here is sumthing else to ponder? uber weapon for fortegunner?

[mooonbow]

ok there are 3 Forte classes right?
ForteFighter, ForteTecher, ForteGunner..would you agree with me when i say that these 3 classes are the main gurdian<SP?> classes? if so then read on. here is my problem. FF and FT get an amazing weapon in the form of the agito replca, and bil de ax. 2 weapons one harder to get then the other but both are very powerfull. the FT gets a psycho wand and the gaozoran rod both hard to get and hard to get mats for them. i was wondering what do the ForteGunners get? ooo a song for death IMO one of the cheesest weapon out there. now while the FF and the FT get to keep there weapons (mentioned above) whenever they go to the masterclasses. the mastergunner looses there most powerfull weapon. but in reality a high grinded shigga desta does more dmg then the song for death. when are gunners gonna get an uber storng hard to find rifle? sumone mentioned a relic gun. iv never heard of this weapon. has anyone else? i want an uber weapon for my fortegunner!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Indica]

Love Inferno is a godly weapon but Sega fucked us all over when the Server overheated and majority of people could not log in during the long weekend holiday.

[mooonbow]

yes the allmighty love inferno a once a year item and again FF and FT can get there uber items all year long. does this seem right?

[Iduno]

Yeah I thought the love inferno might be good (maybe not for those who are insecure about their sexuality though lol seen people moan about sweet deaths hearts looking "gay" a few times :P (love all these heart weapons myself lol wish more werent female only))

Also you guys already get long range knockdown with your rifles so its not that bad if you dont get the better ones right away

[Scottbot]

rattlesnake i guess. untill killer elite and edel fusil are released.

[RegulusHikari]

Degahna Cannon is your best bet until Edel Fusil is released in three years. And the Spread Needle could also be considered a range Uber. (Mainstream company weapons aren't ubers)

The Relic Gun appears in your inventory when your room is full of cactachairs, you have 50% dark Yamata-misakis, a 46% ice Gi-senba, a power level of at least 9000, many pylons, and you have slain Ronald Mcdonald. Possibly.

[chaostroop3]

love inferno
rattlesnake / snac
spread needle
deghna cannon
theres others.......but they arnt any easyer to get than these

if you whant good weps and like guns go protrancer becouse all there wepons have a very good and expencve version =D

[Endykins]

Love inferno = GRM(meaning it is just the standard 12* weapon) product and does not = Repca/Pwand. Same with the Killer Elite.
There is currently no 12* gun equivilant to the two far as i'm concerned. Maybe the real spread needle will be when its released in 2012.

[MSAksion]

12* Kubara Agito Repca - Superior Broadsword
12* Kubara Psycho Wand - Superior Tech Rod
12* Kubara .................. - Superior ??????????

I'm thinking Spread Needle but thats a Shotgun. Most ForteGunners you think of Grenades or Rifles.

I'd love to see a .50 Cal Barrett Sniper Rifle from Kubara.

[Golto]

I agree it was pretty stupid of ST making a regular 12* weapon board drop only on a seasonal rare monster.

[Scottbot]

What makes a deghna cannon better than a meteor cannon??

[desturel]

What makes a deghna cannon better than a meteor cannon??

More PP for about the same amount of power? Plus it recharges faster.

[Turb0]

And the shot looks much better. Anyway, I think the spread needle/g is going to be FG's "uber" weapon for now. It's too bad ATP doesn't matter on shotguns. :(

[LuigiMario]

Bil De axe is not Uber. It drops off of a lot of missions and Goazoran isn't special eigther. Just Agito Repca and Psychowand and maybe Spread Needle.

[mooonbow]

Bil De axe is not Uber. It drops off of a lot of missions and Goazoran isn't special eigther. Just Agito Repca and Psychowand and maybe Spread Needle.

i have to dissagree with this. first off the bil de ax is kubara and they get a 25% dmg when use a PA move with it. goazoran rods are also uber maybe not as strong as the psycho but still its only 10* and the second best rod in the game so far.

[mooonbow]

sry also forgot the deghna cannon was maybe considered uber at one point in time. now its just a collecters item. unless your a GT wanting to use laser cannons.

[CelestialBlade]

It's always bothered me that Fortetechers have had their ultimate weapon for so long (and like 50 other Rods to go with it!), Fortefighters have had their Agito Repca (ultimate status there is debatable, but it's godly at high grinds), and Rangers continue to get the shaft. Spread Needle sucks, it's the best Shotgun available but not by much. There's nothing ultimate about it. Rattlesnake is equivalent to a fT's Kazarod or a fF's Ank Zagza, nothing special there. We have nothing.

I'd be all for some psychotically strong Rifle, and pray the Guld & Milla is pretty godly so Guntechers will have something cool too. Everyone whines about how Segac "hates" Techers despite how they're constantly showered with more and more overpowered stuff, yet Rangers continue to receive pretty much nothing except the nice Rifle boost since AoI began.

[Yuudai_Riisu]

sry also forgot the deghna cannon was maybe considered uber at one point in time. now its just a collecters item. unless your a GT wanting to use laser cannons.

The most important stat on a laser cannon is the PP

[Yuudai_Riisu]

It's always bothered me that Fortetechers have had their ultimate weapon for so long (and like 50 other Rods to go with it!), Fortefighters have had their Agito Repca (ultimate status there is debatable, but it's godly at high grinds), and Rangers continue to get the shaft. Spread Needle sucks, it's the best Shotgun available but not by much. There's nothing ultimate about it. Rattlesnake is equivalent to a fT's Kazarod or a fF's Ank Zagza, nothing special there. We have nothing.

I'd be all for some psychotically strong Rifle, and pray the Guld & Milla is pretty godly so Guntechers will have something cool too. Everyone whines about how Segac "hates" Techers despite how they're constantly showered with more and more overpowered stuff, yet Rangers continue to receive pretty much nothing except the nice Rifle boost since AoI began.

Here is one thing I don't get. People say this game is so easy, but they demand stronger weapons all the time.

[mooonbow]

It's always bothered me that Fortetechers have had their ultimate weapon for so long (and like 50 other Rods to go with it!), Fortefighters have had their Agito Repca (ultimate status there is debatable, but it's godly at high grinds), and Rangers continue to get the shaft. Spread Needle sucks, it's the best Shotgun available but not by much. There's nothing ultimate about it. Rattlesnake is equivalent to a fT's Kazarod or a fF's Ank Zagza, nothing special there. We have nothing.

I'd be all for some psychotically strong Rifle, and pray the Guld & Milla is pretty godly so Guntechers will have something cool too. Everyone whines about how Segac "hates" Techers despite how they're constantly showered with more and more overpowered stuff, yet Rangers continue to receive pretty much nothing except the nice Rifle boost since AoI began.

i agree with you 100% on this. Fortegunners have gotten the shaft form ST since day 1 of this game. and here is why

1st we had/have the longest and hardest lvling skills in this game BULLETS!!!!! anyone who has gotten a rifle bullet maxed out before the PA reblance can vouch for this.

2nd weapons, we have had to find are weapons on the hardest mission out there..before AOI it was extremly diffacult to get ppl to go to Desert goilith. Blackbull, Rattlesnake, shigga baret, gur asted. anyone who tried to solo these missons before AOI can tell you horror stories.

3rd before there element update LASER CANNONS!!!!!!!!! i am a hardcore fortegunner and i belived these guns where a JOKE before they got there update.

anymore ideas please add on

[mooonbow]

The most important stat on a laser cannon is the PP

for me PP is never the most important stat on any ranged weapon iv always gone for ATP!

[mooonbow]

Ranged classes aren't meant for dps XP

says who?

[mooonbow]

i dont mean to toot my own horn. but i will. well actually i cant since my xbox is out for repairs so i can prove anything at this time but i do consider myself on of the better fortegunners in the game. and i can say that since my mine class has been fortegunner ever since i got the game. when is that you ask? about a month or so after its was out. and form my experince PP is the last stat i look at when choosing to buy or hunt for any ranged weapon.

[DISCO]

i have to dissagree with this. first off the bil de ax is kubara and they get a 25% dmg when use a PA move with it.
No they don't.

Spread Needle sucks, it's the best Shotgun available but not by much.
Are you retarded? The spread needle becomes the strongest shotgun in the game at five grinds. Here is the grind chart for it: http://www.pso-world.com/items/psu/1/2885/spread_needle_g/
Try comparing those stats to any other shotgun in the database, then tell me how much they "suck"

The most important stat on a laser cannon is the PP
If pp is more important, you take your degahna cannon and I'll take my love inferno. We'll see who kills things quicker. Chances are you won't run through 10 photon charges in a mission so I'd say power is still more important.

Anybody, who is good at playing any range type class.
My shotguns beg to differ.

[Iduno]

Actually PP is very important for ranged weapons unless you carry spares, photon chargers

The main purpose of most guns (maybe not mechguns and definately not grenades) is to inflict various status effects on the enemy or do damage to multiple enemies (while inflicting status effects)

You are never going to beat a fighter for DPS (unless you use the grenade thats eats hp maybe) so the more important stat does tend to be PP since status effects dont care about your ATA

I would comment on forces being better for damaging multiple enemys with AOE spells but im not too sure about that yet

Of course if the ATP of a weapon totaly sucks its usualy not worth it even with good PP but if its not that far behind others going for the PP is usually better

[DISCO]

After level your bullets up to 30+ we'll talk, ok?

They are above 31...For someone who assumes others are young and immature, you make a lot of naive statements.

[DISCO]

Actually PP is very important for ranged weapons unless you carry spares, photon chargers

The main purpose of most guns (maybe not mechguns and definately not grenades) is to inflict various status effects on the enemy or do damage to multiple enemies (while inflicting status effects)

You are never going to beat a fighter for DPS (unless you use the grenade thats eats hp maybe) so the more important stat does tend to be PP since status effects dont care about your ATA

I would comment on forces being better for damaging multiple enemys with AOE spells but im not too sure about that yet

Of course if the ATP of a weapon totaly sucks its usualy not worth it even with good PP but if its not that far behind others going for the PP is usually better

I'm in no way dismissing the importance of pp, just saying that many people would prefer power first. Most people carry photon charges and even soloing I rarely go through more than three or four.

[Darkhaven]

After reading this I stopped. Waste of time argueing with a 10- year old kid

If you insist on directly insulting someone based on what console they play PSU on, I'll have to set you straight. His opinion is his opinion. No, he doesn't type flawlessly, but he never insulted you. Power can be just as important on a ranged weapon as PP. In most cases, it just depends on the PA you're using. Those of us who leveled PA's such as Killer Shot know that a higher PP weapon would be a better idea. Many of them at that. However, if I'm using a basic elemental rifle bullet, I never find myself beat for PP or having to go back and buy photon charges.

Learn to not judge people based on a console. Realize that you yourself have a lot to learn. And, of course, learn to spell "arguing" correctly. Jerk.

[Endykins]

ATP > PP. That is all.

[DISCO]

Whatever, please stick to the topic.
I was sticking to the topic and stated my opinion. First you assumed that any 360 player was a young child. Did it ever occur to you that some people have the option of playing on either server but choose to play on the 360? Second you assumed my PA's weren't leveled and you were wrong again. Neither myself or the first person you attempted to insult said anything to incite an argument. I'm just saying that you made some incredibly ignorant statements.

[Darkhaven]

Next time be more careful of what you say. You can't insult people and then fall back on "Give it a rest" when they retaliate.

[Yuudai_Riisu]

Next time be more careful of what you say. You can't insult people and then fall back on "Give it a rest" when they retaliate.

whatever.

[Rayokarna]

Everyone whines about how Segac "hates" Techers despite how they're constantly showered with more and more overpowered stuff,

Sorry but I don't agree with this.

Tech damage don't mean squat since AOI came rolling through and with the numerous amount of updates on techs including change there casting time(Which nerfed all low level techs) and the introduction of Just Attack and such have made attack Techs nothing compared to ANY sort of damage. Rangers have had TWO Laser Cannon updates and huge game breaking Rifle update. What else seriously do you need in terms of damage. And lets be honest, other than Psyco Wand, what else do they have which is powerful...

..Not much except for a Gao Rod(Which is still hell to make) and the Kazarod(Which aint common by a long shot). Im not counting the Halarod simply because its Newman only.

I do agree on a gunner version of a 'uber' 12* Kubara Weapon which is available at any time of the year. You can't really count the Spread Needle for 1. It's not the real version and 2. It's not available at any time of the year. But do gunners need anything else other than that?

...Not really...

...If anything, hunter-like classes should be nerfed...

[LuigiMario]

i have to dissagree with this. first off the bil de ax is kubara and they get a 25% dmg when use a PA move with it. goazoran rods are also uber maybe not as strong as the psycho but still its only 10* and the second best rod in the game so far.

All they did was remove the penalty so the axe is as powerful as the Zagza. And that Gaozoran is just a powerful rod. But not that powerful.

[Golto]

Techers got the damage boost when using a Rod. If you think tech dmg is so small try running DGS2 with a techer using decent ground techs. One can kill so fast that it puts killer shot to shame.

We all should know by now this is the order of types that ST favors

1. Melee
.
.
.
.
.
22. Force
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
99. Ranger

[Yusaku_Kudou]

Who cares if it's Kubara or not. You're gonna take your damned Spread Needle/G and take it hard! Grind that little bitch to 10/10 and you have a shotgun with 80 more attack than a Barec 10/10.

[desturel]

I would comment on forces being better for damaging multiple enemys with AOE spells but im not too sure about that yet

Techers do the most damage if there are more than 6 enemies grouped together at once. Which is rare. Dam spells barta megid and zonde can do more damage to a group than lasers or the nerfed chikki, but as soon as the group thins out to 5 and under it's all fortefighter/gunner territory. It doesn't help that creatures die so fast anyway that it doesn't matter who "could" do the most damage.


And lets be honest, other than Psyco Wand, what else do they have which is powerful...

..Not much except for a Gao Rod(Which is still hell to make) and the Kazarod(Which aint common by a long shot). Im not counting the Halarod simply because its Newman only.

Psycho Wand
Gaozoran Rod
Chao Staff

In that order. Kazarod and Halarod are pretty weak overall. I keep them around because I like having one of each techer weapon, but there's really not much point in having either if you have any of the top three. This is from someone who prefers Kazarod to Gaozoran Rod BTW. Mainly because Gao-rod only recharges 3 PP making it highly inefficient, but since most people will just pop a photon charge and keep going, it doesn't matter how inefficient it is.


Techers got the damage boost when using a Rod. If you think tech dmg is so small try running DGS2 with a techer using decent ground techs. One can kill so fast that it puts killer shot to shame.

Techers can fly through the ROBOTS fast, but the humanoids slow things down a lot. I've soloed DG as both a fortetecher (31+megid 31+ radiga 31+ nosdiga 30 jisei-sou 30 jusei-shiki) and a fortegunner (31+ killershot 31+ yak zagenga 31+ boma diga 31+ Grav Shot 31+ Dark Shot 20 majarra). Fortegunner is definitely the faster class for DG. If you have a beast or cast fortegunner it's even easier. Nanoblast and Paradi does wonders on the last Grinna Bete spawn.

Now maybe if the DG maps weren't nerfed and we still had the maps where every second spawn had three Grinna Bete, a fortetecher could claim to be superior since they could take out the large creatures quicker than a fortegunner, but since most of the run are robots and humanoids, the biggest time differences are the last spawn of three (easily won by a cast or beast gunner thanks to paradi/nano+freeze trap g) and the boss.

Besides all of the techer modification were to pull techers EVEN with all of the other classes in the game. Fortetechers were being outdamaged by Acrotechers. That's why fortetechers got the attack tech buff on rods. The HP boost was long overdue. It's only too bad that Masterforce gets stuck with the old Fortetecher HP.

[mooonbow]

hum nerfed mission yeah i remember running good old DG when the S@ first came out and got my ASS WHIPED BOY i tell you what. hardest mission in game when it first came out for S2.

[amtalx]

Part of being a gunner is knowing that you will be ruthlessly sodomized by ST. Our best weapons are nearly impossible to come by, and our skills (before last week anyway) were the hardest to level.

[mooonbow]

oh and another way segac has scwerd over the gunners in this game is the bullet PA frag PAs
only one worth getting is killer shot and maybe boma duranga

[nightlights]

a high grind rattlesnac is really nice. you also gotta think. all the bullets have status effects on them. agito repca doesn't have a status effect. if you get your bullets lvld they do realy nice damage. also if you are looking for a grenade gun look up the gur asted, it does relitivly nive damage. and boma duranga pwns bosses. btw i love my shigga barret. with high lvl bullets that thing can almost one shot every small creature and makes short work of most normal creatures.

[mooonbow]

a high grind rattlesnac is really nice. you also gotta think. all the bullets have status effects on them. agito repca doesn't have a status effect. if you get your bullets lvld they do realy nice damage. also if you are looking for a grenade gun look up the gur asted, it does relitivly nive damage. and boma duranga pwns bosses. btw i love my shigga barret. with high lvl bullets that thing can almost one shot every small creature and makes short work of most normal creatures.

aw come one man you telling if there was an uber hard rifle to get. that had lets say 1000atp at the 5th grind you wouldnt spam whatever mission that it dropped on?

[nightlights]

sure why not. but right now the rattlesnake/snac is about as good as it gets. i'm getting some really awesome damage out of mine. and with killer shot lvled up really high i can solo missions with ease.

[desturel]

oh and another way segac has scwerd over the gunners in this game is the bullet PA frag PAs
only one worth getting is killer shot and maybe boma duranga

Yak Zagenga
Twin Mayalee

Besides if you are going to think that way then the only PAs worth getting as a fighter is Majarra and Jabroga. >.>

[LuigiMario]

oh and another way segac has scwerd over the gunners in this game is the bullet PA frag PAs
only one worth getting is killer shot and maybe boma duranga

Shotguns do nearly 5000 per shot. Crossbow Ult does nearly 3000 per shot. Rifle PAs have knockdown and can do nearly 2000 per shot in the future not to mention Bil De Vears can't do shit against Rifle users with 31+ Bullets. Same goes for other certain monsters.

Oh and SMG can do nearly 1000 in the future as well.

All the dmg I mentioned is going to be happening in the near future. Just wait. For now the dmg is pretty close to above dmg.

[Golto]

2000 per rifle hit non-crit is still out of reach even with lvl 50 bullets against lvl 100+ monsters. If you had a +10 Rattlesnac, Male Beast lvl 150 GunMaster lvl 20, Shifta se lvl 5, Lumirus / Kaos Knight, and Zalure se lvl 5 against lvl 100+ monsters you might hit 2000 non-crit on the higher 3 elemental rifle bullets. But that is a lot of ifs especially the Rattlesnac +10.

[zanotam]

LOL at complaining FG. When the ranged class out melee's the Melee / Magic hybrid class you know what 'balance' means to ST. Go play a WT then complain.

[Ken_Silver]

LOL at complaining FG. When the ranged class out melee's the Melee / Magic hybrid class you know what 'balance' means to ST. Go play a WT then complain.

LOL, I get that, because I am a WT.

But let's not go down that road. At least we (WT's) can heal ourselves with LV20 (LV30) Resta.

[LuigiMario]

LOL at complaining FG. When the ranged class out melee's the Melee / Magic hybrid class you know what 'balance' means to ST. Go play a WT then complain.

Been there, done that.

[Wiz]

i agree with you 100% on this. Fortegunners have gotten the shaft form ST since day 1 of this game. and here is why

1st we had/have the longest and hardest lvling skills in this game BULLETS!!!!! anyone who has gotten a rifle bullet maxed out before the PA reblance can vouch for this.

2nd weapons, we have had to find are weapons on the hardest mission out there..before AOI it was extremly diffacult to get ppl to go to Desert goilith. Blackbull, Rattlesnake, shigga baret, gur asted. anyone who tried to solo these missons before AOI can tell you horror stories.

3rd before there element update LASER CANNONS!!!!!!!!! i am a hardcore fortegunner and i belived these guns where a JOKE before they got there update.

anymore ideas please add on
Wait, so...

1. Before the PA update, bullets were the hardest PAs to level?
2. Before AotI, Desert Goliath was hard?
3. Before the element update, Laser Cannons were nerfed?

So...it kinda sounds like that's all in the past. What's there to still complain about?

[desturel]

1. Before the PA update, bullets were the hardest PAs to level?
2. Before AotI, Desert Goliath was hard?


Actually they made Desert Goliath easy before AotI. I think it was around August when they "rebalanced" Lab Recovery to take out all of the Jarba. Removed all of the Grinna Bete from Desert Goliath. Took most of the Tengohgs out of Moonlight Beast and Demons Above and completely redid the System Defense and Desert Terror maps to make them half as long as they originally were. They also changed Tunnel Recapture around that time, but they mainly just changed the third block to add in more Drua Gohra and Bil De Vear on S and S2 (which made the mission great for leveling grenades). The other Tunnel Recapture rebalance happened after AotI when they added in a warp to the second key room and removed one of the rooms that only had two boxes (moving the boxes up into an alcove).

Also Bullets and techs were equally as hard to level pre-update. It's just that there were more bullets than techs. Now bullets are easier to level than techs, but there are still more bullets than techs meaning it will still take longer to max everything (not more gunners max everything anyway).

Of course Gunners have also had a choice selection of armor. Storm Line Baji-senba and Rabol Lebfa all came out at the same time. Storm Line was obviously the best armor of the group. Shinowa Line came out before Castest line, but castest (a gunner armor) is considered the better of the two armors. Serafi-senba is the only other 4 slot S armor available currently and that is much more rare than Storm Line. Gunners and hybrid gunners currently are the only class that can make themselves immune to level 1 megid without loosing a body slot and without the help of a stamina unit that only dropped from 1up cup.

Female Fortefighter = 12 stamina + 3 from Shinowa line + 6 from Hard Stamina = 21 stamina
Female Fortegunner = 15 stamina + 3 from castest line + 4 from Rappy mode = 22 stamina
Female Fortetechers = same as fortefighter

For fighters a freeze resist is almost a must when fighting Gaozoran. Techers require stun and freeze for Gaozoran and SEED-Ardite meaning they will likely have to give up megid immunity to complete the mission properly. Now when Vijeri / Resist comes out in the next story mission there won't be any problems, but until that time...

[LuigiMario]

Wait, so...

1. Before the PA update, bullets were the hardest PAs to level?
2. Before AotI, Desert Goliath was hard?
3. Before the element update, Laser Cannons were nerfed?

So...it kinda sounds like that's all in the past. What's there to still complain about?

FGs don't get their Spread Needles untill the Panzies on the other server get their chance. ;)

[DISCO]

Wait, so...

1. Before the PA update, bullets were the hardest PAs to level?
2. Before AotI, Desert Goliath was hard?
3. Before the element update, Laser Cannons were nerfed?

So...it kinda sounds like that's all in the past. What's there to still complain about?

The fact that they stuck a few of the best gunner weapons in the boxes of maps with robot slowdown.

[NDW]

I agree it was pretty stupid of ST making a regular 12* weapon board drop only on a seasonal rare monster.

I agree, the Love Inferno should be available at any time when all the regular 12* weapons start to come out. Jaggo Amures should drop a 9* Kubara weapon instead.

Even as a Hunter, I do feel bad for Rangers. They deserve an uber 12* weapon like Hunters and Forces have. In my opinion, I think these are the main weapons for the basic classes:

Hunter: Sword
Ranger: Rifle
Force: Rod

It also caught my attention that the ubers we have now are weapons that were in previous Phantasy Star games. To follow the pattern, I would have to choose the Rianov 303SNR as the uber if it existed. Then it could be:

Hunter: Agito Repca (Sword)
Ranger: Rianov 303SNR (Rifle)
Force: Psycho Wand (Rod)

Stat wise, I think a Rianov 303SNR 10/10 should be:

Att: ~1000
Acc: ~750
PP: ~2000

Not sure if I would want the rifle to start out good like a Psycho Wand or you would have to grind it to get it good like an Agito Repca.

Thoughts?