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View Full Version : Which of PSO's negative aspects are in PSZ?



Phaze37
Jan 4, 2009, 04:22 PM
Don't get me wrong, I love PSO, but it has it's share of problems and I'm hoping some of these problems are fixed in PSZ.

Damage Cancel. Has it returned?

Technique damage. Is it more balanced than PSO? Is a tech nuking force a good idea this time around?

Meseta. Does it have any value? Or is it still worthless for trades between players?

Does PSZ have FSOD? What happens if you're playing online and the game shuts down without saving properly? Do you lose all of your unequipped items like in the console versions of PSO?

I know there are more but I can't remember them right now. It's been a while since I last played PSO.

Callous
Jan 4, 2009, 05:01 PM
Meseta act exactly like they did in PSO, which I love. Photon drops act as a second currency in the underground shop, but even those are quite easy to come by just by playing the game normally. Seems like rares will once again be what it's all about - just how it should be!

I'll say one thing about techs. To cast a RA tech you now charge a normal tech. It is a very slow business and my feeling so far is that for this reason alone a nuker might not be a sensible option. It is still early days, though, and I haven't raised a FO very far yet, so maybe I'm wrong.

Even though lots of people get disconnected, I haven't heard of any cases of FSOD so far. It doesn't seem like it will be an issue at all.

Nowhere
Jan 4, 2009, 05:54 PM
Since your character data is stored entirely on your cart, there's really no chance of an FSOD like problem -- worst case you revert to your last save (unless you power off while saving and corrupt everything, but that's universal to all games.)

Maybe I'm the only one who cares about it much, but the clipping is still fairly bad--i.e. the wall deflection when moving around is still poor.

#1 misfeature from PSO is the game is easily hacked. Not sure how common it is, but there are some cheats available that I'll probably be complaining about forever.

Ultie
Jan 4, 2009, 05:54 PM
techs are more balanced, u can spam them if your not worried about eating at fluids, or you can melee with ur fo wep since fo weps melee damage is based of mind.

the loosing all ur weps like that was only a dreamcast prob i think, anyway it dosnt happen on ps0

Mike
Jan 4, 2009, 09:08 PM
the loosing all ur weps like that was only a dreamcast prob i think, anyway it dosnt happen on ps0

I wouldn't call that a problem.

Phaze37
Jan 5, 2009, 02:53 AM
Since your character data is stored entirely on your cart, there's really no chance of an FSOD like problem

Actually, the fact that character data was stored locally is EXACTLY why FSOD would happen in the first place. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that losing your items when you don't save and quit properly was not a bug at all, but something that Sonic Team put into the game on purpose. Think about it; if it just reverted back to your old save like a single player game, you could give an item to a friend, quit without saving, and load up your old save that still has the item. Then both you and your friend would have the item. Every version of PSO except for Blue Burst has FSOD, and the only reason BB doesn't have FSOD is because it has server side saving. This is why I'm worried that PSZ will have FSOD as well, since your character data is stored on your cart.

Of course, it's not just a frozen game that I worried about. I had to re-hunt my yasimkov 9000m and spread needle on GC several times due to power outages. Made me afraid to play the game when the weather was bad, which is exactly when I WANT to play videogames. At least I won't have to worry about power failures in PSZ.

jmanx
Jan 5, 2009, 04:33 AM
Lvls are flat, I've notice this later on as playing it after like 2 lvls. Because you will not notice it at first much due to the lots of scenery. And Mag lvl and Max char lvl was cut in half. that is all I got...

uo0v
Jan 5, 2009, 05:03 AM
Lvls are flat, I've notice this later on as playing it after like 2 lvls. Because you will not notice it at first much due to the lots of scenery. And Mag lvl and Max char lvl was cut in half. that is all I got...

errrmm, you misread the title of this topic ^^

Zarode
Jan 5, 2009, 06:12 AM
Damage Cancel. Has it returned?

I've played enough online to say it hasn't returned.


Technique damage. Is it more balanced than PSO? Is a tech nuking force a good idea this time around?

Playing a FOnewm main on my cart, tech damage certainly is strong. Sometimes broken.

Also, to the guy who said Gi tech charging is slow, you get slots to counter that.


Meseta. Does it have any value? Or is it still worthless for trades between players?

No value. It's between PDs and actual Rares. You won't trade very often though, considering there is no such thing as a SID now.


Does PSZ have FSOD? What happens if you're playing online and the game shuts down without saving properly?

I had nothing like that happen to me. Closest I got to that was I was joining in a friend's match with some PSOW people, and we disconnected. It wiped them from my list. It was right after the JP release, so the servers were probably full to burst.


Do you lose all of your unequipped items like in the console versions of PSO?

Jesus Christ no, I am so freakin glad they took out that retarded rule out of any version of PSO beyond GC.

It's enjoyable, and I have a feeling they are going to pull a 2nd Freedom on us (totally new game that acts like an expansion). I guess the problem would be transferring data, but I think a save transfer with a middle man approach would work. :)

Rina Rappy
Jan 5, 2009, 09:01 AM
A problem I think that's returned is lack of buttons.
I was struggling with PSOBB and that had the extra keys 0-9 lol...
Though the charging does cut down on buttons needed a bit.
I'm still yet to work out what to do with my FOney at higher levels - SDJZ would use 4 of my 6 button slots...

Callous
Jan 5, 2009, 10:14 AM
Yeah, I don't think J/Z are going to see all the much use in PSZ.

TUSCAN
Jan 5, 2009, 10:45 AM
It's enjoyable, and I have a feeling they are going to pull a 2nd Freedom on us (totally new game that acts like an expansion). I guess the problem would be transferring data, but I think a save transfer with a middle man approach would work. :)

I've been thinking the same thing, but I imagine it would have something to do with the new DSi and it's SD card slot and Nintendo Online Store downloading options. Apparently the only region locked aspect of the DSi has to do with the online store, so worst case scenario would be we'd need a Japanese DSi to download PS0 content. Of course all this should eventually come out domestically, it's just a matter of weather one wants to wait for it or not.

jmanx
Jan 5, 2009, 12:33 PM
errrmm, you misread the title of this topic ^^

XD oh it was a OOOOOOOOO not a 000000000 D: well at least I was half right about pso being flat XD

Nowhere
Jan 5, 2009, 03:16 PM
Actually, the fact that character data was stored locally is EXACTLY why FSOD would happen in the first place.
Yeah, I think you're right. It's been a while. But I meant to imply that the design has changed substantially since then. It would be too cruel to do that kind of thing in a game that's so easily and predictably hacked like PSZ.

Kent
Jan 5, 2009, 08:13 PM
What exactly do you mean by "damage cancel?"

Moniker
Jan 5, 2009, 09:04 PM
In PSO you could cast Resta and have a split second of invulnerability as you healed.

Amherst_Wind
Jan 5, 2009, 09:42 PM
In PSO you could cast Resta and have a split second of invulnerability as you healed.

Now we have an official damage cancel, Dodge Roll! Requires the same precise timing but achieves the same effect.

Rakukojin
Jan 5, 2009, 10:03 PM
Yeah, I think you're right. It's been a while. But I meant to imply that the design has changed substantially since then. It would be too cruel to do that kind of thing in a game that's so easily and predictably hacked like PSZ.

Partially right. When you go online in the console PSO games, it saves the "active" (equipped weapons and the like) to the memory of the gamecube itself (or dreamcast as the case may be). when you log off and save normally, that data is returned to the memory card. When you get an fsod, or you power it system off without logging off and saving normally, that process is ignored and the items are lost. the reason for loading it into the console's memory instead, I think, is to reduce loading times and such as much as possible while online. however, if the data were on the memory card at all times, fsod and such wouldn't be as much of an issue as they were/are (NOTE: this is only one side that I've heard, but it's a logical possibility)

From my own experience, PSZ does not suffer from this problem, but if you didn't save prior to the game freezing or battery dying, or whatever the case, then yes, you will lose everything after your last save, just like any other game.

Nowhere
Jan 5, 2009, 10:24 PM
Yeah, but they must have intentionally removed it from the save to prevent abuse of powering off the system to get an edge. (I'm thinking tekkers and grinders mostly.) Otherwise they could have just left it on the save. Keeping it in RAM really doesn't affect whether or not it's in the save, and you have to have it in RAM anyway.

Rakukojin
Jan 5, 2009, 10:28 PM
Yeah, but they must have intentionally removed it from the save to prevent abuse of powering off the system to get an edge. (I'm thinking tekkers and grinders mostly.) Otherwise they could have just left it on the save. Keeping it in RAM really doesn't affect whether or not it's in the save, and you have to have it in RAM anyway.

I agree that it was most likely intentional, I never said it wasn't. (not trying to start an argument, just clarifying.)

yellow5
Jan 5, 2009, 10:48 PM
What exactly do you mean by "damage cancel?"

Damage cancel is exactly as the name implies. In Phantasy Star Online, damage was canceled if two or more players were attacking the same enemy. This made it seem like enemies had more HP, but in reality, it took longer to kill enemies because some of the damage was canceled. Only applied to online mode.

I'm not sure if damage cancel exists in PSZ, though. Even if it does exist, it's likely offset by the chain system.

Kent
Jan 6, 2009, 12:04 AM
Damage cancel is exactly as the name implies. In Phantasy Star Online, damage was canceled if two or more players were attacking the same enemy. This made it seem like enemies had more HP, but in reality, it took longer to kill enemies because some of the damage was canceled. Only applied to online mode.

I'm not sure if damage cancel exists in PSZ, though. Even if it does exist, it's likely offset by the chain system.
Oh, right, that. I'm fairly certain that the reason for this was due to the netcode that was in place at the time, which was designed to be as efficient as possible for the Dreamcast's standard 33.6k modem. Corners had to be cut somewhere, but this was probably just a bug that may or may not have lingered into later versions of the game.

I've never heard of such a thing referred to as "damage cancel" though, probably because when people talk about a "cancel," they're referring to something a player does specifically to gain an advantage of some sort (generally speaking, the ability to stop one action prematurely to initiate another).

GreenArcher
Jan 7, 2009, 04:14 PM
Damage cancel is still around all the way in blue burst, and it's a problem with the game not the netcode, because it happens in splitscreen on xbox/gc PSO as well.

Multiple people attacking the same target -> only one person's damage will register (usually the lower damage in my experience)

Mike
Jan 7, 2009, 07:34 PM
Do you need food badly? Heh, just kidding. I'm pretty sure this isn't in PS0 since multliple people attacking the same enemy defeats it faster than a single person attacking it.

GreenArcher
Jan 9, 2009, 04:15 PM
Well that's good to hear then.

(I don't need food badly, but I did just gain a level :wacko:)

Baltam314
Feb 24, 2010, 09:34 PM
Probably has to do with data locks, which prevent multiple threads from altering a variable simultaneously. At least it also allows for resta blocking.

Spider
Feb 26, 2010, 05:35 AM
i've only JUST started playing tonight, and the only thing I don't like is that there is no (Or hopefully just haven't found yet) shortcut for quick swapping weapons. That and HUmar now looks terrible and theres not as much customization options when making a character.

Chaos Rappy
Feb 26, 2010, 08:46 AM
i've only JUST started playing tonight, and the only thing I don't like is that there is no (Or hopefully just haven't found yet) shortcut for quick swapping weapons. That and HUmar now looks terrible and theres not as much customization options when making a character.

R+Start is the weapon-swapping shortcut... Are tons people suddenly buying used or something without the enclosed instruction book? I feel this same question's been being asked more and more recently than when the game first came out, even though it's basically told on page 6 of the instructions. <_<

Kirukia
Feb 26, 2010, 08:48 AM
Damage cancel is exactly as the name implies. In Phantasy Star Online, damage was canceled if two or more players were attacking the same enemy. This made it seem like enemies had more HP, but in reality, it took longer to kill enemies because some of the damage was canceled. Only applied to online mode.

I'm not sure if damage cancel exists in PSZ, though. Even if it does exist, it's likely offset by the chain system.

It's still around.
Get Ogi to equip his laser cannon and then try to hit things while hes attacking them.

Mike
Feb 26, 2010, 09:29 AM
Raising a year old thread rocks.