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pinkace
Oct 12, 2009, 06:46 PM
I just played this mission for a few hours. I loved it! Great mission! Why aren't more people playing it? Its actually challenging when you have to figure out where everything is on your own, and having to clear every room in less than 3 minutes... I liked this mission, better than Citadel of Sand.

BIG OLAF
Oct 12, 2009, 07:10 PM
Not sure, really. I, myself, have never tried it. I guess that's because I'm not too into the Guardians Branch missions (HSM, Bruce, Egg Thieves, etc.). I just don't like the puzzle aspect. I'm a Fortefighter. I'm not supposed to think, I just SMASH the CRAP out of things, haha.

Kidding. I fight intelligently, and with tactics. Seriously, though, I should give Security Breach a try. Thanks for the tip.

pinkace
Oct 12, 2009, 07:17 PM
I think Egg thieves, Her secret mission, Bruce's dungeon and this one are among the best co-op experiences on xbox live, hands down.

That is, if you can find people playing these and not White beast :nono:

BIG OLAF
Oct 12, 2009, 07:21 PM
Indeed. I always resort to getting a group of my friends together (which I nowadays only have, like, two people I can play with, anyway. I need to find some new running buddies..) if I want to do Egg Thieves. I ran Her Secret Mission SO much when it was popular, that I am thoroughly exhausted of it. As for Bruce's Dungeon, I have to be frank with you...

..I've never done it. Not even once. *Prepares for the flaming*

Tetsaru
Oct 12, 2009, 08:26 PM
I can understand why a lot of people don't like the Guardians' Branch missions - they're just so restrictive and different compared to missions like White Beast and Seed Express where players can freely do as they wish, whether it's a time attack run, hunting for rares, or just hanging out with friends.

Missions like Her Secret Mission, which I absolutely HATED, btw, are riddled with cheap traps and enemies that can easily KO someone, and OOPS - the mission ends right then and there, you get nothing, you lose, good day sir... just because you didn't see that immobilization trap while several gun turrets peck away at you, or you get Dambarta'd, or a fire Olgohmon one-shots you with Foie. Add in the fact that you're constantly having to rush through the mission due to the time limit, trying to get everyone to cooperate through the puzzle elements, and the fact that there just isn't much good loot, and it's easy to drive people away. Or, in Bruce's Dungeon, having Bruce get KO'd by a Bil De Vear's spin attack, because Bruce by default follows the party leader, who happened to be a noob FF/FM that spammed knockback moves on them - OOPS, you lose again. And then they have to rub it in your face with the whole "you failed" cinematics after the fact someone fucked up... that kind of stuff was what killed the enjoyment for me, and it's sad because it was nice to see some mission variety for once.

And BIG OLAF, unless they added better loot with the higher difficulties, you're not really missing much with Bruce's Dungeon. All I ever really got out of it was Catilium and Mot Walnas, and although you can get Bruce's NPC card, he's not very good anyway. =/

BIG OLAF
Oct 12, 2009, 08:38 PM
Missions like Her Secret Mission, which I absolutely HATED, btw, are riddled with cheap traps and enemies that can easily KO someone, and OOPS - the mission ends right then and there, you get nothing, you lose, good day sir... just because you didn't see that immobilization trap while several gun turrets peck away at you, or you get Dambarta'd, or a fire Olgohmon one-shots you with Foie. Add in the fact that you're constantly having to rush through the mission due to the time limit, trying to get everyone to cooperate through the puzzle elements, and the fact that there just isn't much good loot, and it's easy to drive people away. Or, in Bruce's Dungeon, having Bruce get KO'd by a Bil De Vear's spin attack, because Bruce by default follows the party leader, who happened to be a noob FF/FM that spammed knockback moves on them - OOPS, you lose again. And then they have to rub it in your face with the whole "you failed" cinematics after the fact someone fucked up... that kind of stuff was what killed the enjoyment for me, and it's sad because it was nice to see some mission variety for once.


Boy, do I know what you mean. Can't count how many times someone in my HSM party got "robbed" (meaning, cheaply killed) when we were so close to the goal.

I appreciate Sega's effort at the puzzle/player co-operation aspect of the game, but they have yet to perfect it, really. It seems to me that the "/R" missions are going to be pretty fun, though, what with the certain restrictions towards weapon, armor, technic, and trap usage.

As for Bruce's Dungeon, I really had no plan on doing it, anyway. Thanks for the heads up regarding it's uselessness. Funny thing is, I know some people that say Bruce is their favorite run. I can't see the logic in that statement.

Mimo
Oct 12, 2009, 08:38 PM
I actually kinda like the way it's more uhm realistic i suppose(?) Finally! The good guys lose! :] Not that i like losing, but my mistakes and failing make me stronger and more keen on what the mission is requiring you to do. It makes me think more individually and plan with my group members instead of me just hack/slashing away while my big bro is still trying to recover from lag at the beginning of the block. XD

pinkace
Oct 12, 2009, 10:23 PM
I can understand why a lot of people don't like the Guardians' Branch missions - they're just so restrictive and different compared to missions like White Beast and Seed Express where players can freely do as they wish, whether it's a time attack run, hunting for rares, or just hanging out with friends.

Missions like Her Secret Mission, which I absolutely HATED, btw, are riddled with cheap traps and enemies that can easily KO someone, and OOPS - the mission ends right then and there, you get nothing, you lose, good day sir... just because you didn't see that immobilization trap while several gun turrets peck away at you, or you get Dambarta'd, or a fire Olgohmon one-shots you with Foie. Add in the fact that you're constantly having to rush through the mission due to the time limit, trying to get everyone to cooperate through the puzzle elements, and the fact that there just isn't much good loot, and it's easy to drive people away. Or, in Bruce's Dungeon, having Bruce get KO'd by a Bil De Vear's spin attack, because Bruce by default follows the party leader, who happened to be a noob FF/FM that spammed knockback moves on them - OOPS, you lose again. And then they have to rub it in your face with the whole "you failed" cinematics after the fact someone fucked up... that kind of stuff was what killed the enjoyment for me, and it's sad because it was nice to see some mission variety for once.

And BIG OLAF, unless they added better loot with the higher difficulties, you're not really missing much with Bruce's Dungeon. All I ever really got out of it was Catilium and Mot Walnas, and although you can get Bruce's NPC card, he's not very good anyway. =/

Wow, I never expected to read this from the guy who thinks PSU is too easy... :rolleyes:

So it's challenging. So is Security Breach. To call a trap 'cheap' is a cop-out and you know it. If you plan ahead and pay attention, HSM and this mission are a lot of fun. Also, PSU is not all about the loot. I hate that attitude. Just today I messaged a friend asking her to join me on Citadel of Sand or Security Breach since they are new-er, and her reply was "LOL why? the loot sux"

:disapprove:

Shadow Slayer
Oct 12, 2009, 10:38 PM
i truly hate noobs that take the fun away hunting everthing they can think of psu was to be a fun game not who can get the most money

BIG OLAF
Oct 12, 2009, 10:41 PM
Just today I messaged a friend asking her to join me on Citadel of Sand or Security Breach since they are new-er, and her reply was "LOL why? the loot sux"

:disapprove:

I agree. People that are obsessed with items, and items alone, need to be beaten with a stick. Not to rag on people that are trying to upgrade their gear, but I mean the people that refuse to play with friends just because the mission they are interested in doing doesn't have "any good drops". So what? Go play with your friends, because, well....they're your friends.

PSU is just as much about having a good time beating the piss out of monsters with great friends, as it is about getting good items. Only caring about items/drops is a form of elitism, and I hate elitists with all my mind, body, and soul. (At least the annoying elitists that try to tell you that you need better weapons, or that they're better than you, etc.)

Tetsaru
Oct 12, 2009, 11:38 PM
Wow, I never expected to read this from the guy who thinks PSU is too easy... :rolleyes:

So it's challenging. So is Security Breach. To call a trap 'cheap' is a cop-out and you know it. If you plan ahead and pay attention, HSM and this mission are a lot of fun. Also, PSU is not all about the loot. I hate that attitude. Just today I messaged a friend asking her to join me on Citadel of Sand or Security Breach since they are new-er, and her reply was "LOL why? the loot sux"

:disapprove:

Most PSU missions ARE too easy. The Guardians' Branch missions aren't challenging so much as they are ANNOYING and stressful; take out the "you lose" elements I mentioned earlier, and they're not that different from regular missions, really. I can't say anything about the recent new missions because I haven't been around to try them, but I always remember the Guardians' Branch missions pissing me off or making me lose interest really quick when I could be earning money, loot, and levels a helluva lot easier somewhere else.

And tbh, without the loot, money, and leveling your character, jobs, and PA's... honestly, what else is there to earn?? We STILL don't have the GAS system yet (wtf does that even STAND for, seriously?? GAS?? REALLY, Sega?? As if StD was bad enough...), hell we don't even have the supplemental update yet... There's a reason why the population usually always sticks to one area all the time, and that's because 1 - some missions just have better rewards than others, and 2 - the population has just become so small due to the lack of good updates/maintenance to the game that it'd probably be BAD for them to disperse. I can only take so much of killing the same damned reskinned monsters over and over again before my hardcore gamer instinct starts yearning for something challenging and enjoyable, not repetitive, cheap, and annoying... and it further infuriates me that Sega is doing nothing to address this, and if they are, then why must they always leave us in the dark about it?? I REALLY want to know! I'm sorry if that makes me sound like an elitist to you, but dammit, a game with such a good concept and a devoted fanbase deserves so much better... >_<

BIG OLAF
Oct 12, 2009, 11:44 PM
a game with such a good concept and a devoted fanbase deserves so much better...

Indeed. Phantasy Star stories are incredible concepts, and I've not seen more dedicated gamers to their franchise than we here on the PSOW forums. If only Sega/Sonic Team would open their eyes and see what they're truly working with here, and just how much we, and others, love their games...

And, no, the way you're talking, that's not really elitism. Or, at least, not the type I hate. I'm talking about things that go like this:

You: "Man, this is great! Just got a 42% *insert weapon name here*! I'm stoked!"

Elitist: "That's garbage, dude. You need 50%'s. Also, it needs to be 10/10. Get owned, noob."

You: "But, I worked hard for this!"

Elitist: "Doesn't matter. If you don't have 50% 10/10 EVERYTHING, or don't agree with my play style/in-game views, then you don't deserve to even be in my presence."

You: "...:("

pinkace
Oct 13, 2009, 12:05 AM
Most PSU missions ARE too easy. The Guardians' Branch missions aren't challenging so much as they are ANNOYING and stressful; take out the "you lose" elements I mentioned earlier, and they're not that different from regular missions, really. I can't say anything about the recent new missions because I haven't been around to try them, but I always remember the Guardians' Branch missions pissing me off or making me lose interest really quick when I could be earning money, loot, and levels a helluva lot easier somewhere else.

Well, what is appropriate difficulty to you then? More enemy HP!? that's silly man. They are throwing you a curveball and you can't handle it. "Difficult" is having a time limit, a trap placed on the obvious path, an enemy that aside from one deadly attack, is usually underestimated... these things mix up the quest and make it more fun. I'd hate to be around you when playing Ninja Gaiden, or Demon Souls... you'd explode and leave giblets bouncing on the floor (get the Unreal Tournament reference? another tough-as-a-prostate-exam-by-a-fat-handed-doctor-with-huge-callouses game)


And tbh, without the loot, money, and leveling your character, jobs, and PA's... honestly, what else is there to earn??

Well, you only mentioned loot previously. Now, you add to that meseta, room decorations, leveling PA's, leveling jobs, leveling your character, making weapons, armor and stuff... and multiply that by 4 character slots....

I wish you were on X360 just so I could have a floater race with you... to pwn you just once... :etongue:

But lets stay on topic... :clown:

BIG OLAF
Oct 13, 2009, 12:10 AM
I wish you were on X360..

But lets stay on topic...


I know you JUST said to stay on-topic, but I've been needing to ask this question to somebody for a while, now..

Why is the PC/PS2:360 player ratio like 20:1 on these boards? I figured most people here would be 360 players, but holy hell was I wrong.

I ask this mainly because I need some new people to play with nowadays. Any suggestions?

(Back on-topic): The Guardians Branch missions are somewhat challenging, in a way, but most people would tend to mix up the definitions of "challenge" and "annoyance" when it comes to traps, turrets, and cheap-ass/overpowered monsters. I, for one, don't mind that kind of stuff. I was just saying.

Gunslinger-08
Oct 13, 2009, 12:33 AM
I personally enjoy getting kicked around every now and then when I play PSU, but I have no fondness for HSM. Granted, I've not played it in a while.

However, I have thoroughly enjoyed Egg Thieves and Bruce's Dungeon. The problem these days is getting a party together to learn or run the missions.


I know you JUST said to stay on-topic, but I've been needing to ask this question to somebody for a while, now..

Why is the PC/PS2:360 player ratio like 20:1 on these boards? I figured most people here would be 360 players, but holy hell was I wrong.

I ask this mainly because I need some new people to play with nowadays. Any suggestions?


Because there's more disgruntled PC/PS2 players than there are 360 players, I suppose. The 360 players are here in good numbers, but they tend not to post as much.

Tetsaru
Oct 13, 2009, 01:20 AM
Well, what is appropriate difficulty to you then? More enemy HP!? that's silly man. They are throwing you a curveball and you can't handle it. "Difficult" is having a time limit, a trap placed on the obvious path, an enemy that aside from one deadly attack, is usually underestimated... these things mix up the quest and make it more fun. I'd hate to be around you when playing Ninja Gaiden, or Demon Souls... you'd explode and leave giblets bouncing on the floor (get the Unreal Tournament reference? another tough-as-a-prostate-exam-by-a-fat-handed-doctor-with-huge-callouses game)

Actually, I downloaded and played the Ninja Gaiden Sigma 2 demo a few days ago, and tbh, it wasn't really that difficult... a lot better than PSU's difficulty, though. I got through both Ryu's and Ayame's stages without dying my first time though, but I haven't tried the team mission yet. The giant statue boss felt a lot like a PSU boss battle - I just zerged the hell out of it until it died, save for its magic attacks and the final blow... =/ And lol at being able to jiggle Ayame's boobs with the motion controls. :3

I've also played UT 2004 and UT3 (both very fun games), but I just generally suck at online FPS matches in general, because you constantly have to relearn maps, what each weapon can do, dealing with spawn-killers, etc. from game to game. Kinda ironic since I played as GM on PSU most of the time, go figure...


Well, you only mentioned loot previously. Now, you add to that meseta, room decorations, leveling PA's, leveling jobs, leveling your character, making weapons, armor and stuff... and multiply that by 4 character slots....

You're right, but my point remains. Once you've done all the best and newest missions to the point where you've maxed out everything and have gotten the best gear, there's nothing else to do to really hold your interest or challenge you (and overpowered one-hit-KO enemy attacks and stuff that can instantly immobilize you and peck away at you until you die because you can't do anything doesn't count - that's just the developer's half-ass way to program "challenge" into the game, and all it does is annoy gamers to the point of elitism, imo). PSU seriously needs some good endgame content in regards to that, and the (lol) GAS system could at least give veterans like me something new to work on in terms of character accomplishments. As far as new missions where you'd actually NEED them to succeed, well that's a different story... and seeing how Sega's updates are a slower than a stroked-out granny that fell into the La Brea Tar Pits (and often about as stupidly executed, too), I just don't see it happening soon enough, if at all. ;_;


I wish you were on X360 just so I could have a floater race with you... to pwn you just once... :etongue:

Lol, I wouldn't be surprised if you did. The controls and clipping issues with the floaders and airboard races are horrible... apparently I try to stick to the extreme insides of curves that don't exist after all... map your course edges better, Sega! >_<

garjian
Oct 13, 2009, 07:24 AM
I know you JUST said to stay on-topic, but I've been needing to ask this question to somebody for a while, now..

Why is the PC/PS2:360 player ratio like 20:1 on these boards? I figured most people here would be 360 players, but holy hell was I wrong.

I ask this mainly because I need some new people to play with nowadays. Any suggestions?

(Back on-topic): The Guardians Branch missions are somewhat challenging, in a way, but most people would tend to mix up the definitions of "challenge" and "annoyance" when it comes to traps, turrets, and cheap-ass/overpowered monsters. I, for one, don't mind that kind of stuff. I was just saying.

off-topic: you can always play with me :P youve met me enough times... Sharah, Saria, Exile maybe? probably not my other one... but ringing bells?

on-topic: i love guardians branch missions! ordering people around... teamwork... and youve gotta be careful to not die... for once, i mean, theres actually a penalty for dying!

security breach is the best of the bunch, its barely about combat... its great!

hsm was arounbd when i started, so its got nostalgia... and it makes the party split up a lot....

egg thieves is amasingly confusing at first, when you get into it though its great for commanding people and stuff... but really boring if everyone knows it...

and bruces... bruce dies too much...

thats the order id put them in anyway...
the ONLY problemi can see with them is that, it makes people want to TD travel, and booting them fails the mission... but so far, that hasnt stopped me...

so yeah, people should do this more, and i also think EVERY mission should be in this style, puzzles and difficulties and stuff... and especially the death penalty...

hmph...

a game with such a good concept and a devoted fanbase deserves so much better... >_<

mmyes... its the only MMO i can find that isnt a wow clone... i wish sega would do it properly... well... i wish it wasnt sega really...

Keilyn
Oct 13, 2009, 07:34 AM
I just played this mission for a few hours. I loved it! Great mission! Why aren't more people playing it? Its actually challenging when you have to figure out where everything is on your own, and having to clear every room in less than 3 minutes... I liked this mission, better than Citadel of Sand.

Well...I think the problems lies in the fact that the best drop from that mission in the clear box is a premade Needle Cannon. With players in the last event getting Adana Units and making their Adahna Cannons, along with the many Needle Cannon Board drops from Protectors Beta..

...Not to mention that we just got Bruce's Dungeon S2 and Her Secret Mission S2....that no one is really running this...because there really is no reason for most players to run it at all...

Its a good mission and I like the setup and all, but its just not as attractive as the other CoOpt Missions...Hell we don't have Egg Thieves S2 yet, but that one remains as one of my favorite missions in the game.

BIG OLAF
Oct 13, 2009, 09:27 AM
off-topic: you can always play with me :P youve met me enough times... Sharah, Saria, Exile maybe? probably not my other one... but ringing bells?


Goodness, I can't escape you. I suppose I should just get your partner card and be done with it, then. I'll let you know when I get another Xbox, since mine got E74 a week ago.

Ellrick
Oct 13, 2009, 09:56 AM
This missions sounds fun...I wish I had people to play it with -_-

pinkace
Oct 13, 2009, 12:00 PM
Actually, I downloaded and played the Ninja Gaiden Sigma 2 demo a few days ago, and tbh, it wasn't really that difficult... a lot better than PSU's difficulty, though. I got through both Ryu's and Ayame's stages without dying my first time though, but I haven't tried the team mission yet. The giant statue boss felt a lot like a PSU boss battle - I just zerged the hell out of it until it died, save for its magic attacks and the final blow... =/ And lol at being able to jiggle Ayame's boobs with the motion controls. :3

I've also played UT 2004 and UT3 (both very fun games), but I just generally suck at online FPS matches in general, because you constantly have to relearn maps, what each weapon can do, dealing with spawn-killers, etc. from game to game. Kinda ironic since I played as GM on PSU most of the time, go figure...

I haven't bought Sigma 2 yet, but if you try Sigma 1 or the original on Xbox... of course the early levels will be playable but later on... man. Definitely try it. If you want to test your reflexes also try Shinobi. I am not a controller-slamming person, I am a scream-in-anger person. These two ninja games made me lose my voice more than once :lol: And the hardets UT is the first one... on Dreamcast!. Freaking hard boiled.


You're right, but my point remains. Once you've done all the best and newest missions to the point where you've maxed out everything and have gotten the best gear, there's nothing else to do to really hold your interest or challenge you (and overpowered one-hit-KO enemy attacks and stuff that can instantly immobilize you and peck away at you until you die because you can't do anything doesn't count - that's just the developer's half-ass way to program "challenge" into the game, and all it does is annoy gamers to the point of elitism, imo).

Well, every game has an end right? PSU sacrifices longevity for interesting combat. I am sure there is more to do on FF11, but the combat is not nearly as much fun, is it?



Lol, I wouldn't be surprised if you did. The controls and clipping issues with the floaders and airboard races are horrible... apparently I try to stick to the extreme insides of curves that don't exist after all... map your course edges better, Sega! >_<

The problem with the track is that it is not made like a regular racing game; hugging corners doesn't work, you need to stick to the middle of the track.

Yuicihi
Oct 13, 2009, 01:33 PM
That is, if you can find people playing these and not White beast :nono:Biggest "If" ever.

I should try this mission out if I can grab a couple of people.

str898mustang
Oct 13, 2009, 01:56 PM
This mission is too easy !!!! That mission is tooo hard!!!!



lol u asked for a strategy mission and they give u one. Even if the missions had extremely good drops, u would then complain "BLAH BLAH BLAH this mission has terrible drop rates!!! it's not fair!!"

Q.U.I.C.K.S.I.L.V.E.R
Oct 13, 2009, 03:31 PM
I just played this mission for a few hours. I loved it! Great mission! Why aren't more people playing it? Its actually challenging when you have to figure out where everything is on your own, and having to clear every room in less than 3 minutes... I liked this mission, better than Citadel of Sand.

Well reading that sentence, the part where it says its actually challenging when you have to figure stuff out on your own...Not many people in this game are capable of such things haha, *BACK TO WHITE BEAST*

Delete
Oct 13, 2009, 03:35 PM
I think Egg thieves, Her secret mission, Bruce's dungeon and this one are among the best co-op experiences on xbox live, hands down.


Wait, your not serious are you? :wacko:

pinkace
Oct 13, 2009, 08:57 PM
....

I am. Playing campaign on Halo 3 doesn't require that the team split up, communicate if the egg was in the north office or west building or whatever, and make sure the whole team is painfully aware of the ticking clock.

and dont even say Rainbow Six. missions can basically be done by one really good player in the team. everyone else sucking matters not.

NDW
Oct 13, 2009, 11:35 PM
We STILL don't have the GAS system yet (wtf does that even STAND for, seriously??

GUARDIANS advanced style.

Noblewine
Oct 14, 2009, 01:06 AM
Security Breach reminds me of HSM in a way with the stealth elements. The invisible laser and switches hidden in the map was cleverly thought out.

Delete
Oct 14, 2009, 01:00 PM
....

I am. Playing campaign on Halo 3 doesn't require that the team split up, communicate if the egg was in the north office or west building or whatever, and make sure the whole team is painfully aware of the ticking clock.

and dont even say Rainbow Six. missions can basically be done by one really good player in the team. everyone else sucking matters not.

Don't get me wrong, I didn't say it sucked. But as far as the best coop experiences on Live? That's a little extreme. There are many games that have good coop experiences like Gears of War 1 or 2, ODST,Crackdown,etc. If strategy is what your looking for, play Halo Wars. Coop requires some strategy (actually a lot for the harder difficulties). But..................I do realize it's your opinion, so don't pay me any attention.

pinkace
Oct 14, 2009, 03:46 PM
Don't get me wrong, I didn't say it sucked. But as far as the best coop experiences on Live? That's a little extreme. There are many games that have good coop experiences like Gears of War 1 or 2, ODST,Crackdown,etc. If strategy is what your looking for, play Halo Wars. Coop requires some strategy (actually a lot for the harder difficulties). But..................I do realize it's your opinion, so don't pay me any attention.

There are some moment in Gears co-op that are great too, like providing cover for someone to get to those grenades, etc. But overall, if in your Gears party you have someone that is just unstoppable (like my friend Chris who ranked 10 on the global boards) even playing Horde you can bank on him saving your ass over and over. Maybe this applies to PSU too a little bit...

Crap. I am gonna go play right now.

garjian
Oct 16, 2009, 02:54 PM
Goodness, I can't escape you. I suppose I should just get your partner card and be done with it, then. I'll let you know when I get another Xbox, since mine got E74 a week ago.

but... we already have each others card...

at least i have yours...