So I finally tried it...Final Fantasy XI

[InfinityXXX]

So out the blue one day, my old friend from HS called and told me "Ay I got FFXI, u wanna play with my buddy pass)

And looking at how crazy my life has been (recording in the studio, school, friends, family)..I decided to give myself a break and take his offer

Now before I go on...I have been wanting to play FFXI ever since it came out..but due to me never owning a credit card (or debit) I've never had the chance to play...until now, I had forgotten that the game existed...so I was a bit happy at the chance of being to play it.......

But that joy was soon turned to anger and frustration after about 2 weeks of playing.......

Now, I'm not trying to knock the game...it is a good game (a bit too pricy) but it depends on what type of person you are....and what type of gamer you are..on how good this game is to you....and for me....I left FFXI with a sour taste in my mouth.....

The first shocker...was the character customization...for some odd reason (thinking that this was a game made by SE) I had this crazy idea that the character customization was gonna be good (not necessarily City of Heroes and Perfect World good....but better than Ragnarok and Flyff). I was a bit saddened at the thoguht of being showed..."pictures" to create my characters with and not that much I can do with my character (pick random faces...and the black human avatar was straight jacked....stale dredlocks...)

But it was still good...I made a Mithra (go ahead and make your jokes lol) and started to "try" to enjoy the game...

The actual concept was really nice.. I liked the Class Sysem and the ability to sub jobs and get advanced jobs...I also didn't mind the fighting (it was a bit dragged) and the enviroments were spacy and the music actually fit the area......

But i think what made me hate this game was when I HAD to party to actually level....

I didn't mind partying, I actually like to party with people in mmorpgs but I only party in games when a.) I have the time, and b.) I'm in a party mood....not only that but to party in this game...takes a lot of hard work, determination, and patience.....and I didn't really ahve the patience to wait 1-3 hours to create a party...another 10-20 minutes to get to where your at...another 10-20 minutes for other party members to get to where your at....and then, for the party to disband after a good 30min-1hr of actual partying....all my efforts felt wasted JUST to wind up getting killed and possibly d-level...just to fight the same damn lizards/goblins/seedthingy...After a while i became irritable and frustrated from trying to party and having the parties fail...and I just gave up...simple as that....

.Its a good game and I can see how some people enjoy it...but its not good for me and to me.....

[Zorafim]

All the things you ranted about get worse as you level up. It takes some people weeks to get a party, it can take half an hour to get to where you need, you can't even solo enemies ten levels lower than you (I was killed by a bee. Seriously, a bee.), and you're still fighting the same crabs at lv70 as you are at lv5.
The game has potential, but leave and don't look back. I have many fond memories of the game, but I can't play it anymore.

[DizzyDi]

At least it only took a couple weeks of your life.
I played the game for about a year before I quit. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_disapprove.gif

[Chaosgyro]

Never played FFXI, but that sounds like the same problem Everquest had only magnified. I love the depth and breadth of those types of MMOs, but hell if I just don't have that kind of time anymore. We can't all live in front of our computers, selling the stuff we find in game on ebay to pay the rent, after all.

[xeku]

I hear you too...
I actually still play from time to time - it's a nice relaxing game if you have time to blow....say for instance, an entire weekend free to yourself, and no other interests outside of FFXI - lol!
As a result, my characters may forever be stuck at level 20-30...
Non-solo friendly gameplay is usually a deal breaker for me (I like time to myself too), but I keep going back. Must be the Mithra's http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wink.gif

[Garroway]

I actually like the first 10-15 levels of FFXI. After that it becomes too much of a commitment for me.

[Zorafim]

On 2008-01-21 12:42, xeku wrote:
say for instance, an entire year free to yourself, and no other interests outside of FFXI - lol!


That's a bit more accurate. It takes days or weeks of planning to do anything worthwhile, and anything minor still takes hours of planning. A company should keep in mind that they've failed to produce a game when it's no longer a game.

[xeku]

On 2008-01-21 16:08, Zorafim wrote:

On 2008-01-21 12:42, xeku wrote:
say for instance, an entire year free to yourself, and no other interests outside of FFXI - lol!


That's a bit more accurate. It takes days or weeks of planning to do anything worthwhile, and anything minor still takes hours of planning. A company should keep in mind that they've failed to produce a game when it's no longer a game.




True enough...I was being a bit generous I suppose.
I have a few buds that are hoplessly hooked on the game.
They are willing to "baby-sit" me as I solo (slog) my way through, and graciously bestow me with gifts (heh, leftover low-level crap that they have no use for...but hey, it works). I could actually acomplish something over a weekend....well, by FFXI standards anyhow http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif
But this is a luxury - I don't generally have to hunt for a party (which is a major time sink for most players).

[McLaughlin]

I loved being a Paladin, but all those shitty NIN tanks made it a bitch to get into a party.

[Mystil]

I do not miss FFXI. There is more frustration to partying than the time needed to get in one and get things rolling. There's bad tanks, bad players, people wanting to fight "downtime" mobs(i.e goblins, flies, anything that spams AOE for stupid damage). And you don't know how bad things can REALLY be until you get to HNMLS scene.

[McLaughlin]

Just an addendum to the game's death penalty: It's the harshest in any MMO I've ever played. I have friends who play WoW and when I tell horror stories their jaws drop when I remind them of the EPX penalty after the initial, "Oh, well it's only a death..."

It actually wrecks a day's worth of work when you get up near the cap.

[Mystil]

The xp penalty on death is not as bad as it used to be, even at higher levels(max being about 2400 without Raise III(with it I believe is only 900xp)). However, you don't wont to die ALOT in a short amount of time..because good luck trying to get it back. Yea.. That said.. poor BLMs. They lose more XP than any class in the game and have the hardest time getting back(they can't get parties).

[McLaughlin]

I invited a BLM for an EXP party in Bhaflau Thickets once. Told him we could use the extra healing power (no WHM, RDM wanted help). First thing he did to the Colibri was cast Burst. First thing I did after getting Raised was eject him.

Paladins lose more EXP than any other class. We depend on healers, and there aren't nearly enough competent ones around.

[Kent]

The biggest problems with FFXI were two things:

The limited way for gaining experience (you can party, unless you've got the money/time to get a job combo that can solo).

The time investment required for advancement.

Now, if a game of a similar style were made, except its combat system was more along the lines of FFXII's (that is, you can readily solo things and it's faster-paced), and for example, the different Hunts could be EXP-granting quests... Then we'd have something good.

In fact, I hope that's what Square's next MMO project is like.

[Chaosgyro]

Truthfully, I'm sick of quests. Let me just hunt the monsters I want to hunt in the place I want to hunt them in peace. Save the quests for the truly interesting (maybe epic, but at least interesting) bits of story and interaction with the world.

When I 'quest' I don't want to go around the corner and look for wolf tails, I want to go halfway across the world and look for little pieces of scroll to get translatated so I know how to open Ye Olde Ancient Tomb. hmm...maybe I'm betraying the fact that my first college major was archeology http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

[Sord]

I just watched the game for an hour while a friend played and decided this game was not worth playing in my book.

[InfinityXXX]

On 2008-01-22 12:39, Kent wrote:

Now, if a game of a similar style were made, except its combat system was more along the lines of FFXII's (that is, you can readily solo things and it's faster-paced), and for example, the different Hunts could be EXP-granting quests... Then we'd have something good.

In fact, I hope that's what Square's next MMO project is like.



Exactly my point too. The game has a lot of neat things going for it (i actually like the gameplay and the class system *gameplay can be sped up though and more skills)

But as far as the forced partying, the lack of customization, and then the exp loss (i can imagine how it is at higher levels lol)..it just makes my efforts feel wasted...

(But I would say that a game that has worse exp penalties is FLyff...try dying when your lv 70-80.... ) I've heard that City of heroes have a harsh xp penalty too...but i didn't play long enough to experience it...

[BogusKun]

Get to level 70+ with a Monk... then the REAL complaining begins.
It was SO hard to be in a party with high level characters because back when I played (over 2 years ago), the MNK and WAR characters had a hard time playing on teams... Strategically speaking: Those Monks are power only characters with Red Mages, then, being the powerhouse and most demanding alongside the Paladin and Ranger characters, you were either:

1: waiting prolonged periods of time to play on a team...
2: getting jacked prices on items
3: limited to few of the "cool" items
4: getting random invites by suck-ass players every minute.
5: end up with a fairly decent line-up... only having them all suck and quit on you. sometimes they even boot you when they have a teammate... not even letting you know they're booting you... at least the Japanese players didn't pull that crap off in the past.

I'd say... being a monk, you put yourself through a lot. I didn't like the outcome... but getting past 70 was all I needed... and I said eff you to that game... eff you.

[Spacepest]

I just had this discussion on another thread about MMORPGs on another section of this site, in which I ranted about FFXI's crappiness, especially compared to newer MMORPGs like World of Warcraft. I'll just copy and paste my replies:

Right now I play PSU and WoW. I haven't played FFXI in along time...FFXI to me, has to be one of the biggest MMORPG disappointments I've ever played. Beautiful game, horrible gameplay. WoW might have the lesser graphics of the current MMORPGs, but at least the graphics that are in game have style and whimsy, and the developers make do with what they have (unlike say, EQ2, a graphics intensive monster PC is needed to play that game, and still it looks horrible), and the game if fun to play, even for the casual player.

Now if I could find a game that combined the gameplay of WoW (leveling up easy to do solo, or in party, pvp options, massive dungeons with raids for small parties are huge 40 man groups, fun crafting, and a huge, gorgeous world to explore, on top of the important areas instanced so they can't be flooded and held on lockdown with asshat gold/gil farmers like FFXI, and a responsive GM and development team) with the graphics of PSU I'd be totally stoked. But I haven't come across anything like that yet, so I spend my time between WoW and PSU.


Also, my complaints about the poor server integrations between JP/USA players and the crappy experience loss due to death penalties, and how it ultimately effected the game:

That's another reason I quit FFXI. Any time after 8pm on the USA servers, the game died off for english speaking players. So you know, basically right around the time I was getting off work. I played white and red mage, and even as white mage I had a hard time find parties after 8pm. And the JP players almost never would party with a USA player due to communication issues, despite the in game translator.

I can't even begin to tell you how many times I logged in after 9 pm somewhere to see dozens of damaged dealing classes with JP players, who all needed a white mage to party with. And there I was with my white mage, with no damage dealers or other classes to party with. It was frustrating as all hell, (and I eventually just said "eff it" when my friend sent me a trial version of WoW), and all because of that stupid game mechanic of "losing experience and possibly deleveling when you die." If there was any one game mechanic that needed to changed or fixed in FFXI, that one would be it. People in that game were fearful of trying out new party set ups, or partying with unknown people in general or venturing out in new areas due to possible experience loss. If death was just that in the game--death, no exp loss--then IMHO, it would open up the game to so many more players. NOthing more frustrating than taking 4 hours to gain a level, only to lose it later due to a couple of party wipes.

Seriously, the death penalty in this game is just so harsh and unnecessary. I think this game would have attracted and have kept alot more players if they simply would remove the experience loss as a death penalty. Then people could make some REAL progress in game, and not just keep up a slow grind of level/delevel for years just to maybe reach level cap. People would be a lot more forgiving of this game's shortcomings if the game mechanics allowed for a much more natural progression in leveling.

[Shiro_Ryuu]

I'm currently trying FFXI trial out, mostly from friends who kind of made me curious about the game and made me want to try it out. I remember one time, Obsidian_Knight warned me that I shouldn't try it, but I tried it out anyway. Well, it was a pain in the ass at first, but I began to get the hang of it. Well, the diverse array of jobs and such are very interesting, but the deleveling thing is pretty harsh. I was a bit pissed when I died, and de-leveled, and had to work my way back up there again. But the community of that game seem to be nicer than the community of PSU. Like, I was doing some soloing, I was pretty low on HP and some random dude was all like "Oh, he's low on HP, I'm gonna heal this dude. *casts Cure*". I was like "Thanks", and he was like "No problem". I didn't even know this dude, yet he just healed me like that. That was pretty awesome of him IMO.

[Chaosgyro]

Don't let WoW fool you: it isn't for the casual.

Sure, levelling is simple and easy to do solo, but what about when you get 60-70 and the real game begins? That's when you need a party for everything. Not just a party, but a guild. A good guild. A good guild that raids (or are pvp specialists) and lets you in their parties.

The endgame of WoW is just like any other MMO. You gather a party of familiar, competent players, which takes one half to several hours, go to a dungeon, which takes a few hours at least, and collect drops. Multiply the time needed by a factor of 3-5 for a raid. In between times for dungeons or raids (which are generally scheduled and set up weeks/months ahead of time in proper guilds) you spend hours and hours farming. This farming is not for advancement in any form, it is to maintain even footing. Raiding requires a plethora of consumable items which must be crafted, from items found by farming. It also requires special elemental resistance equipment sets, which require crafters to enlist the entire guild in farming for materials. The crafter themselves must farm reputation (by killing certain creatures and collecting drops) with some group to be able to purchase the blueprints for these pieces of gear. The guild leaders must then sit down and decide the priority order for members receiving the gear. Then the guild often needs to gather a group and run a non-raid dungeon to reach a certain point where the special crafting location is so the crafter can actually create this situational piece of armor. In the meantime, everyone else is farming for money to keep ahead of the cost of repairing armor from all the deaths that raiding entails - and maybe be able to buy something decent for themselves like a mount.

Oh yeah, and when it's all said and done you still have to spend time screaming at each other trying to convince people who didn't get what they wanted that "it's not about the loot" when they just spent a whole week preparing for this one run.

Yeah...casual my ass.

(note: all of this comes from first hand experience as a guild officer of a premier horde-side raiding guild on Shadow Council server)

[Mystil]

On 2008-01-22 12:17, Obsidian_Knight wrote:
I invited a BLM for an EXP party in Bhaflau Thickets once. Told him we could use the extra healing power (no WHM, RDM wanted help). First thing he did to the Colibri was cast Burst. First thing I did after getting Raised was eject him.

Paladins lose more EXP than any other class. We depend on healers, and there aren't nearly enough competent ones around.


Ironically I quit because of bad ninjas and BLMs not backup healing. You paladins fell off the earth after I got to RDM55 http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif.

LOL! OMG I didn't know colibris could reflect ancient magic.

[Xaeris]

And ironically, I quit because of horrid RDMs. Ninjas really need their support to be on the ball with the Hastes and the paralyze and it just wasn't happening. Bloody hell, I can't blink tank when silenced! You know it's bad when you have to take remedies with you to go level on toramas...

[McLaughlin]

On 2008-01-24 07:28, Mystil wrote:

On 2008-01-22 12:17, Obsidian_Knight wrote:
I invited a BLM for an EXP party in Bhaflau Thickets once. Told him we could use the extra healing power (no WHM, RDM wanted help). First thing he did to the Colibri was cast Burst. First thing I did after getting Raised was eject him.

Paladins lose more EXP than any other class. We depend on healers, and there aren't nearly enough competent ones around.


Ironically I quit because of bad ninjas and BLMs not backup healing. You paladins fell off the earth after I got to RDM55 http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif.

LOL! OMG I didn't know colibris could reflect ancient magic.



What's amusing is, since I'm such a lower level than the Colibris, it hits me several times harder than the BLM hit the Colibri for.

It would have killed me if I'd been at full health (which I wasn't, because we had just killed a Dark Eruca. Flame Breathe. What fun!)

I had one RDM in my party, at level 62, WITH NO RAISE SPELL.

[HiroSan]

lol how funny, my roommate wants me to actually get started on FFXI, i was actually thinking about quitting psu for awhile, but from everything i just read ROFL. I can understand the whole "not being able to find a party" and "wantin to solo" situations, i think the only way u can REALLY enjoy FFXI is if u actually have some friends u can play together AT FIRST. Still debating on what i want to do, but for now i have too many friends on psu that i really dont want to leave :/

[Osaka]

I played FFXI back in the day for a year and then some, I liked it, it's kind of an acquired taste and I like a challenge. Many games these days are just too easy to reach to the top. The level grind, deleveling, and looking for party may be harsh sometimes but when you make friends (the community can be great but there's also assholes there too), get in a good Linkshell, get a good party, it will feel more rewarding and the good things will outweigh the bad. Playing this game is a big time commitment tho...

[Mystil]

On 2008-01-24 08:09, Xaeris wrote:
You know it's bad when you have to take remedies with you to go level on toramas...


Thats because dumbass RDMs spreaded the shit that others don't need to sub /WHM. All the jobs have dumbass popular people who spread bullshit to the aspiring new players and they believe them and do the same crap. -.-