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lostbylove
Apr 28, 2011, 01:11 PM
PSO2 must have MAGs, if not the game will crash and burn!!
Photon Blast for the win.

Please leave comments about MAGs.

Support the MAGS!!! they supported you in PSO, its your turn.

Make those developer team get the MAGs in PSO2.

I need a buddy that revives me from death, and make me undestructable.

SS_Death
Apr 28, 2011, 01:13 PM
I vote yes for MAGs!

SephirothXer0
Apr 28, 2011, 01:20 PM
Bring Diwari back and its a deal

Vashyron
Apr 28, 2011, 01:26 PM
So MAGs are a game breaker for you?

I want them back, but not overpowered as PSO where you could just throw them onto a LV 1 character. I liked the idea someone came up with that you'd at least need to be half their level to equip.

Though realistically I think they may just end up being Ranger/Force Weapons.

NoiseHERO
Apr 28, 2011, 01:27 PM
I'm sure they won't forget your mags...:0

Or my *sniff* customization.

Though I hope they make the mag system a little more interesting, only being the alpha I wouldn't be surprised if they were still working on it.

I ignored them in PSO though when you're 11 year olds little floating things turning into giant summons were pretty cool. But in PSZ I found em to be really boring...

eclipsXe
Apr 28, 2011, 01:27 PM
I want them, but not too crazy if they show up or not.

r00tabaga
Apr 28, 2011, 01:41 PM
MAG's = yes
element based weapons = no (and from the video it appears they are gone!)
"non-armor" attire = no
I'm all about customization, but I will not play with anyone running around in a Rappy suit, bath towel, bikini, fur coat, space jeans or hoodie.

Palle
Apr 28, 2011, 01:59 PM
MAG's = yes
element based weapons = no (and from the video it appears they are gone!)
"non-armor" attire = no
I'm all about customization, but I will not play with anyone running around in a Rappy suit, bath towel, bikini, fur coat, space jeans or hoodie.
I'd be for all the gag-reel outfits if defensive statistics were derived from equipped clothing. Bath Towel = DEF + 0, EVA -20, for example.

As for MAGs, I'd like for them to be an integrated element of the suit, like a Unit, perhaps. Give them a greater variety of bonuses, like jewels in MonHan.

Just a thought.

OdinTyler
Apr 28, 2011, 02:04 PM
God...MAGs...endless weeks trying to figure out the best MAG for player class combo.

Bring it on! :P

NoiseHERO
Apr 28, 2011, 02:06 PM
MAG's = yes
element based weapons = no (and from the video it appears they are gone!)
"non-armor" attire = no
I'm all about customization, but I will not play with anyone running around in a Rappy suit, bath towel, bikini, fur coat, space jeans or hoodie.

We had this conversation like 5 times... just let people dress as stupid as they want D:

t3hVeG
Apr 28, 2011, 02:07 PM
I never liked the MAG system in PSO, I'd rather they stick with the whole R-Mag/Tech-Mag setup instead. Personal preference of course.

Corey Blue
Apr 28, 2011, 03:22 PM
If they can do something new and better,that would be nice.

Kaziel
Apr 28, 2011, 03:26 PM
As long as they give a reason for mags not showing up in PSO2, I don't really care.

I'm hoping PSO2 to follow the lore of PSO.

Key word there is "hoping."

"En"
Apr 28, 2011, 03:32 PM
Personally, I'd like to see Mags return in PSO2, but I agree that there should be some way of preventing a low level from obtaining a high level mag. Sticking a max level mag on a Lv1 character and watching your level skyrocket to 80 was a bit silly. The developers could just bar mags from being moved off the character in question, and make evolution management easier. I was never too fond of the idea of selling / trading mags, and this would allow players to still build their stats up by focusing on their mag. Something I'm all too familar with, from my earliest days of PSO.

Aestetically pleasing, and providing variance in character builds... Mags were truly a deep part of gameplay in PSO.

Corey Blue
Apr 28, 2011, 03:33 PM
If they can make then better then yeah,I don't mind at all.It's better then the maid robot's and butlers imo.

NoiseHERO
Apr 28, 2011, 03:46 PM
If these aren't the same people from PSO (regardless of that arks-arkz stuff)

Then I can see why only PSZ and PSO had mags...story wise...

Of course this game could be connected to PSZ as well, seeing as how it has that whole "LEAVE HOME PLANET AND TRAVEL THE GALAXY" story.

Corey Blue
Apr 28, 2011, 03:58 PM
Saving the galaxy..like a boss.

r00tabaga
Apr 28, 2011, 04:12 PM
PM devices......yuck! Robot maids & robot butlers are right up there with bikini armor & "everything has to be a elemental weapon". There were 100 good things that came from PSU & PSP but those 3 killed it for me.
That and those crystal-block-area thingy's. I miss people asking what color pipe to take.

NoiseHERO
Apr 28, 2011, 04:20 PM
I hope this game has more bikinis and swim suits DOA style even.

Corey Blue
Apr 28, 2011, 04:22 PM
I hope this game has more bikinis and swim suits DOA style even.

They gotta be space bikini's. @R00t Oh GOD,I want that back..

NoiseHERO
Apr 28, 2011, 04:26 PM
ryuker > your noob pipes

Immovable One
Apr 28, 2011, 04:28 PM
I want MAGs that transform into a power suit that lets you massacre your enemies, or fly and shoot like Gundam Funnels, or form a barricade shield to protect you from harm.

zombiemoshpit84
Apr 28, 2011, 04:33 PM
i just want to be able to farm, feed, evolve, trade, and pick the color of my mag. i do NOT want them to be weapons, i do NOT want them to be units. they worked out great in PSO lets not ruin em with gimmicks. just bring em back.

Neith
Apr 28, 2011, 04:55 PM
I hated MAGs in PSO; they were just time consuming to raise. Standing in the shop feeding every few minutes was boring as hell, and if you did it mid-mission you constantly had to pipe back for mag food.

I'm also not fond of making a character really strong by gear alone, so i'd rather not see MAGs come back or if they do I hope they're not as irritating to raise.

Part of me thinks PSO2 was a bad name to choose; all a lot of people want is PSO with current-gen graphics. As much as PSU sucked, PSP2/PSP2 Infinity did a lot for the series, so I'd like to see features from those implemented, rather than simply rehashing ideas from PSO. Base it loosely on PSO, sure, but don't just copy it- if I want to play a great game like PSO, I'd play...PSO. I'm hoping for more new innovations in PSO2 personally.

Shinji Kazuya
Apr 28, 2011, 05:08 PM
I too would like to see the MAGs make a comeback. If they don't I'll just live with it, nothing major.

Soul Guardian
Apr 28, 2011, 05:10 PM
If they bring back MAGs, they better bring back Rati or..uh..well they just better!

While MAGs are far easier to abuse for leveling characters, personally I'd much rather see them return than partner machines.

Ffuzzy-Logik
Apr 28, 2011, 06:26 PM
MAG's = yes
element based weapons = no (and from the video it appears they are gone!)
"non-armor" attire = no
I'm all about customization, but I will not play with anyone running around in a Rappy suit, bath towel, bikini, fur coat, space jeans or hoodie.Please, tell us more about how the clothing choices of other players is enough to ruin the game for you.

Shinji Kazuya
Apr 28, 2011, 06:30 PM
That's what they say. They would play the game with naked characters if they could. If they are seriously saying that then they won't play it 'cause the game will have those kind of outfits or Mr. Sakai is sick.

Ffuzzy-Logik
Apr 28, 2011, 06:32 PM
I mean, I think the amount of cheesecake is stupid and I do not get the weird Japanese perversion at all, but I don't give a shit about what other people in the party are wearing.

It's just really, really, inconceivably stupid to let something like that bother you.

Shinji Kazuya
Apr 28, 2011, 06:41 PM
I mean, I think the amount of cheesecake is stupid and I do not get the weird Japanese perversion at all, but I don't give a shit about what other people in the party are wearing.

It's just really, really, incinceivably stupid to let something like that bother you.

Awesomely well said. I will never understand why they rage 'cause of stuff like that.

Kyrith_Ranger_Pso
Apr 28, 2011, 06:41 PM
I hated MAGs in PSO; they were just time consuming to raise. Standing in the shop feeding every few minutes was boring as hell, and if you did it mid-mission you constantly had to pipe back for mag food.





what's wrong with piping back for food, and you didn't have to just sit in shops, i only did that because i enjoyed talking to people sometimes.

Ark22
Apr 28, 2011, 06:42 PM
I don't rage. I just put what I see in life and compare it to this...And seeing what people wear in real life..I really don't care xD

•Col•
Apr 28, 2011, 07:19 PM
I can understand why people don't like the ridiculous outfits... It ruins the atmosphere of the game. Well, it didn't for PSU, because the atmosphere in that game was "LOL lets got kill stuff guyz!!! d(^.^)b"

Imagine if in PSO everyone was running around in bikinis...... Would not be the same at all.

Ffuzzy-Logik
Apr 28, 2011, 07:26 PM
I can understand why people don't like the ridiculous outfits... It ruins the atmosphere of the game. Well, it didn't for PSU, because the atmosphere in that game was "LOL lets got kill stuff guyz!!! d(^.^)b"
That was also the atmosphere of PSO.

ShadowDragon28
Apr 28, 2011, 07:52 PM
They better have MAGs... how the heck can you have a true sequel to PSO without MAGs? Without those, "PSO 2" just would be really missing a big part of what makes a PSO game PSO. :(

I pray they bring back the mags, especially Tapas, Rati, Dewali, Sato, Opa-Opa, and others... I miss my hand-raised, so awesome Rati with the three most effective/awesome PB's :(

•Col•
Apr 28, 2011, 10:08 PM
That was also the atmosphere of PSO.

PSO and PSU had vastly different atmospheres.... I was perfectly fine with PSU's but yeah, the number of guys running around in thongs truly was disheartening.

HyperShot-X-
Apr 28, 2011, 10:21 PM
bringing back the old MAG system as was without well thought-out development for deeper mechanics and enhancements/variety might be way too one-dimensional if not done right.

MAGs in old PSO were used as:
-customizable stat boosting companion
-photon blast unit
-fashion item

then the system has evolved in PSU as:
-partner machine for synthing weps n armors that can be raised up as NPC ally in combat
-Tech Mags and Range Mags used as actual weps
-SUVs, nano-blasts, mirage-blasts
-classes and job types each with variable stats
-player shop cashier bot maid..

it'd be great to have new MAG system on PSO2 to be more like simplified but also evolved and upgraded while retaining all the necessary functionalities.

Itoshi
Apr 28, 2011, 10:40 PM
That was also the atmosphere of PSO.

Userbase atmosphere maybe. The userbase atmosphere of a game is always the bare bones of the atmosphere the creators tried to make. Example, you don't see anyone really getting engulfed in the lore and world of World of Warcraft anymore. Most people are like "Let's go kill some bosses and get some epic rarez".

PSO's atmosphere was pretty bleak, as described by its storytelling. It may not have been the best storytelling, but I'm sure you could tell when you played it that the Pioneer Citizens and Hunters were fighting a threat they had never seen and they really had no idea what was coming. They also lost two of their greatest heroes to this threat, not to mention the corruption within the Pioneer government that is shown throughout all the Episodes of the game.

PSU was a lot different though. They tried to hint at the corruption and such but it was told even worse than PSO. Instead it was "Let's go save the world guys!! YEAH!!!". The SEED was a pretty barebones threat when you think about it. But most of the "Dark Forces", save for maybe the original, were pretty barebones, besides Dark Falz and Olga Flow.

Corey Blue
Apr 28, 2011, 10:50 PM
That was also the atmosphere of PSO.

Hell no lmao PSO had a away better atmosphere then PSU,unless your just living up to you title again,I cant take that comment seriously.^^; (and yeah all of the dudes running around in thong's were kinda..lame.)

Skye-Fox713
Apr 28, 2011, 10:54 PM
Bring Diwari back and its a deal

YES, its a very big deal indeed. Diwari must be included.

Kent
Apr 29, 2011, 12:51 AM
I rather liked the way MAGs worked in PSO, for the most part. You had to vent resources into raising them to give yourself boosts under certain circumstances, Photon Blasts, and the ever-important stat boosts. I felt they were a pretty creative solution to the idea of giving players a means of customizing their characters' stats.

The problem, of course, comes with the fact that you can give them to other players, for any reason at all. Probably the easiest solution would be to bind all MAGs to the character that feeds them. As for stat bonus caps... Yes, something there is necessary, like limiting the potential amount a MAG can benefit its owner's stats, even if you raise it higher than that.

Of course, they could also do away with MAGs entirely, but those things give a distinct PSO flavor in the first place... There's not really a reason to get rid of them, either way.

Recron
Apr 29, 2011, 01:22 AM
I absolutely loved the MAG system, I would often take out a good chunk of time just to raise them. They have to come back.

Ffuzzy-Logik
Apr 29, 2011, 06:15 AM
Userbase atmosphere maybe. The userbase atmosphere of a game is always the bare bones of the atmosphere the creators tried to make. Example, you don't see anyone really getting engulfed in the lore and world of World of Warcraft anymore. Most people are like "Let's go kill some bosses and get some epic rarez".Anyone who gave a shit about PSO's barely-existent story is really way too easily amused.

The areas had nicer atmosphere, yes, but it wouldn't have ruined my immersion to see characters in bikinis.

Blueblur
Apr 29, 2011, 06:47 AM
Anyone who gave a shit about PSO's barely-existent story is really way too easily amused.

The areas had nicer atmosphere, yes, but it wouldn't have ruined my immersion to see characters in bikinis.

I disagree. The little story there was in the game was vague and mysterious; the environments atmosphere lent themselves to the mystery and really sucked me into the world. I was engaged in the lore and very much immersed in the game world because every element of the game was cohesive. If there were player characters running around in bikinis or other ridiculous costumes, it would break the illusion for me. I'd feel less like I'm adventuring in an alien world and more like I'm sitting front of a screen playing a video game.

But hey, maybe that's just me.

Niloklives
Apr 29, 2011, 07:45 AM
The general atmosphere of the game when playing with other people was totally different from when soloing. when soloing you could sit and take it in and there was grim, twisted feel to it. when you were playing with others you were too busy beating on things or running away to notice. in this sense, I agree with Ffuzzy: for the bulk of the game it was "lets murder and get shinies!" and in the end you're not looking at anyone long enough to care what they look like either way.

I think comparing the "atmospheres" of PSO and PSU is ridiculous anyway. The images they tried to sell were different, but that's not even aesthetics, that's just the theme. and if you're that concerned with the themes in a game that has almost no story to it at all and basically a multiplayer dungeon crawl...enjoy.

Anyway on the subject of mags: I used to raise mags for fun all the the time. I'd sit there on the GCN version and calculate exactly how many mats and what to raise my mag to in order to optimize my stats. I'd do it all again, but as far as "keep PSU out of my PSO" though, PSU and the PSP series brought a lot of good things to the table, and a good chunk of them seem to be getting implemented and improved upon. I'm all for making things better and adding things in. I just want it done right.

Seth Astra
Apr 29, 2011, 07:56 AM
I would enjoy mags, for sure. Including various rare forms, a large variety of PBs, and special effects based on the mag (not that nature crap from PSZ). I'd also like to see a large number of branching evolutions. And new special effects, not just support techs. For example, a mag could randomly gain a certain number of shots and automatically fire at enemies in range. Or, when the player's HP is low, it could unleash an AOE blast that knocks enemies back, giving the player a second or two to heal.

I also agree with kent on mag binding. I'd say something along the lines of binding when the mag first evolves. That way you could start a mag on another character, but you'd have to do most of the raising on the character that uses it.

Vashyron
Apr 29, 2011, 08:15 AM
Anyone who gave a shit about PSO's barely-existent story is really way too easily amused.

The areas had nicer atmosphere, yes, but it wouldn't have ruined my immersion to see characters in bikinis.


Sure it does, imagine a ruins like area trying to set a "dark" atmosphere, then suddenly your party was filled with just even 1 or 2 people in bikinis smacking the crap out of everything.

Atmosphere gone for me, it's gone from "dark" to comical.

Niloklives
Apr 29, 2011, 08:15 AM
I would enjoy mags, for sure. Including various rare forms, a large variety of PBs, and special effects based on the mag (not that nature crap from PSZ). I'd also like to see a large number of branching evolutions. And new special effects, not just support techs. For example, a mag could randomly gain a certain number of shots and automatically fire at enemies in range. Or, when the player's HP is low, it could unleash an AOE blast that knocks enemies back, giving the player a second or two to heal.

I also agree with kent on mag binding. I'd say something along the lines of binding when the mag first evolves. That way you could start a mag on another character, but you'd have to do most of the raising on the character that uses it.

You could do some kind of imprinting, like with animals. so that the mag was character bound due to it's personality or encryption or whatever you wanted to call it.

In the very least make it so transferring had severe consequences for the mag - like all stats/lvl cut in half, evolution regressed to match its level (evolution can remain for rare mags) and sync/intelligence zeroed out. At that point you would have to raise the mag's sync to 100 to be able to raise its other stats again. plus make it account bound so this all happened once another character than its owner pulled it out of a common box(with a confirmation screen showing you the effects of the withdrawal.) This way, you could raise a mag for an alt and give them an early boost, but still have a crippled mag that didn't totally break them. plus they would have to feed the mag a bunch just to start lvling it up again. So your new character would get that early nudge but would then have to spend a good amount of time making up for the initial time saver.

doubleEXP
Apr 29, 2011, 08:21 AM
Another vote of YES for MAGS!

For old school, original mags I always loved my trusty Varaha.

Then in GC I had 5 or 6 Sato's.

Oh, and Soniti, and Rati, and the little angel one I got in JP GC PSO (Pian?), and a ton of others.

Heck I even liked Madhu on my RAmar, the one that looked sort of like a floating backpack, lol.

MAGS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Pillan
Apr 29, 2011, 08:48 AM
I am obviously against any item that can easily make a level 1 FOnewearl as powerful as a level 40 HUcast (that is with just a 150 Pow MAG, which is quite easy to make/acquire and still gain enough accuracy afterward).

But reducing it to the point that it is negligible or takes up a weapon slot so that Mag users pay for their higher stats at the cost of a better two hand weapon (essentially making one hand weapons as powerful as two hand), I could certainly support their return.

r00tabaga
Apr 29, 2011, 08:58 AM
Part of the fun of PSO was building a character with the help of loaded MAG. You raised it, why should you not be able to share it with your lower characters?

Neith
Apr 29, 2011, 02:56 PM
what's wrong with piping back for food, and you didn't have to just sit in shops, i only did that because i enjoyed talking to people sometimes.

It wastes time you could be spending doing something more interesting. I'd rather have MAGs approached in a different way in regards to leveling, anything other than sitting there doing nothing for a couple of hours / constantly piping back for more supplies.

Hrith
Apr 29, 2011, 02:58 PM
I minded that MAGS unbalanced the game so much.

If people like them so much, visually, they can add them as accessories, as long as they do not affect stats (more than accessories are supposed to).

moorebounce
Apr 29, 2011, 11:47 PM
I would like them back but they have to make it where you don't accidently set off your Photon Blasts like in PSO EP 1,2 and 4. I really hated setting it off when you're trying to take your mates, fluids and casting a technique.

Kimil Adrayne
Apr 29, 2011, 11:54 PM
I minded that MAGS unbalanced the game so much.

If people like them so much, visually, they can add them as accessories, as long as they do not affect stats (more than accessories are supposed to).

Easiest fix ever: Put level restrictions on equiping mags. ie.: Make it so you can't equip a mag that's more than 10 levels or so higher than you.

Problem Solved

Chaobo99
Apr 29, 2011, 11:56 PM
Maybe your mag should just be an extra storage space that flies with you ^_^

moorebounce
Apr 30, 2011, 12:10 AM
I minded that MAGS unbalanced the game so much.

If people like them so much, visually, they can add them as accessories, as long as they do not affect stats (more than accessories are supposed to).

It was part of the game. So how do you figure it was unbalanced? It only seemed unbalanced to people who didn't know how to raise and mold them into something that could help you. There are countless guides telling you how to raise a mag you wanted. Part of the fun of PSO was trying to raise a mag that could help your character. It actually enhanced your experience in PSO.

Hrith
Apr 30, 2011, 06:50 AM
Easiest fix ever: Put level restrictions on equiping mags. ie.: Make it so you can't equip a mag that's more than 10 levels or so higher than you.So you would have to be Lv190 to equip a Lv200 mag? That does not seem to 'fix' anything =/

Niloklives
Apr 30, 2011, 07:23 AM
I still think if you raised the mag yourself, there's no harm in giving something to an alt to turbo charge them a little as long as it doesn't let them solo maps with enemies 20 levels higher than them in 10 minutes.

I think something that makes them account bound and get a partial reset like cut their level and stats in half or something when they are given to a different character on the account would be ok.

It was pretty ridiculous though. a fully raised mag given to a character let them learn techs way too early, AND increased their TP AND let them equip better MST related gear.

same with a high ATP mag. you were killing stuff faster than it could spawn.

to make matters worse there was some weird math to how PB was gained so if you were lower level, you gained it faster...yeah overkill.

find a way to scale it back a bit and I see nothing wrong with it.

Wutmog
Apr 30, 2011, 09:01 AM
It was part of the game. So how do you figure it was unbalanced?

Huh? How about starting a Lv1 character with a Lv200 MAG equipped?

Ffuzzy-Logik
Apr 30, 2011, 09:20 AM
So you would have to be Lv190 to equip a Lv200 mag? That does not seem to 'fix' anything =/My solution is the best: level requirement equal to half the mag's level.

Niloklives
Apr 30, 2011, 09:26 AM
Or just scale the mag down according to level

Ffuzzy-Logik
Apr 30, 2011, 09:27 AM
That would work too, but there'd be more issues with it (namely, the data would have to store the exact state of that mag at every level, so it could downscale stats, form, and blasts correctly).

Niloklives
Apr 30, 2011, 09:32 AM
that's not too hard...the levels don't have to be exact. just have a simple algorithm to scale it back in proportion to real levels. saving the forms and the blasts would almost be in tandem since all you have do to is have it check for the blast again at evolution points.

Kimil Adrayne
Apr 30, 2011, 10:57 AM
The "10 levels or so" was just an example, the point is changing the game so lowbies couldn't use a maxed out mag from the get go.

Also, what would be the issue with not being able to use a maxed mag till late in the game? Why should you be able to use high level gear early at all?

Niloklives
Apr 30, 2011, 11:05 AM
near lvl 200 is pretty extreme. by then, with the way the numbers have worked recently, the mag wouldn't mean as much

Kimil Adrayne
Apr 30, 2011, 11:08 AM
In terms of how things have worked in PSU (15* weaps equipable around lvl 150) and PSO, it would be a bit much.

This is a new game though, right? And this is harmless speculation... and there's no evidence of MAGs yet at all.

Ffuzzy-Logik
Apr 30, 2011, 11:10 AM
Also, what would be the issue with not being able to use a maxed mag till late in the game? Why should you be able to use high level gear early at all?Well, assuming the leveling curve works the same way it did in PSO or similarly, getting to 100 is easy and everyone can do it relatively quickly. Getting to 200 (or even 190), though, is something that takes absolutely forever and few people will ever do. At that point, the benefits of a few mag levels are completely inconsequential. It just makes more sense to do something like half the mag's level.

Kimil Adrayne
Apr 30, 2011, 11:16 AM
Yeah, that does make sense in terms of how things have gone in the last two games. Just have to see how this one goes.

r00tabaga
Apr 30, 2011, 01:28 PM
I mean, I think the amount of cheesecake is stupid and I do not get the weird Japanese perversion at all, but I don't give a shit about what other people in the party are wearing.

It's just really, really, inconceivably stupid to let something like that bother you.

Would you play Halo in a baseball outfit? I mean, you guys are making a big deal about PSO "atmosphere" vs PSU "atmosphere" and I'm sorry but seeing naked party members KINDA effects my game experience and changes the overall atmosphere IMO. C'mon, it really doesn't bother you? You must be towel wearer yourself! I would just politely leave your party and find more SERIOUS players.

Ffuzzy-Logik
Apr 30, 2011, 01:42 PM
Would you play HaloNope.

C'mon, it really doesn't bother you?Nope. I think a lot of the clothes looked stupid, but I never cared that someone else liked them.

You must be towel werarer yourself!Nope.

SERIOUS players.It's a video game on the Internet. Anyone taking it seriously needs to reevaluate their priorities.

Wayu
Apr 30, 2011, 01:49 PM
^

Hardliner?

-Wayu

Ffuzzy-Logik
Apr 30, 2011, 01:57 PM
Hard Line is a crappy line shield. I used mostly Storm Lines and Orpa-senbas. Maybe a Shinowa Line too, I forget.

Wayu
Apr 30, 2011, 01:59 PM
How about going risky with the De Colte?

-Wayu

Ffuzzy-Logik
Apr 30, 2011, 02:00 PM
Ok, I think we can end the joke here.

Wayu
Apr 30, 2011, 02:03 PM
I think so as well.

Back on topic.

-Wayu

Orange_Coconut
Apr 30, 2011, 02:07 PM
I don't know, I thought that the silly costumes really showed the odd sense of humor that SEGA has come out with in their other games. I mean, in PSO a good number of the special MAGs were silly (like a floating genesis, robochao, puyo, chu chu, or the dreamcast MAG for heaven's sake).

I never thought of PSO as serious business and I don't think I ever will. Half of the weapons were ridiculous too! I remember wanting a medic bag from the Easter Event, or even the armor that shot off chu chus or hearts.

So, I don't see why having costumes is such a big deal. There has always been a lack of seriousness with the online Phantasy Star games and that's part of the reason why I enjoy it so. The biggest difference for comparison here is that in PSO there was really little/no costume configuration because whatever you chose was a preset color scheme and style and there was little to no variation.

I never took PSO seriously in the aesthetic style. I enjoyed what it offered and I enjoyed playing the game. If something about the style is bothersome to someone, then it's fine to feel that way. But I think it's the wrong assumption to judge people who like certain things that are already a part of the game. Like it or not, SEGA has these things in their games and it's really only a cosmetic change anyway.

If the appearance of characters turns someone off from a game then they're not really giving it a chance, but I do understand that visuals tend to be the first thing that people judge because it's right there without having to do anything. There are no mechanics behind aesthetics in terms of gameplay, so one can just say "Wow that's cool," or "Wow that's awful," or just not even care and move on with their game.

Ffuzzy-Logik
Apr 30, 2011, 02:11 PM
I don't know, I thought that the silly costumes really showed the odd sense of humor that SEGA has come out with in their other games. I mean, in PSO a good number of the special MAGs were silly (like a floating genesis, robochao, puyo, chu chu, or the dreamcast MAG for heaven's sake). How dare you list all those without mentioning the best mag in all PSO.

I am, of course, speaking of the Hamburger.

Orange_Coconut
Apr 30, 2011, 02:12 PM
It's funny that you mention that because it was originally going to be my only example. I guess I just decided against it. XP

AztecZombie813
Apr 30, 2011, 02:15 PM
yes 4 mags

Vashyron
Apr 30, 2011, 02:16 PM
Nope.
Nope. I think a lot of the clothes looked stupid, but I never cared that someone else liked them.
Nope.
It's a video game on the Internet. Anyone taking it seriously needs to reevaluate their priorities.

Maybe I'm wrong and people would like to see rotting realistic flesh in a Mario game for once.

No really, if the game is building up the atmosphere one way and sells it like that, but then suddenly has something put in that can completely throw it out of the window of course people are gonna get pissed off, probably not enough to quit the game of course though, but annoying.

r00tabaga
Apr 30, 2011, 02:17 PM
I loved letting my other charaters share my Rati's! I think that trading rare MAG's to other users should be limited or negated all together but as long as MAG's are in PSO2, anything they decide to do w/them is ok by me! Just pleez no PM devices!!!!!!!!!!!

Ffuzzy-Logik
Apr 30, 2011, 02:19 PM
No, I mean, I understand the position, I just don't see how it really applies to this series.

Phantasy Star is a series best defined as an anime space opera RPG. I don't really see the distinctly Japanese/anime styled cheesecake costume stuff as going against the overall atmosphere of the games in any way, even if I do think it looks dumb.

I loved letting my other charaters share my Rati's! I think that trading rare MAG's to other usres should be limited or negated all together but as long as there in PSO2, anything they decide to do w/them is ok by me! Just pleez no PM devices!!!!!!!!!!!There's nothing wrong with letting you share mags between characters or trade them with other players, as long as there are limits in place to prevent high level mags from overpowering low level characters.


Also, PM devices served the same purpose as mag cells, so I'm not really sure what you're saying there.

r00tabaga
Apr 30, 2011, 02:29 PM
It's a video game on the Internet. Anyone taking it seriously needs to reevaluate their priorities.

It's a videogame that costs real money to purchase and probably a hunter's license too, again with real money, so yeah, I guess I do take it more seriously than you. It is my favorite gaming franchise of all time! I want my female hunters to actually look like they could kill something. PSO needs fantasy/sci-fi type armor & clothing or it's not PSO!

BTW, I don't miss elemental line shields either! FAIL

r00tabaga
Apr 30, 2011, 02:35 PM
PMs were the dumbest move of all. MAG's are better in every way. Farming them was 1/2 the fun too. I used to hook friends up all the time with power MAG's or whatever. Besides PM's looking really dumb (space butlers & robot maids.....REALLY SEGA?) they didn't have the awesome look of floating around w/you. Watching MAG's evolve was pretty sweet too. I don't have any issues with people who liked PM's b/c there are plenty who do, I just hated them.

Ffuzzy-Logik
Apr 30, 2011, 02:39 PM
So you're talking about PMs themselves, not PM devices, which were items that altered the appearance of your PM. You really should be more clear.


About your other point, again, the fanservice cheesecake outfit shit isn't something that's new to the series. It's pretty much a defining aspect of the JRPG genre. Go back and look at some of the shit Nei and Rika wore.

NoiseHERO
Apr 30, 2011, 02:39 PM
Only thing that made PM devices stupid, was them turning ONLY into little girls other than the shota and the two other only cool ones, synthesis was all kinds of messed up, and they functioned as NPC's with BAD AI.

Otherwise it was just MAGS with more uses and no nanoblasts.

edit:That's the only anti-ecchi fanservice thing I can agree on with you guys...that I'd rather have the choice of having a medabot or mini gundam or something, instead of a walking pocket pu- I mean...instead of piece of robotic jailbait. But I'd still rather it be a choice than non-existent for the people that liked it.

r00tabaga
Apr 30, 2011, 02:43 PM
The blue dragon PM was pretty cool, I'm not gonna lie. It was just so God damn weird having him fight with me! A MAG version of him in PSO2 would be epic. :)

Niloklives
Apr 30, 2011, 02:43 PM
no what made PMs stupid was typing "PMs" when talking and having it come up censored.

Ffuzzy-Logik
Apr 30, 2011, 02:49 PM
Saturday basement shoes.

NoiseHERO
Apr 30, 2011, 02:52 PM
osama bin-laden was censored too...

Ffuzzy-Logik
Apr 30, 2011, 02:53 PM
You know what else was censored in PSU?

Assgoblin.

Tetsaru
Apr 30, 2011, 03:04 PM
PSO2 just wouldn't be complete without MAG's. They have to bring them back, in all their customizable, evolving, Photon Blasting glory.

As far as balance goes, if they make both the characters' and MAGs' levels both have the same cap (Lv. 200 in PSO), then I say simply make it to where you can't equip a MAG whose level is higher than your own, and its growth would cap out if you tried to raise it to a level higher than your own. I think this would also eliminate only being able to feed it 3 items at a time and then having to wait for a few minutes until you could feed it again, as it would prevent low-level characters with a ton of money from making themselves overpowered. At the same time, if someone DID want to level their MAG in a hurry, they could just give it to a high-level character and do it that way, provided the MAG wouldn't evolve in a certain way (if they bring back Section ID's and the evolution traits associated with them and character classes), but they still wouldn't be able to use it until they reached the same level themselves. Then again, considering how much meseta might be involved in funding "MAG food," I wouldn't mind reverting back to the old methods of leveling MAG's, as one would probably just not have the proper funds starting out. Of course, that would all depend on how easily meseta would be to obtain.

Also, along with the old MAG's like Sato, Diwari, Pushan, etc., I think it would be awesome if you could actually design your own MAG somehow, as well as customize what stats it would boost. Things such as putting together a bunch of small preset parts (think Kingdom Heart 2's Gummi Ships, with some parts being rare drops), changing colors, adding your own decals, the works. You could even choose which attacks or moves to give it, so it could fight alongside you like how PSU's Partner Machines did, although hopefully with much better AI, and then save it for mass production. Then, people would be like, "ZOMG Tets, what kind of MAG is that!?" :o and then I could say, "Lololol, bitch, I made this MAG. :razz: It can fire Shoop-Da-Woop Heaven's Punisher beams as its normal attack. :D But I could trade it to ya for that nice Guld & Milla you have there. 8) It's ok, I've got a schematic saved of it so I can make another one when I get the parts." Hell, guilds could have their own MAG's if they wanted to this way, or a person could simply just have his or her very own unique MAG that's different from everyone else's. Wouldn't that be cool? Of course, Sega would never implement it, it's too good of an idea... >_>;

Niloklives
Apr 30, 2011, 03:11 PM
not being able to feed my mag for 3 months cause I was going from level 199 to 200 would not be cool.

•Col•
Apr 30, 2011, 03:12 PM
Oh man, it'd be so cool if you could slightly customize how your mag looks..... Now I want it. T_T

Tetsaru
Apr 30, 2011, 03:15 PM
not being able to feed my mag for 3 months cause I was going from level 199 to 200 would not be cool.

It should NEVER take 3 months to gain one level. I never got that high in PSO, but if it took that long, that's just ridiculous.

NoiseHERO
Apr 30, 2011, 03:17 PM
It should NEVER take 3 months to gain one level. I never got that high in PSO, but if it took that long, that's just ridiculous.

You should see korean mmos, taking years to get 1 level from a cap. :0

Kent
Apr 30, 2011, 03:33 PM
Making a method of scaling the attribute bonus from a MAG would actually be a pretty simple thing to do. The only real problem comes in when you make the MAG's stat bonuses apply to the base attributes of the character. That is, if every attribute bonus is scaled down linearly, pumping one stat would lower the total stat benefit of all of them. If you just barely meet the requirements to equip a gun while you're pumping your MAG's Power, then over-levelling your MAG in that way could potentially make your ATA temporarily drop from universal linear scaling.

Of course, you can side-step the issue completely in a few different ways: Making MAG attribute bonuses apply to total stats instead of base stats, tying MAG growth to character level, or simply binding the MAG to the character that started raising it, preventing possible trading of said MAGs (which wouldn't be a bad thing, in the first place).

To elaborate on that second one, tying MAG growth to character level could be something as simple as the aforementioned level requirement of half of the MAG's level (because that's about the rate at which characters and MAGs will grow normally in PSO), but without the problem of someone feeding their MAG one too many times and suddenly being unable to equip it. My suggestion would be to tie a small database to MAGs (which is only okay for items if they're very limited in number - which MAGs could very well be, particularly if they bind themselves to the character that raises them) that simply stores which MAG level was given by which stat. This way, if you over-level your MAG, you're simple pre-determining the stat bonuses it will give when you catch up to its requisite level. At the same time, this would easily allow a player to make their MAG the way they want it, and the MAG itself would retain a memory of what its stats were at a given level, should there be a level-capped event or gametype selected.

The only real problem with tying a small database to an item as such (which would be a simple array, really) is the fact that it would take up quite a lot of storage space compared to other items within your character's data. This could probably easily be alleviated by allocating MAGs to a separate and very limited storage (say, six MAGs per character, or something along those lines). Individual characters don't really carry more than a couple MAGs on them in PSO, anyway - generally characters will simply have a MAG they use for everything, and then a MAG they use for learning techniques... And that's it, save possibly for some event-given ones or any rare MAGs someone may have made.

Of course, it's entirely possible that MAGs could be raised in a completely different manner than what we're used to - say, for instance, they could gain their own experience from combat to level up, at which point they can have stats (and therefore, personal stat bonuses) assigned to them. Though, I kind of liked being able to have my MAG eat up unused resources; having a means of putting to use those excess dungeon spoils isn't a bad thing.

Corey Blue
Apr 30, 2011, 03:49 PM
I wanna see some sonic adventure type shit when raising your MAG,now that would be fun.

Ffuzzy-Logik
Apr 30, 2011, 04:09 PM
It should NEVER take 3 months to gain one level. I never got that high in PSO, but if it took that long, that's just ridiculous.If I recall correctly, in terms of total experience, level 187 183 was half of the way to 200.

Hrith
Apr 30, 2011, 06:32 PM
Yes, and going from Lv199 to Lv200 was roughly 4,400,000 experience points, while a Lv100 character was 2,200,000, lol.

Niloklives
Apr 30, 2011, 08:18 PM
PSO Ep 1&2 exp guide (http://www.pso-world.com/sections.php?op=viewarticle&artid=1291)

According to a guide on our very own site, getting to level 193 was less than half way to 200.

Dongra
Apr 30, 2011, 08:26 PM
That guide lists the experience to the reach that level not how much experience you have at said level.

Niloklives
Apr 30, 2011, 08:40 PM
bleh...I thought I remembered having more total exp than that. This looks right (http://www.pso-world.com/sections.php?op=viewarticle&artid=672)

Either way it's a clear spike in what's required as you get up there.

EDIT: That's some memory, Ffuzzy.

Ffuzzy-Logik
Apr 30, 2011, 08:46 PM
I am perfect in every way conceivable; I am flawless.

Niloklives
Apr 30, 2011, 08:52 PM
Except where things are Ffuzzy.

HyperShot-X-
May 1, 2011, 01:10 AM
Also, along with the old MAG's like Sato, Diwari, Pushan, etc., I think it would be awesome if you could actually design your own MAG somehow, as well as customize what stats it would boost. Things such as putting together a bunch of small preset parts (think Kingdom Heart 2's Gummi Ships, with some parts being rare drops), changing colors, adding your own decals, the works. You could even choose which attacks or moves to give it, so it could fight alongside you like how PSU's Partner Machines did, although hopefully with much better AI, and then save it for mass production...
user created MAGs.. what kind of CRAZY idea is that you're coming up with? O: but seriously, if they could pull that off just right, it'd be more than taking the old MAG system to the next level, it could add a whole new dimension to even deeper customization to make it even more interesting. The only thing about it tho is the 'mass production' part, it shouldn't be so easy to reproduce an identical mag fully raised even with all the parts available and mag design saved, it should take about the same amount of time and effort to fully raise one.

As for the repetitive and disruptive part of feeding Mag even during missions, it'd be nice to be able to store mag food items inside mag inventory to queue them up and set it to auto-feed, and then mag alerts the owner when food is all empty.

While we're at it, here's another crazy idea of mine:
DOUBLE MAGs system
-independent of weps equipped on pallet
-three main types(strike, ranged, and tech)
-two of the same type will transform them into one Forte-type mag at owner's will with combined and upgraded photon blasts
-hybrid combos are possible with two different types, keeps uncombined photon blasts on each mag for wide variety
-strike mag can morph itself into a fighting NPC robot or beast form to battle alongside the owner, similiar traits for ranged and tech mags each of their own(shooting and support/attack)

Tetsaru
May 1, 2011, 01:37 AM
Regarding the "mass production" comment, I meant that you could save a schematic of your own MAG, not necessarily the stats associated with it. Then, provided you had enough parts to make them, you could have multiple copies of your design for trading purposes, or at least be able to give your schematic to others so that they can make it themselves. Players could still level up the stats however they like for each copy; the only real drawback would be that the MAG wouldn't evolve. Also, I'm not sure how the Photon Blasts would be learned...

NoiseHERO
May 1, 2011, 01:40 AM
I am perfect in every way conceivable; I am flawless.

Wow and I thought I was narcissistic, you're my hero! :0

FEI LEE
May 1, 2011, 02:23 AM
Except where things are Ffuzzy.

And when using logik :-P

r00tabaga
May 1, 2011, 08:35 AM
I'd like to set a MAG to auto-feed too. That's a great idea.

WolfDreamer
May 3, 2011, 05:42 AM
<---- *Points at the Avatar*

There is a reason why that is there. I miss you Sato...

MESeele
May 3, 2011, 09:43 AM
I loved mags in pso. Whenever I got bored with the grind I'd just mess around and feed them. Pretty much the only time I ever used my tv's picture in picture :)

Perfect mind mags and Rati ftw. Whether they're usable on new characters or not, I don't think the balance would be broken unless they made mag trading possible again. I think a player's mags should be locked with their account - to ease making alts but not taking away the effort and fun of making them. It just sucked when you'd proudly put it on to showcase your time well spent, only to see everyone else with awesome mags whom had just traded for them. Kind of a downer lol

So yeah, they should be included imo.

Krank32oz
May 3, 2011, 10:06 AM
Mags FTW! That's one of the many things about PSO I think a lot of people loved! Why wouldn't they bring it back?

BIG OLAF
May 3, 2011, 10:14 AM
I just realized that I saw no Mags of any sort in the gameplay trailer. Might be a bad sign, as I don't think SEGA would cut them out of the first gameplay trailer unless they simply weren't in it, seeing as they stay with your character at all times when in battle.

RenzokukenZ
May 3, 2011, 10:59 AM
Because Mags are so awesome that they need an entire trailer for themselves.

r00tabaga
May 3, 2011, 11:29 AM
They'll be in...no worries!

Niloklives
May 3, 2011, 04:14 PM
It's entirely possible they weren't ready yet. if they're not in the next trailer, then you can start to worry.

chaoelite
May 9, 2011, 08:29 AM
Because Mags are so awesome that they need an entire trailer for themselves.

I agree! lol

Yes to mags but if you recall in pso the diff race gender and jobs had various stats that increased over levels so the mag helped fill in the gaps missing when you play a certain char. I don't agree about scaling the mags if you want balance then make them non drop/tradeable so they can only be used on the char who raised or bring back the old stat system i believe psp2 did that to a degree so pso2 it may be reality.

I miss my chao mind mag ; ;

yoshiblue
May 9, 2011, 11:38 AM
I wanna see some sonic adventure type shit when raising your MAG,now that would be fun.

Sonic Adventure type missions or gameplay would be awesome as well. MAGS= YES :cheepcheep:

Doing mission that involves you boarding down rails at the entrance to get in. Doing some epic jumps to get from one place to another with a loop to run here and there.

Tetsaru
May 9, 2011, 12:58 PM
Sonic Adventure type missions or gameplay would be awesome as well. MAGS= YES :cheepcheep:

In another thread somewhere, I mentioned that I didn't really see a point in bringing back the Chao Garden, but if they replaced the Chao's with MAG's... now that sounds intriguing. If they went that route, maybe Chao's could show up somehow as an Easter Egg of sorts, or through a quest, or maybe tie it in with that random event thing they showed in the pre-Alpha video somehow, and then the Chao could benefit you somehow, maybe with Chao-related items, such as the actual Chao MAG, Striker of Chao, etc....?


Doing mission that involves you boarding down rails at the entrance to get in. Doing some epic jumps to get from one place to another with a loop to run here and there.

Ehh... I just saw basic jumping in that pre-Alpha video... I don't see how they could incorporate rails and loops unless they bring back Airboards. While it'd be a cool addition, I'm not sure how well it would tie in with the rest of the game, plus they'd have to overhaul the fuck out of the controls compared to how PSU was. That, and I'd rather not see anymore cutscenes of Ethan or some other similar annoying character randomly darting around into people and cars... ><

yoshiblue
May 9, 2011, 01:13 PM
Yeah your right. Maybe as a level entrance cutscene for the story then. Every level would have a unique one. Maybe add 3 different intros per level so it wont get as boring.

I can't find my post were i suggested a bunch of possible pso/sega crossover minigames

Chibi Cast Master
May 13, 2011, 04:58 PM
hell yes for mags i love them there my little friend that is deadly

SyianZi
May 16, 2011, 01:47 PM
It's a yes from me for mags too. The thng is, PB Blast's where fantastic when organized, I just want PB's to combine into things, that'd be nice. For example using M&Y with that dolphin to combine ot be like a whale or something. (You know what I mean!) It's just they where "so powerful" or meant to be at least. They really only benefitted me when I did it with a group for shifta and deband. I would like to see a good syncronized PB for a boss fight to do a hefty chunk of damage.

AfroGuy!
May 24, 2011, 11:08 PM
yes for mags

DarkMaster50
May 25, 2011, 05:47 AM
I love MAGS~~!! If they don't have them in PSO2 I will be so upset. I use to collect them back on DC. I would spend days trying to make exactly the one I wanted.

Miyoko
May 25, 2011, 06:19 AM
Robot maids [...] are right up there with bikini armor

Words cannot describe how badly I want to stab you in the face right now.

Anywho, on topic...

If MAGs never came back, it would still be too soon. Sure, they were great from an asthetic standpoint (except for Kama, I HATE YOU PELICAN FACE, why did ALL of my mags turn into you ARHGDSGFS), but beyond that, bleh. They were terrible for new players, having no real ingame advice to raising them, no info on what stats were good to raise, what was useless, around how high something should be, etc etc., but most of all, they were just so mind numbingly boring to raise. It was alright the first time, sure, but after having to make 12 of the damned things, I just never want to see one again.

r00tabaga
May 25, 2011, 06:34 AM
Opinions are like assholes...everyone has one.

Tyreek
May 25, 2011, 07:05 AM
I think I'm gonna copy paste what I put in another thread to sum up why I would approve of Mags for this game.


I believe I had a talk about this a while back regarding mags. I think it would be an awesome feature for them to incorporate the concepts between their uses from both PSO and PSU. Being able to build their stats to compliment your stats was fine on its own. But I always thought about them being machines themselves. Why do they not have defenses of their own? Attack for you, or shielding you from threats?

When the homage to mags came in the form of Madoog/Shadoog in PSU, that was the type of mag I dreamed of. Autonomous machines being able to assist on their own. Passively or aggresively. Locking with technics or firing a slew of lasers at the enemy. That was awesome. Now how about incorporating both? Customizing not only its stats, but its functions on the battlefield as well. Assigning it to be an attack drone, or a first aid. Managing its Sync/IQ so it can respond better to situations and act accordingly(IE: PSO's mags casting resta or shifta/deband when you're in a pinch). Expand upon the good points of the mags from both generations and I think you'll have a welcome addition to the game. THAT is what I want to see in PSO2.

r00tabaga
May 25, 2011, 07:19 AM
I think I'm gonna copy paste what I put in another thread to sum up why I would approve of Mags for this game.

Definately this. I think most would agree too b/c it appeals to both crowds (PSO/U). I hated PM's with a passion so I hope they're gone & never, ever returning.

Vintasticvin
May 25, 2011, 01:53 PM
Having Mags in the game would be AWESOME!!!! And maybe they could like have some that do one of the following: Heal, Buff, or attack enemy units :3 while looking cool ot add some kinda utility to them atleast.