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mooonbow
Dec 13, 2007, 11:20 PM
O.K since the expasion iv noticed alot of acrotechers running around with nothing buy whips and uel pistols..and the party that these people are in are still depending on the fortetecher for support. Fortetecher are no longer a support class. All you acrotechers out there(i know there are a few who play support this is not for you)but the ones who dont play support need to get off your high horse. and start to use your support spells more often.This is a team based game where everyone needs to put alittle support in to the parties they are in. This mean buying using sol and moon atmizers...Also if your low on health dont depend on the fortetecher or acrotecher to heal you. they sell all sorts of healing at the npc and now you can get megistrides there as well. Now i know im gonna get yelled at for this post i dont care.

hewitt
Dec 13, 2007, 11:25 PM
wait a minute are you saying that ATs should be more supportive or that peopl should buy consumables ? im lost

jayster
Dec 13, 2007, 11:29 PM
Acrotechers aren't really that good at attacking anyways, they're mostly a support class. My acrotecher is mainly support. I have level 31 buffs, giresta, resta, reverser, and debuffs. I have 4 tech mags paired off with whips but I only use whips when iv debuffed everything, checked everyones health, and don't feel like using a tech.

iv been running A ranks on my Acrotecher and fortegunner since they're both in the 60's. And iv noticed that 90% of acrotechers don't have buffs, or atleast buffs past level 11. 90% of them don't use resta unless their health is low and only run around throwing whips everywhere.

unicorn
Dec 13, 2007, 11:29 PM
Thats because you haven't partied with me yet.

I keeps joo buffed at all times babeh. I only buffs in-battle! http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_eek.gif No need for calling my hunters/rangers like cattle, it wastes time anyway. They naturally follow meee, because I do my job well. Or maybe its because I follow my party and FORCE my buffs upon them! >:D

You gotta watch your own HP though, although I'm normally on that. Still, my 31+Deband, 31+Zoldial, 31+Retier should keep choo covered. And I giresta on top of that. Yay for regen!

But yeah...alot of ATs really do suck....

mooonbow
Dec 13, 2007, 11:29 PM
im saying AT should be more supportive. But they cant heal or buff if they are froozen, stunned, or put to sleep. So everyone should cary consumables. Meaning mates also sols for when the AT are froozen stunned or put to sleep

Lyric
Dec 13, 2007, 11:33 PM
Well, in my case I went from GT to AT. I do support my party to the full extent of my ability however, even though my buffs are still being leveled (near 20 now.)

As for whips not doing decent damage though, I'll have to disagree. For the amount of enemies you hit/ contact points on large monsters, it's fairly decent considering the class is in the techer category. Not to mention the status effects. I love paralyzing everything with my zon Vish Adac. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

mooonbow
Dec 13, 2007, 11:35 PM
Well at least there are a FEW GOOD AT out there. That know how to do there job. I guess i just had bad luck withh all the ones i partied with> Next time ill be looking for you

Lyric
Dec 13, 2007, 11:37 PM
Haha, fair enough.

Finae
Dec 13, 2007, 11:46 PM
95% of At on PS2/PC suck (and Im guessing 99.99% on fudbox 360). GF and I rock as AT both melee, technic, and support wise. I have a small list of ATs that don't suck though, but still, the majority out there even at 110/15 will blow. Its just a damn shame if you ask me haha, but whatever, I usually show them how to really play a AT if another one is in the party.

Like I have always said, people saying FT will be a more nuker type class was totally nub and incorrect. FT will be playing support until Sega decreases their support technics to lvl 10. And ATs will live happily ever after with their whips and lvl 1 buffs (Lol, you know you've partied with ATs that have 1-20 buffs haha).

Bliven
Dec 13, 2007, 11:52 PM
I've partied with acrotechers that didn't even have lvl 1 buffs lol

mooonbow
Dec 13, 2007, 11:52 PM
thats why i took all buffs off my art list. put them in my bot. and i only heal when I need it!

MT7218
Dec 13, 2007, 11:53 PM
I try to be a good AT. I buff, debuff, use Giresta, then mainly nuke or use my whip afterwards, healing when someone needs it. Only problem with that is weapon lag tends to get in the way when I switch weaopns, even when most of my pallet is the same: Wand and Madoog/TECH-mag combos, with one Whip and Madoog/TECH-mag combo equipped with Resta/Reverser, and a pair of daggers.

Lyric
Dec 14, 2007, 12:07 AM
On 2007-12-13 20:46, Finae wrote:
95% of At on PS2/PC suck (and Im guessing 99.99% on fudbox 360). GF and I rock as AT both melee, technic, and support wise. I have a small list of ATs that don't suck though, but still, the majority out there even at 110/15 will blow. Its just a damn shame if you ask me haha, but whatever, I usually show them how to really play a AT if another one is in the party.

Like I have always said, people saying FT will be a more nuker type class was totally nub and incorrect. FT will be playing support until Sega decreases their support technics to lvl 10. And ATs will live happily ever after with their whips and lvl 1 buffs (Lol, you know you've partied with ATs that have 1-20 buffs haha).



Well some of us went from Hybrid classes to AT, like I did. In my case, GT's support tech max was level 10 before AoI came out. My supports are nearing 20 now, but damn dude cut some slack.

Indica
Dec 14, 2007, 12:09 AM
Arotecher's will phase out and be a worthless class when the Master classes come out

Chaosgyro
Dec 14, 2007, 12:09 AM
I don't find it a problem what level people's spells/skills are. If you don't want to stand in a buff party for hours a day or set up afk levelling a bullet or two that's fine by me. As long as you're willing to use those spells/skills in the first place. The real problem is ATs who won't buff or throw resta/reverser unless they need it themselves, not ATs who have techs sub-31.

Lyric
Dec 14, 2007, 12:12 AM
On 2007-12-13 21:09, Indica wrote:
Arotecher's will phase out and be a worthless class when the Master classes come out



As will all other classes apparently. I really hope that doesn't happen.

Broodstar1337
Dec 14, 2007, 12:24 AM
And people wonder why Acrotechers are getting a bad rap in PSU. (http://pso-world.com/viewtopic.php?topic=163295&forum=11&52)

Lyric
Dec 14, 2007, 12:41 AM
This is also the reason I stay with a tight knit group of friends instead of joining random groups. We all know how each other plays, and it prevents all of these headaches induced by morons who don't know how to be a team player.

Gen2000
Dec 14, 2007, 02:56 AM
In every random I join I heal and buff just like I did before AoI dropped. If I notice an Acrotecher in the party then I won't buff if I fill I'm invading their terriorty otherwise I keep buffing until they get the message that should be taking advantage of those lv.31+ support techs and share them with the party. You gonna have some buffs in whoever party I'm in one way or another. Hell, Retier lv.31+ is freaking nice for me...so ATs need to gib it. My Resta/Reverser spam however is always on full alert no matter what because a heal is a heal.

Just because Acrotecher dropped or Guntechers got lv.30 support techs doesn't mean I all of sudden forgot how to heal and buff too as a Fortetecher. I noticed a few Fortetechers who switch to just using Megistar in parties, wth is up with that?

MSAksion
Dec 14, 2007, 03:05 AM
a LOT of Acrotechers i've partied with are these whackos who think an AT should rush right up with the ForteFighters and the Figunners and ;

WHIP
WHIP
WHIP

THE TRUE AcroTECHER goes in and DEBUFFS the monsters - this tags them for exp and you become the decoy. Run around or like me directly through the middle of a squad so all the monsters focus on me.

NOW the Team FF and FIG and fG and FT will appreciate your sacrifice as now the monster attention is on you the decoy so their backs are exposed.

THEN the hunters catch up and now dealing with the monsters. NOW the monster's backs are turned to YOU!!! Time to WHIP or cast a quick GI spell then HEAL THE HUNTERS.

AT who dont heal the hunters takes away from us REAL FTs - who have to stop throwing all kinds of 31+ Nukes and run up and heal the hunters - the way we practiced for a YEAR now. AT and WT are right there with the hunters - stop WHIPPING and start HEALING.

Bottom line - an AT with madoog + WHip X 6 is just as bad as Shadoog + Slicer x 6 >_>

Xaeris
Dec 14, 2007, 03:27 AM
I find arguments between ATs funny. You see, oftentimes, one side will accuse the other of not supporting the fighters and making no attempt to earn their appreciation by debuffing and being ready to spam Giresta for the most laughable amount of HP lost.

It's funny, because I, one of those said fighters the heal slaves think they're being so helpful towards, think they're leeching. Let's be realistic here; in both the game's current and projected state, a megistaride, some mates and a warm body to draw fire are all the support I need. So, if the only thing you plan to do is save me 3 or 4k a run...you're leeching. Seriously.

Personally, I find the AT that buffs, then proceeds to melee with their well equipped palette, not stopping to heal or debuff with the exception of Reverser (and even then, only incapacitating effects like Stun or Freeze) , to be making a greater contribution than the Giresta slave that tags a group of sageetas with a Zalure now and then.

Shadow_Wing
Dec 14, 2007, 03:29 AM
Personally, I find the AT that buffs, then proceeds to melee with their well equipped palette, not stopping to heal or debuff with the exception of Reverser (and even then, only incapacitating effects like Stun or Freeze) , to be making a greater contribution than the Giresta slave that tags a group of sageetas with a Zalure now and then.

I swear, u must have played with me XD

darthplagis
Dec 14, 2007, 03:33 AM
well my now level 60 acrotecwearl, was built with the intention of being AT and in doing so got her buffs and giresta up to 21+ pre AOTI. now i was fully expecting AT to be a buff and heal only kinda techer till i actually played the calss.

if you look at the way AT is set up you have a cool selection of medium range weapons (duals of dagger and pistol variety and S rank pistol) some mean close range weapons (namely the S class saber dagger and whip) all that with the cream of the tech support gear (S madoogs and wands). ok so what does this say to you?????????

to me it implies that i as an AT would be best suited to buffing/healing the party either together @safe spots or on the hoof, with the latter being supported by the mele waepons available for self defence. now in doing so you realize that yes AT isnt the most powerful combat player bear in mind this is a team game so you wont be expected to be the mele tank, but hey we have some techs to whip out if we get stuck in a corner.

the thing that annoys me is these damn FT who try and buff/heal as in the above instance, instead of doing the job they have chosen which is POWER TECHS (while complaining FT sux with no har/quick).

granted there are those NOOBS who play AT for the weapon selection just like noobgunners........ i mean figunners (no intent towards 'true' FG just noobsaber spammers) and IMHO these are the ones giving us 'true' AT a bad name

rant over

oooWaveooo
Dec 14, 2007, 03:34 AM
i play my acrotecher as a support class.

my setup looks like this

coni/ serdote (offense+ support)
dori/ vish adan dark (offense)
dori/ serdote (offense/ revive/ reverser)
mira-kikami/ vish adac light (offense)
shato/ magical wand (utility((foie+zalure+reverser+giresta)))
pegita/ magical wand (buffs)


i used to think whips were the shit, but i use them less and less all the time. still taking a bit to get used to attacking with my madoog instead of a wand

darthplagis
Dec 14, 2007, 03:43 AM
my current pallet runs like this

pegita (blue & yellow debuff) / vish adan
shato (girest reverser)/ crimson
shi kikami/ magical wand (element to suit)
viper (dark)/ magical wand (element to suit)
dori (element to suit)/ blumier or twin daggers (depending on enemies)
pegita/ magical wand (buffs)

Keiko_Seisha
Dec 14, 2007, 03:48 AM
On 2007-12-14 00:27, Xaeris wrote:
I find arguments between ATs funny. You see, oftentimes, one side will accuse the other of not supporting the fighters and making no attempt to earn their appreciation by debuffing and being ready to spam Giresta for the most laughable amount of HP lost.

It's funny, because I, one of those said fighters the heal slaves think they're being so helpful towards, think they're leeching. Let's be realistic here; in both the game's current and projected state, a megistaride, some mates and a warm body to draw fire are all the support I need. So, if the only thing you plan to do is save me 3 or 4k a run...you're leeching. Seriously.

Personally, I find the AT that buffs, then proceeds to melee with their well equipped palette, not stopping to heal or debuff with the exception of Reverser (and even then, only incapacitating effects like Stun or Freeze) , to be making a greater contribution than the Giresta slave that tags a group of sageetas with a Zalure now and then.



As usual, X is the one I have to agree with. I play AT, and this is usually what I do: I'll buff you (in combat, so as not to waste time by having everyone stand around), heal you when you're usually at <50% HP, and Reverser you (as fast as I all possibly can, which usually ends up being slow, as I don't catch on to some things very quickly). But other than that, I'm gonna try to keep enemies pinned with a whip (I have a Vish Adac of every element for a reason) or dealing damage with Spinning Strike/Hikai (depends on situation).

But hey, I don't party with randoms anyways, only friends and those who invite me by asking.

Gen2000
Dec 14, 2007, 04:21 AM
the thing that annoys me is these damn FT who try and buff/heal as in the above instance, instead of doing the job they have chosen which is POWER TECHS (while complaining FT sux with no har/quick).

Not sure if that was addressed towards me but if so...don't get it twisted, any -techer class I play I'm attacking 90% of the time I'm not just sitting back waiting for heal moments but if you need a heal I throw a heal, need a buff i throw buff if able, it only takes like 2 seconds. Supporting isn't that complicated. Heal slaves/leechers are bad no matter what class.

The problem is when people get too absorbed in attacking they forget that one player has been frozen/stun for 1 minutue and about to get gangraped or people need to use buff/heal items most of the mission instead of you sharing your better buffs or heal slap. It's like why are you even playing the class. You're not even saving me money which is really the only reason your gimp melee and tech abilities (in a game where the best tech damage still sucks) are accepted. The spot would be better filled with another Fortefighter/gunner/Acrofighter/Protranser.

APEXi
Dec 14, 2007, 04:33 AM
i dont even bother partying with techers. how bout dem apples? everyones responsible for covering theyre own ass

jayster
Dec 14, 2007, 06:39 AM
I runa pallette like this:

Dori (buffs) / Uransara (buffs)
Dori (resta / reverser) / Uransara (deband / Giresta)
Coni (att spell) / adac
Coni (att spell) / adac
Dori (att spell) / adac
Dori (att spell) / adan

True I have 4 whips on my pallette, but I have 2 full slots of support spells.

Guildenstern
Dec 14, 2007, 06:40 AM
On 2007-12-14 00:48, Keiko_Seisha wrote:

On 2007-12-14 00:27, Xaeris wrote:
I find arguments between ATs funny. You see, oftentimes, one side will accuse the other of not supporting the fighters and making no attempt to earn their appreciation by debuffing and being ready to spam Giresta for the most laughable amount of HP lost.

It's funny, because I, one of those said fighters the heal slaves think they're being so helpful towards, think they're leeching. Let's be realistic here; in both the game's current and projected state, a megistaride, some mates and a warm body to draw fire are all the support I need. So, if the only thing you plan to do is save me 3 or 4k a run...you're leeching. Seriously.

Personally, I find the AT that buffs, then proceeds to melee with their well equipped palette, not stopping to heal or debuff with the exception of Reverser (and even then, only incapacitating effects like Stun or Freeze) , to be making a greater contribution than the Giresta slave that tags a group of sageetas with a Zalure now and then.



As usual, X is the one I have to agree with. I play AT, and this is usually what I do: I'll buff you (in combat, so as not to waste time by having everyone stand around), heal you when you're usually at <50% HP, and Reverser you (as fast as I all possibly can, which usually ends up being slow, as I don't catch on to some things very quickly). But other than that, I'm gonna try to keep enemies pinned with a whip (I have a Vish Adac of every element for a reason) or dealing damage with Spinning Strike/Hikai (depends on situation).

But hey, I don't party with randoms anyways, only friends and those who invite me by asking.



Yup, that's what I do, too. Usually I hit the spell-slingers with the Silence whip and on everything else I hit with my Vish Adacs to stun things and hold them in place. Bosses get the Spinning Strike.

If you play proactively (preventing damage from occuring) instead of reactively (healing after the fact) you'll need to heal a lot less and conversely you'll kill a lot faster.

Pillan
Dec 14, 2007, 07:45 AM
Buff when someoneís unbuffed, debuff when the mob spawns, heal when anyoneís around half-HP, and deal damage for the other 3.5/4 minutes, using primarily melee but ranged weapons when appropriate. Thatís how I play and I have yet to receive any complaints, yet plenty of praise.

Itís really not hard to play AT or any Ėtecher class. I donít see why everyone makes it sound so complicated.

RemiusTA
Dec 14, 2007, 08:07 AM
On 2007-12-13 20:20, mooonbow wrote:
O.K since the expasion iv noticed alot of acrotechers running around with nothing buy whips and uel pistols..and the party that these people are in are still depending on the fortetecher for support. Fortetecher are no longer a support class. All you acrotechers out there(i know there are a few who play support this is not for you)but the ones who dont play support need to get off your high horse. and start to use your support spells more often.This is a team based game where everyone needs to put alittle support in to the parties they are in. This mean buying using sol and moon atmizers...Also if your low on health dont depend on the fortetecher or acrotecher to heal you. they sell all sorts of healing at the npc and now you can get megistrides there as well. Now i know im gonna get yelled at for this post i dont care.



Well yeah how about you let the Acrotechers find their own style of play and you concentrate on your own class.


Mkay?

All other classes -- Leave acrotechers alone. If they want their class just to twirl whips around, then thats their own loss.

All Acrotechers --> Try not to be Dicks. Use the higher support spells to your advantage. Its useless to be given a higher support role than Fortecher and not use it.


Edit: Dont you idiots start that "MASTER CLASS" ranting or ill rip your sack off. Nobody knows what the master classes will have/be/do, so just shut up and dont even START spectulating, because this forum cant handle spectulation.




<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: RemiusTA on 2007-12-14 05:12 ]</font>

Broodstar1337
Dec 14, 2007, 08:36 AM
On 2007-12-14 01:33, APEXi wrote:
i dont even bother partying with techers. how bout dem apples? everyones responsible for covering theyre own ass



If everyone shared that sentiment, everyone would be a Fortefighter that never ran out on mates, scape dolls, and buff items.

majan
Dec 14, 2007, 09:56 AM
this is an unbeatable problem as long as people are playing rpgs. people are selfish and its quite rare that you find a party with any kind of good harmony. when you do,send your partner card out.when you are playing with the selfish pricks,leave the party after that run and be done. don't continue whining about it.

as a force,I feel if you want the job done right, do it yourself so as a ft I do 100% of wat I can to support while max nuking as well. majans advice is to party with the right people cus generally speaking you are not going to avoid this shortcoming very easily.its a MORPG thing.

majan
Dec 14, 2007, 10:11 AM
furthermore,people are free to play how they want.while yes acrotechers ougt to pitch at least a little bit into helping support,they have many more things in their arsenal-they are an extremely versatile class and to not take advantage of that,well,they may as well not be an AT in the first place. I'm not making excuses for everybody cus some,well,many people out there really do just suck at the game and RPGs in general. but the rule stands,play how u want.

though I will say a quick word to all forces,at and ft alike, buffing helps everybody. including yourself. you really are better off just taking the second to help out.

creativehope
Dec 14, 2007, 02:47 PM
I understand where the Op is coming from to a certain extent. after reading his first statement a few times I think that what he is trying to say is that if you were a melee class only then the whole whip/pistol thing may be justifiable. Otherwise you are nothing more than a weaker fighguntecher. Seeing as how you have all these options to you the very least you could do is use them all. and not just the chosen, selfish few that make you look like a 1 man army. Seeing as how you have S rank whips you use them, You have potential lvl 31+ buffs and yet you dont use them. You also have lvl 30 attack techs and yet you refuse to use them. all of these options make up the acrotecher, so why not do what you can for the entire group. making their job easy makes your job easy. But as a fotetecher main I couldnt allow myself to allow the acrotecher to be the only support role. Some may call me a leech for spamming giresta immediately after a battle but the stacking feature makes my job as support a little easier. In the end if an acrotecher isnt playing to his or her full potential then there isnt much you can do but leave that acrotecher in search of another party. Thats the best you can do

Poncho_Jr
Dec 14, 2007, 02:52 PM
It's confusing sometimes. When I play with Acros, some of them buff/debuff, some of them don't.
So I'm stuck thinking... "Should I buff/debuff party?"
I don't wanna be an ass and overwrite the better, but sometimes the better doesn't even do it.
And when I DO buff, people keep moving away from it, even after I shout "Buff Circle", or any phrase to catch their attention.
So here's how I play...
Buff each front block, Defense down and Accuracy down creatures, then use level 31 Ra-TECH. And keep Giresta stacked at all times.

Weeaboolits
Dec 14, 2007, 03:16 PM
I play support as a wartecher. >.>;

If someone with better buffs shows up, I switch my wand and madoog to a good attack setup.

I will never stop using resta, though. >_>

Grimhart
Dec 14, 2007, 03:35 PM
Looks like the moral of the story is to use everything your class has to offer.

Acrotechers have the best access to whips, so it's only fitting that an Acrotecher uses whips. By the same logic, though, the Acrotecher has the best potential for support, so it's also only fitting that an Acrotecher handles support.

That's not to say that Acrotechers should be the only ones who support, since other classes also have the ability to support and therefore should be able to if needed. Backup plans are always helpful!

Yeah, leveling buffs to 31+ is hard work and takes a while, but that's no excuse for an AT to not buff. Even if your buffs aren't maxed out the party will still be better off with than without. Besides, they'll never level if you never use them. :

So basically, if you want to play a class well (any class, not just AT), then make sure you use as much of the class's potential as possible. ATs have the best support options, so they should use them.

Thanks to all the ATs out there who know this and do their jobs well! ^_^ Hopefully, we can get the others to catch on.

HaydenX
Dec 14, 2007, 03:46 PM
As a Human Male AT, I can do it all and do. "Twirling whips around" is just fine, esp. when there are many enemies around. Whip + madoog equals yay!. When using a whip, you aren't just doing massive damage (only vs. groups I know), you are also inflicting SE. Balanced w/support on a madoog and dualies in your palette...you have a char that can hit anything, and do everything. AT can do it all as a Human. Max potential lies not just in support.

erickarim
Dec 14, 2007, 04:11 PM
i think AT should be allowed to exclusively use nurse outfits.....




j/k

Sexy_Raine
Dec 14, 2007, 04:26 PM
Anyone who thinks they are awesome spamming lv20 skills and bullets without using any of the support need to GTFO. Use everything the class has to offer and not spam the same bullshit, cause that AT will be worthless in a party in they don't do so. I cannot stand people abusing AT like a fighter class, and makes me want to kick out of a party

I use a little of everything, support, offense techs, cards, whips, and sabers. I only have 2 melee PA's on my list, Rising Strike and Visha Grudda and use them under certain situations only. I sit back and watch everyone in the party with my support, and use whatever I feel is good vs. a certain enemy.

Ryno
Dec 14, 2007, 04:31 PM
Support Acrotechers rock!

Shadow_Wing
Dec 14, 2007, 04:32 PM
On 2007-12-14 13:31, Ryno wrote:
Support Acrotechers rock!



Yes, yes they do.

Oh and since I got tired of all the bawwwing, help me out on completing my acrotecher guide by giving input http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif here (http://www.pso-world.com/viewtopic.php?topic=163462&forum=22&14)

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Shadow_Wing on 2007-12-14 13:33 ]</font>

Akaimizu
Dec 14, 2007, 04:36 PM
Yes they do. And I'm trying really hard to get my Support techs up, I really am. Just that playing GT up until the expansion (a 2nd job killed my time as Force, to catch up) has definitely left me a bit behind in getting those techs up. As of right now, they're definitely on their way to the 21 mark, but I need more time to just buff/debuff like crazy. I want to be Jellen like a Felon....and other stuff.