Don't Forget This Guys... Supplement updates

[roardova lengths]

http://ambitionofilluminus.com/AOTI_supplemental_update

Make sure you read it in depth...

This is what will finalize...
1. Stop paying for PSU
2. Stop playing PSU
3. No more posts here or on the official forums

Make sure you check out the very bottom, it's a killer...

[RemiusTA]

Yes we've known about this for about 800 years.

[roardova lengths]

OK, I'm just bringing it back up again; I don't pay for my account anyway. :)

[GUNcrazy12]

umm, what is this for?
Is there some kind of update to the already known one?
(that segac will never give us...)

[DreXxiN]

WUT. NO PS2 GRAPHICAL UPDATES. MY PS2 RUNS THIS GAME BEAUTIFULLY Y CANT IT HANDLE MORE GRAFIX

[Yamishi]

WUT. NO PS2 GRAPHICAL UPDATES. MY PS2 RUNS THIS GAME BEAUTIFULLY Y CANT IT HANDLE MORE GRAFIX

I'm not sure if you're joking or not, but just to be on the safe side:

The PS2 graphics that will be missing will be for the new weapons. Nothing will be changed or downgraded, you'll just see new weapons as old weapons, even though the stats and text will remain.
Dig?

[Ethateral]

It's PS2... So? :/ I'd never play an MMO of any type on a PS2. Just save up a little money and upgrade your computer over time and buy the game for your PC.

[Criss]

What, about the lack of visual update on PS2? What's the big deal? You can still get all the new items and use everything else from the update, they just reuse old visuals. I mean come on, the PS2 doesn't support hard drives, you had to see it coming. It's your own damn fault if you're still playing on an outdated console anyways. Especially with PS2 accounts being playable on PC and the PC version costing pretty much nothing, there's no reason not to switch to PC if you want visuals for new items so bad.

[AngelofEnders]

I love how PS2 players are bastardized like they're somehow wrong for playing on that console.

[hunterseifer]

I love how PS2 players are bastardized like they're somehow wrong for playing on that console.
If you hadnt noticed the console itself is pretty low end, if you start playing with more than 3 players the game starts to lag, like you need that many ppl to run stuff on this game anyway

[Noblewine]

I like how they are expanding the commbox capacity.

[AngelofEnders]

Oh I've noticed but I'm not gonna tell a PS2 user that his/her priorities should be to upgrade to PC because they're in the way of everyone else's dreams and wishes. :(

[unicorn]

I love how PS2 players are bastardized like they're somehow wrong for playing on that console.

Yeah. Last time I checked, this game was a PS2 game. ST just took their damn time making it (weren't rumors about PSU around since...2003?), so thats why it ended up being released around the same time Next-generation consoles came out.

If anyone is wrong, its ST. All of a sudden they don't want this game to be a PS2 game, well they really should have thought beforehand shouldn't they? They should've just taken another year and made this game for Xbox360/PC/PS3, then we wouldn't have the problems we have now (low population, slow-down, tech-visual nerfs, living on small bi-weekly updates, etc).

[darthplagis]

Yeah. Last time I checked, this game was a PS2 game. ST just took their damn time making it (weren't rumors about PSU around since...2003?), so thats why it ended up being released around the same time Next-generation consoles came out.

If anyone is wrong, its ST. All of a sudden they don't want this game to be a PS2 game, well they really should have thought beforehand shouldn't they? They should've just taken another year and made this game for Xbox360/PC/PS3, then we wouldn't have the problems we have now (low population, slow-down, tech-visual nerfs, living on small bi-weekly updates, etc).

while true, you must also remember that blue burst was PC only, so in fairness PSU was probably meant to be PC only with the ps2 option tagged in for population boost, also the JP ps2 and a small population of western PS2 users with the old 'nearly as big as an xbox' ps2 DID support hard drives and a network adapter, now im not a ps2 fan as sony killed sega's console devision. as we know xbox360 support came later and was probably in response to the mass population of western market having an xbox360 over ps2

[ShuttleXpC]

Oh I've noticed but I'm not gonna tell a PS2 user that his/her priorities should be to upgrade to PC because they're in the way of everyone else's dreams and wishes. :(

Not the players fault, Sega's for programming a game that runs even slow at times on the 360. The game is horribly ported/coded, I think anyone that has played the 360/Ps2 version could tell you that.

[RemiusTA]

Yeah. Last time I checked, this game was a PS2 game. ST just took their damn time making it (weren't rumors about PSU around since...2003?), so thats why it ended up being released around the same time Next-generation consoles came out.

If anyone is wrong, its ST. All of a sudden they don't want this game to be a PS2 game, well they really should have thought beforehand shouldn't they? They should've just taken another year and made this game for Xbox360/PC/PS3, then we wouldn't have the problems we have now (low population, slow-down, tech-visual nerfs, living on small bi-weekly updates, etc).

Um....no.


Absolutely every indication of this game states it was not ment to be ran on a PS2.
-The framerate is horrible. Absolutely horrible.
- the textures aren't even fully visible (On PS2 most of the time you cant even make out whats on the weapons)
-The Line Sheilds dont have special effects (pissed me off first time i played PC and actually noticed)
-Draw distance is garbage
-You cant even play in a room with more than 3 people without HORRIBLE horrible lag.


This game was definately PC based, then through a decision to widen its consumer base, it was stuck on the PS2. This game RUNS like a PC game with 360 support, or vice versa. The PS2 completely butchers this game. The 360 decision was most likely flawed in the sense that Japan hasn't fully cought on to the 360 yet. They're definately starting to, but not towards the release of this game. In the future, if this game continues to get updates, you can only expect the PS2 version to fall farther and farther behind, becuase of PSU ever gets as large as PSOBB, the PS2 will NEVER be able to keep up. It was going to happen eventually.

The PS2 was the absolute weakest of the last generation -- there is no way they can hope to expand upon this game and keep the PS2 in the mix. By choosing to put this on the PC and 360, they've basically put no limit on what they want to add -- if through some new release / patch they can optimize the 360 version farther, then they can advance this game as far as they want with little problems.

But if they ever decide to release NEW weapons? Like, PSU (Not PSP or PSO) exclusive weapons? Expect them to either not reach the PS2, or expect them visually downgraded to hell.


Besides, any gamer with a PS2 at this point should be upgrading. You're mad people dont want to put their stuff on your shitty hardware anymore? Stop whining and get a 360/ps3/wii already. In 2 years time the PS3 will have far more players, so if you arent getting a 360 you might as well go for that.

(BTW, its games like PSU that remind me why i dont even care about the wii anymore. Motion gimmicks are nice, but when you have to STRUGGLE to make shaders work on the system (lolconduit), then it really shows how weak your shit is.)

[biggabertha]

Yeaaaaah.... a PS3 costs £300.

An Xbox 360 costs at least £180 or so.

A PC capable of handling PSU costs in the region of £300 - £450 without the inclusion of a screen.

Compared to my PS2 that cost me £100 two years ago and still has games that are far cheaper than a PS3, Xbox 360 or legit PC game I'm sure I'll happily stay on my PS2.

Why should I upgrade when there's about five games I want to play of all three of those mentioned...? One of those upgrades means leaving behind all of my friends on the PC/PS2 US/EU servers. Another one of those upgrades means having a decent monitor and a knowledge of Windows. The last upgrade doesn't even play PS2 games unless you have the earlier editions of the console and you're just essentially playing a PS2 on a unit that makes more noise than my washing machine.


Sure, I understand your frustration at PSU and I've thought many times to upgrade to a high end PC so I can play the game without needing to think ahead on what weapons I need to use. But to pay £300 or more just for one game when I manage just fine on a PS2...?

I'll wait until we DO get a supplemental update on our servers before doing that. Aside from the three rare missions and the co-operative missions that require another player(s) to stand on a switch, is there anything or anywhere that needs more than one, two or three players..?

£150+ is not easy for some people to pay on a unit that is notoriously unreliable.
£300+ is not ideal for a small, confined living area.

Being told how to spend our money over the internet is really a funny thing.

"Buy a new console for PSU if you care about it but don't pay for the GC missions!!"

[RemiusTA]

Nobody is telling you how to spend your money. Im telling you to invest in a system that doesn't suck. Nobody HAS to listen when people say that...but dont complain when everyone else is moving on, thats all. You cant get angry when even the developers are tired of being held back on shitty hardware.

I dont know why you'd want to play on PS2 anyway. Seriously, i just switched to 360 from PC/PS2 (yes my PC runs PSU perfectly) and im NEVER going back. I rarely ever have framerate problems (Runs at 0 Frameskip until a dip, which almost always goes away in a second or two.), the game runs as smoothly as on PC with a draw distance just as large, and to top it off...i can add my own soundtrack to it on the go.

If i ever am forced to go back to PS2, im just gonna quit. In fact, i would perfer if they'd just drop the fucking PS2 already so this game can be PC/360 like its SUPPOSED TO BE. (Seriously, MICROSOFT Xbox, MICROSOFT Xbox Live, and MICROSOFT Windows. Why the HELL are they different platforms?)

I still believe the only reason PC isnt linked up with 360 is because they had to back the PS2 with something. Either that, or they just had zero faith in the 360 version.

However, if the PC/360 version of this game was linked, it would be great. I dont know how many of the PS2/PC JP players are PC players, but im sure its a very nice chunk of them. JP PC + US/EU PC + 360US/EU/JP would complete the game AND population. FUCK ps2.

[biggabertha]

PS2 plays fine for me and I've played on the PC. Sure, it looks smoother and weapons load (and usually stay loaded) instantaneously but it also makes a lot of noise. The fans, the hard drive being accessed and most of all you can't get the buttons to be EXACTLY the same as the PS2's configuration (Cancel goes to the palette button on PC, it's the PA button on a PS2).

I'm fine with using my laptop or CD player for my own soundtrack. I'm sure others that have enough money will have dedicated portable music players of some sort.


The biggest reason I can think of for the servers not to be merged in unison is because of localisation. JP 360 wouldn't last very long on it's own so it got merged with EU/US 360 servers.

JP PC/PS2 is separate from US/EU PC/PS2 most likely for translation purposes, testing and because it was mainly the Western's fault for ruining PSO for many players. Didn't DC PSO get cut completely while EU and JP DC PSO kept going?

Sonic Team sure learnt their lesson when they thought about merging things together again with PSO GC WHOAH!!! Was that a mistake.

Wasn't PSO Xbox region locked too..?


Sure, it'd be nice if all the servers were linked but I don't think it's really easy to do that. I remember playing on the JP servers for the GC and being welcomed with lots and lots of lag. That and as cool as WORD SELECT was, it rarely worked well.

I'm sure that PC and 360 have the same problems as the PS2 - they can just load things faster. Amazing how everyone just wants things now, Now, NOW.

Pretty soon, people will be saying that rare items don't drop and new content needs to be added in on a weekly basis. Oh wait...

Man, not even WoW or FFXI adds entirely new content every week or month and they have their share of problems.


But I suppose a business has to do whatever the head/lead person says. Even if it's doomed with a PS2, there are still, literally millions of homes with a PS2 in it.

[Zyrusticae]

Not that I want to touch this can of worms, really, but just a note:

PSU would have to be converted to be Games for Windows Live compatible if they wanted it to run with both Xbox Live and PC together. The reason for this is the voice chat; without GFWL you wouldn't be able to hear anyone talking on a mic, and considering that's frequently the primary method of communication for people on the 360 that's pretty much a deal-breaker.

[AngelofEnders]

Nobody is telling you how to spend your money. Im telling you to invest in a system that doesn't suck. Nobody HAS to listen when people say that...but dont complain when everyone else is moving on, thats all. You cant get angry when even the developers are tired of being held back on shitty hardware.

I dont know why you'd want to play on PS2 anyway. Seriously, i just switched to 360 from PC/PS2 (yes my PC runs PSU perfectly) and im NEVER going back. I rarely ever have framerate problems (Runs at 0 Frameskip until a dip, which almost always goes away in a second or two.), the game runs as smoothly as on PC with a draw distance just as large, and to top it off...i can add my own soundtrack to it on the go.

If i ever am forced to go back to PS2, im just gonna quit. In fact, i would perfer if they'd just drop the fucking PS2 already so this game can be PC/360 like its SUPPOSED TO BE. (Seriously, MICROSOFT Xbox, MICROSOFT Xbox Live, and MICROSOFT Windows. Why the HELL are they different platforms?)

I still believe the only reason PC isnt linked up with 360 is because they had to back the PS2 with something. Either that, or they just had zero faith in the 360 version.

However, if the PC/360 version of this game was linked, it would be great. I dont know how many of the PS2/PC JP players are PC players, but im sure its a very nice chunk of them. JP PC + US/EU PC + 360US/EU/JP would complete the game AND population. FUCK ps2.

You wrote all that just to say you want better graphics?

[Criss]

Wow, so many uninformed posts in here.

First off, the game was developed for PS2. During development they had a ton of awesome stuff in mind, like more diverse visual effects, more areas, more items, etc... Because the PS2 could support hard drives, they could make PSU support downloadable updates and new content, as well as include more stuff than what would fit on a single disk.

But disaster struck. Sony released the slim model of the PS2 and cut hard drive support with it. All of a sudden, ST had to scramble to find a way to make PSU run without a hard drive while making the data fit on a single disk. From that point, they had to scrap a ton of content, cut down on visual effects, and rush development to the point where they didn't even have time to optimize the game to run properly on PS2. If you can find old pre-release gameplay trailer videos, you'll see just how much better the game looked before they had to change everything.

Then, of course, they ported the game to PC and X360. They already had to rush the PS2 version, so they didn't have time for any improvements for those either, including code optimizations. And while Sega were free to run the PS2 and PC versions on their own servers as intended, it wasn't so easy for the X360 version. As you all know, pretty much all X360 online services go through Xbox live, and there are a lot of restrictions around it. It was probably more convenient or cheaper for Sega to have X360 servers hosted on Xbox live, and so we are stuck with a community divided between two different servers, with Microsoft's necessary update approval adding to the delay between JP and US servers updates.

[DreXxiN]

You wrote all that just to say you want better graphics?

Did you REALLY just say that..?

Did you REALLY.. Oh god..

Such..IGNORANCE..*facepalm* DFJKDSF.


but it also makes a lot of noise. The fans, the hard drive being accessed


..Have you ever played on a decent PC?

Also Criss is right 100% As far as I know.

Now pardon me as I leave this thread for now as it's damaging to my health.

[Saito S]

Um....no.

Absolutely every indication of this game states it was not ment to be ran on a PS2.
*snip*
First off, unless your PS2 ran PSU considerably worse than mine (or my ex's, or my friend's who used to play PSU, or my other friend who still does, etc), you are exaggerating how bad the PS2 runs this game. In particular, the comments about "can't even make out what's on the weapons" (if you mean you can't tell what element a weapon is, then LOL no unless you have a really crappy TV; if you meant something else, I misinterpreted) and "The Line Shields don't have special effects". Not sure what that refers to....?

But anyway... while you do make some valid points, your whole rant here (snipped for space; this is gonna be a massive post as it is) is essentially moot as far as the point you responded to originally, that it's Sega's fault and no one else's. The game WAS released for PS2, weather or not that's a good thing or a bad thing, and Sega/ST are 100% responsible for that.

Why should I upgrade when there's about five games I want to play of all three of those mentioned...? One of those upgrades means leaving behind all of my friends on the PC/PS2 US/EU servers.
And this is possibly the single best reason ever to not want to switch from one platform to another. Friends are a HUGE part of PSU, at least for me.

Another one of those upgrades means having a decent monitor and a knowledge of Windows.
True, although really, those things aren't as daunting as they seem, these days.

The last upgrade doesn't even play PS2 games unless you have the earlier editions of the console and you're just essentially playing a PS2 on a unit that makes more noise than my washing machine.
While needing to have earlier (now impossible to find) versions of the PS3 to play PS2 games is true (and irritating), I just wanted to point out that if a PS3 is making anywhere NEAR the same amount of noise level as a washing machine, something is seriously wrong with that PS3. Working properly, it's quieter than the 360 by a noticable margin.

Nobody is telling you how to spend your money. Im telling you to invest in a system that doesn't suck. Nobody HAS to listen when people say that...but dont complain when everyone else is moving on, thats all. You cant get angry when even the developers are tired of being held back on shitty hardware.
To a degree, you have a good point here. Gonna cover the other points, then come back to this.

I dont know why you'd want to play on PS2 anyway.
When I first started playing PSU, my PC wasn't that great. No WAY it would have been able to run the game. I had a 360 at the time (which I have since sold), so my choices were that or PS2. Given the number of friends I knew I would have going into one version or another (PS2/PC servers: 4, 360 servers: 0), there really was no choice. I didn't have the money to upgrade my PC (at the time, I've since then built a new machine and now play the PC ver), so that was that. Comparing the disadvantage of playing the weakest, most problem-ridden version of the game, vs going to 360 and not playing with my friends... no contest.

Seriously, i just switched to 360 from PC/PS2 (yes my PC runs PSU perfectly) and im NEVER going back. I rarely ever have framerate problems (Runs at 0 Frameskip until a dip, which almost always goes away in a second or two.), the game runs as smoothly as on PC with a draw distance just as large, and to top it off...i can add my own soundtrack to it on the go.
Ok, seriously, THIS part makes no sense. Are you comparing your new, shiny, PSU 360 experience to PSU PS2, or to PSU PC? Going from PS2 to 360, what you are saying makes sense. Going from a PC that "runs PSU perfectly" as you put it, to 360... that is a DOWNGRADE, in every way except server population. The only reason I don't just assume you mean you went from PS2 to 360 is cause of the aforementioned comment about your PC. 360 PSU on a nice TV was almost as smooth as on my PC with a nice monitor, but not quite. And you don't have the loading/slowdown issues of the PS2, but you do have SOME issues in that area (ROBOTS), compared to the PC, which has none. And as for adding your own soundtrack on the go... iTunes. (To say nothing of the fact that with the PC version, you can utilize a few simple programs to completely replace PSUs in-game music with whatever you like).

If i ever am forced to go back to PS2, im just gonna quit.
So which is it? Did you transition from PS2 to 360, or from PC to 360? If you have a PC that ran it "perfectly", why were you playing on PS2 (if you even were)? If you WERE playing on your nice PC, then what point are you making with the above paragraph? Your "I'm on 360 now and it's so much BETTER" paragraph is all about the technical side of things, and doesn't raise the issue of server population, which is the only advantage one gains going from PC to 360. (Well, that, and internal voice chat that doesn't rely on Vent.)

In fact, i would perfer if they'd just drop the fucking PS2 already so this game can be PC/360 like its SUPPOSED TO BE. (Seriously, MICROSOFT Xbox, MICROSOFT Xbox Live, and MICROSOFT Windows. Why the HELL are they different platforms?)
As promised, returning to this point. Disagreements aside, I am with you on the basic concept that this game would have been better off overall as a next-gen project from the start. But to COMPLETELY drop the PS2 now? At THIS point in the games life? They can't. It's too late. It's by FAR the most played on system in Japan as far as PSU is concerned (and it's popularity at the time PSU was released was a big reason for the PS2 release in the first place. PS2 was a MUCH bigger moneymaker in Japan than PS3, 360, or PC in 2006). And they did make the game for the system, weather you like it or not. To cut out the PS2 players from the beginning, by making it PS3/360/PC only from the start, that would be fair. To make it for PS2 anyway, but NOW say "Actually, never mind, you guys can't play anymore" would be NOT fair. Like I said, it's too late. ST made their decision.

Expanding on that, and also covering the "Microsoft vs. Microsoft" issue, I refer to the posts by Zyrusticae and Criss, as they pretty much lay out why the idea of PC and 360 players sharing servers wasn't really a practical one. And Criss is spot on with the issues about the PS2 hard drive. Sony deserves a chunk of the blame for this entire situation (seriously, even if they weren't planning to give it support anymore, making the slim PS2 completely INCOMPATIBLE with the hard drive was just batshit). And don't forget, especially for a Japanese developer, making a game for PC is not the same as making a game for 360 as far as how heavily Microsoft is involved. PSU for PC is just it's own thing. Windows just happens to be the most popular OS (especially in Japan). What were they gonna release it for, Linux? Mac OSX? That Windows is made by Microsoft doesn't really mean anything, not like it does when making a 360 game that will be played on Xbox Live.

Sega's main PSU playerbase (Japen) has a TON of PS2s, and a good amount of gaming PCs. So combining those made sense. Whereas the number of 360s is laughable. So it just wasn't a high priority for them. Again, this goes back to acknowledging that while releasing it for PS2 certainly has had some serious downsides (many of which I agree with you on), the fact is it HAPPENED, and speaking STRICTLY as far as what was going to make Sega the most money, making a PS2 version was by far the better option vs. cutting it out of the picture.

PS2 plays fine for me and I've played on the PC. Sure, it looks smoother and weapons load (and usually stay loaded) instantaneously but it also makes a lot of noise. The fans, the hard drive being accessed and most of all you can't get the buttons to be EXACTLY the same as the PS2's configuration (Cancel goes to the palette button on PC, it's the PA button on a PS2).
RemiusTA definitely exaggerated the PS2's problem with respect to running PSU. However, you're kinda downplaying them here. It's not unplayable by any means, but it's not just about looking smoother and having weapons load instantaneously. It may not always be necessary to play in a large group (as you pointed out), but there will certainly be times when you might want to do so, and in those situations, the differences in the two versions become pretty glaring. There are little things, too, like loading times (logging off one character to log on with another is MUCH faster on a good PC).
The noise... not so much. Yes, it makes some noise; I'm not saying a good PC will be SILENT. Mine is no louder than a 360 though, really, and rocks PSU easily (surpasses the requirements by a decent margin, actually). It's something you barely even notice after like a week of playing on your PC a lot.

As for the buttons... I have to dispute that as a non-issue, as well. As long as you can get a good controller (I use - ironically enough, considering what this discussion has been about - a wired 360 controller, and it works very well as long as you seek out the XBCD drivers and don't rely on the Microsoft ones), you can map everything as you like. The cancel button must be the palatte button, true, but again, after a week, I didn't even notice it anymore. After AotI was released, I logged onto my account with the PS2 version (my roommate has it) cause I wanted to hear what additions were made to the voices (since they somehow managed to botch them and just leave all the old voices in on the PC version :lol:). Having the cancel button be the PA button again was weird, but I adjusted ok after a few minutes.

That's my story and I'm stickin' to it. ^^

[DreXxiN]

Woah! I managed to suceed in dealing with that wall, and I agree with the most part, except on the 4+ copies of AoI I've played on Both PS2/PS3 (60GB with emotion engine/best ps2 emulation)..it ran pretty bad with 3+ people...like...Terrible D=.

I guess some people got lucky. =/

[biggabertha]

Heh heh, kinda cool that we can discuss this topic in something technically unrelated.

I usually play at night with housemates. The constant fan from a PC is much louder than my PS2.

Our washing machine makes less noise than the fan(s) on my housemates' PC unless we set the spin cycle over 300rpm.

Aesthetics is what matters in the game and yeah, sure you can get used to the cancel button being in different places between a PC and PS2 but it gets annoying to hear that angry noise.

(EU PS2 doesn't have the voices enabled wither which is annoying...)

I run a true RGB SCART cable with my PS2 with a compatible 14" CRT Flatscreen TV and it looks just as good as my housemate's PC on base settings. I just prefer the PS2 version and I'll be sad to see the supplemental update because it means I'll want a decent PC to continue playing the game. Aesthetics mean too much to me in the game - especially when it comes to clothes and weapons.

The graphical details such as Rappy feathers from the Rabol Rappy upon successful evasion is nice from the PC and 360 version. Loveheart Line's evasion animation looks cool too.

I figured something like what Criss posted must've happened but I had no proof on the stuff and had no idea when the Slimline was made. Heh heh, learning things like this reminds me of Skorpius' post about Flowen's Sword years ago.

[Vickie]

damn i'd like to see how that Exact counter Invincibility shit works with acrofighter.

[AngelofEnders]

Did you REALLY just say that..?

Did you REALLY.. Oh god..

Such..IGNORANCE..*facepalm* DFJKDSF.


Yeah I did because summed up that's what your post says as far as your reasoning as to why you think PS2 should be dropped. Essentially that's pretty much what you're gonna get at this point and I highly doubt Sega is gonna expend the manpower to revamp their game from the ground up so late in it's lifespan. Processing speed and such is a non-issue because people are gonna play on what they can afford as long as it doesn't seriously handicap their ability to play.

There are actual points in your post I agree with you on but choosing to purposely withhold what information I know allows me to stay ignant. >BO

[DreXxiN]

Yeah I did because summed up that's what your post says as far as your reasoning as to why you think PS2 should be dropped. Essentially that's pretty much what you're gonna get at this point and I highly doubt Sega is gonna expend the manpower to revamp their game from the ground up so late in it's lifespan. Processing speed and such is a non-issue because people are gonna play on what they can afford as long as it doesn't seriously handicap their ability to play.

There are actual points in your post I agree with you on but choosing to purposely withhold what information I know allows me to stay ignant. >BO

...Can you reiterate that? I didn't understand that XD. I'm sorry. Yeah I know a PS2 is really cheap to play on, but a cheap PC can run it flawlessly and probably will enhance your gameplay experience.

Eh, you pay for what ya get I guess.

[Shinko]

Um....no.


Absolutely every indication of this game states it was not ment to be ran on a PS2.
-The framerate is horrible. Absolutely horrible.
- the textures aren't even fully visible (On PS2 most of the time you cant even make out whats on the weapons)
-The Line Sheilds dont have special effects (pissed me off first time i played PC and actually noticed)
-Draw distance is garbage
-You cant even play in a room with more than 3 people without HORRIBLE horrible lag.


This game was definately PC based, then through a decision to widen its consumer base, it was stuck on the PS2. This game RUNS like a PC game with 360 support, or vice versa. The PS2 completely butchers this game. The 360 decision was most likely flawed in the sense that Japan hasn't fully cought on to the 360 yet. They're definately starting to, but not towards the release of this game. In the future, if this game continues to get updates, you can only expect the PS2 version to fall farther and farther behind, becuase of PSU ever gets as large as PSOBB, the PS2 will NEVER be able to keep up. It was going to happen eventually.

The PS2 was the absolute weakest of the last generation -- there is no way they can hope to expand upon this game and keep the PS2 in the mix. By choosing to put this on the PC and 360, they've basically put no limit on what they want to add -- if through some new release / patch they can optimize the 360 version farther, then they can advance this game as far as they want with little problems.

But if they ever decide to release NEW weapons? Like, PSU (Not PSP or PSO) exclusive weapons? Expect them to either not reach the PS2, or expect them visually downgraded to hell.


Besides, any gamer with a PS2 at this point should be upgrading. You're mad people dont want to put their stuff on your shitty hardware anymore? Stop whining and get a 360/ps3/wii already. In 2 years time the PS3 will have far more players, so if you arent getting a 360 you might as well go for that.

(BTW, its games like PSU that remind me why i dont even care about the wii anymore. Motion gimmicks are nice, but when you have to STRUGGLE to make shaders work on the system (lolconduit), then it really shows how weak your shit is.)

Although I don't agree with everything you said I do agree with most of it. I played it on all 3 system and it's by far the worst on ps2. I could never go back. But if you only ever played on ps2 or a bad pc you really wouldn't know.

[garjian]

whats the problem? so theyre not releasing a disc for ps2 players? did you expect them to? its an update not an expansion...

and tbh... PSU could have much better graphics if ps2 didnt hold it back...

[Kinako78]

(BTW, its games like PSU that remind me why i dont even care about the wii anymore.

What does the Wii have to do with anything?


But disaster struck. Sony released the slim model of the PS2 and cut hard drive support with it. All of a sudden, ST had to scramble to find a way to make PSU run without a hard drive while making the data fit on a single disk. From that point, they had to scrap a ton of content, cut down on visual effects, and rush development to the point where they didn't even have time to optimize the game to run properly on PS2. If you can find old pre-release gameplay trailer videos, you'll see just how much better the game looked before they had to change everything.

Ah, so it's SONY'S fault the game is a piece of crap (or so you guys say: it might not be as good as what we were originally shown, but it's far from being awful)! Well, that explains everything. And yes, it means everyone was right about the PS2 holding it back, but obviously, Sega already promised this game out on PS2 by then, so they couldn't back out. No wonder I'm thinking of passing on the PS3.

[Zyrusticae]

Heh heh, kinda cool that we can discuss this topic in something technically unrelated.

I usually play at night with housemates. The constant fan from a PC is much louder than my PS2.

Our washing machine makes less noise than the fan(s) on my housemates' PC unless we set the spin cycle over 300rpm.

Louder than a WASHING MACHINE?

Something is wrong with that PC. Very wrong.

[Puppet_Papaya]

I didn't want to get involved in this, but I really need to say something.
I started playing on the PS2 and I never had a problemwith it. I switched to my laptop when I moved and no longer had a PS2. Now, my laptop is definetly not made for gaming, but it runs PSU fine. Sure, I have to set the resolution and graphics to the lowest setting, but it runs. If I had to, I would switch back to PS2. There are things I like about the PS2 version and things I like about playing on PC.
Now, I'm sure with an amazing PC, PSU is miles ahead of the PS2 version. But that's the thing. Not everybody has the money to go out and get a sweet PC just to play PSU. Not everybody can ask mommy and daddy to go out and get them a 360 or PS3. Some people have to pay rent and bills and buy food and clothing for themselves. If these people (myself included) already have a PS2 to play on, there is nothing wrong with that. Stop telling us that we're doing it wrong. Stop telling us we need to upgrade. If we could all afford a high-end PC or 360, we'd already have one, damnit.
For me right now, my crummy laptop is just fine.
Besides, some of the arguments I've heard are a little lame. Loud fan? Turn up your music. No custom soundtrack? Right, get a CD player. (I use my Zune all the time with PSU). Not that hard. Bells and whistles are all you get in upgrading.
One more point. There is NOTHING wrong with the PS2. It plays PSU just fine and still has a ton of great games. I still love my PS2 games. Some people don't feel like they need to upgrade just to be next-gen. PS2 playes the games I want to play.

[Rust]

Make sure you check out the very bottom, it's a killer...

Well, instead of being fooled by new shiny graphics, you will see those weapons for what they really are: as bland and boring as the already existing ones.

You should consider that a favor.

[RemiusTA]

I didn't want to get involved in this, but I really need to say something.
I started playing on the PS2 and I never had a problemwith it. I switched to my laptop when I moved and no longer had a PS2. Now, my laptop is definetly not made for gaming, but it runs PSU fine. Sure, I have to set the resolution and graphics to the lowest setting, but it runs. If I had to, I would switch back to PS2. There are things I like about the PS2 version and things I like about playing on PC.
Now, I'm sure with an amazing PC, PSU is miles ahead of the PS2 version. But that's the thing. Not everybody has the money to go out and get a sweet PC just to play PSU. Not everybody can ask mommy and daddy to go out and get them a 360 or PS3. Some people have to pay rent and bills and buy food and clothing for themselves. If these people (myself included) already have a PS2 to play on, there is nothing wrong with that. Stop telling us that we're doing it wrong. Stop telling us we need to upgrade. If we could all afford a high-end PC or 360, we'd already have one, damnit.
For me right now, my crummy laptop is just fine.
Besides, some of the arguments I've heard are a little lame. Loud fan? Turn up your music. No custom soundtrack? Right, get a CD player. (I use my Zune all the time with PSU). Not that hard. Bells and whistles are all you get in upgrading.
One more point. There is NOTHING wrong with the PS2. It plays PSU just fine and still has a ton of great games. I still love my PS2 games. Some people don't feel like they need to upgrade just to be next-gen. PS2 playes the games I want to play.

your arguement is logical, but im sorry. there is something VERY wrong with the PS2 when it comes to this game.

I can think all the way back to Firebreak, during the missions that can only be S ranked through a fast time. Playing on the PS2 in an area that it obviously cant render correctly, because everytime someone uses a PA, or an enemy blows fire at me, my PS2 would lag like hell. Of course, the timer for the missions have to be universal, so the server keeps times of the missions....which means while im lagging moving at bullet time, the clock is moving normal time...and it takes me 10 seconds to finish one Photon Art.

OR when we're playing an event mission (they ALWAYS lag on ps2) and my force is moving too slow to even keep up with the PC players -- everytime the server positiosn update, the players move inches and inches away from me. Not to mention, in the time it takes to cast one Lag spell, i could have casted about 4 on a PC/360.


We know life isnt all money and high end computers. But sorry, the PS2 ruins this game for anyone who plays on it.

The biggest way to tell? Play on a High-end PC or the 360 version. I felt the same way, until i played one of the REAL versions and realized "DAMN, this game doesnt suck...just the platform im playing it on!"

[Squall429]

I didn't want to get involved in this, but I really need to say something.
I started playing on the PS2 and I never had a problemwith it. I switched to my laptop when I moved and no longer had a PS2. Now, my laptop is definetly not made for gaming, but it runs PSU fine. Sure, I have to set the resolution and graphics to the lowest setting, but it runs. If I had to, I would switch back to PS2. There are things I like about the PS2 version and things I like about playing on PC.
Now, I'm sure with an amazing PC, PSU is miles ahead of the PS2 version. But that's the thing. Not everybody has the money to go out and get a sweet PC just to play PSU. Not everybody can ask mommy and daddy to go out and get them a 360 or PS3. Some people have to pay rent and bills and buy food and clothing for themselves. If these people (myself included) already have a PS2 to play on, there is nothing wrong with that. Stop telling us that we're doing it wrong. Stop telling us we need to upgrade. If we could all afford a high-end PC or 360, we'd already have one, damnit.
For me right now, my crummy laptop is just fine.
Besides, some of the arguments I've heard are a little lame. Loud fan? Turn up your music. No custom soundtrack? Right, get a CD player. (I use my Zune all the time with PSU). Not that hard. Bells and whistles are all you get in upgrading.
One more point. There is NOTHING wrong with the PS2. It plays PSU just fine and still has a ton of great games. I still love my PS2 games. Some people don't feel like they need to upgrade just to be next-gen. PS2 playes the games I want to play.

Omg I couldn't agree with you more Puppet! Finally someone else says it. You people think it's so damn easy to get a new Next gen system. Well news for you, the economy is in the worst shape possible, no jobs around, lot's of people getting laid off, fired, and budget cuts. For Godsakes, people. And in case you've forgotten, the PS2 is still the number 1 selling system in the World, and it DAMN well pwns XCrap360. I am a big Sony fan, and do also love the PS3, but as it's going now, it will NEVER top the PS2. And a PC is good too but is still expensive. The PS2 is just fine for PSU, and WHO CARES ABOUT SLOWDOWN?! Sometimes it looks cool >.> XD But seriously, you can still enjoy the game, and if they wanted to they could just release a $10 Dollar Expansion disc for the Update for PS2. So to all you stuck up Next Gen Console users, SHOVE IT! Because you may have the system but WE don't, so stop telling us what we should do, because PS2 is the number one best system. And in my Opinion 360 blows.

All it does is break, get red ring of doom, and the community on Xbox Live ain't worth a shit.

So just deal with us complaining, because we've been on PS2 for years now and what if us PS2 users don't feel like switching? Some people like playing the game on a nice size TV. So if you don't want to hear us complain about the PS2 being neglected, then don't say anything about it.

[darthplagis]

Omg I couldn't agree with you more Puppet! Finally someone else says it. You people think it's so damn easy to get a new Next gen system. Well news for you, the economy is in the worst shape possible, no jobs around, lot's of people getting laid off, fired, and budget cuts.


all the better time to grab a pre owned xbox or pc as an upgrade then aint it :P as people are selling gear they don't need

just a quick note, PS2 was and still is a bad system. it has many flaws, no anti aliasing on chip for example, so games look blocky and liney. but this is not the point.

you can build or have built from a pc shop, a decent gaming rig (thanks to amd/ati fast yet cheap HD 4800 series) for around £400. that's only marginally more than a ps3, and its more than a gaming machine

[RemiusTA]

PS2 was decent enough if you knew what you were doing. (Square Enix, FF12. Best looking game of its generation, IMO.)

However it seriously butchers this game. Badly.

The money you'd need to spend to get a computer that runs PSU around this date should not be horribly expensive at all. Im running on an Nvidia Geforce 8100, which played PSU almost perfectly, and we bought this computer almost 2 or 3 years ago. With each new card released, in a few months the price of the old one drops dramatically.

When we bought this one, i believe the highest was 8600. They're well into the 9000 series now, and apparently their newest ones support DirectX11.

[Volcompat321]

[SPOILER-BOX]I didn't want to get involved in this, but I really need to say something.
I started playing on the PS2 and I never had a problemwith it. I switched to my laptop when I moved and no longer had a PS2. Now, my laptop is definetly not made for gaming, but it runs PSU fine. Sure, I have to set the resolution and graphics to the lowest setting, but it runs. If I had to, I would switch back to PS2. There are things I like about the PS2 version and things I like about playing on PC.
Now, I'm sure with an amazing PC, PSU is miles ahead of the PS2 version. But that's the thing. Not everybody has the money to go out and get a sweet PC just to play PSU. Not everybody can ask mommy and daddy to go out and get them a 360 or PS3. Some people have to pay rent and bills and buy food and clothing for themselves. If these people (myself included) already have a PS2 to play on, there is nothing wrong with that. Stop telling us that we're doing it wrong. Stop telling us we need to upgrade. If we could all afford a high-end PC or 360, we'd already have one, damnit.
For me right now, my crummy laptop is just fine.
Besides, some of the arguments I've heard are a little lame. Loud fan? Turn up your music. No custom soundtrack? Right, get a CD player. (I use my Zune all the time with PSU). Not that hard. Bells and whistles are all you get in upgrading.
One more point. There is NOTHING wrong with the PS2. It plays PSU just fine and still has a ton of great games. I still love my PS2 games. Some people don't feel like they need to upgrade just to be next-gen. PS2 playes the games I want to play.[/SPOILER-BOX]

I started on the ps2 way back in the day too. I never had a problem with it. I switched to my laptop, which was okay for gaming, but not the best. I upgraded a little bit (RAM) and psu runs great with the Anti-Aliasing program from ATI.
Even without that it ran PSU pretty good.
I rarely have problems with lag or speed downs anymore. I tried playing on a ps2 and ps3 after I played on my laptop for so long, (ps2 about 1.5 years, pc the rest)
I could honestly say, I could never play on a ps2/3 ever again. The slowdown is ridiculous compared to playing on a PC. I mean if I had to I could play PSU on my ps2/3 now, but I wouldn't like it very much. I will be on PC for the duration of PSU's existence.

[darthplagis]

PS2 was decent enough if you knew what you were doing. (Square Enix, FF12. Best looking game of its generation, IMO.)

However it seriously butchers this game. Badly.

The money you'd need to spend to get a computer that runs PSU around this date should not be horribly expensive at all. Im running on an Nvidia Geforce 8100, which played PSU almost perfectly, and we bought this computer almost 2 or 3 years ago. With each new card released, in a few months the price of the old one drops dramatically.

When we bought this one, i believe the highest was 8600. They're well into the 9000 series now, and apparently their newest ones support DirectX11.

nah nvidia have pushed the 9000 series down, its GTX now LOL but a 9800 gtx+ is the lowest in the series and retails for about £100, but ATI have the HD4770 for around £90 which is really amazing for its price, it can run crysis albeit on medium settings.

i actually played PSU on PS2 when it was released in Japan, although not online. and in all fairness it sucked. the PSP pulls off better visuals. the sad thing with the PS2 was that it was just essentially a PS1 with faster and bigger processor, so in essence it was a high powered Super Nintendo disk drive LOL

but really the reason square soft could pull off the final fantasy games with stunning visuals is because they sat and wrote the code to do it where as any other machine had the hardware to spare so the CPU didn't have to do all the work, now the PS3 they remedied that with the cell chip, but i aint played one enough to judge if it works however all the games i have seen that have not been ports of other systems games look just like fancy PS2 games :/

[misstigress]

However, if the PC/360 version of this game was linked, it would be great. I dont know how many of the PS2/PC JP players are PC players, but im sure its a very nice chunk of them. JP PC + US/EU PC + 360US/EU/JP would complete the game AND population. FUCK ps2.

If something as trivial as the fact that some individuals prefer to play on the PS2 elicits such an emotional response from you, I believe that you should invest your money in a psychiatrist rather than playing video games.

If Sega didn't want to utilize the PS2 as a platform for PSU, they should have had the foresight to avoid including it as an option initially. No matter how negligible the PS2 population may seem, completely eradicating them would only bring about the death knell (as if it isn't there already) for a game that is desperately clinging to the last wisps of its very existence. (Oh, and I don't even own a PS2, just for reference. I play on the PC.)

[Calsetes]

Warning: Scientific Content Ahead


Alright, as for why they really can't make new models and graphics and that stuff for the update for PS2 users, it's a memory issue. While they might be able to get the content downloaded and fit onto an 8-meg memory card, it would most likely not leave any room for any other save games, or might not have sufficient space for a "swap file" if needed. They can include data on the new weapons' stats, names, grind rates, etc. because they're relatively small amounts of data, maybe a few kilobytes or so per weapon.

Ok, now that the scientific explanation's out of the way, maybe some people can't afford a PC, or afford to upgrade it. A cheap $50 graphics card sounds simple and easy. and also extremely cheap, but they might only get a grand total of $70 spare "spending money" after the bills are all paid, groceries are bought, and loans paid at their minimums. As such, they might hold onto that bit as a rainy day fund, or might see fit to buy 2 or 3 older used games as opposed to a new video card and a second copy of a game they already have for a different system. I think Sega included the PS2 as a platform for PSU simply because when it first came out, they never thought about utilizing their downloadable content in such a way - maybe include an unlock key or two every now and then, maybe just enough spare room for that optional NPC or two that needs a new texture for whatever reason, or needs a retouched texture. Also remember that in Japan, home game consoles probably have a much larger market than home PCs, simply because Japan is so "wired" that why would someone own a computer if they can do everything a PC can do with their cell phone, or with a pocket PC, or some other such contraption?

That's just my thoughts on that. While upgrading or obtaining a PC is (as far as I know) the ONLY way to obtain the new item models / meshes / textures, it's not a necessity to enjoy the game, just like you don't HAVE to see a movie on a DLP in the theater, or own it on Blu-ray to enjoy watching it - you just don't get those one or two extra perks.

[darthplagis]

sega since PSO on DC have implemented DLC, so why assume PSU was different?

yeah the Ps2 IS holding the game back visually...... but ONLY for those that use it.

as the game is out already they wont spruce up our graphics any more than they already have, other than new item skins. i imagine the supplementary DLC to be about quarter a gig or under as it has gameplay changes in it too.

as for upgrading a graphics card, most people on this forum are using a PC yeah???

yes money is tight for everyone but the kind of people who are serious about MMO's and general RPG's tend not to go out and buy games EVERY month, rather play the ones they have till completion then play the MMO's, so yeah a graphics card upgrade is not a big deal in the grand scheme of things.