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View Full Version : We might have a problem with the support techs.



Tek[+]Lok
May 30, 2008, 10:54 PM
When someone casts a support tech (shifta for example) and someone else casts a lower level of the same tech, which one remains? The higher level one or the more recent one?

Here's my example: I was playing white beast, I have level 5 shifta, and with my bow i did about 220 damage to its head or wings. Anyways I join another party of white beast right after. This guy in my party was casting all his support techs as well as I was. I thought that was fine because it helps us both level up our techs, and I thought the higher leveled techs wouldn't get overridden with lover leveled techs.

I get to the boss, and I noticed I was doing like 160 damage with my bow. I decided to run away from my party, cast my shifta again. I started doing 220s again, and quite consistently

I'm I just going crazy? Perhaps I need to do more testing on this, because maybe i just saw a good streak of critical hits?

In PSO it was fine because if someone casted level 30 boosters, then another person with lower level techs couldn't ruin it if they casted them

beatrixkiddo
May 30, 2008, 10:56 PM
Bosses sometimes take less damage from ranged attacks, depending on where you shoot them.

Libram
May 30, 2008, 11:02 PM
The support TECH that hits you last will be the one that takes effect. That means a 31+ Shifta can be overriden by a Lv 1 Shifta. I find it quite annoying at times, especially when I see a Wartecher casting Support spells right after my Fortetecher casts all his.

Tek[+]Lok
May 30, 2008, 11:04 PM
Well i was shooting him in the head and wings always. And the damage is consistent, I understand the the rest of the body has more defense.

But yeah, if thats true about how higher level techs can be overridden by lower level techs, then that should totally be patched up.

beatrixkiddo
May 30, 2008, 11:05 PM
Are you sure? i'm pretty sure i've used a megistaride, got hit by level 1 shifta, and then had all 4 buffs wear off at once. :/

Tek[+]Lok
May 30, 2008, 11:09 PM
well what you can do is, take a really high level shifta or deband, whatever, test out how it affects you and record damage you do to a simple enemy on an easy quest.

remove that tech disk, and replace it with a brand new one from the store, and test that out, see how long it lasts compared to your better tech.

ashley50
May 30, 2008, 11:11 PM
a lv31 Buff can be overwritten by Lower buffs...

31+ Buffs can last for 5 mins
21+ Buffs lasts for about 4 mins
11+...i guess its 3 mins
and lower, i presume its 2mins

Tek[+]Lok
May 30, 2008, 11:13 PM
We are doomed....

beatrixkiddo
May 30, 2008, 11:14 PM
Just boot anyone who doesnt have maxed buffs, obv

EtherForce
May 30, 2008, 11:17 PM
Oh that sucks. I was in a party with a higher level techer once, casting my lower level buffs thinking they wouldn't override.

ashley50
May 30, 2008, 11:17 PM
Just tell them to let him/her buff (assuming he's a "Support" type techer not one of those selfish ones that use Magistar)

if you have the higher Buffs, tell them you'll do that Duty ;l

beatrixkiddo
May 30, 2008, 11:19 PM
just boot them, less arguing involved ;o

Sasamichan
May 30, 2008, 11:31 PM
Just boot anyone who doesnt have maxed buffs, obv


just boot them, less arguing involved ;o

I'll resort to that if they argue with you if you ask them to stop using their gimp buffs.

Weeaboolits
May 30, 2008, 11:36 PM
I just use megistar as WT, people usually have 'rides anyway.

Tek[+]Lok
May 30, 2008, 11:52 PM
Maybe we should write up a petition about that and see if we can get it patched, because its really time consuming just to figure out the tech levels between people if we were to leave it, and its already a pain just leveling them.

Sasamichan
May 30, 2008, 11:55 PM
Lok;2031961']Maybe we should write up a petition about that and see if we can get it patched, because its really time consuming just to figure out the tech levels between people if we were to leave it, and its already a pain just leveling them.

May I suggest posting this idea here?
http://boards2.sega.com/psu_board/viewforum.php?f=41

Tek[+]Lok
May 31, 2008, 12:40 AM
one does not simply wak into sega.com and ask for a specific new patch/update....

ashley50
May 31, 2008, 12:58 AM
Sega JP...
Sega US is just a mere pawn ;}

Shinko
May 31, 2008, 01:22 AM
Yea higher buff can be written over by lower ones. and it seem ppl do it all the time

yea i hate when ppl do that. i just stop buffing all together even if mine is higher.

When im playing wartecher i hate to see my buffs higher than a FT or a AT

Hiero_Glyph
May 31, 2008, 02:18 AM
Oh that sucks. I was in a party with a higher level techer once, casting my lower level buffs thinking they wouldn't override.

Just once though, right?

It does suck, but always define your role when joining a party. It will help to keep everyone doing their job.

SabZero
May 31, 2008, 04:24 AM
Just let the ppl with lower buffs buff first, they get to level the TECHs too, yes?

And shame on you for booting XP

Clint
May 31, 2008, 04:36 AM
Ahem *cough* *cough* Buff Party's + Harquick = lvl'd buffs. :-D

Oh and here is some info to help you out,

Shifta = ATP Boost http://www.pso-world.com/items/psu/12/669/shifta/ Striking

Deband = DFP Boost http://www.pso-world.com/items/psu/12/673/deband/ Armor

Zodial = ATA/EVP Boost http://www.pso-world.com/items/psu/12/676/zodial/ Range & Evation

Retier = Tech/MST Boost http://www.pso-world.com/items/psu/12/681/retier/ Techs & Mental

Hope this helps out :-D

WHlTEKNIGHT
May 31, 2008, 05:17 AM
Just let the ppl with lower buffs buff first, they get to level the TECHs too, yes?

And shame on you for booting XP

no they should go and do what we all have had to do and get there asses into a buff party.
we have all gone through that and seeing as I have put the effort in i dont want some numnuts saying after over buffing that I have to level them some how

AerisZeal
May 31, 2008, 06:39 AM
Everyone realizes this is why buff parties work, right? :wacko:

Powder Keg
May 31, 2008, 07:05 AM
When PSO for Gamecube and Xbox came out, they fixed this issue.


You would thnk they'd remember what they did when PSU was released, but I guess not. It does get annoying at times. Especially since someone with lvl1 Jellen can overwrite and Acrotecher's buffs.


Everyone realizes this is why buff parties work, right?

Not everyone has time for those...maybe when we get he PA exp update.

AerisZeal
May 31, 2008, 07:46 AM
Not everyone has time for those...maybe when we get he PA exp update.

Oh no, I didn't mean it like that. ^^;

I meant that the override of lower level buffs resulted in buff parties, without it this way buff parties would be essentially useless.

F-Gattaca
May 31, 2008, 08:06 AM
just boot them, less arguing involved ;o

... And ya'll wonder why I do this to people using the Winky-O:

http://www.funnyhub.com/pictures/img/cookie-monster.jpg

I guess I recalled wrong about this whole buffs override thing. I could have SWORN that lower level buffs don't override higher level ones. Have I been confusing that with SEs applied to enemies?

And while we're at it--Aeris, I'm not quite sure I follow you on that logic. I always figured that buffs "hit" everything and that those hits count no matter what kind of buff they have on them (or lack thereof), like with Giresta. I've seen buff parties where people spam giresta even though everyone's fully healed and have their "regen boost" stacked to the limit, and still manage to level it.

AerisZeal
May 31, 2008, 08:22 AM
Right, because it works like a buff. Personally if the effect didn't take hold I wouldn't count it as a "hit", thus my logic. Of course Sega may do it differently and so may the entire world but that's how i see it. And with Giresta, working like a buff would mean that everytime it "hits" the regen goes back down to nill because it's being replaced, like with Shifta lv1 vs Shifta Lv31 or even Shifta 31 vs Shifta 31 seeing as recasting causes the buffs to last their full duration. Of course none of this is fact, again just how I interpret it. :wacko:

Hope that made sense... ^^;

Off topic: OMG, I miss your sig too! That was a nice sig!

Astarin
May 31, 2008, 10:15 AM
I guess I recalled wrong about this whole buffs override thing. I could have SWORN that lower level buffs don't override higher level ones. Have I been confusing that with SEs applied to enemies?

I dunno. Frankly, I'm with you on this one. I could have sworn that I did a test before. My level 30 S/D/R/Z, and then a friend re-cast his under-level-ten Shifta. We waited until they ran out. They all ran out at the same time, which would mean it doesn't override. *sigh* Maybe I'm crazy. I'll test it again if I can find someone to help me with it.

Clint
May 31, 2008, 01:09 PM
When PSO for Gamecube and Xbox came out, they fixed this issue.


You would thnk they'd remember what they did when PSU was released, but I guess not. It does get annoying at times. Especially since someone with lvl1 Jellen can overwrite and Acrotecher's buffs.



Not everyone has time for those...maybe when we get he PA exp update.

Jellen overwriting buffs? or Debuffs???? :-?

Vent
May 31, 2008, 01:16 PM
Making the game too easy is a complaint too right? But I guess there's a huge difference in difficulty and simple annoyance.

Svaltus
May 31, 2008, 01:26 PM
Dont look stranger, but is normal apear in party stupids wartechers and gunterchers try overwritten cast spells make for fortetecher or acrotechers!

Clint
May 31, 2008, 01:26 PM
When PSO for Gamecube and Xbox came out, they fixed this issue.


You would thnk they'd remember what they did when PSU was released, but I guess not. It does get annoying at times. Especially since someone with lvl1 Jellen can overwrite and Acrotecher's buffs.



Not everyone has time for those...maybe when we get he PA exp update.

Here is some clarification on Debuffs

Jellen, A fire-based TECHNIC, reducing enemy attack power for a set period of time.

http://www.pso-world.com/items/psu/12/670/jellen/

Zalure, An ice-based TECHNIC. Supports allies by reducing enemy defense for a set period of time.

http://www.pso-world.com/items/psu/12/674/zalure/

Zodeel, A lightning TECHNIC, reducing enemy accuracy and agility for a set period of time.

http://www.pso-world.com/items/psu/12/677/zoldeel/


Link to all techs

http://www.pso-world.com/items/psu/12-3/technic/

Hope this helps :-D

Clint
May 31, 2008, 01:29 PM
Dont look stranger, but is normal apear in party stupids wartechers and gunterchers try overwritten cast spells make for fortetecher or acrotechers!



LOL...............

furrypaws
May 31, 2008, 02:38 PM
Jellen overwriting buffs? or Debuffs???? :-?

I think he was referring to an enemy that casts level 1 jellen overwriting someone who has level 31 shifta, which does happen.

I'm not complaining, as without it, my reverser wouldn't be nearly this high. ^.^

The low buffs overwriting high buffs is annoying though, I'll agree with that.

Aumi
May 31, 2008, 03:15 PM
I don't know if someone has written this already, but IIRC, a bow's damage is the same on all spots of a creatures body.

Niloklives
May 31, 2008, 03:29 PM
Bosses sometimes take less damage from ranged attacks, depending on where you shoot them.



Bows ignore defense, so that argument is moot here.

Yes the only rule with buffs is the last one cast is the one in effect.

I see people cast buffs over others all the time...lvl 20s over lvl 40s and the lvl 20s that were cast would expire first....by several minutes.


... And ya'll wonder why I do this to people using the Winky-O:

http://www.funnyhub.com/pictures/img/cookie-monster.jpg

I guess I recalled wrong about this whole buffs override thing. I could have SWORN that lower level buffs don't override higher level ones. Have I been confusing that with SEs applied to enemies?

And while we're at it--Aeris, I'm not quite sure I follow you on that logic. I always figured that buffs "hit" everything and that those hits count no matter what kind of buff they have on them (or lack thereof), like with Giresta. I've seen buff parties where people spam giresta even though everyone's fully healed and have their "regen boost" stacked to the limit, and still manage to level it.

Giresta is overwritten just like any other buff. I've been tagged qith lvl 11 giresta and had it negate my lvl 31...regenerating 2% as opposed to 3%...So by that logic, the point is SOMETHING has to be overwritten for exp to be accrued.

tAKt
May 31, 2008, 09:27 PM
Dont look stranger, but is normal apear in party stupids wartechers and gunterchers try overwritten cast spells make for fortetecher or acrotechers!

I've had many case's of this happening to me, was doing Pa runs the other day and this Wt insisted he put his buffs over mine... (Which are all 31+.) I just sighed and shook my head =/

Niloklives
May 31, 2008, 09:35 PM
yeah I had a FT with lvl 11 buffs overwriting my lvl 31s and when I said "hey, i got it...my buffs are stronger and you're overwriting mine" they told me to stfu cause they could help too...they're lucky I wasn't leader.

but yes they do overwrite and some people are just crazy when it comes to playing a support role.

Powder Keg
May 31, 2008, 11:21 PM
I think he was referring to an enemy that casts level 1 jellen overwriting someone who has level 31 shifta, which does happen.



LMFAO

How did he not see that?

mooonbow
May 31, 2008, 11:28 PM
Lok;2031791']When someone casts a support tech (shifta for example) and someone else casts a lower level of the same tech, which one remains? The higher level one or the more recent one?

Here's my example: I was playing white beast, I have level 5 shifta, and with my bow i did about 220 damage to its head or wings. Anyways I join another party of white beast right after. This guy in my party was casting all his support techs as well as I was. I thought that was fine because it helps us both level up our techs, and I thought the higher leveled techs wouldn't get overridden with lover leveled techs.

I get to the boss, and I noticed I was doing like 160 damage with my bow. I decided to run away from my party, cast my shifta again. I started doing 220s again, and quite consistently

I'm I just going crazy? Perhaps I need to do more testing on this, because maybe i just saw a good streak of critical hits?

In PSO it was fine because if someone casted level 30 boosters, then another person with lower level techs couldn't ruin it if they casted them


ok you cast a lvl 5 shifta and you were using a bow? how is this at all possiable what class allows you to cast a lvl 5 support buff and use a bow this is very confusing to me

Powder Keg
May 31, 2008, 11:30 PM
xD :D

mvffin
Jun 1, 2008, 02:48 AM
Lok;2031791']When someone casts a support tech (shifta for example) and someone else casts a lower level of the same tech, which one remains? The higher level one or the more recent one?The most recent one remains. ALWAYS.


Lok;2031791']Here's my example: I was playing white beast, I have level 5 shifta, and with my bow i did about 220 damage to its head or wings. Anyways I join another party of white beast right after. This guy in my party was casting all his support techs as well as I was. I thought that was fine because it helps us both level up our techs, and I thought the higher leveled techs wouldn't get overridden with lover leveled techs.

I get to the boss, and I noticed I was doing like 160 damage with my bow. I decided to run away from my party, cast my shifta again. I started doing 220s again, and quite consistently.

You were using Light or Dark bow, yes? Alterazgohg can change its element back and forth between Dark and Light, making your damage change significantly.


Bosses sometimes take less damage from ranged attacks, depending on where you shoot them.

Bows ignore def, but not bullet resistance. I don't think alterazgohg has any bullet resistant areas.

ThEoRy
Jun 1, 2008, 10:13 AM
lol where have you been? It's has always been this way. And has always sucked...

desturel
Jun 1, 2008, 12:15 PM
no they should go and do what we all have had to do and get there asses into a buff party.

I never had to buff party and my buffs are currently level 35. :D

Of course it helps that I've been using them since buffs were released.

gryphonvii
Jun 1, 2008, 12:25 PM
if they patch this, buff parties are eliminated since buff parties rely on the ability to override anyones buffs.

Cathbar
Jun 1, 2008, 01:45 PM
if they patch this, buff parties are eliminated since buff parties rely on the ability to override anyones buffs.

Unless I'm mistaken, this isn't true. I've been able to go into a mission by myself and level my buffs from level 2 to level 11+

I didn't have to wait for my buffs to wear off

AerisZeal
Jun 1, 2008, 01:55 PM
That's because every time a buff hits someone it's reapplied, replacing/overriding the old one with the new one.

Powder Keg
Jun 1, 2008, 02:31 PM
if they patch this, buff parties are eliminated since buff parties rely on the ability to override anyones buffs.

It doesn't necessarily have to mean that. The buff could still register as hitting a teamate, but just not give the effect because a higher level one is already in place.