The Failure and Future of Phantasy Star

[Khorian]

Some of us have played the Phantasy Star Series over the years before they came online. Some of us were introduced when PSO made its US debut on the Dreamcast.
I remember going through endless 30 to 90 day AOL and K-Mart Bluelight.com free internet disks. Eventually I got smart enough and a voice deep enough to call and cancel, only to have the sales rep completely frightened by the idea of losing a customer, comp me an extra two or three months to feed my Phantasy Star Online addiction.

Long after my Dreamcast became a paperweight and I got into PSO PC and PSO BB, I found myself less and less stuck in front of my computer or the nearest telephone jack, and more in the company of friends in four way smash brothers brawl stock battles. Little did I know they were all Hunters as well and eventually we started playing split screen Gamecube.

Many different incarnations of my typical Hunewearl or Ramarl were either corrupted accidentally, or on purpose, but fun was always had. Sadly I enjoyed Episode 3 for a while... But I was an underaged teen with a heavy drinking habit, so those memories are still blurry.

Then the impossible happened.

Phantasy Star Universe trailers were popping up everywhere, and I thought my game finally arrived at last. I figured it would be an end to the tedium that eventually set on when playing PSO for so damn long.

But I was wrong. The exclusion of Offline Multiplayer really hurt it for me. I was still hanging out with Phantasy Star heads, and the chance to LAN or Multitap PS2's for some offline action would have made all of the repeating endless corridors of bad drop rates that embodied the Phantasy Star experience for me. Everything else was great. The community on the PS2/PC servers were brimming with interesting people and within months the drama and episodic life of people in a fantasy made semi-reality were played out on an ambitious futuristic stage.

But hacking kinda ruined that. As it does ruin most things, peoples rooms getting cleaned out, Partner Machines being bombed, random cheaters handing out billions in meseta and items that hadn't even been released yet. It was a complete effjob, and you guys are obviously familiar with the story.

I eventually left for WoW but played a little AotI on a friend's account and enjoyed the little time I spent messing with the hybrid classes, but the wide open spaces and nooks and crannies in Warcraft was a temporary satiation for the lack of depth in the form of openness in Phantasy Star games. I eventually came to terms with the fact that Warcraft is a super-massive quasar in the middle of our internet so powerful that actual space-time can't even escape it. I support my theory with the following equation:

(Time+space) = Space-Time

also

Time=Money

thusly

Space=Time=Money

so:
World of Warcraft > X[(Money)(Tme)]

Meaning World of Warcraft will always increase by the factor of the space you take up playing it, the money you spend on it, and the time you invest.

Giving us: WoW>3(XMT) for three dimensions of space, with WoW acting as the fourth dimension.

Now we all know that the most rewarding fun comes freely, leisurely, and in prime real estate, either physical or psychological, meaning every second spent having fun is a gained investment, expressed by the equation.

Fun=F

F=(X+3)+(M+3)+(T+3)

Ideally for WoW to be fun it would have to generate more or less in any variant of the equation, either it gives you the ability to move freely, or a return investment on money, or something worth your time.

It does none of those things for many casual players, and unfortunately most fail to realize this under the effect of denial. And this is apparent in the expression of the equation:

if WoW >3XMT and F=3XMT then WoW>F : as it is impossible to get a return investment on WoW unless you're a hardcore raider, PvP god, Chinese gold farmer, or really really really REALLY into roleplay (ohwait, the community killed that too.)



Overcomplicated gibberish aside, Phantasy Star was in the running for succumbing to the equation on several fronts, if not for the actual return investment due to the community, which always manages to surprise me.


Most mmorpg'ers are vicious sadists anyways, willing to grind away years looking for a particular piece of digital eye candy. And as one of them I can say it's rare when a game manages to keep me returning like Anna May to Ike every single time like Phantasy Star.

My latest time sink is Phantasy Star Portable. In anticipation of the second game, I'm familiarizing myself with some of the mechanics I've missed. I'm hoping to run into some familiar faces out there, in the online frontier, but will it be all for naught? Sega's history of neglected servers and untranslated or JP exclusive content are outright phlegm and puss-encompassed loogies in the faces of English-Speaking gamers, who are forced to miss out on content time and time again in every incarnation of PS games.

When will they get it right? Will Phantasy Star Portable 2 be the end-all best iteration of the English games with constant support and hacking protection? Or will Sega start strong and randomly blow all their cash on hookers and cocaine once again, and allow English support, downloadable content, and Events to slowly dwindle into a "We Regret To Inform You But your servers are getting shut down again" message?


Also, are there any plans to ressurect PSU PC with private servers?
I'd donate.


tl;dr version:

Sega's screwed the pooch with english support in the past, will they eff over long time gamers who want a solid and steady PS foundation once again?

[TwistedDragon]

I started with Blue Burst.

[str898mustang]

Gamecube EP I & II

[Powder Keg]

I started with IV, thanks to Sega Channel back in the day.

[Seth Astra]

Zero, sadly. Not something better.

[KunoTatewaki]

I started with the original on the sega master system. I remember staying up and playing it with my older brother who got me hooked on the series.

[BIG OLAF]

I started with PSU. Though, shortly afterward, I decided to go "back in time" to see where the series got it's start. I've played (to completion) all the Phantasy Star games to date now.

[Mystic_Nessly]

I really think Phantasy Star Portable 2 will shine. Free online play and portability in one package. Can't beat that! I'm PRAYING it doesn't suffer from graphical slowdown. That will destroy the game for me.

That aside, I think SEGA now recognizes it's got a nice size Phantasy Star fan base (considering the numbers of players on the 360 servers) state-side and anywhere else not JP. Given that, I have faith that SEGA will turn for the better by giving better support to non JP players.

EDIT: My first Phantasy Star game was the one that revolutionized gaming, Phantasy Star Online Dreamcast ver.1 baby!

[Khorian]

I really think Phantasy Star Portable 2 will shine. Free online play and portability in one package. Can't beat that! I'm PRAYING it doesn't suffer from graphical slowdown. That will destroy the game for me.

That aside, I think SEGA now recognizes it's got a nice size Phantasy Star fan base (considering the numbers of players on the 360 servers) state-side and anywhere else not JP. Given that, I have faith that SEGA will turn for the better by giving better support to non JP players.

EDIT: My first Phantasy Star game was the one that revolutionized gaming, Phantasy Star Online Dreamcast ver.1 baby!

I'm hoping so as well.

I forgot to mention. My first PS game was Phantasy Star II. I never recovered from nerdiness having been literally raised on Final Fantasy, Phantasy Star, and Star Trek: TNG.

[FOkyasuta]

Pso V.1. Am I Lucky?

[Fox2Tails]

PSO ver.2

I feel so..."special"...:(

[pikachief]

Phantasy Star runs in my blood! The first thing my father ever bought with the money he got from a paying job was Phantasy Star.

as a child i may have playeda bit of PS3, PSO, but i didnt get into it until my friends told me to try the PSU beta (i forgot what Phantasy star even was at the time and my brother was telling me how it was like the worst game ever lol)

[Marik]

Xbox Episodes I & II.

[Justyn_Darkcrest]

Ah.. I remember my first PHantasy Star game like it was just yesterday.. I was 8 and my neighbor gave me his brand new Genisis due to it taking too much of his study time away.
Came with Sonic the Hedghog and Phantasy Star 3.

To this day I have yet to find more than a handful of ppl who liked that game as much as I did.
P.S. I have played the others as well and 3 is still my fave ^.-b

[Redpaige13]

I started with IV, thanks to Sega Channel back in the day.
Oh gawd, Sega Channel... That was so fucking awesome. <3

I honestly started with PSO on the GC. I had never heard of Phantasy Star before then, but one day at Walmart I saw Phantasy Star Online ep. I & II, and bought it on a whim.

I'm glad I did. I never got to experience it online, but once PSU rolled around, I was finally able to experience a video game online.

Lately I've been snooping around small-business video game stores, trying to find the classics. I feel like I'm really missing out.

[Ryno]

forgot to put PSO I&II xbox on the list.... thats the one i would vote if it was there.

[voodlar]

Phantasy Star II for me. Still have my original Genesis -- came with Altered Beast. It's a little fidgety but still functions.

[Hucast-Kireek]

I started with Dreamcast PSO.

[pikachief]

Phantasy Star II for me. Still have my original Genesis -- came with Altered Beast. It's a little fidgety but still functions.

WISE FWOM YOUR GWAVES!! (my mom used to occasionally say that when she'd wake me and my brother up lol)

[Jim Stelnium]

PSO V.1 for DC, what an awesome game that was back in the day. I remember fighting De Rol Le with my level 12 Humar...THAT was an epic battle!

[DoubleJG]

Episodes 1&2 on the Gamecube.

[JCGamer]

^^ man old good time and worse part of are life when pso got hack and everyone started to duping items. yeah it was fun back then and still is. but Sega at that time never could fix there own problem and they sure did made a lot of the mistakes in the past. Some of u gonna say :rant: no I never dupe item :rant: :razz: cuz we all did at one point. We had a lot of troubles on log-in issue,Lag out when doing a event mission and etc. ^^Well u get the point.but still over all nice game indeed :razz:

[milranduil]

You made 1 of 2 mathematical errors in your OP:

1) (Time+space)=Space-time where - is a minus sign. This would simplify to Time = 0 meaning also Money = 0 and thus World of Warcraft > 0 which is common sense. Anything existent is implicitly greater than zero meaning nothing can be proven by this statement.

2) (Time+space)=Space-time where - is a hyphen implying the planar quantity of space time. This can only work if space is strictly defined in the x direction and time in the y direction such that every single time you end up with the exact vector quantity of space-time (x,y), such that it is never anything else. Because of your second equation, Time = Money, if we substitute this into your first equation, we get (Money+space)=Space-time, again assuming that space-time is a singular vector quantity (the money does not carry in this particular instance because it is not explicitly clear how time directly correlates into space-time as it is not defined). This would mean then that, Space-time - space = money, and this then cannot work anyways because we have have a scalar equal to the difference of a 4-dimensional quantity and a 3-dimensional location. This is not permitted in addition and subtraction of vector quantities. This also pertains to your WoW>3(XMT). WoW must be a 3-dimensional quantity for this to even be considered a valid argument (even though it is most definitely not sound). WoW can only be a 4-dimensional quantity if your right-hand argument is also a 4-dimensional quantity. The entire rest of your argument is invalid and unsound simply based on the fact that the equation, WoW > 3XMT, isn't defined explicitly.

Just my two cents.


Oh, and I started on PSO GC to be on-topic.

[rayner]

My first Phantasy Star game was the original... I did play Phantasy Star II at my cousins house before I played the original, but it was never my own ( And later when I bought it from him he had lost the Hint Book! )

I've played every Phantasy Star Game on that list besides Blue Burst & Zero.

[Mystic_Nessly]

^^ man old good time and worse part of are life when pso got hack and everyone started to duping items. yeah it was fun back then and still is. but Sega at that time never could fix there own problem and they sure did made a lot of the mistakes in the past. Some of u gonna say :rant: no I never dupe item :rant: :razz: cuz we all did at one point.


Haha! That's right. I remember when the shop-dupe glitch method became popular on the GC. Then came the dupes and overstacked items. I loved duping. It genuinely made the game more fun for me. It turns out that glitch also workd on DC ver 1 and 2. To think, that glitch was there the WHOLE time and could be done without any cheat device! haha! (Hypothetically speaking, I could have made a killing selling items on ebay while the game was still popular if I had known about it before GC/XBOX release.... ^^;. Haha! I know others made some serious profit.)

[darkante]

PSO for me.

Glad it were too, gems like this are easy to miss.

[Khorian]

Oh gawd, Sega Channel... That was so fucking awesome. <3

I honestly started with PSO on the GC. I had never heard of Phantasy Star before then, but one day at Walmart I saw Phantasy Star Online ep. I & II, and bought it on a whim.

I'm glad I did. I never got to experience it online, but once PSU rolled around, I was finally able to experience a video game online.

Lately I've been snooping around small-business video game stores, trying to find the classics. I feel like I'm really missing out.

If you're starving for the classics, I'd suggest downloading them on an emulator, or if you want to funnel more money into the franchise, get the collection versions that are available on Virtual Console.

I may go back and play PS II III and IV while waiting with drug-addict like anticipation for PSPo2...

[Khorian]

You made 1 of 2 mathematical errors in your OP:

1) (Time+space)=Space-time where - is a minus sign. This would simplify to Time = 0 meaning also Money = 0 and thus World of Warcraft > 0 which is common sense. Anything existent is implicitly greater than zero meaning nothing can be proven by this statement.

2) (Time+space)=Space-time where - is a hyphen implying the planar quantity of space time. This can only work if space is strictly defined in the x direction and time in the y direction such that every single time you end up with the exact vector quantity of space-time (x,y), such that it is never anything else. Because of your second equation, Time = Money, if we substitute this into your first equation, we get (Money+space)=Space-time, again assuming that space-time is a singular vector quantity (the money does not carry in this particular instance because it is not explicitly clear how time directly correlates into space-time as it is not defined). This would mean then that, Space-time - space = money, and this then cannot work anyways because we have have a scalar equal to the difference of a 4-dimensional quantity and a 3-dimensional location. This is not permitted in addition and subtraction of vector quantities. This also pertains to your WoW>3(XMT). WoW must be a 3-dimensional quantity for this to even be considered a valid argument (even though it is most definitely not sound). WoW can only be a 4-dimensional quantity if your right-hand argument is also a 4-dimensional quantity. The entire rest of your argument is invalid and unsound simply based on the fact that the equation, WoW > 3XMT, isn't defined explicitly.

Just my two cents.


Oh, and I started on PSO GC to be on-topic.
Ohnoes, my maths is teh badz!!


I guess you shouldn't try to use equations to make a philosohical point. ;-)

[milranduil]

I was bored last night, so I decided to break down your math and disprove it lol.

[Quatre52]

Started back on the first PSO, awesome stuff.

[Ce'Nedra]

PSO GC, good old times. Got many good memories and made many friends on there. I was saddned to see alot of people go when PSU came though.

One of the best games i ever played, i still can see the entire ep1 intro in my head when i hear the intro tune.

[Akaimizu]

I wont lie. I didn't have my own Genesis/Nintendo/Super NES consoles, back in the day. I only played it on my friends'. None of them were big RPG folks either, so the main RPGs I played were still on my computers.

Phantasy Star Online (Dreamcast) was the first I played, and then I quickly went back to play the Original non-online games. (I did get myself a Sega Genesis, but not the *normal* Sega Genesis. I got myself a Nomad for a little over 20 dollars. Pretty cool little unit.) I also enjoyed their re-releases on the GBA and in the Sega Collections they released.

[Gahnik]

I started with PSO GC, but i couldn't find the adapter thing to go online, so I played local multiplayer a lot with my friends, and occasionally still do, though we remake characters alot lol

[Noblewine]

My first game was PSU. I loved it.

[RebhtheDark]

My first time was PSO Ep I & II for the GC. And its a long story how I got into the series:

My and my siblings were really into Sonic Adventure 2 Battle at the time and fell in love with the Chaos, then we heard of the Tails Chao and that you were able to get it from some game. I didnt know what game it was. At this time I just started Highschool I made some friends and we started talking about games and I mention thet Tails chao. One of my friends said that he has it and the game that you get it from. I told him if I can borrow it, and I did. Then thats when my PSO adventures started! I had the game for 2 months before I gave it back then I bought my own. I got all my sinlings into it and most of my cousins, we all played split-screen offline and had huge parties were we all played PSO and which all switch up the parties with all of our different characters. VERY good times!

I've never played it online tho....didnt really needed too O.o;

I also got the Tails Chao too!

[Redpaige13]

If you're starving for the classics, I'd suggest downloading them on an emulator, or if you want to funnel more money into the franchise, get the collection versions that are available on Virtual Console.

I may go back and play PS II III and IV while waiting with drug-addict like anticipation for PSPo2...

I'm most likely going to do that. I just got myself a new Wii a few weeks ago, and I memmer seeing the classic Phatnasy Star titles available on the VC. I've been really tempted to buy them off there. But then again, I'm a realy fickle bitch at times, and I prefer having the physical copy of a video game rather than DLing it..

[adycarter]

V1 iirc...

It was a long time ago, /points at join date

[HeartBreak301]

I started on GC but now I mainly play BB on a private server.

[Tetsaru]

PSO Gamecube here. All my friends had it, and we'd play offline multiplayer together. I never got online with it, but one of my friends did, and he gave the rest of us rare stuff he found and showed us how to dupe items. :wacko: It was a great multiplayer co-op experience back then.

PSU for PC/PS2 was next for me. Again, a lot of my friends had it, but they all eventually quit early on after having to deal with the hacking, the fact that so much from offline wasn't even available, etc. Personally, I'm surprised that I stuck with it as long as I did. I've heard PSO was similar in regards to online, but still, you'd think that Sega would get their shit together the second time around... Oh yeah, and PSU's story SUCKED compared to PSO's; kinda ironic how you could pretty much ignore it entirely online.

I got PSZ afterwards, and although I enjoyed it, after beating the main story, I just lost interest in trying to beat the other difficulties or hunt down rare items... too much repetition involved, I guess (one thing that drove me away from PSU).

A friend of mine who has a modded PSP showed me PSPo, which from what little I played of it, wasn't too bad, I guess, but I hated the lengthy text-based cut-scenes (didn't like that about PSZ either). I asked him to try out the JP version of PSPo2 for me too, but he quickly got rid of it when he saw that some of the starting levels were, in his words, EXACTLY the same as PSU's maps. I downloaded the US PSPo2 demo a few days ago, but I don't have a PSP of my own yet to play it on, so I can't judge it just yet. :confused:

I think Sega just needs to hand over development of their Phantasy Star games to other teams, which is what they've been doing with PSZ, PSPo1, and PSPo2. Thing is... I don't play handheld games that much, lol; I'd rather play on something like my PS3 or my PC (if it was up to date on hardware, lol). Personally, I'd love to see Square-Enix develop the next big online non-handheld Phantasy Star game. After watching my friend play Star Ocean: The Last Hope (a game they worked on), I'm sure they could pull it off, especially since a lot of the main characters (Bacchus and Myuria especially) look VERY similar to PSO characters. Some of the development videos I've seen for FF14 also look very promising.

As far as private servers go, we're not really allowed to discuss them in detail on these forums... >_>X

[Khorian]

PSO Gamecube here. All my friends had it, and we'd play offline multiplayer together. I never got online with it, but one of my friends did, and he gave the rest of us rare stuff he found and showed us how to dupe items. :wacko: It was a great multiplayer co-op experience back then.

PSU for PC/PS2 was next for me. Again, a lot of my friends had it, but they all eventually quit early on after having to deal with the hacking, the fact that so much from offline wasn't even available, etc. Personally, I'm surprised that I stuck with it as long as I did. I've heard PSO was similar in regards to online, but still, you'd think that Sega would get their shit together the second time around... Oh yeah, and PSU's story SUCKED compared to PSO's; kinda ironic how you could pretty much ignore it entirely online.

I got PSZ afterwards, and although I enjoyed it, after beating the main story, I just lost interest in trying to beat the other difficulties or hunt down rare items... too much repetition involved, I guess (one thing that drove me away from PSU).

A friend of mine who has a modded PSP showed me PSPo, which from what little I played of it, wasn't too bad, I guess, but I hated the lengthy text-based cut-scenes (didn't like that about PSZ either). I asked him to try out the JP version of PSPo2 for me too, but he quickly got rid of it when he saw that some of the starting levels were, in his words, EXACTLY the same as PSU's maps. I downloaded the US PSPo2 demo a few days ago, but I don't have a PSP of my own yet to play it on, so I can't judge it just yet. :confused:

I think Sega just needs to hand over development of their Phantasy Star games to other teams, which is what they've been doing with PSZ, PSPo1, and PSPo2. Thing is... I don't play handheld games that much, lol; I'd rather play on something like my PS3 or my PC (if it was up to date on hardware, lol). Personally, I'd love to see Square-Enix develop the next big online non-handheld Phantasy Star game. After watching my friend play Star Ocean: The Last Hope (a game they worked on), I'm sure they could pull it off, especially since a lot of the main characters (Bacchus and Myuria especially) look VERY similar to PSO characters. Some of the development videos I've seen for FF14 also look very promising.

As far as private servers go, we're not really allowed to discuss them in detail on these forums... >_>X

WHOA.

Hang on.

Put the rails on there.

Square Enix cannot do ANYTHING right, at least when it comes to original franchises.


Examples.

Squaresoft games:

Final Fantasy 1-10

Final Fantasy Tactics

Chrono Trigger

Chrono Cross.

*The quality of these games is pretty self evident.


Square ENIX games:

Final Fantasy X-2 -probably the best one they made.

Chrystal Chronicles -Forcing everyone to use extra hardware hurt this game

Final Fantasy Tactics Advance -Don't know WHAT they were thinking. They took a good formula, and added the BS law system that RUINED THIS GAME ENTIRELY.

Final Fantasy XIII- I don't even have to say anything.


And you want that company making Phantasy Star?

I'll pass.


Now on the subject of Phantasy Star games being too grindy...

Well that's just Phantasy Star. Although I'm hoping that ALL of the throwback PSU maps wont be in the game pixel for pixel, I'm glad they left some familiar missions in there too.

With the cap being lv 200, and hopefully (I said "hopefully") full support for event missions and DLC, boredom doesn't seem like it will come too easily.
That being said, I think that Phantasy Star Portable2 is perfect in the sense that its portability makes it easy to pick up and put down at random hots-pots.


I can only find two gripes with PsPo2. 1-Why cant I level up my PAs anymore? Grabbing disc after disc after disk to level up my Techs was retarded and frustrating in PSO, and they brought it back....>.>

And the opening song... Oh god, my ears bleed and I poop myself a little every time I hear it.

[Anon_Fire]

WHOA.

Hang on.

Put the rails on there.

Square Enix cannot do ANYTHING right, at least when it comes to original franchises.


Examples.

Squaresoft games:

Final Fantasy 1-10

Final Fantasy Tactics

Chrono Trigger

Chrono Cross.

*The quality of these games is pretty self evident.


Square ENIX games:

Final Fantasy X-2 -probably the best one they made.

Chrystal Chronicles -Forcing everyone to use extra hardware hurt this game

Final Fantasy Tactics Advance -Don't know WHAT they were thinking. They took a good formula, and added the BS law system that RUINED THIS GAME ENTIRELY.

Final Fantasy XIII- I don't even have to say anything.


And you want that company making Phantasy Star?

I'll pass.


Now on the subject of Phantasy Star games being too grindy...

Well that's just Phantasy Star. Although I'm hoping that ALL of the throwback PSU maps wont be in the game pixel for pixel, I'm glad they left some familiar missions in there too.

With the cap being lv 200, and hopefully (I said "hopefully") full support for event missions and DLC, boredom doesn't seem like it will come too easily.
That being said, I think that Phantasy Star Portable2 is perfect in the sense that its portability makes it easy to pick up and put down at random hots-pots.


I can only find two gripes with PsPo2. 1-Why cant I level up my PAs anymore? Grabbing disc after disc after disk to level up my Techs was retarded and frustrating in PSO, and they brought it back....>.>

And the opening song... Oh god, my ears bleed and I poop myself a little every time I hear it.

And what makes you say Square-Enix can't do anything right?

on-topic: I started off on PSO Episode I&II on GC offline.

[Khorian]

And what makes you say Square-Enix can't do anything right?

on-topic: I started off on PSO Episode I&II on GC offline.

Do I really have to say it again? Have you noticed the decline in quality of Final Fantasy games ever since the merger? Bangaa Viera and moogles that look NOTHING like moogles run rampant in FFXII (my wife loves it but I absolutely hate that game), Final Fantasy XI was laughably one of the worst online games made in the past ten years by a big-named company, and they CONSISTENTLY whore out Final Fantasy VII in attempts to print more money before the collective (ORIGINAL) Final Fantasy fanbase decides to lynch them all.

Crisis Core- Would have been damnably decent if THE STUPID SLOT MACHINE mechanic wasn't implemented. However it touts more yaoi fanfiction material than an actual yaoi fanficiton site. The best boobs in recent FF games are stuck on the chest of all the male characters- who seem to have hips that would make Shakira jealous. Also prequels not handled with care tend to suck monkey butt.

Dirge of Cerberus .....Where do I start.... Nowhere, if you want to know how bad this game was, don't rent it, go read a review. Only thirteen year old girls that had never heard of FFVII until Advent children and wet their panties over Vincent Valentine will like this game. (and those numbers dwindled to nothingness since the release of Twilight)

Before Crisis- Never played it, but the fact that it's a FF7 prequel .. ANOTHER FF7 prequel shows how much reverence the merged Square Enix has for the vision and legacy laid down by the Squaresoft devs.

Square Enix isn't trying to make good games anymore, it seems they're just trying to turn profits.



Edit:

I've been called a stodgey old-school gamer for these particular views on Square-Enix. Mind you I'm only 23 but I've probably played almost every Squaresoft game to date. There are a few I find fault in, like FF8 for its battle system, which seems to have been designed for the total of two days with the entire team lighting up regularly from their crack pipes and vomiting ideas on a whiteboard. So it's not that i think that ye olde Squaresoft can do no wrong, it's just that Squaresoft's slights against the videogame community were always that they'd try something different, and it'd hit or miss. Square Enix on the other hand seems to goose-step through the streets firing upon Hardcore fans like me with their nonsensical and completely un-needed taint that seems to have plagued every game since the merger.

/rant

[SuKKrl]

Not really interested on the Square Enix discussion, but there you made a mistake there Khorian:

April 1, 2003 - Square Enix formed

Release Data
Title Company Product ID Release Date Region
Final Fantasy XI SquareSoft 11/07/02 JP

The US version was only released after the merger, but the game was originally made by SquareSoft.

[Dragwind]

Keep the discussion on-topic folks.

[MadDogg]

I started on PSO version 1, randomly bought it on day 1 of its U.S. release because I seen the words online rpg on the back and it was free to play. I've always wanted to play everquest but my families first computer was ass cheeks, so this was the next best thing. PSO was so damn good when it was legit I went through like 3 months of failing grades in my junior year in high school.

With that said, I don't know I'm torn on psp2. I played the demo, and I like the fact that it brought back some of the oldschool pso feel with finding new disks instead of grinding, no more stupid lobbies to go through to hunt parties and whatnot, but on the other hand I have a feeling that the U.S. version of psp2 will be hacked to hell and back, and sega wouldn't give a damn compared to the japanese version.

I'm going to be real with you, if sega ever released a blue burst port for xbox live arcade or PSN, I would play the living hell out of that. Wasn't really feeling that game on the PC for numerous reasons, but I would love it on a console.

[Khorian]

Not really interested on the Square Enix discussion, but there you made a mistake there Khorian:

April 1, 2003 - Square Enix formed

Release Data
Title Company Product ID Release Date Region
Final Fantasy XI SquareSoft 11/07/02 JP

The US version was only released after the merger, but the game was originally made by SquareSoft.

Apologies, I promise to stay on topic after this little note. The decline of square truly began when Sakaguchi left shortly before the merger. He resigned in 2001, and quite a few games were created bearing the Final Fantasy name, but without the Final Fantasy soul before Enix happened and ruined what was already a tragedy.



-ON Topic-


I wouldn't want this to happen to Phantasy Star, however the series is definitely more malleable in the hands of fresh developers and writers. As long as continuity is respected to a certain degree, I don't think we're in danger of falling into that trap.


The notion that another development studio or two could add some much-needed depth is spot on, as I've recently gotten my hands on the demo and so far there isn't much I can point out or immediately hate.

[Red*]

PSO Episodes I&II for GameCube

[Tetsaru]

[spoiler-box]WHOA.

Hang on.

Put the rails on there.

Square Enix cannot do ANYTHING right, at least when it comes to original franchises.


Examples.

Squaresoft games:

Final Fantasy 1-10

Final Fantasy Tactics

Chrono Trigger

Chrono Cross.

*The quality of these games is pretty self evident.


Square ENIX games:

Final Fantasy X-2 -probably the best one they made.

Chrystal Chronicles -Forcing everyone to use extra hardware hurt this game

Final Fantasy Tactics Advance -Don't know WHAT they were thinking. They took a good formula, and added the BS law system that RUINED THIS GAME ENTIRELY.

Final Fantasy XIII- I don't even have to say anything.


And you want that company making Phantasy Star?

I'll pass.[/spoiler-box]

I can agree with you on SOME of that... Sorry if I'm dragging this further off-topic, but I think Khorian does bring up an interesting point of Squaresoft vs. Square-Enix that deserves some discussion of its own. Guess I'll spoiler-box my reply, for those not interested... I'll leave it up to Khorian and the mods to decide whether or not they want to split this thread up, as well as this post. :)

[spoiler-box]
FF13 was alright, I guess... sure, you had the JRPG-style convoluted ass story and the stereotypical characters, such as the angsty teenage boy (Hope), the moe/loli girl (Vanille), the guy who thinks he's a badass but really isn't (Snow), and the tsundere female lead (Lightning). I thought they did an awesome job with Sazh, though - one of the few black characters in a JRPG that isn't totally stereotyped. Fang was alright too, but her "relationship" with Vanille kinda disturbed me a bit... were they sisters, friends... perhaps something more? =x What I hated most was the level design (other than when you went to the huge area in Gran Pulse; the "final dungeon" looked like they tried to fuse Mirror's Edge with Tetris) and the weapons upgrade system that forced you to farm Adamantoises for Platinum Ingots because for some stupid reason, they decided that Gil wouldn't drop in battles anymore. For the most part, I loved the new form of the ATB battle system that was in previous FF games, but I hated not being able to control my non-leader party members, as well as the fact that if the leader died, you lost automatically. The whole stagger thing was... ok, I guess, but kinda unnecessary, and the Paradigm system, while also ok, made things complicated in some of the later, more difficult fights - again, making me wish I had control over all three party members, instead of just one. If I had to bitch about anything else, it was that the "My Hands" song seemed SOOOO out of place to me - an FF game just doesn't seem complete to me without Nobuo Uematsu's music. Luckily, he's back for FF14! :D Also, doesn't Barthandelus' ("Super Pope," lol) Fal'cie form look like a boss ripped out of Bayonetta??

FF12... now that I look back on it, it was very forgettable. I liked how they reverted back to an older FF setting, bringing back the various races of Bangaa, Viera, etc., as well as the huge maps you could explore, and the airship designs... but that was about it, lol. Vaan and Penelo, despite being two main characters that you start out with early in the game, have little significance in the storyline, which all I remember was "oh noes, war is breaking out between the nations, something about the Judges and another thing about the Crystals/similar gems for power," etc. The Gambit system was convoluted and often times VERY broken, to the point where you could just move the left analog stick and destroy anything in your path. I got pretty far in that game, but I never completely finished it, I think mostly due to it falling by the wayside since PSU had just come out, lol.

FF10-2 was horrible to me - it was like they took FF10 (which was one of my favorites of the series), ripped apart the story that was fine as it was, and then hired some random otaku to write a doujin about it and turned that into a game. Yuna's character design from FF10 was completely ruined, Rikku became even more sexualized, and they had to throw in Paine, a random third "Charlie's Angel" which had nothing to do with the first game, other than what extra story the second game conjured up. The whole Dressphere system just dolled it up even more, turning class-switches into Dress Me Up Barbie or some shit, with all the fanservicey Japanese-style transformation cut-scenes, of course... :nono:

The original Crystal Chronicles for Gamecube/GBA (dunno about the later ones) was a fun co-op game, but I agree, the connectivity shit was stupid. I blame Nintendo for that though, not Square-Enix; they've been on the whole "let's make it innovative and unconventional" path lately, probably why I hate the Wii so much, lol...

FF Tactics Advance was just fine, imo, though I have not played the DS or original Playstation versions. It's been forever since I last played it, but from what I remember, it was a very fun game that didn't suffer any particular problems, other than the fact that some of the classes could be broken as hell (thieves that steal equipment AND experience off of your enemies, gunners that can use Ultima Shot to kill anything from anywhere, etc.). The whole laws system just added some minor challenge to the game, as simple as "don't do this," and helped tie gameplay to the storyline for the fact that the Judges were becoming corrupt.

Dirge of Cerberus suffered from horrible gameplay (Cait Sith stages, anyone?). The storyline was... okay I guess; Vincent really needed some background story, since it was only hinted at in the original FF7, but they probably could've done a better job of it. I liked how Vincent and Lucretia's story tied in with Hojo, personally. As for all the side characters and Hojo turning into Weiss... ehh. :confused:

I don't own a PSP, so I've never personally played Crisis Core, but I did watch a friend of mine play it briefly, and I remember seeing the slot machine thing in battle. He was trying to show me some of the summons, and I remember it taking forever for him to proc it, despite having gear built towards swaying it in his favor.

I had never even HEARD of Before Crisis until just now, lol. After Googling it, I noticed it was specifically for mobile phone platforms... figures. My family's cell phones are all pay-as-you-go and outdated as hell... >_<

As for FF11 and the upcoming FF14, I recently posted some of my thoughts about them here, (http://www.pso-world.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2522274&postcount=1974) so I'll let you read up on that. As long as FF14 fixes those issues mentioned there, I think it'll be fine, so long as they don't throw in any other complicated and/or annoying stuff. I've watched a friend of mine livestream some Alpha and Beta gameplay, and while it looks a lot like how FF11 was, keep in mind that 1 - it's still a Beta, lol, and 2 - MMORPG's like this generally need some time to "age" before they get REALLY good; however, this DOESN'T mean holding out on content that was already in an offline mode, like PSU did. Of course, FF11 never had an offline mode, and I doubt FF14 will either...
[/spoiler-box]

Final Fantasy discussion aside, if not Square-Enix, who would you prefer to develop and manage the next online console Phantasy Star game? I just know that I sure as hell don't want Sonic Team working on it, lol... probably not Nintendo either, as they have horrible online support (friend codes, anyone?) and feel that up-to-date technology and hardware advances aren't critical to gameplay experience... which is true to an extent, but if it was true all the time, we'd probably still be playing 8-bit Mario, except with waggle controls. :wacko: Maybe Blizzard? Diablo 2 and WoW are both very successful, but I think most Phantasy Star fans would be afraid that that kind of gameplay might get implemented over the kind of stuff that made PSO and PSU unique... I dunno, I'm just throwing out ideas, lol. :confused:

Also, for those of you who have a PS3 or 360 that are wanting to get hold of the first 4 Phantasy Star games, you might want to look for the Sonic's Ultimate Genesis Collection game (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sonic%27s_Ultimate_Genesis_Collection). It has all 4 of them on there, although you have to unlock the first one for some reason (think you have to play Sonic 2 and beat the first boss with Tails alongside you getting at least one hit in - not too hard, lol). I think they're also available on the Wii's Virtual Console as well, but you also get a lot of other old Sega games on this disc, so in the long run, it's probably more bang for your buck. :) I should play through them sometime, lol... I mostly got it for the Sonic games! ^^;

[Delete]

Damn, am I like the only one who hasn't played PSO?

I only played PSU :( and PS:P if that counts.

[Khorian]

@Tetsaru
To reference a hypothetical future console release, because I won't pretend to know the technical limits of the PSP....

There are a lot of game developers out there that have very specific niches. I'd task the level design to someone with a little more imagination, capable of offering staggering detail and complexity, while remaining easy to navigate. I wouldn't change much on the combat because it's in a good place with Phantasy Star Portable 2, so I'd port it over, mostly, but the lobby system needs an overhaul badly. That being said, this is a game that dares to put it self on the internet and have "Universe" in the title.


They promised us vehicles as well- so I'd most likely ask the people behind Beyond Good and Evil to go balls to the walls in creativity, damn the cost. This is merely my experience; I played BG&E, and I think a system of navigating to lobbies in open space could change the face of the game entirely by enriching it with a new element that was perfected here. You could put "Urgent Missions" on some random asteroid with a small space station on it. Since we're "Hurting for Resources" we could go Pistatore's blazing off to an abandoned colony to chop up their ship like they do cars in the hood, where I live. Instead of "My Room" how about "My Quarters" on "My Ship?"

Once we get that subspace drive thingy working we're going to be branching out into other planets. Why not take the open space route to a whole different level? Phantasy Star's really about a few core principles: Grinding the bar, hitting the cap, getting the shinies, and whacking the uglies- and recently- pimping your room. I love, absolutely love this formula, and the action in PSU puts it in a neat little box and allows personal expansion. The players have grown and I think it's time for the game to grow too, so I'd task developers responsible for Spore to flesh out at least the local cluster close to Gurhal.

If crafting is going to continue to play a big part in the game, why not leave a slot or two open on a board for the player to add an item that will give a weapon a set property? (I think Tabula Rasa had an open ended crafting system.. wonder what became of that game)

I'd borrow elements from .hack's series and inject some randomness into the dungeon system. Of course I wouldn't rip off delta hidden forbidden holy ground directly.... but what if you put a set of coordinates in your ship and "dial" a completely randomized lobby with relevant points on an actual star chart?

Yes, I'm geeking out, I know, but gosh-darnit this is a forum on the interjunks, i'm allowed to.

So instead of "Yawn, Parum, Sleeping Warriors S2 again," you'd actually have a real reason to get you pumped to press square a lot, punctuated by many triangles?

I'd rather jam the hyperdrive button into a nearby star system and be greeted with my quest: "Distress Beacon: Recently minted virgins from the COG were caught in a micrometeorite shower and crash landed on a nearly inhospitable jungle planet full of hot, semi-hostile, fiercely bisexual amazons and a-beasts! SOS"

/ramble


I guess I'd borrow elements that other studios have perfected to PS, instead of bringing over an entire studio. Phantasy Star is in the position to completely turn the MMO landscape on its head, but still it aspires to mediocrity, likely due to the large amounts of coke being done on the backs of really expensive women at Sonic Team. The one thing Phantasy Star needs more than handing its gameplay off to another studio, is hiring some more writers to flesh out online mode, at least if they want to sell us on being integral to the plot.

[Zantra]

I've owned and played every Phantasy Star game, that you can legally obtain in America, except for Blue Burst. PSO is perfection to me (offline at least), and Sega will never be able to recreate that magic, again. The limits of the dreamcast and other systems back in the day, pushed companies to make fun interesting games, not graphics heavy games with limited fun, and replay value, like we experience today. Games today lack hardwork, and imagination.

[DragonForce]

I started out on PSO Xbox. PSU felt like it was made by retards who left all the good shit back in PSO.

I have hope the next phantasy star game will be good. I mean, it would almost be impossible to make it worse than PSU.

[Akaimizu]

Take note. All of the classic Phantasy Star Games are all in a single package as well. Cheap too. I say pretty much any classic SEGA fan *needs* to get Sonic's Ultimate Genesis Collection. It'll be the best 20 or less you'll spend.

[rise urbanus]

pso dc :)

[Naruuchiha1313]

well, i kew phantasy star existed since PSU came out and I like it, but i never bought it, my first a actually game was zero

[FOkyasuta]

@Akaimizu Or If Your Lucky Have The Original Cartdrige. =3

@Zantra Yeah... Maybe The Creator Of PSO Is Retired?

[Noblewine]

I saw a review of PSU on Game Informer and tried the game. I loved the gameplay and played online most of my time. I'm pretty eager to see what psp2 is going to be like. I like how psp improved psu.

[FOkyasuta]

Hell Yeah!