Anyone else just transfer over to the XB360 servers?

[Lacen]

I'm originally from the PC/PS2 server and have been playing since Nov. 2006. My in-game name was "Lacen" so if you've run into me on there or have met me between Nov. 2006 to the server shutdown then let me know. I wanted to know who else made the jump over to the XB360 servers due to the English PC/PS2 server shutdown. I know a bunch of my friends went over to the JP server so I hope they have a lot of fun. As for me, I'm still PCless so I can't join them. =P Stuck with the XB360 that I originally didn't have at the time of the initial launch of PSU. But yeah, just wondering who else made the switch or who has decided not to play anymore. Just wondering what everyone was gonna do or how they felt about the entire situation. I feel pretty bad about working really hard day in and day out and losing all my data, but at this point it can't be helped. I've loved every Phantasy Star game that I played thus far. And I've actually found the "starting over from scratch" to be somewhat refreshingsortasorryPS3outoftext

[PepperCat]

NO.....

[NiceOnes]

I've been on the 360 since day one. I feel for you. Let me know if you want any help.

NiceOnes

[Sinue_v2]

I was on the 360 servers for a few weeks during FireBreak, but went back to the PS2/PC side. So I've picked that account back up and recreated all my old characters until "other" options become available.

[Loopy]

Yeah man, that does suck that Sega killed the PC/PS2 servers. I remember being disappointed when the Dreamcast servers shut down back in the day. So did you go out and but a new 360, activate a gold account, buy a copy of PSU, buy the expansion for 800 microsoft points, activate your hunter's license, to start allllllllll over, all in the love for PSU?? props to you man, seriously.

[Darklighter]

You do not need a gold account to play PSU on the 360. Not only that he is getting a deal, the expansion used to cost twice as much when I got it.

[Lacen]

Thanks NiceOnes. I'm doing my best to earn money atm by selling mats and other things that I don't need. I've been told to synth Grinder S+10's but that one's a toughy since I don't really have the funds to do something like that. xD That's pretty cool Sinue. Firebreak brings back memories. =P *Burning Rangers song starts playing in background* Hey Loopy. Yeah, I never got to play online on the DC but I did get to play PSO on the XBOX version when it was stuck in Christmas forever. xD Then they eventually shut it down. =/ All my data went with my broken XBOX so yeah, that sucked. xD Oh, I had picked up a 360 to play with my co-workers when I worked at Gamestop for the Christmas season back in 2008 I think. I picked up the 360 version of the game shortly after just in case I ever wanted to check out the 360 side. Just so happens I ended up having to do that now. =P I renewed my Gold membership to play online and ended up downloading AoTI along with a Hunters License. I think I ended up having PSUwithdrawels.xD

[Sinikal]

You do not need a gold account to play PSU on the 360. Not only that he is getting a deal, the expansion used to cost twice as much when I got it.

Lol AMEN

[Loopy]

You do not need a gold account to play PSU on the 360. Not only that he is getting a deal, the expansion used to cost twice as much when I got it.

I stand to be corrected about the gold account, sooorry! I paid 1600 points for AOTI back when it was new as well. So enjoy your discount price!! (In my opinion, the expansion should be free when they shut down the V1.0 servers, but we all know cheap-ass Sega will never do that).

[Sinue_v2]

I'm doing my best to earn money atm by selling mats and other things that I don't need. I've been told to synth Grinder S+10's but that one's a toughy since I don't really have the funds to do something like that.

I've been farming scrolls from M. Defense for cash. Found about 4 of them so far, and they sell for 400~500k. You won't get rich doing that, but you can make some easy starting cash. I've also got a Sonic room statue I either got from FireBreak or when I opened the account that's worth about 5 to 6 million... so if you're not too particularly attached to it (if you have one), that will help also. Beats selling mats and grinders anyhow, especially if you have only one mouth to feed instead of four at once.

[Shou]

You just got off the sinking island that was PC/PS2 EN servers. Why are you jumping right back onto annother sinking island that is the Xbox server?

If you want to play PSU, join JP.

[Loopy]

I never did understand, if the JP servers are so much better, then why do I see so many Japanese players online, on the [rest of world] servers? I played with a dude from Tokyo, and he couldn't give me a straight answer the point on not playing on the JP servers.

[Shou]

Yes because there are SO many JP players playing on the Xbox server...

[Loopy]

Your sarcasm is noted. But, doesn't deny my original point.

[Shou]

You said there are many JP players that perfer to play on the Xbox server over the PC server and there are not, I promise you. All you have to do is compare the populations to see that.

[Loopy]

You are missing my point my friend. I am not talking about specific numbers, I'm talking about the few, or many, or whatever non-specific relative word you want to use, that do choose to play on the US servers. I never said "more Japanese players play on the US servers than the JP servers"
My point is, I'm wondering why.

[Darklighter]

Not everyone is a 360 hater.

[FUDGEHOY]

You just got off the sinking island that was PC/PS2 EN servers. Why are you jumping right back onto annother sinking island that is the Xbox server?

If you want to play PSU, join JP.PSU is doing just fine on the 360. We're still getting 4-5* at peak time. Shou is probably turning some people off to the JP servers with his 360 bashing.

[Max B]

PSU is doing just fine on the 360. We're still getting 4-5* at peak time. Shou is probably turning some people off to the JP servers with his 360 bashing.

4-5* lol Jp servers get 5-6 servers full at peak time
Which is the better choice?:-?

[FUDGEHOY]

4-5* lol Jp servers get 5-6 servers full at peak time
Which is the better choice?:-?The 360 side is a better choice for me, because its in English. You're more than welcome to enjoy whatever side you like. It seems that the decision isn't that easy for you since you play both.:D

[FUDGEHOY]

Nope , I do not play 360 anymore. Most likey not playing Psu period. Probably going to wait to see what happens at E3 2010. Pso Big Announcment is suposed to occur there or so I have heard.Why are you posting about a game that you don't actually play?

[Shinato]

He plays it, he still buys stuff and sells it, dunno what that's all about, I even have his partner card =/

[Shou]

Some people like to assume things about what you think and put words into your mouth. You will have to learn to get used to that. ;)

[FUDGEHOY]

Thank God for People like you.:-P

Shouldn't you be making fake bids on Granahodoras instead of posting here?

[FUDGEHOY]

Some people like to assume things about what you think and put words into your mouth. You will have to learn to get used to that. ;)I'm impressed that you made a post without bashing the 360 servers. There may be hope for you yet.;-)

[Powder Keg]

Hey, we're all buds here, now as long as we don't go pulling a Keilyn we'll all get along just fine here.

[Danny_Dark]

(I'm EX PS/PC Player)
No,...You Think I'M Full Of It ?!

[Katy]

I'm not too sure what all this arguing is about. If someone wants to choose one server over the other knowing what both sides have to offer, then let the decision be final.

Max B still plays, this pic was taken last week
http://www.pso-world.com/forums/album.php?albumid=741&pictureid=13299

[Lacen]

Yo so what's going on here exactly? I kinda read through everything but can't quote anyone on PS3 w/o messing up my text space. xD There's no need to argue about anything. JP side has the bigger population hands down and quite possibly if things don't get better and we don't get more players or cycle around the copies of PSU for XB360 that isn't being used then maybe the 360 servers could end up like our EN PC/PS2 servers. Now we should all be friends here. I've known Shou for a LONG time and I also remember Katy and Artea. Friends of mine for awhile too. I didn't create this thread to create anymore problems for anyone here. I had to switch over to 360 because I had no other choice. I don't have a PC atm nor do I have the money to pick one up. I've had a 360 for awhile and also a copy of the game so I ended up doing the only thing I could for the time being. I love PSU. I loved PSO. Anyone and everyone from the PC/PS2 EN servers is hurting. We're all upset about the fact that we put our hard work, time and

[Lacen]

(Sorry had to double post due to space. If a mod or someone could combine my post into 1 then please do so. PS3 sucks with the text limit. But I need to get across what I need to say to make things better for everyone here. Hopefully.) Effort into doing what we loved and enjoyed day in and day out. I'm sure everyone is pissed at Sega or just upset in general for whatever happened. We branched off into the JP server and XB360 server. Most people who I played with even quit. They were forced to. No one feels good about it. We had to go our seperate ways. If I could join you guys on JP PSU I would. But I am sure you're all having fun over there as you should. =] Hopefully the bonds of friendship is bigger than a server that is no more. Atleast, I'd like to think so. I'm on this "sinking island" as you call it because I have no other choice. It's either quit like everyone else who can't play on JP PSU or 360 or do what I can. I'm not mad at anyone or anything like that, just chill out and try to understand where

[Lacen]

(Sorry, a 3rd post, but this should be my last one. Please combine it into 1 post since I can't do so on the PS3. >.<; My apologies) Everyone is coming from. I don't know what we can do to prevent the 360 servers from sinking like the EN PC/PS2 servers... Unless they make the game available for download I'm not sure what we can do. I've noticed quite a bit of people have been joining as of late. Maybe most are switching over from PC/PS2. But there are a lot of people who are getting into the game only now after it released back in late 2006. Maybe people play on the XB360 servers because it's the only thing they've got? Well, that's my reasons anyway. And as we all know, everyone has their own reasons for what they choose to do. But, don't worry about who's right or who's wrong. Just relax and have fun like we usually do. I actually want to know how all of my old friends are doing. Please, Shou, Katy, Artea and anyone else who I used to play with. Let me know how you have been. =] Take care everyone! ^.~;

[Shou]

Aww sorry to hear that. I pray that a decent computer falls into your lap and you are able to play JP. :)

[FUDGEHOY]

There's where you messed up. I wasn't comparing populations. I was stating that the 360 population is doing just fine. I'm willing to put an end to this if you are.

[FUDGEHOY]

All I did was state the JP population and asked which one was better and the answer was obvious.And simply put 4-5* is not "fine" in my opinion. The End.

Why did you bring the Jp population up? It nothing to do with what I was saying. For me the 360 server is better. It would be even if the Jp server had 1000 stars, because I enjoy playing in English. I also don't want to play on a server that I would have to make up a fake address(or use the example) in order to play on. I have no problem with those that do enjoy the Jp server. There's just no need to bash one server to make the other look better. Either way good luck to you, and I also hope that there's a good announcement at E3!:D

[jaws1475]

:D^^; i tranfer during mag+ when both sever were still up i recreated 1 of my ps2/pc chacter for the xbox

[xBULLYDOGG]

:D^^; i tranfer during mag+ when both sever were still up i recreated 1 of my ps2/pc chacter for the xbox

Welcome to pso-world

[Raymee]

I stand to be corrected about the gold account, sooorry! I paid 1600 points for AOTI back when it was new as well. So enjoy your discount price!! (In my opinion, the expansion should be free when they shut down the V1.0 servers, but we all know cheap-ass Sega will never do that).

Hey Loopy, are you the guy whom I asked what song you were playing in your room, and you replied back saying it was "Rose Confrssion but not sure which disk it was"

[RemiusTA]

you guys are funny. I immigrated to 360 FAR before PS2 (officially) died. It was absolutely bound to happen, and the JP updates were clearly non-ps2 friendly.

Not to mention PS2 version runs like snot, and while PC was arguably the best version, barely anyone on our side played. 360's base was larger despite the other version supporting 2 platforms.

And why the HELL wasn't it PC/360 and PS2? I mean, Microsoft owns Xbox and they might as well own Personal Computers because they own Windows, too. It makes no sense.

[Loopy]

Hey Loopy, are you the guy whom I asked what song you were playing in your room, and you replied back saying it was "Rose Confrssion but not sure which disk it was"

Yes, that is me.
Did you give your room that charming musical piece? I'm partial to that song myself.

[FUDGEHOY]

Well, I said that because I felt if you were going to bring up 360 population I figured I should let the people who are leaving Eu/Na PC/PS2 be informed simple as that. And yep I hope the Announce a new Pso at E3.You completely misunderstood why I put the 360's peak population up in the first place. You're just too stubborn to admit it. I put the "4-5*" comment up because of the "sinking ship" comment made by Shou. It had nothing to do with 360 pop. vs. JP pop. You took what I wrote out of context.

[FUDGEHOY]

No, I simply put JP population and asked which one is better you are making this overly complicated.

Well stating that Jp has a bigger population just proves that you have mastered the obvious. I'll let you continue this since you seemingly have to have the last word. Please prove me right by making another useless post.

[Arika]

you guys are funny. I immigrated to 360 FAR before PS2 (officially) died. It was absolutely bound to happen, and the JP updates were clearly non-ps2 friendly.

Not to mention PS2 version runs like snot, and while PC was arguably the best version, barely anyone on our side played. 360's base was larger despite the other version supporting 2 platforms.

And why the HELL wasn't it PC/360 and PS2? I mean, Microsoft owns Xbox and they might as well own Personal Computers because they own Windows, too. It makes no sense.

so you were playing PSU at PS2 version?

I always thought you played with PC, because you are kind of a programmer.

[DragonStriker]

Well stating that Jp has a bigger population just proves that you have mastered the obvious. I'll let you continue this since you seemingly have to have the last word. Please prove me right by making another useless post.

No, I'm going to have the last word. Max Fudge is completely right, the Japan server is great in it's own right for people who want to play it. Although calling something with an active 4-5*s at peak times during a slow period of updates a "Sinking ship" is idiotic by Shou. Obviously this isn't some stupid console war, everyone can enjoy whatever they like. And my last point is that the PC/PS2 server stayed open with about 1* at peak times for about a year, so that leads me to believe the 360 version has a long ways to go before it's shut down.

[Max B]

you guys are funny. I immigrated to 360 FAR before PS2 (officially) died. It was absolutely bound to happen, and the JP updates were clearly non-ps2 friendly.

Not to mention PS2 version runs like snot, and while PC was arguably the best version, barely anyone on our side played. 360's base was larger despite the other version supporting 2 platforms.

And why the HELL wasn't it PC/360 and PS2? I mean, Microsoft owns Xbox and they might as well own Personal Computers because they own Windows, too. It makes no sense.

I wonder how many people transferred over like you.

[Shou]

I didn't refer to Xbox as a sinking ship because of its population. I called it that because, I believe, the servers will be shut down within the year.

I played on the PS/PS2 EN servers from the first to the last day. If anyone can speak for not caring about population size, it's me.

[DragonStriker]

I didn't refer to Xbox as a sinking ship because of its population. I called it that because, I believe, the servers will be shut down within the year.

I played on the PS/PS2 EN servers from the first to the last day. If anyone can speak for not caring about population size, it's me.

I was right there with you for the majority of it. I don't see any reason why SEGA would shut down a server which has 4-5*s when there's not even updates anytime soon. Guessing it'll be shut down with absolutely no basis but "lol it's SEGA" makes no sense. If they kept the PC/PS2 server open so long, it obviously doesn't take many players to keep a profit for SEGA. And aslong as they are profiting why would they shut down the server? Making an uneducated statement with no basis off a "hunch" is why I called it idiotic in the first place. Throw aside all games besides PSU and from that I would say this server doesn't take very many players to stay profitable, let alone if Guardians Cash ever makes it to the US/EURO side.

[FUDGEHOY]

I didn't refer to Xbox as a sinking ship because of its population. I called it that because, I believe, the servers will be shut down within the year.

I played on the PS/PS2 EN servers from the first to the last day. If anyone can speak for not caring about population size, it's me.

What are you basing your belief that the 360 server will be shut down within a year on?

[RemiusTA]

so you were playing PSU at PS2 version?

I always thought you played with PC, because you are kind of a programmer.

I'd never call myself a real programmer. I just know how to do specific things with programs to make games, and im not even particularly exceptional at that either.

I started off first on PS2 because when the game came out, my PC was too weak. I later got a new PC and downloaded PC version and played on both versions. (PC ran way better.) I mained a Force when AotI came out, and i have to tell you, PS2 version was a PAIN to play with. Forces were amazing in v1.0, but when AotI came out, they were just pathetic. During Event missions, i'd struggle to even hit the enemies, since PS2 already lags and using spells just made it worse for yourself....


In all truth, the 360 version was always my favorite because of built-in voice chat and the ability to alter the soundtrack made grinding WAY more fun. I just disliked the demo. The only reason i really enjoyed PC better is because you could easily take screenshots : P

[Cloudstrife xx]

In 12months time ill be saying hey guys remember that idiot shou well we are still here.

[Shou]

Jebus people. I don't believe 100% that the Xbox servers are going to be shut down within the next year. No GM hinted toward it or SEGAC make an announcement. The way things are going it is not that farfetched to think there is a chance the Xbox servers will be shutdown in the next year...

[FUDGEHOY]

Jebus people. I don't believe 100% that the Xbox servers are going to be shut down within the next year. No GM hinted toward it or SEGAC make an announcement. The way things are going it is not that farfetched to think there is a chance the Xbox servers will be shutdown in the next year...

Anything is possible, but this is not very likely. The 360 server has five times the population that the pc/ps2 had when they shut down. The population will most likely go up 2-3*s(rough guess) when the Supp. Update hits. Why would you bother claiming a server that you don't play on is going to shut down? I'm glad you're enjoying the Jp server. Why can't you just enjoy the server you're on without predicting doom for one that you've never played on?

[Sinue_v2]

I didn't refer to Xbox as a sinking ship because of its population. I called it that because, I believe, the servers will be shut down within the year.

Yeah but, Sega is the ship that's sinking, not specifically PSU. So it matters little where you are in the long run. Sega's online games have never been known for their longevity or support.

[Shou]

Because Its a forum about PSU and I wanna talk about PSU. Even if it is about a server I don't play on. I see many posts on the official forums asking why people who don't even play the game post on PSU forums. It's kinda the same thing. My opinion or anyone else's shouldn't upset anyone. Now if I claim something is fact when it is not, then I can understand someone getting annoyed.

[FUDGEHOY]

Because Its a forum about PSU and I wanna talk about PSU. Even if it is about a server I don't play on. I see many posts on the official forums asking why people who don't even play the game post on PSU forums. It's kinda the same thing. My opinion or anyone else's shouldn't upset anyone. Now if I claim something is fact when it is not, then I can understand someone getting annoyed.You're right. You are well with in your rights to speak your mind about PSU. The question you should ask yourself is why are you so focused on dooming the 360 server? Your statements are very similar in quality to what you might hear on the fourth floor or the demo.

[DragonStriker]

Jebus people. I don't believe 100% that the Xbox servers are going to be shut down within the next year. No GM hinted toward it or SEGAC make an announcement. The way things are going it is not that farfetched to think there is a chance the Xbox servers will be shutdown in the next year...

Contradiction is still a contradiction. "No GM hinted toward it or SEGAC make an announcement" although he says "It's not that farfetched to think there is a chance the Xbox servers will be shutdown".......Where is this chance or logic coming from? Earlier in the topic he just flat out said he believes it'll be shut down in the next year. Now he's saying "I don't believe 100%"......Ogawd how the idiots have fallen.

[Sinue_v2]

Where is this chance or logic coming from? Earlier in the topic he just flat out said he believes it'll be shut down in the next year.

He's not wrong in his pessimistic sentiment. Where does that logic come from? Likely from 10 years +plus of dealing with Sega's bullshit. The only idiots are the ones who deal in absolutes and false dichotomies. Of course he could be wrong, but the track record thus far does not inspire confidence.

[Shou]

Exactly.

Apple, someone cant believe a certain team is gonna win in a football game? They don't know for sure which team will win.
Please, calm down and get over yourself.

[DragonStriker]

Exactly.

Apple, someone cant believe a certain team is gonna win in a football game? They don't know for sure which team will win.
Please, calm down and get over yourself.

Your sir are a tool. Statements like these are why you had multiple people mock you in this thread.

[Mortalis]

Contradiction is still a contradiction. "No GM hinted toward it or SEGAC make an announcement" although he says "It's not that farfetched to think there is a chance the Xbox servers will be shutdown".......Where is this chance or logic coming from? Earlier in the topic he just flat out said he believes it'll be shut down in the next year. Now he's saying "I don't believe 100%"......Ogawd how the idiots have fallen.

You're playing semantics in this post. You don't have to be 100% behind something to believe something. "I believe such and such game will be a good game when it comes out." Would I be 100% sure the game will be good? Nope. Do I believe the game will be good? Yep.

No GM hinted that PS2/PC would be shut down before Edward slapped that shutdown notice on us either. Quite the opposite. They got us excited with MAG2, and then went all, "Ohlol, and we're also shutting you guys down."

[Max B]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LLt9iNOSDmA&feature=related

[FUDGEHOY]

Nothing interesting on the 4th floor! Gee, thats really shocking news...:-P

[Max B]

Nothing interesting on the 4th floor! Gee, thats really shocking news...:-P

Ikr. 5char

[HyperShot-X-]

Yeah but, Sega is the ship that's sinking, not specifically PSU. So it matters little where you are in the long run. Sega's online games have never been known for their longevity or support.
Are you referring to 'Sega' as the whole corporate or just SoA & SoE only? You're only partially right for western regional ports due to the nature of user base in dealing with hacking and glitching online. So, it does matter which platform the game is built on and in case of Xbox Live with its closed network, eventho it's not 100% hackproof, still has the best chance to survive for longer than ever before outside of JP.

Now, the longevity of PSU on 360 would depend on many things, but if you stay pessimistic and negative all the time, you will eventually be proven wrong at some point, just like those who thought they'd never bring the Supp. update to 360 server before the announcement.

[Mortalis]

but if you stay pessimistic and negative all the time, you will eventually be proven wrong at some point, just like those who thought they'd never bring the Supp. update to 360 server before the announcement.

I was generally one of the ones who remained positive all the time, from PSU's release to somewhere 3/4's into it's lifetime. However, I was proven to be wrong with my positivity more times than I was proven right. If they start getting things right, then awesome, but 3-4 years worth of seeing how things operate is more than enough time for people to start thinking the worst.

[Sinue_v2]

Are you referring to 'Sega' as the whole corporate or just SoA & SoE only? You're only partially right for western regional ports due to the nature of user base in dealing with hacking and glitching online.

What the hell are you talking about? You realize there are plenty of cheaters, glitchers, and griefers on the Japanese servers too? Not to mention there are plenty of successful online games in the west which deal with cheaters while still maintaining a decent game population... some of which even come from Japan, like FFXI. But see, those kinds of companies support their products and aren't having their regional staff's hands tied with corporate politics and incompetence.

Don't come in here with simple apologetics and expect to lay the whole blame for their screwups on the userbase itself.

Christ man, the private servers can run a better online service through volunteer work than Sega provides at the cost of subscription... and that includes dealing with cheaters.

[HyperShot-X-]

What the hell are you talking about? You realize there are plenty of cheaters, glitchers, and griefers on the Japanese servers too? Not to mention there are plenty of successful online games in the west which deal with cheaters while still maintaining a decent game population... some of which even come from Japan, like FFXI. But see, those kinds of companies support their products and aren't having their regional staff's hands tied with corporate politics and incompetence. look who's talking here.. I asked 1st if you meant by 'Sega' as a sinking ship it includes SoJ's JP PSU as well, so then you're saying it's not successful in JP either compared to other competing online games or what?? Also, don't even start with apples and oranges comparison with FFXI which doesn't support Live closed network, not saying it's a shytty game but I'm one of those who wouldn't waste their time on such mmorpg even if they pay me to do it.



Don't come in here with simple apologetics and expect to lay the whole blame for their screwups on the userbase itself.
yet there are those were surprised and lay the whole blame on Sega for pulling the plug on pc/ps2 Eng when 70% of user base cancelled their subs fooled by false leads like a bunch of tools getting delusional that it'd actually make a difference. They never saw it coming and never will if they choose to stay inside the box.



Christ man, the private servers can run a better online service through volunteer work than Sega provides at the cost of subscription... and that includes dealing with cheaters.if that were true, then that psobb private server should've been even more populated then PSU paid servers by now, yeah right.

[xBULLYDOGG]

Contradiction is still a contradiction. "No GM hinted toward it or SEGAC make an announcement" although he says "It's not that farfetched to think there is a chance the Xbox servers will be shutdown".......Where is this chance or logic coming from? Earlier in the topic he just flat out said he believes it'll be shut down in the next year. Now he's saying "I don't believe 100%"......Ogawd how the idiots have fallen.

I've missed you and your ways.

[DragonStriker]

I've missed you and your ways.

I have missed you and your correctness.

[GreenArcher]

Well I just hopped over to 360. I was on JP for a bit but I can't stand not playing in English..

[Powder Keg]

Well I just hopped over to 360. I was on JP for a bit but I can't stand not playing in English..

This is one of the reasons I didn't want to try JP...send me a message if you want to exchange cards, and I can definitely help you out with some meseta and/or equipment if you need it.

[Sinue_v2]

I asked 1st if you meant by 'Sega' as a sinking ship it includes SoJ's JP PSU as well, so then you're saying it's not successful in JP either compared to other competing online games or what??

I'm saying that there are multiple factors on various levels leading to PSU's failure, and that to try to justify it by scapegoating the whole debacle on cheaters is just asinine. Most of those failures were a direct result of Sega's actions, both developmental and management. Cheaters were a factor in the failure, but they are a fact of life in online games, and it was Sega's responsibility to deal with them in a manner conducive to maintaining a healthy population. However, the cheating problem on the PS2/PC servers was minor compared to even PSO - not because it was harder to accomplish, but because by the time the first real cheats and glitches started to emerge, Sega had already devastated the population and stymied further growth. There was no population to draw the talented griefers.

Most of PSU's issues were set in motion during the development and planning phase, and were too integral to the extended business plan to change by the time they became apparent. Corporate politics and the way Sega coordinates (or rather, doesn't) their regional offices with their cooperate HQ didn't help, as it prevented the regional branches from making the changes necessary to accommodate the problems.

Yes, Sega as a whole is a sinking ship - and PSU (as an extension) is going down with it. Do we really need to tread over the last 10 years (at least) of Sega's death spiral? Do we really need to pull up the active subscriptions and comparison charts with other online RPGs in Japan over the last four years? Do we really need to compare the longevity of PSO/PSU lifespans to other subscription based online RPGs? Do we really need to remind everyone that from the get-go, Sega only suggested a 5-6 year plan for adding to PSU's content. Your call.


Also, don't even start with apples and oranges comparison with FFXI which doesn't support Live closed network

Again, what the hell does that have to do with it? Cheating was not a significant factor in PSU's failure, and you have yet to substantiate that such is the case.


not saying it's a shytty game but I'm one of those who wouldn't waste their time on such mmorpg even if they pay me to do it.

You and me both. It's excel spreadsheet management with a Final Fantasy GUI as far as I'm concerned. So what?


yet there are those were surprised and lay the whole blame on Sega for pulling the plug on pc/ps2 Eng when 70% of user base cancelled their subs fooled by false leads like a bunch of tools getting delusional that it'd actually make a difference.

It did make a difference. Sega shut the servers down. That's how boycotts and customer dissatisfaction works. The point is, Sega operates on profit. If they want profit, they have to court their subscribers. The reason why the players left was because of Sega's continual neglect and fuck-ups. Ultimately, the entire blame rests on Sega. Some of the problems they couldn't help, couldn't foresee, or couldn't do anything about... sure.. that happens. Nobody is perfect, nobody is omniscient, and you can't please everyone... but it is their goddamned responsibility to make their own profit, not the customers.


if that were true, then that psobb private server should've been even more populated then PSU paid servers by now, yeah right.

That's a massive non-sequitur, and that's not even the point I was trying to make. My point was on the cost of customer service per user is pathetic, and does not justify the price of the subscription payed.




The issue surrounding PSU's failure has far more facets than you're not willing (or capable) of considering, and simplistic justifications do not satisfactorily or correctly address the situation. However, these facets are typical of Sega's long term business trends and do not bode well when speculating on the future of PSU.

[HyperShot-X-]

I'm saying that there are multiple factors on various levels leading to PSU's failure, and that to try to justify it by scapegoating the whole debacle on cheaters is just asinine. Most of those failures were a direct result of Sega's actions, both developmental and management. Cheaters were a factor in the failure, but they are a fact of life in online games, and it was Sega's responsibility to deal with them in a manner conducive to maintaining a healthy population. However, the cheating problem on the PS2/PC servers was minor compared to even PSO - not because it was harder to accomplish, but because by the time the first real cheats and glitches started to emerge, Sega had already devastated the population and stymied further growth. There was no population to draw the talented griefers.
My point of view on death of pc/ps2 Eng server is quite simple which is that cheaters and hackers killed most of the population within 3 months of game launch and the server's been tripping ever since dragging on it's short life span for years, never recovering from the initial fatal blow. If you just blame Sega with full responsibility for managing the problems on pc/ps2 side then you must also give them full credit for keeping 360 server hack free over the years. It was not Sega's mistake in developing 360 port on Live closed network, and they tried to manage both servers with equal opportunity and evenly divided resources to keep it fair, not trying to focus all their attention on one side only. As it turned out, pc/ps2 eng version just happened to come up short in comparison on multiple levels unfortunately.



Most of PSU's issues were set in motion during the development and planning phase, and were too integral to the extended business plan to change by the time they became apparent. Corporate politics and the way Sega coordinates (or rather, doesn't) their regional offices with their cooperate HQ didn't help, as it prevented the regional branches from making the changes necessary to accommodate the problems.Here you almost sound like someone working in Sega's HQ corporate management or an expert in business science of some sort. If you think it's so easy to point out their problems, then why don't you just run your own freakin corporate yourself?



Yes, Sega as a whole is a sinking ship - and PSU (as an extension) is going down with it. Do we really need to tread over the last 10 years (at least) of Sega's death spiral? Do we really need to pull up the active subscriptions and comparison charts with other online RPGs in Japan over the last four years? Do we really need to compare the longevity of PSO/PSU lifespans to other subscription based online RPGs? Do we really need to remind everyone that from the get-go, Sega only suggested a 5-6 year plan for adding to PSU's content. Your call. If you're gonna keep spewing out such bold statements out of your own grotesque arrogance like it's just nothing then I expect you to be able to back up your own statement with facts, so why don't you pull up all the sales figures of all PS franchise titles ever released in JP and the life span of all PS servers ever existed to make fair comparison with competing rivals, then we'll talk.



Again, what the hell does that have to do with it? Cheating was not a significant factor in PSU's failure, and you have yet to substantiate that such is the case.As I said already, cheating/hacking was the significant factor for the fall as far as pc/ps2 Eng server is concerned when compared to 360 server in my point of view, not to mention PSU being built on Live takes full advantage of its closed network system fused with PSU in-game interface. I expect you to fully understand what I'm talking about here without further explanation.



You and me both. It's excel spreadsheet management with a Final Fantasy GUI as far as I'm concerned. So what?So then why did you even bring up FF as an example in the 1st place just to support your own opinion? Pointless.



It did make a difference. Sega shut the servers down. That's how boycotts and customer dissatisfaction works. The point is, Sega operates on profit. If they want profit, they have to court their subscribers. The reason why the players left was because of Sega's continual neglect and fuck-ups. Ultimately, the entire blame rests on Sega. Some of the problems they couldn't help, couldn't foresee, or couldn't do anything about... sure.. that happens. Nobody is perfect, nobody is omniscient, and you can't please everyone... but it is their goddamned responsibility to make their own profit, not the customers.Of course it is their responsibility to not lose their own profit by keeping the empty server up and running, what else did you or anyone else expect them to do other than cutting their losses by shutting the whole damned thing down? You knew what was going to happen for sure and you did it anyway, but the problem was with those 'false leads' who instigated the rest to do the same saying it will teach 'them' a lesson and it will force them to bring more update contents at faster rate which were all just big lame lies. So then the real question here is were you part of this group or not? because I really can't tell from your nonconstructive posts one after another that divides us fan base from the developer instead of bringing us all togather to work against and face our real common enemy which is cheaters on online gaming that's killing this franchise.



That's a massive non-sequitur, and that's not even the point I was trying to make. My point was on the cost of customer service per user is pathetic, and does not justify the price of the subscription payed.if you think $10/month is too high then what price range do you think justifies it and give some examples to support it. Or are you rather saying that they should make PSU free to play online so we can be happy togather all mingled with the demo trashes? well, they already made JP like that with the community course and they might do the same on 360 soon so we shall see about that.



The issue surrounding PSU's failure has far more facets than you're not willing (or capable) of considering, and simplistic justifications do not satisfactorily or correctly address the situation. However, these facets are typical of Sega's long term business trends and do not bode well when speculating on the future of PSU.While your point of view is rather seem to be focused on complicated analysis of the past *which will never correctly or satisfactorily address the whole matter completely anyways, mine is simple in looking ahead of possibilities with humble optimism. It is unnecessary to complicate things more than it already is and if you keep insisting on speculating the future of PSU or Sega as a corporate or any other matter in real life with your worst of negativism and skepticism, then you might as well be unknowingly sealing your own fate eventually.

[RemiusTA]

woooh man im gonna go get some coffee anyone else want some coffee

[xBULLYDOGG]

woooh man im gonna go get some coffee anyone else want some coffee

I'm game

[RobTrance]

i've transferred too :O was know as .Trance on the PC/PS2 server, now known as marlboro
GT: SCFC Rob, gimme a shout sometime.

[Sinue_v2]

My point of view on death of pc/ps2 Eng server is quite simple which is that cheaters and hackers killed most of the population within 3 months of game launch and the server's been tripping ever since dragging on it's short life span for years, never recovering from the initial fatal blow.

However, for that point of view to be accurate and applicable, it must be shown that cheaters did not strike at the Xbox or Japanese servers, which they most certainly did. Yes, the 360's closed platform did assist in staving off many of the cheaters, beyond grinder duping, but then - why (if cheating is the principal cause of low subscription rates) are the 360 servers only hitting 1 full server (1,000 players) during peak hours? total subscriptions to PSU on the 360 side are only in the low 100k range, which does not differentiate between active and inactive accounts. Indeed, a sampling of the Demo servers vs. Official servers gives the impression that many PSU players stick to the demo servers and only return for events.


If you just blame Sega with full responsibility for managing the problems on pc/ps2 side then you must also give them full credit for keeping 360 server hack free over the years.

They are fully responsible for the success or failure of the game. The issue of keeping cheaters in line is differed by Microsoft's Xbox Live, which bans user accounts for cheating - even free silver accounts. The two issues are only intrinsically linked as you suggest if you assume that cheating is the principal throttle to subscription rates... which it's not.


Here you almost sound like someone working in Sega's HQ corporate management or an expert in business science of some sort.

No, I'm simply not so naive as to think that cheaters are the principal throttle of subscription rates, or that developing and managing an online game is so simple.


If you think it's so easy to point out their problems, then why don't you just run your own freakin corporate yourself?

I never said it was easy to run your own corporations. The high degree of complexity in the market is one of the reasons why describing the issues leading to failure is easier in hindsight than forecasting. Complex systems are inherently unpredictable, and a company must stay adaptive... which Sega's only degree of success in regards to PSU was the temporary shift away from focus on the online game to their portable markets wherein they could experiment with the game formula without the need to run servers and with much of the resources already developed.


If you're gonna keep spewing out such bold statements out of your own grotesque arrogance like it's just nothing then I expect you to be able to back up your own statement with facts, so why don't you pull up all the sales figures of all PS franchise titles ever released in JP and the life span of all PS servers ever existed to make fair comparison with competing rivals, then we'll talk.

I expect you to put just as much research and correlative data into your baseless assumptions that cheating is a principal cause of PSU's market failure in the west, and have the data on hand to either falsify my claims or prove that PSU is a noteworthy player in the online RPG market. Breaking even doesn't count as a success, because if you're not growing your brand - your losing it to stagnation.

I'll start:

Active subscription rates are hard to come by, since they are rarely released to the public (especially if the game is unpopular); they are typically gathered by market analysis from industry sources such as NPD, which cost money to access. You want to go this route, we can. Though it's a bit much of an effort to prove that water is wet. Just from free sources, no source I've come across even lists PSU as a market factor in subscription based MMO/MORPGs. PSU does fit into this category, though it's principal competition (Monster Hunter) would not be counted, as it is free to play. Comparison of the demo servers vs. paid servers on the X360 show the disparity a few dollars in fees will cause within a population.

2008 market demographic based on average concurrent users according to MMOcharts: Here (http://www.mmogchart.com/Chart7.html).

2008 Asian Market Average Concurrent Users: Here (http://www.mmogchart.com/Chart10.html)

2008 Total Active Subscription across all genres/markets Here (http://www.mmogchart.com/Chart4.html)

Now, according to the march 2006 Gamasutra article detailing a GDC talk by POL organizer Sage Sundi on Final Fantasy XI's success, at a comparable point to PSU's lifespan - FFXI was the most popular online RPGs in Japan, with up to 55% of it's total subscription hailing from that nation. Out of 500,000 users, roughly 260,000 of them were Japanese. This is several orders of magnitude more players than the PSU servers even allow. At their peak, I don't believe the JP PSU servers have ever even filled half of their available servers (Prior to or post server merger). At peak times, there are less than 15,000 players in their most popular region, let alone worldwide. FFXI (as of the writing of that article) was logging about 150,000 players simultaneously at peak hours.

Would anyone who's switched to the JP servers recently care to post the ballpark number their account is? Because by Mar 01' PSO had 200,000 registered users on the Dreamcast. (http://www.mastergamer.com/news03162001.html) By Oct. 02, that number had jumped to half a million prior to the launch of the GameCube Ep I & II according to Sega (http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/newsArt.cfm?artid=7839). Of course, the Dreamcast v.1 was free to play online, and v.2 was only 4.99/month.

When you contrast the level of cheating on the Dreamcast/NGC version to the current versions of PSU, taking into account even older online games which are plagued by cheating yet remain popular (such as Diablo I & II) with the level of customer service (or lack thereof) and content available to price ranges and subscription fees (free, 4.99, 8.99, 9.99) - there is a significant correlation. People don't mind paying for quality service, and many don't mind cheating and poor service if the game is free. However, poor service w/ low content and high subscription fee is deal breaker. Right now, on just one private server - there are about 320 active players... roughly half of the 360 current PSU population.. and the demo servers are enjoying at least two full universes.

The Japanese servers do have greater customer service and higher levels of content, which falls right in line with such predictive statements... despite having their own issues with cheaters and glitchers.

(As a side note: In that Gamasutra article, Mr. Sundi mentioned the importance of universal servers and customer service, which helps to punctuate my point.)

http://www.mmogchart.com/
Wikia: VG Sales, some free NPD & Famitsu data (http://vgsales.wikia.com/wiki/Video_Game_Sales_Wiki)
Brighthub Mar 2010: Top MMO Subscriptions (http://www.brighthub.com/video-games/mmo/articles/35992.aspx)


As I said already, cheating/hacking was the significant factor for the fall as far as pc/ps2 Eng server is concerned when compared to 360 server in my point of view

Point being, both servers have fallen and are a joke of the industry. (http://kotaku.com/325706/hello-phantasy-star-universe-expansion) (From the opening paragraph concerning the AotI expansion; "Don't be ashamed. We know there are still some of you who play PSU. It's OK! We're not judging you, or your niche online gaming habits.")


not to mention PSU being built on Live takes full advantage of its closed network system fused with PSU in-game interface.

I understand what you're saying, but I don't see it's relevance. At least, not to the degree which you think it holds.


So then why did you even bring up FF as an example in the 1st place just to support your own opinion? Pointless.

The only thing pointless is assuming that my personal opinion of a game has anything to do with market relevance.


So then the real question here is were you part of this group or not? because I really can't tell from your nonconstructive posts one after another that divides us fan base from the developer instead of bringing us all togather to work against and face our real common enemy which is cheaters on online gaming that's killing this franchise.

I've always given my unabashed opinion of PSU; Good, bad, and ugly. Usually, it's been bad and ugly. I've also bought two extra copies of the game on the PC version to give to friends who were laid off at the time (both of whom quit to return to FFXI/WoW in the first three months because there was not enough content to keep them satisfied), and I've recently had a relative who plays on XBL join up since I'm on that platform now.

I'm not going to sugarcoat and scapegoat Sega's failings to do Sega's advertising and customer service for them.


if you think $10/month is too high then what price range do you think justifies it

Personally, I'd say offhand that $4.99 would be sufficient for a decent profit given the level of customer service we're getting. Initially, when there was little to no content (they didn't even fucking Moatoob open at launch), I wouldn't have even put the price that high... but that is the critical period when hype is still high, and raising prices later would outrage the community.


Or are you rather saying that they should make PSU free to play online so we can be happy togather all mingled with the demo trashes?

Dehumanization. Cute.


well, they already made JP like that with the community course and they might do the same on 360 soon so we shall see about that.

Yes, we will.


While your point of view is rather seem to be focused on complicated analysis of the past *which will never correctly or satisfactorily address the whole matter completely anyways

No, a complex view will never be 100% accurate or correct on all levels. But this is a complex world, and our competitive markets are complex adaptive structures. A complex view will bring you closer to the reality of the situation, whereas a simplistic view will always be wrong and never get a higher degree of accuracy. For example, NPD's market analysis for online game subscriptions take into account measures such as:

- Quarter-by-quarter view of market size
- Title-level detail
- Subscriber profiles
- Subscriber satisfaction profiles
- Quarterly trends
- Trended software information
- Total market size for category and platform (units and dollars)
- Top platform by units and dollar share
- Etc.

.... and that's just for a rough analysis.

NPD: Video Game & PC Game Subscriptions Reports (http://www.npd.com/corpServlet?nextpage=entertainment-vg-pc-game-subscriptions-reports_s.html)
NPD: Game Scoring (http://www.npd.com/corpServlet?nextpage=entertainment-games-score_s.html)


mine is simple in looking ahead of possibilities with humble optimism.

Two quotes come to mind:

"Wish in one hand; shit in the other. See which one gets filled up first." ~ Unknown.
"He that lives upon hope, dies farting" ~ Ben Franklin


It is unnecessary to complicate things more than it already is and if you keep insisting on speculating the future of PSU or Sega as a corporate or any other matter in real life with your worst of negativism and skepticism, then you might as well be unknowingly sealing your own fate eventually.

Again, we live in a complex world of emergence and self-organization, and our global markets (in which these games are sold and compete) are no exception. That I am negative and skeptical is only a result of seeing which way the wind is blowing, to analogize with trendline from another complex adaptive system.

Applying strictly linear causal thinking to a non-linear system is foolish and naive.

[DragonStriker]

You people are morons.

[HyperShot-X-]

You people are morons.
hey man, leave me out of that loop and let's go get some coffee, shall we?

I'm done wasting my time on responding back to some unofficial corporate research project done by someone who's neck deep in his own arrogance that knows no bounds, leaving out the crucial points on the other side of view at his own convenience only to support his eqotistical point of view, getting delusional in thinking that he could somehow predict which way wind will blow next by complex analysis of trends on ever dynamic and unpredictable system.

There, your one adequately deserved sentence in short.

[Lacen]

I think someone's salty cause they got OWNED!!! XD j/k j/k. Geez Sinue_v2, if I had to ever take on someone in a crazy debate I'd hire you to do it. It'd probably be about something dumb like which is better for breakfast... Rice or Toast. xD I live in Hawaii so we eat alot of rice but I also like toast for breakfast. Fried Rice Omelet w/Toast Yo! But yeah, I've read everything and from the looks of things you seem pretty damn knowledgeable. I wouldn't be surprised if maybe you did work for some video game company or something to that extent. It's obvious that you're not some child and that you're just stating the facts. If you actually take the time to read what you wrote and aren't trying to win a war, it actually makes alot of sense. Don't mess with Sinue_v2 everybody. They have achieved Super Saiyan 3 Status. =P Anyway, who went and threw all this poop in mah thread!?xD Imma make you eat it then poop it out again!!! XDDDDD Geez, remind me next time to sleep before I post. =P Anyway take care. Cya in-game.

[Max B]

Geez I could build a small village with all those walls of text.

[xBULLYDOGG]

I forgot what the topic at hand was.

[Cloudstrife xx]

Sin- the Xbox 360 servers has more than a 1000 players playing/paying you know nothing.
Most wont even bother to read your essay.

[xBULLYDOGG]

Sin- the Xbox 360 servers has more than a 1000 players playing/paying you know nothing.
Most wont even bother to read your essay.

I know I didn't.

[DragonStriker]

I love the dude who thinks this Sin moron is good at "arguing". It's not a very good argument when your "argument" is completely written off by everyone it's intended for simply because it's a rant of stupidity.

On topic though, 360 and Japan can be a good fit for different players and both won't be going anywhere anytime soon.

[Sinue_v2]

Got anything other than ad hominem, or are we done here?

Better Business Bureau Reliability Report: SquareEnix (http://www.la.bbb.org/Business-Report/Square-Enix-Inc-13168063): A+ BBB Accredited = Yes

Better Business Bureau Reliability Report: Blizzard Entertainment (http://www.la.bbb.org/Business-Report/Blizzard-Entertainment-13050668): B. BBB Accredited = Yes

Better Business Bureau Reliability Report: Sega of America (http://www.bbb.org/greater-san-francisco/business-reviews/video-games-wholesale-and-manufacturers/sega-of-america-in-san-francisco-ca-63142): F. BBB Accredited=lulzno.

Some highlights:


Of the total of 13 complaints closed in 36 months, 5 were closed in the last year. These complaints concerned :

+ 1 regarding Advertising Issues
+ 2 regarding Billing or Collection Issues
+ 3 regarding Customer Service Issues
+ 1 regarding Delivery Issues
+ 4 regarding Product Issues
+ 1 regarding Sales Practice Issues
+ 1 regarding Service Issues

These complaints were closed as:
+ 1 Administratively Closed
+ 8 No Response
+ 4 Resolved

BBB Industry Comparison (http://goldengate.app.bbb.org/industry_compv2/63142?clean)


Sin- the Xbox 360 servers has more than a 1000 players playing/paying you know nothing.

You do realize I play the 360 version, and I can see for myself how many people play at peak hours. Further, this has already been confirmed in this very thread by an impartial party.


PSU is doing just fine on the 360. We're still getting 4-5* at peak time. Shou is probably turning some people off to the JP servers with his 360 bashing.

4-5 stars is 800~1000 players at peak hours. While I'm glad there's more than 1-2 as the PC side was before shutdown, having 1,000 players online at peak hours is nothing to be proud of nor is it indicative of a successful subscription based online RPG.

[Powder Keg]

The internet is changing, Sinue..

[Sinue_v2]

The internet is changing, Sinue..

Was that in regard to the Alexa web tracking info? I removed that temporarily because Allakhazam has gone multi-game and not really applicable. I hadn't been there since I quit FFXI, and was unaware of the change.

I was going to update with more applicable data; specifically PlayOnline vs. the PSU Official Webpage. Ranks 21,993 and 296,652 respectively. Wow's official homepage has a rank of about 1,198, for the record.

Alexa Web Tracking. (http://www.alexa.com/)

That web data is in itself a useful indicator of general interest, and it collaborates with the view that PSU is not doing well in the west regardless of platform.

Or were you referring to something else?

[Cloudstrife xx]

Got anything other than ad hominem, or are we done here?

Better Business Bureau Reliability Report: SquareEnix (http://www.la.bbb.org/Business-Report/Square-Enix-Inc-13168063): A+ BBB Accredited = Yes

Better Business Bureau Reliability Report: Blizzard Entertainment (http://www.la.bbb.org/Business-Report/Blizzard-Entertainment-13050668): B. BBB Accredited = Yes

Better Business Bureau Reliability Report: Sega of America (http://www.bbb.org/greater-san-francisco/business-reviews/video-games-wholesale-and-manufacturers/sega-of-america-in-san-francisco-ca-63142): F. BBB Accredited=lulzno.

Some highlights:



BBB Industry Comparison (http://goldengate.app.bbb.org/industry_compv2/63142?clean)



You do realize I play the 360 version, and I can see for myself how many people play at peak hours. Further, this has already been confirmed in this very thread by an impartial party.



4-5 stars is 800~1000 players at peak hours. While I'm glad there's more than 1-2 as the PC side was before shutdown, having 1,000 players online at peak hours is nothing to be proud of nor is it indicative of a successful subscription based online RPG.

Yes i know you play 360 servers i ran past your character yesterday at parum central

4-5 stars at one point in time but going through out the day more sign off and others come online also you dont count the people that pay for the game but dont play very often or some that dont even bother to unsub while they are taking a break/playing other games/doing other stuff outside of psu, cause its a pain in the backside to cancel you sub for xbox psu.

Guess what Sega doesnt care if there only 4-5 five stars online as long as people are paying thats all that matters to keep us running.

[xBULLYDOGG]

PSU Anyone else just transfer over to the XB360 servers?
That was the original meant for topic correct?

[Tyreek]

Seems pretty clear.