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napalmB
Jan 1, 2008, 06:40 PM
Wow. I've been using twin handguns since the start of my character and not one of the bullets its past level 6, while I have melee PAs that are already level 15. What the hell? Is it like this for all ranged weapons. If it is, then I might as well become a fortefighter because I have absolutely NO intention of grinding whatsoever. Not for base exp, job exp and certainly not for PA exp.

While I'm at it, can you guys and gals tell me other PAs that take that long to level so I can avoid them from now?

Zael
Jan 1, 2008, 06:46 PM
All bullets and techs take an excessively long time to level :/

Aviendha
Jan 1, 2008, 06:46 PM
The only ranged weapons that level with any kind of speed are Bow/Cards, because they're "force" weapons and forces would never get them to a decent level otherwise.

Travis IV
Jan 1, 2008, 06:51 PM
well i am a fortegunner, and depending on when you started playing nothing past 6 seems pretty bad. i played for a bit toay and started lvling twin burn for my new arb biso, and got lvl 7 for it in about 2.5 hours or so. i also have twin dark almost capped. in my opinion granade launcher is tough unless your AOEing groups of enemies. laser cannons are toughest though

GoldRidley
Jan 1, 2008, 06:52 PM
I agree. The only sane way to do it is swallow one's pride and AFK level your bullets. It's a pain to set up for a while, but once you know what spawns you're looking for (in Scarred Planet S, ideally), and you have all your tech set up, it's well worth your effort.

Apone
Jan 1, 2008, 07:15 PM
Leveling all your twin handgun bullets past 31 is a labor of love....BUT I HATED IT! only 2 more elements to go....
Instead of leveling them for the sole sake of leveling them, add another goal to it like raising a level or hunting an item. Grinding is a little less bad when there is the potential for multiplw rewards instead of just one.

Jakosifer
Jan 1, 2008, 07:18 PM
Yea I hate bullet leveling, especially Xbows from 1-11, seriously that has to be the most boring thing ever. >_<

RedMussel
Jan 1, 2008, 07:44 PM
On 2008-01-01 16:18, Jakomay_07 wrote:
Yea I hate bullet leveling, especially Xbows from 1-11, seriously that has to be the most boring thing ever. >_<

*IS the most boringest thing ever. lol

Golto
Jan 1, 2008, 07:45 PM
For easier twin handgun lvling buy a bunch of 1* yohmei twin handguns and use the safe spots in the highest rank of Plains Overlord you can do. That can go for most guns too.

Gunslinger-08
Jan 1, 2008, 08:12 PM
well, if you get 90 frags, twin penetration and penetrating hit level like a dream.

HaydenX
Jan 1, 2008, 08:17 PM
On 2008-01-01 16:44, RedMussel wrote:

On 2008-01-01 16:18, Jakomay_07 wrote:
Yea I hate bullet leveling, especially Xbows from 1-11, seriously that has to be the most boring thing ever. >_<

*IS the most boringest thing ever. lol



Uh-uh....levels 12-21 are the most annoying and boring.

Oh...and Anga Jabroga is pretty damn slow.

Shadow559er
Jan 1, 2008, 08:21 PM
I was a Fighgunner, and used a my single handgun a lot with Freeze Hit. In about 3-4 weeks of some pretty serious playing, but just going about my normal playing, I got Freeze Hit to 22. It really didn't take that long, but I used my handgun a lot to hit every enemy before they were all killed, so maybe that is why I leveled it so fast. I did not use any other method besides just playing normal missions.

Criss
Jan 1, 2008, 08:22 PM
On 2008-01-01 17:12, Gunslinger-08 wrote:
well, if you get 90 frags, twin penetration and penetrating hit level like a dream.

Is the att % mod still as uselessly low?

Jakosifer
Jan 1, 2008, 08:36 PM
On 2008-01-01 17:17, HaydenX wrote:

On 2008-01-01 16:44, RedMussel wrote:

On 2008-01-01 16:18, Jakomay_07 wrote:
Yea I hate bullet leveling, especially Xbows from 1-11, seriously that has to be the most boring thing ever. >_<

*IS the most boringest thing ever. lol



Uh-uh....levels 12-21 are the most annoying and boring.

Oh...and Anga Jabroga is pretty damn slow.



12-21 are annoying and boring as well yes, but thats TWO bullets, meaning its actually somewhat funner and *seems* a bit faster. One bullet that fires slow anyway = Dull/Lame/Fail Etc etc...

And Jabroga levels moderately fast on De Ragans tail using a high % Fire Weaksauce/Yohmei axe.

GreenArcher
Jan 1, 2008, 08:57 PM
Well...look at this way

If Bullets and TECHNICs didn't take forever to level, the high level characters would have absolutely nothing to do http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

HandOfThornz
Jan 1, 2008, 09:15 PM
i absolutely hate leveling bullets, up i wish i wasnt so found of gunner classes.lol!
Worst/boring/mind numbing thing i had to level was megistar to lvl20 for my GT, that really was painfully.I've started rifles finally, and damn them they take just as long,grrrrrr

seriously though hunter classes pa's level up much quicker than bullet and tech pa's. and with a little cash you can make 40%-50% elemental weapons quite easily now. bullets(lvl31+) stop around 30-40% elemental.
Mellee in general as well does far more dameage than bullets.
I hope one day gunner pa's dont take so long to level up.
RSI anyone http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wink.gif

RACast_Raiden
Jan 1, 2008, 09:23 PM
if you hate Bullet/Tech levelling then Ranger and Force Type classes are not for you.

Go stick to Hunter type classes.

ljkkjlcm9
Jan 1, 2008, 09:37 PM
the difference is people are suppose to use regular melee attacks. It's just that people don't very often. Bullets/techs are your only way of attacking. If they leveled as fast as melee skills which are suppose to be special and not used constantly, it would be pretty dumb.

THE JACKEL

pikachief
Jan 1, 2008, 10:24 PM
i dont remember EVER using twin hadnguns in this game...

I checked my PAs and I have all of them except for ice and ground to lvl 21+! XD lol

and this was during the seabed days.... i was like WTF? lol http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif

Telina
Jan 1, 2008, 10:30 PM
http://www.pso-world.com/viewtopic.php?topic=165545&forum=20

Just hope for the third bullet under Guardian's boost road to become a reality. But yea, they level slowly because they are the only method of attacks that rangers have, short of non-elemental bullets.

Inazuma
Jan 1, 2008, 11:28 PM
bullets are easy to level. easier than skills or techs imo. switch to a type that gains pp faster or has a lower pp cost, use a weak wep w/ a high pp regen rate, equip bullet save and pp generate, and use the very easy to set up polty method. then go to work, or to sleep. wake up to many levels. the less you play psu, the faster your bullets will level http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

techs level fast too but its a lot more complicated to set em up correctly.

GuardianElite
Jan 1, 2008, 11:36 PM
On 2008-01-01 20:28, Inazuma wrote:
bullets are easy to level. easier than skills or techs imo. switch to a type that gains pp faster or has a lower pp cost, use a weak wep w/ a high pp regen rate, equip bullet save and pp generate, and use the very easy to set up polty method. then go to work, or to sleep. wake up to many levels. the less you play psu, the faster your bullets will level http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

techs level fast too but its a lot more complicated to set em up correctly.


Techs do not lv fast xp

Telina
Jan 1, 2008, 11:39 PM
if your talking about AFK leveling, keep it. we're not saying they're not easy to level, anything is easy to level. But we're talking about how long they take to level. I hit 9 monsters with 4 megid balls and it gained 1 percent. I think your confusing relative ease of leveling with the leveling pace

Akaimizu
Jan 1, 2008, 11:46 PM
I think the wierd special method only works on PCs. If that's what you mean about levelling bullets. They take a good while, depending on the guns you want to use, and even more so, the guns in your class.

Of course, the thing is, in general you need to level all your elemental bullets of the guns you like to use the most. Some guns and gun access have quicker levelling. Some are slow as dirt, like certain techs. If you're a twin-handgun fan, I will state the truth that you'll probably be levelling all your bullets and that it should take about 600 direct hours of using mainly those bullets to get them to 30. Add on quite a bit of time to take them from 30 to 31. No need to concern yourself, right now, with higher than that.

Of course, this translates to a whole lot more hours of playtime considering you wont generally be using Twins with that level of frequency in your actual gaming, these days. I made the test, early, by getting a couple of elemental Twin handgun bullets to 30 while actually timing their use. (appx. 80hrs each for 1-30) Crossbows and stuff weren't always available, you know. It's best not to make them a chore. Twinnies are a labor of love, but in general just use them against proper monsters as much as you can. Every once in a while you might see them get close to a significant level, and you concentrate time to push them over the edge; but between that, just try to go with the elements or see how well you can status effect with them at a distance. They do pay off, eventually.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Akaimizu on 2008-01-01 20:55 ]</font>

pikachief
Jan 1, 2008, 11:52 PM
On 2008-01-01 20:28, Inazuma wrote:
bullets are easy to level. easier than skills or techs imo. switch to a type that gains pp faster or has a lower pp cost, use a weak wep w/ a high pp regen rate, equip bullet save and pp generate, and use the very easy to set up polty method. then go to work, or to sleep. wake up to many levels. the less you play psu, the faster your bullets will level http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

techs level fast too but its a lot more complicated to set em up correctly.



U cant compare skills to techjs or bullets in terms of lvling ever because they always lvl up WAAAAYYYY faster than both of those XD

Shiro_Ryuu
Jan 2, 2008, 12:01 AM
I'm a fighter and I don't mind leveling techs. I just do some Sleeping Warriors S2 where there are a bunch of Badiras and spam away. I got Megid and Barta to 21 with this mission.

Telina
Jan 2, 2008, 12:09 AM
megid at 21? grats, now get it to 40 http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif But the underlying premise here is that techs and bullets require special circumstances to level up at any acceptable pace. and for the most part, hunters require only two or three enemies with enough hp to take some hits. level barta or a prism bullet off of single mobs and you'll be insane quick quickly

Gunslinger-08
Jan 2, 2008, 12:29 AM
On 2008-01-01 17:22, Criss wrote:

On 2008-01-01 17:12, Gunslinger-08 wrote:
well, if you get 90 frags, twin penetration and penetrating hit level like a dream.

Is the att % mod still as uselessly low?


Yeah, but you end up dealing out a lot more as a total. Think of them as miniature laser cannons, weaker, but ones that let you strafe, and leave a hand free (handgun).

To be honest, though. I ended up getting them out of curiosity as to their usefulness. I wouldn't go and get them unless you have nothing else worth saving up for at that time.

Inazuma
Jan 2, 2008, 12:57 AM
before i go to sleep/work i will spend around 15 mins to setup afk. and then i will return 2/3 of a day later to a good 10-15 levels of a PA. so thats 10-15 levels in 15 mins time. if you look at it that way, its pretty dam fast. thats what i meant when i said bullets and techs level the fastest.

Akaimizu
Jan 2, 2008, 01:06 AM
Too bad I can't do that on the 360 version. hehe. But I guess they do want me to do it the regular way, you know. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wink.gif

Telina
Jan 2, 2008, 01:08 AM
that hardly counts as legit, that requires the use of an outside program to press the button over and over. And just casue your not there for it doesn't mean it takes less time mind you. Just cause leveling hunter skills require you to move around and seek enemies is hardly grounds to dub it harder to level. Just the fact that to level the skills effectively you need to develop such stratigies and utilize these outside resources is evidence to my point.

Jife_Jifremok
Jan 2, 2008, 02:48 AM
Heh. Try leveling boma maga...

VanHalen
Jan 2, 2008, 03:14 AM
Just pretend like they never level at all. You'll be at level 10 in no time. Then you'll realize depending on the gun you have that your close to it actually doing something cool examples like SE3 or extra bullet you'll notice the crawl speed again http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

darkante
Jan 2, 2008, 04:06 AM
If there is one gunner weapon bullet leveling that needs to be changed.
Then it would be rifle..why?
Cause itīs easily outdamaged by most things and takes the most time to level too.
Say how many situations you need the rifle seeing how you can just bring out a shotgun and lay out the hurt 4-5 times more on one shot.

I wish ST just added shorter bullet leveling time on rifle and i would be very happy.
I love my FG class and rifles the mos but takes to damn long time to level.

EMPYREAN
Jan 2, 2008, 04:35 AM
im an FG but IMO all bullets exept the rifle and laser LVs fast. and i have never afk Lvd them. as an example, it took me 3 days playing approx 6H every day to get the xbow dark bullet to 21. and to me thats fast. u just need to consentrate on 1 bullet for 1 wep at the time.

amtalx
Jan 2, 2008, 07:42 AM
On 2008-01-02 01:35, EMPYREAN wrote:
im an FG but IMO all bullets exept the rifle and laser LVs fast. and i have never afk Lvd them. as an example, it took me 3 days playing approx 6H every day to get the xbow dark bullet to 21. and to me thats fast. u just need to consentrate on 1 bullet for 1 wep at the time.



It seems fast until you have to level a melee skill. In the time it took you to get that Xbow bullet to 21, you could have gotten 3 melee skills to 21. I didn't realize how easy it is being a fighter until I decided to fill out my fGs melee offense.

Reipard
Jan 2, 2008, 08:27 AM
Bullet leveling does need to be sped up by at least 50%. I know it has to be your regular attack and all but it doesn't need to be this slow.

Akaimizu
Jan 2, 2008, 08:40 AM
Really, it depends on the bullet. Force-based ranged weapons don't need a speed up. (Bows, Cards). There's also a few others that are decently fast. Crossbows hit that category because the slow speed of levelling them is really only the first ten levels. They endure moderate levelling pace at 11-20 and are quite fast at 21-40. By far, easiest to level to for a Gunner's ranged weapon. 1-10 for a xbow is a bit painful, but only to those who really haven't invested Twin Handgun or Rifle elemental levelling. For those coming from rifle or twinnies, the 1-10 on xbow is more like average levelling speed while 11-20 is above average and 21+ is way above average.

Lasers, on the other hand, have nice things about them now. For one, the new missions and the AOI strengthening of cannons aid their levelling. Very easy to spam a session of a big group of enemies, constantly tagging them all with lasers, these days. In fact, I'll soon have to get back to doing that as soon as I top off my Acrotecher. I reached 11 so my trip to 15 is coming very soon.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Akaimizu on 2008-01-02 05:45 ]</font>

amtalx
Jan 2, 2008, 09:50 AM
Personally, I don't really have a problem with how long it takes to level bullets. It's pretty much the only thing I have left to do. The thing that is annoying is how easy it is for fighters. A good gunner will need twice as many PAs as a fighter, and it takes 3x as long to level. Making fighter PAs take longer would even it out...but then all the fighters would start menstruating.

Rashiid
Jan 2, 2008, 09:53 AM
On 2008-01-01 23:48, Jife_Jifremok wrote:
Heh. Try leveling zonde...



Indeed.

jobber
Jan 2, 2008, 10:21 AM
I've been using Twin Burn for over a year and it's just level 33 which is my highest bullet PA. My Dark Shot is around level 27, but it's far and away my best PA. It infects within 2 shots + the damage with a 5/10 phantom, level 30 shifta, and phantom line is ridiculous.

desturel
Jan 2, 2008, 10:23 AM
On 2008-01-01 17:36, Jakomay_07 wrote:

On 2008-01-01 17:17, HaydenX wrote:
Uh-uh....levels 12-21 are the most annoying and boring.

Oh...and Anga Jabroga is pretty damn slow.



12-21 are annoying and boring as well yes, but thats TWO bullets, meaning its actually somewhat funner and *seems* a bit faster. One bullet that fires slow anyway = Dull/Lame/Fail Etc etc...

And Jabroga levels moderately fast on De Ragans tail using a high % Fire Weaksauce/Yohmei axe.



40% fire Aksuc on de ragan. Got jabroga from 1-6 in one fight. Dugrega is a work in progress. Level 4 so far. Melee arts are silly easy to level so I only do it in my spare time.

For bullets Barada Riga, Inga, and Yoga are all at 31. Frozen Shot, Dark Shot, and Killer Shot are 31. Twin freeze and twin burn 31. Yak Banga and Yak Zagza are next on the range end.

For techs, barta, diga, foie, dambarta, damfoie, damdiga, resta, reverser, shifta, deband, zodial, retier, giresta are at 31. Next up for techs are zonde and the ra-spells. Probably ramegid first.

ensei-shiki, raisei-shiki, reisei-shiki, insei-shiki, are all 31. I'm not a guntecher anymore so I haven't finished off the rest of the cards. They level fast though.

Ensei-sou, Reisei-sou, Insei-sou are 31. Like with the cards, I'd need to go back to guntecher to finish the others off to 31. Unfortunately techs take priority.

Anyway, fortefighter is a good class, so their's no problem with sticking to that class if you don't like leveling techs and bullets. After a while when you have all of your fighter PA's maxed out, you might want to go to Fighgunner to level up crossbow and twin handguns while still dishing out the pain with your level 40 melee.



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: desturel on 2008-01-02 07:56 ]</font>

Gen2000
Jan 2, 2008, 10:54 AM
Techs and Bullets leveling as fast as Melee? What the...

Maybe lv.1-10 is fast otherwise a majority of them level at an unnecessary slow speed. There is a little hope once you pass the 11/21/31 mark but then for some reason the speed slows down again as you get closer to the next tier or lv.40. Also unlike melee you can't really level techs/bullets in random games because you will be doing ass damage unless you're using the correct element. You know like using Zonde on every mob or a random element Rifle bullet the majority of the mission.

Melee PAs works no matter what type of element, imo that's where ST fucked up on when trying to "balance" to leveling speeds of these PAs. I guess they assumed Fortegunners would use Plasma Shot on everything or FTs use Megid, etc, etc. I dunno. The speed is just right with Bow, Cards, and Grenade (this actually levels fast if you can actually find a multi-target monster to take the pain long enough). Regrant was probably the best thing to happen to techs speed leveling wise, too bad it's a sucky compared to your most used ones.

I don't mind leveling a skill but at the point when I log on I spend a majority of my time locked up in Sleeping Warriors/Plains Overlord shooting/nuking away that's weak. When I log on I should be ready to play some missions but I know if that's all I did I wouldn't have nearly as much 31+ PAs as I do now. AFK'ing can only help so much and sometimes I actually just want to play the game. The fact that Gunner/Techers have to even resort to this should speak about the leveling speeds.


it took me 3 days playing approx 6H every day to get the xbow dark bullet to 21. and to me thats fast.

You serious? 6 hours for 3 days is fast? Maybe compared to other bullets, most melee PAs can get lv.21+ in 6 hours.

Helly
Jan 2, 2008, 04:43 PM
I got Giresta from L1 to L30 in under 3 hours today! Wish alot more stuff leveled that fast. @_@ I still don't have a Rifle bullet at L30 even though those have been my most used weapons since the very beginning!


On 2008-01-01 21:01, Shiroryuu wrote:
I'm a fighter and I don't mind leveling techs. I just do some Sleeping Warriors S2 where there are a bunch of Badiras and spam away. I got Megid and Barta to 21 with this mission.

Is it reallys that easy to get Barta up high? I hate going to a S2's alone~ but I'll try that.

darkante
Jan 2, 2008, 05:13 PM
You canīt believe the relief i feelt when i got to finally max Fire rifle bullets.
So sick of the red colour now lol.

Time to level killer Shot 15-21 and then level the bullet of my choise. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif

Seira7
Jan 2, 2008, 05:29 PM
I don't mind leveling a skill but at the point when I log on I spend a majority of my time locked up in Sleeping Warriors/Plains Overlord shooting/nuking away that's weak. When I log on I should be ready to play some missions but I know if that's all I did I wouldn't have nearly as much 31+ PAs as I do now. AFK'ing can only help so much and sometimes I actually just want to play the game. The fact that Gunner/Techers have to even resort to this should speak about the leveling speeds.




Yup, that was really well said. Ive given up on my GT for a while, not because I dont love playing the class, but because bullets are so tedious to level.
I dont feel like shelling out the cash for an auto fire controller for my 360 just for the purpose of afk leveling bullets in one game. For the people that got all their bullets level 40 the old fashioned way, I salute you, but PSU should be fun, not mind numbing...at least thats how I feel. Maybe because I have limited time to play, and I dont want to log on only to spam the same mission over and over leveling a bullet =( I want to relax and enjoy the game XD.

Zuurr
Jan 2, 2008, 11:16 PM
Did you ever notice you don't NEED to level up bullets, you can just play normally and let the bullets level themselves up.

unicorn
Jan 3, 2008, 03:31 AM
Its just ridiculous the lvling time of some skills.

I spent lvling zonde from 23 to 31. Thats it for the day. No play time. All I got was a shiney skill thats very situational. Heaven forbid I try to level that up in a party without being booted by some "elitist".

The problem with leveling bullets/technics is that they're much more situational than melee. You can enter a party as a hunter with skills on level 1, and no one would make no mention about it. However, if a gunner is just spamming rifles in a party, he probably wouldn't be very appreciated. Imagine a techer just spamming gi-techs on everything? Yeah.
Meanwhile, a hunter can spam lvl 1 Buten and get away with it for the whole mission. Not to mention gain 1-2 levels for it, in the same time it takes a gunner/techer to only get 20% (or less).



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: super_luu on 2008-01-03 00:31 ]</font>

Finae
Jan 3, 2008, 03:47 AM
Never had problems with lvling bullets as I normally did it in parties. Uh, I ain't that retarded to go into solitude for about 5 years just so I can get some bullets to 31.

Technics though, a different story but as of late, thats been easy due to many reasons I won't say (uh yeah, I really don't feel like telling my life story here) so I would put bullets as more of a annoyance if I had to choose. If you know where and how to lvl x technics efficiently, they'll lvl pretty fast considering the one you're doing. For example, zonde only took me from 9 am to about 12-1pmish from 21>31 back then. Not really accurate when compared to barta since I had the map with the 4 robot cast and barta had the 5 cast map. 31>40 a breeze too for those types of techs. And nope, I dont do SW or PO, I got better places.

The only technic I had a serious problem with was megiverse. 30>31 seemed like years.

Silver_Wyrm
Jan 3, 2008, 04:18 AM
wish there was an auto-fire for keyboartd, moreso I wish the bullets simply lvl'd faster >.>

on my Ff I can spam a pa in any situation without anyone caring and get a ton of exp and lvl pretty fast (some may be slow but not many) nwith my GT if Im using a "bad" element I get yelled at, so I often need to switch to the "right" element which results in having a ton of under lvl 10 bullets and some less used elements barely able to do anything.

Not only do bullets take longer than skills to level, but gunners have to have MORE bullets PER weapon, hell for twins alone I have more bullets than skills I use on my hunter (I have 6 I mainly use, the ones on my pallette) and each takes longer than one of those skills >_< I really want to play my GT but the thoguh of tyring to lvl those bullets makes me balk, and they dont just "level" as I do, at least not very well, it took me to 25 to get one of my twin bullets alone to 11, and my other bullets are lacking because i focused..