Money Sinks, (or lack thereof)

[Kumlekar]

There have been quite a few complaints about inflation within PSU's economy. This is natural in all MMO's but PSU is an extreme case. When you finish a relitively high ranked mission you might get a couple thousand meseta (not including drops, because weapons and items are not meseta unless you sell to merchant). Why are items selling in player shops for hundreds of millions then?

I believe it is because of a complete lack of money sinks. We are continuously dumping money into the game economy. Every time you pick up one of those little yellow icons, meseta is added to the economy. Every time you sell an item to the merchant some is added. The problem is that almost none ever leaves. Obviously you do remove some by buying scape dolls and other comsumable items from the merchant, but realistically, how much is that? Maybe 20K per mission if your having a little trouble. 70K if your having alot (full stack of scapes, trimates, dimates and a couple of star atomizers). Thats almost nothing in comparison to the amounts being dropped. A single meseta drop can be 2K per person. Multiply that by how many you get in the mission that expenditure is nothing.

What I propose is not to increase or decrease the amount of meseta that can be held (that would take far too much work from a programming standpoint) but rather add expensive items to shops that players would actually want. These would vary in cost from as low as 100,000 to as high as 50 mill. Money is entering the economy, and it needs somewhere to go, merchants are the best choice. This doesn't mean adding weapons that are superior to weapon drops, but how bout some really expensive clothing? A reskin for specific dropped weapons? Some more extra slot units that have a visual effect? Most of these wouldn't even have to provide an advantage, many people would pay just to make their characters look cooler. (On a side note, male cast part selection is horrid!)

As it is we have a continuous net increase in the amount of money in the economy, and it has nowhere to go. As inflation increases, the game becomes harder and harder for new players to get established, and old timers will have more of an advantage. As much as supporting the orginal player base is cool, this isn't the way to do it. Sega needs to fix the root of the problem, not the symptom that you can't carry enough money.

[dogg1000]

What about materials players buy from npc?

[Kylie]

My friend was saying the same thing to me. We were debating the pros and cons of a server merge (he's a 360 player), and he said he would worry about our economy affecting theirs. See, some players still have an excess of meseta from the haxeta days on PC/PS2 (from 2006/early 2007!), and there are no real money sinks to get rid of that excess. It's just forever flowing in our economy. Yes, there are things like NPC shop items, but that's not enough.

[LOL]

Easy answer:
GIB MESETA.

[Gloveboy]

i hadd a pt last night and we did white beast. it was wild to see meseta drop by the k! also i joined a pt with a lvl 150 and he gave me 10000 for nothing. its good to see we have a generous community

[SegaSpyder]

I have to agree. I've been seeing this for quite a while now and adding another digit to your wallet is not the way to go. With all the money centrally located in a few persons pocket, you know what I'm talking about, it would only cater to those few and not the masses as a whole. If you want some thing to get it moving a little bit, put Walna conversion boards in the NPC shops. Along with grinder base Ses and how about some polymer to while they're at it. Oh and how about some Gem Stones for a change too. I still make the 7* crea weapons for my human and it sickens me every time I go to look for some in player shops and see the cheapest sitting at 28k and you have to buy 10-20 of them and not to mention you have to score a 40%+ to make it worth your while. Man where have the days gone of the 2k per shop, oh wait that's right grinder base Ses.
The easiest way to make stuff disappear, meseta wise, is to put more things in the NPC shops that people will want. And yes male casts haven't gotten anything new in the parts department since the retro stuff, a.k.a. RAcast/HUcast. It's almost to the point where they should go and put the 10* everything in the shops; woods, gems, carbons, and boards. If they did that how much do you think would actually disappear on the first day?

P.S. Hey don't forget to check NPC prices before you buy something anyway. To Many people sell things over NPC and also buy up from those that do sell less to control the market that way as well. So be smart about it check it out first, make them give you a deal. After all that is the point of having stores isn't it? To give people a break every now and then and put a little something back in your pocket.

[WildArms2]

your correct and this has been stated before soon they are releaseing an item called Brand Reactor I think its called for 400k npc shops and it is used in a trade mission for some new sticky weapons in the arms dealer mission this will wiper some of the money but in the long run wont do much. They need more things like this but they have faileded to added them to the japanese servers soo we wont see them for at least 1.5 years over here

[fay]

im sure brand reactor only costs 250K actually

[amtalx]

They should add an income tax, lol.

[Dana]

They should add an income tax, lol.

lol, tax the rich!

[Kinako78]

P.S. Hey don't forget to check NPC prices before you buy something anyway. To Many people sell things over NPC and also buy up from those that do sell less to control the market that way as well.

I do sell my weapons and other items found in NPC shops for less then what the NPC charges and I seem to make quite a bit of sales. I agree that players should be smart when shopping in player marts and buy their items from people that sell for less.

[Raveno]

I agree with this, make items like mates, and scapes, much more expensive, about 4 or 5 times more expensive then things will look better

[amtalx]

I agree with this, make items like mates, and scapes, much more expensive, about 4 or 5 times more expensive then things will look better

Adjusting the prices of existing items isn't fair to new players that won't be able to afford basic healing items. Its better if new items are added.

[Seority]

Photon Charges: 20k
Scape Dolls: 100k

Promotes:
Actually using normal attacks instead of only PAs.
Making sure not to die a lot.
Healers actually being more useful. (aka teamwork)
People hunt for scape dolls to use or sell at a slightly lower price to gain meseta if they are in need of it (say for newer players).
Helps inflation of meseta.
Makes the game funner. (Or harder to you whiners. =P )

[Ffuzzy-Logik]

Or we could just let it go until Meseta is practically worthless except for buying stuff from NPCs, like it was on PSO. I'd actually prefer that, to be honest. It would encourage people to trade rare items for other rare items, rather than spamming WB until you have enough cash to buy whatever you want.

[Noblewine]

I rather leave it alone. It was like this before AoI and even after the expansion was released the readjustments fixed the ecomony a little. I don't see a problem. I just continue spamming a misison and use the player shops.

[Powder Keg]

It's fine the way it is.

[II_Tokio_II]

It wouldn't make sense to raise the prices of the healing items etc. It's always been like this it's just the people who spend big money don't really have a reason to get on right now thus making our economy a lttle slow and also the prices of weapons regarding supply and demand never change. Sure the prices of A-ranks and other stuff are nothing compared to back then when they were like 500k for a 9 star weapon like a howrod, but now that there are so many S-ranks that are easy to obtain, the prices for A-ranks have decreased drastically. The system hasn't changed all that much, but since power synthesizers and other spenders are waiting for a new event to start the economy is slow. I used to be able to put out a catilium for 10k less than the lowest shop and at least 2 players would run in and buy it, but now thats not the case. Changing anything would be a useless attempt. Especially for an economy run by a good majority of young people and very young people. Deal with it.

[Orrefe]

My friend was saying the same thing to me. We were debating the pros and cons of a server merge (he's a 360 player), and he said he would worry about our economy affecting theirs. See, some players still have an excess of meseta from the haxeta days on PC/PS2 (from 2006/early 2007!), and there are no real money sinks to get rid of that excess. It's just forever flowing in our economy. Yes, there are things like NPC shop items, but that's not enough.

Considering how easy it is to make money in PSU now, max meseta is easy enough to attain on either server if you're willing to play enough [which a lot of people are]

Honestly, although our economy never really fixed after the meseta inflation haxxing whatever, AoI essentially evened it out for us. I don't think a server merge would hurt their economy at all at this point.

[amtalx]

Considering how easy it is to make money in PSU now, max meseta is easy enough to attain on either server if you're willing to play enough [which a lot of people are]

Honestly, although our economy never really fixed after the meseta inflation haxxing whatever, AoI essentially evened it out for us. I don't think a server merge would hurt their economy at all at this point.

Not so fast, kemo sabe. As someone that's been part of both servers, if the current state of the PC/PS2 economy is 'evened out' I can't imagine what it was like a year ago. D:

[TChirath]

I agree with re-pricing the items, but only if the items cost more depending on your level. Scape dolls and trimates especially should have a multiplier to their prices.

[RemiusTA]

I agree with re-pricing the items, but only if the items cost more depending on your level. Scape dolls and trimates especially should have a multiplier to their prices.

a-effing-men. Maybe not trimates, but definately scape dolls.

[stukasa]

Not so fast, kemo sabe. As someone that's been part of both servers, if the current state of the PC/PS2 economy is 'evened out' I can't imagine what it was like a year ago. D:
But are the higher prices because of the haxeta or because of the smaller population? Someone on 360 said P-wand boards are 20 million there, whereas they're 50 million on PC/PS2. I could be wrong but I think that's because there are simply more people playing on 360, and more people playing means more rares will be found, lowering all the prices. I think overall the prices on PC/PS2 are pretty good. Most weapons in shops are reasonably priced, especially the common/A-rank stuff. There are some S-rank boards I can't even sell for 100K! :eek:

And to answer the OP, yes I think it's a good idea, if only because I want more clothes to wear. :D

[amtalx]

But are the higher prices because of the haxeta or because of the smaller population? Someone on 360 said P-wand boards are 20 million there, whereas they're 50 million on PC/PS2. I could be wrong but I think that's because there are simply more people playing on 360, and more people playing means more rares will be found, lowering all the prices. I think overall the prices on PC/PS2 are pretty good. Most weapons in shops are reasonably priced, especially the common/A-rank stuff. There are some S-rank boards I can't even sell for 100K! :eek:

And to answer the OP, yes I think it's a good idea, if only because I want more clothes to wear. :D

Well, it all goes back to supply and demand. You are correct in saying that there will be more P-wand boards on 360 because of the sheer force of people killing enemies to make them drop. However, since there are more people to run said missions, there are more people that want the boards as well. In the end, it ends up being proportional. More people making boards drop, more people that want to buy them.

Over on 360, we were lucky that the glitch for getting quick money was Grinders and not meseta itself. The advantage to having Grinders glitched was that it didn't actually add and meseta to the economy. All it did was move the existing wealth to people that glitched. Its bad, but it doesn't screw the economy nearly as much. It only created a class of super rich people, which will inevitably spend that money and redistribute it anyway. Also, Grinders are a consumable resource, so they eventually disappear. Its not like having a bunch of glitched weapons that will never leave circulation. Thanks to the grinding boost, Grinder prices are back up high where they should be, and all the rich folks blew their money oh chewing gum and matchbox cars.

[Kumlekar]

Well, it all goes back to supply and demand. You are correct in saying that there will be more P-wand boards on 360 because of the sheer force of people killing enemies to make them drop. However, since there are more people to run said missions, there are more people that want the boards as well. In the end, it ends up being proportional. More people making boards drop, more people that want to buy them.

Over on 360, we were lucky that the glitch for getting quick money was Grinders and not meseta itself. The advantage to having Grinders glitched was that it didn't actually add and meseta to the economy. All it did was move the existing wealth to people that glitched. Its bad, but it doesn't screw the economy nearly as much. It only created a class of super rich people, which will inevitably spend that money and redistribute it anyway. Also, Grinders are a consumable resource, so they eventually disappear. Its not like having a bunch of glitched weapons that will never leave circulation. Thanks to the grinding boost, Grinder prices are back up high where they should be, and all the rich folks blew their money oh chewing gum and matchbox cars.
Spot on, theres a huge difference between creating grinders and creating meseta.

I would like to point out that I never suggested repricing current items. This would have to much of detrimental effect to players trying to get into the game. The suggestion for re-pricing scapes is plausible, but increasing the price of photon charges and mates would only make PSU less accessible for new players. (right now the hardest range for startign your first character seems to be lvs 50-100, that change would mainly target players below lv 50.

[Syaoran_69]

Make NPC prices variable depending on your level? That's the only way I could see a decent money sink working in this game.

[lexus_chris]

How about guaranteed 3* luck for 24 hours, for 1 million meseta. Im pretty sure people would buy that, I would, every day,

[shadowsniper6]

Why reprice the healing items? it kinds sounds stupid..... anyway Why don't they just put it to where when someone buys from a player shop the person that sold something loses 2% or 5% of what ever was sold (if this was already said sorry i didn't read all of the post just some of them)

[Finae]

Would love to see what prices would be on ps2/pc if RMT came to the servers. I mean damn, thats a lot of P-wands those farmers would be farming haha. Pwands going for 1 million meseta! Woot haha! 50% weapons! +10 weapons! Haha!

Really, economies in mmos (even tho psu is not a mmo) are always f'ed up. They get f'ed up eventually and after that, there is no going back. Whatever you may propose on these forums does not mean people are going to do it nor do the ones who don't come to forums at all know about it anyway. Whatever valiant effort people make will be in utter phailure.

So its a nice idea OP, but in the end, its never going to work. The game company who is in control of the game can only make the difference and..........."lol segac."

[Kion]

How about guaranteed 3* luck for 24 hours, for 1 million meseta. Im pretty sure people would buy that, I would, every day,

No, that would spark massive flame wars in psu general on the subject of luck and what it does.

I think a system of interest rates would work pretty well. Meseta drops in lower level missions would be uneffected for new players starting out, and for everyone else drops would be based on the entire ammount of money in circulation. If everyone has tons of money to the point where its worthless, the best way is to stop the flow to bring back some of the value. Also spamming the same mission over and over again would reduce the end mission rewards. "good work gaurdians, you've purified this mission a hundred times now. the area is safe, move along".

Repricing some NPC items or tinkering the system by actually making some of them worth buying might be a decent idea. Instead of merchants always having neutral weapons, having some with percents. Health items i would leave alone. Possibly making scapes more exspensive, mates should be leaft alone. Making materials more exspensive, or possibly limited edition items in shops might be pretty cool.

[Raveno]

here is an idea, what about an item that you use, and it increases your photon art's experience rate for 10 minutes...let be a very very expensive item (sold only at NPC)

[RadiantLegend]

Meseta Charge weapons.

Fixes everything.

[amtalx]

Meseta Charge weapons.

Fixes everything.

WHY DID NO ONE THINK OF THIS?!?

[Smidge204]

Meseta Charge weapons.

Fixes everything.


I probably missed the point of this completely, but:

http://img369.imageshack.us/img369/6372/photonchargerki0.jpg


Maybe these should just be more expensive. I think it's just under 0.5 meseta per PP right now. Perhaps make these more expensive as the quantity of PP needed goes up - lower level characters are unlikely to have lots of money on them and not need much PP to refill, while higher level chars will have weapons that need lots of PP and will also have the money to pay for it.

Or maybe you mean a gun that literally shoots meseta as its ammo... which would be hilarious.
=Smidge=

[Green_Bandit]

They mean it could take meseta to use increase ATP. This was in PSO times.

[BIGGIEstyle]

Oh sure that'd be great LoL. All the people with multiple stacks of meseta spamming through the game one shotting bosses with meseta-haxed axes using jabroga. It'd level the economy a little, but once master classes came out NOBODY would let any master types in their party LoL

I think the idea of useful items that cost a ton is a nice idea, but things like that never happen when they should. The economy is fucked up and we have nobody to blame but ourselves for it. After all we're the ones charging retarded high prices for everything.

Just an fyi: Meseta caps where it does because you're not supposed to HAVE more than 99999999.

[Powder Keg]

I probably missed the point of this completely, but:

http://img369.imageshack.us/img369/6372/photonchargerki0.jpg


Maybe these should just be more expensive. I think it's just under 0.5 meseta per PP right now. Perhaps make these more expensive as the quantity of PP needed goes up - lower level characters are unlikely to have lots of money on them and not need much PP to refill, while higher level chars will have weapons that need lots of PP and will also have the money to pay for it.

Or maybe you mean a gun that literally shoots meseta as its ammo... which would be hilarious.
=Smidge=

lolno.

Starting out from scratch, for Rangers and Forces they were almost impossible to afford.

[unicorn]

- They should double the price of restoratives. Meaning support will be useful again.

- Melee weapons should have to be repaired after a while or they will break (Guns and Teching weapons excluded, since they don't have direct contact with enemies). This might balance jobs a bit. Since the game currently favors melee classes waaaay too much. Crea weapons should also be excluded from repairs(giving preference to Human/Newman for some players).

- Armor should be repaired as well.

- Lower meseta drops in missions. Not like pre-AoI, but lower than it is right now.

- Make getting an S-rank give a bigger payout. When a party member dies, the rank should go down (like before).

[desturel]

Maybe these should just be more expensive. I think it's just under 0.5 meseta per PP right now.

The cost of a recharge cube completely depends on the weapon itself. Melee weapons are cheap per PP. Gun weapons are moderate per PP. Tech weapons are expensive per PP. Also star ranking matters. A 1* rifle with 1200 PP (Raihoh +10) is cheaper to refill than an 7* rifle with with the same amount of PP (Assasin +0). Also a Rifle with 2000 PP (Mizurakihoh +9) is much cheaper to refill than a wand with 2000 PP (Psycho Wand +3).

Besides, your plan would only hurt lower level players, especially low level techers. Since techer weapons are the most expensive thing to recharge, they would feel the squeeze much more than any other class.

[Powder Keg]

- They should double the price of restoratives. Meaning support will be useful again.

- Melee weapons should have to be repaired after a while or they will break (Guns and Teching weapons excluded, since they don't have direct contact with enemies). This might balance jobs a bit. Since the game currently favors melee classes waaaay too much. Crea weapons should also be excluded from repairs(giving preference to Human/Newman for some players).

- Armor should be repaired as well.

- Lower meseta drops in missions. Not like pre-AoI, but lower than it is right now.

- Make getting an S-rank give a bigger payout. When a party member dies, the rank should go down (like before).

Phew, thank God you're not in charge.

[Ffuzzy-Logik]

I probably missed the point of this completely, but:

http://img369.imageshack.us/img369/6372/photonchargerki0.jpg


Maybe these should just be more expensive. I think it's just under 0.5 meseta per PP right now.
Actually, it varies. Rarer weapons cost a lot more to refill than lower grade weapons.

[TecherRamen]

Haxeta from way back when. everything is actually deflating.

[IrisForscythe]

Things are getting better, honestly they just just multiply the price of the luck fortune by 10 everyone uses it anyway, 100k for a chance at new luck every 12 hours. It's work out, also lol meseta charge items would help too. For awhile some people would be over powered hax'd axes but.. eventually it would all event out.

[Grimhart]

A-rank --> S-rank material conversion boards. ;_;

Even if each of them costs a small fortune, and they eat up a ton of the A-rank material per synth.

[haruna]

I've given the NPC plenty of money.

Buy 32 Kubiri-Hiken boards. Buy stacks of Slaterian. Buy stacks and stacks of Neu Ebon.

Make boards. Watch your money disappear as you try for a 50% elemental.

Before, I cringed at the thought of Charge weapons. Now it seems like the economy is ripe for having them back. For the non PSO players, Charge weapons cost money to unleash a special attack. The power of that special was just insane. Charge Vulcans were a hot commodity from the NPC shops. If you were really lucky, you got a Vajya from a roulette with high accuracy hit% bonus. That sucker cost 10,000 a swing but man, the damage!

[desturel]

A-rank --> S-rank material conversion boards. ;_;

Even if each of them costs a small fortune, and they eat up a ton of the A-rank material per synth.

There are S rank conversion boards that eat up a ton of A-rank material. They just have a random output.

Throw in a [b] hiken (10 el photon or im photon, 6 Kerseline, 1 Slaterian, 3 Neu Ebon). Cross your fingers. Come out with a random S-rank material.