish made e-peen enlager pump

In a game where cooperation is the mainstay, PvP just doesn't fit very well.

F-Gattaca

Oct 15, 2007, 11:12 AM

On 2007-10-15 07:23, Gazetti wrote:
there was no back story on pvp in pso, and that worked. who says there needs to be one here? some people dont listen to the main story, but yet some do and live by it. i've met people who dont even know who ethen waber is, and people who dont let lou or Laia out of their party. but really as far as pvp on psu goes for story... i really could care less i just wanna kick some ass.

There's a reason why this game is in the role playing genre, man. Sure, as an MMO, most people don't get into the story on a personal basis, and like you said there are some who don't even care and just like to kill things and gain levels, but it's still there.

With PSO it was okay to not give PVP any explanation because Hunters were bounty hunters. Unlike the GUARDIANS, the Hunter's Guild wasn't a company where Hunters were employees and meant to follow corporate regulations. Neither was it an army. It was exactly what its name said--a guild for bounty hunters, members of an organization that existed mainly to organize requests for jobs and give some coordination.

You could expect some potentially deadly competition among rivals and enemies within the guild--after all, look at Kireek and what encounters you have with him during the offline story missions in PSO. So, there'd be no need to explain why Hunters would sometimes feel like cutting each others' throats.

TranceZiggy

Oct 15, 2007, 11:53 AM

On 2007-10-12 22:43, AzureBlaze wrote:
Yes, PSO's BA did have probs.
Ffuzzy logic picked one out right away. FO's were seriously overpowered. ST gave way too much weight to techs. I didn't get into it in my original post, because no one had yet asked for depth in the experience of BA.

BA was conducted in such a way (with specific team-names governing who could join---it actually ended up as a type of code in the end) Such as RU6 NOFO. Meaning, only forces were allowed to fight eachother, and only hunters could fight hunters. If any FO were to enter such a game, it would be shouted at until it left.

So you basically had all these humars running around fighting only other humars. And on rules (like 2, 3, and 6) they all had exactly the same gear, exactly the same stats, and all the same 'space' to work in. The only thing that varied was skillz, which was where the fun came in, and that other stuff from my first post. This 'extra user set rules' solves ffuzy logic's, and panzer unit's problem.

**Should you have had to have all these extra rules? No. ST should've taken care of it. But did the extra user-made rules make it work, and make it fun? Yes. Did they prove PSO BA was broken? In a way, yes, but in that same way they served to help fix it.

There weren't really any 'tricks' avialable in such tight circumstances, except shooting ice traps, faster ice-wiggle, (damm you psu bring back my ice wiggle) self-kill and team-mate kill (KM! KM!) with damg traps, and the ability to unequip before you died, all of which are considerably easier said than done.

But it will never solve the maniacs who want to 'bring the argument into the ring'--but they're here anyway proving their point by "having more haxeta then u" because I don't think you can stop them by simply not having or having a mode. They'll always try to front to prove their point.

(oh boy another long post. Press button: get history lesson. wheee)

I normally wouldn't bother commenting on a random post such as this, but it caught my attention. Idk about you, but BA6 No Techs was the best thing about PSO. I did it for years, constantly. PSO wasn't an RPG to a small community known as the 'R6 Battlers'. It was a battle ground. And, keeping techs out of battles, with purely close range characters, was a way of determining one's skill. Ever pulled out mechguns, shot an ice trap above yourself while an opponent was charging at you with a Brand, ice-broke out of the ice and mechgunned them to death before they can react to being frozen? THAT is easier said than done. Most of these tricks weren't even designed to be used by the developers, the battle community invented them. Every single battle was unique, NO battle went the same way, it was up to your pure skill to react to your changing surroundings on the battle field, and it was a constant challenege. No, we shouldn't HAVE TO make up these extra rules, but who say's were not allowed to make the game our own? Who says we have to integrate EVERY part of the game into our battles?

FO's did alot of damage with techs, yes. They could do 3/4 to 3 characters in the same area, with Rafoie. BUT, they could be 1-hit killed with a hard hit from a HUmar wielding an Autogun. Correct use of your surroundings easily ensured they couldnt lock a Zonde or Rafoie onto you, and don't even start on Grants. Grants cost all your TP, and did about as much damage as a slap in the face from an unarmed FO.

But yep, imho. PSO BA Mode was the best thing to happen to that game.