Sori / TECH Charge vs. Har / Quick for a....

[Hiroko]

Cast FT. First off, I'm looking for some input, not CAST bashing, so save it <.<

Do you think it would be more benificial to use Sori / TECH Charge for the added dmg? Or perhaps Har / Quick for the speed? I wonder what the DPS would be in comparison w/ these 2 units.

Thanks in advance,

Hrk

[Turb0]

Har/quick is always better imo.

[Kizeragi]

Each have their strengths/weaknesses, but Har / Quick I find more effective overall, so I'd go with that.

[Miyoko]

I think Har / Quick will always give a higher DPS output. (Unless, of course, you're using Shadoogs! ;p)

Or you can get both, and swap them out depending on the tech you're using.

[R2D6battlebot]

I'd have to agree, I think Har/Quick would be more damage over time.

[Dragwind]

Get both. Some techs benefit more from the speed, like Ra techs, line techs, support techs. Others benefit more from the TP, like Dam and Nos techs.

Example- .5 of a second (or whatever it is) cut off from the startup of a Dam tech will not increase DPS when with added TP, you're doing more damage to each target, each hit.

[stukasa]

It's probably too much hassle to swap units back and forth during runs. If I had to pick one I'd pick Har/Quick simply because casting is more fun with a Quick unit, plus it's easier to hit enemies since there's less of a delay. -100 TP is what, 20-25 less damage? With faster casting you can make up for the loss in TP anyway. ^^

[Shou]

Har/quick is always better.

Fixed

For Har Quick to be = with other tech units it would have to lower your TP by about 500 seriously

[Zorafim]

20-25 damage is more noticeable when doing 100 damage per tech than if you're doing 1000. Regardless, I doubt you're going to be missing the extra TP, even if you're scrounging for as much as you can get.

[erickarim]

unequipping a har and equipping a stc is +380 tp.

[Shou]

Get both. Some techs benefit more from the speed, like Ra techs, line techs, support techs. Others benefit more from the TP, like Dam and Nos techs.

Example- .5 of a second (or whatever it is) cut off from the startup of a Dam tech will not increase DPS when with added TP, you're doing more damage to each target, each hit.

Yup this is the only acception. But who wants to only use Sprey and "Duh uh yuk yuk im chacing you!" techs? Not me thats who. :etongue:

[Dragwind]

It's probably too much hassle to swap units back and forth during runs. If I had to pick one I'd pick Har/Quick simply because casting is more fun with a Quick unit, plus it's easier to hit enemies since there's less of a delay. -100 TP is what, 20-25 less damage? With faster casting you can make up for the loss in TP anyway. ^^


Why do so many people believe what they read on PSOW forums? Ever since that value randomly popped up at the gameplay and guides forum, many tend to use that 20-25 damage argument every time this topic of head units comes up.

Below is my main, Human male lvl 130 WT 20 with Dambarta 30, Tesbra +5.

(Dambarta doesn't even do it justice with its modifier, but the damage adds up over targets hit, and the amount of times hit)

http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c390/silenthorror666/psu20080604_194833_000.jpg

http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c390/silenthorror666/psu20080604_194906_002.jpg

http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c390/silenthorror666/psu20080604_194909_003.jpg



http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c390/silenthorror666/psu20080604_195005_004.jpg

http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c390/silenthorror666/psu20080604_195023_005.jpg

http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c390/silenthorror666/psu20080604_195031_006.jpg


Thats roughly ~440 more damage per "wave" on dambarta against 4 enemies. Thats a bad example, as dam techs should be used for hitting more enemies, anyhow.

[Hiroko]

Hmmm, 20-25 dmg less for -100tp? Would that be for all races? Please keep in mind that my base TP is 1337 at lvl130FT20. ^^; Well those pics were certainly helpful. I guess switching off between the 2 is prob the most benefical way to exploit the units. And knowing which tech to use it on helps as well. Thanks all for the input^^

[Astarin]

*nods* I usually argue for Quick units, but that's because my bread-and-butter attacks are the basic and Ra- technics. Dragwind is right, though. If you use the Dam- and Nos- technics more, then they'd easily benefit more from a TECH Charge or Force unit.

[Kion]

over sori-tech; i'd recommend orpa force if you can get your hands on it. the pp consumption on tech charge isn't very appealing. on all of my techers i generally equip quick units. for casting support, or getting an attack out before the hunters in the party massacre everything; it's essential.

... and cast FT bash!:bash:

[Weeaboolits]

On a cast FT? I'd recommend Me/ Quick over Har in this case, it's not that much less a speed boost for a smaller penalty, also a bit easier to get.

[Abashi76]

Cast FT. First off, I'm looking for some input, not CAST bashing, so save it <.<

Do you think it would be more benificial to use Sori / TECH Charge for the added dmg? Or perhaps Har / Quick for the speed? I wonder what the DPS would be in comparison w/ these 2 units.

Thanks in advance,

Hrk

I tried teching with a CASTs, although it doesn't work very well. Since CASTs don't do high damage with techs, its probably better to go with support techs.

Probably a Har / Quick would be the way to go, certain techs like resta and ice techniques would support the team well enough to contribute.

[dc534]

I say go Har Quick as well. I mean sure if you love damn techs go with the Orpa Force or Sori tech charge but most of the time that extra few seconds it takes to cast resta while not using a quick unit gets someone killed.

[stukasa]

Why do so many people believe what they read on PSOW forums? Ever since that value randomly popped up at the gameplay and guides forum, many tend to use that 20-25 damage argument every time this topic of head units comes up.
I didn't mean that the difference in damage between a Har/Quick and an Orpa/Force was 20-25, I meant your base damage would be ~25 less equipping a Har compared to not equipping it. Obviously if you swap a Har/Quick with Orpa/Force that's a 320 TP difference, which is 80 more base damage. Dambarta level 30 has a 130% modifier so 80 x 1.3 = ~104 more damage per hit.

After thinking about it, I think I prefer Ronin's answer: compromise with a Me/Quick. It's almost as fast as a Har and only -30 TP.

[RemiusTA]

ROFL cast FT

More like FTL </lame joke>


And WHAT THE HELL, PEOPLE, where are you getting 20~25 damage from? Are you serious?!

The difference in Sori/Tech charge and Orpa Force to a Har-Quick is substantial, at LEAST 300~500 damage.

[xEndrance]

Har / Quick
Bcause once you use it and switch to something else you notice the speed difference and once you see how slow you cast it start to get iritating.

[-Ryuki-]

Har / Quick
Bcause once you use it and switch to something else you notice the speed difference and once you see how slow you cast it start to get iritating.
Seconded.

[Hiroko]

Thanks once again for all the responses! I have a Har/Quick and the Sori / TECH Charge, so I'll be experimenting w/ some of these ideas, prob borrow my buddie's Me/Quick...
Every inch counts with my race/class combo.

...And thanks for refraining from the cast bashing, for those you who just couldn't resist...You'll be added to my NO RESTA list, so...I'd carry those Trimates so you can stay alive! =p

[RemiusTA]

Not like your resta can heal over 12 hit points anyway































[kidding]



Edit: im not entirely sure since my force is newman, but i would believe that TP boosters would be more benefical in this case to make up for the lack of damage.

Casts really cant afford to lose any more TP than they already dont have, so i would try to boost my attack power more.

Har/Quick is mostly for the forces who already can do decent damage but want to deal it quicker. However, sending off quick blasts that are weak really dont do too much.

But experimenting is best, i guess.

[Hiroko]

Good one, Remius...^^;

My Resta lvl25 does about 2100hp, though my hp is 2615, so I have to use it twice, if I'm low into the yellow zone

[dc534]

Cast FT is like a beast trying to use a gun. LOL. Seriously though I think Cast AT is much better than a cast FT you may wish to go that route with your cast. Another thing is also you will be able to equip storm lines as a AT this means that S-Rank SUV that is hot right now you too can wear, because other than that FT does not have access to to many armors that have both a head and an extra slot. So I definetly would go Cast AT if you go techer with your cast. Sure lvl 40 Techs are nice and all but they are not the be all end all. I guess you can get some shinowa lines if you go FT but those are also expensive to make.

[The_Gio]

Well if your a cast FT, to me it would make more sense to push for that tp you lack, speed isnt everything. The only reason I would recommend a har/quick is if your an AT and support otherwise,ill say go with the tech charge

And for the post above, a beast FoG is actually a deadly combo. They have ATP and the FoG's ATA makes up for the lack of ATA from the beast unlike the cast and FT's tp

[S4CT4L1TY]

Hmmmm if your gonna do support as a FT might as well be an acrotecher but id still say Har quick all the way

[Dragwind]

Well if your a cast FT, to me it would make more sense to push for that tp you lack, speed isnt everything. The only reason I would recommend a har/quick is if your an AT and support otherwise,ill say go with the tech charge

And for the post above, a beast FoG is actually a deadly combo. They have ATP and the FoG's ATA makes up for the lack of ATA from the beast unlike the cast and FT's tp

By FoG, do you mean fortegunner? If so, I'd hardly say just because the class has such a high ata modifier, doesn't mean its too much. Try using nades and lasers on beasts. Those 0's can add up pretty fast.

[The_Gio]

By FoG, do you mean fortegunner? If so, I'd hardly say just because the class has such a high ata modifier, doesn't mean its too much. Try using nades and lasers on beasts. Those 0's can add up pretty fast.

I have a beast Fortegunner with a Solid/Power S and I hardly miss and if I do hit a 0,its when the monster has that immunity where everything does 0.I hit in the 1ks against Dulk Fakis using a level 10 rising shot rifle which I only do 800 with my cast. Only reason a cast beats a beast at Fortegunner is because of SuV, but then again thats what would make casts a better anything.

[Dragwind]

I didn't say they miss with everything, they do fine with rifles, xbows, handguns, etc. Most of the equipment they perform well with. However, with Grenade launchers and laser cannons, you need all the ata you can get, and even a cast fortegunner gets a few 0's here and there with those.

[Hiroko]

I do like the prospect of AT, but it's not for me. I need the lvl40 TECHS for added dmg. As for the line shields...I have the Paradi and a Shinowa to make, so...I think that wil make a good combo.