An Honest Question

[CDOG14515]

What did Sega ever give us for our monthly fees? I happily paid them on the Gamecube to get my PSO fix, but by now they seem cruel and archaic. The games are not MMOs...the servers (I never played PSU beyond the demo, but I've heard) were never especially stable and there was almost no content given back to the players.

Having just quit WoW (where I happily paid $15 a month for stable servers and regular content updates), I'm looking for something similar to sink my teeth into, but I'm not paying $10 a month for the quality of game I'm led to believe PSU is. Were it free to play, I'd buy it in an instant.

On a different note, with the PC/PS2 servers closed, what's on the horizon for y'all? What are the odds that a new console/PC PS game will be unveiled this year? What are the chances Monster Hunter Frontier comes to the west? I hope Blizzard's undisclosed next MMO is announced soon (though with Cataclysm around the corner, that's unlikely).

Anyways, a few questions, sorry for the length. I used to frequent this site (never the boards, though) in my PSO days...figured there was no better place to come for advice given the great community.

[Hatrix]

Honestly man I think PSU was basicly an experiment in my eyes on how to upgrade the online PS experience, I have faith that a awsome PSO reincarnate is in the works for the 10th anniversarry. Sega must have learned somthing from their past mistakes by now

[Anibaal]

they better be

[Sinue_v2]

Access to their servers.

You can argue the worth of service provided vs. the price all you want, but technically Sega owes it's customers nothing beyond what is explicitly stated in the ToS. They could have halted PSU's NA/EU updates a week after the opening Moatoob - and still be perfectly within their rights to charge $9.99 a month.

That's a shitty way to do buisness, just as the support they did end up providing was shitty (and not worth the monthly fees IMO)... but as far as owing you, they don't, and that's just the way it is. You have every right to refuse to pay for bad service, which is what happened and part of why PSU failed so hard in the US/EU. Gotta spend money to make money, and that includes giving players the sense that their monthly fee is going to more than just the development of a new shitty 3D Sonic game.

[Palle]

To address your second paragraph/second question, I'm not sure how similar to WoW the 'thing' you're looking for has to be, but there are a lot of buddy keys for STO floating around right now, as Atari are trying to win back the customers they put off over the past couple months. You might get some free time tacked on to a trial period as a result. From what I hear, Cryptic have put the community in the driver's seat with regard to updates and rebalancing, but there is still a long way to go to putting the game right. Too many chiefs, as the saying goes...

[Zeek123]

What did Sega ever give us for our monthly fees? I happily paid them on the Gamecube to get my PSO fix, but by now they seem cruel and archaic. The games are not MMOs...the servers (I never played PSU beyond the demo, but I've heard) were never especially stable and there was almost no content given back to the players.

Having just quit WoW (where I happily paid $15 a month for stable servers and regular content updates), I'm looking for something similar to sink my teeth into, but I'm not paying $10 a month for the quality of game I'm led to believe PSU is. Were it free to play, I'd buy it in an instant.

On a different note, with the PC/PS2 servers closed, what's on the horizon for y'all? What are the odds that a new console/PC PS game will be unveiled this year? What are the chances Monster Hunter Frontier comes to the west? I hope Blizzard's undisclosed next MMO is announced soon (though with Cataclysm around the corner, that's unlikely).

Anyways, a few questions, sorry for the length. I used to frequent this site (never the boards, though) in my PSO days...figured there was no better place to come for advice given the great community.

The community is pretty bangin' here.

As it was said, the Terms of Service pretty much spelled out "f*ck you, we'll do what we want", but yeah, I feel like Sega owes it to themselves at least to prove they can make quality games. Be it another MMO or whatever.

As to the whole next Phantasy Star console thing, honestly, I wouldn't expect any announcements this year, and maybe next. Personally, I'm kind of done buying Sega games atm. I won't be buying PS Zero or PS: Portable 2 unless they're used, and I definitely won't ever be paying monthly for another PS game.

That Monster Hunter Tri seems to be the new black around here, so there's always PSO-W members you could pal around with when it hits.

What I'm doing to fill the time is going for a Platinum trophy in Final Fantasy XIII and playing Battlefield Bad Company 2. Then I'm probably going to burn through the God of War games.

[stinkyfish97]

Sega is why I just cancelled my PSU Guardian lisence, I have been a member since may 2007 and have not ever cancelled or suspended my account once. I did it because it has been nearly 2 years since I have actually enjoyed this game. I much rather would spend the money on map packs to Boarderland, map packs to MW2 and other DLC. The question is not whether or not PSU is a good game, it is, the question is, is it worth 10 bucks a month to get less than I get with other games? My answer recently has been no it hasnt.

[Keilyn]

What did Sega ever give us for our monthly fees? I happily paid them on the Gamecube to get my PSO fix, but by now they seem cruel and archaic. The games are not MMOs...the servers (I never played PSU beyond the demo, but I've heard) were never especially stable and there was almost no content given back to the players.

They did the same crap on Consoles by always releasing new versions on other consoles to force people to restart their characters just to get the best items...and later when all failed...the Caniving and Immoral PC which they view down since there is actually GLOBAL scrutiny on PCs....and Majority Japanese Scrutiny on their own consoles...GAVE IN and finally PSObb worked as a PC GAME.

Oh wait...the same happened with PSU and during such times SEGA could care less. Easy Solution? Don't buy from SEGA....and to teach Japan a lesson, simply side with PC and XBOX360 (Like many have) and it has really hurt Japanese gaming that rather than try harder to compete...they simply lock themselve up in their little island nation and continue releasing the same crap over and over.


Having just quit WoW (where I happily paid $15 a month for stable servers and regular content updates), I'm looking for something similar to sink my teeth into, but I'm not paying $10 a month for the quality of game I'm led to believe PSU is. Were it free to play, I'd buy it in an instant.

There are a lot of good Free To Play MMOs....but if you want the MMO List on PC go to www.mmorpg.com. Its a good site that has a lot of information. I try games a lot and I love some of the F2Ps better than the P2Ps (and not just because they are free).


On a different note, with the PC/PS2 servers closed, what's on the horizon for y'all? What are the odds that a new console/PC PS game will be unveiled this year? What are the chances Monster Hunter Frontier comes to the west? I hope Blizzard's undisclosed next MMO is announced soon (though with Cataclysm around the corner, that's unlikely).

As usual...MMORPGs, Gaming tournaments and everything in between.


Anyways, a few questions, sorry for the length. I used to frequent this site (never the boards, though) in my PSO days...figured there was no better place to come for advice given the great community.

Trust me, there are better places. If you like full MMORPGs...go to an MMORPG community. Also there is an entire community of Japanese PSO/PSU players that never come here for Obvious reasons.

Of course if you want to see what exists so far....I like www.gametrailers.com

I'm registered to this forum, but im borderline out the door with this group of people.

[Anibaal]

Trust me, there are better places. If you like full MMORPGs...go to an MMORPG community. Also there is an entire community of Japanese PSO/PSU players that never come here for Obvious reasons.

I'm registered to this forum, but im borderline out the door with this group of people.

And do you know where is that community u mention? would like to know

[Kinako78]

There are a lot of good Free To Play MMOs....but if you want the MMO List on PC go to www.mmorpg.com. Its a good site that has a lot of information. I try games a lot and I love some of the F2Ps better than the P2Ps (and not just because they are free).

www.onrpg.com is another good place to find F2P MMOs. Some personal recommendations are Talisman Online and Destiny Online.

[ZIE creations]

For one, this game has a lot of complaining children on it (see the last few hundred posts about us not getting updates more than 3 times a month) and second of all you played the demo only. One thing you can't judge this game by is it's looks and second thing is the demo.

The game has been updated more than most realize. The demo is how the game started but with updates of atleast 2-4 updates a month the game evolves. Instead of releasing a large expantion at once they do it over time which does put us behind the JP servers but it gives us something to look forward to (plus we don't get all the screw ups because ours is slightly updated).

Truthfully if you are looking for a game like the horrible WoW mmo then you probably shouldn't go here because of three major reasons.

1. Although you lvl and have different races and thing like that the game play is completely different.
(WoW: THERES A WORTHOG!!! *click* YEAH KILL THAT PIG WILE I EAT MY DERITOS WITH TWO HANDS!!!)
(PSU: HOLY C*** IT'S A CARRIGUINE!!! *hit Y button* *wait a sec.* *hit Y button* *Fly across the screen* *hit X button* *hit by megid* *"You used a scape doll" message apeares* *press A button* *scream "D*** YOU CARRIGUINE!!!" and "F*** YOU SEGA" all at once* *repeat till enemy has been purified*

2. All races can be male or female so there will no longer be an excuse for having a female charecter.

3. Women actualy play this game (And yes, most of them are atractive in a hot way and not a "video game" way.)

...to more than just the development of a new shitty 3D Sonic game.
Mr (or Mrs.) Sinue_v2, I don't like you, THE SONIC GAMES ARE AWESOME!!! and they start pricing at 50 USD rather that 60 USD8-)

[Yuicihi]

They gave you a game, and a server to play it on, which does indeed cost money, unlike what many would tell you.

[stinkyfish97]

For one, this game has a lot of complaining children on it (see the last few hundred posts about us not getting updates more than 3 times a month) and second of all you played the demo only. One thing you can't judge this game by is it's looks and second thing is the demo.

The game has been updated more than most realize. The demo is how the game started but with updates of atleast 2-4 updates a month the game evolves. Instead of releasing a large expantion at once they do it over time which does put us behind the JP servers but it gives us something to look forward to (plus we don't get all the screw ups because ours is slightly updated).

Truthfully if you are looking for a game like the horrible WoW mmo then you probably shouldn't go here because of three major reasons.

1. Although you lvl and have different races and thing like that the game play is completely different.
(WoW: THERES A WORTHOG!!! *click* YEAH KILL THAT PIG WILE I EAT MY DERITOS WITH TWO HANDS!!!)
(PSU: HOLY C*** IT'S A CARRIGUINE!!! *hit Y button* *wait a sec.* *hit Y button* *Fly across the screen* *hit X button* *hit by megid* *"You used a scape doll" message apeares* *press A button* *scream "D*** YOU CARRIGUINE!!!" and "F*** YOU SEGA" all at once* *repeat till enemy has been purified*

2. All races can be male or female so there will no longer be an excuse for having a female charecter.

3. Women actualy play this game (And yes, most of them are atractive in a hot way and not a "video game" way.)

Mr (or Mrs.) Sinue_v2, I don't like you, THE SONIC GAMES ARE AWESOME!!! and they start pricing at 50 USD rather that 60 USD8-)


Wow. This game has not changed since the expansion. I just cancelled my PSU guardian lisence, and I never cancelled once before and I have been playing since may 2007. And no we doo not get 2-4 updates a month it is closer to 1-2 updates a month, at most. Some months we dont even get updates. Anyone who has played this game as long as I have realized long ago that the way Sega runs this game is crap. We dont really care because the game has enough goodies about it that we keep playing. It is a very relaxed MMO compared to many of the other games. I dont even have to run the missions I can just sit around chat with people. I can shop. I can run missions with randoms. Pretty much the basis or PSU is great.

What this game isnt is run to give something back to us who enjoy it. If you add up all the updates you would have payed 120 bucks, 10 bucks a month, for alot less than you got with the AoTI expansion. Ok, even if it costs 5 bucks a month for sega to keep the servers up and that means you are still paying 60 bucks for all the updates. Do you honestly think we have gotten 60 dollars of updates just last year? To put it in comparison. I could buy all the expansions to Oblivion when they first came out with the expansions, not just right now, for less than I could have payed for the so called updates of PSU. Another example, you could have spent all that money on the expansion map packs to various other games as well. Basically Sega does rip all of its customers off. But some of us dont really look at it that way because we just love PSU.

Oh the reason I cancelled is because I just havent been playing PSU very much and cancelled is because I have been busy and havent played more than 8 hours a month. So I figured that I am paying 10 bucks for 8 hours of gameplay and decided it wasnt really worth the price.

[CDOG14515]

You can argue that Sega is giving you exactly what they "owe" you but in 2010, that's not really enough (IMO). I don't have a ton of cred since as I said I only played the PSU demo but I've heard your complaints and they sound justified. I've played a handful of subscription based games in my day and I always felt that the game was good enough to warrant the payment. Even in my brief time with the PSU demo, I could tell I would not be playing that game at retail. I don't mean to come into your house and dump on your game here, but I am/was a huge PSO fan and I just want to see Sonic Team do right again.

I'm a little turned off by Monster Hunter Tri because it's on the Wii (a hunk of white plastic I virtually never use), but hey, getting a Gamecube online was pretty niche s*** in 2002 and we got by fine w/o voice chat. Maybe my old GC controller-port keyboard will even work on Wii.

I guess my point is, every community has gripes and complaints (check out the WoW forums...), but people seemed happier in the PSO days, and they seem like they're just going through the motions now. Makes me sad, is all. Anyway, thanks for all the responses. I still got love for this site.

[Zeek123]

You can argue that Sega is giving you exactly what they "owe" you but in 2010, that's not really enough (IMO). I don't have a ton of cred since as I said I only played the PSU demo but I've heard your complaints and they sound justified. I've played a handful of subscription based games in my day and I always felt that the game was good enough to warrant the payment. Even in my brief time with the PSU demo, I could tell I would not be playing that game at retail. I don't mean to come into your house and dump on your game here, but I am/was a huge PSO fan and I just want to see Sonic Team do right again.

I'm a little turned off by Monster Hunter Tri because it's on the Wii (a hunk of white plastic I virtually never use), but hey, getting a Gamecube online was pretty niche s*** in 2002 and we got by fine w/o voice chat. Maybe my old GC controller-port keyboard will even work on Wii.

I guess my point is, every community has gripes and complaints (check out the WoW forums...), but people seemed happier in the PSO days, and they seem like they're just going through the motions now. Makes me sad, is all. Anyway, thanks for all the responses. I still got love for this site.

Thanks for the love brosef.

Anyway, if you do get over your skepticism of MHTri, III, 3, w/e, you should know that it actually does! have voice chat... with the Wii Speak peripheral. Maybe there's useful 3rd party headsets out there for the Wii, but I doubt it. If I had to venture a guess, the amount of people playing their Wii with a headset will be much less than the amount using them on the PS3. Which is sad.

And @ ZIE

I'm glad you don't feel like you wasted your money, man. It's just most of us do. I personally feel like I wasted so much time and money on PSU, but it is ultimately my fault for not discontinuing the service.

Lightning doesn't strike twice, and Sega's proved it time and time again... :disapprove:

[Keilyn]

I feel I wasted my money.

53,000 people registered on PC/PS2 in a three year period is not a good track record to go by. Also it has nothing to do with the conspiracy theory of "Americans and Europeans" not "knowing" about the existence.

A Japanese Game comes out in the US...Its on every major site, forumboard and review site out there. Of course people see a game for what it is. The funny thing to this all....is that if you measure any Japanese game released outside of the Japan.....The majority of the players still play in Japan, the content updates are mostly Japanese.

The majority of the time It felt like an online singleplayer that I actually would log off of PSU to play Singleplayer RPGs and many other RPGs I loved and had far more fun with them.

As far as Japanese go....They make ok Singleplayer RPGs, but make the WORSE MMORPGs ever devised. Compare PSO, PSU, Final Fantasy XI, Fantasy Earth....and compare them to the content in other RPGs, the scalability and playability..

...and many FREE MMORPGs exist that completely beat out anything offered in those games.

[DragonStriker]

I feel I wasted my money.

53,000 people registered on PC/PS2 in a three year period is not a good track record to go by. Also it has nothing to do with the conspiracy theory of "Americans and Europeans" not "knowing" about the existence.

A Japanese Game comes out in the US...Its on every major site, forumboard and review site out there. Of course people see a game for what it is. The funny thing to this all....is that if you measure any Japanese game released outside of the Japan.....The majority of the players still play in Japan, the content updates are mostly Japanese.

The majority of the time It felt like an online singleplayer that I actually would log off of PSU to play Singleplayer RPGs and many other RPGs I loved and had far more fun with them.

As far as Japanese go....They make ok Singleplayer RPGs, but make the WORSE MMORPGs ever devised. Compare PSO, PSU, Final Fantasy XI, Fantasy Earth....and compare them to the content in other RPGs, the scalability and playability..

...and many FREE MMORPGs exist that completely beat out anything offered in those games.


When you look back on any situation and think "I wasted my money" you have only one person to blame.....Yourself. Honestly any reasonable person would be upset with the service we had recieved for years but to think that means you, myself, and any other reasonable person didn't enjoy the game for hundreds and even thousands of hours would be ridiculous. Trying to compare games and bitch and moan about a game YOU paid for and logged onto under your own free will is retarded. Quit bitching and moaning and find something you actually enjoy and go do that so that I don't feel obligated to continually call you stupid.

[Keilyn]

Unfortunately, you fail to realize that its not all about you. Anyone who knows me knows I only played PSU for some of the people I met there. I helped them raise their characters and conversations with them was ok. They also know I play many games....and not just one.

Its just like you post in this forum for some of the people here...and if those people existed elsewhere, you wouldn't be posting here. Plain and Simple.

I am actually a caring person and I am not going to feed the friends I've made to the wolves. I've always been like that. Two Dozen+ games installed on this computer...Including two I've written as I am updating them.

Also I only leveled characters during events to not waste time....the rest of the time I was logged in helped friends or talking to them. So I don't need your shit.ok!

[Mike]

Two Dozen+ games installed on this computer...Including two I've written as I am updating them.
Not really relavent to the conversation at hand.

But if you feel paying the monthly fee was a waste and you stayed on only to "help" your friends, then it is, as Dragon Striker said, nothing but your fault. As a consumer, your power is your wallet. Don't like the game? Don't subscribe to it. The biggest words you can say that Sega or any other company will listen to come not from your mouth but from your wallet.


Quit bitching and moaning and find something you actually enjoy and go do that so that I don't feel obligated to continually call you stupid.
There's nothing wrong with complaining. Even if it is occasionally contradictory. It won't win anyone any friends but I think most people who complain know that.

[DragonStriker]

Unfortunately, you fail to realize that its not all about you. Anyone who knows me knows I only played PSU for some of the people I met there. I helped them raise their characters and conversations with them was ok. They also know I play many games....and not just one.

Its just like you post in this forum for some of the people here...and if those people existed elsewhere, you wouldn't be posting here. Plain and Simple.

I am actually a caring person and I am not going to feed the friends I've made to the wolves. I've always been like that. Two Dozen+ games installed on this computer...Including two I've written as I am updating them.

Also I only leveled characters during events to not waste time....the rest of the time I was logged in helped friends or talking to them. So I don't need your shit.ok!

I post here because I feel obligated to defend intelligence and slay stupidity over forums of a game I play. No one here likes me nor does that entirely matter. Lastly what the hell were you even talking about in the third paragraph? It was very off topic and dumb, and I guess you could say the same about the last paragraph aswell....

Anyways your response was very odd and off topic so continue.

[Kent]

It's been pretty well-established that the vast majority of Phantasy Star Universe's monthly fee is not needed for funding new development or maintenance - there are games out there that function in an almost-identical way (for a non-MMO - a good example is Guild Wars) and have no monthly fees at all.

The vast majority of PSU's monthly fee is pure profit - which is not something that can be said for actual MMORPGs, which generally have a 50% higher monthly fee. Generally-speaking, with actual MMO games, about $2 out of that $15 you're paying monthly are actually profit for the company - and that's assuming that it has a stable playerbase. The outrageous fee for PSU's service was probably justified, on Sega's end, by the fact that they were expecting a low turnout for the subscription numbers.

Of course, if the population dwindles so low that this massive chunk of the fee ceases to be much of a profit (or any at all), then the servers close down. It happened with PSO servers, it happend with PSU servers... The game just ran out of steam, and ceased being profitable. Considering how low the operation costs for the game must really be, that's a pretty critical failure.

[DragonStriker]

It's been pretty well-established that the vast majority of Phantasy Star Universe's monthly fee is not needed for funding new development or maintenance - there are games out there that function in an almost-identical way (for a non-MMO - a good example is Guild Wars) and have no monthly fees at all.

The vast majority of PSU's monthly fee is pure profit - which is not something that can be said for actual MMORPGs, which generally have a 50% higher monthly fee. Generally-speaking, with actual MMO games, about $2 out of that $15 you're paying monthly are actually profit for the company - and that's assuming that it has a stable playerbase. The outrageous fee for PSU's service was probably justified, on Sega's end, by the fact that they were expecting a low turnout for the subscription numbers.

Of course, if the population dwindles so low that this massive chunk of the fee ceases to be much of a profit (or any at all), then the servers close down. It happened with PSO servers, it happend with PSU servers... The game just ran out of steam, and ceased being profitable. Considering how low the operation costs for the game must really be, that's a pretty critical failure.

You sir are completely right.

[Zeek123]

I post here because I feel obligated to defend intelligence and slay stupidity over forums of a game I play. No one here likes me nor does that entirely matter. Lastly what the hell were you even talking about in the third paragraph? It was very off topic and dumb, and I guess you could say the same about the last paragraph aswell....

Anyways your response was very odd and off topic so continue.

And that was a super-intelligent response :rolleyes:

Look, you troll and disregard anyone's opinions but your own. Don't sugar-coat it.

[Frosty7645]

Honestly man I think PSU was basicly an experiment in my eyes on how to upgrade the online PS experience, I have faith that a awsome PSO reincarnate is in the works for the 10th anniversarry. Sega must have learned somthing from their past mistakes by now


naaaaaaaah =p