Poll: What made PSO better than PSU (if anything?)

[Ken_Silver]

*A nice peaceful debate here would be nice, since this my first major topic*

I never played PSO online but offline, it was OK to me at most. I had fun but I had just as much fun playing PSU online. What truly made PSO so popular and made people hate PSU afterwards? I mean from a graphics, mechanics and clothing options standpoint PSU seems to be the superior. As I look through the forms, I see the most obvious reason for the argument PSO > PSU: more rare hunting. Were rares that importatnt? I am not taking sides here, but is there a chance that people don't want to open up to a new idea. I just want to know people's opinion so I can wonder if I was just a bit late on getting in to the community of PSO/PSU.

Please discuss here. (and take into account the release of PSU: AOI)

[Zorafim]

inb4flamewar


Erm, I liked the levels, actually. Each PSO level was a maze instead of a path. You had to figure out your way to the boss, often getting lost if you didn't keep the map close. Even if you did the same level multiple times, either the variance of the level would cause you to be continuously lost, or the the sheer amount of mazeness would do it.
PSU's levels are much more linear, causing people to master the levels much quicker. It makes for boring gameplay in between battles.


Speaking of battles, I think PSO was more fun there as well. The monsters, despite being much more simple, always moved around and had a danger of striking. PSU's monsters strike randomly, and the strikes take a while to do. I could always figure out strategies for PSO's combat, but I can't do too much besides button mash Majarra in PSU.

Also, I liked PSO's fleshies and class distribution.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Zorafim on 2007-11-08 18:01 ]</font>

[Zantra]

PSO is better offline, PSU is better online, end of discussion.

[Ken_Silver]

I hope not *hids under trash can*

[Remedy]

The community. People were actually willing to help you out and share rares in PSO. PSU's community is so god damned greedy and self-serving that it's depressing. Item calls were respected in PSO, instead of getting you laughed at in PSU.

In games like these, the community makes the game. PSU may be better from a technical standpoint, but god damn is it way worse from a community standpoint.

[Zantra]

On 2007-11-08 17:59, Remedy wrote:
The community. People were actually willing to help you out and share rares in PSO. PSU's community is so god damned greedy and self-serving that it's depressing. Item calls were respected in PSO, instead of getting you laughed at in PSU.

In games like these, the community makes the game. PSU may be better from a technical standpoint, but god damn is it way worse from a community standpoint.



Agree'd

[Zorafim]

By the way, I'd like to add this to counter-act the PSU baseless fanboyism.


If only PSU could be an eighth of what PSO was.


This was on a FFXI forum, on neutral ground. There hasn't been a single post like that on any forum that I've seen besides the PSU forums. So don't start with the "PSU was better than PSO in every way, and everyone who thinks otherwise is blind to the truth" I keep on hearing.



Another thing I liked about PSO was the quests, or at least the offline ones. Simply by playing offline, I felt a sense of accomplishment just by continuously running new quests through the same area. It was also a great way to get to know the PSO world, and get deeper into the story.
So far, all that PSU's quests have done is show me that only your character is competent, and everyone has to have you cover up their mistakes. Either that, or some monster is attacking some area for some reason, and you have to stop it.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Zorafim on 2007-11-08 18:13 ]</font>

[Wallin]

The fact that in PSO had a story both online and offline was nice, I miss that.

PSU online doesn't have anything, you go to your room, take a boring tutorial and go out and gives hugs to Pannons. No messages from Red Ring Rico tripping out as you progress, no really boring chats with the president on Pioneer (okay, that we can probably skip, LOL), although the president at least gave some interest to the game. "There's something going on in the caves, a freaky monster! Oh noes! Please investigate while we monitor the planet from a safe distance like pansies. kthxbye" And then you find out about Dark Falz at the end, and you also had to go through that (annoying) monolith thing where you had to find all the keys to open the door to the Ruins.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Wallin on 2007-11-08 18:10 ]</font>

[Ken_Silver]

On 2007-11-08 18:07, Wallin wrote:
The fact that in PSO had a story both online and offline was nice, I miss that.

PSU online doesn't have anything, you go to your room, take a boring tutorial and go out and gives hugs to Pannons. No messages from Red Ring Rico tripping out as you progress, no really boring chats with the president on Pioneer (okay, that we can probably skip, LOL), although the president at least gave some interest to the game. "There's something going on in the caves, a freaky monster! Oh noes! Please investigate while we monitor the planet from a safe distance like pansies. kthxbye" And then you find out about Dark Falz at the end, and you also had to go through that (annoying) monolith thing where you had to find all the keys to open the door to the Ruins.



LMAO. I can relate to that. PSU offline mode is lame. But I heard that epsiode 2's will be much better. Then again, too little too late, I suppose.

[Zantra]

I don't like crafting, or room decorations, or changing my characters clothes, so I only shop at the armor shop, the items shop, and the weapons shop in PSU, just like in PSO. I won't even use the grinders shop until AOI comes out, so that none of my items break.

PA's are a poor replacement for the strong attacks and special attacks that weapons used to have. Partner machines are a poor replacement for MAGs, and I don't like the fact that you have to attach spells to your wand, when in PSO your force could cast tons of spells, and never have to swap them out.

[Wallin]

I never actually played offline mode. I figured if I was going to play offline I could obviously spend the time leveling up my character online. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wink.gif That and it was less personal since the hero wasn't you this time, it was someone else who never really got my attention.

I also remember from PSO that a lot of the missions seemed boring back then, I remember skipping over a lot of the text, but now that I remember them they were actually a lot of fun. Rescuing the n00b hunter, finding the android who could talk to MAGs, getting out of the Mines by solving the maze-switch puzzle before the whole thing exploded and killed your group (how many other people completely f'd this up and died over and over because they couldn't figure out how to deactivate the stupid steam guns that blocked the exit teleporter?!?) - those were good times.

[Ken_Silver]

On 2007-11-08 18:11, Zantra wrote:
I don't like crafting, or room decorations, or changing my characters clothes, so I only shop at the armor shop, the items shop, and the weapons shop in PSU, just like in PSO. I won't even use the grinders shop until AOI comes out, so that none of my items break.

PA's are a poor replacement for the strong attacks and special attacks that weapons used to have. Partner machines are a poor replacement for MAGs, and I don't like the fact that you have to attach spells to your wand, when in PSO your force could cast tons of spells, and never have to swap them out.



I can't agree with the whole clothing thing. That is one of the few things that PSU has over PSO. I like to change my clothes. There is so much variety. Then again, who plays a game soley for the fashion? Not I. And yes, being able to use a bunch of spells is a lot better than being restrained to 1 or 2 or 4

[Wallin]

On 2007-11-08 18:14, Ken_Silver wrote:
Then again, who plays a game soley for the fashion?

ME!!! (And no, I'm not joking http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif)

[DarthRuin]

PSO was fresh and new. Then they released the same game all sexed up. I still like PSU, but PSO was like... wow.

[Zorafim]

On 2007-11-08 18:15, Wallin wrote:

On 2007-11-08 18:14, Ken_Silver wrote:
Then again, who plays a game soley for the fashion?

ME!!! (And no, I'm not joking http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif)



That's actually something that PSU has leaps and bounds above PSO. Though I like PSO's style a bit more, the customization of PSU is just amazing. You couldn't even begin to do the things that PSU could do, and it just keeps on getting deeper as the game continues.

[Hokokaru]

I thought PSO was pretty cool and whatnot and i only had offline due to having dial-up internet back then but I like PSU online because I have people to mess around with and talk to while on PSO i had no one to play with but it was pretty fun so im drifting more towards PSU =)

[Ffuzzy-Logik]

I think the past 100 versions of this topic handled the debate well enough.

[Rizen]

I will say that PSO was alot more fun to hunt rares than PSU. It kept the game what it was for so long.

Also, I would say that the stages were a bit more fun to play since it wasn't all linear. Also you could take your time with stages instead of trying to get to the end for rewards and repeating.

[Ken_Silver]

On 2007-11-08 18:15, Wallin wrote:

On 2007-11-08 18:14, Ken_Silver wrote:
Then again, who plays a game soley for the fashion?

ME!!! (And no, I'm not joking http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif)


I Lol at you in a good way. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif Take no disrespect in it. I just find it funny. *moving on though* Clothes are very important to me too, but I don't think that PSU is 100% broken in terms of the fighting system. It forces people to think due to its restrictions. However there is no excuse for lame, linear maps

[mizukage]

PSO... I woke up, played 25 minutes and dozed off for a few hours. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_sleep.gif
PSU... I woke up, played 7 hours and didn't need to sleep for many more hours. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif

Thus, is PSU more awesome than PSO or not???

The topic is asking for a biased opinion and here is my biased answer. Of course, I know and understand that tons of people love PSO more than anything and I also play PSO too. Its a great game!

[Zantra]

I actually think that we have enough threads like this, to make a whole "PSU or PSO: contrast and compare" forum...

[GeekRuler]

I went back to PSO and I'm glad I play PSU the interface has become much more cumbersome over the years and the battle mechanics take block to a new level (or old one).

Don't get me wrong, I loved PSO and it was complicated and engrossing when I first played it but it hasn't aged well enough for my tastes ...
I still remember all the map variants though, and the weapons; where they drop, drops them and what have you.
I can't say PSO was deeper in any sense lol (don't fool yourselves disproving this one...)
The only thing I can think of was the accessability of rares. The synthing system isn't bad granted the AoI improvements will be well met but I see no need I bashing something to make the game a bit more difficult to plow through.
The reason why people are more greedy is that they have means to be greedy with, giving PSO a shop option would have made stingyness go up a hell of a lot more... (not to mention some weapons were gotten by cheating methods *cough cough*)
PSO was one of the most simple MMO's I've played thats why I liked it and now with PSU I find the difficulty factor satisfactory so by me and my humble I find PSO only better than V1 of PSU.

(ps if this thread goes on for a long time grab some popcorn theres gonna be some biased nostalgic fanboy answers plus good arguements http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif *please don't hurt me for saying that* *wince*

[Weeaboolits]

They both excel in different aspects, dammit. PSO had better atmosphere, cooler weapons and a better story (from what I saw of PSU so far).

PSU has more fluid gameplay and looks nicer, though the weapons seem pretty limited from a creative standpoint. :<

[Zantra]

I miss the section ID's... PINKAL, REDRIA, etc.

[Weeaboolits]

No you don't, recreating your character with different names over and over until you got the ID that had the weapons you want? No thanks.

[ThEoRy]

Nostalgia

period

[Zantra]

On 2007-11-08 18:36, Ronin_Cooper wrote:
No you don't, recreating your character with different names over and over until you got the ID that had the weapons you want? No thanks.



Actually if you knew the system, you could get the ones you wanted.

And, I made one character for every section ID, so that I could get all the weapons.

[Ken_Silver]

sorry if the topic is overdone, but I honestly just wanted to know why PSU has been smashed on since its debut. I like PSU (just a slight more) more than PSO. That is why I added the pole, just to make it slightly different. That is why I wanted the fair and balanced opinion of people who have played PSO online and PSU online. Appeareance wise (to me) PSU is better, while PSO is better storywise and offline-wise (for the Gamecube.)

[Weeaboolits]

A character for every ID? What a nuisance. Even if you used a calculator it was a pain to go through name after name trying for the right ID.

[Hokokaru]

I miss the section ID's... PINKAL, REDRIA, etc.
---------
It would balance out the trading i guess due to the fact that only certain people can get certain Items so people hat to trade to get the weapons maybe....

[Zantra]

On 2007-11-08 18:41, Ronin_Cooper wrote:
A character for every ID? What a nuisance. Even if you used a calculator it was a pain to go through name after name trying for the right ID.



It's only 10 characters, and you don't even really need a YELLOWBOZE, because it has no exclusives. So, basically you only need nine characters. So (Pre-episode 1&2) you can have one character of each race/class combo, and have them each be of a different section, in order to get every item/armor, that is in the game.

If you like PSO, like I do, you wouldn't find it tedious to have 9 characters, actually, you'd probably enjoy having the option of having more then 4 characters in PSU, if they gave you that option. I imagine that most people playing PSU, would want 8 characters, so that they could have every race/sex combo, and so that they could make whatever classes they wanted, without having to switch.

That way, they could use luck to their advantage, and get more rare items.


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Zantra on 2007-11-08 18:55 ]</font>

[Zorafim]

On 2007-11-08 18:37, ThEoRy wrote:
Nostalgia

period



Different forum than my last quote:


Hmm, lets see. Well I was a big fan of the original PSO on Dreamcast back in the day. That game was like a revolution for me, it got me hooked on online games. Between now and back then I've played more online games than I can recall, but I remember getting bored with PSO and wanting FFXI to come out. Ironically when FFXI came out I was wishing I could be playing PSO instead, but didn't want to buy an X-Box/Gamecube for just one game. I kept looking back like PSO on Dreamcast was some kind of golden age when gaming online was actually fun and didn't feel like a chore.

Anyway PSU failed to live up to my expectations. I wanted another PSO but somehow, PSU just couldn't be that. Some people might disagree with me, but PSU didn't have the same kind of charm as its predecessor. Maybe after playing a few real MMORPGs, I could never go back to enjoying a game like PSO. Compared to FFXI and WoW, PSU was really shallow, and I got bored with it in the first week. Another reason I quit was because Sega hardly delivered on their promises with the updates. Bottom line, PSU was a bland hack 'n' slash/grindfest. If I wanted to mindlessly grind all day I'd just go back to WoW, which I did when BC came out.

The game is still on my PC because one of these days I'm going to at least beat single player mode. All I gotta do is manage to stay awake while I play.

[ThEoRy]

u guys do know there is a section ID calculator right here on this very site?! linx below..

http://pso-world.com/secid_BB.php

[Zantra]

On 2007-11-08 18:52, ThEoRy wrote:
u guys do know there is a section ID calculator right here on this very site?! linx below..

http://pso-world.com/secid_BB.php



i'm aware, and I use it for Gamecube, and Xbox PSO, but back when I played dreamcast, I didn't have access to this site, and I had to use the trick.

[Dragwind]

The two can't be compared. Different games. Don't care about the troll arguments either, kthxbye.

[Zantra]

On 2007-11-08 19:04, Dragwind wrote:
The two can't be compared. Different games. Don't care about the troll arguments either, kthxbye.



I actually agree.

Even though they are made by the same company, and set in the same kind of Universe, they are not comparable. Like Samurai Warriors, and Dynasty Warriors.

[Blueblur]

I like PSO better. I think its much better when it comes to the design choices. The UI, art and gameplay design were very clear cut. As previously said, many of the stages are very different variants because they were more or less mazes which kept things interesting. And the story was easier to follow because it was simpler and clear (well, it got silly with the Episode 2 crap).

And of course, there's the nostalgia. I might have been happier if PSU was just a PSO remake with better graphics and more mazes.

[MT7218]

I would have to agree with what has been said about PSO being better than PSU.

Community: The Phantasy Star online community started to degrade into greed and stat-whoring near the end of US BB's life, and only got worse when PSU came out with it's item destributation system: Whatever happened to calling a rare you want when you are specfially hunting for it instead of being a greedy fuck and keep whatever you got when Order/Random gives it to you despite knowing that other members of your party needing it more than you?

Orignality of maps: The maps being too similar as well as the same format of said maps in other places: HOW many Raffon Meadow "variations" do we have agian? PSO had slightly diffrent variations for their maps like PSU does, yes, but that was for each "block" of an area, like Forest 2 was somewhat diffrent from Forest 1 as it was raining all the time and had you go in front of the Central Dome at the end. PSU uses those things as "second" quest for the area. Quests that have several blocks of the same thing.

Orignality of mobs: Come on, you can NOT tell me ST is slacking with this in comparison to PSO: There are far too many reskins and reuses of the same enemy or it's type and boss type here. I can understand Vahara/Vanda/Ghomon/Delsabans, but when there are reskins of flyers(The Parum and Moatoob ones... I forget their names), large humanoid enemies (Jarba, DBV, Kaga, Darbs), small humanoid enemies (Polty, Phonons(sp?), Jaggo), and so on. PSO had it's reskins and reuses, yes, but unlike PSU, they weren't nearly as blantant or heavy with them, or said reskins were so diffrent that you need to use diffrent strategies to beat them. GDV Monkies were reskins of wolves, but they were wolves on crack and hopped around like mad, being hard to hit, and loved to shoot elemental techs out of their mouths. Sinows from GDV and Seabed had invisability from sight as well as radar, and hit a hell of a lot harder than the Mines Sinows while being able, and some could acutally de-equip your weapon with their fists, too. Where as something like BDV and Kaga, similar tatics can be used on both: One just sometimes uses their spin at random as well as spin when knockback/up/aways are used on itand need to watch what element you use on it. Olghs spit barta while Go Vahara ran up to you and smack you around: Same offensive strategy of PA spam can still be used, just one requires a high % elemental armor to tank hits (Go Vaharas) while the other requires stunlock/dodging, or tanking hits with a high % elemental armor as well (Olgohmon).

And before anyone says "Go back to PSO then!", US BB has how much of a community nowadays? And as I know almost no Japaneese, JP BB is out of the picture, too. I don't want to or have the funds to subscribe to XBox Live for the endless Christmas Lobby version of PSO, and with all the other offical PSO servers dead, my only other option would be private, homemade servers, which I won't further discuss about.

And that's my opnion on the PSO in comparison to PSU topic.

[Jao]

im guessing if you couldnt lvl your character on pso offline and no TTF mission to lvl up easy i think it will be quite different=/

[Zantra]

On 2007-11-08 19:39, MT7218 wrote:
I would have to agree with what has been said about PSO being better than PSU.

Community: The Phantasy Star online community started to degrade into greed and stat-whoring near the end of US BB's life, and only got worse when PSU came out with it's item destributation system: Whatever happened to calling a rare you want when you are specfially hunting for it instead of being a greedy fuck and keep whatever you got when Order/Random gives it to you despite knowing that other members of your party needing it more than you?

Orignality of maps: The maps being too similar as well as the same format of said maps in other places: HOW many Raffon Meadow "variations" do we have agian? PSO had slightly diffrent variations for their maps like PSU does, yes, but that was for each "block" of an area, like Forest 2 was somewhat diffrent from Forest 1 as it was raining all the time and had you go in front of the Central Dome at the end. PSU uses those things as "second" quest for the area. Quests that have several blocks of the same thing.

Orignality of mobs: Come on, you can NOT tell me ST is slacking with this in comparison to PSO: There are far too many reskins and reuses of the same enemy or it's type and boss type here. I can understand Vahara/Vanda/Ghomon/Delsabans, but when there are reskins of flyers(The Parum and Moatoob ones... I forget their names), large humanoid enemies (Jarba, DBV, Kaga, Darbs), small humanoid enemies (Polty, Phonons(sp?), Jaggo), and so on. PSO had it's reskins and reuses, yes, but unlike PSU, they weren't nearly as blantant or heavy with them, or said reskins were so diffrent that you need to use diffrent strategies to beat them. GDV Monkies were reskins of wolves, but they were wolves on crack and hopped around like mad, being hard to hit, and loved to shoot elemental techs out of their mouths. Sinows from GDV and Seabed had invisability from sight as well as radar, and hit a hell of a lot harder than the Mines Sinows while being able, and some could acutally de-equip your weapon with their fists, too. Where as something like BDV and Kaga, similar tatics can be used on both: One just sometimes uses their spin at random as well as spin when knockback/up/aways are used on itand need to watch what element you use on it. Olghs spit barta while Go Vahara ran up to you and smack you around: Same offensive strategy of PA spam can still be used, just one requires a high % elemental armor to tank hits (Go Vaharas) while the other requires stunlock/dodging, or tanking hits with a high % elemental armor as well (Olgohmon).

And before anyone says "Go back to PSO then!", US BB has how much of a community nowadays? And as I know almost no Japaneese, JP BB is out of the picture, too. I don't want to or have the funds to subscribe to XBox Live for the endless Christmas Lobby version of PSO, and with all the other offical PSO servers dead, my only other option would be private, homemade servers, which I won't further discuss about.

And that's my opnion on the PSO in comparison to PSU topic.



Yeah, having to pay for an Xbox Live account, and for a hunter's license was PSO-X's downfall, plus not being able to play it offline, without a gamertag...

[DarthRuin]

Good a place as any to ask this, does BlueBurst support gamepads or Keyboard/mouse only?

[Weeaboolits]

On 2007-11-08 19:46, Jao wrote:
im guessing if you couldnt lvl your character on pso offline and no TTF mission to lvl up easy i think it will be quite different=/I had plenty of fun playing only online and not doing TTF (Today's Rate is significantly more fun). ;o

Edit: BB has gamepad support, as does Ver2.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Ronin_Cooper on 2007-11-08 20:00 ]</font>

[Jao]

well i played pso i was fun as he/ll but since i was a NOOB i didnt reall care what i got cuz it was free but they were hacked items thats what threw me off a lilttle

[DanMalak]

PSO is still better then PSU so many reasons have been explained already, and I dont feel like making a long post so...

Being able to use resta (or any other tech) with any meele/ranged weapon is a good enough reason for PSO>PSU.

well, that and not having to spam pa's and actually using normal attack, strong attack and special attack in different situations to survive because PSO isn't as easy as PSU
bah... I already did what I didn't want to do...bad me >.<

[Jao]

whaaaaa you are right pso is harder i dont know if it was just me but a party of lvl 200s we couldnt beat epi.2's first boss out of the VR missions=(
that damn lightning

[Jniebaum32]

Each has there good and bad points.

PSU Good: Melee has a techlike abilities, new race, any race can be any class, weapon variations earlier, rapid continuous ranged attacks, Individualization of character (Clothing), synthesis (crafting)

PSU Bad: Only two attack "types" for Melee (Normal, special), limit of number of Technics (spells) you can use at one time, Ranged weapons have an ammo limit, need to be able to go online to find some of the better items/armor in the game (and pay sega at the same time, the money hogs)

PSO Good: Multiple attack options for melee (Weak, Strong, Special), Ranged weapons with no ammo limits, Forces can use any tech they know at any time, Most items/armor available offline.

PSO Bad: Melee weapons limited, Ranged weapons fired max 3 shot burst, Melee has no techlike abilities, No synthesis (crafting), no true individualization of character (clothing).

(Note: I have purposely omitted anything on area/levels and Online community.)

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Jniebaum32 on 2007-11-08 20:59 ]</font>

[TranceZiggy]

I dunno.. I voted that they can't be compared.. I mean, I'm a PSO loyaist, yeah.. Played that game for 5 years, since DC v1. (LAWD VEGA). But, I won't go and say PSO was better, because in gaming aspects.. PSU is better, based on the mechanics, and how everything works in general.

But, at the same time, PSO always brought this sense of nostalgia, I guess most people cling to PSO simply cos it was all they knew til PSU. (Like me). I mean, the biggest aspect for me, was the music.. Not sure what did it, exactly. But the music from PSO always brought this sense of belonging, hell, i know the music from that so well, I can actually play the Pioneer 2 theme in my head, like RIGHT NOW, as if i'm wearing headphones & listening to an MP3.. lol

The music in PSU never did anything for me, I played it for a month on PS2, then switched to PC, and didn't bother with sound, because the music is just.. Just isn't PSO lol. Once AoI comes, i'll put sound back on again, and listen to the old PSO tracks..

But yeah, seriously, my conclusion is this, and no one can bash me for passing judgement, because I AM one of the people im about to mention.. But, I think the majority of us that ay PSO was the better game, are just people who got so attached to that game, and really don't want to see it change. We're people who spent our teenage years skipping class to chill all day with people on PSO (Yes.. I failed my last year of school thanks to PSO <.< AND A CERTAIN SOMEONE - but it's okay >.> good times http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif)

So really, don't assume you're playing a game that's 'worse' than PSO. COs, gaming-wise, this is really PSO, revamped. More battle content, better mechanics, ALOT more interaction, and a storyline that actually sucks you in. (PSO was lacking in story..) But yeah, entering the PSO/PSU community 'late' isn't a bad thing, not by far.. Just try to ignore us old geezers, we dont like our flowers being stepped on <.<

[Wallin]

On 2007-11-08 18:45, Hokokaru wrote:
I miss the section ID's... PINKAL, REDRIA, etc.


Eww, no. lol

I made characters with the dumbest names, adding spaces and - and all this other crap just so I could get the right section ID on my character. I'm definitely over that. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

[DarthRuin]

On 2007-11-08 20:37, Jniebaum32 wrote:

On 2007-11-08 19:57, DarthRuin wrote:
Good a place as any to ask this, does BlueBurst support gamepads or Keyboard/mouse only?



Yes you can use a game pad but as previously stated Sega has discontinued there official servers indefinitely.



I think BlueBurst is still live. Just not updating. I accidentally got a BB hunters license when I activated my brothers PSU account last month. Why would I be able to pay for it, but not play?

But thanks for answering my question.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: DarthRuin on 2007-11-08 21:00 ]</font>

[Jniebaum32]

sorry I edited my post just now. BB is still active but is in the process of being closed down, all other versions (ep1,2&3) are already closed. So only private server run them. All the one of them...

[Ffuzzy-Logik]

On 2007-11-08 21:02, Jniebaum32 wrote:
sorry I edited my post just now. BB is still active but is in the process of being closed down, all other versions (ep1,2&3) are already closed. So only private server run them. All the one of them...


BB isn't really being officially shut down. Of course, they conveniently forgot it existed in August of '06 and haven't updated it once since...

[Jniebaum32]

its only a matter of time.

[LanVanDam13]

the best part of PSU was HUNTING RARES this stuff is stupid on psu how u have to find the board then u can attempt to get the weapon it was fun to SEE A RED BOX and have to go ID it because it was SPECIAL WEAPON and all the weird lil weapons to find such as needle lavis cannon heavens thats y we fiend pso psu is coo dont get me wrong everything is better i just miss rare hunts nad having specific weapons for certain classes now everyone can be anything which is cool but then its not do u get what im saying

[nooblet]

the weapon lag in psu is very annoying. I hate it, nuff said about that. Also the comabt in psu is pa spamming, meleeing with your weapons is useless.

[Wallin]

On 2007-11-08 21:25, LanVanDam13 wrote:
the best part of PSU was HUNTING RARES this stuff is stupid on psu how u have to find the board then u can attempt to get the weapon it was fun to SEE A RED BOX and have to go ID it because it was SPECIAL WEAPON and all the weird lil weapons to find such as needle lavis cannon heavens thats y we fiend pso psu is coo dont get me wrong everything is better i just miss rare hunts nad having specific weapons for certain classes now everyone can be anything which is cool but then its not do u get what im saying



What, you don't think the excitement factor is the same?

PSO: OMG!!! A red box! It says Special Weapon! Quick, try it on! Oh rats, I can't because I'm not high enough yet, the requirements are uber so it must be awesome! Gotta telepipe and have the techer check it! !!!!!! I got <insert cool item name here> * squeal *

PSU: Oh... my... god... a rare actually dropped in this game! Someone take a screenshot! It's <insert cool item name here>!! I wonder who's going to get it... oh, it went to me, sweet! * log out to take another screenshot of +300 hours on character time before obtaining first 10* rare * Now to put it into the PM... ohhh, I hope I have enough materials! Yes! Now all I have to do is wait 24 hours for it to finish! * insert work, eating, sleeping * Come on PM, come on Goddess of luck... ... ... oh @#$@%#@$@#!!! (You can decide whether or not that's happiness or anger, LOL)

[Jao]

i would like to think anger but you could be @#$@%#@$@#!!! becasue it might of been a 50% 10*=p

[D1ABOLIK]

Where is the "PSO pwns PSU in every possible way" option?

[Maxson]

A lot of people mention how good PSO's community was, but I think it's important to remember that those memories are based off the final, best days of PSO (okay, it's not quite over yet, but you get what I mean).

I played PSOv1 for the DC and a little of PSOv2; I quit after that because the community was terrible. The fact that you dropped your weapon when you died destroyed random grouping for me- I hated the way I had to watch my friend's back every second, just in case he died and some random bastard decided he wanted a free +55 weapon. The inability to trade safely made trading ridiculous- it was like exchanging hostages, never knowing if the other guy was lying or not. And people lied all the time. I felt like I was locked in a prison with a bunch of psychos.

Some may blame this on bad game design, not on the community. But it's not hard to see why the PC/PS2 Japanese and US versions of PSU are separated- US PSOv1 players built a reputation of stealing from Japanese players back then. The game was popular, and popular games are full of people like that. To me, the eagerness to take blatant advantage of the bad game design told me more about PSOv1's community than I wanted to know.

The fact that things clearly improved by Blue Burst says, to me, that PSO was in its twilight years and wasn't drawing a new crowd anymore. If you jump into any greying MMORPG today, you'll find a small but tightly knit community- an ideal game to sit back and enjoy playing. That's because all that's left are the dedicated players- the jerks have run off to spoil the newest, shiniest games. PSU, in contrast, is still pulling in new players, despite its very rocky start- and AoI will bring in even more. That means the community will remain full of jerks, but it'll be a growing community- which means we have many more updates and changes to look forward to. (And at least you don't lose your weapon when you die!)

Every MMORPG's community endures rocky growth before hitting its peak. I think PSO had a long and fulfilling run, even if I ended up leaving before I got to see the benefits. So cut PSU a break- it'll have its glory days in due time.

[Myphys]

What made PSO better than PSU?
In a graphical sense, PSO was artistic. The art direction, especially in Episode III, was especially brilliant.
Many will disagree with me, but I loved the bright, contrasting colours...
Conpare a PSU screenshot with a PSO screen, and you'll notice PSO is rather colourful (which I love) and PSU has a more "realistic" colour scheme (which feels rather washed out).

All the little things they put into the game that makes you say "wow". Central Dome in the distance, rainbows, waterfalls, butterflies, the "death" garden, etc...

The nod to the classical Phantasy Star series made me smile seeing it in PSO...nearly every nod to the classic series in PSU made me smack my head and groan.

PSU's battle system is only slightly better.
Photon arts for melee classes was a great idea in PSU, though not implemented as well as what I imagined it would be.

[Finae]

Ruins, Seabed, Desert, Olga flow, Chaos bringers, Gran sorcerers, Dark falz (all forms), the annoying lil robots in ruins, delesabers, volt opt, the people named SSJTrunks20192 SSJGohanSS SSJGoku Cloud Sephiroth, Sinow zoa, that big monkey in that one episode 2 area or w/e it was, the music

Oh did I mention difficulty when played legit? Yeah that too. And the nubs.

[physic]

basically yall just want the same game, or you are too nostalgic. because the bull about pso community is bull. weapon thefts, crappy exploits nol, scammers spammers people reseting your inventory to 0 in randoms. people forget all the bad. Pso was entertaining, but it was far from perfct.

heres what pso had at start
forest caves mines ruins thats all
if you want to count thats
2 + 3 +2 +3 levels
you can beat the game in 5 hours literally
rares? well started out with...
hmm 24 that are actually unique ( the initial 3 after calibur tier looked the same with multicolor photon)
now psu had ummmm like 24 or more weapon types with each one having its own models and effects ffor 3 of them, and usually two looks for 1-6 star, thats like uhhh a lot of dif weaps.
soo yeah its not unreasonable to say that pso is not really better than psu, maybe dif, but better is far stretch

[SegaSpyder]

THERE IS NO C-MODE!!!!!!!!!! There fore PSU will always be in a solid second place to PSO, until the day that mabe they will once again return. Oh, also, Falz or Olga can wipe the floor with Fakis any day of the week.

[D1ABOLIK]

On 2007-11-08 23:36, physic wrote:
heres what pso had at start
forest caves mines ruins thats all
if you want to count thats
2 + 3 +2 +3 levels

Yeah but just those first 4 areas in the initial PSO are better than anything they have come up with on PSU.

[physic]

i will admit C mode was the greatest part of pso imo, but that didnt come till ver 2.

Those 4 zones being better than anything in psu? i dont see it. I do think it was planned well. but really i always hated 2/3rds of caves. forest 1 and 2 was basically the same, and short as hell.

[D1ABOLIK]

The ruins alone are better than any level in all of PSU.Thats of course just my opinion though.

[SegaSpyder]

Daim physic, sounds like you never got of the Cast train, the Dreamcast train that is. The big thing about PSO weps is that they some kind of life to them. They moved, changed shape, deployed, actually had a special ability. Meaning, the weapons on PSO had character, something that is desperately needed for this version. And go out and say something about the stupid glow from a wand when its casted, the glow/hase/smoke from a sword, or better yet cannon balls from a baret. That is nothing compared to what was. Even the remakes of the weapons that are comming back are only a sad reflection of the past because they to have had the life removed from them. And yes there was a bunch of modding and what not but, hey you could avoid it just like me and the other Dav 10 survivors from the X-Box.

[Jniebaum32]

Dav 10?

[SegaSpyder]

Davburite 10 the ship and block where we used to hang out.

[physic]

they just gave most the special abilities to the gunners, but even now many of teh s ranks have special abilities, gudda skella does sleep, the 1 hand claw does ice, they got hp steal bullets, and berserk grenades. and honestly most specials were near useless in pso initially all the weak ass technique weapons, does fire dmg! for 4 dmg.... A few specials mattered, berserk charge, in rare occaison devils, but for a hunter , just like in psu, its use was pretty limited. I was entertained by pso, loved it, it has some things that psu doesnt, but isnt that the nature of making a new game?

now if by life you mean something other than special attacks, i dunno sounds like a personal thing.

[Ibuka]

Hmm. PSO or PSU... I played PSO since Dreamcast all the way to PSOBB... And i also played PSU... I love PSO and had so many good times... But after i played PSU i don't see my self going back to PSO...

Legit wise PSO was not hard game to me... To me it was "If didn't kill you one hit, Then you was ok" That kind made classes with resta cheap. PSO was only hard with a party of Cast, But when Cast had the ability to use Ice or Confuse Traps, It made it seem a little easier then they were on Dreamcast.

Gamecube and PSOBB kinda nerfed HUmar resta and S/D Techs so it didn't seem cheap...
But made HUnewearl even better.
And RAmarl... If you found Spead Needles, Frozon Shooter, Red Mechguns/Charge Mechs and get to lv120 and offline don't even need to be that high to beat it.

PSU has its easy moments too. And the combat in PSU was good but yeah. The PA's made normal attacks seem point less. And Forces can't attack with there Canes or Staffs in PSU... But in all honestly, "I DID NOT" Waste my time attacking Monsters with a Force Weapon. I either pulled out some mechs with FOmarl/FOmar or used Plantain Huge Fan or Soul Eater/Soul Banish, or Bringer Rifle and Demon up a storm when needed.

I like lvling my Techs with a Force better on PSU then hopeing i find a lv30 tech disk or find God Tech to boost my tech lvls. I like how Evsp didn't seem useless in PSU like it was in PSO. And i like the fact in PSU that having alot of HP wasn't a bad thing. Anyone that had a high HP character know what im talking about! Recons will fuck you up! And any other things that didn't knock you down. Sad when i refuse to use HP mats cause of this >.<

But i do agree that PSO you had to do some thinking in the combat instead of PSU's "Give them all you got and don't hold back" >.<

But i still love PSU more. I have good friends and i love to help them when i can. Although during the 1Up event bring back memories of PSO, giving my friends Rares i didn't need or really wanted them to have.
If i could bring anything back from PSO into PSU, Would most likely more PSO Clothes instead of what AOI had to offer so more PSO Fans can bring there classic PSO characters back, And bring back PSO Ep4 stages.

[RappyRobot]

On 2007-11-08 17:59, Remedy wrote:
The community. People were actually willing to help you out and share rares in PSO. PSU's community is so god damned greedy and self-serving that it's depressing. Item calls were respected in PSO, instead of getting you laughed at in PSU.

In games like these, the community makes the game. PSU may be better from a technical standpoint, but god damn is it way worse from a community standpoint.




amen

[Jniebaum32]

Its the player run shops options. They always bring out the hoarders.

[Guildenstern]

On 2007-11-08 18:04, Zorafim wrote:
By the way, I'd like to add this to counter-act the PSU baseless fanboyism.


If only PSU could be an eighth of what PSO was.


This was on a FFXI forum, on neutral ground. There hasn't been a single post like that on any forum that I've seen besides the PSU forums. So don't start with the "PSU was better than PSO in every way, and everyone who thinks otherwise is blind to the truth" I keep on hearing.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Zorafim on 2007-11-08 18:13 ]</font>


Actually, on all the FFXI forums I read, whenever I bring up PSU the only thing I hear is how PSO was dorky and "sucked ass" compared to the "flexibility and style" of PSU. Quite a few of my LS members play PSU on the side for the fun and sheer 'pick up and play' value PSU offers over other MMOs.

So, the 'appeal to authority' logical fallacy cannot be applied here. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime2.gif;

Purely as a person who never played PSO and never had the slightest inclination to-- and yet loves PSU, I'd have to say that if I wanted to read constant threads about PSO, I'd go hang out in the section of this forum clearly marked 'PSO Discussion' and not in the one for 'PSU Discussion'. Quite frankly hearing about 'omg PSO' and 'THE CAVE LEVEL' and 'Lavis Cannon' and FOnewerasusmdfdkafads whatever the eff it's supposed to be got incredibly, incredibly old by the time I'd been playing PSU for two weeks, and to be honest it scares off the fledgling players who might want to try PSU but are too intimidated by the constant unfamiliar terminology and complaints. Can we give it a rest with the PSO stuff and talk about PSU?

Most sincerely~
A member of your newbie community, PSU player for a year.

[Zantra]

On 2007-11-09 03:34, Guildenstern wrote:

On 2007-11-08 18:04, Zorafim wrote:
By the way, I'd like to add this to counter-act the PSU baseless fanboyism.


If only PSU could be an eighth of what PSO was.


This was on a FFXI forum, on neutral ground. There hasn't been a single post like that on any forum that I've seen besides the PSU forums. So don't start with the "PSU was better than PSO in every way, and everyone who thinks otherwise is blind to the truth" I keep on hearing.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Zorafim on 2007-11-08 18:13 ]</font>


Actually, on all the FFXI forums I read, whenever I bring up PSU the only thing I hear is how PSO was dorky and "sucked ass" compared to the "flexibility and style" of PSU. Quite a few of my LS members play PSU on the side for the fun and sheer 'pick up and play' value PSU offers over other MMOs.

So, the 'appeal to authority' logical fallacy cannot be applied here. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime2.gif;

Purely as a person who never played PSO and never had the slightest inclination to-- and yet loves PSU, I'd have to say that if I wanted to read constant threads about PSO, I'd go hang out in the section of this forum clearly marked 'PSO Discussion' and not in the one for 'PSU Discussion'. Quite frankly hearing about 'omg PSO' and 'THE CAVE LEVEL' and 'Lavis Cannon' and FOnewerasusmdfdkafads whatever the eff it's supposed to be got incredibly, incredibly old by the time I'd been playing PSU for two weeks, and to be honest it scares off the fledgling players who might want to try PSU but are too intimidated by the constant unfamiliar terminology and complaints. Can we give it a rest with the PSO stuff and talk about PSU?

Most sincerely~
A member of your newbie community, PSU player for a year.



PSU wouldn't exist without PSO, so just be aware of that.

[Hucast-Kireek]

PSO is better than regular PSU in terms of fun factor...but compared to AOI? we will see.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Hucast-Kireek on 2007-11-09 04:17 ]</font>

[Krisan]

I honestly do think PSO had a better atmosphere.. Something about the music, artstyle, plot.. (Well okay, the plot was a bit lacking, but after Ep2 came out and all the quests.. it wasn't half bad.) Something about it all seemed a bit darker too when compared to PSU. PSU just seems so upbeat and bright..

All and all though, PSU is a much, much better game mechanically. The gameplay, interface, itemization.. everything is just better done. The game just lacks a really good atmosphere.. and uh, more quests would be nice. PSO had a fair number of quests you could do - both solo and with a group.. PSU's group quests really only shine during big events, like the 1up Cup going on right now. (Which are great, but they are too sparsly seen..)

Eh.. I wouldn't want PSO again.. I like PSU a lot more as a game. But they could do much more to make PSU's atmosphere more interesting.. and they do seem to be doing a good job of that in AoI. The music improvements, clothing, missions.. these all look to be headed in a better direction. Still not ideal (though, PSO's atmosphere was hardly ideal either) but getting there.

[Ezodagrom]

When comparing pso to psu, let's not forget psu been here for almost an year, and with this time only pso ver.2 from dreamcast was available (pso ver.2 was released 8 months after the original pso, the 1st one had lvl 100 cap, was only episode I and had no ultimate mode). I think the current psu should be compared to the 1st pso on dreamcast, or even pso ver.2.
I think when comparing to the 1st one, psu is better than pso. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif

[Hucast-Kireek]

you cant burn PSO, PSO was the reason PSU exists...and AOI proves that you need the past to make a good future.

[Sinue_v2]

PSU wouldn't exist without PSO, so just be aware of that.

Without PS, neither of which would exist.

At any rate:

PSO had better Atmosphere
PSO had better Art Design
PSO had catchier Music (IMO, but I'm also a fan of Midi music)
PSO, even v1, had more rare weapons and better rare weapons.
PSO had a better group-quest setup, which only Bruce, HSM, and special events touch on.
PSO allowed Casting with weapons, none of this switching bullshit.
PSO was a complete game from day one. No "unlocked content" junk that only gives the illusion of real updates, when really you're just getting half of what you payed for as Sega holds the rest for ransom at $9.99 a month.
PSO still had SOME semblence of Numen as they should be, at least, with HUnewearl.
PSO had Mono/Di/Trifluids and Telepipes.
PSO had a far better color selection system for hair.


PSU beats out PSO in pretty much every other aspect - which I won't list since that's not what this topic is about. I will say that PSU is going great in offering an offline single-player storymode which is a step (well, more of a stumble and faceplant into a concrete slab) in the right direction. Honestly, Sega could return the franchise to a completely offline-only affair and I'd be just as happy.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Sinue_v2 on 2007-11-12 09:44 ]</font>

[ShinMaruku]

PSO and PSU ah the diffrenceces.. I miss the TP bar... This PP thing is unadultrated bullshit for techs
The thing is PSO isn't ST's attepmt at an MMO in the MMO style and that too is good, but I think PSO had more balnce stuff in order than ST's attempt to limit people.

[Remedy]

On 2007-11-08 23:36, physic wrote:
basically yall just want the same game, or you are too nostalgic. because the bull about pso community is bull. weapon thefts, crappy exploits nol, scammers spammers people reseting your inventory to 0 in randoms. people forget all the bad. Pso was entertaining, but it was far from perfct.All of the nonsense you describe occurred on Dreamcast v1/2 and XBox only. GC was far better behaved, and Blue Burst was even better still, with people that would actually respect item calls and help each other for little or nothing in return.

As I've said before - if there were a game with PSU's mechanics and PSO:BB's community, I would be in heaven. It won't happen, though - too many immature, self-serving people in this game's community. C'est la vie, unfortunately.

[physic]

so then, your not talking about pso, your talking about pso BB, because that game came like 3 years later and was built on all teh screw ups they made in the past.

And yes GC started out ok, but quickly became a hack fest. which lead to extreme seperation between hackers and legits. Then there were the various glitches and fairly commmon charachter corruption. As far as the time release bullshit, i agree it sucks, but they did the same thing with BB only it was worse because uhhhh all that content was already out in 3 platforms, i remember VHard is locked! then ultimate is locked! then version 4 is is released!

Pso was cool, had some great moments, but really open your eyes, people are people, and most people are aholes. as far as calling rares in randoms, i wouldnt run with that unless i had no desire for the item. What is it about saying i called it that makes someone deserve an item more?

[realP]

First - Finding rares that are ready to use.

I really miss that. I am not a fan of the synthesis. In all honesty, I would love it taken out. I am sick of finding tons of synth material and having rare synthesis fail. IMO I feel it is the worst part of the game.

Second - Being able to actually grind your own weapon while in a level.

Wow! What a concept. IMO, again, the grinding in PSU blows.

[Esufer]

It alarmed me in PSO that when surrounded by hordes of ravenous man-gophers, man-sharks, man-bots or man-things, your character would always casually walk before he broke into that brisk, agonisingly slow jog.

I did like the class system better though.


EDIT: changed 'you' to 'your.'



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Esufer on 2007-11-12 10:51 ]</font>

[Dragwind]

On 2007-11-09 04:51, Ezodagrom wrote:
When comparing pso to psu, let's not forget psu been here for almost an year, and with this time only pso ver.2 from dreamcast was available (pso ver.2 was released 8 months after the original pso, the 1st one had lvl 100 cap, was only episode I and had no ultimate mode). I think the current psu should be compared to the 1st pso on dreamcast, or even pso ver.2.
I think when comparing to the 1st one, psu is better than pso. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif




QFT. Just look at what PSO V.1 had back during release compared to PSU during release.

Yes, PSU is still evolving. Don't be so rash on judgment just yet.

[Remedy]

On 2007-11-12 10:18, physic wrote:
What is it about saying i called it that makes someone deserve an item more?Let's see...

*The fact that it'll be used on a main character
*The fact that if you're calling it, you've probably been hunting it for a very good long while
*The fact that rare hunter's etiquette would state that you don't interfere in someone else's hunt unless you've hunted for longer
*Respect for fellow human beings, even if they are "randoms"
*Seeing a item be used by someone that will enjoy it, instead of selling it for your own profit

I dunno, plenty of reasons. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif

[Sinue_v2]

With that said, PSO was capable of holding onto a decent playerbase all throughout the turmoil of the v.1-Ep I & II days. PSU's cheats and griefers are peanuts compared to what PSO went through, and yet - a few sporadic PM resets and some meseta flooding nearly killed the entirety of PSU's PS2/PC userbase in just a few short months.


you character would always casually walk before he broke into that brisk, agonisingly slow jog

I understand full well what you're talking about, but that jog could also be seen as a boon at times. There was often times when I melee'd that I'd be using a weapon with a poor third combo which allowed the enemy to counter-attack. Instead, I'd use two attacks, and then pull back on the joystick in a quick 360 digree motion. Because you were walking, you'd turn around JUST far enough to evade their counter-strike.. and then be right there in prime position for your next offensive. Although you can do it with PSU's system, it was much faster and more efficent in PSO since you barely moved due to the slow pace.

One plus in a sea of negetives, but I felt it should be mentioned.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Sinue_v2 on 2007-11-12 11:01 ]</font>

[chibiLegolas]

On 2007-11-08 17:57, Zorafim wrote:
inb4flamewar

Erm, I liked the levels, actually. Each PSO level was a maze instead of a path. You had to figure out your way to the boss, often getting lost if you didn't keep the map close. Even if you did the same level multiple times, either the variance of the level would cause you to be continuously lost, or the the sheer amount of mazeness would do it.
PSU's levels are much more linear, causing people to master the levels much quicker. It makes for boring gameplay in between battles.


I'd have to agree here. I hate linear levels in general. And am quite suprised that they made most of PSU maps like this. Actually, I'd thought after hours of PSO gameplay to reach lvl 150+, Sega would improve it's sequel with RANDOM maps. Since we'd have to grind those levels over 'n over again, it seemed to make sense to me.

I also thought PSO is slightly better than PSU since it was more customizable with the rare stat raise materials you can find. I want PSU to have the same. Why should a female newman FT have the same exact stats as the next female newman FT of the same level? Unique PA and equipment aren't enough to make me feel unique IMO.

And don't forget mags. Yea, they're cheesy on low lvled characters. But they're also visually stunning add-ons/accessories that made the game unique. Other online games have accessories for your characters, but they surely don't have the vast amount of funky combinations that we had in PSO.

[Dragwind]

I'd have to agree on the linear level design thing. I did enjoy wandering into random rooms in pso then realizing I had to chose a different route. However, that effect got dulled out once you knew all the variations =

[Palle]

Since I have a moment, I'll waste it on this old, tired topic. Different platforms, different eras: or if you prefer more recognizable cliches, apples and oranges.

Also, a bit of tweaking >

On 2007-11-12 09:30, Sinue_v2 wrote:
PSO had better Atmosphere
PSU had better Art Design
PSU had catchier Music (IMO, but I'm also a fan of Midi music)
PSO, even v1, had more rare weapons and better rare weapons.
PSO had a better group-quest setup, which only Bruce, HSM, and special events touch on. (Wait until PSU has been out for 5 years, then judge.)
PSO allowed Casting with weapons, none of this switching bullshit. (Easier = better?)
PSO was a complete game from day one. No "unlocked content" junk that only gives the illusion of real updates, when really you're just getting half of what you payed for as Sega holds the rest for ransom at $9.99 a month.
PSO still had SOME semblence of Numen as they should be, at least, with HUnewearl.
PSO had Mono/Di/Trifluids and Telepipes. (Different system, see: Photon Charge)
PSO had a far better color selection system for hair.
In a sea of opinions, each is as valid as the next.

[RadiantLegend]

I'll say it in two words

"Red Box"

The mystery of the box that can be anything..... your weapon or the photon drop.

In psu the weapon board / weapon itself doesnt carry the feeling as the red box.

[Desecration]

IMO, I think it was the rares that made pso better, I remember killing 1 monster many times over and over untill i finally got that bright red box (I miss those http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif ), I would say the story too but I believe PSU's story is getting very good, but the 1 thing I think we still lack is the uniqueness of rare weapons (which I believe AOI will fix), but if you look at most of PSU's weapons they all look very similar, but I do believe when AOI comes out this problem will be fixed for me except for the dull red box I still wish they would make the rare box the same color like they did in PSO, Oh well.

[Otis_Kat]

The only thing I liked more about PSO was the atmosphere. PSU is just way to happy-go-lucky.

[Ashkahn]

I miss all my shiny rares from PSO... Oh, Tsumikiri J-Sword, how I miss thee...

And my MAG. Man, I miss my little Kabanda, helping me kick ass and take names.

The boss battles were way more intense, as well. The only boss fight that rivals the PSO bosses is Dulk Fakis, which is too little, too late.

I'll give PSU the nod for a better combat system, further customization, etc. Synthesis makes me want to rip off my PM's arms and throw them out of an airlock, though. If I get a ultra rare weapon, I shouldn't hope and pray that it comes out okay. I should just GET TO USE MY DAMN WEAPON!

PSO managed to have enemies that weren't entirely brain-dead... just halfway there. With PSU, all I need to do is fire a grenade every so often, then fill my enemies full of little holes with my Phantom.

In the end, they're on roughly equal footing. Nostalgia is a bit of a factor for me with PSO, as I've been playing since the DC Ver. 1 era, but PSU holds up fairly well as far as gameplay mechanics go.

...If only I could jettison the bad community out an airlock with my PM, though.

Oh, and completely off topic: PSO Ep. III was, and still is, awesome.

[physic]

"PSO even ver 1 had more rare weapons"

uhh i dont see that, psu has 7-12 star as rare weapons, if you mean unique looking weapons, then psu has 4rare) per weapon, and it has.. 23 weapons?
that comes out to uhh 92 weapons? even if you discount the a ranks completely (even though they are marked rare) thats still 69 weapons. this isnt even counting various joke weapons or enemy part weapons, and the special kubara weapons (like sarafi)

check the files, i think pso ver 1 has like 26 rare weapons, unless your counting the weapons with the same exact frame and multicolored photon as rare, even though they were common as piss and not unique in design until pso GC.

"pso had better group quest setup"

once again your looking at the end product evolved over 4 incarnations, the group quests in pso started out involving no more groupness than crimson beast ie standing on a switch for 2 seconds, and that only applied to half the levels.
not much more teamwork was needed on any quest besides one caves one i think, lost ice spinner, and im not even sure that came out before v2



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: physic on 2007-11-12 12:11 ]</font>

[Carlo210]

The stupid thing about PSU is that there aren't any rares. All of the 'rares' are simply weapons with a higher star rating that become weapons that EVERYBODY has when ST adds that weapon or board to the vendors.
Which is why I've never spent millions for any weapon. It will be dirt cheap when ST bothers to update the game and give us 'new' content (content we already payed for via buying the game).

[BanF]

MNSHO:

PSO is good, PSU is better.

[RemiusTA]

On 2007-11-12 12:15, Carlo210 wrote:
The stupid thing about PSU is that there aren't any rares. All of the 'rares' are simply weapons with a higher star rating that become weapons that EVERYBODY has when ST adds that weapon or board to the vendors.
Which is why I've never spent millions for any weapon. It will be dirt cheap when ST bothers to update the game and give us 'new' content (content we already payed for via buying the game).



AoI. Case closed.



And PSO rares were Overrated, at least now that PSU is here. Most of the rares you got were useless, You could easily trade something like a Photon Drop for most lower rare weapons....After you got a new rare weapon, your attack would maybe increase by a MAXIMUM of 50 points of damage, if that.


IMO, PSU weapons are 10x cooler than PSO weapons, and if PSOBB allowed all the "normal" psu weapons to be implemented into PSO, they would be the damn coolest weapons on the game.

The only thing PSO rares have on PSU rares are the fact that most of them have no photon on them. Although it really doesnt matter. Most of the cool looking weapons were overshadowed by the lesser cool ones.

More rares dropped in PSO, but i KNOW all of you PSO vets, ESPICALY the offline ones, have at LEAST 5 carbon copies of EVERY RARE WEAPON YOU HAVE, Save for the strongest one in your arsenal since it took forever to drop.

[Jaspaller]

Everyone's given their answer already. Let the topic die already, sheesh.

[Ken_Silver]

heh, I was suprised to see it get this far. I am happy that people took the time to answer my first thread. But after reading all of the post, I believe that I should be able to put in my final input.

For one, I am IMPARTIAL to the argument. I titled the argument the way I did, for the reason that I thought that most people felt that PSO > PSU. But according to the end result of the poll. PSU came out ontop. Of course you can't go by the poll exactly, but I put it there for a reason. In the end, I believe that the two cannot be compared. My reason why is that PSU is just getting started. We have to be patient. AOI should make things much better. With connections to PSO and new attacking system and everything else done over, I think that PSU will do much better than it would have if the continuation was more like PSU verson 1. Of course people tend to cling to the past and in some degrees, the past is better, but no one can truly live in the past. So we must continue forward with a heavy heart and hope and faith in the future. And as for the community issue, let us note that WE are the community of PSU. Most of us (not I) were the community of PSO. Hopefully, people don't change that much over time and hopefully the incomming generation won't be total jerks.

So in the end, we all should just agree to disagree. I didn't mean to bug those who have heard this agrument over and over and over, but you can't say you know about something until you actually have experience in it... and stuff... you know what I am trying to say.

In the end, thanks for taking my survey and giving me your time and input.

[ilovetypemoon]

I only played PSO offline so I don't know if this applies to online mode, but I remember falling asleep during a session often. I don't know what did it, but that game was like a sleeping drug to me. It wasn't once I ended up slapping myself silly to finish a dungeon.

[Sinue_v2]

(Wait until PSU has been out for 5 years, then judge.)

Perhaps you don't expect your games your improve over time, but most people do. Sonic Team should have learned from 5 years of PSO development, rather than following in the same mistakes, or worse, compounding them.

You're seriously advocating waiting for 5 years until the game can become good before criticizing it? Sounds to me like a ST apologist of the worst order.


(Easier = better?)

You're not going to find much support on this point, especially among the PS2 players. Weapon switching to cycle techs is clunky as hell, and thanks to weapon lag it makes it almost useless in the areas it's needed most.

Thank god you're not a game designer if you think an obtuse and broken pallet system is a good way to increase the difficulty.


(Different system, see: Photon Charge)

Oh, I'm sorry. I thought for a minute we were talking about Phantasy Star here. My bad.

[XavierDreamknight]

Here's what I don't get. Why is it that PSO has better net code than PSU? I find it strange how in PSO when you're in a party, they are all synced fine, but in PSU it goes straight to hell in which net code turns to confetti. I totally hate how I'm attacking x mob, yet my ally appears to be attacking nothing two feet away but is damaging the same guy I'm attacking. That alone drives me nuts when playing PSU. I don't play PSU now but I might come back after Ambition comes out. Hopefully when it does, Sega will fix the net code so it doesn't look like it was tossed in a blender.

[Sinue_v2]

It was worse on PSO. The thing is, PSO played entirely client side - so it appeared in synch, but what you saw and what others saw were quite different. PSU plays partially server-side, so the lag is more apparent. That's why you're "required" to have a broadband connection to play PSU, whereas PSO was fine with 56k.

Battle Mode and Lobby Soccer in PSO were prime examples of showcasing PSO lag.

So no, the Netcode is actually far better in PSU - but because of difference in how the game is played online, it just doesn't appear so. And yes, they needed to do that, because having the game played entirely client side like PSO would usher in a LOT of oppertunity for cheats.

[Ffuzzy-Logik]

On 2007-11-12 18:06, Sinue_v2 wrote:

(Different system, see: Photon Charge)

Oh, I'm sorry. I thought for a minute we were talking about Phantasy Star here. My bad.
Holy fucking Christ. Things change, deal with it. Were you all upset at Super Mario Sunshine because they had Shines instead of Stars?

[Palle]

Ease off the 'roids, hombre, let's have a look at this in a manner befitting non-14-year-olds... >_>


On 2007-11-12 18:06, Sinue_v2 wrote:

(Wait until PSU has been out for 5 years, then judge.)

Perhaps you don't expect your games your improve over time, but most people do. Sonic Team should have learned from 5 years of PSO development, rather than following in the same mistakes, or worse, compounding them.

You're seriously advocating waiting for 5 years until the game can become good before criticizing it? Sounds to me like a ST apologist of the worst order.

I'm advocating giving both platforms a controlled and equal amount of time to generate content. I find that the game is good now, I've enjoyed it for the breadth of the past year, and I don't have to wait to think so. How much content was added to PSO after launch? How regular were the intervals in which it was added? I'm certainly not going to say PSU is any worse because ST does the same thing it did with PSO.


On 2007-11-12 18:06, Sinue_v2 wrote:

(Easier = better?)

You're not going to find much support on this point, especially among the PS2 players. Weapon switching to cycle techs is clunky as hell, and thanks to weapon lag it makes it almost useless in the areas it's needed most.

Thank god you're not a game designer if you think an obtuse and broken pallet system is a good way to increase the difficulty.

A] Luckily for me, garnering support for my opinion is not a priority. Is it the best system? Nope, not as far as I'm concerned. However, given the limitations of both the DC and current-gen controllers, I definitely find it to be an improvement.
B] I'm not a designer, it's true, but I am a production staff member for a publisher who makes a lot more money than Sega. We must have suckered all of those consumers into thinking that learning a new and deeper system was fun. Shame on us.
C] Here's a PSU controller to fit your needs:

http://img.engadget.com/common/images/9264041161650351.JPG?0.5468580639172729


On 2007-11-12 18:06, Sinue_v2 wrote:

(Different system, see: Photon Charge)

Oh, I'm sorry. I thought for a minute we were talking about Phantasy Star here. My bad.

Yeah, God forbid ST makes their game how they see fit without your say-so...

While the entire PS series is indeed stellar, don't you ever get tired of living in 1987?

[Pengfishh]

On 2007-11-08 18:11, Zantra wrote:

PA's are a poor replacement for the strong attacks and special attacks that weapons used to have.



This is kinda fucked up. Flashy attacks with multiple strikes and effects are somehow trumped by three hit combo that's slower and stronger?

[Sinue_v2]

I'm advocating giving both platforms a controlled and equal amount of time to generate content.

Again, I contend that Sega should learn from the mistakes of PSO. For as long as PSU was in development, they should have been able to add much more to the game to keep players interested. Instead, they gave us basically scraps - and scraps you had to unlock over the course of a year just to get a complete game. This doesn't seem to be a problem for most decent online RPG developers, but then, I suppose that is the crux of the matter. Sonic Team is not a decent online RPG developer.


How much content was added to PSO after launch?

About the same amount of content that added to PSU after it's launch. Nothing really "New" has been added. It can't be added. Everything is already on the disk. The difference is, Sonic Team didn't lock away 3/4's of PSO for most of it's lifespan. They let players enjoy the game at their own pace, and released expansions later.


I'm certainly not going to say PSU is any worse because ST does the same thing it did with PSO.

But I will, because seven years have passed since PSO v.1 launched, and people expect more out of their games these days. PSU was an incremental improvement over PSO v.1 content wise, but it wasn't nearly enough to stay viable in the market.


Luckily for me, garnering support for my opinion is not a priority

I would argue the contrary, because poor sales and throngs of canceled accounts already back up my position.


I definitely find it to be an improvement.

You find sitting there helplessly waiting for techniques to load off the disk (after being arbitrarily unloaded), fumbling around with unresponsive controls when the framerate begins to drop, or circumventing this by placing Resta on EVERY wand/rod (negating elemental bonsues in most cases) - or worse, being pidgeonholed into a Resta/Reverser ONLY machine in difficult areas because your team-mates take damage too fast an improvement? Perhaps if the game was developed solely for the PC, or optimised for consoles, this wouldn't be an issue and the pallet system would work as intended.

As it is now, however, it doesn't. For most players, it's an unnecceary encumberance.

Not to mention the complete retardation of the Photon Charge in regards refilling 1-hand weapons. Rather than having a charge fill a certain amount of PP which "spills over" to the other weapons when one's PP is full. As it is now, even with a full PP gauge on an off-hand weapon, you only get a half-charge on the weapon you're using at the time. This is stupid. This means that you either go without a left-hand weapon or you have to stop everything, open the menu, navigate to your inventory, select the weapon and recharge it individually. How can you NOT say that's overtly cumbersome in combat situations? Unless you just want to effectively cut your Photon Charge carrying capacity down to 5 by using a bunch of half-charges.


We must have suckered all of those consumers into thinking that learning a new and deeper system was fun.

If your system works well, then more power to you. PSU's does not.


Yeah, God forbid ST makes their game how they see fit without your say-so...

They can make their game however they see fit. I will speak out against what I don't like. You really think if Betheseda turned Elder Scrolls into a online RPG which made massive sweeping changes to the established mythos, that it's already established fanbase won't raise a few harsh words? Hell, even Oblivion got thrashed by it's established fans and you often see topics much like this (Morrowind vs Daggerfall vs Oblivion, etc) - and all in all, at least it was a GOOD game.


don't you ever get tired of living in 1987


Not if what PSU is offering is the best that Sonic Team these days can come up with, no. I'd love to see the series back in the hands of talented developers who are actually capable of taking the franchise and making it live up to it's full potential. But until that day comes, I'll continue to voice my complaints about both Sonic Team and whatever it is they're trying to pass off as Phantasy Star.

It wouldn't even really be as much of an issue if PSU was just a better GAME in general. One that doesn't necessarily have to mimic it's predecessors - but can stand equally on the same ground as them. This was at least something that PSO did right for it's time.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Sinue_v2 on 2007-11-12 22:56 ]</font>

[Saphion]

I'm of the viewpoint that PSO is infinitely better than PSU, and even I'm sick to death of the constant PSO vs. PSU threads.

Although everything Sinue_v2 says is absolutely correct.

[Zantra]

On 2007-11-13 00:18, Saphion wrote:
I'm of the viewpoint that PSO is infinitely better than PSU, and even I'm sick to death of the constant PSO vs. PSU threads.

Although everything Sinue_v2 says is absolutely correct.



AGREE'd

[Sekani]

On 2007-11-12 21:50, Owsla_Scarlet wrote:

While the entire PS series is indeed stellar, don't you ever get tired of living in 1987?


I was just gonna say something like this and be done with the thread, but looks like this person beat me to it.

[Palle]

On 2007-11-12 22:48, Sinue_v2 wrote:

Luckily for me, garnering support for my opinion is not a priority.

I would argue the contrary, because poor sales and throngs of canceled accounts already back up my position.

What I should have said was, "I don't care if anyone agrees with me, I've already expressed my take on it."

As far as supporting your own argument, which may or may not be necessary (depending on whether of not your argument was that I needed to make garnering support for my opinion a priority), I'm not sure I would be comparing "throngs" of canceled accounts to the, by my best guess, 200000+ active subscribers worldwide who have enjoyed and continue to enjoy some aspect(s) of the game.

If you think the NA market's relative weakness is due to lack of Monofluids, well, I can't say that I concur. The demographic in the US are children, they don't remember PSII, and they quit PSU after a couple weeks for something with more trash-talk and breasts. If you want to blame ST here, go ahead and call them on publishing the NA version at all.


On 2007-11-12 22:48, Sinue_v2 wrote:

I definitely find it to be an improvement.

You find sitting there helplessly waiting for techniques to load off the disk (after being arbitrarily unloaded), fumbling around with unresponsive controls when the framerate begins to drop, or circumventing this by placing Resta on EVERY wand/rod (negating elemental bonsues in most cases) - or worse, being pidgeonholed into a Resta/Reverser ONLY machine in difficult areas because your team-mates take damage too fast an improvement? Perhaps if the game was developed solely for the PC, or optimised for consoles, this wouldn't be an issue and the pallet system would work as intended.

As it is now, however, it doesn't. For most players, it's an unnecceary encumberance.

I definitely haven't experienced any of this, and though I don't know the reasons why, I can guess it's because I did not go into the play of this game hoping and thinking that I would be playing PSO Episode 5, and instead I bothered to learn the interface, just like with any other game.

If you don't want to L2P, there's always FFXI.


On 2007-11-12 22:48, Sinue_v2 wrote:
Not if what PSU is offering is the best that Sonic Team these days can come up with, no. I'd love to see the series back in the hands of talented developers who are actually capable of taking the franchise and making it live up to it's full potential. But until that day comes, I'll continue to voice my complaints about both Sonic Team and whatever it is they're trying to pass off as Phantasy Star.

My best suggestion here is start working on making the board of directors. Personally, if I were in your position, rather than disparaging whatever final product SoJ was willing to shell out for (and subsequently, what SoA was forced to accept on a reduced budget), I'd get back to working on my own, apparently superior PS projects so that we might partake of my handicraft.

Best of luck on that, BTW.

[Carlo210]

Owsla, Sinue is referring to the PS2 version of the game.

To which I say... lolps2.

Sinue provides valid points, though, and Owsla isn't really counter-arguing, just telling Sinue not to make such a big deal about it.

PSU does suck, and we all know that, but we play (mostly off and on) because its fun sometimes with a tiny sense of achievement... sometimes.
Otherwise, every other aspect of this game is built to suit the 'low content, high grind' nature of this game. Meaning, it's shallow (and, frankly, executed better in other games of it's type - PSO, Diablo2, etc).

Why do I play for one month off and on, with 6 month of non-PSU-ness in between? Cause PSU stinks. It already feels like one of those old games you brush off and play for a while 'just cause'.

Until next time -



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Carlo210 on 2007-11-13 01:23 ]</font>

[Jniebaum32]

I actually agree with the "Unlocking of content" hate. I noticed alot of gaming companies are into that. Sega seems to be the worst contributor to the trend, followed by Capcom and Nintendo. I'm sure Sony and a few other have there hands in that annoying little barrel of BS too. Again I think I said in a post earlier I like the clothing system idea. Lets you look how you want. What I DON'T like is the fact most of the items, clothing and otherwise, requires me to pay an extra $10 bucks just to go online once to get it. I pay my money for complete access to my game, not this piddly get 25% and pay more to get the other 75%.

Note: Statistics are not correct most likely altho the unlocking of items stuff just might be, and I rounded the cost up to 10 just so its an even number.

[Psycho_Sonic]

While I agree with almost everything Sinue V2's said, should i even bring up the horrific screen-writers in PSU? *cries*

Actually, i'm surprised no one's complained about this yet... being possibly the worst thing about PSU. While PSO had a lot less actual dialogue and events, the characters (in the quests) weren't absolutely retarded and the script didn't make my eyes bleed. Whenever i play PSU offline (or almost all of ep2), i wonder if i'm in hell.

[Callous]

Almost everything that needs to be said has been said by Sinue V2. Excellent wording.

I sure as hell hope ST has fixed the PS2 pallette lag (and lag in general) for AoI. Anyone played the JP PS2 version?

To answer the original question:

Music
Atmosphere
Level design
Gameplay
System
Technical issues
BOSSES

PSU does a few things better. Namely character customization and camera control.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Callous on 2007-11-13 06:39 ]</font>

[Carlo210]

Lol Psycho_Sonic, nothing can save PSU in terms of writing, so I don't even bother complaining about it. It's a preteen feel-good rainbow-and-sunflower-kisses p.o.s. excuse for a storyline that I could (seriously) pull out of my ass within an hour.

[MrPOW]

I've been playing PSU since March on Xbox 360. Before that I played PSO on DC up until the GC release. I played on GC pretty much up until Blue Burst came out. I only recently went back to play PSO on my Wii to see what it was like after playing PSU for almost a year. Yeah...except for a little nostalgia and better music all it did was make me want to play PSU instead. No strafing, first-person aiming, the same weapon combo over and over...and worst of all no free camera. I think it's awesome some old PSO areas will be in AoI because I'll get to revisit old places and enemies with the new and improved game system. I have a hard time seeing how anyone could prefer PSO to PSU...but hey, to each their own.

[Jniebaum32]

If ST is smart they won't stick to this stupid arse "Unlockable Content" garbage and actually gives us a FULL game.

[Zantra]

On 2007-11-13 12:21, Jniebaum32 wrote:
If ST is smart they won't stick to this stupid arse "Unlockable Content" garbage and actually gives us a FULL game.



They won't... they're going to slowly give us all of the content, over several months, in order to get us to keep playing. If they gave us everything, we would have nothing to look forward to, and we would get bored, and move on to a much better game.

[Yusaku_Kudou]

PSO music >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Backstreet Boys > PSU music

[Carlo210]

Their idea of 'keeping us playing' resulted in 50%-80% of the people who started palying this game to quit.
I'm shocked that they think this method... 'works'.

Though the fact that this game has mission rewards calls for this. Why? Because, if every mission was open to us from the start, we would've been doing seabed since the game came out. Sega doesn't want to balance out all the S and S2 missions in terms of rewards and so forth. If they DID balance it, then playing in seabed would be no different than playing in mizuraki or the mines in moatoob.
But, since they like being a sheep-herder and guide us to where we must go next every 2-ish months, this is how it is.

Just like any other mmo, the one who solos is the one who's free to explore. Thing is, Sega doesn't make any of the areas in this game worthwhile. Most of the areas we have now were areas that were fine when we were level 60 (max level). Why on earth would we play those when we have the new 'level 100' missions to play?
Which is why people quit. Doing the same crap (literally) for 2-3 months until we are allowed to play a new mission mission is boring. Of course, if that mission isn't worthwhile, then nobody will play it and go back to seabed.

PSO was cool because it allowed us to play all the areas because they were all worthwhile. Yes, it was forest, caves, etc etc, but you'd always play through them instead of do one of those levels over and over and over for 3 months.

[Jaspaller]

On 2007-11-13 12:56, Yusaku_Kudou wrote:
PSO music >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Backstreet Boys > PSU music



I approve of this post!

[Saito S]

On 2007-11-13 01:20, Carlo210 wrote:
Owsla, Sinue is referring to the PS2 version of the game.
To which I say... lolps2.

Sinue provides valid points, though, and Owsla isn't really counter-arguing, just telling Sinue not to make such a big deal about it.

PSU does suck, and we all know that, but we play (mostly off and on) because its fun sometimes with a tiny sense of achievement... sometimes.
Otherwise, every other aspect of this game is built to suit the 'low content, high grind' nature of this game. Meaning, it's shallow (and, frankly, executed better in other games of it's type - PSO, Diablo2, etc).

Why do I play for one month off and on, with 6 month of non-PSU-ness in between? Cause PSU stinks. It already feels like one of those old games you brush off and play for a while 'just cause'.

Until next time -
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Carlo210 on 2007-11-13 01:23 ]</font>

I bolded the most offensive part, but this applies to the whole post. THIS is the attitude that gets on my (and I'm sure other people's) nerves. If you don't like PSU, fine. If you think it sucks, fine. If you think nearly every aspect of this game is built to suit the "low content, high grind” nature of it, fine.
Everything in your post is YOUR opinion, and you're entitled to it. But the bolded part...what is this "PSU sucks and we all know it" crap. Don't act like PSU's quality is somehow an established fact, because it's not. It's completely a matter of opinion. I, personally, am finding it to be better than PSO overall, though I LOVED PSO and it is still better in certain ways. But that also is only MY opinion. Stop trying to pass yours off as fact.

Somewhat more on-topic… I played PSO to death and loved it, but at this point, I have to give the nod to PSU. To me, it feels like Sonic Team DID learn from PSO, and tried to set the sequel apart in certain ways while still retaining the core idea. Yes, some of their decisions were bad (not enough content for most mainstream players at launch, for example), but overall I found PSU to still be a good game. Now, with all these updates we’ve gotten, I would call it an awesome game. Going point by point here:

-Atmosphere: I will give the nod to PSO here, but only just barely. I think PSU does have a nicely done, well-realized atmosphere, but PSO’s was a bit better, with it’s moodier music and elements of mystery.
-Artistic/visual design: Tie. PSO was groundbreaking, but PSU to me, just carries on the tradition. I know a lot of people think PSO’s was WORLDS better, but I don’t get it. They actually look pretty similar to me, overall, in terms of artistic style. One thing that tips this in favor of PSU, actually, are the visual designs of characters (and I specifically mean OUR characters, for online/extra mode, not the NPC’s). In this area, PSU is a noticable improvement over PSO.
-Music: Tie again. I loved PSO’s music, and I love PSU’s music. That’s pretty much the long and short of it. PSO had a moodier, more ambient and atmospheric soundtrack, but few tracks that really pulled you into the melody when listening outside the game. PSU has a more direct, attention grabbing soundtrack, but fewer tracks that really blend in to the levels and become part of the atmosphere, like PSO had. They balance eachother.
Hey Sinue! This is not meant to be a criticism, I'm honestly just curious: what does you liking Midi music have to do with PSO vs PSU music?
-Combat: PSU by a bit here. It WOULD be by a landslide if it weren't for a couple annoying little flaws in PSU's combat. Yes, timed button presses were cool. Yes, I miss them. Also the sometimes bizarre hit detection for enemy attacks in PSU. But melee Skills, the VAST (and complete, with pretty much no counter-balancing drawbacks, at least to me) improvement of Gun combat, and general higher energy, faster feeling from combat in PSU, just win. I am VERY happy to see the return of timed attacks meaning something in AoI, as well as fixes to some of the other nits in PSU's combat, but even disregarding that, and only looking at PSU’s regular combat system compared to PSO's…I have to give it the edge.
-Character customization: Again, PSU, and by a fair margin this time. I hear a lot of people mentioning the materials from PSO, and how they made it possible to distinguish one level 58 HUcast from another level 58 HUcast. To me, mats just changed…numbers. That never did much for me. I find the fact that one level 58, FF 8 male CAST and another level 58, FF 8 male CAST could have completely different parts, color schemes, weapon preferences, and PA’s to be MUCH more significant than “I rasied my ATP more and you raised your DFP more.” On the flipside, 2 characters of the same class are GOING to look very similar in PSO. There's no way around it. You can have a different "costume" (palette swap) or a different head, etc. But you are going to look way more similar than 2 chars of the same race/class in PSU have to be if they don't want to be. And again - just my personal take on it, but PA and weapon choices (PA's having no equivalent in PSO and weapons being much more varied in PSU) make me feel like my character is set apart from others WAY more than those stat raising materials ever did.
Of course, let's also not forget the fact that ANY character of ANY race and gender can be ANY class, and switch among them how they please. The class system in PSU is a HUGE step up from PSO to me.
-Rares: I must admit, PSU's approach to rare drops is...weird. PSO has this one. Thankfully, AoI looks to fix this. HOWEVER...comparing PSU right now (or even several months ago) to PSO version One as far as number, variety, coolness, etc. of rares...PSO v1 REALLY did not have much. I would compare PSU's current array of rares favorably to that of PSO v2. Once AoI has been out a little while, I bet it will compare favorably even to Ep. 1&2.
-Finally, as for Sinue's points on Numen/Newmen, -fliuds, etc... I understand and respect that you were (apparently) a big fan of classic PS. But you have to understand that for some of us who never played the series (and no, it's not cause I'm a young'in, I just never got into it), it's hard to care about stuff like that. Do I like how Newmans work in PSU? Yes. Did I have any knowledge of "Numens" PRIOR to PSO? Nope.
Don't get me wrong...if this were a series I DID care about, I probably would be saying similar things (one of the things I hate about FF11 is how UN-FF it is, at least to me). So I'm not saying you're WRONG, just pointing out that a lot of it depends on your perspective.

Excessively long post FTW. O_O Since it IS already very long, I'm not going to attempt to cover EVERY little difference between PSO and PSU; I feel I've covered the main stuff. In the end, I see PSU as a full sequel to PSO: similar in many ways, but very different in key areas as well, as it should be.

[Carlo210]

I'll admit I was going on the extreme side of the spectrum. I sometimes have a habit of trying not to post indifferent or passive posts. Why? Cause I'd much rather see people's reactions and intelligent arguments against something I say rather than someone read it and go 'meh, okay."
Thanks for your reply. d(^.^d)

[Psycho_Sonic]

And who was it that said that this community's made of "young-uns"? Good God, i hope not. This is an online game. The youngest anyone should ever be to be exposed to ppl like us is a freshmen in high school (ok, maybe 8th grade. I was http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif). And at that age, you know about things that were before your time and you should know to get roms or something. The reason ppl don't know classic PS is because they just haven't gone out of their way to experience it yet.

Anyway, good post Blue Flame, and while i do have a few disagreements w/ you, the main one is the dimate/trimate issue. While this is a new era of Phantasy Star, this IS still Phantasy Star. Would Final Fantasy be what it is without Pheonix Downs and Firaga? Exactly. If they wanted to not use these PS aspects, they shouldn't have called it Phantasy Star. While i'm not fuming about this, it does miff me a bit. That and the fact that Newmans are pathetic wuss-elves compared to what they once were: an original, non-generic race. *sigh*

Anyway, i'm giving AotI the benefit of the doubt and hoping that the writing and voice acting improves, along with the sub-standard music (i don't think the music's terrible, but it isn't really nearly as good as pso. imo.).

...

I can dream, can't i?

Anyway, can't wait for AotI! THAT's when i'll truly start judging whether or not this can become a great MMO.





<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Psycho_Sonic on 2007-11-13 15:04 ]</font>

[pikachief]

idk about PC but i've met A LOT of kids between teh ages of 12-14 >.<

some even 6-10!!! (one wa sa little british girl who convinced me to give her a swimsuit that i jsut bought 15 feathers for!!! >.<)

[mizukage]

The only thing that made PSO better than PSU would be the system of grinds.

[spoiler-box]
In PSO, the droprates of monogrinders and digrinders occur very frequently at the beginnning of the game, while it is revealed that each monogrinder costs 5000 meseta in the NPC shops later midway Episode 1.

Actually, I had misused it at the start on a saber+0 and made it a saber+9, when I could have saved it for an ultimate weapon. When I realized it, it was already too late. However, I still have saved more than 10 pieces of these monogrinders for Episode 2.

In PSU, it sucks when a weapon breaks during a failed grind. Supposedly, this has been fixed in AOI, but I believe the board will not be returned after the break. Instead, you will get a rare item instead and no, the rare item won't be something ridiculous like Koltova Juice or Puyopuyo Drop. It can possibly be a 13* item. The only thing I don't like about PSU would be the system of grinders. When synthing a +5 grind board, I don't know why it always turn out to be +3 which has quite a high rate of failing. The highest number of grinds I had was a 6 for a B-rank twin dagger, which sounds like crap.. Although it had 6 successful grinds, the attack power and PP is lower than that of a 7* zero grind.

PSU grinder system = http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif

[/spoiler-box]

[Saito S]

On 2007-11-13 13:51, Carlo210 wrote:
I'll admit I was going on the extreme side of the spectrum. I sometimes have a habit of trying not to post indifferent or passive posts. Why? Cause I'd much rather see people's reactions and intelligent arguments against something I say rather than someone read it and go 'meh, okay."
Thanks for your reply. d(^.^d)


Yeah? Well, you can just --

Wait. You didn't flame me or insult me or even argue with me?? http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_eek.gif
Actually, I respect your reply all the more because - as would be typical of most message boards - I EXPECTED to get flak for what I had said, haha. In seriousness, thanks for the frankness of your response. And as far as getting a reaction and (I HOPE it was intelligent, anyway) argument...well, you certainly got that from me. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif
Though we will likely always disagree about PSO/PSU, it's still an interesting discussion.

And yeah, Psycho_Sonic, I DO see what you mean. Actually...I sympathize. Come to think of it, a much better example of me experiencing similar feelings than the whole FF11 thing, is Star Trek, and the BLASPHEMOUS abomination that is Star Trek: Enterprise. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_mad.gif lol
So in a way I feel your pain...and yet, for me personally, "Phantasy Star" means "PSO and PSU. Oh yeah, and there was a series of traditional RPG's that came before them too."
While I RESPECT the games as being the foundation of the series, I just can't get worked up about such changes.
I don't think there's really anything to be done about that, nor am I leading up to some dramatic epiphany here... different people just have different perspective on things. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif

[Psycho_Sonic]

...


pinkchief = this. (http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/gullible)

[Saito S]

On 2007-11-13 15:13, Psycho_Sonic wrote:
...


pinkchief = this. (http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/gullible)


I'm assuming you meant "pikachief", Sonic. Although... "pinkchief" is an awesome name http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif

And Mizukage...um, I think you're getting your Grind system and your Synth system mixed up, dood. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_confused.gif

[Ken_Silver]

I have created a monster, and now I regret it so... http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif I had no idea, that people were that opinionated on the issue. It is almost as bad at politicts. If not worse. What else can I say? All has been said and then some. All that I hope for is some sort of peace in the end...

[Jaspaller]

Mods can close this at the request of the thread starter *hint hint*. Unless you really want this war that has been done thousands of times over to continue.

[Ken_Silver]

good idea. Okay mods, please shut down this thread. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif We can all agree to disagree.

[Rasputin]

I detect massive amounts of BAAAAAAAAAAAW in this thread. Is it a rant or something?

[Dhylec]

By request.