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View Full Version : Slicer is nerfed



Aviendha
Nov 20, 2007, 09:55 AM
For reals

Chikki Kyoren-jin
LV1
PP Cost 24
Att. 202%
Acc. 48%

On the other hand, WT didn't get Twin Claws or Knuckles and I can't be bothered to check "Rod Efficiency", whatever that could be...

Mystil
Nov 20, 2007, 09:58 AM
Sorry but that clearly is not a good enough nerf. That's only a few % behind a lvl13+ Jabroga.

Rizen
Nov 20, 2007, 09:58 AM
From Axel's thread...

Chiki Kyoren-jin (Slicer PA)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-VRx5z-ke84

Level 1: 282%/58%
Level 11: 302%/68%
Level 21: 322%/78%
Level 31: 342%/88%
Level 40: 360%/97%

I guess it is. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif

RedX
Nov 20, 2007, 09:59 AM
NNNNNNNNNNNNNNNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOO!

oh well, they still look awesome http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

Aviendha
Nov 20, 2007, 10:00 AM
I'm not saying that they truly fixed the problem with this minor nerf, I'm just saying we got it right away. Hopefully they nerf the second part too, which is supposedly unchanged. But hopefully they also don't nerf it too hard like Renkai and Daggas.

Rizen
Nov 20, 2007, 10:04 AM
I am glad that they actually address this issue in a timely manner, minor or not. Looks like theirs still some hope for a well balanced PSU down the line. One can dream right?

amtalx
Nov 20, 2007, 10:07 AM
Thanks ST. Way to piss on my foot an tell me its raining...nerf my ass.

Kinako78
Nov 20, 2007, 10:22 AM
Whine, whine, whine. Follow Rizen's example and be glad it was nerfed at all.

panzer_unit
Nov 20, 2007, 10:26 AM
If getting a JA on the Slicer PA has some delay to it, I don't see how this move is much worse than axes with Jabroga. How easy is it to adjust aim on the second move of the PA?

Dein
Nov 20, 2007, 10:42 AM
On 2007-11-20 07:26, panzer_unit wrote:
If getting a JA on the Slicer PA has some delay to it, I don't see how this move is much worse than axes with Jabroga. How easy is it to adjust aim on the second move of the PA?



You can pretty much do a full turn on the second part of the first slicer PA if you wanted so it's easy to aim. Would've been nice if they boosted the frag PA's power a bit though considering that Chikki has a longer range than a rifle so you can basically snipe enemies with it.

amtalx
Nov 20, 2007, 10:48 AM
On 2007-11-20 07:22, Kinako78 wrote:
Whine, whine, whine. Follow Rizen's example and be glad it was nerfed at all.



Has ST set the bar so low that we should be happy that they even notice their mistakes, even if they aren't properly corrected? It's good that they made an effort, but trying and doing are two different things. Bringing it to ST's attention is what got us this far. Simply being content with what they hand us will get us nowhere.


On 2007-11-20 07:26, panzer_unit wrote:
If getting a JA on the Slicer PA has some delay to it, I don't see how this move is much worse than axes with Jabroga. How easy is it to adjust aim on the second move of the PA?



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w8mlJaLJMZA

Still not much different than here...

Kinako78
Nov 20, 2007, 10:50 AM
Well, I don't even understand what the problem with the slicers was, since I haven't gotten to use one yet. I'm just sick of all the whining and of having to worry about being booted from a party for using a slicer.

Edit: Also, in that video, that 2k+ damage was done using JA, so it doesn't seem that powerful to me.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Kinako78 on 2007-11-20 07:52 ]</font>

amtalx
Nov 20, 2007, 10:54 AM
On 2007-11-20 07:50, Kinako78 wrote:
Well, I don't even understand what the problem with the slicers was, since I haven't gotten to use one yet. I'm just sick of all the whining and of having to worry about being booted from a party for using a slicer.



Ah, I see. It's basically the original Spread Needle revisted. Long story short, it's a weapon that is so powerful that players without them are having difficulty getting hits on everything because enemies die so fast. In a game where cooperation is intended to be the mainstay, wiping out spawns in seconds and leaving your teammates with nothing is very rude.

Rizen
Nov 20, 2007, 10:55 AM
Well look at it like this, we finally received something first that JP has been asking to be done since AoI was released and they still have to wait for it.

Kinako78
Nov 20, 2007, 10:58 AM
amtalx: I know what a Spread Needle is. I've played PSO. And as far as slicers in PSU, I don't think I should be punished just cause some (or most, whichever) players abuse them.

Rizen: You're the wisest person in this topic.

amtalx
Nov 20, 2007, 11:05 AM
On 2007-11-20 07:55, Rizen wrote:
Well look at it like this, we finally received something first that JP has been asking to be done since AoI was released and they still have to wait for it.



Your relentless optimism is terrifying. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif


On 2007-11-20 07:58, Kinako78 wrote:
amtalx: I know what a Spread Needle is. I've played PSO. And as far as slicers in PSU, I don't think I should be punished just cause some (or most, whichever) players abuse them.




You should be applauded for considerate use of Slicers; however, it still remains that its disruptive to groups. Maybe it's just me, but I don't see balancing weapons and possibly taking away the "Ages 3-5" mode as a punishment.

panzer_unit
Nov 20, 2007, 11:10 AM
The last time I saw a video of it, it looked pretty slow. This one's much quicker.

I'm not seriously worried about Slicers yet. The nerf doesn't look serious, but there's a lot to it... the weapons themselves took a hit to stats, you've got to perform the full combo every time in order to get to the serious damage, and the drop in ATA could be the biggest deal... I'm missing a LOT more than I used to before the AOI update.

Kinako78
Nov 20, 2007, 11:12 AM
On 2007-11-20 08:05, amtalx wrote:

On 2007-11-20 07:55, Rizen wrote:
Well look at it like this, we finally received something first that JP has been asking to be done since AoI was released and they still have to wait for it.



Your relentless optimism is terrifying. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif


On 2007-11-20 07:58, Kinako78 wrote:
amtalx: I know what a Spread Needle is. I've played PSO. And as far as slicers in PSU, I don't think I should be punished just cause some (or most, whichever) players abuse them.




You should be applauded for considerate use of Slicers; however, it still remains that its disruptive to groups. Maybe it's just me, but I don't see balancing weapons and possibly taking away the "Ages 3-5" mode as a punishment.



I'm not talking about that. I'm talking about being kicked out of a party by some jerk just cause I have a slicer. Thought I'd already explained that.

Aviendha
Nov 20, 2007, 11:12 AM
Yeah, I'd hate to see what it was like before the nerf, 'cause I just solo'd Sakura S as a lvl 76 Human Female AF (1) and it was too easy...seriously, the Boomas were a joke. The sageetas were harder to spam Chikki on, so I had to use a different weapon, which was still too easy w/ JA PAs. Melee nerf plz.


On 2007-11-20 07:26, panzer_unit wrote:
If getting a JA on the Slicer PA has some delay to it, I don't see how this move is much worse than axes with Jabroga. How easy is it to adjust aim on the second move of the PA?


The JA on Chikki is actually really fast, or at least of AF it is. But, man, AF is way fast. JA PAs on AF are at least as fast as button-mash PAs on FI/FF/WT, if not a little faster. Sometimes I miss the JA because the animation is too fast...I'm trying to use PSO timing on AF, which doesn't quite work all the time.

EDIT:

[b]On 2007-11-20 08:10I'm not seriously worried about Slicers yet. The nerf doesn't look serious, but there's a lot to it... the weapons themselves took a hit to stats, you've got to perform the full combo every time in order to get to the serious damage, and the drop in ATA could be the biggest deal... I'm missing a LOT more than I used to before the AOI update.



Be worried. I though the ATA would be a problem at first, I was missing more than I like, but soloing Sakura S (with aformentioned char) was very very easy w/ Chikki, so unless Boomas have particularly low evasion or something, I think it will be fine.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Aviendha on 2007-11-20 08:14 ]</font>

amtalx
Nov 20, 2007, 11:16 AM
On 2007-11-20 08:12, Kinako78 wrote:


I'm not talking about that. I'm talking about being kicked out of a party by some jerk just cause I have a slicer. Thought I'd already explained that.



Sorry then http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif You can always use the PA Frag skill. It's still a solid skill, just without the ourageous numbers. It's mostly Chiki that people hate.

Kinako78
Nov 20, 2007, 11:22 AM
How many PA frags do I need for it? And is it out on the US servers yet?

WildArms2
Nov 20, 2007, 11:50 AM
On 2007-11-20 07:00, Aviendha wrote:
I'm not saying that they truly fixed the problem with this minor nerf, I'm just saying we got it right away. Hopefully they nerf the second part too, which is supposedly unchanged. But hopefully they also don't nerf it too hard like Renkai and Daggas.



MINOR nerf? the took 80% off of the weapon how is that minor nerf? and they also took 10% off ata

Aviendha
Nov 20, 2007, 11:51 AM
On 2007-11-20 08:22, Kinako78 wrote:
How many PA frags do I need for it? And is it out on the US servers yet?


60 Frags and no. The new frag pas will be out in 2 updates IIRC.

omegapirate2k
Nov 20, 2007, 11:54 AM
On 2007-11-20 08:50, WildArms2 wrote:

On 2007-11-20 07:00, Aviendha wrote:
I'm not saying that they truly fixed the problem with this minor nerf, I'm just saying we got it right away. Hopefully they nerf the second part too, which is supposedly unchanged. But hopefully they also don't nerf it too hard like Renkai and Daggas.



MINOR nerf? the took 80% off of the weapon how is that minor nerf? and they also took 10% off ata



The nerf only applies to the first part anyway, and the % as it is now is still quite good.

Sora_Psu
Nov 20, 2007, 12:03 PM
Umm..The Slicer has Always been nerfed for those who played PSO...this is nothing new. The Slicer is a good addition to the weapon category but in FFXI terms it is and has been <too weak>

kyle21
Nov 20, 2007, 12:08 PM
How about ST makes all weapons do 500dmg per hit, maybe then people will stop crying cause one weapon is better than the other.

Reeses
Nov 20, 2007, 12:17 PM
Are people still bleeding about the slicer? -.-

I remember when everyone was saying the axe was too strong when it first came out, now its the slicer, and sooner than later, a new powerful weapon will come out and people will be crying about how hard that weapon hits for. I just as soon use it, kill stuff, and get an S rank on the mission. If its too strong, will I still use it? Yes, and heres why:

When I'm in a party with my friends, and they know that slicer can clean a room by itself, I will let them tag all the monsters first before I get a hit. Hell, I just might tag them with a gun myself just incase, If were having trouble with a room, ill whip out the slicer and handle some buisness.

To me, slicer is a weapon, like mentioned above, that can be abused easily. Forces complained about the knockback of some PA's a while ago and everyone "evolved" with that to be able to play off of it and win. If you plan on using a slicer, be considerate, if you know someone who uses a slicer, dont bash them for it...simple as that...

*Hands out kleenex for the people still crying*

kyle21
Nov 20, 2007, 12:22 PM
On 2007-11-20 09:17, Reeses wrote:
Are people still bleeding about the slicer? -.-

I remember when everyone was saying the axe was too strong when it first came out, now its the slicer, and sooner than later, a new powerful weapon will come out and people will be crying about how hard that weapon hits for. I just as soon use it, kill stuff, and get an S rank on the mission. If its too strong, will I still use it? Yes, and heres why:

When I'm in a party with my friends, and they know that slicer can clean a room by itself, I will let them tag all the monsters first before I get a hit. Hell, I just might tag them with a gun myself just incase, If were having trouble with a room, ill whip out the slicer and handle some buisness.

To me, slicer is a weapon, like mentioned above, that can be abused easily. Forces complained about the knockback of some PA's a while ago and everyone "evolved" with that to be able to play off of it and win. If you plan on using a slicer, be considerate, if you know someone who uses a slicer, dont bash them for it...simple as that...

*Hands out kleenex for the people still crying*



I agree!

omegapirate2k
Nov 20, 2007, 12:42 PM
To be fair, ST boosted up many other PA's to comparable levels of damage.

Kinako78
Nov 20, 2007, 01:42 PM
On 2007-11-20 08:51, Aviendha wrote:

On 2007-11-20 08:22, Kinako78 wrote:
How many PA frags do I need for it? And is it out on the US servers yet?


60 Frags and no. The new frag pas will be out in 2 updates IIRC.



Ok, thanks. I can at least start saving for it. I also want the new twin dagger frag PA, though. So I have a lot of saving to do. ^_^;;

Carlo210
Nov 20, 2007, 02:26 PM
amtalx is right about Sega's efforts. Remius, you seriously think that trying harder on this game than Sonic Heroes is a big feat? Big whoop, the game isn't as half-assed as Sonic Heroes. Meaning... ?

Kimil
Nov 20, 2007, 03:36 PM
WT isn't getting the 2 S-ranks on relase
The JP players don't even have that yet, their getting it this update though so that either means we have to wait 2 months, or are getting it this friday too



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Kimil on 2007-11-20 12:36 ]</font>

physic
Nov 20, 2007, 03:55 PM
i dont know why people are complaining about slicers when most havent even actually played with them, also, all PAs dmg is up, is your goal to make slicers useless? (which the ata drop may have already done for my beast) Slicer is a line of attack weapon like laser, but laser shoots about 3 times faster. laser also has a 215-220 mod at 40 and natural elemental of like 23 % or something as well as level 2 status. It has way better ata and a huge amount of pp, how again is that not hax? maybe the RA who ignored lasers all this time need to level up so they can be nerfed
im not saying it isnt strong, but keep in mind what your fighting, what the weap ele is, and levels of skills. fact is im guessing at high levels ill be able to tear through anything 10 levels under me

Carlo210
Nov 20, 2007, 04:03 PM
Slicers can JA, physic. You aren't taking that into account. Gun damage =/= weapon damage. Weapons naturally have a higher damage potential now with JA.

physic
Nov 20, 2007, 04:13 PM
i realize the JA power, but that takes like an extra second, and believe it or not people miss the JA often and you can never JA without first doing some sort of attack. Point is, i doubt they will kill everything on screen before anyone can touch it with the new nerf. The combo is not fast, and you cant move during the PA. it shoots, then it twirls then it shoots, then it twirls again and shoots, notice even in the hax video she has the boomas in corner cheese.

Its also ranged which means most the time, you have to be facing foward, the ata nerf will matter alot for that. not to mention 1hand weapons generally dont have infinite PP if you spam a 1h weap skill usually will run through 10 charges within first block.

its really not spread needle hax especially after the nerf, and to keep nerfing it would just make it a useless weapon.

devildante
Nov 20, 2007, 07:27 PM
if people will use the slicers they can use them wut r we gonna do boot them they'll just blist u.

amtalx
Nov 21, 2007, 07:46 AM
On 2007-11-20 13:13, physic wrote:
i realize the JA power, but that takes like an extra second, and believe it or not people miss the JA often and you can never JA without first doing some sort of attack. Point is, i doubt they will kill everything on screen before anyone can touch it with the new nerf. The combo is not fast, and you cant move during the PA. it shoots, then it twirls then it shoots, then it twirls again and shoots, notice even in the hax video she has the boomas in corner cheese.

Its also ranged which means most the time, you have to be facing foward, the ata nerf will matter alot for that. not to mention 1hand weapons generally dont have infinite PP if you spam a 1h weap skill usually will run through 10 charges within first block.

its really not spread needle hax especially after the nerf, and to keep nerfing it would just make it a useless weapon.



Nope.

NeoTeppin
Nov 21, 2007, 10:41 AM
it may have been nerfed but with my lvl 74 FF with lvl 5 FF im still doin 2200 with my slicers if i use just attacks on the PA
And thats with a lvl 12 PA

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: NeoTeppin on 2007-11-21 07:41 ]</font>