PSU and other MMO's.

[dias_flac_0g]

I been a long time fan of PSO/PSU (since dreamcast) and it's pretty much been my only online RPG experience. I have tried WoW the Demo trial for 2 weeks and it seemed like the world was so much bigger than anything PSU/Pso could ever have.

So this question is for those who play other MMO's. How does PSU compare to these other games? I been recently seeing alot of video's about FF14 and it looks pretty cool, but at the same time it looks like WoW. The battle system looks boring since it seems like you just stand there and press attack.

But what interest me the most is how big the world of these games looks. Does this huge world come to an end like PSU or does it go on forever? Cuz it seems like it just goes on forever and it seems like there's always something to do unlike psu were you can reach a point in the game where there's like nothing to do unless you make a new character.

They just seem so overwhelming and easy to get lost as well.

They also seem like "solo" kinda games like eeveryone is always doing their own things community wise where as in PSU everyone talks to each other and socializes.

Anyways, this is not a "Wow is better than PSU blah blah" thread or anything of the sort. I just want some information from some of you here who have infact played other MMO's and what they are all about in comparison to PSO/PSU.

[Ishia]

You can't compare them, as PSU is more of a Dungeon Crawler than a MMO.

[Ezodagrom]

I been a long time fan of PSO/PSU (since dreamcast) and it's pretty much been my only online RPG experience. I have tried WoW the Demo trial for 2 weeks and it seemed like the world was so much bigger than anything PSU/Pso could ever have.

So this question is for those who play other MMO's. How does PSU compare to these other games? I been recently seeing alot of video's about FF14 and it looks pretty cool, but at the same time it looks like WoW. The battle system looks boring since it seems like you just stand there and press attack.

But what interest me the most is how big the world of these games looks. Does this huge world come to an end like PSU or does it go on forever? Cuz it seems like it just goes on forever and it seems like there's always something to do unlike psu were you can reach a point in the game where there's like nothing to do unless you make a new character.

They just seem so overwhelming and easy to get lost as well.

They also seem like "solo" kinda games like eeveryone is always doing their own things community wise where as in PSU everyone talks to each other and socializes.

Anyways, this is not a "Wow is better than PSU blah blah" thread or anything of the sort. I just want some information from some of you here who have infact played other MMO's and what they are all about in comparison to PSO/PSU.
PSU/PSO don't compare to MMO's because they're not MMOs. PSO and PSU lack the "massive" part.

[dias_flac_0g]

Alright then..Hmm well assuming you guys have played MMO's (not gonna say other mmo's since psu is not one xD) can you guys give me some info on my questions? Basing them on psu of course. I know psu is not an MMO but they can still be compared to an extent.

Better yet, what are the differences between psu and mmo's? Is it what I explained earlier? Like how you can play "forever" on an mmo? Comparing to psu "update" system were we have to wait inorder to have something to do cuz from the looks of MMO's it seems that you can play "forever" without ever "maxing out".

[Ezodagrom]

Hmm, let's see, I really haven't played many MMO's, the only one I played...*cough* officially...was Aion.

Updates there are big, but really slow to arrive (I got tired of that game only 3 months after release anyway, due to lack of content/repetitive content in the 2nd half of the game). Nearly 1 year after release, I think there's been only 2 updates that added new content, even though those 2 updates were quite big.
But I'm guessing other MMOs get patches, maybe once every few months, and major content additions with expansions. The major difference with PSU is that the content is not locked, they actually create new content to be added with patches/expansions, and there's alot of content available right on release (unlike PSU).

Gameplay wise, it's more about strategy, less about action, but it can be kinda dull sometimes, in my opinion. Tried the FFXIV beta sometime ago, I think its gameplay was even more boring than Aion (mostly because of it being slower paced).

Replay value wise, some MMO's have PVP, which makes ppl want better gear, to be even stronger in PVP. There's also huge bosses, that require more strategy and huge groups to beat (and by huge groups I mean like...20+ players, maybe more).

[dias_flac_0g]

Ohh nice thank you for that info. So with an MMO you basically have the "whole" game at your disposal unlike psu that we have to wait for the things to get "unlocked". That sounds really nice actually. The reason why PSU's content is locked is because if they gaved it to us all at once i'm sure some of the hardcore players would be "maxed out" in about a month xD

So my guess now is that with an MMO like Aion there's much more to do than PSU as soon as you buy the game.

What's interesting to me though is the fact that you said that you got bored because there wasnt any new content. So you're basically telling me that there is infact an "end" where as I thought you can play "forever".

Lastly 20 players plus in one party? That sounds ****ing nutts xDDD

I did not know you can make parties of 20 players like that in an MMO.

Hahaha I cant picture 20 players in a PSU run xD

[Ezodagrom]

Ohh nice thank you for that info. So with an MMO you basically have the "whole" game at your disposal unlike psu that we have to wait for the things to get "unlocked". That sounds really nice actually. The reason why PSU's content is locked is because if they gaved it to us all at once i'm sure some of the hardcore players would be "maxed out" in about a month xD

So my guess now is that with an MMO like Aion there's much more to do than PSU as soon as you buy the game.

What's interesting to me though is the fact that you said that you got bored because there wasnt any new content. So you're basically telling me that there is infact an "end" where as I thought you can play "forever".

Lastly 20 players plus in one party? That sounds ****ing nutts xDDD

I did not know you can make parties of 20 players like that in an MMO.

Hahaha I cant picture 20 players in a PSU run xD
The 20+ player thingie, it's not really partys, in Aion I think it was Alliances. Basically it's having several partys joined, but each party is still a separate party. When partys are joined in an alliance, the members of each party can communicate with members from other partys of the alliance through the alliance chat.

About the lack of content, the biggest problem was leveling, which became too slow in the higher levels, and there wasn't nearly enough quests and instances at those levels. To level up players had to "grind" (randomly kill monsters in a certain area, I'm guessing this could be compared to doing White Beast over and over again, but with a more boring and repetitive gameplay).

[SolomonGrundy]

there is nothing more boring and repetetive than white beast. except whie beast with slowdown.

[dias_flac_0g]

Ahh I see so that's how the 20+ players works.

About it being hard to lvl up. That's actually a good thing IMO.

That's actually one of the problems with PSU is the fact that lvling up is soooo easy. I mean some players hit lvl caps in like 2 days!!

Also new players get to 180 in like 3 weeks or even less...xD

Being hard to lvl is actually a good thing because you ahve something to look foward too all the time.

I think in that respect PSO was better because lvling was sooo hard in that game. I have 4 chars (GC version) and my highest is 187 I could never get to 200 and this was in a period of over 2 years of playing it lol.

So it always felt like there was something to do. and that's just the jist of it.

Can you go into some detail about the world itself? Cuz like I said when I played WoW it seemd like the world kept going on forever. Like I could keep walking and walking and there was new areas back to back it was crazy. I'm assuming Aion is the same way?

[mll]

They're a very different experience really.
I quit PSU when the supplemental update was first announced (did that ever show up?) and tried a good few MMO's.
If your going to try one I'd recommend Warcraft, it might not be the best (its debatable) but it has a lot more content and a lot less bugs than every other mmo on the market (most are riddled with bugs and are a pretty frustrating experience).
Its also one of the few with a decent sized community (making forming raids and whatnot easier). Raids are 25 man content btw.
There's always something to do, it might be something pretty unimportant like the equivalent of getting a mikunas set was 2 years ago (maybe its easy now, wasn't really at the time).
But really it would take a year or two of playing regularly to run out of things to do with a class and the classes are genuinely different enough to make leveling a second one enjoyable. (As opposed to being a crap fF or FM or whatever the "good" melee class is these days).
Solo PvE (Player vs Enemy) is very static. You will just stand there trading blows because doing anything else is pointless (you can't circle behind enemies really).

PvP (Player v Player) is a lot more ... dynamic i suppose and would be more similar to a PSU style combat - theres a billion videos on youtube it'd be worth checking to see for yourself.
Combat is more fun than it looks, though I did love the combat system in PSU.
Also the first 20 levels are incredibly boring with every class in warcraft - it does get better though.
The world is huge

They can be quite "solo" but if you want the social aspect you can join a guild and every server has guilds with hundreds of members which you can keep in touch with at all times via a chat pane. They'll arange raids on a weekly basis and whatnot. It takes a long time to find a guild that will suit you and in my experience if they're advertising in game they're not worth joining (MMO players are jerks the vast majority of the time unfortunately, Warcraft players being a particularly bad example of them).
Check the server forums you'll get a better idea of what a guild is about (attitute and expectations) and don't get discouraged by a bad experience, it takes a while to find a guild that suits you - though it makes the game a lot more enjoyable when you do.

Its certainly worth trying.

[Ishia]

Quit at the announcement of the Supplemental update? Something irked you?

(We did get it mid-July by the way)

[mll]

Nah not really, I guess them announcing paid for missions. Updates even then were rare and there just wasn't much else that i wanted to do (nothing that i wouldn't have to wait months and months for)
Maybe im mixing up what it was called, was a while ago, it was when they announced you could upgrade your characters PA's and what not. (It can't possibly still be a 10 months away?)

EDIT: Reread your reply ... makes more sense - even sega aren't that bad.

[Ezodagrom]

Ahh I see so that's how the 20+ players works.

About it being hard to lvl up. That's actually a good thing IMO.

That's actually one of the problems with PSU is the fact that lvling up is soooo easy. I mean some players hit lvl caps in like 2 days!!

Also new players get to 180 in like 3 weeks or even less...xD

Being hard to lvl is actually a good thing because you ahve something to look foward too all the time.

I think in that respect PSO was better because lvling was sooo hard in that game. I have 4 chars (GC version) and my highest is 187 I could never get to 200 and this was in a period of over 2 years of playing it lol.

So it always felt like there was something to do. and that's just the jist of it.

Can you go into some detail about the world itself? Cuz like I said when I played WoW it seemd like the world kept going on forever. Like I could keep walking and walking and there was new areas back to back it was crazy. I'm assuming Aion is the same way?
About leveling in Aion, I would be okay with the leveling speed, if there was anything to do other than randomly kill monsters, or more than just 1 instance for the level I stopped playing (level 40, max was 50).

About the world in MMOs, I think most of them are like that, massive worlds, but I think World of Warcraft is possibly one of the largest ones.

[SolomonGrundy]

I don't think having a huge world is that big a deal. I'd rather have a smaller, world with a great experience, than a huge one with a mediocre experience.

[Tetsaru]

Technically, MMO by itself just means "Massively Multiplayer Online." Then, you just stick RPG (Role-Playing Game, not Rocket-Propelled Grenade, lol) onto the end. I think a lot of gamers tend to throw around the term "MMO" for games like WoW, FF11/14, etc., but MMO's don't have to specifically be RPG's. So far, FF11 is the only MMO I've really played; I intend to at least try FF14 later on, but I have not played WoW.

That said, PSU definitely does not classify as an MMO, simply because it just doesn't have a huge community anymore. Again, I blame this partially on the server splitting, although other games do it to an extent as well. On FF11, you could choose a specific server to play on upon creating your character, and then you had to stay on that server unless you paid a fee to move all of your data over. This tended to cause a lot of trouble for people who wanted to play together, but I believe people from all regions AND all consoles were able to play together, regardless of what server you chose.

FF11's world was MUCH larger than PSU's, and also featured a "return to the past" part of the storyline that gave you even more exploration. Out of the several months that I played, I probably only covered less than 1/5 of all the areas in the game. One of my friends who played FF11 and then got on PSU was highly disappointed because that, with 3 planets and the space station, there'd be tons of areas to explore like FF11's, when instead, they just consisted of lobbies, shops, and mission counters which led to the dungeon-crawling aspect. FF11 also had its own share of dungeons and similar areas, many of which were hard as balls to get through because you didn't always have a map, they were much larger, and monster spawns were MUCH less predictable and MUCH harder to deal with. In PSU, a monster would usually leave you alone if you left the general area in which it spawned; however, in FF11, monsters would chase you to the ends of the Earth and back (there was also a deep "aggro" system in which monsters could detect and turn their attention towards you) unless you either killed them (which for a lot of places was impossible to solo), someone else diverted their attention, or you zoned (exit an area and load into a new area), and if you died, you'd have to either warp back to the last Home Point you activated, or if you were lucky, get a White Mage or similar class to go out of their way to revive you. You could get an Auto-Raise buff, similar to PSU's Scape Dolls, but upon using it, it put you in a near-death amount of HP, and most enemies would still hold their aggression towards you and hit you again to kill you.

I could go on and on about both games, but I decided to stick with PSU at the time because most of the things in FF11 took FOREVER to do and relied heavily on group cooperation. As such, parties could take HOURS to form (we need a *insert specific class or role here*), only to do a few battles and someone end up having to leave, etc., and finding warps and other ways to get around wasn't always easy. Iirc, only Black/White Mages could cast certain warp/teleport spells, if they were a certain level AND had the spells, AND it was common for players to usually charge you in-game currency as a type of "compensation" for their services, otherwise you had to use certain items (I remember one was a Halloween event item that you couldn't trade for or buy and could only use once every 24 hours) or do a quest to be able to rent Chocobos (mounts), which basically increased your on-foot speed and couldn't go into certain areas and only lasted for so long before they would ditch you and run off on their own, although they lasted a while and you could easily trek across several maps if you knew where you were going. From what I've learned about FF14 though, a lot of these issues have supposedly been resolved: quests and missions to level up take much less time to do and are solo-able, warping around is much easier, more character customization, etc... I'm not sure how party play works yet. Once I get a chance to play FF14, I'm pretty sure I'll be posting about it somewhere on these forums. :)

[Professor Xavier]

The PSU killer question. I have played PSU since the third week of release. I quit for 10 months or something like that. I am back and loving almost every minute of it.

With all that said. I have looked far and wide. I have found one game "Which I will not mention here" that is similar. It was released. But alass its not in english. And for me at least I have not done the painful work around with steap learning curves that come with such a process. Many here could speak of what I talk about. Some of you made it to the JP version of PSU and continue to play. I will not mention this other game until it evolves. It still has a long way to go. I do not believe it to be a PSU killer either. Maybe just only something similar in gameplay only. I have vastly searched the internet. There is nothing else like this game anywhere.

You may have read my other threads. "All JP RPG's (worldwide release with loose translations) Proposal" and the "Close the sever mentality" More to the point. There is no comparison for PSU to other MMO's the only comparison that is valid and fair would be to other Phantasy Star games. PSO,PSP2 etc. There is no cure of fix for PSU or any other phantasy Star game for that matter. Other than being a billionare and buying the franchise from SEGA and paying to make your own perfect Phantasy Star game.

Phantasy Star is unique in all the world. It has no equal! It has no rival!

There is only one!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HqqNOqEhC0s

[Crazyleo]

I normally don't read any of the threads for PSU (currently playing PSP:2), however trying to compare PSO or PSU to an MMO is like comparing apples to oranges. If anything, the actual game play is more comparable to say Diablo 2 than say WoW or City of Heroes. (My favorite MMO of all time).

The reason why I say that is that the party size is quite small (Mind you, I've only played PSU off line), where as the largest number any "one" group is around 8. And off course there are events that needs more than one group in order to complete.


I was searching this forum for the story outline for Ambition of the Illuminous. ^^

[Ishia]

I like PSU than other online game.

Your signature is fabulous.

[bloodflowers]

As soon as I saw the topic, I knew the 'PSU is not a MMO' trolls would come oozing from under their rocks.

[Ezodagrom]

As soon as I saw the topic, I knew the 'PSU is not a MMO' trolls would come oozing from under their rocks.
Trolls? Then could you explain what makes PSU a MMO?
I can say why I don't consider PSU a MMO, it lacks a massive world.
I think the best way to classify PSU would be Multiplayer Online Action RPG, not MMORPG (Massively Multiplayer Online RPG).

[Ishia]

Do you hear the site from other players?

Oh yes, I did. I'm curious though, what other players have used these sites on PSU? I need to find a new crowd to join in. Perhaps you could PM me their names?

[BIG OLAF]

As soon as I saw the topic, I knew the 'PSU is not a MMO' trolls would come oozing from under their rocks.

Well, PSU isn't an MMORPG. Taken from the Wikipedia article for MMORPGs:

[SPOILER-BOX]MMORPGs are distinguished from single-player or small multi-player RPGs by the number of players[/SPOILER-BOX]

PSU doesn't have nearly enough players to signify it as a Massively Multiplayer Online Role-Playing Game. PSU is just a ORPG; cut out the MM part. A few thousand players is by no means massive compared to a game like WoW, with it's millions.

So, I fail to see how anyone here is trolling.

[xBladeM6x]

Personally, what I like about PSU is that it is a dungeon crawler. I can't fucking stand the "open" and "massive" 20+ player battles. :l PSU is more disguised as an MMO. Due to the fact that when in lobbies, you can see hundreds of players at a single time. However the fighting aspect is more squad or mission based. Again, it's this aspect that gives the PSO/U franchise it's identity, and I wouldn't want them to become "massive" like most PC MMORPGs.

TL;DR Version: Changing the formula from ORPG -> MMORPG would kill what the series is and make it every bit as generic as the PC MMORPGs.