AotI: Photon Gacha update from Sega

[Syl]

http://phantasystaruniverse.com/news_gacha.php


"This is a warning from the GM team to all players about an issue with the Photon Gacha room decoration available in the casino. If you are not aware of this item, it is a vending machine that can be filled with any item in the game, and the owner can set the price to any amount of meseta to allow his room visitors to randomly draw one item from the machine.

The issue with the machine is that the price to activate the machine is not correctly displayed in the warning that appears when activated. A number of unscrupulous players have lured people into their rooms and misled them about the price to activate it, and secretly reset it so as to steal all the meseta the victim is carrying once he or she activates the machine. In other cases, players have stumbled on these for the first time with no idea as to what is happening until they noticed their meseta gone.

The machine looks like a lava lamp or gumball machine. The command to active it is "TURN" -- you will see a warning about your inventory limits and a yes/no. Click no to cancel the transaction.

SEGA is fixing this problem, but until prices display correctly, DO NOT BLINDLY ACTIVATE THE MACHINES. If you have been victimized by this issue, please use the abusive behavior form at http://www.phantasystaruniverse.com/support_contact.php, and include your partner card id number so we can verify your report.

We are investigating players reported to be abusing the machine, and will ban players who have been exploiting this glitch. Even if you believe that your room's gacha is priced fairly, please put it away until this issue is resolved, as you may be reported by anyone who claims to have been ripped off."

Justice is served?


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: SylviaEspada on 2007-11-29 17:31 ]</font>

[Remedy]

Ohoho, excellent.

*links Green to this*

[JenJen902]

Wait.. ANY item in the game?

[Randomness]

The item is played in it by the owner.

Wonder if you can put casino stuff in em?

[haruna]

I don't see why not.

[Remedy]

Because the game prevents you from trading casino goods. I am 99.62% sure that you can't put casino items in a Gacha.

[JenJen902]

Well since the gacha is a casino item..

[Remedy]

That has what, exactly, to do with the question at hand?

[JenJen902]

Maybe its the only way to get rid of a casino item or give one..

[D1ABOLIK]

Highly doubt it.Casino items are like PA frags.Your stuck with them.

________
Vaporizer Manufacturers (http://vaporizer.org/forum/vaporizer-manufacturers/)

[Syl]

If you could, then theoretically you would be able to put in PA frags and disks... so no.

[Jao]

so this means the price will be displayed on friday?

[Dragwind]

Interesting. Good to know they're addressing it rather quickly.

[Hokokaru]

lol I was gonna buy 1 of those when i get the coins (4-6 days) and I was gonna price for 500 ish maybe XD

[Hokokaru]

lol I dont believe it... SEGA is actually BANNING ppeople.... i bet they wont lol

[Jao]

i got a feeling they will

[Hokokaru]

How long have we known SEGA not to ban people? so far all I know of is trashman and Strike ninja

p.s. If its bad to post names then sorry and ill edit it or a mod will change it

[Nobo]

I just wanna know is it being removed tommorow or will they be adding a price thing on it?

[StrongFiend]

nah they'll ban them everyone has had this problem, and its rather rude to steal peoples money like that

[Rizen]

[quote]On 2007-11-29 18:21, Hokokaru wrote:
How long have we known SEGA not to ban people?/quote]
SEGA has banned quite a few people including my brother's friend and a few other people I know. They all ended up remaking accounts though.

[D1ABOLIK]

Did you report to sega?

________
Ford Thunderbird History (http://www.ford-wiki.com/wiki/Ford_Thunderbird)

[wazzup3901]

will i get my 8 mill bak i got scammed 4 on that gatcha thing?

[Zantra]

http://www.pso-world.com/viewtopic.php?topic=161854&forum=20&19

[Keiko_Seisha]

As I was gonna state in the thread I made then noticed this one (deleted mine):

So far, according ot the official forums only 360 users have sent in complaints, if you're on PC/PS2 and have been scammed be sure to sumbit a claim to Sega to receive reimbersement.

[beatrixkiddo]

Epic.

[Broodstar1337]

No.

[Arcturus]

Awesome. Even though ST nerfed the hell out of rangers (please don't make me rant), at least they're cracking down hard on cheaters.

[GuardianElite]

On 2007-11-29 18:21, Hokokaru wrote:
How long have we known SEGA not to ban people? so far all I know of is trashman and Strike ninja

p.s. If its bad to post names then sorry and ill edit it or a mod will change it



sega ban i lot way back when everybody running around with weps that weren't released in the begining of psu

[Segaholic2]

I think Sega banning accounts for this is kind of ridiculous, as the problem was their fault to begin with.

[VanHalen]

Nice glad they are fixing it, I wanted to buy one of these machines after they were patched since it seemed like a cool item.

[GuardianElite]

On 2007-11-29 22:27, Segaholic2 wrote:
I think Sega banning accounts for this is kind of ridiculous, as the problem was their fault to begin with.



its only rediculous until it happen too you <.<

[ShawnLeeGuku]

On 2007-11-29 22:43, GuardianElite wrote:

On 2007-11-29 22:27, Segaholic2 wrote:
I think Sega banning accounts for this is kind of ridiculous, as the problem was their fault to begin with.



its only rediculous until it happen too you <.<


I can vouch for that.

[Biollante]

k, funny story... i lost 19mil to that scam, and the dude's brother ended up finding out and giving it all back to everyone that got scamed... I reported the loss to sega but now i have it all back, what do i do now?

[Syanaide]

On 2007-11-29 23:12, Biollante wrote:
k, funny story... i lost 19mil to that scam, and the dude's brother ended up finding out and giving it all back to everyone that got scamed... I reported the loss to sega but now i have it all back, what do i do now?



???
Profit.

[Biollante]

Yeah I guess the worst that can happen is they don't give it to me. If they give it back at all, that is.

[Isabella]

Gacha PSU BICH!
Tchau~

[BaconZero]

Glad i never bought one, lol.

[GuardianPoe]

I'm just amazed Sega actually acknowledged a problem in the game and said they're doing something about it, instead of just pretending nothing was wrong with anything like they were for the last year. Kudos to them!

For once.

[D1ABOLIK]

On 2007-11-29 22:27, Segaholic2 wrote:
I think Sega banning accounts for this is kind of ridiculous, as the problem was their fault to begin with.

Even if its their fault the text wasnt displayed its not their fault people abused it to scam other peoples meseta. Sounds like someone maybe feels guilty about something and is now worried....hmmmmmmm.

________
Honda Varadero (http://www.honda-wiki.org/wiki/Honda_Varadero)

[AnamanaAU]

Honestly, this is all SEGA's rush job that's at fault. Not the players, but the company. It's no different to players being able to sell items in their shop at 999999999. Sure, you can see that, but it's one in the same.

[PhenoBS]

I lost a mil and i don't want anyone banned its sega's fault i just wish i had my money back http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif

[D1ABOLIK]

On 2007-11-30 02:18, JubeiSaotome wrote: It's no different to players being able to sell items in their shop at 999999999. Sure, you can see that, but it's one in the same.

Its really nothing like that at all.

________
THINKMILL (http://thinkmill.com/)

[RemiusTA]

Of course they wont. Its not like those people KNEW they were shitscamming people.

I actually found this whole deal quite funny.

[Hatemachine]

My take on this is kinda like the trade issues with people switching things out and still clicking yes to trade. Your money and items should be your own lookout if you get scammed then something happened that YOU initiated no one forced you at gunpoint to do it.

You were curious and you paid through the nose for that curiosity it's sad but true I wouldve just chalked it up to my own curiosity.

Seriously it may be harsh but maybe folks should take some responsibility. Sonic team seems to have done that admirably even catering to a sense of justfied revenge on the part of the poor slobs that got taken AND giving them back their money.

Kinda crappy thing is now these people may just find a buddy transfer all the ill gotten booty plus his own items then just see if he gets nailed if not he's clear if so all he lost was some time and ST just tossed a few million meseta out without having removed the money from the original offenders.

[JAFO22000]

On 2007-11-30 05:10, Hatemachine wrote:
My take on this is kinda like the trade issues with people switching things out and still clicking yes to trade. Your money and items should be your own lookout if you get scammed then something happened that YOU initiated no one forced you at gunpoint to do it.

You were curious and you paid through the nose for that curiosity it's sad but true I wouldve just chalked it up to my own curiosity.

Seriously it may be harsh but maybe folks should take some responsibility. Sonic team seems to have done that admirably even catering to a sense of justfied revenge on the part of the poor slobs that got taken AND giving them back their money.

Kinda crappy thing is now these people may just find a buddy transfer all the ill gotten booty plus his own items then just see if he gets nailed if not he's clear if so all he lost was some time and ST just tossed a few million meseta out without having removed the money from the original offenders.



On the other hand, when has it ever cost someone meseta to look/activate a room decoration? The victims of this scam didn't know what was going on. The perpetrators did know what was going on and scammed those who didn't know.

If you had no idea what a Gacha machine was, would you think it would cost money? I mean, imagine someone says "Sit in my Cactus chair. Now dance in front of this big onion. Now use this gacha machine." First two didn't cost you meseta, but the last one did.

I think the people who scammed people should be banned. They knowingly used an oversight by the developers to cause greif to other players. If there are no victims in exploiting oversights (e.g. machinegun glitch), then it would be silly to ban. But for something like this, people who used it to their advantage should not be allowed to play the game.

[Kylie]

I feel funny about this... Like, anyone that took advantage of this exploit is horrible, but to ban people for using something that SEGA put in the game by accident or not is kind of lame. It's not even really hacking, in my opinion, or anything ban-worthy. I think they should just fix it; the warning and what people have heard should suffice for the rest. But, whatever, I haven't touched or seen this item, and none of my friends that I know of have either.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Lorelei on 2007-11-30 08:22 ]</font>

[Raine_Loire]

On 2007-11-30 02:18, JubeiSaotome wrote:
It's no different to players being able to sell items in their shop at 999999999. Sure, you can see that, but it's one in the same.



???

You DO realize that when people list stuff for all 9s it means it's either not for sale or they want you to send offers right???

These machines are... stupid I guess is the right term. I used one yesterday just for funsies, the store ad said 5k a spin and if it was more than that it wasn't a noticeable amount, but that was still the most expensive photon I've ever bought! But... no where as I was using the machine did it say the price, it just said spin. So really, if I just wandered in, I would have assumed it was free!

So yeah- a 5k photon? My bad because I HAD to spin it, I just HAAAD to see. But if there's someone in their room, looking at peoples meseta when they come in and changing the machine to cost that amount, well then that's their bad, and I think they SHOULD get banned. It's a freaking GAME people, you gain nothing tangible by taking advantage of people!

[Reipard]

I feel funny about this... Like, anyone that took advantage of this exploit is horrible, but to ban people for using something that SEGA put in the game by accident or not is kind of lame. It's not even really hacking, in my opinion, or anything ban-worthy. I think they should just fix it; the warning and what people have heard should suffice for the rest. But, whatever, I haven't touched or seen this item, and none of my friends that I know of have either.

It does not matter whether the scam was the result of a hack, a programmer error at Sega or a game exploit. People knew there was an error they could exploit to scam people and they scam it. I see no problem with making them take responsibility for being greedy, irresponsible and immoral.

[Rashiid]

On 2007-11-29 18:13, Hokokaru wrote:
lol I dont believe it... SEGA is actually BANNING ppeople.... i bet they wont lol



My friend was banned >< . Seriously.

[Kylie]

On 2007-11-30 09:25, Rashiid wrote:

On 2007-11-29 18:13, Hokokaru wrote:
lol I dont believe it... SEGA is actually BANNING ppeople.... i bet they wont lol



My friend was banned >< . Seriously.


Same here, so it's possible.


It does not matter whether the scam was the result of a hack, a programmer error at Sega or a game exploit. People knew there was an error they could exploit to scam people and they scam it. I see no problem with making them take responsibility for being greedy, irresponsible and immoral.

Yeah, but I don't feel like ST should be the morality police. They should accept full responsibility for putting an object like that into the game and just now warning us about it, especially when it was on the Japanese server for months (right?). There's no question that people that took advantage of the item acted wrongly, but a warning should have at least been posted on the main site (not everyone checks the board) before banning people. To me, it sounds like their banning people prior to a warning because of something they put into the game, which doesn't seem fair - as right or wrong using the item may be. But, again, I don't think it affects me since I've not seen or touched the item before anyways.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Lorelei on 2007-11-30 09:43 ]</font>

[beatrixkiddo]

It says somewhere in the ToS that abusing game mechanics (flawed/glitched/SEGA's fault or otherwise) is a bannable offense. When abusing that game mechanic, KNOWINGLY, to ruin the game for others, of course SEGA is going to take action.

[JAFO22000]

The ToS basically says that they can cancel your account at any time, for any reason.

I agree totally with the banning of these people. I'm sure there were plenty of people who knew of this scam and didn't participate. This is because these people were good community members.

If someone was douchey enough to use this oversight by the developers to scam people, I don't want them in my community. ST is doing a good thing by removing them; it's the only way to ensure they will never do it again AND may deter those who may think of scamming in the future AND gives confidence to the majority of the community that these actions will not be tolerated in the future.

Gotta make examples of these people. One griefer can cause a lot of people to stop playing this game, especially if nothing is being done to stop them. Better to ban the one person then to have 20 stop playing (and paying!) because of them. I say, good job ST....good job!

[Eureka]

I was using the machine to sell pannon dolls. And I put an add saying the price when another player told me he was scammed by someone else with that machine. So I sent warnings to my friends warning them. I even put a message on my pm to check my bulletin about the machine.

I priced stuff fairly in it using conditional search, put up warnings, etc. Now I have to take it down because anyone could report I scammed when I did not. Basically gonna turn into a witch hunt because a few bad players wanted to exploit something to get rich.

[LS_Aksion]

Excellent! im glad the Photon Gatcha (GOTCHA >_>) is being fixed as it SHOULD'VE been. i feel really bad for the victoms who got suckered into this glitch due to their curiocity.

[Reipard]

Yeah, but I don't feel like ST should be the morality police.

Well, that's too bad. It's their game and they do what they want at their discretion. Not to mention banning weasels who take advantage of it only benefits the playerbase.

The only people who could be wronged are those who are WRONGFULLY banned. And they can contest that ban.


They should accept full responsibility for putting an object like that into the game and just now warning us about it, especially when it was on the Japanese server for months (right?). There's no question that people that took advantage of the item acted wrongly, but a warning should have at least been posted on the main site (not everyone checks the board) before banning people.

The news appears to be just such a warning. It infers that they will only ban people who are reported to have scammed. Unless they're particularly hasty about their customer's accounts, they won't just check logs of anyone who has ever had a Gacha and then ban them without word or warning. Innocent until accused.

[Wallin]

From the Sega forums:
If the issue could have been fixed last night we would not have had to issue that warning. It will be at least two more weeks.

To those who are worried about a "witch hunt" please do not feel so threatened. We mostly are concerned about the method we detailed in the warning, and wanted to make sure that we were not contributing to the problem by informing players about a scam method they could use to victimize casual players who do not visit the website or forums. We will deal with the reported offenders on a case by case basis.

-ChillAura

Seriously, how hard is it to change text so that prices will fit in the window? Do SoA employees have to go through SoJ every time they want to make a change to the game or something?

[Reipard]

My only guess (Since I could have fixed something like that in under an hour O_o) is that they have it fixed already in the update build and simply have a policy that they are not allowed to modify or recompile the game while it's active and making them money. It's not good form to boot all of your users off of the game and has a tendency to piss them off, even if your underlying intentions were good.

Well, that and you want to be absolutely certain your fix didn't create a bug elsewhere.

It's also not an omg gamebreaking problem that necessitates a forced maintenance. It can easily wait until scheduled maintenance where updates can be properly tested and additional work can be done. That's an understandable policy.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Reipard on 2007-12-02 00:26 ]</font>

[ShawnLeeGuku]

Does anyone know if we'll be getting our money back if we were scammed by it?

[Sylpheed]

Oh fucking brilliant. I look forward to getting unfairly banned because a dim-witted idiot reports me for stealing 1k from him. I swear to god if this happens it'll just prove that SEGA have no understanding in how to create a game. Don't get me wrong im glad people are going to get banned for exploiting players but what about poeple who have but fair prices on their machines and have been already reported by some kid because he lost 1k to the machine.

[Nobo]

Thats exactly how I feel...
http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_beer.gif

[BFGfreak]

Do you think having the price mentioned on the ad and bot's welcome message would be enough? or should I just close it (and by that I mean 99999999999 it and change the welcome message to "do not use Gacha", I don't have enough room in my PM to store all the prizes)

[Wallin]

On 2007-12-02 06:20, BFGfreak wrote:
Do you think having the price mentioned on the ad and bot's welcome message would be enough? or should I just close it (and by that I mean 99999999999 it and change the welcome message to "do not use Gacha", I don't have enough room in my PM to store all the prizes)



According to Sega, this is not enough. Pull the thing out of your room and put it in storage until it's fixed.

http://www.phantasystaruniverse.com/news_gacha.php
"We are investigating players reported to be abusing the machine, and will ban players who have been exploiting this glitch. Even if you believe that your room's gacha is priced fairly, please put it away until this issue is resolved, as you may be reported by anyone who claims to have been ripped off."

[Reipard]

I do not think you have anything to worry about if you were pricing your Gachas fairly. I'm certain Sega will perform an investigation to ensure those people weren't lying as opposed to blindly banning paying customers just because Anna Said So.

[Nisshoku]

I've listed my Gacha price on the ad to my store. So honestly, if the lose 250-500 meseta on it, they can come to me, and I'll gladly reimburse it. The price is on the ad, so they know what they're getting themselves into, really.

[Ashkahn]

I found a Gacha with an ad that said 8k for a turn.

I tried to prove the guy a scammer, so I only brought 8k into the room and used the machine.

Not only was the machine legit, but it also spat out the cheapest damn Gur Bazga in PSU.

But unless you're positive of what you're getting into, I don't reccomend touching the things with a 50-foot pole.

[Kylie]

On 2007-11-30 15:16, Reipard wrote:
Well, that's too bad. It's their game and they do what they want at their discretion. Not to mention banning weasels who take advantage of it only benefits the playerbase.

The only people who could be wronged are those who are WRONGFULLY banned. And they can contest that ban.

The news appears to be just such a warning. It infers that they will only ban people who are reported to have scammed. Unless they're particularly hasty about their customer's accounts, they won't just check logs of anyone who has ever had a Gacha and then ban them without word or warning. Innocent until accused.

First of all, I hate that reasoning. Yes, SEGA can do just about anything they like, but that doesn't mean it's the best thing to do or the most "fair," which I think most people agree they look for fairness from the people in charge. Secondly, it didn't seem like a warning to me; it looked like they were saying anyone that's abused it even before the message was posted will get banned:


We are investigating players reported to be abusing the machine, and will ban players who have been exploiting this glitch.

If that is just a warning, then I have no problem with people banned [with fair warning], and I'd actually love to show them the door. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

[Raine_Loire]

But it specifically says they will be going after people who EXPLOITED the glitch- citing the ones who change the amount to whatever the user has on them to take ALL their money. I'd say you're safe if they can look at the log from your room and see that EVERY person paid the same amount- it doesn't seem to me that it's an issue of overpricing- or they'd ban people who were charging 200k for a ray photon way back when. It's more using an exploit- and that's a ban-able offense according to the TOS of almost every online game, no?



The issue with the machine is that the price to activate the machine is not correctly displayed in the warning that appears when activated. A number of unscrupulous players have lured people into their rooms and misled them about the price to activate it, and secretly reset it so as to steal all the meseta the victim is carrying once he or she activates the machine.

[Reipard]

First of all, I hate that reasoning. Yes, SEGA can do just about anything they like, but that doesn't mean it's the best thing to do or the most "fair," which I think most people agree they look for fairness from the people in charge. Secondly, it didn't seem like a warning to me; it looked like they were saying anyone that's abused it even before the message was posted will get banned:

Yes, I agree that there should be fairness from the people in charge. But you seem to be under the notion that they're not being fair. I do not see anything about their post that infers they are just going to blindly ban people. The post itself is a warning both to people who USE the Photon Gacha and to the people that abuse it.

Not only that, but their terms of service clearly states that you cannot abuse glitches or bugs in the game to the detriment of others. There is absolutely no way at all the people who would be banned would not know what they're getting into, why they got into it and what the consequences were.

How is this not fair?


If that is just a warning, then I have no problem with people banned [with fair warning], and I'd actually love to show them the door.

Read the whole thing and don't take one portion out of context. Even then, that portion makes it clear- 'We are investigating players reported to be abusing the machine'. There has to be a Scammed bitching about it before there can be a Scam Investigation on a person. It is not like they're performing any kind of witch hunt.