Class Discussion and Fixes

[xBladeM6x]

Y'know what. Nevermind. Apparently ideas are not taken seriously, or with any thought from anyone else. And it's funny because I'm usually a person to stay away from balance topics, but hey, apparently good ideas aren't allowed. Close this topic.

[xBladeM6x]

I know it's a lot to read. But please take these points into consideration with party, and soloing. And just yeah. >.>;

Take your time reading. x3

[amtalx]

I can see your point in most cases, regardless of whether I agree or not. However, the bleeding over Paradi is a bit much. Its not like it clears entire blocks. Its only available a couple times a mission anyway, and only has an impact if you are counting seconds.

[majan]

techers do suffer the worst, but you are missing the point of the master classes.

before I go on my rant, understand that I do agree that mastertechers *MAYBE* deserve a sliver more HP - remember 1 thing, force is supposed to be the most challenging class to play in the game -and shouldve at least got level 20 support because it defeats the purpose not to because now they all just carry megistarides and star atomizers instead.

now onto my main point: the master classes are the most advanced, "masterful" classes in the game. for example, a person who specifies in accounting his whole life and has completely devoted himself to it becomes EXTREMELY good with numbers and managing money,obviously. but when it comes to providing food for himself, he needs backup. he can probably boil water and throw some pasta in it or go to mcdonalds and spend his hard earned cash on a burger, but when it comes to fending for himself, he's more or less fucked. this is the idea behind the master classes. a person who masters in one thing does not consequently then master a balance of that one thing with other things, because he would then no longer be a master of that one thing. the master classes are not meant to be played solo. can it be done? yes,with difficulty,and for the solo enthusiasts,they will enjoy this challenge. but the true blue team of PSU with the masterclasses is thus:
the fighmaster at the forefront dealing the heavy damage and playing the tank, masterforces nuking like hell in a variety of ways while applying a few status effects, gunmasters also doing heavy dps while applying the main bulk of the SE's (and SE's do make a massive difference in mission times) and acrotechers as the white mage,healing with unparalelled force and throwing buffs that now offer massive performance increases. the other hybrid classes are good too,but when it comes to an ideal situation, this is probably what they had in mind when they designed how each class would be built.
ironically,this "perfect team" is a 4-person team,and for whatever reason, ST still insists on letting this be a 6-player game. in theory its cool to have a bigger team because,well,it rocks to play with a bunch of people,but when it comes to a balanced party,a good strong team of 6 will blow through,well,pretty much anything without difficulty.

so you see,these classes are designed #1- for the elite player looking for a legitimate challenge at this stage in the game,seeing as its come quite a long way, and #2- to be played in a team with other classes at that same high level.

if you're going to get one thing out of my post if you're too immature or impatient to read and make sense out of it, understand one thing:

"master classes" =/= "easy mode"

oh,and PS:
paradi cataract,I can see,gets a bad rap for being "overpowered" when in reality it isnt at all. it is just a hell of a lot faster and hits a lot harder than the other SUV's,but does half the amount of hits,if you pay close attention. higher dps than the other suv's? probably,in the long run,I guess. strong weapon? huge help to the party? well,yeah. that's what most s-rank slot units should be,I would guess. don't knock it. in a lot of ways, nanoblast is still better. suv's do suffer from a key disadvantage: they only last the x amount of seconds (which for paradi cataract is like really bad sex with a hot chick, satisfying but 4 seconds and it's over) and are only good in that one-shot deal. nanoblasts on the other hand offer a lot of damage to be dealt over the course of 50 seconds, as you see fit. a boss that can't be targeted easily with an SUV will be getting pummeled in the face by a red beast dealing 1800+ per target,at a pretty smart pace.

[xBladeM6x]

I can see your point in most cases, regardless of whether I agree or not. However, the bleeding over Paradi is a bit much. Its not like it clears entire blocks. Its only available a couple times a mission anyway, and only has an impact if you are counting seconds.
The paradi thing is true though. Look in a party of 1-6 casts. The more, the faster. You could clear an entire block if you were speed running with 6 casts. And with that, you could be clearing spawns within 10 seconds.

6 Paradis = .......... Death.

It's not that I was so angry over it as much as I just feel that it was a point that needs to be made because most people who adore it, will bash me without even thinking of it logically.

[Kylie]

I would give WT and GT a little more ATP and TP. I think MF could use a little HP too, but that's all I definitely think deserves a fix on your list. I'd rather them balance the missions more so than classes and races because some most missions aren't even worth doing anymore because they're so easy. S3 v1 missions couldn't come sooner.

[xBladeM6x]

"master classes" =/= "easy mode"
Yes I did read your entire post. And this is what sums it up. Anyways, I understand that. And I never said it should be easy mode. But I'm saying In terms of what a techer should be strong and resistant against, what I posted above has a VERY valid point. And it doesn't just go for Masterforce, it goes for all classes that use Techs.

[Jose!]

The only thing I could complain about is Nanoblast on Master Classes. I thought it would get the speed boost that FM got. I wish Nanoblasts got the FM speed boost. That would make them MUCH more useful.

[Erkthemerc]

The only things that needs to be fixed are jabroga and majarra...everything else is ok and how it should be.

[Finae]

Ya see the thing about paradi is, if it was such a gamebreaker, it would of already been fixed like chikki was. Chikki was the most overpowered thing that even the JP were complaining like no other about it. I mean, even a FF could be doing crazy dmg with it and not need jabroni at all unless it was a boss for example :P. That is a game breaker to me as you just bring in 2-3 of these slicer whoring fools (I was one too) and its worse than the Fighmaster owning everything ordeal currently.

Yes, if you have about 6 casts in the party, paradi will make the run a whole lot faster vs any other racial group or mixed racial group. Its like 6 nanoblasts lol. Too bad nano not that great to me heh. But its nothing that gamebreaking as my beast is just like 2-3 min slower than my cast usually if I do TA runs. I hardly call that gamebreaking. Segac don't really care about people TAing imo so to them, your argument is invalid.

Lastly, think the JP would be in a uproar over this one seeing as a good amount of their population is cast lol. Most of the TA videos you see that are JP, are cast :P. So if the JP population is fine with paradi, segac won't change it like chikki haha.

Lol my Newman AF > my newman FT/MF. Hah with that setup of mine, going ft/mf is for shits and giggles. Obviously my AF outdid my FT back then on a speed run by far lol.

Eh....ya....the mf dying so fast and crap can be changed but amusing to me haha.

Anyways, this is wishful thinking, it could or could not happen, but I personally doubt it :P.

[ashley50]

who needs nanoblasts when the Jabroga is much faster? ;l

[Tulio07]

- Any type of Techer applies to this. They should give them a Ra-spell update that allows them to hit the number of targets on a single monster, as they can hit groups. Otherwise, they are useless at bosses and large creatures with more than 1 point.

I couldn't agree with this one more. I also would like to see this happen with the line spells like barta and megid. This would make some bosses much easier to kill, so up their hp. I for one think that in a game where 6 players are possible, being able to solo an S2 boss in a decent amount of time is ridiculous. Up their hp.

[Seira7]

I agree with this post on many points, before PSU was actually out, I was very excited about being able to choose a race I liked and build it the way I wanted it. I envisioned TP affecting buffs or something to that extent, maybe ATA affecting gun power, anyway, I liked the idea of having freedom to build my own character, looks wise, skills wise.

I liked the direction they went with Shadoogs (TP and ATA affecting a weapon) I'd like to see additional weapons like that, so humans and newmans could bring more to the plate as fighters.
Or super high tp/mst req on a something, ala Elysion/Holy Ray.

People might laugh at the idea of giving Newmans and Humans superpowers, but honestly, shouldnt you be able to choose any race and be powerful in your own right?
But no, you are stuck playing a cast if you want to be the best. Also, cast design looks awful in this game. If I have to be a robot, cant I look awesome like Lou or Vivienne (or Elenor...lol)? Instead of some half n half mish mash of robot and human parts with god awful skin tones.

So PSU's appeal is customization, but not all races are good, and hybrid classes blow.
Any class should be good if you work at it. Maybe some classes should be harder than others to make awesome, but in the end every class should be exceptional in its own right. Including hybrids.

Also, Just Attack made the game more exciting for fighters, so why cant gunners or techers use it? (please dont say they have Just Counter, its cool, but fighters have both JA and JC)
Werent you able to use normal-> heavy -> special on guns in PSO? What gives?

Its just all seems incomplete, but hey, its SEGA. What can ya do.

[Dark Emerald EXE]

I...... agree yet disagree with the paradi statement
Bcuz most missions are somewhat easy to do durin the level

Normally when i have cast in the party 85% of the time the cast's (includin myself) would used paradi in the last room....which is normal. However.....sometimes i use mine for quick saves for others.....like if some people in the group are about to die or somethin

[amtalx]

The paradi thing is true though. Look in a party of 1-6 casts. The more, the faster. You could clear an entire block if you were speed running with 6 casts. And with that, you could be clearing spawns within 10 seconds.

6 Paradis = .......... Death.

It's not that I was so angry over it as much as I just feel that it was a point that needs to be made because most people who adore it, will bash me without even thinking of it logically.

Yea but you act as if you can fill your SUV meter with a Photon Charge. Sure, you get those 6 SUVs in a mission...then what. You have to go back to fighting.

[Tetsaru]

- Stricter requirements on being able to equip certain weapons/armor. For example, my Lv50 AF shouldn't be able to already use the best slicers and range-mags currently available; that should be near-endgame level equipment, perhaps usable around Lv100 or so, rather than having X amount of ATP or whatever. This would help make items more valuable and usable, instead of automatically making them obsolete whenever a newer, stronger item becomes available. Also, perhaps more race/gender/class-only items, to add even more variety and balance.

- Not really a balance thing, but Segac should add more special and/or visual effects to weapons and armor. Why doesn't the Psycho Wand fold up and extend like in PSO? Why doesn't the Guld & Milla have an awesome HP stealing special shot? Why do most of the line shields, depending on their manufacturer, have the same blocking animations? This could be greatly improved upon.

- Make every manufacturer make every weapon type. Stuff like Tenora Works rifles or GRM slicers don't exist yet, and they should. Their stats should also reflect the trends of the manufacturers, and give players more options in considering their equipment, rather than always getting the ones with the best ATP, etc.

- Do away with Kubara "clone" weapons (Rattlesnac, Blackheartic, etc.). They're stupid, and only proves that Segac would rather reskin a weapon rather than make a new one, which could easily have the same stats. Kubara-only weapons (Carriguine-Rucar, Degahna Cannon, etc.), are just fine. Also, why are there no Kubara armors or units?

- Nanoblasts need an overhaul. The strength (red) and invulnerability (blue) ones are the only two that are useful anymore. Create new ones, rebalance the ones that aren't used, and provide unique attacks for each, so that Beasts have as many options as Casts do with SUV's. Also, female Nanoblasts could possibly be rebalanced as well, or even given entirely different abilities from their male counterparts... for example, a "yellow" Nanoblast could give a huge movement and attack speed boost, but females would move faster; males, however, would have considerably more strength with a "red" Nanoblast.

- GIVE HUMANS AND NEWMANS THEIR OWN RACIAL ABILITIES.

I'll probably think of more later on, but that's a start. =P

[xBladeM6x]

Well here. For everyone who is saying they don't agree with the paradi statement. Look at the time attack leader boards on MAG1 and MAG2. Tell me what the most dominate race is? CAST. Alllllllll paradi's doing.

[AweOfShe]

Jabroga needs it's ATA mod fixed so that the mod itself actually matters. I mean seriously, the only time you'll ever see a 0 with it is if you use it with a Bico... :P

[amtalx]

Well here. For everyone who is saying they don't agree with the paradi statement. Look at the time attack leader boards on MAG1 and MAG2. Tell me what the most dominate race is? CAST. Alllllllll paradi's doing.

In a mission where there are large numbers of non-bullet-resistant enemies that spawn at the same time? Real conundrum there. :p Yes, Paradi is powerful, but its not game breaking like you are saying. I can shatter mobs with Sturm too, should we nerf that?

[Ezodagrom]

In my opinion, or paradi should be nerfed just a bit, or there should be S rank SUVs as strong as paradi based on the lower rank ones. But for SUVs to get boost, nanoblasts should be boosted a bit so they would be as good as the S rank SUVs.
The ones needing more changes are the yellow and purple ones though. Maybe something like the yellow one having a speed boost and the purple one having an increased duration? ^^;
Also Newmans and Humans really need a special ability...not only Beasts and Casts are the best races for most classes, they also have their special abilities...

Also I think that enemies should be boosted too, something like stats increase (mainly HP), movement speed increase and even higher number of enemies on some missions, mainly some v1 missions (for example Dual Sentinel...there are some huge rooms with just a few enemies).

I agree with everything else in the first post, plus the higher requirement for weapons and line shields, every manufacturer making every weapon type and Jabroga actually missing. ^^

[ZeroKamikaze]

I just like how everyone who was a beast or human went to cast just for power. I played a Cast from day 1, and he's still around, not because I can use a 'Super Weapon,' but because I think in general Casts are the coolest looking race in the game, and add in more customization options for casts than all other races, and yea I enjoy being a cast. Sure I ended up having a powerful character that was fun to play (Fighgunner since V1) but it just turned out to be luck of the draw. I'm not going around making fun of people who have 12% or low grinded equipment, I actually try to hep people get better stuff, and the way things are nowadays that seems almost taboo, what with everyone being powerhungry and all.

All those who made new characters just for paradi... pretty stupid really, not much else to say. Even if you have a reputation, thats still no reason to go through the work of maxing a new character just to be able to use a 'Super Weapon,' add in the fact that your reputations won't mean shit when the servers shut off.

Honestly I know paradi is overpowered, possibly broken, and I dont use it unless i get the okay from my usual party members. I'm no elitist, I'm not an elite player, I just your average joe looking a play a good game and have fun with my friends. And on a final note, I'd rather use Espada, Faust, or the other SUVs mostly cause they look badass, even if Paradi makes me stronger, but then again thats the way I play, "To Have Fun, Not Make a Name for Myself, or Practice My Economic Skills."

[fay]

i agree with everything the OP said

wasnt too concerned with the paradi thing but at the same time i realy think damage should be cut in half.
im not saying it should be cut in half because its too strong but because of the 5 END you get with it. its the strongest and gives out the best END. to make people want to use other SUVs this should have half damage or only put up about 2 END

[Dark Emerald EXE]

In my opinion, or paradi should be nerfed just a bit, or there should be S rank SUVs as strong as paradi based on the lower rank ones. But for SUVs to get boost, nanoblasts should be boosted a bit so they would be as good as the S rank SUVs.
The ones needing more changes are the yellow and purple ones though. Maybe something like the yellow one having a speed boost and the purple one having an increased duration? ^^;
Also Newmans and Humans really need a special ability...not only Beasts and Casts are the best races for most classes, they also have their special abilities...

Also I think that enemies should be boosted too, something like stats increase (mainly HP), movement speed increase and even higher number of enemies on some missions, mainly some v1 missions (for example Dual Sentinel...there are some huge rooms with just a few enemies).

I agree with everything else in the first post, plus the higher requirement for weapons and line shields, every manufacturer making every weapon type and Jabroga actually missing. ^^

Just a thought

S rank SUV
Grom Striker
Hegel Striker
Rafal Striker
Strum Striker

I dont see why they cant do it.....They already have the buster series for B class and atttacker for A why not S?

[RegulusHikari]

Concerning some of the "balances" people have been asking for, you need to remember that this is an ORPG. This isn't some kind of fighter or RTS where balance is critical for player to player interaction. Even less so when there is no direct PVP involved.

In the case of Paradi in particular, when you play an MMO/RPG, you get stronger and stronger and progress to the point where all of your new equips and skills and whatnot completely outclass your old ones. Paradi is a high tiered SUV, it's supposed to be better than the rest. This isn't a fighter where I need to sit back and examine the benefits and drawbacks of all my choices, this is an RPG where I say "this one's better, that one can get the fuck out."

Not directed at anyone in particular, but rather the subject of some rebalances as a whole.

[darkante]

I wouldn´t mind an upgrade on the Attacker units to be an S-rank variants.

Hell, i prefer to see myself shoot off a big big rocket up in the air and then see it travel fast down to make a huge impact blast (think of those rooms in SP & LB) doing about equal dmg as Paradi and off course Burn status.

Just something to use that still do just as good dmg.

[JAFO22000]

- Techers in general. They should hit harder then they do. I don't mean in damage either. I mean literally, they HIT harder. As in the make a creature fall over or fall back kinda, instead of just flinching. I say this because not even the badira will flinch when you are being charged by them, using 41+ dambarta.




Not trying to derail your argument, as I think you make some great points here (especially MST meaning a lot more!) but this quote in particular sort of proves a point I've been trying to make all along about techers in this game.

Yes, you are correct that 41+ Dambarta does not flinch badira's.....BUT, there are 3 other Barta techs that do! Barta and Rabarta both stop them in their tracks for a split second; enough time for you to cast again with the increased casting speed and Gibarta actually flinches them.

Most techers do not know this as most do not have these to a high enough level and/or do not use anything except Dambarta. I don't know about the OPs particular mastery of techs and this post is in no way a judgement, but too often I see people complain, then look at their techs and see Diga, Foie and Dambarta at 41+ and the rest below 25...