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View Full Version : Brainstorming and Story Theory Time



Revy
Jul 6, 2011, 02:01 PM
/rant BAAAW April 24th was the last PSO 2 info dump which came in a nice shiny video, it's now July 6th and all I've heard about is "alpha invites are sent, but damned if I know when it starts! LuLz." I think Sega did the community a huge disservice by skipping out on a PSO2 E3 announcement, even if there was no new content I think their marketing team should be taken out back and shot or commit seppuku. Just hardcore fans are aware of the existence of PSO 2 rather than building up general anticipation. /rant

So let's go over what we do know; Starting with some plagiarism from psupedia about "sorta" announcements of what to expect from PSO2 from Sega's first video back in September 2010:

* "Action" and "RPG" re-connected
* Increased variety of client orders
* Map functions changing in real time
* User-created story
* New interface for environmental interactions
* Global support
* Thorough racial balances
* Full-user participation events
* Seasonal changes
* New chat system
* New mail functions
* Drastic item synthesis overhaul
* Even wider variety of ways to raise your character
* New direction of event scenes
* Approach from NPCs (New approach maybe?)
* Silhouette changes by add-ons (Not too sure what they mean here.)
* New photon arts (This was partially obscured in the video, so may not be 100% accurate.)
* Community support content (Again, slightly obscured in the video.)
* Additional customizations when you create your character
* Category-based weapon training system (Slightly obscured.)
* Implementation of asynchronous communication
* New party system
* Consideration of enemy cooperation
* Limitless content
* New approach to the game client
* Implementation of a new "life work" (Partially obscured.)
* Daily surprises
* "Trump card" system
* Mutual interaction functionality for new and veteran users

And now for words and phrases that give hints at the world of the game:
* Awakening
* Sealed stone monument
* Pure Dark Falz (Partially obscured.)
* Apostles of _____ (Partially obscured.)
* Camp ship
* Arkz
* Why is darkness born?
* Why is the Great Light no longer here?
* A world in ruin

And we got a little tidbit [<3 Mike] from the Alpha invite e-mail which the producer Sakai writes: "Even though the stage has changed from Ragol to Oracle, I'm looking forward to being able to meet everyone again. Please look forward to the test."

I played PSO Ver.2.

I tried playing Episode 3, I still have it, but didn't get too far in the story because the card game bored the hell out of me.

Did some PSOBB and for the life of me I can't recall the storyline much from Episode 4.

Did PSU until the Computer/Playstation servers went down and took my Spread Needle/G with it [so many hours spent on that Maximum Attack G ;_; ]

Played Phantasy Star 0 on muh DS which was a fun game, but really short.

I'm trying to play Phantasy Star Portable but the button arrangement on the PSP itself makes my hand sore after a while of playing.

It's a mess of a post but to sum this up I'm sick of talking about alleged game play mechanics [that nobody knows about] and mostly want to talk about what we may expect story wise [that nobody knows about] with the new planet "Oracle" and if that means that this is a different Pioneer ship? I'm no story expert and I don't know if I over looked something in the games I have played or if there's more information in the newer games I haven't played that might hint about Oracle. I'm just assuming that Oracle is a planet. Might not be, but there's not much to go off of.

I'd also like to hear any theories about how all these stories from each game might tie into each other. [Don't care about spoilers :D] PSO2 will have another "Sealed stone monument" and something about a "Pure Dark Falz." Hell, this could be the original Pioneer 2 team sending "Arkz" to investigate the home planet of the alien ship that was found on Ragol that held a "less pure version of dark falz." I'm really rusty on a lot of the story though. I'd love to hear what's been stewing in everyone else's mind about the coming story.

The only thing that can mess up a theory is fact.

Shinji Kazuya
Jul 6, 2011, 02:16 PM
* "Action" and "RPG" re-connected
* Increased variety of client orders
* Map functions changing in real time
* User-created story
* New interface for environmental interactions
* Global support
* Thorough racial balances
* Full-user participation events
* Seasonal changes
* New chat system
* New mail functions
* Drastic item synthesis overhaul
* Even wider variety of ways to raise your character
* New direction of event scenes
* Approach from NPCs (New approach maybe?)
* Silhouette changes by add-ons (Not too sure what they mean here.)
* New photon arts (This was partially obscured in the video, so may not be 100% accurate.)
* Community support content (Again, slightly obscured in the video.)
* Additional customizations when you create your character
* Category-based weapon training system (Slightly obscured.)
* Implementation of asynchronous communication
* New party system
* Consideration of enemy cooperation
* Limitless content
* New approach to the game client
* Implementation of a new "life work" (Partially obscured.)
* Daily surprises
* "Trump card" system
* Mutual interaction functionality for new and veteran users


Looking at this list, one would expect Phantasy Star Online 2 to be one hell of an awsome game.
I really hope it will be.
Let's see if "they" follow their list close enough to deliver all the stuff that's in it.

AzureBlaze
Jul 6, 2011, 02:23 PM
Story Theory Contribution / Question:
Ok so I have "heard" that Infinity was supposed to have "HINTS FOR PSO2" contained in it. It seems reasonable enough. They were developed alongside for some of their time. There was some early screencaps that showed something that looked like Pioneer 2 (from Ragol etc) in an Infinity setting. You also had all the PSO weps showing up magically / thru a portal /whatever in the relic areas as an excuse to bring back pso cool stuff into psu.

I have religiously avoided inf.spoilers despite pre-ordering the JP ver. of the game and getting it. However with the megadumb news that there won't be an Eng. release of Inf (BS! RAGE!) It still doesn't mean I can understand the story of Inf....ever...I come to ask:

What ARE the PSO2 hints inside of Infinity?
What's up with Pioneer 2 showing up in Infinity?

It's useless for anyone to avoid spoilers now on Inf.

blace
Jul 6, 2011, 02:47 PM
It doesn't have anything about why it shows up, but that it contained the great evil, Dark Falz. Besides we can't forget that in the true ending in episode 1 that they decide to be the test subjects for their first manned sub space test.

Revy
Jul 6, 2011, 02:49 PM
It doesn't have anything about why it shows up, but that it contained the great evil, Dark Falz. Besides we can't forget that in the true ending in episode 1 that they decide to be the test subjects for their first manned sub space test.

Episode 1 PSO? Whats the story line behind this "first sub-space test" if you don't mind me asking?

blace
Jul 6, 2011, 02:56 PM
Episode 1 PSO? Whats the story line behind this "first sub-space test" if you don't mind me asking?
I meant to reply to AzureBlaze, Infinity is also split into 2 episodes. Episode 1 being that you're a mercenary and episode 2 where things like the pioneer like ship comes up from the ground.

Revy
Jul 6, 2011, 03:56 PM
I meant to reply to AzureBlaze, Infinity is also split into 2 episodes. Episode 1 being that you're a mercenary and episode 2 where things like the pioneer like ship comes up from the ground.

If you could, since apparently Infinity won't be translated, do you think you could sum up the story/plot?

RemiusTA
Jul 6, 2011, 04:10 PM
There is no point to this topic, we dont know anything and probably wont be able to spectulate much aside from the regular ol' japanese cliches


And i pray to G O D this has nothing to do with PSP2. If so this story is going to blow balls

Revy
Jul 6, 2011, 04:16 PM
There is no point to this topic, we dont know anything and probably wont be able to spectulate much aside from the regular ol' japanese cliches


And i pray to G O D this has nothing to do with PSP2. If so this story is going to blow balls

Opinion noted. Carrying on with the notion that the topic isn't pointless and no matter how minor it may seem the games do have some sort of tie in. Strained for content or not.

ARASHIKAGE
Jul 6, 2011, 04:42 PM
Man I love this post, it gets me all excited about the story location and the cool fighting system. Great job Revy!

As I'm looking at that list I'm noticing most of the "improvements" are just upgrades to the PSU format; Drastic item synthesis overhaul, New photon arts... I know this road is well traveled so I wont focus much time here. But why would PSO need a drastic item synth overhaul? Combining two weapons into one and getting Dr. Montague to turn an enemy body part into a weapon, is hardly worth mentioning for an "overhaul". They are clearly talking about PSU here, It's like saying PSU2 is going to get a "card battling overhaul!" (ok I'm done)

That's just me being nit picky though in the end that list is packed with "new" additions, and great changes and ideas. I'm hoping for the best, I really want to see them succeed in making an awesome game!

To the story! PSOs story was very very bland. We only got tidbits of info and even then it was really left to the player to piece it all together, in our minds. We know Dark Falz took Red Ring Rico's body as some sort of vessel. We killed Falz and Rico died too, yay end of story... Then In ep. 2 we get to kill an organic computer possessed dark force named: Olga Flow, I don't really remember much from that other than he was similar to Vol Opt's story. They basically recycled a few ep. 1 enemies for ep. 2 and made connections to the previous game. Anyway it would be interesting to get a real PSO story in PSO2 and that's whats exciting me most right now.

Btw wouldn't it be cool if they went back to calling the great evil: Dark Force again? But I guess I'm sure a lot of people are waiting to see the "Dark Falz" tens years later, in HD! Since you can never truly kill the Dark Force he will return in some form in PSO2.

I forget what the Arkz were, can someone refresh my memory?

Revy
Jul 6, 2011, 04:52 PM
I forget what the Arkz were, can someone refresh my memory?

I think Arkz were the "bad guys" in PSO Episode 3 Card Revolution.

ARASHIKAGE
Jul 6, 2011, 04:56 PM
I think Arkz were the "bad guys" in PSO Episode 3 Card Revolution.
Oh ok, for some reason I was thinking it was a PSZ thing.

GCoffee
Jul 6, 2011, 05:04 PM
To the story! PSOs story was very very bland. We only got tidbits of info and even then it was really left to the player to piece it all together, in our minds. We know Dark Falz took Red Ring Rico's body as some sort of vessel. We killed Falz and Rico died too, yay end of story... Then In ep. 2 we get to kill an organic computer possessed dark force named: Olga Flow, I don't really remember much from that other than he was similar to Vol Opt's story. They basically recycled a few ep. 1 enemies for ep. 2 and made connections to the previous game.

Goddammit, did you even try to assemble those story pieces? There was a whole lot going on.
If you said the storytelling was bad I could see where your complaint is coming from, but the story itself is fabulous. Leave aside Dark Falz for a moment, because PSO offered connections between characters you never would have seen coming, a crapton of background information about Pioneer 1, 2 and Coral to make for a realistic and well thought-through scenario and so much more.

RemiusTA
Jul 6, 2011, 05:05 PM
I think Arkz were the "bad guys" in PSO Episode 3 Card Revolution.
I believe the Arkz were a faction of people opposed to pioneer 2's government. Their opposition had something to do with how the government was dealing with the planet. I think the main issue the Arkz had with the government was their use of "the germ", which the lifeform they based the C.A.R.D. technology off of. (The germ was able to pretty much copy, remember and replicate any atomic structure) IIRC they stole the technology from Pioneer 3 and made their own form of it to fight them. (hence the monster summoning)

Sakai said the Arkz faction from PSO III has no relation to the PSO2 group "Arkz", which seems to basically be the replacement of "Hunters" from Pioneer 2 (which has been replaced by "Oracle")

Which probably means they are connected. My guess is that after the events of PSO Ep.III, there was a shift in command where the "Hunters" basically became "Arkz" because it was revealed how dangerous the Germ really was (like the Arkz were bitching about). Simple name change i guess...? Maybe lol





To the story! PSOs story was very very bland. We only got tidbits of info and even then it was really left to the player to piece it all together, in our minds. We know Dark Falz took Red Ring Rico's body as some sort of vessel. We killed Falz and Rico died too, yay end of story... Then In ep. 2 we get to kill an organic computer possessed dark force named: Olga Flow, I don't really remember much from that other than he was similar to Vol Opt's story. They basically recycled a few ep. 1 enemies for ep. 2 and made connections to the previous game. Anyway it would be interesting to get a real PSO story in PSO2 and that's whats exciting me most right now.And PSO's story was great because it didn't try to focus too much on it, but it was still very much a REAL STORY there for you to enjoy. The game was fun without it, but the more you played the game, the more the story was revealed to you. The way PSO Ep.I played out, you would probably eventually become intrigued by the story because of the way it ends.

At least, thats how it worked for me. I wondered why the hell the final stage got increasingly darker, and darker, and disgusting, and evil looking until it got super pretty outside and then "OMG WHAT THE FFFFFFFFFFFUU"

It was pretty straightforward -- president loses his daughter, you go to find her, follow her breadcrumbs, and kill the beast that ate her. I found the particular style of storytelling very effective. By spoon feeding you the story and making you figure it out on your own, it's like you're actually in the shoes of the hunter you're playing with. As opposed to PSU, where everything is carried out in cutscenes and in-game dialogue. With the focus on another character, in order for any emotion to take place, you have to relate with the character. And if that doesn't happen...well. In PSO you really only had to relate with what was going on around you. It was an intriguing storyline that honestly took place between the player (you) and two dead people (Rico and Flowen). Bring Quests into it, and you're basically experiencing it with your own self as well as the NPCs. In PSU AoTI, you basically do the same thing. However, PSU focused way too hard on drawing you into the story by using typical anime drama and the character relations. PSO mainly drew you into the story by giving you an IDEA of what's happening and then letting you figure it out for yourself. Reading Rico's logs, you get advice on how to fight enemies and HER own thoughts of what happened while she was going through the area. As she asks questions, you answer them, and eventually you both end up finding out everything by Ruins 3....which was really nothing SUPER SHOCKING or any kind of AMAZING PLOT TWIST, but nonetheless extremely threatening and dark. "Giant evil lifeform is absorbing all life on the planet. I think we should kill it."

Thats the difference between PSU and PSO. PSO never tried to WOW OMG you with anything other than the scale of the enemies you battle and the environments around you. In PSU you have Karen and Mirei being twins, Mirei dying, all these racial issues, colonies falling on planets, viruses making whole populations go mad, MOON SIZED ENEMY HIVES, dimensional riffs and subspace distortions fusing worlds together, people being possessed by ancient races from forever ago, main characters going pale and growing eye patches, old PSO characters randomly spawning due to MORE subspace shit....it's just one "BIG DAMN EVENT" after the other.

In PSO? Everything SUPER SERIOUS and SUPER TRAGIC....it happened before the game even started. You're just assigned to find out why. Monsters are hostile, creatures are mutating, and even MACHINES are going crazy. And at the end of the game, you find out why; there's an old, evil lifeform sealed into the planet that someone woke up before you got there that basically ate them all. The game's premise is more about survival in a mysterious world than all that other crap.
[spoiler-box]


Tl;Dr= people who complain about games that dont have VOICE ACTING, or game that need more Mo-cap cutscenes and crap....they're the reason franchises like Final Fantasy are dying off right now. It's a VIDEOGAME -- Final Fantasy 6, 7, 8 and 9 got damn near cult followings for being amazing, and there wasn't a shred of voice acting, and not a single spoken word in ANY of the CG videos. The game doesn't have to try and be a shitty anime to get its point across. PSO's storytelling methods worked just damn fine (obviously, if we're all here waiting on the second one.) Just because it merged the storytelling with the gameplay (the exact same reason Final Fantasy 7 was so god damn popular, although taken to another level obviously) doesn't mean it's missing anything.

Personally, im tired of the Ethan Wabers, im tired of the Karens going from badass female leads to male lead ball-swingers, im tired of the Hyugas that LOLCHANGERACE in the middle of the story just for fanservice, im tired of the shitty Shizuru's and their completely impractical 6 swords to fight with, and im sick of the Nagasia's that use stupid played-out-since-FF8-in-1999 gun+blade weapons with 1 dimensional personalities until they acquire the POWER OF FRIENDSHIP and then love everybody. Jeezeeee.

[spoiler-box]

(the only reason i didn't mention Emilia's shitty loli-ness is because i actually loved her as a character, but hated her character design. Another thing that's starting to kill me about this franchise -- she just HADDDDD to be a damn near loli.)

[spoiler-box]
(***which is made even worse when they protray her in CG. In-game, Emilia has a super wide assortment of emotions, until you see a CG video in which she has that stupid stock "emotionless loli bot" face on with a voice that absolutely did not fit her in-game text dialouge. I dont think she ever fully opens her eyes in a single CG video in the whole game.)[/spoiler-box][/spoiler-box]
[/spoiler-box]

^ ^
if nobody read those spoilers, ill just say it:

No voice acting is probably the ABSOLUTE BEST THING that could have EVER happened to PSP2's US/EU release.

Jinketsu
Jul 6, 2011, 05:25 PM
I can't agree with that more. PSO's storytelling was very well done, but was such because it was like that from start to finish. I doubt we'll ever see anything like that again, which is sad.

RemiusTA
Jul 6, 2011, 05:55 PM
Yeah, there probably wont be unless they specifically make it a point to.

Games were alot more creative around PSO's lifetime, but i believe things slowly started to fall since then. People aren't as creative anymore because the bar for a "decent" title has been risen so high that it just isn't financially smart to take creative risks anymore.


Which is why i really dont mind PSO2's graphics staying the way they are. Improvements are good, but if they can keep it at a development level that isn't too ridiculous, we might be able to get alot more out of the title. If the game looked like, oh say Sonic Unleashed (Hedgehog Engine level lighting), then environments would be MUCH harder to develop for, as everything would have to consistantly be on that high level of detail.

So while we would probably be getting the SEXIEST anime-styled MMO on the planet...you know, downsides. It's sonic team.

ARASHIKAGE
Jul 6, 2011, 06:17 PM
To be clear I enjoyed PSOs story, and I never said it was bad. But there was very little of it. I'm sure there's a few people that still have no idea what PSOs story was, simply because it was easy to pass by. But I loved PSO's story I have wrote many of fan fiction about the story and integrated many of my characters into it. It's one of the few story lines you could do that with because it left many gaps to the imagination. PSO is still my favorite MMO and the story of the game plays a big part in that.

That said..
I know I'm gonna get ripped a new a-hole for this but... As a whole PSO's story line does not compare to other great RPGs, it doesn't even come close. It barely holds a candle to the; Tales of (Series), Final Fantasys, Chrono Trigger, Zeldas, hell even Pokemon. All of which were made before and some during PSO. Hence why I called it "bland".

NoiseHERO
Jul 6, 2011, 06:23 PM
I kinda just skimmed and jump through a lot of chunks in this thread so meh if someone already said this.

But PSO's story telling wasn't ALL THAT.

However I see it as impossible for SEGA to do a good job making the story good again...

Yes that's right THIS is where my pessimism comes in, I have absolutely NO faith japan's story telling abilities after the year 2001.

Hopefully with sakai back in control this may not be the case, and we can actually get a serious sci-fi rpg story going on, and not a post PS2 anime trope fest. (regardless what story telling style they use.)

But sci-fi was actually awesome in the 80's and 90's so yeah... little to no hope, I'm just gonna hope the gameplay and environments don't suck, which they probably won't at least for my tastes so far with PS.

RemiusTA
Jul 6, 2011, 08:11 PM
The point isn't that it was all that, the point is that it worked.

When you try to make something dramatic and epic and it doesn't work, regardless of how good your story is, you just make it look really, really, REALLY bad. (Just look at Naruto.)




That said..
I know I'm gonna get ripped a new a-hole for this but... As a whole PSO's story line does not compare to other great RPGs, it doesn't even come close. It barely holds a candle to the; Tales of (Series), Final Fantasys, Chrono Trigger, Zeldas, hell even Pokemon. All of which were made before and some during PSO. Hence why I called it "bland".

PSO's story in general isn't too much different than some of the stories in those games. In fact, if you were to take PSO's world and turn it into an RPG then it'd probably hold up pretty well.

And also note...every game you mentioned was an RPG. PSO is not an RPG, nor does it try to be. PSU does, but PSO did not.

NoiseHERO
Jul 6, 2011, 08:26 PM
Wait... now pso isn't an rpg either? <_>

But yeah like I said, it WORKED but I'd be surprised if it would work again... whether it'd be because this is not the year 2000 anymore, sakai losing his touch, and or SEGA just bombing altogether.

Whatever happens, I just hope they don't go the pseudo anime kingdom hearts wannabe route that PSU's story failed to pull off...

Revy
Jul 6, 2011, 08:28 PM
Well this thread got derailed fast. Anyone play infinity? Care to sum up the plot? Was it actually Pioneer 2 that shows up or a Pioneer-esc ship?

NoiseHERO
Jul 6, 2011, 08:35 PM
and usually things fly off topic... when theres not really a lot to go on about the main topic anyway...

I think someone already said there wasn't any powerful confirmation that infinity was connected anyway.

I doubt we'll be able to put together some sort of base background plot for the amount of information SEGA has given us, through tidbits of spoils, hype and bad story telling. You know other than the confirmation that we have the same plot set up as all the other PS games from the last decade:

"A group of mercenaries trying to survive in some sci-fi world because of crazy, hostile monsters getting brainwashed by giygas. Then in the end it was just because dark falz impregnated another japanese japanese girl with a white girl hair style."

blace
Jul 6, 2011, 08:40 PM
I summed up the story in your visitor message. Just take a look there.

Revy
Jul 6, 2011, 08:45 PM
I summed up the story in your visitor message. Just take a look there.

Thanks - would you mind if I posted what you sent me under spoilers?

blace
Jul 6, 2011, 08:46 PM
Go for it.

Revy
Jul 6, 2011, 08:48 PM
blace:
I'll just tell you the basic story plot of PSP2i here:

Basically, in the one year stint in the end of PSPo2 and sometime after a year, you're enlisted as a bodyguard of sorts to female Dewman. All she asks for is for you to help her find and retrieve pieces of a dark stone, empowered with dark energy.

The girl in question hasn't had much experience with the outside world so she's a bit out of touch with her common sense. She's also "possessed" by an ancient, a being from the time before the SEED invasion in a society that created the Stateria.

In the end, after collecting all the pieces of the stone, the evil powers became too much for her to handle and proceeds to take over her body as well as summoning an ancient ship that resembles Pioneer 2. Dark Falz is then released and is in control of the ship, from which I couldn't find a translation for, but my guess is to return to whichever part of the universe it originally came from.

My guess is, Coral found other planets suitable for life, and that Pionner 2 was given the task to explore the other planets after the incident on Ragol, and that PSO 2 will probably be on some other Pioneer in another part of the system.

blace
Jul 6, 2011, 08:58 PM
What Mike just told me:
[spoiler-box]
Just to clarify a few things on Infinity's story, Nagisa was created to house the stones that contain Dark Falz's power and to be DF's vessel when all the stones were collected. She was set about this task by Howser but the DF's power sapped her memories so we as players don't learn this until the end of the game.

Wynarl, the ancient Nagisa encounters in the Denis relics (I think), takes pity on her comes up with a plan to save Nagisa by absorbing one of the stones himself and taking Nagisa's place as DF's vessel. After all the stones have been absorbed, Wynarl activates the ship, not DF, and teleports inside with Nagisa. The ship itself is an anti-SEED weapon with the power to seal DF inside. Wynarl is in control of the ship and he sets it on a course outside of the Gurhal system. Once Wynarl absorbs the power of Dark Falz from Nagisa and the players defeat Dios, the power of Dark Falz is sealed inside the ship.[/spoiler-box]

Revy
Jul 6, 2011, 09:03 PM
Oooooh! That sounds like it leads right into the plot of PSO. That's kinda of exciting!~

NoiseHERO
Jul 6, 2011, 09:12 PM
Okay then so benimaru( Incase you overlook this joke http://www.fightersgeneration.com/np5/char/benimaru-cvs2-fix.jpg ) is the connector between pso, psu, and pso2. Got it!

blace
Jul 6, 2011, 09:13 PM
Sounds like it. Who knew the guy with the bad 80's hair was the reason behind everything?

Revy
Jul 6, 2011, 09:22 PM
eesh the more I think about this plot development the more I think about the chicken or the egg :X

Seth Astra
Jul 6, 2011, 09:26 PM
Wow. That's actually pretty cool. Interesting to see a link to the PSO storyline.

Dracheseele
Jul 6, 2011, 09:33 PM
The gameplay preview seems to allude that the Oracl fleet is exploring. The Ragol Incident would surely have altered how the government handles selecting new worlds for colonization. Perhaps the Oracl is some sort of System able to detect dark entities and ARKS is a special military force trained to combat them.

moorebounce
Jul 6, 2011, 09:33 PM
When PSO for the Dreamcast it was more about the real time fighting and less about the story. I liked PSO's story telling method better than PSU and PSZ's. I don't mind reading but not as much as I had to do in PSU and PSZ.

IMO PSO's story was good and the method was good.

Revy
Jul 6, 2011, 09:36 PM
Ok so this is a question that won't be answered for a long while yet, but I wonder if PSO2 will be a rehashed version of PSO1 in the PSU universe. I don't mean the down play that it will probably have its own unique storyline, but man my mind is reeling. Bah! Did anyone see anything about it being a direct sequel to the original PSO?

blace
Jul 6, 2011, 09:41 PM
I just thought that the game was its own spinoff from PSO, seeing that it was a big hit back in the day.

Who would've known that PSU happened before PSO? Still doesn't explain the weapons that I've been picking up lately and the random mobs that came from PSO.

Revy
Jul 6, 2011, 09:44 PM
I just thought that the game was its own spinoff from PSO, seeing that it was a big hit back in the day.

Who would've known that PSU happened before PSO? Still doesn't explain the weapons that I've been picking up lately and the random mobs that came from PSO.

Yeah I'll be the first to admit theres some plot holes with that idea, like where did all the beastmen go? But you can't help but wonder right?

Or it's just a case of history repeating :rappy:

blace
Jul 6, 2011, 09:49 PM
Well considering that PSU has three different planets (Parum, Moatoob and Neudaiz) and that PSO just has Cloral as its only homeworld, I'm gonna say that it's two completely different civilizations, with similar cultures and technology.

Casts do have their own personalities while PSO doesn't really reiterate anything about androids being able to think on their own. Dark Falz being an ancient threat is good enough I suppose. Now to explain why forest 1 and 2 were recorded in Rykros' records and why Flowen and Rico even existed in that part of the story.

Revy
Jul 6, 2011, 09:55 PM
It's kind of funny that I'm just left with this notion that similar civilizations keep capturing Dark Falz and then just set him adrift. Poor guy.

blace
Jul 6, 2011, 09:57 PM
Dark god indeed. Unkillable, but can be subdued and sealed away for someone else to deal with. If that was the case, just how many worlds are out there dealing with it?

NoiseHERO
Jul 6, 2011, 11:11 PM
I still say he should just do what his brother giygas did and possess someones womb.

RemiusTA
Jul 6, 2011, 11:28 PM
Wait... now pso isn't an rpg either? <_>

But yeah like I said, it WORKED but I'd be surprised if it would work again... whether it'd be because this is not the year 2000 anymore, sakai losing his touch, and or SEGA just bombing altogether.

Whatever happens, I just hope they don't go the pseudo anime kingdom hearts wannabe route that PSU's story failed to pull off...

Everyone is doing it, dude. Well, at least everyone who sucks ass at writing stories. Once again, i point to Naruto, who's writer thinks that EVERY TINY LITTLE CHARACTER in the fucking show needs some kind of epic emotional tie-in to EVERY OTHER TINY LITTLE DETAIL in the storyline.

The moment Phantasy Star Online's cameos inside of PSU started to take shape into the ACTUAL story of the game, i dont know how anyone didn't instantly realize the storyline was going to complete shit. (as if it wasn't already.)


And no, PSO is not an RPG, it was an MMORPG. Action RPG, Action Adventure RPG if you must. There is a difference. It could work again, they would just have to know how to do it right. PSO was chocked full of terrible plot advancements during some random quests, but most of the time the conflicts and mysteries were so terribly obvious i couldn't help but think the developers made it that way on purpose for comical / gameplay purposes. (So you'll know there is something more to look for, ect ect)

But yeah, i dont really care for them to do it again. They could do PSU's style right and i'd be equally as happy.

I am 100% positive they will ruin their characters in the same way on this game. Because they are Japan, and all the developers in the country seem to suffer from the same damn mistakes at the same damn time these last few years.




Casts do have their own personalities while PSO doesn't really reiterate anything about androids being able to think on their own. Dark Falz being an ancient threat is good enough I suppose. I think Casts were much more functional on PSO, but i do believe they definitely had free will. But then again...they're casts.

And Dark Falz's simplicity is what makes him such a good final boss, IMO. In either setting. I just didn't like his PSU form very much because of how utterly random he was. (although the fight was epic as shit)




Now to explain why forest 1 and 2 were recorded in Rykros' records and why Flowen and Rico even existed in that part of the story.Fanservice.

Done.



Ok so this is a question that won't be answered for a long while yet, but I wonder if PSO2 will be a rehashed version of PSO1 in the PSU universe. I don't mean the down play that it will probably have its own unique storyline, but man my mind is reeling. Bah! Did anyone see anything about it being a direct sequel to the original PSO?
You know, im more counting on it to be a direct sequel, but time will have to tell.

The PSU and PSO universe seem to not be connected very well, though. The physics of the PSU world seem to be different than those of the PSO world. Where Photons were pretty much a form of energy in PSO, they're pretty much classified as the "soul material" of the PSU world. Where it takes living beings to channel it in PSO (humans have the ability, newmans are best, casts are unable), it basically just takes a reactor to channel them in PSU...and then you have the Divine Maiden, the blessings, looking into the future...They dont seem to be the same thing. I mean, this is just stuff aside from the fact that PSU is from a much more technologically advanced period, obviously. In PSO, the physics of the world seemed much more realistic. You dont have people channeling energy and doing all this crazy shit, but the reason for that probably is due to development limitations other than story reasons. Im sure the battle engine had you do the whole "assume high numbers means something really badass" thing. Otherwise i dont think it'd be possible to kill Olga Flow by slicing him in the toe.

There's a reason they're calling it PSO2, and a reason that they're working so hard on making sure it stays true to PSO. The art direction seems to be leaning much towards PSO (which was more realistic), but the gameplay footage seems to be all over the place (swords bigger than the characters, floaty Kingdom Hearts air combos, ect.) In PSO, the concept of morality was much higher than in PSU, at least judging from PSO EpIII's art and storyline. PSO just seems more realistic. (hence Sakai noting that the game is much more realistic looking in environments than PSU.)


So yeah, it's a "time will tell" thing. Im not counting on this game to have anything to do with PSU, though. I really do believe those are just two different universes with very similar plot elements, like all Phantasy Star games.

BIG OLAF
Jul 6, 2011, 11:50 PM
Hopefully PSO2 is completely free of any major (not minor) plot tie-in. It's worked for the Phantasy Star games so far (well, except for the PSO fanservice in PSP2i, etc.). Most Phantasy Star games are related to each other somehow. Just in extremely subtle ways sometimes. That being said, I'm sure PSO2 will have outside references to other happenings in other games (most likely PSO, duh).

RemiusTA
Jul 7, 2011, 12:00 AM
Funny thing is, this is PSO2. Seeing as PSO was (obviously) far more popular than PSU in terms of fanbase, i dont think they'll even NEED to focus on fanservice to sell what they do, as long as it keeps the PSO feel.

I never, ever cared for PSO content being rehashed into PSU. That's never what I wanted. What i wanted was for PSU to feel more like PSO. As in, i wanted better weapons, i wanted better stage design, i wanted better music, i wanted more diverse class animations and i wanted better bosses.

PSO2 can allude to PSO, but honestly, heres to hoping it's a completely different game with only a few obvious nostalgic similarities. Maybe they can throw some Pioneer 3 ruins in there for story reasons, which would be JUSTIFIED since its a sequel and thus probably in the same universe just at a far removed time.

But yeah, PSO fanboys hate PSU because PSU isn't like PSO. PSU Fanboys hate PSO because PSO is too old to be fun to them anymore. PSO2 is [supposed to be] everything good about PSO with a battle system more close to PSU. Everyone is happy.

BIG OLAF
Jul 7, 2011, 12:08 AM
But yeah, PSO fanboys hate PSU because PSU isn't like PSO. PSU Fanboys hate PSO because PSO is too old to be fun to them anymore. PSO2 is [supposed to be] everything good about PSO with a battle system more close to PSU. Everyone is happy.

In theory, at least. People on both sides of the field (PSO and PSU) will find multiple things to bitch about. Like...I don't know...incorrect curvature of the spinal column based on a character's stance. Just an example, haha.

NoiseHERO
Jul 7, 2011, 12:11 AM
Blagh, I always just called anything with numbers and character growth rpg elements. Or backwards just a sub categorey of an rpg game. In that case I'd still call PSO an rpg and shrug off the technicalities.

I still truly believe that theres no way this game will have a truly great story. But I wish Sakai luck, and I do think there's a possibility it can be bearable.

But if anything I'm hoping "benimaru's" possible tie-in to PSO2 isn't already hinting that we'll have a corny story...

edit:
as for PSO vs PSU, I'm on the side that thinks 80% of PSO's hype is extremely old news, and thought PSU could've gone on the right path, but bombed horribly. and I just want them to fix everything and added into this clearly completely new and different, while still holding the same base gameplay.

Run in all badass with your friends -> kill monsters -> look cool -> get rares -> chill in the lobby's/room + Everything is awesome cause it's japanese and in space, but somehow not lame = Success. Everything else is just pointless nit picking and over analytic fanboy bitching.

Corey Blue
Jul 7, 2011, 12:16 AM
A dark story filled with tragedy and survival is what I'm hoping for.

RemiusTA
Jul 7, 2011, 01:04 AM
In theory, at least. People on both sides of the field (PSO and PSU) will find multiple things to bitch about. Like...I don't know...incorrect curvature of the spinal column based on a character's stance. Just an example, haha.

Yeah well. Fuck em.





Blagh, I always just called anything with numbers and character growth rpg elements. Or backwards just a sub categorey of an rpg game. In that case I'd still call PSO an rpg and shrug off the technicalities.


Yeah, you're right i guess. But at the same time, Final Fantasy and PSO....really dont mix well. Phantasy Star, sure, but not the newer ones.

BIG OLAF
Jul 7, 2011, 02:06 AM
Yeah well. Fuck em.

My thoughts exactly.

Nitro Vordex
Jul 7, 2011, 02:21 AM
Like...I don't know...incorrect curvature of the spinal column based on a character's stance. Just an example, haha.
It was stupid looking. Stop bringing it up.

NoiseHERO
Jul 7, 2011, 02:28 AM
It was stupid looking. Stop bringing it up.

But it was such a stupid thing to be bothered by as well... So nobody's really better.

Nitro Vordex
Jul 7, 2011, 02:29 AM
But it was such a stupid thing to be bothered by as well... So nobody's really better.
Don't make me get anatomy books, boy.

Mike
Jul 7, 2011, 02:33 AM
And no, PSO is not an RPG, it was an MMORPG.
More MO than MMO. There was no massive multiplayer content to it.


I think Casts were much more functional on PSO, but i do believe they definitely had free will. But then again...they're casts.
Androids had free will but older models didn't. Shino's quest in PSO touches on this. Also, "casts" don't exist in PSO. Androids do, casts don't. The naming for the robots in PSU likely came from the class names of the male androids in PSO but other than class names, no android characters are refered to as casts in PSO.

BIG OLAF
Jul 7, 2011, 02:43 AM
It was stupid looking. Stop bringing it up.

Only if one is bothered by inexplicably unimportant details that have nowhere near any sort of significant impact on the game as a whole. I just think it's silly.

But, all right. I'll stop talking about it.

Nitro Vordex
Jul 7, 2011, 03:02 AM
It was aesthetics. Aesthetics, however, come after gameplay. After gameplay, THEN the graphics come into question, and I personally did not like the weird hunchback thing going on. Maybe it was just that screenshot.

But oh man, that thread was great regardless.

More on topic:...uh, something about story. Story. Story. Hmm, story. Might have to break out Generic Anime Plots vol.2011

ttdestroy
Jul 7, 2011, 03:22 AM
If this ain't even taking place on Ragol does that mean there won't be very many ties(or none at all) to the first game? 'Cuz if that's the case why even call it PSO2?

NoiseHERO
Jul 7, 2011, 04:17 AM
If this ain't even taking place on Ragol does that mean there won't be very many ties(or none at all) to the first game? 'Cuz if that's the case why even call it PSO2?

You should read like at least 10 other threads in this section, then read this whole thread again.

RemiusTA
Jul 7, 2011, 04:19 AM
More MO than MMO. There was no massive multiplayer content to it.


Well that follows the same logic as Michaeru was after. You converse with hundreds of unique players a day.

It's an MMO by any classification standards.


Edit:




If you guys bring up that fucking girls spine one more god damn time im going to rip your balls off. Are you going to complain about the giant 400 lb sword shes carrying on her back, her natural unnaturally red hair color or the technology behind the bra shes wearing that gives her that wonderous perkyness in her tits next? I could have sworn hunewearls were dark skinned by default in PSO what the fuck did she just change race or something OH WAIT how about we bitch about how her ears are COMPLETELY elongated and stretched out like that, i mean NOBODY has ears like those what the fuck is this shit

if you dont believe me then i guess i have to go whip out my ANATOMY BOOK to show you fools



(seriously people. Leave it alone. It's 1) a videogame and 2) from japan. It looks absolutely fine and can always be worse.)

NoiseHERO
Jul 7, 2011, 04:27 AM
If you guys bring up that fucking girls spine one more god damn time im going to rip your balls off. Are you going to complain about the giant sword 400 lb sword shes carrying on her back, her unnaturally red natural hair color or the technology behind the bra shes wearing that gives her that wonderous perkyness in her tits next? OH WAIT how about we bitch about how her ears are COMPLETELY elongated and stretched out like that, i mean NOBODY has ears like those what the fuck is this shit

if you dont believe me then i guess i have to go whip out my ANATOMY BOOK to show you fools



(seriously people. Leave it alone. It's 1) a videogame and 2) from japan. It looks absolutely fine

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL *remembering how much I laughed at that thread*

But yeah I'm on the "spine looks fine/meh" side.

edit:
Well I laugh at 98% of the threads on here anyway.

Nitro Vordex
Jul 7, 2011, 01:47 PM
Edit:




If you guys bring up that fucking girls spine one more god damn time im going to rip your balls off. Are you going to complain about the giant sword 400 lb sword shes carrying on her back, her natural unnaturally red hair color or the technology behind the bra shes wearing that gives her that wonderous perkyness in her tits next? I could have sworn hunewearls were dark skinned by default in PSO what the fuck did she just change race or something OH WAIT how about we bitch about how her ears are COMPLETELY elongated and stretched out like that, i mean NOBODY has ears like those what the fuck is this shit

if you dont believe me then i guess i have to go whip out my ANATOMY BOOK to show you fools



(seriously people. Leave it alone. It's 1) a videogame and 2) from japan. It looks absolutely fine and can always be worse.)
Sword could be argued, hair could be argued, tits could be argued, skin could be argued, ears could be argued. Her goddamn FUCKED UP SPINE WHAT IS THAT SHIT could be argued.

in this post: u :mad:

GCoffee
Jul 7, 2011, 02:02 PM
Dark god indeed. Unkillable, but can be subdued and sealed away for someone else to deal with. If that was the case, just how many worlds are out there dealing with it?

Actually, Dark Falz and Olga Flow killed eachother as explained in Episode 3. ^^
The Amplum Umbra that produces the Germ was created from the leftovers of the fight and slowly regenerated the power of Dark Falz so he could awake yet again. Never happened, though. We destroyed the Amplum Umbra.
The Dark Falz in PSZ supposedly was brought onto Coral via experimental probes from Pioneer 1, and even though he was destroyed eventually aswell, a PSZ quest explaisn that Dark Falz is reborn as much as it pleases if there simply is enough dark energy or the like to feed on. Basicially, the premise changes all the time a new sequel comes out.

Yet I wonder where that new Dark Falz is supposed to come from.

Tetsaru
Jul 7, 2011, 02:06 PM
We're talking about spines again? Really? :rolleyes:

Well, maybe I SHOULD be concerned. I mean, if I can make another female alternate character again, I'll have the proportions slider adjusted so she'll have the biggest boobs possible anyway. Who knows what that'll do to her back? Will she suffer stat penalties? :wacko:

Nitro Vordex
Jul 7, 2011, 02:10 PM
We're talking about spines again? Really? :rolleyes:

Well, maybe I SHOULD be concerned. I mean, if I can make another female alternate character again, I'll have the proportions slider adjusted so she'll have the biggest boobs possible anyway. Who knows what that'll do to her back? Will she suffer stat penalties? :wacko:
It should make her ATA fall, because they'd get in the way. Or have a speed reduction.

Revy
Jul 7, 2011, 02:15 PM
Actually, Dark Falz and Olga Flow killed eachother as explained in Episode 3. ^^
The Amplum Umbra that produces the Germ was created from the leftovers of the fight and slowly regenerated the power of Dark Falz so he could awake yet again. Never happened, though. We destroyed the Amplum Umbra.
The Dark Falz in PSZ supposedly was brought onto Coral via experimental probes from Pioneer 1, and even though he was destroyed eventually aswell, a PSZ quest explaisn that Dark Falz is reborn as much as it pleases if there simply is enough dark energy or the like to feed on. Basicially, the premise changes all the time a new sequel comes out.

Yet I wonder where that new Dark Falz is supposed to come from.

They killed eachother? wat? Pretty sure I killed them :X - I never finished episode 3, but when was that covered? I didn't think PS0 had much to do with the main storyline, just thought it had the same kinda "Mother Brain" stuff that was in PSU. Oh and can anyone fill me in on what the heck epsiode 4 was about again?

GCoffee
Jul 7, 2011, 02:25 PM
They killed eachother? wat? Pretty sure I killed them :X - I never finished episode 3, but when was that covered? I didn't think PS0 had much to do with the main storyline, just thought it had the same kinda "Mother Brain" stuff that was in PSU. Oh and can anyone fill me in on what the heck epsiode 4 was about again?

I suppose it was meant to be like that back in the days, but Episode III makes it clear that both Dark Falz and Olga Flow merely fleed from battle after losing to you. Later on Rico and Flowen respecively influenced their parasites controlling them to develop a deep-rooting mistrust in eachother, ending in a clash of both entities that got both of them killed. Endu and the Amplum Umbra were born/resulted from that incident. If memory serves me right Endu gains a last chance to 'talk' to both Rico and Flowern before the final battle if you pick him for it (and meet all those other complicated conditions Episode III wanted you to in order to see important story sequences), and he refers to both of them as his parents.

Oh and PSU had the same Mother Brain stuff in it that PSII had. So much fanservice. :(

Tetsaru
Jul 7, 2011, 02:29 PM
It should make her ATA fall, because they'd get in the way. Or have a speed reduction.

Lol, guess it'd be something like this? (it's safe, don't worry)

[spoiler-box]http://th06.deviantart.net/fs70/PRE/f/2011/172/6/c/mobility_by_matsu_sensei-d3jmk2c.jpg[/spoiler-box]

But then again, shouldn't be a problem. Everyone knows that, in video games and anime, the chicks with the best figures and most revealing outfits are the strongest. Once I find the next Voloyal outfit in this game, she'll be unstoppable. :wacko:

RemiusTA
Jul 7, 2011, 03:27 PM
in this post: u :mad:

BTW i dont know if you noticed but i definitely noticed that if you look closely you can see that some parts of her body are actually FLAT what the fuck is with that it's like her body is made out of triangles or something it's so fucking wierd i think sonic team should just give up they suck at anatomy people do not have random flat spots on their bodies also its like her underwear is grafted onto her skin fuck they dont know how humans work at all and those ears are still bugging me the fuck out WHY IS SHE SO WIERD LOOKING MAN this game is dumb im gonna go read more anatomy books to study for my videogame anatomy correction classes so i can sound smart when people ask me how spines work in videogames because im tired videogame animators not reading anatomy books because they fucking suck i mean look at ramarl her hair is way too long she would get it caught in branches irl thats so impractical i cant believe they even did it man sonic team needs to read hair anatomy books too

also spines

blace
Jul 7, 2011, 04:00 PM
Actually, Dark Falz and Olga Flow killed eachother as explained in Episode 3. ^^
The Amplum Umbra that produces the Germ was created from the leftovers of the fight and slowly regenerated the power of Dark Falz so he could awake yet again. Never happened, though. We destroyed the Amplum Umbra.
The Dark Falz in PSZ supposedly was brought onto Coral via experimental probes from Pioneer 1, and even though he was destroyed eventually aswell, a PSZ quest explaisn that Dark Falz is reborn as much as it pleases if there simply is enough dark energy or the like to feed on. Basicially, the premise changes all the time a new sequel comes out.

Yet I wonder where that new Dark Falz is supposed to come from.
I didn't get to that part unfortunately, playing as Arkz made me rage, and I was stuck at Caster(or was it Pollux?) as Hunters so that made me rage.

But I do remember reading somewhere that it ressurects itself whenever it pleases, but will it ever end? Or will it be like Final Fantasy and its neverending battle between good and evil?