AotI: Thoughts About The Master Class's [Archive]

Darius_Drake

Mar 28, 2008, 03:28 PM

I am also unsure of the master classes.

Fighmaster: I like the though of being able to use both double sabers and axes, but I am denied the use of knuckles and I don't even gain the ability to use twin daggers. This is way to limiting as far as what weapons I can use. I will most likely never use this class. If they wanted to make it rewarding they should have really made it a master melee class so that you could not only use both axes and double sabers, but you could use twin claws, twin daggers, twin sabers, knuckles, spears, and swords (S rank only of course).

Masterforce: Out of the three this is the only one I could currently see myself possibly using. The bad part is this will most likely replace fortetecher as the class for nuking techers. It seems with the other master classes that they were made to encourage the user to be in a party. With the masterforce this seems to be the opposite because the attack spells are more powerful, but the support spells are actually weakened. That would tend to make this the class for the soloing techer. That doesn't make sense to me since the mastergunner and fighmaster classes were seemingly made to encourage team play.

I haven't really done much as a gunner at the moment, so don't really have a gunner style to see if the mastergunner class would be worth it for me.

Dark Emerald EXE

Mar 28, 2008, 03:28 PM

Hmmmim on the US server so iknow we wont get it anytime soon but from what i know....... they seem kinda odd how can u have lvl 50 techs but 10 buffs???? wierd............

hopefully it will b better when it comes to us....or they change it first

Syl

Mar 28, 2008, 03:32 PM

I'm not really enticed by Masterforce or Fighmaster. I don't care that Gunmaster doesn't get grenades (that's all everyone seems to complain about http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_nono.gif) because it looks like a really interesting class to play. The % mods for lvl 41+ bullets are amazing along with SE 5, so I really can't wait for that. Along with the faster bullet shots... <3

These classes are probably going to change sometime in a later fix. I guess they're just trying to see how it fits into the game right now.

chaoskila

Mar 28, 2008, 03:33 PM

w.e if it makes me stronger and i dont have to buff people hey im up for it

Poncho_Jr

Mar 28, 2008, 03:37 PM

I'm all about teching.
Level 50 Attack TECHs are nice, but the level 10 Support???
It IS Materforce.
It should have level 50 on both sides.
It won't outclass fT's or aT's due to the fact that they'll only be able to use teching weapons, and nothing else.

xEndrance

Mar 28, 2008, 03:37 PM

I think out of all the class's Fighmaster will be the best

vfloresjr24

Mar 28, 2008, 03:38 PM

Wasn't there suppose to be a acromaster class? Would that type of class will take care of the buff situation? They can have lv. 50 buffs and lv. 10 techs. I'm not sure I just heard that there was one. Maybe its just a rumor or something. I personally am not happy with the fighmaster class. Hopefully we will see some changes to these class in the future but right now there are not appealing to me and we don't have them yet.

DarkEliteRico

Mar 28, 2008, 03:43 PM

I'm not even gonna touch them, unless they get some fucking godly stats at 20 i don't see a reason to use weapons i can't stand (long swords and double sabers)

Darius_Drake

Mar 28, 2008, 03:45 PM

On 2008-03-28 13:37, Poncho_Jr wrote:
I'm all about teching.
Level 50 Attack TECHs are nice, but the level 10 Support???
It IS Materforce.
It should have level 50 on both sides.
It won't outclass fT's or aT's due to the fact that they'll only be able to use teching weapons, and nothing else.

I feel you. It seems as if the techers that actually use support techs are being punished in this class. If you leveled your support techs up nicely there is almost no point in choosing masterforce.

I have checked out sojme footage on the increase in speed for the gunmaster. That speed boost is huge. That would definitely seem like a good upgrade. The only downside is I feel they should have included grenade launchers. If you aren't a big time grenade launcher user this class would definitely look good. I am now wondering what the speed boosts for masterforce and fighmaster will look like. I am still a little sick that the fighmaster class does not include knuckles. I really love those things. Doing Ikk Hikk with a good speed boost would be sweet.

chaostroop3

Mar 28, 2008, 03:46 PM

masterforce need like at least lev 30 support and like 30 range and 10 skills.... i mean a bow is a force only wepon (other than pro) and cards are force only , fighmaster and master gunner need atleast level 10 range and strick to be able to get threw all the stages

when i say force i mean magic classes

Proto07

Mar 28, 2008, 03:48 PM

On 2008-03-28 13:32, SylviaEspada wrote:
I'm not really enticed by Masterforce or Fighmaster. I don't care that Gunmaster doesn't get grenades (that's all everyone seems to complain about http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_nono.gif) because it looks like a really interesting class to play. The % mods for lvl 41+ bullets are amazing along with SE 5, so I really can't wait for that. Along with the faster bullet shots... <3

These classes are probably going to change sometime in a later fix. I guess they're just trying to see how it fits into the game right now.

I'm not gonna miss the gl that much when I go GM. It was only really useful against dragons. Mobs are too hard to hit unless they're slow and mini bosses don't have too many hit targets. I will miss my spears though. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif Those were my buff enemy and mini boss weps.

panzer_unit

Mar 28, 2008, 03:49 PM

On 2008-03-28 13:28, Darius_Drake wrote:
Masterforce: Out of the three this is the only one I could currently see myself possibly using. The bad part is this will most likely replace fortetecher as the class for nuking techers. It seems with the other master classes that they were made to encourage the user to be in a party. With the masterforce this seems to be the opposite because the attack spells are more powerful, but the support spells are actually weakened.

I dunno... how much better is a Masterforce popping rides versus a Fortetecher who can cast lv40 buffs for themselves and the NPC's.

Syl

Mar 28, 2008, 03:51 PM

chaoskila

Mar 28, 2008, 03:54 PM

i think fortetecher is gonna be for people solo so they can cure and buff themself and still have good spells
but for people like me who party and in partys theres usually a person who is a achrotecher so buffs are unneeded so they might as well just attack really good and not buff at all

Aries2384

Mar 28, 2008, 03:54 PM

Is there somewhere where I can see all the relevent info to the Master classes? I.E.- what weapons they can use, PA lvls etc. etc.

Darius_Drake

Mar 28, 2008, 03:57 PM

On 2008-03-28 13:49, panzer_unit wrote:

On 2008-03-28 13:28, Darius_Drake wrote:
Masterforce: Out of the three this is the only one I could currently see myself possibly using. The bad part is this will most likely replace fortetecher as the class for nuking techers. It seems with the other master classes that they were made to encourage the user to be in a party. With the masterforce this seems to be the opposite because the attack spells are more powerful, but the support spells are actually weakened.

I dunno... how much better is a Masterforce popping rides versus a Fortetecher who can cast lv40 buffs for themselves and the NPC's.

I see your point. The superior buffs may more than make up for the 10 extra levels in your offensive spells. To me the deciding factor might depend on how much of a speed boost the master force gets in casting spells. The speed boost given to the gunmaster seemed unreal. You could shoot a rifle just as fast as anybody else shoots a pistol. If that is the case in casting I would still give the nuking advantage to the masterforce. When looking for a techer to invite to a party though I am sure people will look at a fortetecher in a better way than a masterforce which just seems backwards.

Lighthero

Mar 28, 2008, 03:58 PM

On 2008-03-28 13:45, Darius_Drake wrote:

On 2008-03-28 13:37, Poncho_Jr wrote:
I'm all about teching.
Level 50 Attack TECHs are nice, but the level 10 Support???
It IS Materforce.
It should have level 50 on both sides.
It won't outclass fT's or aT's due to the fact that they'll only be able to use teching weapons, and nothing else.

I feel you. It seems as if the techers that actually use support techs are being punished in this class. If you leveled your support techs up nicely there is almost no point in choosing masterforce.

I agree. I feel that I wasted time getting my buffs to 31 for special causes to actually play AT. I'm FT as main job but go AT IF it's really needed. level 10 support techs gotta be sucky, you probably won't even heal ALL your HP. And you can actually use buff items instead of casting them.

My character is a total techer, but this fucks up, level 10 support techs? That's even worse than Wartecher. letting it the same as the FT's would be nice but having both 50/50 would be awesome!

xEndrance

Mar 28, 2008, 03:59 PM

Yeah but AT will be the Buff/Support and the MasterForce will be a All attack as for a ForteTecher will be the Average therefor they will be over all the best 40/40 comapred to 50/30 or 50/10.... its quite iritating the MasterForce is.....Plus you need to get your warTecher to 10 and you cant even use weps as a MasterForce WTH??

Error?

[ This Message was edited by: xEndrance on 2008-03-28 14:00 ]

Darius_Drake

Mar 28, 2008, 04:00 PM

On 2008-03-28 13:54, Aries2384 wrote:
Is there somewhere where I can see all the relevent info to the Master classes? I.E.- what weapons they can use, PA lvls etc. etc.

http://www.pso-world.com/viewtopic.php?topic=172448&forum=20&754

Located in this thread is a link that also shows a gunmaster in action.

chaoskila

Mar 28, 2008, 04:01 PM

Aries2384

Mar 28, 2008, 04:01 PM

Many thanks for the Master class info!

[ This Message was edited by: Aries2384 on 2008-03-28 14:02 ]

Proto07

Mar 28, 2008, 04:01 PM

On 2008-03-28 13:54, Aries2384 wrote:
Is there somewhere where I can see all the relevent info to the Master classes? I.E.- what weapons they can use, PA lvls etc. etc.

On 2008-03-27 01:08, FOnewearl-Lina wrote:
Guess they're official now... GM1 ATP = GT20 ATP http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif
[spoiler-box]http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y274/FoLina/PSU/1024/psu20080327_210316_000.jpg[/spoiler-box]
[spoiler-box]http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y274/FoLina/PSU/1024/psu20080327_210518_001.jpg[/spoiler-box]
[spoiler-box]http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y274/FoLina/PSU/1024/psu20080327_210521_002.jpg[/spoiler-box]
Time to play around see how much of a speed boost they get on the guns...

xEndrance

Mar 28, 2008, 04:01 PM

MasterGunner looks cool but no GL why!?!? that was like the main wep for big boss's/mobs....they ruin the point =(

xEndrance

Mar 28, 2008, 04:02 PM

The stats are in Japanese just like find the psu jpwiki and look for the class's i would get a link but im at school using a proxy righ now so i cant but later i will

Aries2384

Mar 28, 2008, 04:06 PM

Holy smokes. Look at those stats! MF and GM will be nice indeed. I use a bow rarely as a FT anyway so MF looks pretty good to me.

Darius_Drake

Mar 28, 2008, 04:09 PM

On 2008-03-28 13:59, xEndrance wrote:
Yeah but AT will be the Buff/Support and the MasterForce will be a All attack as for a ForteTecher will be the Average therefor they will be over all the best 40/40 comapred to 50/30 or 50/10.... its quite iritating the MasterForce is.....Plus you need to get your warTecher to 10 and you cant even use weps as a MasterForce WTH??

Error?

[ This Message was edited by: xEndrance on 2008-03-28 14:00 ]

I thought these master classes where supposed to be the top job classes. I thought that being a hunter/ranger/force was what you needed to do to get to the advanced classes like ForteFighter/Techer/Gunner and hybrid classes. The advanced classes were what you needed to become a top class like Masterforce, Gunmaster, and Fighmaster. If this is the case then it seems to me that if you are going to call a class a Masterforce and you won't let them use bows or cards then allow them to master the spells. Something like level 50 offensive spells and level 40 support spells. Make it worth the while of someone who has leveled there fortetecher to 10. If they are going to give up their bows, cards, and guns, I feel it is unreasonable to expect them to accept a severe nerf on their support spells just to be able to level their attack spells up 10 more levels.

Follisimo

Mar 28, 2008, 04:18 PM

Seriously quit thinking so stupidly people. If they made Master Classes the best then no one would bother playing the other classes. They have to find a slight advantage and disadvantage to every class they make. If they didn't there would no need to even have other classes besides masters since everyone would play them. I'm sure Sega might do some rebalancing but nothing huge and drastic.

Each class has a benefit and a weakness if you ever bother to really look at it. The game is about variety.

RemiusTA

Mar 28, 2008, 04:21 PM

On 2008-03-28 13:58, Lighthero wrote:

On 2008-03-28 13:45, Darius_Drake wrote:

On 2008-03-28 13:37, Poncho_Jr wrote:
I'm all about teching.
Level 50 Attack TECHs are nice, but the level 10 Support???
It IS Materforce.
It should have level 50 on both sides.
It won't outclass fT's or aT's due to the fact that they'll only be able to use teching weapons, and nothing else.

I feel you. It seems as if the techers that actually use support techs are being punished in this class. If you leveled your support techs up nicely there is almost no point in choosing masterforce.

I agree. I feel that I wasted time getting my buffs to 31 for special causes to actually play AT. I'm FT as main job but go AT IF it's really needed. level 10 support techs gotta be sucky, you probably won't even heal ALL your HP. And you can actually use buff items instead of casting them.

My character is a total techer, but this fucks up, level 10 support techs? That's even worse than Wartecher. letting it the same as the FT's would be nice but having both 50/50 would be awesome!

Yeah, awesome and broken. The level 10 support is a downside, but in all truth, if your going for damage then it wont make much of a difference. The 10 extra levels of technics not only add more power but also add more range AND targets, which will automatically blow a fortetecher with lv40 support out the water in terms of damage.

Not to mention, it isnt like Masterforce cant RECIEVE lv 50 buffs. There are still Fortetechers and Acrotechers on the game, people. Pop a -ride and keep on stepping.

And lv10 resta can pretty much heal almost all your HP if you have enough TP. Or at least half, which should be good enough for parties, unless your with idiots who cant use a quick -mate when they see your not in position to save them.

If master force had 50/50, there would be absolutely zero reason to play any other class that has the word "Techer" on it. 50/50 would render fortetecher, Wartecher AND acrotecher completely useless.

they never said the Master classes were the demigodsuperbrokenofflineextramodeethan classes, and i highly doubt there will EVER be one. These classes are just a new, advanced way of playing that focuses on damage and requires you to change your style of playing. Thats it.

Stop with the "i thought" or "Master was supposed to be" stuff because your wrong and dont know what your talking about.

For the force branch, this is what just happened:

Masterforce = Battle
Fortetecher = Battle / Support
Acrotecher = Support

Why is this so hard to grasp

[ This Message was edited by: RemiusTA on 2008-03-28 14:30 ]

Shiro_Ryuu

Mar 28, 2008, 04:26 PM

I wouldn't have it any other way. The Master classes look fine for me. I was worried at first, and anti-Master class because I really thought they were going to completely wipe out the other 9 expert types, but now, I know what they're all about. They seem to be powerful at what they do, but they have some pretty bad flaws, so it's all good.

kazuma56

Mar 28, 2008, 04:36 PM

I'm not impressed with any class outside of probably GM... and i didn't lvl any advanced gunner jobs at all.

I think they should allow for a "custom" class, one where we can make are own class under some restrictions...

something like:
we get 40 points to use when selecting weapons, 1 point for making a class be able to use C grade weps and 4 points for leveling it to S

stats will also be pooled from that 40 points, with each point attributing a 10% boost in X stat(s).

that way, you can either be specialized as a character with huge stat boosts but restricted equips or have a crap load of weapons to use and crap stat boosts.

either way, the dream of making a RAmar again is still stuck to me latching onto Fighgunner...

RemiusTA

Mar 28, 2008, 04:36 PM

Exactly. They are simply classes that pinpoint a single purpose.

Gunmaster is now strictly Long-range DPS class.

Fighmaster is now a short-range crowd control class with higher potental damage than FF.

Masterforce is now for focus more on the offensive spells, with quicker casting, range and DPS. (just like Ft was focusing on both, and At was focusing on support.)

jayster

Mar 28, 2008, 04:39 PM

I think that these master classes are their worst idea yet. They had so much potential and now... well they just appaul me. Of course I'll try out gunmaster but idk...

edit: to explain more. I think the thing that annoys me most is the limited gun choice. I know crossbows and everything aren't the highest DPS but I love crossbows and grenade launchers.

[ This Message was edited by: jayster on 2008-03-28 14:44 ]

Powder Keg

Mar 28, 2008, 05:51 PM

From what I'm hearing, I think they are fine. Maybe we could have another weapon or two for each class to select, but this doesn't make the other classes obsolete. It's just a SPECIALIST Specialist class.

Aries2384

Mar 28, 2008, 05:54 PM

I'm pretty impressed with the classes. They are completely well off IMO. Think about it. Who wants to spam Boma Duranga as a GM? You'd kill yourself everytime! I think the master classes are pretty good. Theres my two cents...

Magus_84

Mar 28, 2008, 06:04 PM

On 2008-03-28 14:39, jayster wrote:
I think that these master classes are their worst idea yet. They had so much potential and now... well they just appaul me. Of course I'll try out gunmaster but idk...

edit: to explain more. I think the thing that annoys me most is the limited gun choice. I know crossbows and everything aren't the highest DPS but I love crossbows and grenade launchers.

[ This Message was edited by: jayster on 2008-03-28 14:44 ]

Stick with Fortegunner, then?

I don't think these are intended to "replace" any current class at all. People went into this thinking that the "Master Classes" were going to do to the "Advanced Classes" (Fortes and Hybrids) what the "Advanced Classes" did to the "Basic Classes" (Hunter, Ranger, Force).

Instead, we got three classes that are slightly different takes on three things we already had. Each seems to either define a new role (when looked at in reference to the class balances that are upcoming for some of the other classes), or fill one of the few niches that were still available.

The Master-series also seem to be leaning more towards group play, rather than the locked solo-fest everyone seems to be complaining about lately. The Fortes, by comparison, almost seem to be "hybrids" now.

Gunmaster forgoes variety for speed, and becomes the highest-SE inflicting class in the game, it seems. Downsides are that limited weapon choice, limited trap usage and utter reliance on bullets.

It's a tradeoff, in much the same way that you would make a trade between Fortegunner and Guntecher (the two other Rifle users). In the same way that a Guntecher can't completely "replace" a Fortegunner (or vice versa), I doubt Gunmaster will be replacing either of those.

Masterforce seems kinda the same thing. People are looking at it in light of "oh, it has bad support techs". But let's flip that around a bit. Look at the new role it's going to fill, and the new roles fT and AT are getting after the changes to their respective tech cap. People who wanted 50 buffs will still be able to get them. They'll just be on AT still. People who want solid attack techs along with good support ability still have an option in FT, as its buffs will be better than GT's again.

FT becomes a more "balanced" tech class, having equal proficiency in both support and attack. And with their boost in HP, they won't be as horribly penalized for their tech proficiency as they are now. MF is for the hardcore nukers, and the support techs seem to be mainly an afterthought. Note the reports of "MF with no /quick unit casting as fast as an FT with a /quick". It's going to be an offensive tech machine. I just wonder if it'll do more damage to other players' framerates, or to the enemy.

Each techer class will now play to different segments of the techer population, creating three more distinct roles. Compare this to now, with all the complaints about AT stealing FT's role. This update, and the implementation of MF, gives FT a defined "role" again, in my opinion. It's the only techer (post-update) with equal proficiency on both sides of the FO-ing coin. And it's no longer the techer most likely to become a grease spot if the enemy glares at you.

Fighmaster's the only one I'm still a bit puzzled about. I haven't seen enough on how the speed boost affects the weapons. It seems to be a class for those players who want to strictly focus on the "common" melee weapons and do well with them. Jabroga, Majarra, Gravity Break and Tornado/Absolute Dance seem to be some of the most popular PAs, and Fighmaster will excel with them.

In the end, of course, this is all just speculation and opinion. But as far as I can get a read on what ST's intentions seem to be, this makes sense. I'll likely be proven drastically wrong once we get this update, but that's quite a ways away.

Ezodagrom

Mar 28, 2008, 06:15 PM

I agree with everything Magus_84 said.
About the fighmaster, I guess it's the acrofighter of the big weapons xD
It has all the hunter 2-handed weapons (not counting the twin ones)

TUSCAN

Mar 28, 2008, 07:10 PM

lvl 50 boma duranga with acrospeed and a power unit. hmmm, now that I think about it, no grenades makes alot of sense!

JC10001

Mar 28, 2008, 07:22 PM

After seeing the increase in speed, damage, and status effects... I take back what I said about Gunmaster.

Does Killer Shot 41+ have incapacitate level 5?

Edit: Oh, and Fire, Ground and Dark laser cannon PA's appear to have an ATP modifier of 250% at level 50. 250% coupled with that rate of fire? HA! Why do I get the feeling they are going to have to nerf that at some point? (But I hope they don't) Guess its time to level my laser cannon PAs. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif

[ This Message was edited by: JC10001 on 2008-03-28 17:30 ]

LanVanDam13

Mar 28, 2008, 07:22 PM

i think master classes are cool. the name MASTER fits the class because the class allows you to master certain weapons. and skills. im really excited to see them in battle. not going to complain about lack of weapon selection if it will make my gunner own i use rifle/shotgun only anyway. Only draw back is for techers since support techs will be so low

BFGfreak

Mar 28, 2008, 07:55 PM

On 2008-03-28 15:54, Aries2384 wrote:
Who wants to spam Boma Duranga as a GM?

I do! As a matter of fact, now I'm curious what Boma Duranga LV 50 is. Granted it should have reduced the Damage reflect down to 1, but still, it has to be uber powerful

Shiro_Ryuu

Mar 28, 2008, 08:02 PM

Man, now that I'm thinking of it, Anga Jabroga with a speed bonus that Fighmaster has is gonna be scary. As is Gravity Break, and the lolbignumbarz that will come out from that. I'm happy with these classes now.

KiteWolfwood

Mar 28, 2008, 08:15 PM

It is starting to piss me off that everyone is thinking that Master classes should make all the other classes obsolete and/or they are just fail classes.

First off for Fighmaster you get 10 more skill levels. If we take a look at the pattern Jabroga levels at, that would give it at least a 500% atp mod. So now you have a higher modded Jabroga that can be used faster. Also they get spears. So now you got a Majarra with 10 extra levels. That gap isn't as big as it was with Jabroga but it still will make up some of the damage loss. Also add in the speed boost to it and there ya go.

Now you have hasted Majarra to take out everything up till the boss an hasted Jabroga to take out the boss. They even throw in Swords an Double sabers to spice it up.

Gunmaster. Hasted firing speed and 10 extra levels of bullets. Also sweet ass boost to Acc. Nuff said.

MasterForce. You get AT tech speed boost plus the ability to use S Rods, Madoogs, Wands, and 10 extra attack tech levels over Fortetecher. What the hell is with people saying this is a solo class? Group with a AT for buffs and now you are a killing machine.

Oh boo hoo they cost more pp to use. If you are crying about that then how the hell you gonna buy the S rank for the class. Photon Charges people, use um.

Gama

Mar 28, 2008, 08:46 PM

i hope they change them or ill stick to ft and fg i like twin daggers too much.
those master types dont look so master theyre unbalanced. fightmaster should be able to use all strike weapons/gunmaster all ranged weapons/masterforce super powerfull techs but only tech mags, wands and rods. and lvl 50 techs...all of them.

Dein

Mar 28, 2008, 08:46 PM

On 2008-03-28 18:02, Shiroryuu wrote:
Man, now that I'm thinking of it, Anga Jabroga with a speed bonus that Fighmaster has is gonna be scary. As is Gravity Break, and the lolbignumbarz that will come out from that. I'm happy with these classes now.

Jabroga is a decent amount faster but Gravity Break doesn't benefit a very large amount from the speed boost of FM. Also, unless you use a cati skill save unit to reduce the PP cost of skills on FM you'll eat up a weapon's PP quickly if you use PAs too much.

[ This Message was edited by: Dein on 2008-03-28 18:46 ]

Trey

Mar 28, 2008, 08:49 PM

it cant hurt to try out the fighmaster class for me so ill give it a try and see what it brings me -_-

GreenArcher

Mar 28, 2008, 09:17 PM

On 2008-03-28 17:55, BFGfreak wrote:

On 2008-03-28 15:54, Aries2384 wrote:
Who wants to spam Boma Duranga as a GM?

I do! As a matter of fact, now I'm curious what Boma Duranga LV 50 is. Granted it should have reduced the Damage reflect down to 1, but still, it has to be uber powerful

450% ATT

chicken105

Mar 28, 2008, 09:18 PM

there any videos of comparing things like a FF/Figh- jabroga/gravity break/dus majarra/tornado dance and absolute dance to a Fighmaster?

Fox_Makenshi

Mar 28, 2008, 10:02 PM

I probably won't use the master classes. I'm really not into the immensely limited weapon selection. I'm not saying that they're bad, I'm saying that it's not my cup of tea, you know? My perfect class would be GT with S-rank Cards XD Take away Handgun or RCSM (or both lol).

Love,
Fox Makenshi

jayster

Mar 28, 2008, 11:31 PM

I want to stay fortegunner but without level 50 bullets, I don't feel like a true gunner.

I just don't get how master classes aren't the almighty classes that replace all the others. Master means you've conquered all aspects of your class, you can use anything. Master > forte.

They should have named them something else because master really doesn't quite fit the new classes. Maybe Gun Ops, Figh Ops, Techer Ops? lol... who knows, maybe next we'll get the God classes which will be everything we expected.

amtalx

Mar 28, 2008, 11:35 PM

The name may have not been the best choice, but regardless, replacing 9 classes with 3 would have ruined this game.

[ This Message was edited by: amtalx on 2008-03-28 21:35 ]

PhdChristmas

Mar 28, 2008, 11:44 PM

Seeing as how theyre taking support abilities from Mastertechs.... will mastergunner lose access to traps? '-'

unicorn

Mar 28, 2008, 11:47 PM

I think their speed increase balances out their slightly lower stats. GM and MF look *great*, they have very defined roles.

FM seems a little iffy, but its obviously going to be the best Axe, Spear, Sword, and Double Saber user (which are the most damaging weapons atm). Yes, FF has more ATP, but FM has AF speed AND 10 more skill lvls, thats enough to compensate the small ATP difference. FF still has access to its Twin Claws, Twin Sabers, Knuckles, Sabers, and Claws.

I LOVE what MF did to FT and AT. MF is strickly BLACK MAGE. No supports up in hurr. That makes me WANT to keep my CAST FT - no reason to go GT (we have better support again) or AT (I keep my bows and stronger techs).

xEndrance

Mar 29, 2008, 12:52 AM

I think that MT is somewhat a waste there baically making another foce class that really isent neccasry i mean come on we have AT which are ment for support and FT which has support plus attacks??? So why just make a power class? your lvel 10buffs wont mean much so all the time you spent leveling them will be a waste unless you make a new account and having level 50 spells... the only thing that will be different is the damage bouns plus the new look at 41 which btw may look cool but is it really worth the haslte... I think they should just give FT 50 spells and 40 buffs then give the AT 50buffs and 31 spells or something around that...

As for the FM there going to be oki but it ruins the point.... No S-knuckles No S-Twin daggers.... What else uses S twin daggers.... Unless they plan on making an AM then that would be nice but so far im not thinking they are...

Overall the new class's will be for people that have the money for the weps and the time to waste....

Inazuma

Mar 29, 2008, 02:11 AM

the master types are a 3rd tier. i already knew MF and GM were way ahead of their forte counterparts but now i can add FM to the list. not only can FM move around the map much faster than everyone else due to boosted tornado dance speed, he can even switch to axe and finish the PA before the other party members even arrive on the scene (^_^);

the way i see it, there are 5 types in psu. the 3 masters, PT and AT. everything else is severely lacking imo.

Shake

Mar 29, 2008, 02:45 AM

I'm looking forward to Fighmaster. Their weapon selection is what I miss during my Acrofighting escapades. With the FM type, I wouldn't have to sacrifice speed for some different weapons every now and again.

Skye-Fox713

Mar 29, 2008, 03:49 AM

well it appears that i'm gonna need to find myself a S rank twin handgun |3

EMPYREAN

Mar 29, 2008, 03:50 AM

as said b4 this could have been fun but it turnd out bad. only 4 weps for GM and FM is just plain stupid. the weps for MT is ok but LV 10 support is not.
give GM granade gun, FM knuckles, and MT lv 20 support and it wouldent bee too bad.
allso wartecher lv 10 rec for a MT.... whats the point of that since a MT cant use blades.

daniel_drago

Mar 29, 2008, 06:21 AM

People please stop fucking whinning about these classes. What I think everyone has done on this damn site is taken the 'speculations' to seriously and is now upset that they were wrong. These classes are good, If they were to good the game would be ever so more boring than it is now.

I'm quite sad that masterforce even got lvl10 support. At least you get more than just lvl50 in one section.

These classes are here to add more variety, NOT make other classes obsolete.

It seems that the boost you receive with lvl41+ is very significant if i recall correctly 41 rifle bullet had an extra 22% ATT and 15% more elemental ...Thats a huge bonus
So why are people still whinning about them?

Yes weapon selection is small but seriously do they need more weapons?

STOP whinning that the classes are far off you perceived Ideas and accept that these are the classes and there not here to make eveyon else crap.

sorry for the slight bad language folks and kudos to those that are not whinning about these classes, at least some people seem to understand the intetions of theses classes.

Follisimo

Mar 29, 2008, 06:39 AM

Nice post daniel. But what do you expect with stupid kids posting? They truly don't understand how a game works and how to make things balance out.

JarinKail

Mar 29, 2008, 08:20 AM

I'll be switching to Gunmaster the second that it's released to the US. I'll miss the healing that my Guntecher provides but I'll live. I will not miss Crossbows on a Gunmaster since they're really only used with a wand to heal on a GT anyway and a Shotgun will be more than adequate with the increased firing rate. No comment is needed about the Rifles and PEWPEWLAZOR cannons, they will be insanely powerful. Twins will finally get a good use out of a gunner class.

I'm stoked.

amtalx

Mar 29, 2008, 08:35 AM

On 2008-03-28 21:44, PhdChristmas wrote:
Seeing as how theyre taking support abilities from Mastertechs.... will mastergunner lose access to traps? '-'

Gunmaster can only use Burn G, Virus G, and Poison G (FAIL) now. All the other traps are off limits, but with SE5 I don't see that being much of a burden.

Golto

Mar 29, 2008, 08:50 AM

daniel_drago: rifles only gain 2% atp and 8% element going from lvl 40 to lvl 41, we just haven't gotten the rifle 20% atp and element boost yet.

Just look at all the ranged and melee weapons that won't be able to get lvl 41+ pas, that is just stupid. Its not like they don't have them coded already either since you can get those weapons' pa to 41+ offline.

jayster

Mar 29, 2008, 09:24 AM

btw, what is a gunmasters atp compared to a fortegunners atp?

Fox_Makenshi

Mar 29, 2008, 09:26 AM

On 2008-03-29 06:50, Golto wrote:Just look at all the ranged and melee weapons that won't be able to get lvl 41+ pas, that is just stupid. Its not like they don't have them coded already either since you can get those weapons' pa to 41+ offline.

Yeah I was thinking about that too. Maybe some of the other classes will get a PA boost later? I mean what's the point of putting 41+ into the game for all weapons when only 8 weapons (and all techs) will get there?

Also now that I'm thinking about it I MAY go GM just to level up those guns faster.

Love,
Fox Makenshi

DEM_CIG

Mar 29, 2008, 09:50 AM

Hybird classes FTW!!! I would hate only using one type of weapon.

PhdChristmas

Mar 29, 2008, 10:13 AM

On 2008-03-29 06:35, amtalx wrote:

On 2008-03-28 21:44, PhdChristmas wrote:
Seeing as how theyre taking support abilities from Mastertechs.... will mastergunner lose access to traps? '-'

Gunmaster can only use Burn G, Virus G, and Poison G (FAIL) now. All the other traps are off limits, but with SE5 I don't see that being much of a burden.

SE5... im sold (¯-¯')

Lets hope the devs implement a palette dedicated to traps (°A°;;')

Edit:
GM's being "can only use guns"

FM's "can only use melee"

etc with MT

will have their drawbacks, another form of balance. "your really good at this, but you arent worth squat in these"

[ This Message was edited by: PhdChristmas on 2008-03-29 08:30 ]

TecherRamen

Mar 29, 2008, 10:14 AM

On 2008-03-28 14:21, RemiusTA wrote:

On 2008-03-28 13:58, Lighthero wrote:

On 2008-03-28 13:45, Darius_Drake wrote:

On 2008-03-28 13:37, Poncho_Jr wrote:
I'm all about teching.
Level 50 Attack TECHs are nice, but the level 10 Support???
It IS Materforce.
It should have level 50 on both sides.
It won't outclass fT's or aT's due to the fact that they'll only be able to use teching weapons, and nothing else.

I feel you. It seems as if the techers that actually use support techs are being punished in this class. If you leveled your support techs up nicely there is almost no point in choosing masterforce.

I agree. I feel that I wasted time getting my buffs to 31 for special causes to actually play AT. I'm FT as main job but go AT IF it's really needed. level 10 support techs gotta be sucky, you probably won't even heal ALL your HP. And you can actually use buff items instead of casting them.

My character is a total techer, but this fucks up, level 10 support techs? That's even worse than Wartecher. letting it the same as the FT's would be nice but having both 50/50 would be awesome!

Yeah, awesome and broken. The level 10 support is a downside, but in all truth, if your going for damage then it wont make much of a difference. The 10 extra levels of technics not only add more power but also add more range AND targets, which will automatically blow a fortetecher with lv40 support out the water in terms of damage.

Not to mention, it isnt like Masterforce cant RECIEVE lv 50 buffs. There are still Fortetechers and Acrotechers on the game, people. Pop a -ride and keep on stepping.

And lv10 resta can pretty much heal almost all your HP if you have enough TP. Or at least half, which should be good enough for parties, unless your with idiots who cant use a quick -mate when they see your not in position to save them.

If master force had 50/50, there would be absolutely zero reason to play any other class that has the word "Techer" on it. 50/50 would render fortetecher, Wartecher AND acrotecher completely useless.

they never said the Master classes were the demigodsuperbrokenofflineextramodeethan classes, and i highly doubt there will EVER be one. These classes are just a new, advanced way of playing that focuses on damage and requires you to change your style of playing. Thats it.

Stop with the "i thought" or "Master was supposed to be" stuff because your wrong and dont know what your talking about.

For the force branch, this is what just happened:

Masterforce = Battle
Fortetecher = Battle / Support
Acrotecher = Support

Why is this so hard to grasp

[ This Message was edited by: RemiusTA on 2008-03-28 14:30 ]

<3

EDIT--- come to think of it as a fortetecher I usually dont have any weapons other than a rod wand and mag on me. I only carry other weapon types if i specifically know i will need them (like a dagger for those farkin gainozeros and there accursed anti-magic shield)

[ This Message was edited by: TecherRamen on 2008-03-29 08:19 ]

pikachief

Mar 29, 2008, 10:17 AM

On 2008-03-29 07:50, DEM_CIG wrote:
Hybird classes FTW!!! I would hate only using one type of weapon.

i know me too!

good thing master classes have 4 http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif

daniel_drago

Mar 29, 2008, 11:04 AM

On 2008-03-29 06:50, Golto wrote:
daniel_drago: rifles only gain 2% atp and 8% element going from lvl 40 to lvl 41, we just haven't gotten the rifle 20% atp and element boost yet.

Just look at all the ranged and melee weapons that won't be able to get lvl 41+ pas, that is just stupid. Its not like they don't have them coded already either since you can get those weapons' pa to 41+ offline.

no I'm sorry to say this but I've seen a rifle bullet at 41 that 202% ATT and 48% ele Im going to go find it now, however if i do find and i was wrong then by all means flame me however i doubt that i am.

On 2008-03-28 07:24, FOnewearl-Lina wrote:
Ok here's the stats on the elementals past 41 on weapons useable by GM, already posted rifle before but doesn't hurt to have it again:
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y274/FoLina/PSU/shot.jpg
Shotgun; 30% SE2.
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y274/FoLina/PSU/twins.jpg
Twin handgun; 44% SE2
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y274/FoLina/PSU/laser.jpg
Laser; 50% SE3
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y274/FoLina/PSU/rifle.jpg
Rifle; 48% SE5

[ This Message was edited by: daniel_drago on 2008-03-29 09:07 ]
This is rifle fire bullet:
lvl 31 - 40 162 - 180%ATT 75ACC 33%ele Burn 4 14pp
sorry do i see a 22% ATT boost? from 1 level? is that an extra 15 elemental? wow who knew!

[ This Message was edited by: daniel_drago on 2008-03-29 09:10 ]

ThEoRy

Mar 29, 2008, 11:10 AM

Try it out first. Then tell us if you don't like it.

Kylie

Mar 29, 2008, 11:35 AM

FM: You expect me to give up knuckles, twin claws, twin daggers, and twin sabers?! Eff that, and eff you. I don't even like axes or double sabers, so why would I play this class? Meh, I might play it to cap it, but I can't see any way I could possibly like this class without my favorite weapon types. Anyone else that likes it, good for you; I don't care. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_lol.gif So I'm not saying it sucks - just not for me.

GM: Eww, guns. No offense, but I can't stand using most range weapons.

MF: I'm actually intrigued by this... A TECHNIC class that you don't have to buff in? After the PA patch? HEL YEH! Sign me up! I might just make my newman (supposed to be an AF) into this, but I need s rank techer gear.

Davot

Mar 29, 2008, 01:31 PM

On 2008-03-29 09:35, Kylie wrote:
FM: You expect me to give up knuckles, twin claws, twin daggers, and twin sabers?! Eff that, and eff you. I don't even like axes or double sabers, so why would I play this class? Meh, I might play it to cap it, but I can't see any way I could possibly like this class without my favorite weapon types. Anyone else that likes it, good for you; I don't care. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_lol.gif So I'm not saying it sucks - just not for me.

GM: Eww, guns. No offense, but I can't stand using most range weapons.

MF: I'm actually intrigued by this... A TECHNIC class that you don't have to buff in? After the PA patch? HEL YEH! Sign me up! I might just make my newman (supposed to be an AF) into this, but I need s rank techer gear.

Somebody who understands how fighters are getting F***** over with master classes.MF will be good for my little techer.GM, meh ill stick to my twin sabers.

Zorafim

Mar 29, 2008, 01:42 PM

After seeing the video of the Fighmaster attack speed boost, I think I'm ready for the change. That was a huge boost in speed, as if I was using a one handed weapon. I've noticed that two handed weapons are more overall useful than twin weapons, and I always use two handed in specialized situations and twin in generic situations. Four weapons is enough to cover the bases of melee combat, especially weapons as specialized as these four, so I shouldn't miss out on my twins anyway. Ranged weapons will be missed, but I don't use them too often anyway.
What irks me is the PP penalty, though. I'm not sure how big it is, but going from a PP saver to a PP waster may take some getting used to. I know I'm going to have to keep a PP save on me at all times, which should limit how much I lose, but even then I may have to go for the S rank version. Oh, I hope they become more common by the time the class comes out...

Follisimo

Mar 29, 2008, 03:46 PM

On 2008-03-29 11:42, Zorafim wrote:
After seeing the video of the Fighmaster attack speed boost, I think I'm ready for the change. That was a huge boost in speed, as if I was using a one handed weapon. I've noticed that two handed weapons are more overall useful than twin weapons, and I always use two handed in specialized situations and twin in generic situations. Four weapons is enough to cover the bases of melee combat, especially weapons as specialized as these four, so I shouldn't miss out on my twins anyway. Ranged weapons will be missed, but I don't use them too often anyway.
What irks me is the PP penalty, though. I'm not sure how big it is, but going from a PP saver to a PP waster may take some getting used to. I know I'm going to have to keep a PP save on me at all times, which should limit how much I lose, but even then I may have to go for the S rank version. Oh, I hope they become more common by the time the class comes out...

If you are talking about cati / skill pp save then don't worry they are easy to get. I've gotten 3 already. Just get a FOI run with rappy on non holiday and you are almost always getting 1. Only morons have them priced so high.

Golto

Mar 29, 2008, 04:16 PM

daniel_drago you must have missundertsood me then. For JPN pc/ps2 lvl 40 rifles have 200/195 atp % and 40% element. We haven't gotten the latest pa adjustments yet so you only see 180/175 and 33% for NA PSU. There is not a big jump going from lvl 40 rifle and lvl 41 rifle elemental bullets. 2% more atp annd 8% more element.

before patch

lvl 40 fire rilfe bullet
180% atp 33% element

after patch
lvl 40 fire rifle bullet
200% atp 40% element

lvl 41 fire rifle bullet
202% atp 48% element

Mysterious-G

Mar 29, 2008, 04:23 PM

On 2008-03-29 11:42, Zorafim wrote:
After seeing the video of the Fighmaster attack speed boost, I think I'm ready for the change. That was a huge boost in speed, as if I was using a one handed weapon. I've noticed that two handed weapons are more overall useful than twin weapons, and I always use two handed in specialized situations and twin in generic situations. Four weapons is enough to cover the bases of melee combat, especially weapons as specialized as these four, so I shouldn't miss out on my twins anyway. Ranged weapons will be missed, but I don't use them too often anyway.
What irks me is the PP penalty, though. I'm not sure how big it is, but going from a PP saver to a PP waster may take some getting used to. I know I'm going to have to keep a PP save on me at all times, which should limit how much I lose, but even then I may have to go for the S rank version. Oh, I hope they become more common by the time the class comes out...

Don`t we get MAG in a holiday free periode? Means we get Rappies in ruins. ;o (And I think people said rare enemies were more like common enemies there.)

lvyhd

Mar 29, 2008, 04:33 PM

let's face it master classes are goin to suck ballz but if they get revamped by the time they come to us then we got somethin to look forward to. Me i'm goin fighmaster just to max it out like the other classes i got maxed then it's back to fighgunner...

Magus_84

Mar 29, 2008, 05:05 PM

On 2008-03-29 11:31, Davot wrote:

On 2008-03-29 09:35, Kylie wrote:
FM: You expect me to give up knuckles, twin claws, twin daggers, and twin sabers?! Eff that, and eff you. I don't even like axes or double sabers, so why would I play this class? Meh, I might play it to cap it, but I can't see any way I could possibly like this class without my favorite weapon types. Anyone else that likes it, good for you; I don't care. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_lol.gif So I'm not saying it sucks - just not for me.

GM: Eww, guns. No offense, but I can't stand using most range weapons.

MF: I'm actually intrigued by this... A TECHNIC class that you don't have to buff in? After the PA patch? HEL YEH! Sign me up! I might just make my newman (supposed to be an AF) into this, but I need s rank techer gear.

Somebody who understands how fighters are getting F***** over with master classes.MF will be good for my little techer.GM, meh ill stick to my twin sabers.

The following is more towards Davot:

You wouldn't go AF, then baaw about how they can't use Axes.

You wouldn't go WT, then baaw about how they can't use S-Rank Swords.

You wouldn't go, Fighgunner then baaw about how they can't use whips.

At least, I hope you wouldn't.

So why are you complaining about switching to a class that, from the beginning, obviously can't use your favorite weapon types?

If you want to use those with a speed boost, go AF. If you want any of the other stuff I mentioned, use the classes that already exist in the game that can use the stuff you like.

Not being able to use your favorite stuff doesn't automatically mean the classes inherently suck. Nor does it mean that melee are getting shafted.

The master classes are simply a variation on stuff that's in the game, not "OMG WTF PWN" that obsoletes the other classes.

For once, ST decides to try to balance things and keep the new classes from overpowering the old ones, and all people can do is complain. -_-

[ This Message was edited by: Magus_84 on 2008-03-29 15:07 ]

scuba7292

Mar 29, 2008, 05:43 PM

I think masterforce should get lvl 40 buffs and lvl 40 attacks so its nicely balanced, a true master.

Vitamin_D

Mar 29, 2008, 05:54 PM

Being primarily a Fortefighter, I kinda like the look of Fighmaster. It uses 4 Weapons that I really like and there's a speed boost. As for the PP penalty, I found a Giga/Skill PP Save during the Winter Event so I'm not too worried about that. Only thing is there's absolutely no guns, which would be a huge negative factor for some situations, but ah well. I'll definitely give Fighmaster a try and see how I like it.

EMPYREAN

Mar 29, 2008, 06:00 PM

well if things r gonna stay as they r now whit the new jobs when we get them, then they better not have the name Master in it cuz that is Way wrong. advanced FM/GM/TM or something like it suits it better.

Dein

Mar 29, 2008, 06:02 PM

On 2008-03-29 11:42, Zorafim wrote:
After seeing the video of the Fighmaster attack speed boost, I think I'm ready for the change. That was a huge boost in speed, as if I was using a one handed weapon. I've noticed that two handed weapons are more overall useful than twin weapons, and I always use two handed in specialized situations and twin in generic situations. Four weapons is enough to cover the bases of melee combat, especially weapons as specialized as these four, so I shouldn't miss out on my twins anyway. Ranged weapons will be missed, but I don't use them too often anyway.
What irks me is the PP penalty, though. I'm not sure how big it is, but going from a PP saver to a PP waster may take some getting used to. I know I'm going to have to keep a PP save on me at all times, which should limit how much I lose, but even then I may have to go for the S rank version. Oh, I hope they become more common by the time the class comes out...

Edit: Nvm what I originally said. I did some math and found out that the PP penalty for the Masterclasses seem to be 30%. So yeah, if you want to use skills at the normal cost you'll need a cati skill save unit.

[ This Message was edited by: Dein on 2008-03-29 19:50 ]

daniel_drago

Mar 29, 2008, 06:56 PM

On 2008-03-29 14:16, Golto wrote:
daniel_drago you must have missundertsood me then. For JPN pc/ps2 lvl 40 rifles have 200/195 atp % and 40% element. We haven't gotten the latest pa adjustments yet so you only see 180/175 and 33% for NA PSU. There is not a big jump going from lvl 40 rifle and lvl 41 rifle elemental bullets. 2% more atp annd 8% more element.

before patch

lvl 40 fire rilfe bullet
180% atp 33% element

after patch
lvl 40 fire rifle bullet
200% atp 40% element

lvl 41 fire rifle bullet
202% atp 48% element

Fair enough then, that does suck, however it's still going to be a nice damage boost for rifles when this extra 20% kicks in http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif.
The extra Elemental damage will also add a large bonus to damage as well.

I still believe that theses classes are fine and that people are just upset because they are nothing like what people expected them to be like.

The_Brimada

Mar 29, 2008, 08:38 PM

On 2008-03-29 15:43, scuba7292 wrote:
I think masterforce should get lvl 40 buffs and lvl 40 attacks so its nicely balanced, a true master.

Ummm thats what Fortetecher has already >_>

mvffin

Mar 29, 2008, 11:38 PM

So far the masterclasses are very meh.

Fighmaster looks promising. Double Sabers for groups, Axes for Big Un's and Bosses. What more do you need? Dimmagolous will make you pull out your hair though.

Masterforce: 6 Psychos. What more you need? bow? psh.

Gunmaster: They get shotties and rifles right? lasers? good enough. Twins... meh...gimme a 10* yohmei twins. = )

After seeing the first 3 ,I am hoping AcroMaster looks like this:

S rank: Slicer, Whip, Madoog, Shadoog
30/0/10/30
THAT would be awesome.

Libram

Mar 30, 2008, 12:35 AM

Fighmaster will make tough things bleed through their ass, and here's how.

Step 1: Equip Axe and Anga Jabroga.
Step 2: Go to a shop and purchase Freeze Trap G
Step 3: Freeze a group of enemies that are giving you trouble.
Step 4: Rain Jabroga on frozen enemies.

Tita

Mar 30, 2008, 01:18 AM

On 2008-03-29 22:35, Libram wrote:
Fighmaster will make tough things bleed through their ass, and here's how.

Step 1: Equip Axe and Anga Jabroga.
Step 2: Go to a shop and purchase Freeze Trap G
Step 3: Freeze a group of enemies that are giving you trouble.
Step 4: Rain Jabroga on frozen enemies.

whoa whoa whoa wait, fighmasters get traps?

sorry if i missed something here, but last i read i didn't see anything on traps. halp?

Zorafim

Mar 30, 2008, 02:10 AM

Erm, since when can hunter types use traps? I think you're confusing FighMaster with the class that takes thought to play.

Tamashi

Mar 30, 2008, 02:17 AM

Regarding the complaining:

Gunmaster: If you gave Gunmaster Grenade Lauchers then Fortegunner would be worthless.

Masterforce: Level 10 support was probobly just for your resta/giresta.

Fighmaster: pretty much takes the "tank" title away from Fortefighter. Why do you think it needs more weapons? Because you like those weapons? Ha, thats a good reason.

Libram

Mar 30, 2008, 02:23 AM

http://www.pso-world.com/viewtopic.php?topic=172448&forum=20&start=0&15#1

Unless Espio is lying or mistranslated something it says specifically under equipment that Fighmaster can use FREEZE TRAP G! That means the Fighgunner aspect gave them both Doublesaber use and one very special ability to use a trap.

Poncho_Jr

Mar 30, 2008, 02:24 AM

My reason for saying Masterforce should get level 50 Support...
Hence the name MASTER.
It won't overshine Acro, because being an Acro, you get more weapon variety and versatility.
Being Masterforce, the only thing you're gonna do is TECH.
Therefore Masterforce should get both.
Everyone has their own reasoning.
Here I am thinking Masterforce would be, a, ya know, Force Master, yet it is clearly not.
So that means getting Resta, Buffs and Giresta to their final tiers was a waste of time.
I'm a Supporter and Damage dealing techer.
What are we gonna do with a level 10 buff, if there's no other techer.
Where's the "team player" in that?
This is only my opinion.
Some will agree, MOST will disagree. MOST=Sega and Acrotechers that is.

[ This Message was edited by: Poncho_Jr on 2008-03-30 00:26 ]

[ This Message was edited by: Poncho_Jr on 2008-03-30 00:28 ]

Libram

Mar 30, 2008, 02:29 AM

I'll also throw my hat in with the TECH-levels-are-fine-as-they-are crowd. For the casting speed I saw on a Rod and ten extra nuking levels I'm fine with only receiving Lv 10 support. I've got Mates and Atomizers, and it's not like they can't be bought.

Tamashi

Mar 30, 2008, 02:29 AM

Oh I see. Masterclass = Master everything.
I get it now! Black Mage = Black guy with magic powers.

THAT MAKES PERFECT SENSE.

Not.

Poncho_Jr

Mar 30, 2008, 02:33 AM

I see what this is about now...
People here thinking just because they'll "have a higher base cap" then the rest of them.
If they didn't split the damn Support/Attack in the first place. We wouldn't be going through this mess.
Support Tech or Attack Tech is still Force.

Libram

Mar 30, 2008, 02:37 AM

More like I'm thinking even soloing I'll probably do as much damage per shot as a Fortetecher, but only faster and with a much wider AOE even when the FT has Retier Lv 4 going. And I'm probably underestimating the power of the Masterforce's TP base.

Ezodagrom

Mar 30, 2008, 02:38 AM

Want support? Acrotecher (30/50)
Want attack techs? Masterforce (50/10)
Want both in a balanced way? Fortetecher (40/40)

Even though I think Masterforce should get at least lvl 20 or lvl 30 support techs, it isn't that bad if you look at the other classes. This doesn't make both fortetecher and acrotecher obsolete.

Poncho_Jr

Mar 30, 2008, 02:46 AM

Clearly Sega needs to rethink their priorities.
Having a "10" at anything is a Master. It's an Apprentice.
Just switch the names around as so

Acrotecher- 30AT-50ST
Masterforce- 40AT-40ST
Fortetecher- 50AT-10AT

Since when does a basic class LOSE their basic skills on each advancing stage.

Let's see here.

SKILLS
Hunter 20
Fortefigther-40
Fighmaster- 50

BULLETS
Ranger- 10
Fortegunner- 40
Gunmaster -50

TECHNICS
Force- 20-20
Fortetecher 40-40 (in the near future)
Masterforce 50-10 (Whoop there it is!)

[ This Message was edited by: Poncho_Jr on 2008-03-30 00:56 ]

MaximusLight

Mar 30, 2008, 03:53 AM

Everyone is missing something about the term master.

In Japan a master is someone who devotes themselves soly to a single task in a specific area to become the best they can be in that area, NOT someone who can do EVERYTHING, that's the north america definition.

By this logic the master classes make sense because they area the absolute best in their titles, but not in other areas.

If you're wanting to use you specific weapon with 50 skills there will probably be a class for those later on. (like why acro got 50 support techs)

Thought I'd point out that cultural difference before everyone keeps going.

That said this threads purpose is to point out the cultural differences so that people can understand why they have they names they have. Not to give an opinion on how I or anyone else feels about them, there is alread a thread for that, do it there.

[ This Message was edited by: MaximusLight on 2008-03-30 01:59 ]

Mysterious-G

Mar 30, 2008, 04:20 AM

Aha? We don`t need another topic about this. :/
(Is a master in north America really somebody who can do everything? Lmao.)

ljkkjlcm9

Mar 30, 2008, 04:24 AM

except people figured a master of fighting would excel at all fighting. Master of guns would be a master of all guns etc. It's not like it says "Heavy melee master"

There is no confusion with the title, and they're certainly masters of the weapons they were given, people just figured they'd be given more weapons.

THE JACKEL

daniel_drago

Mar 30, 2008, 04:34 AM

People are still bitching about this. My lord grow up. These classes have been made END OF. They are made to be balanced so they don't make anything else obsolete.
Again I'm going to have to say it "poeple are upset because master classes are completely different to the perceived ideas and 'speculations'.
I've player nearly every class on the game I'll admit I've never leveled all of them up as some just don't take my intrest, I play them If I dont like the class I stop playing it and move onto something else.

Fighmaster: Ok yes this does kind of take the 'tanking' aspect now, However do you see any weapons there that are good for taking out a single target? FF has many weapons that are quick and take single targets down easily I.e. Twin claws. FF simply has the advantage of taking smaller groups quicker and more PP friendly.

Gunmaster: This would be over powered with rapid fire grenade launcher, machinegun EVER THINK OF THAT? If Gunmaster had any of the other weapons I would seiroulsy agree that theses classes are turning ot to be, well, In the words of the ignorant forum users 'crap'. It would be far to over powered I'm fine with the weapon set. I used to be FG but after a while I got bored of the class in general and became FF.

Masterforce: Speed of an Acrotecher, More damaging than FT. Yet our still asking for more? WTFBBQ? I'm sorry but look at like this. Acrotecher quick healer short to mid range class. FT consistant damage from all ranges short to long. With the lvl40 buffs this class can now get close enough with deband and possilby jellen and be able to cast Gi and Damu series nicely without, how to put this nicely, getting fucked. Forcemaster is mid to long range on pure nuking the healing or support is there just incase something goes wrong with the acrtecher or FT.

Now I know people are going to say " ONLY ELITES SHUD BE FT's COZ THEY NO HOW NOT TO TAKE A HIT!!" I'm sorry to have to say this but this is a G A M E. Yes take it seriously but think of others that are here to enjoy them selves they like the class then they play the class whether or not they are particularly good at the class, as long as they are having fun they can do as they please.

These classes are fine. You want to know why they are fine? Because the developers make the game THEY chose how the classes are made WHAT THEY SAY GOES. Sadly the game doesn't really get any changes from what the cummunity wants but if it did hell would open diablo would be fucking your mother and you'de think you were happy wouldn't you?

Thanks for reading my bloody long post but people on this forum really need to accept that these are the Master classes maybe they will get tweakd I for one see no real reason to, However I'm open to change.

Peace to the forum.

Sazan

Mar 30, 2008, 05:33 AM

It is quite simple. You have to be a master of gaming to master the master classes.

SabZero

Mar 30, 2008, 05:47 AM

Well, they would have to had *some* restriction, otherwise, as stated, the other classes would become redundant.

Retehi

Mar 30, 2008, 05:59 AM

Why don't we just call them Jesusfighter, or Buddhagunner, and be done with this nonsense.

chaoskila

Mar 30, 2008, 06:01 AM

its master cuz it needs the other classes [forte and hybrid] to change it
if it was just another job you would only need to lvl up the base jobs

PhdChristmas

Mar 30, 2008, 06:17 AM

to be a master@gunning is to sacrifice your saber, spear and snare traps to devote everything into obliterating your opponents with SE5 from a distance or the usual DoT traps. Your not going to give the enemy the opportunity to get close to tear you nor your comrades to shreds. Your watching your friendly's back, but no one is watching yours. Your ability to deter enemy attacks are next to none, make every shot count. Lead the way ranger.

to be a master@fighting is to sacrifice any utility of diverse combat styles to focus on a handful of weapon types to obliterate your enemy with sheer concentration and devotion. Do not pursue multiple styles of combat to attain experience over your enemies, take the path of physical prowess where you defeat the enemy with your own power. You don't know your weapon's name? Its been trying to tell you. Say its name and your enemies will tremble before your killing intent. When your oppoenent tries to flee you grab them by the neck and force them to fight you toe to toe. Only one of you will make it home alive.

to be a Master@teching is to open boxes with techs onry

Fox_Makenshi

Mar 30, 2008, 07:23 AM

daniel_drago, this is a forum. People like to "discuss" their approval, or disapproval, of aspects of the game. We're not "still bitching," we're discussing how some of us like how the master classes are and how some of us will not be using them and disagree with how they were put together. I'm sorry you can't understand us "ignorant forum users." Furthermore why are you still bitching about us still bitching? Every time you post here you're complaining about us complaining. Not trying to start a flame war, I just think you need to calm down a bit.

ANYWAYS...After reading most of this topic I'm seeing that the Master classes are balanced, and yes we did ruin it for ourselves with all the speculation. Even without the speculation though my opinion of GM would still be the same. I'm not crazy about it because I don't like Rifles personally (I like Bows better), Shotguns are alright (crossbow FTW!), Lasers didn't quite meet my expectations when they first came out (though they have gotten a lot better) and Twins....well I can't really say anything about them lol. I'll use GM to cap it, and maybe to lvl rifle bullets.

Love,
Fox Makenshi

goaferboy

Mar 30, 2008, 07:29 AM

On 2008-03-30 03:59, Retehi wrote:
Why don't we just call them Jesusfighter, or Buddhagunner, and be done with this nonsense.

Or Muhammedtecher/AcroAllah to really cause a shitstorm.

Might even cause enough publicity to get some more people on this game. I should be Segas chief of marketing.

Dragwind

Mar 30, 2008, 07:31 AM

AcroAllah! Lol!

but yeah, I feel the whole master concept is to specialize the single/few "forte" aspects of the forte classes. Not just in using the weapons and Pa's, but dealing with the stats as well I suppose.

Rayokarna

Mar 30, 2008, 07:50 AM

On 2008-03-30 05:31, Dragwind wrote:
AcroAllah! Lol!

jayster

Mar 30, 2008, 08:28 AM

I don't agree.

jayster

Mar 30, 2008, 08:34 AM

I think it's funny how masterforces will be inconvienced to heal themselves now.

RemiusTA

Mar 30, 2008, 09:13 AM

Or just pop a diamate or trimate like most people do when their about to die.

I always carry Di/Trimates on my Fortetecher just incase im in a position where healing is too slow and will get me killed. Other classes should do the same.

I mean hell, its not like a Dimate wont completely heal you anyway >_>

MaximusLight

Mar 30, 2008, 02:48 PM

Thanks guys for defeating the purpose of that thread!
It was not an opinion and I asked you all not to post opinion in it so people could understand the cultural difference!

So thanks really I mean it! http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif

th0rnz

Mar 30, 2008, 03:09 PM

Fightmaster with no weapons but those, shitty.

Gunmaster, no crossbow? Go to hell.

Masterforce, not bad.

Shiro_Ryuu

Mar 30, 2008, 03:25 PM

On 2008-03-30 12:48, MaximusLight wrote:
Thanks guys for defeating the purpose of that thread!
It was not an opinion and I asked you all not to post opinion in it so people could understand the cultural difference!

So thanks really I mean it! http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif

Yeah, you're very much right. But still, people are still gonna bitch because they wanted the Master types to be perfect without any flaws because they want to be more powerful.

People had the mentality of "You want the ultimate fighter, be FM. You want the ultimate gunner, be GM. You want the ultimate techer, be FM. You want the ultimate hybrid (LOL), be Acromaster. There, instead of 9 types, we only have 4.", and they were thinking and hoping it would be like this. Now however, I am very glad that Sega gave a huge slap in the face to the people who thought this by limiting the Master types to being balanced.

Hayaiyoru

Mar 30, 2008, 03:45 PM

well if there are people seeking to be the ultimate guardian, just max every type, master every photon art... then you can do or be everything + just a little more... quityabichin [ enough said ]

stukasa

Mar 30, 2008, 05:27 PM

On 2008-03-30 13:25, Shiroryuu wrote:
People had the mentality of "You want the ultimate fighter, be FM. You want the ultimate gunner, be GM. You want the ultimate techer, be FM. You want the ultimate hybrid (LOL), be Acromaster. There, instead of 9 types, we only have 4.", and they were thinking and hoping it would be like this. Now however, I am very glad that Sega gave a huge slap in the face to the people who thought this by limiting the Master types to being balanced.

I agree, diversity ftw! http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/anime1.gif I'm glad Masters won't be the ultimate classes everyone was expecting. I was also really surprised about the "lower stats, faster speed" thing. I was expecting Masters to have higher stats than Fortes but this way is much more balanced, I think.

My opinion of the classes from what I know so far:

FighMaster: I always liked one-handed weapons more than two-handed weapons, and the two-handed weapons I like (Knuckles, Twin Claws, Twin Daggers) aren't even in FM's weapon selection. I think I'll pass on this one. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

GunMaster: I might try this class out. I like the weapon selection, and the idea of shooting faster sounds really fun!

MasterForce: Tough call. I like the speed boost and the 41+ techs but I don't like giving up my support techs either. Maybe I'll just switch temporarily to level my techs, then switch back to fT.

Tita

Mar 30, 2008, 05:47 PM

On 2008-03-30 00:17, Tamashi wrote:
Regarding the complaining:

Gunmaster: If you gave Gunmaster Grenade Lauchers then Fortegunner would be worthless.

i had a hard time seeing "Lasers over Nades" as a balancing factor -_-
only because i was super stubborn, of course http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_wacko.gif

i would have loved to have sped up nades, but on second thought, why would nades need to be sped up other than in boss fights? with laser cannons already having a knock down PA and hitting multiple hit points on bosses, i guess having nades as one of the four weps on a master class would have put a lot of weight into shotties. gunner having to be up close AND immobile in a boss fight? uh uh.

i fully understand the laser cannon over nades now.

ok sega, i gotcha. we're cool now. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_lol.gif

[ This Message was edited by: Tita on 2008-03-30 15:50 ]

Chaobo99

Mar 30, 2008, 05:49 PM

On 2008-03-30 13:09, th0rnz wrote:
Gunmaster, no crossbow? Don't need em' anyways cause shotguns are super fast now and greatly easier to lvl.

Fix'd

ljkkjlcm9

Mar 30, 2008, 06:04 PM

dude you guys haven't heard have you

a new class, called Ultimatefighguntecher

Can use Axe, Doublesaber, Rifle, Shotgun and Rods
melee cap 60
bullet cap 60
tech cap, offensive 10... support... 60!

yes the point of the rod is to buff yourself but they have a 3000% tp modifier, so even level 10 attack techs are strong!

oh yeah, requirements are 15 fighmaster, 15 gunmaster, 15 masterforce... get to work!

THE JACKEL

[ This Message was edited by: ljkkjlcm9 on 2008-03-30 16:04 ]

Umberger

Mar 30, 2008, 06:06 PM

On 2008-03-30 16:04, ljkkjlcm9 wrote:
oh yeah, requirements are 15 fighmaster, 15 gunmaster, 15 masterforce... get to work!

Why not 20? ;p

th0rnz

Mar 30, 2008, 06:59 PM

On 2008-03-30 15:49, Chaobo99 wrote:

On 2008-03-30 13:09, th0rnz wrote:
Gunmaster, no crossbow? Don't need em' anyways cause shotguns are super fast now and greatly easier to lvl.

Fix'd

Nah, shotty you still have to hold still when firing, not mobile movement while firing like x-bow.

ljkkjlcm9

Mar 30, 2008, 07:02 PM

On 2008-03-30 16:06, Umberger wrote:

On 2008-03-30 16:04, ljkkjlcm9 wrote:
oh yeah, requirements are 15 fighmaster, 15 gunmaster, 15 masterforce... get to work!

Why not 20? ;p

because sega never makes sense

THE JACKEL

Randomness

Mar 30, 2008, 07:08 PM

On 2008-03-30 16:59, th0rnz wrote:

On 2008-03-30 15:49, Chaobo99 wrote:

On 2008-03-30 13:09, th0rnz wrote:
Gunmaster, no crossbow? Don't need em' anyways cause shotguns are super fast now and greatly easier to lvl.

Fix'd

Nah, shotty you still have to hold still when firing, not mobile movement while firing like x-bow.

Shotty hits everything anyways. And you can move between shots.

magenta

Mar 30, 2008, 07:31 PM

dammit.. now have to level ranger to 5, then fighgunner to 10

RemiusTA

Mar 30, 2008, 07:34 PM

On 2008-03-30 16:04, ljkkjlcm9 wrote:
dude you guys haven't heard have you

a new class, called Ultimatefighguntecher

Can use Axe, Doublesaber, Rifle, Shotgun and Rods
melee cap 60
bullet cap 60
tech cap, offensive 10... support... 60!

yes the point of the rod is to buff yourself but they have a 3000% tp modifier, so even level 10 attack techs are strong!

oh yeah, requirements are 15 fighmaster, 15 gunmaster, 15 masterforce... get to work!

THE JACKEL

[ This Message was edited by: ljkkjlcm9 on 2008-03-30 16:04 ]

Your joking around, but isnt this what you were complaining about in like 8 other threads

ljkkjlcm9

Mar 30, 2008, 08:29 PM

On 2008-03-30 17:34, RemiusTA wrote:

On 2008-03-30 16:04, ljkkjlcm9 wrote:
dude you guys haven't heard have you

a new class, called Ultimatefighguntecher

Can use Axe, Doublesaber, Rifle, Shotgun and Rods
melee cap 60
bullet cap 60
tech cap, offensive 10... support... 60!

yes the point of the rod is to buff yourself but they have a 3000% tp modifier, so even level 10 attack techs are strong!

oh yeah, requirements are 15 fighmaster, 15 gunmaster, 15 masterforce... get to work!

THE JACKEL

[ This Message was edited by: ljkkjlcm9 on 2008-03-30 16:04 ]

Your joking around, but isnt this what you were complaining about in like 8 other threads

no, only thing I said anything about was before the master classes, that they shouldn't be awesome with everything, which they're not. And after master classes that I don't see why masterforce doesn't have better support techs.

As it turns out, that class wouldn't even be that broken. Two guns, two melee, and basically support techs.

THE JACKEL

Omega_Weltall

Mar 30, 2008, 10:49 PM

I like how they did Masterforce. To be honest if they striped Fortecher of all support i wouldn't bat an eye. Mainly cause i'm goin by PS1,3 and 4 standards for tech users, all attack techs and minimal support. PS2 never really had a tech heavy character save Amy and she was mostly support. But lv 10 support? come on, they are MASTER Force right?

DreXxiN

Mar 30, 2008, 10:49 PM

I actually did have the idea that they might be the "god" of their classes. But I was wrong.

..I'm very glad I was, I like this much better. =D

Yeevs

Mar 31, 2008, 12:44 AM

I definitely see the lv 10 support as a slap in the face. I can respect MasterForce being a living glass cannon (like ForteTecher), but even glass cannons need to provide a good support.

The idea a Techer needs to carry Buff drugs because the 30 Support cap doesn't carry over... *shudder* I'd have to see a very large HP and TP increase to even consider MasterForce if that sticks.

From an objective view, I can see why: there's probably a Master class designed to function like an AcroTecher to complement the MasterForce. I doubt that class would get Rods, though...

XenithFlare

Mar 31, 2008, 12:54 AM

On 2008-03-29 21:38, mvffin wrote:
After seeing the first 3 ,I am hoping AcroMaster looks like this:

S rank: Slicer, Whip, Madoog, Shadoog
30/0/10/30
THAT would be awesome.

I agree! AcroMaster I can see having just whips, slicers, shadoogs, and wands/madoogs. Give 'em high-level support buffs and decent melee PAs, and they're set. People'll stop complaining about MF not having support techs once that comes out.

Now, if only there were a Master Protranser (ProtoMaster, if you will)... THERE'D be your weapons-god. Maybe give 'im lv30 melee and ranged PAs, but stick the class with 6 or 7 different weapon types, and traps of course. Mmmm...

As for the current classes, I'm very pleased with them. The only thing I DON'T like is the PP deficiency, but I'll get over it; I do find it amusing that the people of this game seem to have forgotten that it's an online RPG (of sorts) for a reason, and that party members are meant to compliment each other in every way. A team of MasterForce, MasterFighter, MasterGunner, AcroMaster, and Protranser (tee hee ProtoMaster) would be the end-all-be-all of parties. The game isn't meant to be solo'd, and I think people have lost sight of the concept behind PSU.

....christ-on-a-stick, I've been ranting. <_<; Done, now.

unicorn

Mar 31, 2008, 01:25 AM

The PP deficiency thing keeps being brought up.

Did people forget WT/FI/GT/AT/PT don't have pp reductions? >_> Get with a Cati/PP Skill (or Bullet Save). Theres also Te/PP Generate (and eventually Sori/ PP Generate). Techers have the option of Te/Tech PP Save (and soon Orpa/Tech PP Save).

Winter_of_uno

Mar 31, 2008, 03:34 AM

I will try out Gunmaster. Twins come in handy for zalure but thats about it for me. Only real letdown is that they cannot use nades. Mechgun and Xbow are both cool but I can live without them, especially when Rifle and Laser get the hax0r update, coupled with faster firing speed and lv41 PAs for GM. Just gotta level Guntecher now.

Andy1423

Mar 31, 2008, 10:40 AM

Rifles and Lazers are going to IZZOWN !!!

Dein

Mar 31, 2008, 12:05 PM

On 2008-03-30 23:25, super_luu wrote:
The PP deficiency thing keeps being brought up.

Did people forget WT/FI/GT/AT/PT don't have pp reductions? >_> Get with a Cati/PP Skill (or Bullet Save). Theres also Te/PP Generate (and eventually Sori/ PP Generate). Techers have the option of Te/Tech PP Save (and soon Orpa/Tech PP Save).

Did you forget that those classes also don't have an additional 30% PP cost added to their PAs? The PP penalty these classes have is not really a problem you should underestimate, even if you use a skill save and pp regen unit.

pikachief

Mar 31, 2008, 12:12 PM

if your gonna be using all S ranks, u should grind them and they should be having a ton of PP. if your still running out, im pretty sure thats the reason Photon charges drop like monomates now >.>

but right now i feel like an idiot for selling 2 twin tornado's and 3 hyper vipers right before this info came out X.x

Dein

Mar 31, 2008, 12:25 PM

On 2008-03-31 10:12, pikachief wrote:
if your gonna be using all S ranks, u should grind them and they should be having a ton of PP. if your still running out, im pretty sure thats the reason Photon charges drop like monomates now >.>

but right now i feel like an idiot for selling 2 twin tornado's and 3 hyper vipers right before this info came out X.x

Grinding S ranks really depends a lot on luck and how much money you have to blow. Charges do drop a lot more than they used to but I wouldn't say they drop so often that you can just spam them. I'm saying that the PP penalty on these classes, mixed with the speed they get, can be a bigger problem than you'd think.

Darius_Drake

Mar 31, 2008, 12:27 PM

I am sorry about suggesting that Masterforce should have better support techs. Unfortunately I don't see how letting them have better support techs render other techers obsolete. As another poster stated:

Force: 20/20
Fortetecher: 40/40

These are the pure classes

Acrotecher: 30/50

If you give the Masterforce a speed boost like the Acrotecher and penalize it in PP usage and cut down the weapons usage and make the spells like

Masterforce 50/30

I would hardly call that a broken class that will make other classes obsolete.

Acrotecher: 30/50
Fortetecher: 40/40
Masterforce: 50/30 (with more weapon restrictions and pp efficiency penalty)

That is the very definition of variety and in this scenario the class will not be broken. If your playing style is support you will still choose Acrotecher. If your playing style is strictly offensive then Masterforce is your speed. If you want a nice balance Fortetecher will still be your class.

This thread is titled "Thoughts About the Master Class's". Silly me, I thought that meant I was free to give my thoughts on what I know about the master classes. I haven't made any demands on ST to change anything. I am just expressing my thoughts on the classes. The only reason I won't use Fighmaster is because my favorite melee weapon is not included in the class. The Gunmaster looks sweet, but I don't have a high level gunner. The only thing that bothers me about Masterforce is that a basic class (Force) has the ability to have higher level support spells. Making the support spells at this class cap at 30 would make the most sense looking at the other advanced techer classes. It would not make the other classes obsolete.

[ This Message was edited by: Darius_Drake on 2008-03-31 10:28 ]

pikachief

Mar 31, 2008, 12:28 PM

I spam my PP cahrges http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_frown.gif lol.... anyways.

Yes it'll be hard and you'll run out of PP quick, but this is probably just an excuse for u all to use more regular attacks, since it'll charge up the PP quicker.

With G-rods and P-wands i dont think Techers will have that much trouble with PAs, and gunners have destas all over the place for super cheap along with hyper vipers and meteor cannons.

DreXxiN

Mar 31, 2008, 02:32 PM

I suppose you could grind S rank weapons for more PP...

Grinder Base S = 30000 Meseta

Cati Skill PP Save= 80000000 Meseta

PHOTON CHARGE = 500 Meseta

Choose your destiny...

[ This Message was edited by: DreXxiN on 2008-03-31 12:33 ]

panzer_unit

Mar 31, 2008, 04:29 PM

On 2008-03-31 12:32, DreXxiN wrote:
I suppose you could grind S rank weapons for more PP...

Grinder Base S = 30000 Meseta

Cati Skill PP Save= 80000000 Meseta

PHOTON CHARGE = 500 Meseta

Choose your destiny...

Don't forget carrying spare weapons to swap into the palette... and the big-PP advantage on Kubara weapons for some types (axes, double sabers, shotguns, cannons)

Is the PP drain a headache if your team just consists of two Master types? You've gotta do three times as much damage each as you'd have to to clear the same mission in a full party.

desturel

Apr 1, 2008, 09:14 AM

On 2008-03-31 10:28, pikachief wrote:
With G-rods and P-wands i dont think Techers will have that much trouble with PAs

Gaozoran rods are pretty garbage for PP. Since they only rechargge 3 per tick, the Halarod winds up casting more times. The Gaozoran rod is purely for power, but if you have Psychowand, there isn't really a reason to use Gaozoran except as a backup wand. I use Gaozoran over Halarod, but Kazarod over Gaozoran and Psychowand over over everything else (as it should be).

Inazuma

Apr 1, 2008, 11:21 AM

pwand recharges 20 pp at a time for MF. and puushan (madoog) does 10 pp.

Gen2000

Apr 1, 2008, 11:26 AM

I'm liking all of the master classes.

- Fighmaster, Spear and Axe takes care of nearly 95% of mobs anyways when I solo as FF. Chikki/Choutasu is excellent at times but I won't miss it much with a speedhax Jaborga and lawl at even faster Majarra. Lack of Handgun is meh at best since the bulk of damage comes from melee'ing even on bosses like De Rol and Onma/Dimma. I only shoot the handgun to not be as bored. The limitation vs. those rare "you need a handgun to shoot this button" missions won't be that bad imo since I there will still be few non-Master classes/Gunmasters when I need them.

My main issue is the fact that I have a Cast FF, the whole Srank armor with extra slot is a pain in the ass since the obvious Stormline is out of question. I still have yet to see Sefari-senba drop and Castest Line doesn't drop enough for me to have a full rainbow of em yet (the prices of them in shops is too retarded). Also the PP drain rate, I used a Hard Power Charge on a fighter before and it sucked hard on any mission longer than 7min. That may be the only thing that keeps me being Fortefighter instead.

- Gunmaster, ignoring the lack of Grenade which I think may be ok with increased Shotgun speed (though seeing a lv.50 Durenga would have been awesome, instant death upon hit? lol) I don't like the Twin Handgun inclusion. Xbow or Grenade would have been much better. The few times you'll need to use Twin Handgun Rifle will be better, especially with the update. Lack of melee kinda sucks but then again the increased Shotgun speed may help, already do 1.5-3k on melee resistant mobs with Shotgun plus they still get DoT traps. It may hurt them vs. certain bosses though since Majarra was the strongest offensive option Fortegunner had on certain bosses but the power of lv.50 Rifle/Shotgun and faster firing rate may make up for that.

I use Hard Power Charge on my Fortegunner anyways so the whole PP deal with GM won't be as annoying or a shock to deal with compared to Fighmaster.

- Masterforce, finally good casting speed with good power behind it. The lv.10 support kind of sucks but for me it's mainly because of the weaker Retier and Zodieal (for evade for Just Counter>Tech spam on certain mobs). I won't have any problems using the buff items though. I could care less about Resta/Reverser. There are 3-4 other classes to babysit crappy players already. Nice to have a nuke able class actually focusing on their nuking ability.

Inazuma

Apr 1, 2008, 11:36 AM

On 2008-04-01 09:26, Gen2000 wrote:

- Masterforce, finally good casting speed with good power behind it. The lv.10 support kind of sucks but for me it's mainly because of the weaker Retier and Zodieal (for evade for Just Counter>Tech spam on certain mobs). I won't have any problems using the buff items though. I could care less about Resta/Reverser. There are 3-4 other classes to babysit crappy players already. Nice to have a nuke able class actually focusing on their nuking ability.

MF doesnt block nearly as often as FT, but they can cast techs so fast that the enemies cant even move. any click tech casted from a madoog is so fast it has the same kind of effect as damu techs do. you keep the monsters constantly pinned down from the flinches.

panzer_unit

Apr 1, 2008, 11:45 AM

On 2008-04-01 09:26, Gen2000 wrote:
I'm liking all of the master classes.
...
My main issue is the fact that I have a Cast FF, the whole Srank armor with extra slot is a pain in the ass since the obvious Stormline is out of question. I still have yet to see Sefari-senba drop and Castest Line doesn't drop enough for me to have a full rainbow of em yet

Castest Line is gunner-only armor too... we really get screwed on high-end choices. There's Serafi, personally I'm hoping to get my hands on some Shinowa even though no body slot.

AmyPsycho

Apr 1, 2008, 12:07 PM

On 2008-03-28 13:46, chaostroop3 wrote:
masterforce need like at least lev 30 support and like 30 range and 10 skills.... i mean a bow is a force only wepon (other than pro) and cards are force only , fighmaster and master gunner need atleast level 10 range and strick to be able to get threw all the stages

when i say force i mean magic classes

Huh? What are you talking about, per say? I'd like at least 20 support, but we get 50 range. That's dandy. We dont need skills. I support this class being for those that just want to tech-damage. I'm all for it, I never used other stuff anyway.

AmyPsycho

Apr 1, 2008, 12:12 PM

I was disappointed at first as well by the whole 10 support stuff.. but yea, all my friends know me quite well as a Tech Nuker. The more I think about it, the more I'm thoroughly excited for Masterforce. I rarely EVER use support, I'll do items for that. I'm looking forward to just destroying things. I dont use swords, etc either, only rods and occasionally wands when i want to spam a tech quicker.

I'd support raising buffs to 20, but otherwise this is just a nice, hardcore focused damage class for Techers, which we've wanted all along in the first place.

I shall be satisfied. http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif

painXxX

Apr 2, 2008, 03:37 PM

there really going with the master classes?well I did look at them and I thought they were bad..but only my opinion cuz I read they can use S-rank double sabers axes spears and think knucles then under that it said that they can only use S-rank armor/weapons..did I just read it wrong?

Umberger

Apr 2, 2008, 03:46 PM

No, you did not, the three master classes can only use S rank weapons and armor, but C-S units. Fighmaster and Gunmaster have 4 weapons, and Masterforce has 3...the fourth weapon in question for Fighmaster however, is a Sword...not Knuckles.

painXxX

Apr 2, 2008, 04:52 PM

someone made a thing before about the master classes they said something about an acromaster and also they showed that the master classes had much more to choose from..well now I'm going to still be sticking with forte fighter and techer..

Umberger

Apr 2, 2008, 04:53 PM

On 2008-04-02 14:52, painXxX wrote:
someone made a thing before about the master classes they said something about an acromaster and also they showed that the master classes had much more to choose from..well now I'm going to still be sticking with forte fighter and techer..

You can select the master classes offline through hacking/modding/whatever you want to call it, but they all have random stat modifiers (although I believe Fighmaster, Gunmaster, and Masterforce had the same modifiers) and weapon selections...I believe the advanced types were the same way in PSU v1's offline mode.

painXxX

Apr 2, 2008, 04:58 PM

I only play online..but im quiting for a while after max atack..to bad that there not how he said they were...

bp_shoruko

Apr 2, 2008, 06:48 PM

Not what? overpowered?

Reginaldo

Apr 2, 2008, 06:54 PM

I'm glad the 3 new classes don't make all the others obsolete. I'm sure alot of people feel the same way.

bp_shoruko

Apr 2, 2008, 06:57 PM

The fighmaster definitely sounds perfect for my cast... although I know that many little kids will not want to use it because they can't use their slicers/ the master classes stats aren't as high as their corresponding Forte.

gryphonvii

Apr 2, 2008, 10:41 PM

I am actually impressed with these master classes. They seem well balanced and not the uber-soldiers everyone was hoping would null out every other class. I can't see why everyone is complaining, if you don't like them then don't change, I like how they are meant to be support-style classes that should be in a party.

majan

Apr 2, 2008, 11:42 PM

back before anybody knew anything concrete about the master classes, one person kept saying something about there being less diversity in what these new classes would be endowed with and that being a "master class" would suggest something more along the lines of a deeper expertise in the given area,rather than a fighmaster having all S-rank melee A-rank twin handguns and handguns and level 20 support techs like some others were suggesting.

oh,right,that was majan. I didnt think they'd take it this far with limiting the weapon selection the way they did,but I must say that each of these classes are constructed for team play. sure you can say masterforce is a good soloing class cus it has lots of offensive firepower but bear in mind we can never rely on technics for support anymore given that they will all SUCK. so we will need,in order to perform with true efficiency,a teammate,preferably a FT or AT to keep us buffed strong and healed well. besides, if you think a fragile force,even a strong one,is enough to solo any mission in this game,head over to neudaiz and enjoy running through any of the old school missions and let me know how long it takes.

anyways, I like the idea, but I do think that fighmaster and gunmaster could have gotten a little bit of a wider choice I mean c'mon gunners deserve grenade launchers,and fighters definitely deserve either knux or twin claws,or both. also the fact that MF's will have an increased cast speed(which is fucking lightning-fast,I saw a youtube video that I lost the link for -.-) along with superior levelled technics makes them very appealing for the sorcerer/ess purists like me. while I think that they could have gotten a little bit more in the TP region(they edge AT by only 2%,and they have buffs that shit all over this difference) I think masterforces are pretty well setup,they have everything they need. the illest wands,the illest mags,and of course the illest rods.

interesting that they saw fit to grant doublesaber access elsewhere and then grant fighgunners 2 new s-rank range weapons. it's like they were apologizing to one of the most rigged classes in the whole game.

well,forces,gather up your megistarides and trimates. it's gonna be a fun run from here on out.

pikachief

Apr 2, 2008, 11:58 PM

there was several people with that idea not just u http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

I had that idea and im pretty sure Zorafim did too

zeroguy518

Apr 3, 2008, 09:06 AM

Anyone else psyked they don't have to carry around a buff rod http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif?

panzer_unit

Apr 3, 2008, 10:18 AM

On 2008-04-02 21:42, majan wrote:
fighmaster having all S-rank melee A-rank twin handguns and handguns and level 20 support techs like some others were suggesting.

I was in with those guys. Basically I couldn't imagine how ST could make a playable type MORE specialized than the Forte's we have.

I didnt think they'd take it this far with limiting the weapon selection the way they did,but I must say that each of these classes are constructed for team play

The unappealing restrictions on weapons, stats, and PP are what make the Master jobs awesome IMO. They're so hardcore that they sorta look like crap on paper and you can definitely see how the Fortes are still worthwhile class choices.

interesting that they saw fit to grant doublesaber access elsewhere and then grant fighgunners 2 new s-rank range weapons. it's like they were apologizing to one of the most rigged classes in the whole game.

Who plays Fighgunner these days? The moment it wasn't a super-close second to Fortefighter in terms of ATP people left like rats on a sinking ship. AT has better stats, the same melee/range balance, and a speed boost... FF has all the melee weapons save double saber, with free skill save and hueg ATP.

There are more Protransers even, now that their stats aren't so awful as to ruin the draw of their incredibly awesome EX traps and weapon collection.

They were too strong in PSU, but post-expansion Fighgunner needed some love and it was also awfully nice that rare mechs and twins aren't limited to a specialized job like GT.

painXxX

Apr 3, 2008, 12:58 PM

actualy yea it is good there not how they could of been I like my FF http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_razz.gif

Zorafim

Apr 3, 2008, 01:02 PM

On 2008-04-02 21:58, pikachief wrote:
I had that idea and im pretty sure Zorafim did too

You mean master classes being more specialized than their forte counterparts? No, I was hoping for an offline mode type class. If only so I could rebuild my paladin, or use my muguntek and serafis on the same class.

Darius_Drake

Apr 3, 2008, 02:43 PM

Strangely one of the things I do really like about the master classes is that they specialize in their type of weapons only. The melee class has no access to techs or guns, the range class has no access to techs or melee weapons, and tech classes have no access to guns or melee weapons. I can't wait to see how a party that has a masterforce, fighmaster, and gunmaster work together.

-Kenji-

Apr 3, 2008, 04:12 PM

Gunmaster is what is making me consider returning to PSU.

After all...I can use Dual Handguns! (yay).

Gen2000

Apr 5, 2008, 01:27 PM

On 2008-04-01 09:36, Inazuma wrote:
MF doesnt block nearly as often as FT, but they can cast techs so fast that the enemies cant even move. any click tech casted from a madoog is so fast it has the same kind of effect as damu techs do. you keep the monsters constantly pinned down from the flinches.

I'm really liking the sound of that, thanks for the info.

panzer_unit:
Castest Line is gunner-only armor too... we really get screwed on high-end choices. There's Serafi, personally I'm hoping to get my hands on some Shinowa even though no body slot.

Damn I thought Castest Line wasn't type specific...ugh that just makes the whole transfer progress even more frustating. Was hoping not to have to resort to Shinowa (I like body slot units) but I seen to have better shot at getting that then Serafi.

Ahkaskar

Apr 5, 2008, 01:51 PM

I'd think if these "master" types were meant to replace the advanced types, the advanced types wouldn't go beyond level 10.

Inazuma

Apr 6, 2008, 02:47 AM

On 2008-04-05 11:51, Ahkaskar wrote:
I'd think if these "master" types were meant to replace the advanced types, the advanced types wouldn't go beyond level 10.

they might not go past lv 20.

IsoDonk

Apr 6, 2008, 05:54 PM

On 2008-03-30 22:54, XenithFlare wrote:
Now, if only there were a Master Protranser (ProtoMaster, if you will)... THERE'D be your weapons-god. Maybe give 'im lv30 melee and ranged PAs, but stick the class with 6 or 7 different weapon types, and traps of course. Mmmm...

This made me do a lol. How exactly is your proposed ProtoMaster any different to the Protranser we have now? http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif

panzer_unit

Apr 7, 2008, 10:50 AM

On 2008-04-06 15:54, IsoDonk wrote:

On 2008-03-30 22:54, XenithFlare wrote:
Now, if only there were a Master Protranser (ProtoMaster, if you will)... THERE'D be your weapons-god. Maybe give 'im lv30 melee and ranged PAs, but stick the class with 6 or 7 different weapon types, and traps of course. Mmmm...

This made me do a lol. How exactly is your proposed ProtoMaster any different to the Protranser we have now? http://www.pso-world.com/images/phpbb/icons/smiles/icon_smile.gif

PT W/ SPEED BOOST PLZ

Legendria

Apr 7, 2008, 10:56 AM

Uh.

FT with 31 self-buffing Retier > MF (until all spells are ready to cross from 40> 41) gg

3 minute runs. Laser spamming. Sounds like fun. Sign me up.

Inazuma

Apr 7, 2008, 01:09 PM

On 2008-04-07 08:56, Legendria wrote:
Uh.

FT with 31 self-buffing Retier > MF (until all spells are ready to cross from 40> 41) gg

3 minute runs. Laser spamming. Sounds like fun. Sign me up.

yea, for a low level player w/ low level techs and poor equip, i wouldnt be surprised if FT wins. thats what its for. its the step in between force and masterforce. FT seems like such shit after playing MF. i never want to change back to FT. just like an FT player wouldnt want to go back to Force.

[ This Message was edited by: Inazuma on 2008-04-07 15:22 ]

Dirkster111

Apr 8, 2008, 01:56 PM

Not sure if I've read it anywhere or not, but someone refresh my memory. Do Gunmaster's get the use of traps?

Zorafim

Apr 9, 2008, 12:16 PM

Given time to get over the fact that I won't get my Paladin class, I'm overall starting to like the concept of master classes. After seeing lv20s be the same class as you, it's nice to finally have something to differentiate myself from the common player. Even if low levels can easily get the class, they probably won't be able to take full advantage of it due to the restrictions on weapon levels. And even if they do get their S ranks, they probably won't have the skill to play the class well.
I'm also glad that I finally get a full melee class. Many techers are rejoicing that they are no longer forced to support, I'm glad that I no longer have to carry around a handgun on my person all the time. Ranged has always been my least favorite weapon type, especially with small weapons, and now I don't have to deal with it at all. I still want some magic on me, but between mates, traps (fighmasters are getting them, right?), and SUVs, I think I'm satisfied.
As for the downsides, I can live with the weapon limitations. I don't like using A rank weapons anyway, and my choice in weapons is different enough. I have the overwhelming powerhouse weapon, the spread weapon, the direct weapon, and the quick multiple hit weapon. Between these four, I can preform any melee feat that I can do on my fortefighter, probably even more now that I can Tornado Dance. I also have a smaller PA access, meaning that I can level all my PAs without too much hassle. All this, and I can get rid of the downside these weapons have via speed boost.
For the PP penalty, I'm a fan of my skillsave anyway. I've noticed that it's diminished in value since AoI started, so seeing it work overtime will probably be nice. I'll probably have to hunt a cati save, once it becomes easier to get. As for running out of PP, money has become so easy to get at higher levels that dropping 500mes every now and then won't hurt me won't hurt me, no more....

Heh, I'm actually looking forward to this.