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View Full Version : PSU Regarding Edward's statement of JP PSU and 360 PSU being "different versions"



Tetsaru
Jul 21, 2011, 06:33 PM
This thread is to avoid the whole "off-topic discussion" Ryna mentioned in Edward's original thread. Although I know a lot of people have already voiced their opinions, I'm curious as to everyone's reaction to his statement, as it seems to be giving us some insight into Sega's intentions for the future (or lack thereof) of PSU.

Here's the original quote, in case anyone missed it; emphasis on the bolded portion:

[spoiler-box]

I know this is one of the biggest questions right now. It's also something best addressed on our official forums, when they return. Let me say what I can though.

1) First, when you say "lacks support" ... you're entitled to your opinion, of course. I would say if you would like to engage in actual discussion with me here -- where I'm just a lowly user but still a representative of SEGA -- please let's not get into the "they hate us / they don't care" mode. It isn't true and it isn't productive :( That doesn't mean things can't be done better or that there have been no mistakes -- quite the contrary -- but there's a lot of people who are working very hard to deliver the best game possible. You may not like everything, but this is an MMO which has done well for 4+ years with regular updates, events, and missions. Let's have some perspective :)

2) Officially, the XB360 version is a different version of the game. It is not meant as a duplicate of the JP version. You can disagree with that but that is the official stance, and so whatever communication you're going to hear from me or us, that's the ultimate message. That means that saying "it was like X there but it's like Y here and therefore it is broken" isn't something we can respond to, officially. They are different versions for a reason, and supplying new artwork to the XB360 is not the same as providing new artwork to the PC version. I know there's a fuzzy line there, some things, yes, it's worth raising the issue for sure. I said this on our forums before they went down and if you are unsure of what is "okay" to bring up ... you can always ask!

3) That said -- while I have to respect and discuss our official SEGA stance, I won't pretend you aren't all familiar with the JP version of the game. Of course you are. And of course our updates generally have followed what theirs were. I know that's the case, and so do you. So as far as that goes, I'm sorry that right now we aren't seeing the artwork you were expecting.

4) The truth is, it was a matter of getting these items or nothing at all. There are not unlimited resources to work on this, and again, XB360 is a unique platform to provide new content to an existing game. I promise we are doing the best we can with what we have, and this is something I did my best to help work out -- rather than cutting content entirely, we tried to find a way to supply us with something comparable. For those of you about to protest "it isn't comparable!", please keep reading :) Otherwise -- please keep in mind that we have only so many people at SEGA, and time is always precious. Some of these people must work on other games; particularly games that are sequels to previous much-loved games for which certain websites are named, if you get my very subtle hint. The point is, we can't always make everything just how you want it but we will do our best to respond to what the game & players need.

5) What I can say is I think there can be some changes made to the items we are seeing. That's not a promise about what will happen but it's my gut feeling and I think it's quite reasonable. If we accept that ours is a distinct version -- and honestly, for this discussion to progress, we have to, or it will be forever stuck at 'yes it is / no it isn't / I hate you I hate you!" -- then we can also discuss ways to improve *our* version. I'm open to that and encourage us to discuss that once we return to our official forums. Just so we are on the same page -- I mean that we can look at how the weapons are balanced, the elements (instead of the surplus of neutral weapons...), the et cetera.

There we are. I hope this works as something of an update from me -- please let's wait to discuss more until we return (honestly I hope it is not much longer, I know they are hurrying to bring us back now).

And, if you doubted it was me, hopefully the length of this post convinced you :)
[/spoiler-box]

Personally, I think this was a horrible move by Sega when it was promised that the 360 version would receive more updates after the PC/PS2 servers went down. Even though I no longer play PSU, I find it very disheartening and unfair to those who do to know that the JP servers will remain ahead of the rest of us, instead of being our equal, and that this problem still has yet to be properly addressed after 4 years.

Discuss.

oG Epik
Jul 21, 2011, 06:38 PM
" Officially, the XB360 version is a different version of the game. It is not meant as a duplicate of the JP version. You can disagree with that but that is the official stance, and so whatever communication you're going to hear from me or us, that's the ultimate message. That means that saying "it was like X there but it's like Y here and therefore it is broken" isn't something we can respond to, officially. They are different versions for a reason, and supplying new artwork to the XB360 is not the same as providing new artwork to the PC version. I know there's a fuzzy line there, some things, yes, it's worth raising the issue for sure. I said this on our forums before they went down and if you are unsure of what is "okay" to bring up ... you can always ask!" Now this is true but serious re-skins why give us same weapons different name and stats when you think of a new design or just give us twin diobalics

Halcyote
Jul 21, 2011, 07:48 PM
This thread is going to be fun to read.

Powder Keg
Jul 21, 2011, 07:51 PM
This thread is going to be fun to read.

Not really. :(

Quatre52
Jul 21, 2011, 07:53 PM
was this really needed?

Especially considering you dont even play the game anymore....

Halcyote
Jul 21, 2011, 07:55 PM
Not really. :(

If people actually respond seriously as they did with Edward's thread, then yes it will.

DesignZ
Jul 21, 2011, 08:01 PM
was this really needed?

Especially considering you dont even play the game anymore....
Yes, everyone's entitled to their own opinion rather they play or not. He/She has played the game before and I'm sure they get tired of the bull like most are.

Tetsaru
Jul 21, 2011, 08:04 PM
was this really needed?

Especially considering you dont even play the game anymore....

It'd be my luck that I'd only get my posts censored here too, had I not posted this... from previous experiences, Ryna and I don't really get along too well (no offense :razz: ).

And just because I don't play the game anymore doesn't mean I'm not concerned for everyone else who does. Anyone can see it's not right for Sega to treat you guys like this. :(

blazingsonic
Jul 21, 2011, 08:16 PM
We need more people like you, as for me, I'm mulling over rather to complete story mode and stick around to see what happens or, End my sub.

gordon/alpha999
Jul 21, 2011, 08:18 PM
Seg@ is the joke to the gaming industry.

EvilMag
Jul 21, 2011, 08:22 PM
Redownloading PSU JP tonight. I tried earlier today but got an error and I'm assuming one of my files got damaged.

Fuck 360. I was gonna plan to go there but with the recent events happening...

D-Inferno
Jul 21, 2011, 08:33 PM
This is why PSO2 should be PC-only with shared servers. No need to worry about having to "port" updates and have them go through Micro$oft.

blazingsonic
Jul 21, 2011, 08:34 PM
You forget PS3, Look at how it was back when it was PS2, and look at DCUO.

D-Inferno
Jul 21, 2011, 08:37 PM
Having a PS3 version would still likely cause a userbase split. Plus DLC/ect can be added faster to the PC version.

gordon/alpha999
Jul 21, 2011, 08:41 PM
Either way i wouldn't want PSO2 handled in the wrong hands.

WiZ1988
Jul 21, 2011, 08:49 PM
Either way i wouldn't want PSO2 handled in the wrong hands.

Agreed

JP Pulpy
Jul 21, 2011, 09:11 PM
I've learned my lesson with sega of america over the past what 4-5 years? I'm playing PSO2 jp from the start.8-)

Anyone else here not even going to give the new english version a chance?

Midori Oku
Jul 21, 2011, 09:28 PM
I've learned my lesson with sega of america over the past what 4-5 years? I'm playing PSO2 jp from the start.8-)

Anyone else here not even going to give the new english version a chance?

Without a doubt I will be on JP.

Masterflower
Jul 21, 2011, 09:44 PM
Actually I do want PSO2 to be ported on the PS3. Cuz if worst comes to worst, I can use the PSN cards to pay for PSO2 for people like me don't have JP CCs lol. Tho I plan to play this on PC, I still would like to way out my options.

gordon/alpha999
Jul 21, 2011, 09:47 PM
Actually I do want PSO2 to be ported on the PS3. Cuz if worst comes to worst, I can use the PSN cards to pay for PSO2 for people like me don't have JP CCs lol. Tho I plan to play this on PC, I still would like to way out my options.

What if Sony pull a Micro$oft and forbid pay from those ?

Even though the PSN card is a good substitute, Sony could look at it just as Microsoft look at PSU. Let PC take us in it's grasp.

blazingsonic
Jul 21, 2011, 10:10 PM
Having a PS3 version would still likely cause a userbase split. Plus DLC/ect can be added faster to the PC version.

Both PC and PS3 versions of DCUO get updated at the sametime.

Shadowth117
Jul 21, 2011, 10:20 PM
Both PC and PS3 versions of DCUO get updated at the sametime.

This. Sega's already chosen to use what appear to be 360 launch level graphics for PSO2 so I see nothing holding them back there. And since Sony doesn't do the whole update BS there really aren't many problems there either. Sega, could make it work for the 360 even if they honestly tried, but its obvious from their treatment of the PSU 360 servers that that won't happen.

I just hope the game is really good or so bad that they have no excuse, but to look at themselves to see what was wrong with it.

unicorn
Jul 21, 2011, 10:23 PM
Yeah they're different.

The 360 version is a flop server and JP isnt. :D

Edward is bullshitting by saying 360 isnt supposed to get the same updates. They got pretty much the same updates up until this point.

Masterflower
Jul 21, 2011, 10:27 PM
You know what... PSO2 for PS Vita! Apparently SE had talks about wanting to do a straight port of FFXI on the PS Vita. Why not do the same Sega :D (yeah right... like that will ever happen...how the hell would FFXI work on a handheld...?)

gordon/alpha999
Jul 21, 2011, 10:28 PM
"These are"Unique Items" exclusive to ____"

I do not want to see that term in PSO2.

blazingsonic
Jul 21, 2011, 10:34 PM
This. Sega's already chosen to use what appear to be 360 launch level graphics for PSO2 so I see nothing holding them back there. And since Sony doesn't do the whole update BS there really aren't many problems there either. Sega, could make it work for the 360 even if they honestly tried, but its obvious from their treatment of the PSU 360 servers that that won't happen.

I just hope the game is really good or so bad that they have no excuse, but to look at themselves to see what was wrong with it.

Oh man, get this, want more proof how bad Microsoft is with DLC, Remember Marvel Ultimate Alliance 2, well on Xbox Live the content was pulled down, on PSN it's still there AND free that includes the Juggernaunt preorder bonus, So Edward should have simply said that Microsoft is the problem. But yeah PSO2 can work on a PS3 I'm sure with Sega's track record they don't do THAT much with it.

Gypsy72
Jul 21, 2011, 10:38 PM
all i have to say is if we truly are our own version we should get our own unique weapons and unique skins and unique events, clothes etc that japan doesn't get.... but that's never going to happen, so as far as i'm concerned it's a line of bull...

Recon Tactical
Jul 21, 2011, 10:39 PM
"These are"Unique Items" exclusive to ____"

I do not want to see that term in PSO2.

That's why I'm sure as hell hoping PSO2 remains a PC exclusive. Going by my 3 years of experience on the **** stain that is the Xbox 360 servers, I can tell you for a fact that the console community consists of the worst human beings you could imagine. Granted PSO2 may not be any better, but at least I won't need to actually buy a keyboard to give them a piece of my mind.

blazingsonic
Jul 21, 2011, 10:43 PM
That's why I'm sure as hell hoping PSO2 remains a PC exclusive. Going by my 3 years of experience on the **** stain that is the Xbox 360 servers, I can tell you for a fact that the console community consists of the worst human beings you could imagine. Granted PSO2 may not be any better, but at least I won't need to actually buy a keyboard to give them a piece of my mind.

You don't use a USB keyboard or are you on a laptop?
Why do so many people here forget about the PS3?

BIG OLAF
Jul 21, 2011, 10:44 PM
If you think about it, if we were truly a "unique version", then we would have had "unique" updates since the very beginning of the game, almost five years ago. The fact that SEGA has just recently pulled this "unique server" policy out of their ass shows that they were running out of options and copped out with that excuse, thinking it was better than just telling us "oh, well SoJ has finally lost all interest in keeping your version of the game at least a little on-par with the JP version, sorry!"

Now, they're trying their damnedest to spin their new policy...but no one's buying it (except for those clueless few).

Recon Tactical
Jul 21, 2011, 10:45 PM
You don't use a USB keyboard or are you on a laptop?
Why do so many people here forget about the PS3?

I'm on a laptop. Also, I would get a USB keyboard for my 360, but that'd just seem awkward for me - constantly switching between keyboard and controller.. I could never get used to that.

Anon_Fire
Jul 21, 2011, 10:46 PM
I'm on a laptop. Also, I would get a USB keyboard for my 360, but that'd just seem awkward for me - constantly switching between keyboard and controller.. I could never get used to that.

It's no problem, really.

I had to do that when I was on the PS2

xxmadplayerxx
Jul 21, 2011, 10:57 PM
I think a majority of the PSU xbox comunity has "Big brother syndrome" , im not quitting just because the big brother japanese server has it better.
So Cmon people cheer up and enjoy what we have..

gordon/alpha999
Jul 21, 2011, 11:04 PM
I think a majority of the PSU xbox comunity has "Big brother syndrome" , im not quitting just because the big brother japanese server has it better.
So Cmon people cheer up and enjoy what we have..

It's too late for that.

thunder-ray
Jul 22, 2011, 12:18 AM
You don't use a USB keyboard or are you on a laptop?
Why do so many people here forget about the PS3?Good question.


I think a majority of the PSU xbox comunity has "Big brother syndrome" , im not quitting just because the big brother japanese server has it better.
So Cmon people cheer up and enjoy what we have..If I didnt lose my old account on the ps2/pc servers then I would feel the same sadly i dont.

Taijutsu-Joshua
Jul 22, 2011, 12:55 AM
I'm probably throwing my neck out on a cutting board here, but can I ask exactly what the problem is? Why Edward's statement riled up so many of you? Why it is such a big deal?

All you guys sound pretty determined about this situation being solved, I just wanna know why it's such a big deal.

Vashyron
Jul 22, 2011, 01:00 AM
Are people here venting or do they believe Sega actually gives a crap? After 5 years people should of learned otherwise, even more so on a Fansite.

Unless your in Denial you should know that the "Unique" story along with the renamed weapons should tell you 360 isn't getting them "fixed." Are people forgetting they still haven't bothered to fix the month(s) old bugs? Specifically ones like Sevacuc being invisible and Tiga De Regan Sabers requiring materials that do not exist? Or currently all new Melee weapons coming out Neutral? Or even past fuckups that shouldn't of happened like Ares Espada only hitting once and certain weapons being unequippable to certain classes unintentionally. All things that any other company would get slaughtered for.
Do realize this means they don't test any of the new added updates as well.

Either Deal with it or Cancel your sub, if you still believe they are going to fix all of this and still update the game regularly with new updates... that amount of "optimism" can't be healthy. (Or hey maybe you don't care.)

Sega aren't going to come out and Say "Nope your not going to get anything new." They can't profit from that.

Some people may Remember Edward promising GC content more than a year ago, what if instead he said "Nope sorry guys in about a year you'll stop getting new item models. :wacko:"

That should speak for it's self.

bloodflowers
Jul 22, 2011, 02:34 AM
I think a majority of the PSU xbox comunity has "Big brother syndrome" , im not quitting just because the big brother japanese server has it better.
So Cmon people cheer up and enjoy what we have..

Well I was going to try enjoying what we have, but then my cool new laser looked like the one I found four years ago, and my new spear was neutral and therefore useless.

dias_flac_0g
Jul 22, 2011, 03:29 AM
"Unique versions" my ass haha.

Only an idiot would believe that **** xD

Lock
Jul 22, 2011, 04:37 AM
we need a "NEWER" version in my opinion

Kizer497
Jul 22, 2011, 11:43 AM
I would play the jp version but I cant speak nor read Japanese Its to much work for me, so im just w8 for the us version of pso2 and see what happens.

Kizer497
Jul 22, 2011, 11:46 AM
It's too late for that.
its not really 2 late because we don't know what they are going to do. They didn't say we wasn't going to give us more stuff. just w8 and see or just quit.

MoonlightMyau
Jul 22, 2011, 01:02 PM
I think a majority of the PSU xbox comunity has "Big brother syndrome" , im not quitting just because the big brother japanese server has it better.
So Cmon people cheer up and enjoy what we have..

I don't think it's "big brother syndrome"at all. Some people have been paying a monthly fee on top of buying the actual game and add-on for almost 5 years, in the promise that we were simply behind the Japanese version, I don't think anybody had an issue with that as such, it was a little annoying yes. But I think most people were happy that we would at least see the same stuff eventually.

Not only can you download the Japanese version for free, but I think I am right in saying that there is no monthly fee & the premium account update is optional.

So we are essentially paying for their server to be regularly updated, while not getting the same content or a server maintained/updated to anywhere near the same standard.

It is like being kicked in the teeth & the balls simultaneously.

gordon/alpha999
Jul 22, 2011, 02:07 PM
its not really 2 late because we don't know what they are going to do. They didn't say we wasn't going to give us more stuff. just w8 and see or just quit.

We do know they will stall and lie even more.

mr pink
Jul 22, 2011, 02:11 PM
I dont believe in second chances. Here you got this sega of america promising the world to 360 server whip sega of japan is giving the world to you. When I joined 360 side I was givin nothin. Just a fu and have a nice day. As oposed to jp where I was given various 50% weps and a ton of cloths for just joining. Its simple jp is by far the unqiue server.

gordon/alpha999
Jul 22, 2011, 02:21 PM
I dont believe in second chances. Here you got this sega of america promising the world to 360 server whip sega of japan is giving the world to you. When I joined 360 side I was givin nothin. Just a fu and have a nice day. As oposed to jp where I was given various 50% weps and a ton of cloths for just joining. Its simple jp is by far the unqiue server.

Sega has misused the term "Unique".

Psu5675
Jul 22, 2011, 02:40 PM
Officially, the XBOX 360 version is a different version of the game

YES THE XBOX 360 THE S_ _ _ version OF THE GAME FACT PC JP PSU get better

which i could speak JP

I TO can make a statement

Lock
Jul 22, 2011, 02:49 PM
Sega has misused the term "Unique".

I'll say....

Vashyron
Jul 22, 2011, 03:00 PM
its not really 2 late because we don't know what they are going to do. They didn't say we wasn't going to give us more stuff. just w8 and see or just quit.

Of course they wouldn't say that, they can't profit from it.

Their intention is to make players "wait and see." That way they can rake in money from subs.

Slayer76
Jul 22, 2011, 03:45 PM
I'm only playing this game to pass the time now. I'm not playing pso2 at all nor any other sega game. Once Fall hits, im done with sega

Valiant
Jul 22, 2011, 03:55 PM
I'm going to trust Eddy on this one. Oh yeah and I made a PSO-world account.

Ishia
Jul 22, 2011, 03:56 PM
I'm going to trust Eddy on this one. Oh yeah and I made a PSO-world account.

FOOL.

Slayer76
Jul 22, 2011, 03:58 PM
FOOL.

This. And possible excalibur reference? lol

Valiant
Jul 22, 2011, 03:58 PM
FOOL.

I'm just going to see if they can deliver. Sure they've let me down since I was 11 but I'm going to give them one chance to give me a reason to see this game through till its final days.

Slayer76
Jul 22, 2011, 03:59 PM
I'm just going to see if they can deliver. Sure they've let me down since I was 11 but I'm going to give them one chance to give me a reason to see this game through till its final days.

Hope you like "unique" weapons

Frozensword
Jul 22, 2011, 04:50 PM
That's why I'm sure as hell hoping PSO2 remains a PC exclusive. Going by my 3 years of experience on the **** stain that is the Xbox 360 servers, I can tell you for a fact that the console community consists of the worst human beings you could imagine. Granted PSO2 may not be any better, but at least I won't need to actually buy a keyboard to give them a piece of my mind.I am part of the console community thank you very much, and I don't plan on getting PSO2 unless it comes to consoles in America. I enjoy my games in English just like I enjoy them on consoles. A console version might not get the updates of a pc version, but I enjoy playing Phantasy Star games on what they were created on and that is a console. I still find it funny how people forget that PSO showed how that mmorpg games can be made for consoles. I wouldn't be going on this rant if you had not posted what you did.

bupjo
Jul 22, 2011, 04:56 PM
cancelled my subscription today.

Lock
Jul 22, 2011, 05:33 PM
It seems that we are getting less and less these days. Even with the new missions, It was a bit disappointing. Yeah I like the old school maps, but...come on now. Give us something "NEW NEW".

Vintasticvin
Jul 22, 2011, 11:59 PM
For all those complaining and crying about english PSU not being on par with the main Asian region servers please keep in mind The american HQ has little to no workers after the workforce reduced to producing digital products. They also had a bunch of no good hackers messing up their systems which carries our personal data also if you all dont like the service at all I suggest

1. Going to the JP side where the game is up to date and the natives are secretly plotting to get the importers removed. 2. Cancel your subscriptions and never return to a network game managed by Sega Of America . Or three accept the fact we may not never get the neato japanese content, continue to enjoy the game for what it is and be greatful they didnt shut the game servers down while they sort out the mess them hackers left.

So that leaves the question of if Im defending Edward and Sega? Maybe but I dont care Im going to continue enjoying the game while I wait for PSO:2 and continue the fun there.

boomadatigger
Jul 23, 2011, 12:09 AM
For all those complaining and crying about english PSU not being on par with the main Asian region servers please keep in mind The american HQ has little to no workers after the workforce reduced to producing digital products. They also had a bunch of no good hackers messing up their systems which carries our personal data also if you all dont like the service at all I suggest

1. Going to the JP side where the game is up to date and the natives are secretly plotting to get the importers removed. 2. Cancel your subscriptions and never return to a network game managed by Sega Of America . Or three accept the fact we may not never get the neato japanese content, continue to enjoy the game for what it is and be greatful they didnt shut the game servers down while they sort out the mess them hackers left.

So that leaves the question of if Im defending Edward and Sega? Maybe but I dont care Im going to continue enjoying the game while I wait for PSO:2 and continue the fun there.

People are "complaining" because they were basically lied to about what a lot of players thought they were spending money on for the past five years. That's half a decade and then they find out that the money they have been spending for the past five years was not for the game they they were told it was but a "unique" version of the game. Dude, people have every fucking right to complain about it. Continue to enjoy the game for what it is, a p.o.s.? Hell to the fucking no. I think a lot of people will be, or already have, opted for option two and I don't blame them. NOT. ONE. BIT. I usually don't curse but damn, five years of being lied to and you asking players to be reasonable?

Vintasticvin
Jul 23, 2011, 12:27 AM
WOW.... just wow Im in light blinding shock >_> How could such injustice go unpunished for this long </3 I WILL NOT be leaving the forum but I will keep the crusaders in thought and cheer them on from the side lines in hopes of Sega fulfilling the promise they made to the players. And we really do need Mods that will rise up and do their jobs accordingly >_<

padiwac
Jul 23, 2011, 01:06 AM
I'll continue to enjoy the game on the 360 until the servers close. We get regular updates, events and free GC items (a great unique feature) and other problems will be fixed by supplementary updates.

Tyreek
Jul 23, 2011, 02:11 AM
One can only wonder what limitless optimism holds.

I used to be optimistic about Sega. After the flipping fiasco with MAG and then the Lightning Carnival ended,(the inital reason we were held back so far at the time) I thought things were finally gonna go on track. We got the events in order, Innocent Girl was given to us, despite the excuses of technical difficulties with the lack of PC->PSP and probably 360->PSP, and we finally got the chapter closed on EP3 of PSU. Barring that hiccup of not including Dark God S2. until later. Yes, I was very optimistic that Sega was really stepping their game up that year, however sub-par it was. And then they shut the PC version down.

And then the talk of better things for the Phantasy Star franchise now that the PC servers went kaput, and the mention of better and faster updates for the 360 servers that was rolled around the forum like a ball, whether or not Sega said it. And after all this drama, the supplemental update FINALLY comes for the regional servers. While I didn't own a 360 for PSU, I was happy for the players to get what was so anticipated.

And funniest thing to see, now that they've gone through the first supp. update, something that the JP servers have already gone over a year through before we did, and the 360 servers don't have ANYTHING that goes towards the second supp. update. You know, the update that was applied to the game BEFORE The Great Arms Race, with Exam and Firearm and Kongora and Ank Giaz. That was something anticipated by the players, like the rest of the updates. Bar GC items, seeing as you'll own only 1 of any of those thanks to this GAR and not be able to trade them at all, unlike the JP version where you can get them all as long as they're bought. And when that wasn't enough, they come out with Distant Memory, which was the start of new weaponry from PSP2. And instead... You got renamed, reskinned weaponry with the talk of "unique" content. And it seems that's the final word by Edward. All those anticipations and inspirations crushed.

I kept myself quiet about my opinion on SEGA, but I feel for you guys, I really do. How you will be able to deal with the third content update I dunno. SoA will have to pull a rabbit of its ass and more if they've failed to even give out the second supp. update for you guys at this point in time. And it sounds like currently, they're not even mentioning a hint or whisper about it. Only time will tell. Unique content? I'm sorry, but not even I will be that gullible enough to sit there and support that. If unique content is their game, they need to do something A LOT BETTER than this. The JP servers have already tasted the fruits of Update 3. What will that mean for the 360 exactly when its supposed to come?

Sorry for this long-winded response, but that is MY one and ONLY two cents about this from now on. I wish the best for you guys for whatever time this server has left.

Lock
Jul 23, 2011, 02:18 AM
For all those complaining and crying about english PSU not being on par with the main Asian region servers please keep in mind The american HQ has little to no workers after the workforce reduced to producing digital products. They also had a bunch of no good hackers messing up their systems which carries our personal data also if you all dont like the service at all I suggest

1. Going to the JP side where the game is up to date and the natives are secretly plotting to get the importers removed. 2. Cancel your subscriptions and never return to a network game managed by Sega Of America . Or three accept the fact we may not never get the neato japanese content, continue to enjoy the game for what it is and be greatful they didnt shut the game servers down while they sort out the mess them hackers left.

So that leaves the question of if Im defending Edward and Sega? Maybe but I dont care Im going to continue enjoying the game while I wait for PSO:2 and continue the fun there.

well, thats nice and all, but is it really wrong to ask for more? Even if it was just a little? I mean when M.A.G came out, that was one of the best updates. It pass and i was really looking forward to the next best thing.

Its good to like the game man. I like it too, but I just want a little more.

Vintasticvin
Jul 23, 2011, 02:38 AM
well, thats nice and all, but is it really wrong to ask for more? Even if it was just a little? I mean when M.A.G came out, that was one of the best updates. It pass and i was really looking forward to the next best thing.

Its good to like the game man. I like it too, but I just want a little more.

I just learned the horrible truth from Yuri the serious thread cat :no: And yeah they need to pay attention to their EU users as well X_X And we should get a lil bit more.

Hatemachine
Jul 23, 2011, 04:30 AM
Guess i'll toss my 2 cents in, nothin else to do with it, I gotta say thise UNIQUE version excuse (let's call it what it is) is simply unacceptable.

It's the SAME GAME, SAME CODING, SAME MECHANICS, different Voice overs, and language settings are the ONLY things that make the games Unique.

And OK let's say it IS unique, well then if that means we have to sacrifice new Content to remain as such, it's NOT flippin worth it, we don't want to be UNIQUE, so get bent and cough up the good's we KNOW exist and can find NO viable reason not to implement the new goodies.

This was an Issue back when me and my friend quit in 2008, Her and I returned last month in time to start the Great arms race only to find out the Non JP versions are STILL getting the shaft when it comes to content.

When we scan the Item database and see a metric SH!T ton of neat items NOT AVAILABLE it makes ya wonder WHY? why not implement the items? the missions? HELL how's about at LEAST a bug fix, we got the return of the MG glitch, weapons dropping as Neutrals, and impossible boards, and people are STILL after all this time getting clipping issues and stuck INSIDE huge monsters.

I'll continue to play though, as, A, I happen to be dumb as a post and still love the PSU game and it's mechanics vs most other online games, and B, My friend happens to be as dense and stupid as I am and is sticking around for the same reasons.

WHEW so much for 2 cents, that there was a whole buck fifty, DAMN IT shoulda bought a Cheeseburger with it, OH WELL see ya'll round.

boomadatigger
Jul 23, 2011, 06:21 AM
Man, I wouldn't be surprised if Edward comes back to the forum and posts "U mad, bro?"

Eat poo derek
Jul 23, 2011, 09:11 AM
I guess sega was to "unique" to keep making consoles,but ya they dont make systems for a reason LOL

Slayer76
Jul 23, 2011, 09:49 AM
I'll continue to enjoy the game on the 360 until the servers close. We get regular updates, events and free GC items (a great unique feature) and other problems will be fixed by supplementary updates.

We will probably never see the majority of GC items and they most likely won't fix the skins for PSP2 weapons on our servers.

Noc Codez
Jul 23, 2011, 10:14 AM
Never seen booma cure befre..he means buissness....

MistyWaters
Jul 23, 2011, 10:21 AM
Methinks I'm finding this "Unique" situation more entertaining than it should be.

I've been tempted to join the 360 version after the PC/PS2 servers went belly-up, but.. That's a definite "No" for sure.

...Could make a drinking game out of this. Every time SoA breaks hearts, take a shot. Although we'd all die of alcohol poisoning before we knew it.

Keilyn
Jul 23, 2011, 10:24 AM
I wouldnt trust anything Edward says.

Considering he called us "Wayward" in his opening post returning here was insulting enough. Look up the definition of the word...its almost like we are that way simply because we aren't all registered into the 360 version and the official forums.

MoonlightMyau
Jul 23, 2011, 10:41 AM
I wouldnt trust anything Edward says.

Considering he called us "Wayward" in his opening post returning here was insulting enough. Look up the definition of the word...its almost like we are that way simply because we aren't all registered into the 360 version and the official forums.

That actually really annoyed me, at first I thought I must've misread. What a strange thing to calls us, especially as the definition of the word could easily describe Sega at this point.




[SPOILER-BOX]Definition of WAYWARD

1
: following one's own capricious, wanton, or depraved inclinations : ungovernable <a wayward child>
2
: following no clear principle or law : unpredictable
3
: opposite to what is desired or expected : untoward <wayward fate>[/SPOILER-BOX]

momonpso
Jul 23, 2011, 10:55 AM
OK I think this is kind of going a bit too far. Edward had no intention of being disrespectful in any way. Another definition for the word would be "tending to stray" and I believe that was his implied meaning. Since the forums are down people have strayed to other forums. No malice was intended. I myself have used that word in that context before.
There are enough bad feelings right now with this situation, we do not need to go looking for more by putting every word under a microscope.

Totori
Jul 23, 2011, 11:11 AM
OK I think this is kind of going a bit too far. Edward had no intention of being disrespectful in any way. Another definition for the word would be "tending to stray" and I believe that was his implied meaning. Since the forums are down people have strayed to other forums. No malice was intended. I myself have used that word in that context before.
There are enough bad feelings right now with this situation, we do not need to go looking for more by putting every word under a microscope.

That's the best thing I heard all day, he's right I think everyone is just looking into this too hard.

sage 69er
Jul 23, 2011, 11:14 AM
At least i know now how Sega view the rest of the world. Looks like i'll give pso2 a miss as we know how it'll end up.

MoonlightMyau
Jul 23, 2011, 11:50 AM
OK I think this is kind of going a bit too far. Edward had no intention of being disrespectful in any way. Another definition for the word would be "tending to stray" and I believe that was his implied meaning. Since the forums are down people have strayed to other forums. No malice was intended. I myself have used that word in that context before.
There are enough bad feelings right now with this situation, we do not need to go looking for more by putting every word under a microscope.

I am sure there wasn't, the choice of word just annoyed me given what followed it. I actually have A LOT of time and respect for Edward & said in his thread that I do not blame him personally. I also didn't mean to imply that he "attacked"us, I was simply pointing out the irony in his word choice.

I have stuck with Sega my whole entire life & find myself constantly standing up for them/their games. But this "different version" malarky has got me to my limit. Even people who don't play that I've mentioned the situation to are horrified.

There have been many instances over the PSO/U years where people have overreacted, I do not think this is one of those occasions. The current service which people are PAYING for is completely unacceptable.

People have been misled and treated unfairly & that just isn't right.

Totori
Jul 23, 2011, 12:04 PM
It's nothing new, Edward was right this version is different, it's not SOA choice it's Sonic Team's choice. Just because you couldn't get your so loved weapons isn't a good reason to complain.

The lack of updates are only because Sonic Team is constantly busy with development, and most likely not enough people to spare for porting any updates, so we get left behind a little.

DragonForce
Jul 23, 2011, 12:07 PM
I've been with PSU since day 1 and if there's one thing that I've seen that sega CAN'T do it's concentrate itself in more than one area. I remember when we were getting weekly updates and on the main site it would tell us what we're getting prior to getting the update. Funny how it went from that to this...

This whole "unique server" excuse is a fat fucking lie. I bet if they took all the weapons post-2nd Update from the japan server and reskinned them I bet they'd lose almost all their players. I mean why do we play this shit in the first place? I don't know about you guys, but I play to get better shit and I also care about the uniqueness of the equipment I'm using.

I feel sorry for Ed, though. He has to come up with this bullshit because it's his job. He can't openly admit the words that are coming out of his mouth are sugar-coated lumps of shit. It's his job to feed us this shit so sega doesn't lose subscribers.

All I'm saying is that if that 2nd Update thing doesn't come in before the end of the year, then you know just how much sega gives a fapping fuck...

Noc Codez
Jul 23, 2011, 12:07 PM
It's nothing new, Edward was right this version is different, it's not SOA choice it's Sonic Team's choice. Just because you couldn't get your so loved weapons isn't a good reason to complain.

The lack of updates are only because Sonic Team is constantly busy with development, and most likely not enough people to spare for porting any updates, so we get left behind a little.

Left behind a little ? 2 1/2 years is a little to you ? Wow... give me some of that thing your taking.


I've been with PSU since day 1 and if there's one thing that I've seen that sega CAN'T do it's concentrate itself in more than one area. I remember when we were getting weekly updates and on the main site it would tell us what we're getting prior to getting the update. Funny how it went from that to this...

This whole "unique server" excuse is a fat fucking lie. I bet if they took all the weapons post-2nd Update from the japan server and reskinned them I bet they'd lose almost all their players. I mean why do we play this shit in the first place? I don't know about you guys, but I play to get better shit and I also care about the uniqueness of the equipment I'm using.

I feel sorry for Ed, though. He has to come up with this bullshit because it's his job. He can't openly admit the words that are coming out of his mouth are sugar-coated lumps of shit. It's his job to feed us this shit so sega doesn't lose subscribers.

All I'm saying is that if that 2nd Update thing doesn't come in before the end of the year, then you know just how much sega gives a fapping fuck...

Amen Brother ! Day 1 player here too

bloodflowers
Jul 23, 2011, 12:15 PM
OK I think this is kind of going a bit too far. Edward had no intention of being disrespectful in any way. Another definition for the word would be "tending to stray" and I believe that was his implied meaning. Since the forums are down people have strayed to other forums. No malice was intended. I myself have used that word in that context before.
There are enough bad feelings right now with this situation, we do not need to go looking for more by putting every word under a microscope.

He should address people in places he can't control more often - this topic has not been censored, and as such it represents a more honest and representative response. It's a shame that between the two topics it turned into a hit & run with no more responses from the Sega side.

I think if I was in Edward's job I would simply resign and move on, I couldn't come out with the current company spin like that without feeling like I was betraying my customers and insulting their intelligence. I always thought that was one of the reasons Chillaura moved on, but I could be wrong.

THLPSC
Jul 23, 2011, 12:37 PM
OK I think this is kind of going a bit too far. Edward had no intention of being disrespectful in any way. Another definition for the word would be "tending to stray" and I believe that was his implied meaning. Since the forums are down people have strayed to other forums. No malice was intended. I myself have used that word in that context before.
There are enough bad feelings right now with this situation, we do not need to go looking for more by putting every word under a microscope.

With SOA it is the only way to understand there motives. Please do not try and make excuses for him it is foolish of you.

MoonlightMyau
Jul 23, 2011, 12:44 PM
It's nothing new, Edward was right this version is different, it's not SOA choice it's Sonic Team's choice. Just because you couldn't get your so loved weapons isn't a good reason to complain.

The lack of updates are only because Sonic Team is constantly busy with development, and most likely not enough people to spare for porting any updates, so we get left behind a little.

If it's a different version then that should have been made explicitly clear from the beginning. I am well aware (and I'm sure most people are here) of the ins & outs of Sega/Sonic Team & what has to go through who.

Personally I'm not that bothered about the weapons, but I am bothered about the overall service & how people are treated. People are not getting the advertised service that they are paying for.

If you ordered a steak in a restaurant and got a garden salad, you'd send it back.

Noc Codez
Jul 23, 2011, 12:50 PM
If you ordered a steak in a restaurant and got a garden salad, you'd send it back.

Nope most users will just eat the Salad because their scared to speak up.

Keilyn
Jul 23, 2011, 02:39 PM
Considering that Sega's Forums are still down..

It takes me 14 minutes...to do a full recovery if I were to lose everything and all I paid was $100 for two HDD, one for a full back up and a second to be mirrored.

Yeah...not everyone is me, but I am just one person......SoA has a whole team. I don't know why they simply dont do the WAMP/LAMP method and the BAD TRAP method of preserving stuff. Seriously...they are an entire team. Each time Sega Fails at something it makes me happier I went to psujp...

oh yes for those who do not know:

[spoiler-box]

WAMP = Windows/Apache/MySQL/PHP
LAMP = Linux/Apache/MySQL/PHP

BAD TRAP = Backup, Access, Duplicate, then Transfer, Redundancy, Availability and Performance. The first word is a cycle to be done per maintanance, the second is the way to check for I/O performance bottlenecks of servers.

[/spoiler-box]

boomadatigger
Jul 23, 2011, 04:02 PM
If it's a different version then that should have been made explicitly clear from the beginning. I am well aware (and I'm sure most people are here) of the ins & outs of Sega/Sonic Team & what has to go through who.

Personally I'm not that bothered about the weapons, but I am bothered about the overall service & how people are treated. People are not getting the advertised service that they are paying for.

If you ordered a steak in a restaurant and got a garden salad, you'd send it back.

More like ordering a well done steak with a side of mac n cheese and getting a chicken patty with a side of ramen noodles instead.

bloodflowers
Jul 23, 2011, 04:30 PM
Considering that Sega's Forums are still down..

It takes me 14 minutes...to do a full recovery if I were to lose everything and all I paid was $100 for two HDD, one for a full back up and a second to be mirrored.

Yeah...not everyone is me, but I am just one person......SoA has a whole team. I don't know why they simply dont do the WAMP/LAMP method and the BAD TRAP method of preserving stuff. Seriously...they are an entire team. Each time Sega Fails at something it makes me happier I went to psujp...

oh yes for those who do not know:

[spoiler-box]

WAMP = Windows/Apache/MySQL/PHP
LAMP = Linux/Apache/MySQL/PHP

BAD TRAP = Backup, Access, Duplicate, then Transfer, Redundancy, Availability and Performance. The first word is a cycle to be done per maintanance, the second is the way to check for I/O performance bottlenecks of servers.

[/spoiler-box]

In all fairness, this is made far more complex when you have multiple services to consider, and the auth backend is compromised. Sure you could quickly put them all back up, but they will immediately be hacked again unless you take time to:

1) Discover the method of compromise
2) Fix it (which may be non trivial)
3) Audit all your sites for similar methods
4) Depending on type of hack, audit some/all of your data too - because most people rely on input validation and then trust their database contents afterwards.

Ilikelamp7
Jul 23, 2011, 06:19 PM
Wouldn't a major company like SEGA have done that in the first week of it happening?

Totori
Jul 23, 2011, 11:09 PM
If it's a different version then that should have been made explicitly clear from the beginning. I am well aware (and I'm sure most people are here) of the ins & outs of Sega/Sonic Team & what has to go through who.

Personally I'm not that bothered about the weapons, but I am bothered about the overall service & how people are treated. People are not getting the advertised service that they are paying for.

If you ordered a steak in a restaurant and got a garden salad, you'd send it back.

You are only bothered by the server cause like many others you think we should get exactly what the japanese server gets no matter what. What didn't this server get that was advertised to it?

Being here since PSU first kicked off in September, I seen much of the major updates. People should have already known something were going to be different when we got the 1up Event. Regional Diff. will always affect content, that's why localization is such a hard job for some companies. I mean look at PS0, we didn't get everything there because of some licensing issues, but they tried to replace the mission content with other things.

I guess the main point is if you don't like this service then just quit, or sign up for the Japanese server. I play constantly on both and I still like the 360 servers a little more than the Japanese Server.

Tetsaru
Jul 24, 2011, 12:33 AM
You are only bothered by the server cause like many others you think we should get exactly what the japanese server gets no matter what. What didn't this server get that was advertised to it?

Being here since PSU first kicked off in September, I seen much of the major updates. People should have already known something were going to be different when we got the 1up Event. Regional Diff. will always affect content, that's why localization is such a hard job for some companies. I mean look at PS0, we didn't get everything there because of some licensing issues, but they tried to replace the mission content with other things.

I guess the main point is if you don't like this service then just quit, or sign up for the Japanese server. I play constantly on both and I still like the 360 servers a little more than the Japanese Server.

Advertisement? Lol, what advertisement? I never see Sega advertising their games nearly as much as they used to - none of the "Sega does what Nintendon't" or the Segata Sanshiro level stuff, anyway. Maybe in Japan, but definitely not around here in the US.

No, the point is that an online RPG should not have had its servers segregated as they were, and caused a 1 year+ gap in terms of what content we BOTH were supposed to eventually get. The fact that Edward came in here and pulled the "you guys are a special case" bullshit years after the game's initial release leads me to believe that Sega is just going to continue toying with us. Had they said from the get-go that, "oh, you guys aren't Japanese, so we're going to treat you differently," yeah, I'd still be upset about it, but not nearly as much, because at least I would've known their intentions ahead of time. I can understand localization issues and different companies having different policies, but come on. It's usually acceptable (to a degree, at least) for an offline game that's originally released in Japan and then later to other regions, or on one console and later ported to other consoles, to have different content or features. HOWEVER, if your intent is to have a bunch of people from all over the world playing together online (basically, an MMO, even though PSU isn't really one), then this simply doesn't work effectively. Square-Enix did it with FFXI and FFXIV, and I'm pretty sure Blizzard did it with WoW and Diablo II, otherwise they wouldn't have been as successful as they are. Why can't Sega effectively do the same? Why do they insist upon such unacceptable practices, and then leave us in the dark without explaining anything?? They simply don't care, or they have something to hide; either way, they're just going to keep making people frustrated and eventually lose business because of it.

Lock
Jul 24, 2011, 12:35 AM
So we can all agree that something is not right here.....

Sinue_v2
Jul 24, 2011, 12:40 AM
So we can all agree that something is not right here.....

I think that's been pretty well established ever since Sega released PSU with a lvl cap of 20 and Moatoob/Neudaiz locked away for the first month. It's only gotten worse with the content gap between US/EU and JP. Shit, we didn't even get Shifta & Deband until what... after christmas? Talk about not getting what was advertised.

It's one thing to lock away a bit of content so as to trickle it out as the game progresses... but when you're locking away core components of the game itself for months on end, you're doing it very very wrong.

Totori
Jul 24, 2011, 02:07 AM
Advertisement? Lol, what advertisement? I never see Sega advertising their games nearly as much as they used to - none of the "Sega does what Nintendon't" or the Segata Sanshiro level stuff, anyway. Maybe in Japan, but definitely not around here in the US.

No, the point is that an online RPG should not have had its servers segregated as they were, and caused a 1 year+ gap in terms of what content we BOTH were supposed to eventually get. The fact that Edward came in here and pulled the "you guys are a special case" bullshit years after the game's initial release leads me to believe that Sega is just going to continue toying with us. Had they said from the get-go that, "oh, you guys aren't Japanese, so we're going to treat you differently," yeah, I'd still be upset about it, but not nearly as much, because at least I would've known their intentions ahead of time. I can understand localization issues and different companies having different policies, but come on. It's usually acceptable (to a degree, at least) for an offline game that's originally released in Japan and then later to other regions, or on one console and later ported to other consoles, to have different content or features. HOWEVER, if your intent is to have a bunch of people from all over the world playing together online (basically, an MMO, even though PSU isn't really one), then this simply doesn't work effectively. Square-Enix did it with FFXI and FFXIV, and I'm pretty sure Blizzard did it with WoW and Diablo II, otherwise they wouldn't have been as successful as they are. Why can't Sega effectively do the same? Why do they insist upon such unacceptable practices, and then leave us in the dark without explaining anything?? They simply don't care, or they have something to hide; either way, they're just going to keep making people frustrated and eventually lose business because of it.

The PC and Xbox are different consoles and if you knew already PSU isn't a MMO not even close it's a Online Multiplayer game MUCH different so that case CONTENT is going to be diffferent, and also the US players aren't the only ones getting "screwed over" by SEGA remember the 360 is shared server so, Japanese players also have to work with the different content.

That being said NO one is getting screwed over, the versions are just much different if it hurts people that much, stop looking at the Japanese PC updates, to expect the same service it's not going to happen. Both servers were not suppost to get the same thing, SEGA never said that once they only claimed constant updates nothing more.

Lock
Jul 24, 2011, 02:24 AM
I think that's been pretty well established ever since Sega released PSU with a lvl cap of 20 and Moatoob/Neudaiz locked away for the first month. It's only gotten worse with the content gap between US/EU and JP. Shit, we didn't even get Shifta & Deband until what... after christmas? Talk about not getting what was advertised.

It's one thing to lock away a bit of content so as to trickle it out as the game progresses... but when you're locking away core components of the game itself for months on end, you're doing it very very wrong.

I honestly think even when PSO2 is releases, we still won't have everything....

who knows.^^;

Sinue_v2
Jul 24, 2011, 02:43 AM
The PC and Xbox are different consoles and if you knew already PSU isn't a MMO not even close it's a Online Multiplayer game MUCH different so that case CONTENT is going to be diffferent.

There is absolutely no logic behind this statement. How exactly does the difference between instanced and persistent fields and lobbies affect the translation of text and importing of models/textures? That's like saying a Car is not a Bus, therefore you can't expect Toyotas exported to England to get the same gas mileage they do in Japan.


and also the US players aren't the only ones getting "screwed over" by SEGA remember the 360 is shared server so, Japanese players also have to work with the different content.

All five of them?


That being said NO one is getting screwed over

It seems the vast majority of the PSU community disagrees with you.


Both servers were not suppost to get the same thing

Find me one official Sega statement starting from July 2010 back to the launch of the game in the west that confirms this statement. Back it up.


SEGA never said that once they only claimed constant updates nothing more.

They never explicitly made any distinction between the US and JP in regards to content differentials, which they have done with other PS titles like PSZero and PSP2 (due to licensing restrictions on branded items, which is a valid reason). They have always only ever referred to the US servers as being behind the JP servers, and getting the same content on different time tables. (I.E. Same content, but not in the same order).

This means, if we were never planned to get the US/EU servers the same content as the JP servers, then they intentionally led their customers to believe something which wasn't true. That's a form of deceit, any way you cut it.

Totori
Jul 24, 2011, 03:17 AM
Allright because it's really stupid the way you point your facts.

There is absolutely no logic behind this statement. How exactly does the difference between instanced and persistent fields and lobbies affect the translation of text and importing of models/textures? That's like saying a Car is not a Bus, therefore you can't expect Toyotas exported to England to get the same gas mileage they do in Japan.

-That's just stupid we are not talking about a car we are talking about the differences between a MMO and a Online Multiplayer RPG.

All five of them?

- Regardless of how many Japanese players you "think" play, they are still counted, don't be a dick about it.

It seems the vast majority of the PSU community disagrees with you.

-You mean PSO-world community, and that's becuase most of them, complain about the same thing the JP servers content.

Find me one official Sega statement starting from July 2010 back to the launch of the game in the west that confirms this statement. Back it up.

- When did SEGA say they were suppost to give the same updates? Never I never heard that once, they only get the updates from Sonic Team, and if that's what Sonic Team wants for the 360 server then that's final.

They never explicitly made any distinction between the US and JP in regards to content differentials, which they have done with other PS titles like PSZero and PSP2 (due to licensing restrictions on branded items, which is a valid reason). They have always only ever referred to the US servers as being behind the JP servers, and getting the same content on different time tables. (I.E. Same content, but not in the same order).

- They have because it was SEGA of America that said that, it was quoted once in the offical guide that Updates would be constant, but that's it, they didn't include anything more.

boomadatigger
Jul 24, 2011, 03:21 AM
*slowly raises hand*Edward kept mentioning a schedule for updates and that we would soon have what the JP have just belatedly.

Orochinagi
Jul 24, 2011, 03:32 AM
I'm actually beginning to believe that a portion of this is done because they WANT us to quit. Whether it be because they were being "jerks" giving horrid customer service or the slight possiblity of wanting to use more resources on PSO 2. Could be a shot in the dark, but they also may have this motive in order to possible work on a "possible" console release for PSO 2 and we may be "taking up space" or resource to them in general (console release or not). Think of this, personally Ed might not mind this so much because he would get to work in a US/EU release of that on consoles. This is all pure speculation of course, which either way, this whole situation is just wrong. I seem to remember a similar situation with PSO on Xbox. We were told that we would get content from PSO BB. Instead we only got a few missions that used the original data and shortly after the release of PSU (whether Alpha/Beta). Slightly before or after this, they annouced discountinuing support for the Xbox version, but vowed to leave the servers up until further notice. The "easy" part about this process was that the 360 had completely different server mainframes (essentially different servers), so they were able to continue the public testing for PSU without effecting PSO. In this situation, they probably can't afford costs here (or don't want to use funds) to run both even in testing phases at the same time. Again, this may be a shot in the dark, but that's the only positive excuse I'm willing to accept. Either way, they are doing this WRONG from the consumer perspective. From the business standpoint, they are cleaning up off of our hopes and dreams, something that most business do. College is the first example that comes to mind. Most of them promise you good jobs upon entry to reel you in. Afterwards, they give to the boot and make you fend for yourself after spending thousands. Business is business as always. Its up to us not to support that model.

Totori
Jul 24, 2011, 04:15 AM
*slowly raises hand*Edward kept mentioning a schedule for updates and that we would soon have what the JP have just belatedly.

But Edward didn't say "what" we would get, now did he?

In PSU wise we did get everything required, such as story missions.

boomadatigger
Jul 24, 2011, 04:23 AM
But Edward didn't say "what" we would get, now did he?

In PSU wise we did get everything required, such as story missions.

I used to work PR before and one of the things you can do to sell something to someone is by presenting the product in a certain light by not mentioning the products shortcomings. As omission does not constitute lying, the company, or the presenter, can't get in trouble. Now, if someone knew the right questions to ask, like bloodflowers did, they would be forced into a corner. They can't lie so they try to forestall it as much as possible. But when they started noticing others following bloodflowers' lead in asking the same questions they banned him in the hopes that the questioning would go away.

Totori
Jul 24, 2011, 04:26 AM
I used to work PR before and one of the things you can do to sell something to someone is by presenting the product in a certain light by not mentioning the products shortcomings. As omission does not constitute lying, the company, or the presenter, can't get in trouble. Now, if someone knew the right questions to ask, like bloodflowers did, they would be forced into a corner. They can't lie so they try to forestall it as much as possible. But when they started noticing others following bloodflowers' lead in asking the same questions they banned him in the hopes that the questioning would go away.

PR for what company?

But I still stand with what I said Edward never said "what" content, so the unique content might be what's in forcast for the servers

boomadatigger
Jul 24, 2011, 04:32 AM
PR for what company?

But I still stand with what I said Edward never said "what" content, so the unique content might be what's in forcast for the servers

He said JP content. Never was there any mention of "unique" content meaning none JP content. As for what company? United States Military.

Totori
Jul 24, 2011, 04:41 AM
He said JP content. Never was there any mention of "unique" content meaning none JP content. As for what company? United States Military.

You see your PR experence is different that PR work for a budget company.

Also what is "JP content" that sounds so stupid, the way you put it. It could be anything, that's wouldn't sound too assuring for people to hear, JP content sure but Edwards also didn't mention if something would get cut.

It can't be called "JP content" as the 360 servers are still maintained from Japan.

boomadatigger
Jul 24, 2011, 04:50 AM
You see your PR experence is different that PR work for a budget company.

Also what is "JP content" that sounds so stupid, the way you put it. It could be anything, that's wouldn't sound too assuring for people to hear, JP content sure but Edwards also didn't mention if something would get cut.

It can't be called "JP content" as the 360 servers are still maintained from Japan.

PR is PR regardless of who you are working for. All the PSS classes I took are the same PSS classes businesses use.

JP content is JP content. Edward mentioned it along with a schedule of pending JP content we would be getting here in the US. Again, when you say, "he didn't mention this or that" it just reinforces my earlier statement about how to present a product without mentioning its shortcomings.

The last part of your argument you are just splitting hairs. Of course it wouldn't be called JP content when it gets localized for US consumption. Then it will be called US content. But before it does become localized for US consumption it is still considered JP content.

Orochinagi
Jul 24, 2011, 05:22 AM
It can't be called "JP content" as the 360 servers are still maintained from Japan.

The 360 servers are NOT maintained from Japan. They are maintained from California.

boomadatigger
Jul 24, 2011, 05:25 AM
The 360 servers are NOT maintained from Japan. They are maintained from California.

That too.

Totori
Jul 24, 2011, 06:14 AM
That too.

Actually they are ONLY HOSTED in Cailfornia, SOA does not pick what updates will hit they only HOST the server, so the final decision or rather the only one, is left up to Sonic Team, in which they reside in Japan.

Also they aren't really worried that badly about what the server can't get and because certain companies and Licensing doesn't work out right a certain version cannot become a PHOTO COPY of the Japanese PC server.

Tetsaru
Jul 24, 2011, 06:19 AM
I think if Sega REALLY wanted to spend more time on PSO2 and less time on PSU, they would just kick the 360 players to the curb by closing down their servers, like they did with us PC/PS2 players. Right now, I think they're just trying to see how much more subscription money they can milk out of their diehard fans before doing so, with the least amount of effort possible. With that in mind, along with the fact that Microsoft also has a hand in this, I highly doubt they'd incorporate a free-to-play option anytime soon.

Sinue_v2
Jul 24, 2011, 09:01 AM
T-That's just stupid we are not talking about a car we are talking about the differences between a MMO and a Online Multiplayer RPG.

-The Point.
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|- Your head.

Try again, and do try to address my point this time. Seeing the word *cars* in an analogy and tossing out the argument is just evasion.

To repeat: How exactly does the difference between instanced and persistent fields and lobbies affect the translation of text and importing of models/textures?


Regardless of how many Japanese players you "think" play, they are still counted, don't be a dick about it.

Again, you miss the point. The amount of Japanese players on the 360 version very much does matter in this equation, because if there were a substantial amount, Sonic Team would be putting a hell of a lot more effort into keeping the content levels caught up and the services as similar as possible in order to sustain that userbase. However, the Xbox 360 is not doing well in Japan, and the lack of a Japanese consumebase in their target audience makes the handful of Japanese subscribers acceptable losses. After all, if the service is shitty, they have a Japanese alternative to turn to.


You mean PSO-world community, and that's becuase most of them, complain about the same thing the JP servers content.

Which other internet community is a better representative of PSU's status with it's fanbase? PSUpedia, perhaps, but I doubt you're going to find much deviation in opinion there. Many of them are PSOworlders as well. The Sega forums, where they delete and ban dissenting opinions? That sounds like an option an apologist would support.


When did SEGA say they were suppost to give the same updates? Never I never heard that once

You are the one who claimed that this policy of separate and distinct versions was what Sonic Team had promoted from the beginning. The burden of proof is upon you to sustain and demonstrate that assertion.


if that's what Sonic Team wants for the 360 server then that's final.

This is about the only thing I agree with you on, and only because we don't have a whole hell of a lot of choice in the matter since Sonic Team doesn't give a shit about what their customers want on a dying game. They're just wringing you for whatever cash you're still good for, at as little cost to them as possible, before closing your asses down just like the PS2/PC servers.


They have because it was SEGA of America that said that, it was quoted once in the offical guide that Updates would be constant, but that's it, they didn't include anything more.

Explain exactly, how is one to tell if Sonic Team really has always maintained this *unmentioned* policy... and that the behavior pattern for past updates has only "LOOKED" like they were trying to keep up with the Japanese releases which degraded over time.... or if it's all just post-hoc bullshit rationalization fed to you to as an excuse to stop supporting the platform? You can't base customer policy on sly little, "well, no matter what we lead the customer to believe, we didn't actually say we'd deliver X,Y,Z, under A,B,C conditions, in regions QRX". That's childish and would never hold up in a court of law. Companies have been called on that shit in the past, which is why you have these nifty little *asterisks* denoting fine print of overly complicated legalese which explains exactly how they're going to fuck you over.

What does hold up is Sega's clause in the TOS that states that they have the right to change their policies at any time without notifying the customer. Nobody's arguing against Sega's right to do that, but it's still a dick move and they should be called on it.

Keilyn
Jul 24, 2011, 09:07 AM
This is exactly why many play the JP version.

Opinions between "what is" and "what isn't" and dealing with all of this...

Play the JP version of the game and there is no "What is" and "What isn't" between updates and reskins. You deal with all the other BS that you would deal with players....but you don't deal with any update BS. You get the updates in a timely manner.

One reason I moved to the jp version before the pc/ps2 servers closed down is because look...I am not getting any younger. A game that lacks updates means I have to deal with software 1 - 2 years behind the original version.

Time is not going to stop for me...

With all the BS I have to deal with in my life...I REFUSE to deal with Software/Hardware BS when it comes to my leisure time and entertainment. I may have to put up with BS in dealing with jobs, because it involves completing a task and getting paid.

...But I absolutely refuse in BS coming between me and entertainment.

Of course to each their own...

If you want to be swindled away and believe that its good where you are right now, then who am I to argue if you are content and satisfied...However, if you say want more and deserve what you feel you deserve and aren't getting it, and all you get are stonewalled and stalled for weeks to months....

...then its better to just play the JP version itself and skip the majority of the BS out there.

padiwac
Jul 24, 2011, 09:54 AM
Don't know what all the fuss is about. Officially our server is now unique so if our uniqueness doesn't appeal then other obvious options are available. The 360 community is a good one and as I mentioned earlier we're getting regular updates and events and the population is strong so our version is still a good one to play

Majarra
Jul 24, 2011, 10:02 AM
I don't know why some people bother arguing with the blind fanboyism at this point. Content and treatment wise, it's clearly obvious which version is better. If you don't like getting new missions, events, weapons, and clothing(NEWS FLASH: WHAT PHANTASY STAR UNIVERSE IS ALL ABOUT) then play the 360 version. Phantasy Star will never get a fair chance in the United States and Europe.

On a side note, server size doesn't matter if the community is littered with asshats who phish each other, get married on PSU, scam, spam, and stir up shit on the 4th floor. After being in random JP games, it makes me kind of wish I knew Japanese so I could talk with them too. They seem nice and organized.

xBULLYDOGG
Jul 24, 2011, 10:55 AM
Don't know what all the fuss is about. Officially our server is now unique so if our uniqueness doesn't appeal then other obvious options are available. The 360 community is a good one and as I mentioned earlier we're getting regular updates and events and the population is strong so our version is still a good one to play

Thanks, I needed that.

Totori
Jul 24, 2011, 11:00 AM
if that's what Sonic Team wants for the 360 server then that's final.

Sinue_v2, We can agree on this, we GET what SONIC TEAM says.

WHAT'S IN THE TOS goes nothing more, and beacause we can agree on the top that's fine why complain, I mean in the end why bitch you still pay them and even if you do the free play JP server option. You are STILL SUPPORTING SEGA.

If you all are that pissed then STOP SUPPORTING THEIR PRODUCTS that will make them "listen".

Carrighan
Jul 24, 2011, 01:00 PM
The one thing that is consistantly overlooked in this "go play the jp version" is not all of us can afford a pc that can run it. ive tried playing the pc version on my laptop and it nearly melts down.

PSU was never stated anywhere to be a different version until recently as an excuse. It has always been clearly stated that we would be getting the same updates as soon as they could code them regionally.

IMHO the reason for all this, is they are mad at us for not being as dumb as thier jp fanbase and not suckered into guardians cash. I was so glad we weren't that dumb.

I love and have played Phantasy Star since it first came out on master system. In fact i still have the original and the system to this day. It's truely a shame that such a great seeries is being so badly mishandled.

Oh and trust me if the coding was all that difficult do u think gameshark and the like would be as successful?

MoonlightMyau
Jul 24, 2011, 01:15 PM
You are only bothered by the server cause like many others you think we should get exactly what the japanese server gets no matter what. What didn't this server get that was advertised to it?

Being here since PSU first kicked off in September, I seen much of the major updates. People should have already known something were going to be different when we got the 1up Event. Regional Diff. will always affect content, that's why localization is such a hard job for some companies. I mean look at PS0, we didn't get everything there because of some licensing issues, but they tried to replace the mission content with other things.

I guess the main point is if you don't like this service then just quit, or sign up for the Japanese server. I play constantly on both and I still like the 360 servers a little more than the Japanese Server.

I did not say I think we should get exactly what is on the Japanese servers & please do not tell me what I am bothered about.

What I did say was, that the "different version"nonsense is a cop-out and a load of bullshit because it was heavily implied (by Sega) that we would get the same content just at a different pace, I also said, that I reckon most people were happy with that.

Hypothetically, if the official servers for PSO Dreamcast & PSO Blue Burst were still running & PSO DC had re-skinned weapons but PSO BB had completely new weapons, then his limitations and different version claim would be perfectly valid.

But to turn around and claim that there are "limitations"etc in this case is an absolute insult, when we see other games getting new maps, item packs & add-ons willy nilly. We know fine well the Xbox 360 can handle it.

Of course some events because of regional issues are going to be different, that's an absolute given and happens in every aspect of life.

They also said that the servers would be maintained & updated regularly & would be online for around 5 years. This PC/PS2 server was down after what, not even quite 3 years? The 360 server is plagued with regular issues.

They are not delivering or being as transparent as they should be on a service that they are taking people's money for. That is what I am bothered about it doesn't matter which way they dress it up because it's out & out wrong.

Powder Keg
Jul 24, 2011, 01:44 PM
Bottom line: Judging by the huge negative reaction to this news/realization about future content, the game will begin to wither slowly.

A lot of well-known players quit this month. The majority of players don't really visit or post on forums, but you can bet when most of them start to discover these newer weapons appear as weapons we had 5 years ago, you'll start seeing some of those stars disappear.

It's really a shame, because I believe on the US side, with the community and the US staff's help, we gave this game a big push in the US with getting it to Games on Demand and such. Blame US all you want, but when it comes down to content, JP is responsible, as it's been mentioned several times that communication and waiting for responses is needed before any news can be given or any action taken.

"Different version" is indeed a total crock, but there's not much else you can expect him to say from an official standpoint. That's just how JP suddenly decided to treat the 360 Version.

To see the hard work and support by the US side thrown into the trash like that is pretty disgusting if you ask me. I'm sure the staff feels the same...they obviously just can't comment on it. If those next few title updates could just get thrown in everything would be fine.

BIG OLAF
Jul 24, 2011, 01:54 PM
Bottom line: Judging by the huge negative reaction to this news/realization about future content, the game will begin to wither slowly.

A lot of well-known players quit this month. The majority of players don't really visit or post on forums, but you can bet when most of them start to discover these newer weapons appear as weapons we had 5 years ago, you'll start seeing some of those stars disappear.

It's really a shame, because I believe on the US side, with the community and the US staff's help, we gave this game a big push in the US with getting it to Games on Demand and such. Blame US all you want, but when it comes down to content, JP is responsible, as it's been mentioned several times that communication and waiting for responses is needed before any news can be given or any action taken.

"Different version" is indeed a total crock, but there's not much else you can expect him to say from an official standpoint. That's just how JP suddenly decided to treat the 360 Version.

To see the hard work and support by the US side thrown into the trash like that is pretty disgusting if you ask me. I'm sure the staff feels the same...they obviously just can't comment on it. If those next few title updates could just get thrown in everything would be fine.

^This is the most accurate post regarding the subject matter that I've read yet.

EDIT: Also, this excerpt from Carrighan's last post is also dead-on:


PSU was never stated anywhere to be a different version until recently as an excuse. It has always been clearly stated that we would be getting the same updates as soon as they could code them regionally.

WiZ1988
Jul 24, 2011, 02:02 PM
IMHO the reason for all this, is they are mad at us for not being as dumb as thier jp fanbase and not suckered into guardians cash. I was so glad we weren't that dumb.


As dumb as the jp fanbase? I don't know about that one. I made the right choice, which was leaving the 360 server a while ago. I feel for everyone on the 360, I experienced some of the bs myself. But I don't see why jp fanbase was "that dumb". Sega is to blame for this. Why they continue to screw over the US/EU is beyond me.

Tetsaru
Jul 24, 2011, 02:29 PM
Bottom line: Judging by the huge negative reaction to this news/realization about future content, the game will begin to wither slowly.

If you ask me, the game was already "withering slowly" after the release of AotI turned everything into easy-mode...

And after the PC/PS2 servers went down...

And after the login errors during MAG...

And after each rollback or massive glitch/exploit...

Powder Keg
Jul 24, 2011, 02:33 PM
If you ask me, the game was already "withering slowly" after the release of AotI turned everything into easy-mode...

And after the PC/PS2 servers went down...

And after the login errors during MAG...

And after each rollback or massive glitch/exploit...

You haven't played, so you really wouldn't know. I hopped onto 360 shortly after PC's closing was announced, and the population has actually grown slightly since then from the AOTI+ update and Games on Demand availability/free expansion download. Last night, there were 8 stars. Things looked good as content updates started to become regular....then this missing data appeared, which will likely have the effect of a brick wall.

Tetsaru
Jul 24, 2011, 02:46 PM
You haven't played, so you really wouldn't know. I hopped onto 360 shortly after PC's closing was announced, and the population has actually grown slightly since then from the AOTI+ update and Games on Demand availability/free expansion download. Last night, there were 8 stars. Things looked good as content updates started to become regular....then this missing data appeared, which will likely have the effect of a brick wall.

Perhaps, but I'd accredit part of that simply to PC/PS2 players who were still wanting to play the game and didn't want to learn Japanese having nowhere else to go, like war refugees to a foreign country. In terms of completely new players joining the game and helping it prosper, I'm not so sure. I see new people around the PSU forums asking about the game every now and then, but it seems for every one of them, there's 5 moving to or asking about the JP servers, or just quitting altogether.

I'm just going by my own personal experiences here. The fact that Sega let so much of these events happen in the first place just tells me they either don't know what the fuck they're doing, or they just don't give a rat's ass... probably both.

Lock
Jul 24, 2011, 02:56 PM
Bottom line: Judging by the huge negative reaction to this news/realization about future content, the game will begin to wither slowly.

A lot of well-known players quit this month. The majority of players don't really visit or post on forums, but you can bet when most of them start to discover these newer weapons appear as weapons we had 5 years ago, you'll start seeing some of those stars disappear.

It's really a shame, because I believe on the US side, with the community and the US staff's help, we gave this game a big push in the US with getting it to Games on Demand and such. Blame US all you want, but when it comes down to content, JP is responsible, as it's been mentioned several times that communication and waiting for responses is needed before any news can be given or any action taken.

"Different version" is indeed a total crock, but there's not much else you can expect him to say from an official standpoint. That's just how JP suddenly decided to treat the 360 Version.

To see the hard work and support by the US side thrown into the trash like that is pretty disgusting if you ask me. I'm sure the staff feels the same...they obviously just can't comment on it. If those next few title updates could just get thrown in everything would be fine.

Ant that the truth. I also been noticing that yeah, a lot of known players have been quitting. When I came to the 360 it was alright for a little bit. But it still had the same problems that good old PC server had. Slow updates. I was off the game for a while before coming to 360 and when I came back, it did not take me that much time to do all the stuff I miss during my time of absents. Big let down^^;

I agree it sucks that we are being toss aside. I know the staff feels the same was. There's just too much red tape and crap for them to do anything. Keep faith I guess:-?

Anna_Wren
Jul 24, 2011, 07:41 PM
Personally, I think the main reason we are behind in graphical updates is because if we got all the cool Japanese GC stuff, and didnt have to pay for it then all the JP players would jump ship seeing as how 360 is the international version.

That would cut into the profits of SoJ severly. And thats why we are "Unique" now. We didn't start that way and it wasn't initially intended that way either, but now that GC is so prevalant in Japan it makes no monetary sense to Japan to give us the golden cash cow.

And since JP is working on PSO2, they have little monetary reason to update the graphics much or ensure the proper data. Its very likely that the SoA team has little know how in the actual game data so they have a rough time porting it alone.

Ironically, I think one of two things will happen before the end of the year. Once PSO2 comes out, the JP servers will pretty much die and 360 will get a bit more attention for a while. Or 360 will hit total stagnation. Right now its not really total stagnation because there are still many weapons unrealsed with true graphics and despite what Edward said, if we DO get the next supplemental update, then the graphics WILL be fixed. I personally think that SoA is behind the Reskins and mess ups and SoJ is too busy with PSO2 to really care about 360 since they make little money from it compared to the JP version.

Totori
Jul 25, 2011, 01:38 AM
Yes and because SOA cannot "port" it alone, that's why we are "slowly" updated Sonic Team. Is to busy most of the time to have some people work on a update patch for the 360 version because most of the programmers are currently trying to complete PSO2.

So the 360 server and SOA will have to wait, but looking at Sonic Team they might already have worked on a few smaller updates, to hold down some time.

I don't know about the graphics being "fixed" as they are different weapons now, but I guess on that all we can do is wait and see.

XxXTHEBUTCHERXx
Jul 25, 2011, 01:43 AM
When it all comes down to it we paid just like Japan did for years and Japan only started a month before us I personally think its wrong that we are so far behind "like 2 years"

Idk.... Just seems wrong

And I think we are entitled to more then what we have now it just seems cruel :-?

unicorn
Jul 25, 2011, 01:54 AM
I said it numerous times before.

The second that they pulled the plug on the PC servers should have been a huge red flag. And you call tell me about the 360 population being better than US PC and whatnot, but getting the updates to PC was actually easier than getting them to 360.

Theres no reason to play 360 if you came from the US PC version. Even if you find katakana overbearingly difficult, the benefits of playing on the Japanese server overweight playing in English.

If you have a PC (which I assume all of you do) and its crappy, theres solutions. Save up $100 and buy a graphics card and get 1 gig of ram ($20-40), you're set.

And I think PSO2 will be separated. Why else would the beta only be available to JP players?

Totori
Jul 25, 2011, 02:17 AM
I said it numerous times before.

The second that they pulled the plug on the PC servers should have been a huge red flag. And you call tell me about the 360 population being better than US PC and whatnot, but getting the updates to PC was actually easier than getting them to 360.

Theres no reason to play 360 if you came from the US PC version. Even if you find katakana overbearingly difficult, the benefits of playing on the Japanese server overweight playing in English.

If you have a PC (which I assume all of you do) and its crappy, theres solutions. Save up $100 and buy a graphics card and get 1 gig of ram ($20-40), you're set.

And I think PSO2 will be separated. Why else would the beta only be available to JP players?

One because it's their game so updates they make go on that server first. and it's not the beta it's the ALPHA test, nothing has been said about the beta yet.

bloodflowers
Jul 25, 2011, 01:14 PM
And I think we are entitled to more then what we have now it just seems cruel :-?

I have seen Sega staff mock customers for believing they are entitled.

hewitt
Jul 25, 2011, 02:07 PM
Edward made a new post in his thread.

EdwardAges
Jul 25, 2011, 02:12 PM
I wouldnt trust anything Edward says.

Considering he called us "Wayward" in his opening post returning here was insulting enough. Look up the definition of the word...its almost like we are that way simply because we aren't all registered into the 360 version and the official forums.

Yeahhhh I think this may have been misread :) It was an affectionate greeting -- "wayward" because the official forums are down and that's where I'm used to communicating with PSU players. An acknowledgment that our boards & site are down, that it kinda sucks, and that it had been a while since we'd all spoken.

This is some Psych 101 but: The truth of the matter is if people are responding aggressively to that one word there's an undercurrent of hostility that has nothing to do with my vocab choice. Either it's because you don't like me (fair enough), you don't like the news I'm bringing (okay), or it's just fun to trash someone from SEGA because they're the messenger and they're talking to you somewhere where they can't ban you for your actions (probably). Or it's likely some combination of those!

So just so we're on the same page -- you're upset because you don't like not being told exactly what's coming / when it's coming; you don't like seeing different/reused weapon skins on new weapons here; you don't like that we're different from the JP version in general. And I'm guessing no one is happy about the PSU site & forums being down (and that includes me). I'm sure there's more but is that enough to be going on with?

I'm happy to be the community rep for PSU. I know where there's been problems & I know where there's been successes. Some of you can keep this in perspective while still discussing the issues the game has; some can't. That's how all community management is. I don't have the power to make things how you want them but I'll do my best to explain the way things are. If there's something I'm not saying, its not just that I'm withholding information I could tell you; it's that I'm limited in what I can talk about. That's just how most games are.


I have seen Sega staff mock customers for believing they are entitled.

Deservedly so! Gamers are a pretty entitled bunch and to actually discuss real game issues both company & customer have to be able to cut through that garbage. Saying that this represents an "uncensored" dialogue is pretty hilarious considering the number of people posting mindlessly aggressive stuff, and considering some of the trolling that people have gotten away with for years on the PSU official forums (yourself included). Go search the forums -- or you know, search them if they were up :-( -- but there is no shortage of criticism. I never "censored" criticism so long as it wasn't an attack.

If you want to have a dialogue about this stuff, I'm happy to. But forums do not always represent a perfect dialogue -- they represent (at their worst) group think and reactionary opinions about things that don't actually matter as much as the emotions people put into them. Go ahead and tell me that's not how the internet works sometimes :) In order to have a dialogue about PSU we need to keep in perspective that this is a video game and we're all people who work on / play on it.

At their best, forums are a great way for a company to connect to the people who actually play -- and pay for -- their games; a chance to learn about issues & customer experience. For my part I make sure Japan is aware that our Western PSU audience is fanatically devoted to the game but is extremely dissatisfied when they feel like they're "second-class" citizens -- that even small differences will always be noticed and that this is a group of players who have supported their games for over a decade (or more).

That's the big picture, that's what I've been imparting to them for as long as I've been here, and I believe there's good people there who I work with who see and understand just how much success of Phantasy Star has come from the West. That doesn't mean everything with PSU will happen just the way you want it, but it does mean that there's every chance to improve the way we deal with this game -- and future games. I love this community and this franchise and I feel personally responsible for making sure these concerns get to Japan and this game (and future games) are improved. I'll keep working for that regardless of how my use of "wayward" gets misconstrued. :P

Tetsaru
Jul 25, 2011, 02:24 PM
Well Edward, I'm glad you feel that way about the franchise, but let's face it - the non-JP PSU servers are never going to be equal to Japan's content at this rate. You might as well just tell the other people at Sega to just shut the 360 servers down too, because too many people are livid about the state of things over the past few years... myself included. Not enough information is given out to the community about what is going on in Sega.

EdwardAges
Jul 25, 2011, 02:31 PM
Well Edward, I'm glad you feel that way about the franchise, but let's face it - the non-JP PSU servers are never going to be equal to Japan's content at this rate. You might as well just tell the other people at Sega to just shut the 360 servers down too, because too many people are livid about the state of things over the past few years... myself included. Not enough information is given out to the community about what is going on in Sega.

Got it. Tell Japan to shut down the servers because you want to know more about what's going on, even though no video game company operates with total transparency like you're asking.

If no one else has any objections I'll go ahead and let Japan know Tetsaru said we can shut things down? Yeah? Sound good?

boomadatigger
Jul 25, 2011, 02:36 PM
And the sarcasm doesn't really help customers become less livid, Edward.

xBULLYDOGG
Jul 25, 2011, 02:38 PM
No but it is fun to read.

boomadatigger
Jul 25, 2011, 02:39 PM
No but it is fun to read.

Till he gets that pink slip.

EvilMag
Jul 25, 2011, 02:43 PM
I know it will be almost impossible to do this, but could you at least try to make 360 have the free course system? I know most of you are gonna be like "STP SUGGTING STUD THINGS!!!111" I know it will be hard since you guys are dealing with M$. Have you consider trying to do that Edward? Or maybe give new players like 15 days to play PSU for free? Sure it might bring back the spam bots back from the Demo but if you really want to keep the game alive at this point, you're going to have to try.

IMO having a monthly fee on a Dungeon Crawler isn't worth it.

Tetsaru
Jul 25, 2011, 02:46 PM
Got it. Tell Japan to shut down the servers because you want to know more about what's going on, even though no video game company operates with total transparency like you're asking.

If no one else has any objections I'll go ahead and let Japan know Tetsaru said we can shut things down? Yeah? Sound good?

Well, if you want to keep making people angry and lose business, that's your call. :wacko: I can always go play some FFXIV... which is still free-to-play, btw, because Square-Enix realized that their original dev team screwed up. Perhaps you guys could learn from them. :razz:

Besides (and I'm sure a lot of people will agree with me), I'd rather play a new game that has some promise rather than keep playing a shitty game that's been run into the ground. :disapprove:

boomadatigger
Jul 25, 2011, 02:48 PM
Well, if you want to keep making people angry and lose business, that's your call. :wacko: I can always go play some FFXIV... which is still free-to-play, btw, because Square-Enix realized that their original dev team screwed up. Perhaps you guys could learn from them. :razz:

Besides (and I'm sure a lot of people will agree with me), I'd rather play a new game that has some promise rather than keep playing a shitty game that's been run into the ground. :disapprove:

You can play DCUO too. It's practically problem free compared to PSU. And customer service is superb.

xBULLYDOGG
Jul 25, 2011, 02:52 PM
Well, if you want to keep making people angry and lose business, that's your call. :wacko: I can always go play some FFXIV... which is still free-to-play, btw, because Square-Enix realized that their original dev team screwed up. Perhaps you guys could learn from them. :razz:

Besides (and I'm sure a lot of people will agree with me), I'd rather play a new game that has some promise rather than keep playing a shitty game that's been run into the ground. :disapprove:

I read SE and SEGA and think this;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nvc5QO4FTbc&feature=channel_video_title
If only.

And if only it wasn't turn based.
And all cinimatic.

Ok I like the HUD, sue me.

EdwardAges
Jul 25, 2011, 02:53 PM
And the sarcasm doesn't really help customers become less livid, Edward.


Till he gets that pink slip.

Thanks for your concern! But it's okay -- we're humans and we're allowed to be sarcastic! I don't get fired for that.

It *is* funny that the people banned for being unrepentant trolls on the official boards are the ones most concerned with my employment. Again, that's Psych 101, but there might be something to it :P

Look -- You can't have it both ways: I can talk to you in a "faceless spokesperson" sort of way and you can rage at me; or I can act a little more human and reply to some of the ridiculous stuff in a sarcastic way. If you want to actually talk to me about this stuff in a personable way then we need to be able to treat each other as, you know, humans.

boomadatigger
Jul 25, 2011, 02:59 PM
Thanks for your concern! But it's okay -- we're humans and we're allowed to be sarcastic! I don't get fired for that.

It *is* funny that the people banned for being unrepentant trolls on the official boards are the ones most concerned with my employment. Again, that's Psych 101, but there might be something to it :P

Look -- You can't have it both ways: I can talk to you in a "faceless spokesperson" sort of way and you can rage at me; or I can act a little more human and reply to some of the ridiculous stuff in a sarcastic way. If you want to actually talk to me about this stuff in a personable way then we need to be able to treat each other as, you know, humans.

Actually, I'm treating you like how one adult treats another adult. But hey, if you want to resort to name calling then by all means proceed. You can just use the excuse that you were just being "human" and not a "faceless spokesperson".

Tetsaru
Jul 25, 2011, 03:01 PM
Thanks for your concern! But it's okay -- we're humans and we're allowed to be sarcastic! I don't get fired for that.

It *is* funny that the people banned for being unrepentant trolls on the official boards are the ones most concerned with my employment. Again, that's Psych 101, but there might be something to it :P

Look -- You can't have it both ways: I can talk to you in a "faceless spokesperson" sort of way and you can rage at me; or I can act a little more human and reply to some of the ridiculous stuff in a sarcastic way. If you want to actually talk to me about this stuff in a personable way then we need to be able to treat each other as, you know, humans.

I'd prefer the latter, but that doesn't change the fact that we're still upset and tense over this matter. I mean, we've had to put up with this for several years now with no surefire way of actually getting any word across back to you guys without being suppressed in some way. :(

EdwardAges
Jul 25, 2011, 03:01 PM
Well, if you want to keep making people angry and lose business, that's your call. :wacko: I can always go play some FFXIV... which is still free-to-play, btw, because Square-Enix realized that their original dev team screwed up. Perhaps you guys could learn from them. :razz:

Besides (and I'm sure a lot of people will agree with me), I'd rather play a new game that has some promise rather than keep playing a shitty game that's been run into the ground. :disapprove:

FFXIV? I heard they added auto-attacks! :)



I know it will be almost impossible to do this, but could you at least try to make 360 have the free course system? I know most of you are gonna be like "STP SUGGTING STUD THINGS!!!111" I know it will be hard since you guys are dealing with M$. Have you consider trying to do that Edward? Or maybe give new players like 15 days to play PSU for free? Sure it might bring back the spam bots back from the Demo but if you really want to keep the game alive at this point, you're going to have to try.

IMO having a monthly fee on a Dungeon Crawler isn't worth it.

Personally, I would really like to see at least something changed for the pricing or options for PSU, or accessibility. The course as it exists in Japan is very unlikely but it doesn't mean we couldn't consider something in the future. In my opinion the demo was a huge missed opportunity -- I wish it had been more fully integrated into the game, for one; it would be nice to have used that way. Instead it was kind of an island. An island filled with aggressive weirdos (along with those who legitimately were interested in the game and willing to try the full version).

Obviously I can't comment on decisions that aren't made yet but yeah, pricing and how people can get into the game in the future is definitely something to look at.

MoonlightMyau
Jul 25, 2011, 03:07 PM
FFXIV? I heard they added auto-attacks! :)




Personally, I would really like to see at least something changed for the pricing or options for PSU, or accessibility. The course as it exists in Japan is very unlikely but it doesn't mean we couldn't consider something in the future. In my opinion the demo was a huge missed opportunity -- I wish it had been more fully integrated into the game, for one; it would be nice to have used that way. Instead it was kind of an island. An island filled with aggressive weirdos (along with those who legitimately were interested in the game and willing to try the full version).

Obviously I can't comment on decisions that aren't made yet but yeah, pricing and how people can get into the game in the future is definitely something to look at.

I am pleased to see this. My main concern has been the overall treatment for the money paid by the players. So if that area will be looked at then fantastic.

I know things won't and can't change over night, but from the bits of information in your posts tonight, I feel a bit better about the over all situation.

EvilMag
Jul 25, 2011, 03:10 PM
I would really love it where if I have a Gold account, I can play.

I really do not want to pay for 3 things at once since it's too much for me.

Internet, Xbox live sub, and a sub for just one game. This is the reason why i'm not picking up Modern Warfare 3 since Activsion seems to try to get you pay for their own content.

Tetsaru
Jul 25, 2011, 03:10 PM
FFXIV? I heard they added auto-attacks! :)

You'd be correct. :) They also got rid of that annoying stamina gauge and fatigue system, and added two new dungeons, several new settlements, and tons of new quests - all in the same update. When's the last time Sega did something on that scale for an update for PSU without it being an event? :razz:

However, they also did several things that people are upset about: Cure spells having MUCH higher MP costs and no longer being able to AoE them as a Disciple of Magic class (have to use Curega etc. now), Guildleves not giving nearly as much skill points, etc... BUT players are able to voice out about it along with the dev team's intentions and influence the next update, and that's what's important - the game company AND the customers working together for the best and most enjoyable gaming experience.

EvilMag
Jul 25, 2011, 03:11 PM
I also heard FFXIV is a terrible game.

xBULLYDOGG
Jul 25, 2011, 03:17 PM
Here's one of the worst ideas I've had in a while.

Set up GUARDIANS cash to be run on a website, so people pay cash there, and get the credits added to their account, and then scrap the montly fee.

Feel free to flame.

Tetsaru
Jul 25, 2011, 03:22 PM
I also heard FFXIV is a terrible game.

Eh, it's still lacking a bit in content and a few balancing issues at the moment, but there's still plenty to do, and I like it a lot better than I did FFXI, personally. I mean hell, it's free-to-play right now, so I don't see much reason to complain... unlike how PSU was. :wacko:

cheapgunner
Jul 25, 2011, 03:24 PM
At the very least SoA should have the power to increase the drop rates on all missions / runs rite Edward? I mean, that would very much appreciated for a lot of us...:-(

Tetsaru
Jul 25, 2011, 03:30 PM
At the very least SoA should have the power to increase the drop rates on all missions / runs rite Edward? I mean, that would very much appreciated for a lot of us...:-(

NO, the whole "3* luck and increased % success to synths and grinds" was Sega's lazy, go-to compensation/event reward gimmick, and was a big problem after AotI came out. Increasing drop rates just floods the game economy with items that everyone and their grandma can get, which in turn makes meseta more useless, and encourages elitism ("You don't have a ____ yet? Silly noob, everyone has one of those, even though they're a 9001* rare item."). I'd only save this for right before when Sega actually DOES take the 360 servers down, so players can at least have a chance to get that one item that was actually rare and constantly eluded them.

I enjoy being able to trade and buy/sell items, but things that are meant to be top-tier should be EARNED and possibly account-bound, as much as I know people don't like that option.

cheapgunner
Jul 25, 2011, 03:34 PM
NO, the whole "3* luck and increased % success to synths and grinds" was Sega's lazy, go-to compensation/event reward gimmick, and was a big problem after AotI came out. Increasing drop rates just floods the game economy with items that everyone and their grandma can get, which in turn makes meseta more useless, and encourages elitism ("You don't have a ____ yet? Silly noob, everyone has one of those, even though they're a 9001* rare item.").

I'd only save this for right before when Sega actually DOES take the 360 servers down, so players can at least have a chance to get that one item that was actually rare and constantly eluded them.

True enough.

Some drops though are too ridiculous to even try for (amore tips off of Dancing Birds >.>;.

boomadatigger
Jul 25, 2011, 03:36 PM
Sooooo, what was the point of Edward posting today, aside from the need to be "human" and not a "faceless spokesperson"? What was accomplished? What concerns were acknowledged, and, importantly, resolved from a customer perspective?

Noob Saibot
Jul 25, 2011, 03:44 PM
No matter how you spin it, the 360 servers "uniqueness" are all negative. Perhaps with a little cooperation from the community and SOA, we can help bring some positivity into light. My suggestion is to un-account bound Shijins. Why? Because on the 360 servers we are not able to change their elements nor upgrade them (in my case I have 14 without a full set as where in JP, I would only need 6). The process of getting the materials are tedious and can be very frustrating. This does not make a steady equation for a good game.

Many like myself would like to see account binding done away with altogether on our servers. This can all be done server side and no title update is required.

The Daltony
Jul 25, 2011, 03:53 PM
Why do I get the feeling this thread was created just to stir up trouble. I doubt people being upset about how the game is being (and has been for years) handled is suddenly a new thing.

Literally nothing in this thread (except maybe people realizing Edward is a snarky asshole http://i471.photobucket.com/albums/rr78/Ed_Lolington/mmmhmm.gif?t=1311627015) hasn't been repeated a million times.

bloodflowers
Jul 25, 2011, 03:57 PM
Deservedly so! Gamers are a pretty entitled bunch and to actually discuss real game issues both company & customer have to be able to cut through that garbage. Saying that this represents an "uncensored" dialogue is pretty hilarious considering the number of people posting mindlessly aggressive stuff, and considering some of the trolling that people have gotten away with for years on the PSU official forums (yourself included). Go search the forums -- or you know, search them if they were up :-( -- but there is no shortage of criticism. I never "censored" criticism so long as it wasn't an attack.

Customers certainly are an entitled bunch! I would say they're entitled to complain without being told it's trolling (when often it isn't). I'd say they're entitled to respond to update threads without there being a not-so veiled warning not to be negative in the first post. I'd especially say they're entitled to respond to GM questions about game bugs without getting an infraction for 'trolling' in a post comparing weapon stats with Japan, which may well have been a genuine bug.


If you want to have a dialogue about this stuff, I'm happy to. But forums do not always represent a perfect dialogue -- they represent (at their worst) group think and reactionary opinions about things that don't actually matter as much as the emotions people put into them. Go ahead and tell me that's not how the internet works sometimes :) In order to have a dialogue about PSU we need to keep in perspective that this is a video game and we're all people who work on / play on it.

This is a video game we are paying you (Sega) to play, that's the perspective and why people are so upset about the content void (I'm not sure gap applies anymore) and de-skins.


That's the big picture, that's what I've been imparting to them for as long as I've been here, and I believe there's good people there who I work with who see and understand just how much success of Phantasy Star has come from the West. That doesn't mean everything with PSU will happen just the way you want it, but it does mean that there's every chance to improve the way we deal with this game -- and future games. I love this community and this franchise and I feel personally responsible for making sure these concerns get to Japan and this game (and future games) are improved. I'll keep working for that regardless of how my use of "wayward" gets misconstrued. :P

I'm afraid all the good intentions in the world aren't going to fix this one, and Sega (collectively) letting down their Western customer base just undermines the fanbase support between each game. It's sad really. It's good you revisited this thread to reply to people, I felt quite sorry for Silver a few nights ago having to stand in front of so many people with such an unpopular message.


No matter how you spin it, the 360 servers "uniqueness" are all negative. Perhaps with a little cooperation from the community and SOA, we can help bring some positivity into light. My suggestion is to un-account bound Shijins. Why? Because on the 360 servers we are not able to change their elements nor upgrade them (in my case I have 14 without a full set as where in JP, I would only need 6). The process of getting the materials are tedious and can be very frustrating. This does not make a steady equation for a good game.

Many like myself would like to see account binding done away with altogether on our servers. This can all be done server side and no title update is required.

If you (Edward) can influence Japan in just one thing, and if content is impossible, please make it this. It would re-start the game economy and give people a reason to play again. I can't tell you how depressing it is to pull duplicates over and over, that you can't even trade - you'd have to experience that one yourself.

Tetsaru
Jul 25, 2011, 04:01 PM
The only account-bound items that I was aware of on PSU were the Elysion, Edil Fucil, and Edil Arrow, but that was near the time PC/PS2 went down, if I recall.

In my opinion, account-bound items are necessary in order to keep people who haven't properly earned them (say, through a quest or difficult mission) from simply buying them or trading for them with another easily-obtainable resource, etc. However, I know that item-trading is a big part of PSO/PSU, and that should be respected as well. I just don't want it to get to the point where people have top-tier items at low levels, or suddenly EVERYONE has a Psycho Wand... like Sega suddenly plugged in a Game Genie/Gameshark/Action Replay into the servers or used the duping glitch, lol.


Why do I get the feeling this thread was created just to stir up trouble. I doubt people being upset about how the game is being (and has been for years) handled is suddenly a new thing.

Literally nothing in this thread (except maybe people realizing Edward is a snarky asshole http://i471.photobucket.com/albums/rr78/Ed_Lolington/mmmhmm.gif?t=1311627015) hasn't been repeated a million times.

I know it's not a new issue - far from it, actually - but the fact that Edward actually came here to address us seemed like a golden opportunity to provide him with, shall we say... constructive criticism. :wacko:

Seriously though, we desperately needed (and still do) some solid feedback from Sega, and so far, this has been our only outlet.

bloodflowers
Jul 25, 2011, 04:03 PM
I enjoy being able to trade and buy/sell items, but things that are meant to be top-tier should be EARNED and possibly account-bound, as much as I know people don't like that option.

Do you still play PSU? The account binding ruins it, it forces everyone to be lucky. The amount of effort expended has little relation to the end result when you have weapons needing 3 insanely rare account bound materials. And then, you get 2 fire ones in a row.

Ryna
Jul 25, 2011, 04:07 PM
Sooooo, what was the point of Edward posting today, aside from the need to be "human" and not a "faceless spokesperson"? What was accomplished? What concerns were acknowledged, and, importantly, resolved from a customer perspective?

What did Edward accomplish?

* Gave us news about this week's update.
* Let us know the status of the Sega Trouble Ticket team.
* Told us that not all of the new weapons are going to be reskins.
* Gave us some insight into the process for getting updated models released on the Xbox 360 servers.
* Gave assurances and and answered the questions he was capable of answering.

As Edward mentioned in his posts, he's not in a position to make official statements or or answer questions about certain matters. Still, it is very nice to see him stop by, answer the questions that he can, and comment on the state of the game.

Tetsaru
Jul 25, 2011, 04:14 PM
Do you still play PSU? The account binding ruins it, it forces everyone to be lucky. The amount of effort expended has little relation to the end result when you have weapons needing 3 insanely rare account bound materials. And then, you get 2 fire ones in a row.

Wait, the MATERIALS to make the item were account-bound!? No, that's messed up - I'm talking strictly complete equipment. Account-bound items should be rewarded to you for doing something difficult or time-consuming. They should never be entirely luck-based.

In FFXIV, account-bound items (or "Exclusive" items, as they're called) can drop from notorious monsters, but it goes to your "loot list" instead of directly your inventory. The Loot List is basically a 10-slot temporary space on your character that stores items that have dropped from monsters for a limited period of time before moving them to your inventory, or discarding them if there's no room left. At any point, you can access the loot list from your menu and decide to move a dropped item to your inventory, discard it, or pass it to someone else in the party who may need it more instead of trading it to them. If your Loot List is full though, you can't get anything new in terms of drops until the previous items are dealt with first, so it also helps against one person getting too many items at once, because all drops are random. Once an account-bound item hits your inventory though, it's stuck there until you NPC-sell or drop it. This way, you can still party up with your friends and help them get something, even if it drops to you.

Un4givingSlayer
Jul 25, 2011, 04:26 PM
Also, I'd like to add something else to be changed. Since we won't be getting the upgrade device and won't be able to fix broken weapons, if we can remove the restriction on the legendary weapons? I'd like to be able to 10/10 an Edel arrow (since mine is 7/7). I don't mind if it's account bound, I'd just like to be able to get more than just one shot.

Now, I know this will with people having a palette of 10/10 legendary weapons, but I'd rather have that reality, than never having the chance of getting my own 10/10 legendary weapon.

chaos-shadow
Jul 25, 2011, 04:36 PM
I would like to hear some good answers to this.

The community already KNOWS that our version does not include what seems to be PSP2 content... right? From what it seems Edward is hinting at is, because we are on the XBOX360, it sounds like it requires a little more finesse to get new things updated to the XBOX versus just slapping it down on the PC.

So how is it, you know that it is somewhat beyond the control, you know EXACTLY what weapons are probably going to be re-skinned (seeing as everyone here RELIGIOUSLY follows JP and knows what's next...) but STILL continue to complain and jump on Edward? Come on, people. You've beat this subject dead. Stop getting angry because that's all you can think to do...

Noob Saibot
Jul 25, 2011, 05:46 PM
Also, I'd like to add something else to be changed. Since we won't be getting the upgrade device and won't be able to fix broken weapons, if we can remove the restriction on the legendary weapons? I'd like to be able to 10/10 an Edel arrow (since mine is 7/7). I don't mind if it's account bound, I'd just like to be able to get more than just one shot.

Now, I know this will with people having a palette of 10/10 legendary weapons, but I'd rather have that reality, than never having the chance of getting my own 10/10 legendary weapon.

They could change the grinds on select weapons to "no chance of failure" all the way to 10. This is something that can be done server side also and no need of a patch.

Lock
Jul 25, 2011, 06:07 PM
Think everyone is forgetting something.....

"don't shoot the messenger."

Things in our PSU community and game sucks, and Edward has been here long enough to know how piss off we all are. BUT, he can only do so much. He can let Sega knows how we, the customer feels, and what can be done to make us happy. That's it.

Regardless of what he says to the Sega big bosses, its still up to SEGA to have a green light on anything. This little "hate" or whatever it is thats happening, people come on. I agree with chaos-shadow. You've beat this subject dead.

meh....

Dilly123
Aug 1, 2011, 06:24 AM
You'd be correct. :) They also got rid of that annoying stamina gauge and fatigue system, and added two new dungeons, several new settlements, and tons of new quests - all in the same update. When's the last time Sega did something on that scale for an update for PSU without it being an event? :razz:

However, they also did several things that people are upset about: Cure spells having MUCH higher MP costs and no longer being able to AoE them as a Disciple of Magic class (have to use Curega etc. now), Guildleves not giving nearly as much skill points, etc... BUT players are able to voice out about it along with the dev team's intentions and influence the next update, and that's what's important - the game company AND the customers working together for the best and most enjoyable gaming experience.

Hey, CE owner here, you know, the thing that came with a worthless hat that they reskinned and give out to everyone now? The game has been in 're-development' for about a year now and I can honestly say next to nothing important has changed yet. It still feels like the same old boring game it did months ago. Nothing is happening fast enough for a majority of the players. Sorry SE, adding 'content' that involves me running for 25 minutes, getting 1 minute of 'content', running for another 10, killing one monster, then having to head back to town is not fun or exciting.

I'm much happier on JP PSU than FFXIV.

And if you want to bring the console version into this, ask SE how that PS3 verison is coming. God, I should just uninstall FFXIV, just remembered it's going to be bogged down to accomdate a console, as if the horrible console-port feeling interface on a pc game that doesnt even have a console verison yet didn't remind me enough. Sigh, much happier with a game that has console roots being on pc rather than a mmorpg being restricted by the devs wanting to be on a console, cough ffxi.

Keilyn
Aug 1, 2011, 07:50 AM
Final Fantasy always was a time sink.

I had characters on Asura and Pandemonium before the server merge. In fact there were things I liked about FFXI, but things I really hated. I hated all the LinkShell Drama in FFXI and I totally hated how everything was so spaced apart it took a lot of time to do basic things...Just going from your own character room to check on things, to the auction house in windurst and searching along could take 5 minutes to 30 minutes...

and all the travel times...

specially all the poor white mages who wanted to make money so they all charged for high level Ressurections and some even charged for high level cures. Don't even get me started on how the game was so dependent on having a healer in a group or getting your ass kicked.

Personal favorite was how when you ran away from battle you would still take damage as though you were still next to the enemy in battle....and you would have to zone a map to not die. Also the people who pulled enemies to get others killed....

I remember all the horrible stuff that occurred in FFXIV and Square-Enix even openly admitted that FFXIV has problems....Here is the link

http://lodestone.finalfantasyxiv.com/pl/topics/detail?id=c499e4c5df4f3f0fde1fb47a28574cb9c3991c9f

This translates to a "We admit FFXIV sucks and we are sorry" letter...as an announcement by the CEO of the company.

Tetsaru
Aug 1, 2011, 08:37 AM
The problem with FFXIV is that it was released way too early; Square Enix brought in a whole new team to "fix" the workings of the original team, and tried to keep the players' and their own opinions of the game in mind while redesigning it, so there's a lot of conflict going on in terms of what direction it should be going in. PSU, on the other hand, started out fine, but gradually got worse over time due to issues such as multiple consoles and regions being separated (including the people who did or didn't have AotI when it first came out), GM's not effectively dealing with in-game problems and exploits, updates being bugged and causing rollbacks, etc. Both cases are examples of poor management, though.

I'm quite aware that FFXIV is struggling - some of my Linkshell members have even moved back to FFXI - but at least Square Enix publicly apologized for their mistakes and is trying to do something constructive to fix them (hell, they made the game free-to-play, and imo they fixed a lot of problems that were in FFXI that Keilyn mentioned). To my knowledge, Sega has done nothing of the sort for PSU's non-JP players, and that lack of communication is what bothers me. Now, correct me if I'm wrong, but I have never seen any direct news from PSU's developers, other than the obligatory "here's your shitty recycled update and a max luck bonus because we didn't feel like doing anything better for you" from people like Edward, who probably don't have much to do with the game's content at all and are just, as people have said, lowly messengers. I know people will either stick to the games they enjoy or move on, so there's not much point in me trying to persuade anyone to make any decisions on what to do anymore.

That said, I'm really hoping Sakai and his team continue to give us information on PSO2's progress as they have been lately, even after the game is released. It would be a really good gesture on their part to help Sega's reputation with the PSO/PSU community.

Keilyn
Aug 1, 2011, 09:29 AM
Tetsaru..

This is very true.

I still am mad how in a five year period when Square-Enix was square soft, we had Final Fantasy 7 - FFX-2 (The game was completed before the full merge in Japan) and FFXI was completed before the full Merge....and that is all well and good..

But the only full FF games released after becoming Square-Enix that aren't spinoffs for handhelds or crap are FFXII and FFXIII, while FFXIV having its problems. Don't get me wrong I like Enix, but hate how Square only owns 6% of Square-Enix in its shares and that to me is a horrible position to be in.

In regards to PSU...

I can't believe some people believe in the entire idea that Sega actually cares. The thing is we as people are not getting any younger and its better to get updates now that you should be having than later. Its not fair that in order to get a fair-share you have to register and play in PSU JP to actually get anywhere. It becomes unfair because that means dealing with multiple versions and more than double the energy and time spent.

Every major game I have played be it a First Person Shooter and MMORPG that DOES NOT COME FROM JAPAN have reached a point where all versions get patched to a similar version number allowing for more compatibility and localization support has been good in those games, but every single time I play any video game that comes from Japan, always:

~Our translations are worse than could be
~There is always a pure, native japanese version that is BETTER than the released version and if by any chance westerners get a better version (example being dot hack infection, mutation, outbreak and quarantine where we got both voice overs and they got one), they always release in the future a better version for themselves.
~In an Online Game there is always a localized version that sucks compared to the original and there usually are two sets of servers merged at the end of life cycle for a product. YES THATS RIGHT. SEGA isnt the only company that does this.

There are exceptions to the above. Ive played two games that were updated and good for a period of time, but thats it....it doesnt compare to the fact even a shitty no name game gets better updating across versions than SEGA does with PSU.

Don't get me started how if you were on Dreamcast and played PSO to get an UPDATE you had to buy a new version of the game or buy a new console + the game itself because the updates were in the new version of the game.

Thank God PSO2 is going to be PC...

But if Guild Wars II comes out at the same time as PSO-2, I will spend more of my time in Guild Wars 2 as I've waited for a long time and while I can play PSO-2 for a while, I don't want to deal with another endless grind fest like PSU and PSO were...or people playing Digital Dressup barbie with their Digital Dolls.....and then expecting me to take them seriously.

(Honestly, this is the only game where a party of four males with their female characters take a lot longer to decide on what outfit to wear than which weapons to bring into a map...because they want to look pretty and impress)

Meyfei
Aug 15, 2011, 07:08 PM
on the topic of PSU and sega, given this is a few days late. Has sega allowed an answer, out of slight curiousity, to this one question: WHY, of all choices, was the Xbox360 server chosen to be kept running when such restrictions were around since launch? WHY, when nearly All households have a computer. Why was the PS2/PC servers abolished when they were seemingly the best choice for any and all updates?


Why cant things be done in the way that seems more convenient to both sides practicality, and service over the $'s and headaches. I will NEVER buy an Xbox, unless some crack head comes to my door with a brandnew one and offers it to me for 30$. and even then i'd rather resell it and do what? i dont know but perhaps upgrade my Computer?

dias_flac_0g
Aug 16, 2011, 03:48 AM
on the topic of PSU and sega, given this is a few days late. Has sega allowed an answer, out of slight curiousity, to this one question: WHY, of all choices, was the Xbox360 server chosen to be kept running when such restrictions were around since launch? WHY, when nearly All households have a computer. Why was the PS2/PC servers abolished when they were seemingly the best choice for any and all updates?


Why cant things be done in the way that seems more convenient to both sides practicality, and service over the $'s and headaches. I will NEVER buy an Xbox, unless some crack head comes to my door with a brandnew one and offers it to me for 30$. and even then i'd rather resell it and do what? i dont know but perhaps upgrade my Computer?

Yeeeaaa....

Because the PS2 has a nice big built in HDD that has enough room for DLC, Patches and overall game content making ideal for digital downloads and online gaming in general.

Lmao.

Resanoca
Aug 16, 2011, 04:42 AM
lol Doesn't sound any different from the 360. o:

RemiusTA
Aug 16, 2011, 10:21 AM
This version cannot be unique in any way other than negative because there is no Sega of America, and PSU360 does not have its own development team.

So "unique" can only mean "not up-to-date."


And on the subject of FFXIV....i hope all developers make good note of it, because Square Enix has made a terrible example out of themselves. They're having to work very, VERY hard to make that game profitable, or even anything but a complete and total failure. It's difficult to run, it isn't Pay to Play, but worst of all, it isn't a very decent game. I never played FFXI, but from the sound of the synthesis and crafting systems in this game, it sounds like something i'd never waste my time with, no matter how gorgeous it looks or how wonderful the soundtrack may be.


Square is in trouble with that game. It's looking to be one complete and total waste of an entire development cycle. They're going to have to basically revamp the game after it's already been bought...pity too. It's the second FF game in a row with bad reviews from the fans. And Square is full of potential.

Tetsaru
Aug 17, 2011, 05:51 AM
And on the subject of FFXIV....i hope all developers make good note of it, because Square Enix has made a terrible example out of themselves. They're having to work very, VERY hard to make that game profitable, or even anything but a complete and total failure. It's difficult to run, it isn't Pay to Play, but worst of all, it isn't a very decent game. I never played FFXI, but from the sound of the synthesis and crafting systems in this game, it sounds like something i'd never waste my time with, no matter how gorgeous it looks or how wonderful the soundtrack may be.


Square is in trouble with that game. It's looking to be one complete and total waste of an entire development cycle. They're going to have to basically revamp the game after it's already been bought...pity too. It's the second FF game in a row with bad reviews from the fans. And Square is full of potential.

For what it's worth, here's (http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/20998?p=292495#post292495) the latest update schedule for FFXIV that I've seen so far. From what I've gathered, it's pretty extensive, and they intend to have it done by the end of September, although that's still up in the air at this point.

I know I'm repeating myself here, but the fact remains that at least Square-Enix is giving everyone an idea of what's going on development-wise and what they're trying to fix or adjust on a pretty frequent basis. I rarely saw Sega do anything of the sort for PSU, and if they did, their schedules were usually way off, often due to not properly releasing updates and having them bugged, etc.

Btw, here's a video on FFXIV's crafting, if you're not familiar with it. It's an older one, but most of the basic mechanics are the same. You can PM me if you want some more up-to-date details.

[spoiler-box]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d49CyShoiBQ[/spoiler-box]

Hatemachine
Aug 17, 2011, 06:55 AM
I already tossed a few bucks worth of opinion on this, guess I can spare an extra buck 0 five. especially after calming down after returning from a 3 year Hiatus to find that PSU has pretty much stalled out horribly, Kinda cheesed me off lol.

ANYWAY on with the wall of conceivably false or ill informed gibbering nonsense.

PSU has been pretty much hamstrung by M$ when it comes to patching games and content, which has actually been well known and documented that M$ is particularly stringent towards patches and updates. As soon as a patch or content update hits a certain data limit they get mean and force it to become DLC in order to recoup the server space and XBL bandwidth dedication, and JP PSU has gotten ALOT of patch's that I am pretty sure are larger than the imposed limit set for NA/EU XBL.

Truth be told NA/EU PSU is INDEED the unique version, as it's set of rules governed by the terms set forth by M$ regarding patching and update sizes, as well as frequency of patching and updating is undoubtedly different from the JP side of the coin. So there IS indeed a truth to the statement, it sucks no less, but this is the nature of the beast when it comes to games with international releases and drastically different rule sets established for each given region.

Which I suspect is why PSO2 will be and remain PC exclusive, with a possible porting to PS3 as Sony is more lenient in regards to data size and bandwidth allocation for patching and content updates. Best hope is gonna be they decide to release it all as a Massive DLC file, however this seems unlikely as the population size just doesn't merit the cost, especially with a new title in the series that will HOPEFULLY now allow for a repeat of this horse pucky LOL.

Good luck folks and Happy hunting, see ya'll on PSU and PSO2 hopefully this year.

Mekimaru
Aug 17, 2011, 07:16 AM
When i played PSU most of the players in my party when said topic arose, were very lets say Unhappy about the JP server being so far ahead. As for me, i couldnt justify why the JP were so far ahead.
If im paying £7.50 ( i think it was) which was at the time about 10 dollers? or somthing like that . I want updates and i dont want to be Behide anyone else when im paying the same as them

I pay for xbox live gold, NEW DASHBORD LAYOUT UPDATE ( oh but only the us have it, you have to w8 about 6 months )

Now imagine if that happend ?

Keilyn
Aug 17, 2011, 11:36 AM
When i played PSU most of the players in my party when said topic arose, were very lets say Unhappy about the JP server being so far ahead. As for me, i couldnt justify why the JP were so far ahead.
If im paying £7.50 ( i think it was) which was at the time about 10 dollers? or somthing like that . I want updates and i dont want to be Behide anyone else when im paying the same as them

I pay for xbox live gold, NEW DASHBORD LAYOUT UPDATE ( oh but only the us have it, you have to w8 about 6 months )

Now imagine if that happend ?

What is horrible is the fact a lot of people in PC/PS2 EU/NA version felt hollow from starting over in the Japanese Version. When I started in that version the game was so far ahead than PC/PS2 that in ONLY 3 months of playing that game I actually had better equipment, better grinds and better performance under every single type than on EU/NA version.

In fact the game is up to the point that a fully GASed Newman WT on a Just Counter can nearly hit 11,000 damage per hit on a level 40 Jabroga. For those of you who don't believe me.

[spoiler-box]http://www.smashmybrain.com/downloads/keilynaxewt.jpg[/spoiler-box]

Basically I am at the point where a female newman wartecher thanks to way PSUJP is set up outdamages and out DPSed my female beast fighmaster/FF in EU/NA PSU...and that is just plain Sad.

Vintasticvin
Aug 17, 2011, 11:52 PM
Rabble rabble rabble been here since day rabble rabble I want what japanese have rabble rabble we're rabble rabble rabble <---(This is what Sega reads as well as I.) Take all your hatred to microsoft, let them feel your fury and allow Sonic Team to give you all your "deserved" updates. reads)And I honestly feel Ed had every right talking to you all like he did. One could take so much abuse that the call for retalliation must be answered.

If you all dont like it here then get your butts over to JP, or go rage at Microsoft.

Hatemachine
Aug 18, 2011, 12:18 AM
Well truth be told folks have a right to their opinion, and like most things people have opinions about they either lack the requisite information to make an informed statement, are emotionally compromised, or looking for an outlet to vent anger. Also the love it or leave it argument has never really been a solution, whats needed from folks is better understanding and better communication from Sonic team, and Microsoft and a lot less ambiguity.

But as I understand it due to whatever contacts were negotiated to M$ in regards to NA/EU PSU the folks at Sonic team have their hands Tied just as Valve was when they stated they wanted to release new content for TF2 for free, and M$ tight rein on the frequency of patch's for games.

They aren't allowed to SAY why were not getting the JP versions updates, because in so doing they violate their contract, and as this issue is UNIQUE to the NA/EU servers that was the best statement that could be formulated to explain the situation without violating said contract.

now look how many words it took for just ME to say it's Microsofts fault and explain it clearly and eloquently, how would it sound if I had a whole troop of circling Vultures who's very livelihood depends on their looking and prodding for every available opportunity to swoop in and make a quick buck and prove their prowess in their given field to justify getting that big ole paycheck M$ pays them?

You folks want the solution? press Sonic team to release the content as A Downloadable update, that's the only way it will ever happen, and Edward has already expressed an interest in posing this option to his superiors.

Vintasticvin
Aug 18, 2011, 01:03 AM
Well truth be told folks have a right to their opinion, and like most things people have opinions about they either lack the requisite information to make an informed statement, are emotionally compromised, or looking for an outlet to vent anger. Also the love it or leave it argument has never really been a solution, whats needed from folks is better understanding and better communication from Sonic team, and Microsoft and a lot less ambiguity.

But as I understand it due to whatever contacts were negotiated to M$ in regards to NA/EU PSU the folks at Sonic team have their hands Tied just as Valve was when they stated they wanted to release new content for TF2 for free, and M$ tight rein on the frequency of patch's for games.

They aren't allowed to SAY why were not getting the JP versions updates, because in so doing they violate their contract, and as this issue is UNIQUE to the NA/EU servers that was the best statement that could be formulated to explain the situation without violating said contract.

now look how many words it took for just ME to say it's Microsofts fault and explain it clearly and eloquently, how would it sound if I had a whole troop of circling Vultures who's very livelihood depends on their looking and prodding for every available opportunity to swoop in and make a quick buck and prove their prowess in their given field to justify getting that big ole paycheck M$ pays them?

You folks want the solution? press Sonic team to release the content as A Downloadable update, that's the only way it will ever happen, and Edward has already expressed an interest in posing this option to his superiors.
^
\- THIS POST THIS POST HERE ultimatly clarifies things for all you rage heads out there (If y'all are able to grasp the true power of what he said. I would have said "This post is full of win but I'd saound stupid for it.)

BIG OLAF
Aug 18, 2011, 01:06 AM
You folks want the solution? press Sonic team to release the content as A Downloadable update, that's the only way it will ever happen, and Edward has already expressed an interest in posing this option to his superiors.

Yes, a fleeting interest...with a very low chance of the idea ever reaching anything close to fruition.

Vintasticvin
Aug 18, 2011, 01:40 AM
Yes, a fleeting interest...with a very low chance of the idea ever reaching anything close to fruition.

Better to make an attempt than to not even try yes?

Tetsaru
Aug 18, 2011, 07:05 AM
Unless Sega and Microsoft can somehow churn out a massive "expansion" or something to get everyone on the same page with Japan, I think it would just be better in the long run to close the 360 servers down, and let everyone who's still interested in the game turn to the Japanese servers, or possibly future private servers that wouldn't charge people for putting up with this crap. I honestly don't see how they're still earning revenue when so many people know what's going on now... but then again, I guess there will still be those people who are diehard fans, or are too lazy/stubborn to learn Japanese and jump ship, or who are just too young to understand and/or are oblivious to how certain gaming companies work. :confused:

SupermanNC21
Aug 18, 2011, 10:06 AM
Xbox an JP version are the same an Edward an sega GM's saying that it isn't are wrong, up until the GC we got everything JP did the only reason why they say it isn't is because we didn't get GC an any way if JP an Xbox was on the same updates Xbox would be way better than PC I never understand how Sega say that we are different cause where not. We have Dimates Trimates crea saber Spread Needle Distasnt Memory Edel Fucil White Beast Sleepping Warroirs Mugunburga Ank Buti which is everything you can find on JP. The only thing that is different is GC an Sega trying to make it seem like we are different from JP well were not Xbox is just been Punished because of sega mistake they shouldn't have ever given JP GC if the know Xbox couldn't get it i mean really we pay 10 buck a month just like JP you can't change a game because of 1 mistake i mean really, An really the name on the CD says Phantasy Star Universe Made By Sega the SAME GAME i mean really how slow do you have to be a potato gonna be the same dam potato even if its in Japan. O to you know you r about you comment about the bike story we have the same bike with the same parents its just the parents favor one child better than the other i mean there bike is gas power has all the colorful reflectors an the red horn when our bike is just plan an dull but wutever i know this want lead anywhere its falling on death ears. I really like PSU it the best MMO on Xbox but yeah sega can't see that an take advantage of it they would rather go up against WWO an all the other MMO on PC ya why try to revulsion ins MMO on Xbox i mean really Call of Duty your just so dumb for going Modern Warfare.

BIG OLAF
Aug 18, 2011, 10:22 AM
I guess there will still be those people who are diehard fans, or are too lazy/stubborn to learn Japanese and jump ship, or who are just too young to understand and/or are oblivious to how certain gaming companies work. :confused:

Or maybe I don't have money to just drop on a new PC (no job at the moment), since my piece o' shit laptop can barely play PSOBB. That, and I'm still trying to learn Japanese (for PSO2). I've been studying basic Kanji for weeks now, and still barely know any of it. It's really hard for me.

So, "just stop being lazy and join the JP servers" isn't viable for everyone.

SupermanNC21
Aug 18, 2011, 10:31 AM
Or maybe I don't have money to just drop on a new PC (no job at the moment), since my piece o' shit laptop can barely play PSOBB. That, and I'm still trying to learn Japanese (for PSO2). I've been studying basic Kanji for weeks now, and still barely know any of it. It's really hard for me.

So, "just stop being lazy and join the JP servers" isn't viable for everyone.

It's not been lazy. why the heck would i want to learn JP when i could just buy an xbox an not have to learn a new lang JP psu is a lazy game all you have to do is be rich an willing to throw away money to pay for good weps on that game but anyway i'm don't with this thread i'm go get on my Xbox 360 an play wink wink PSU Xbox 360 verision of psu an hunt for fluge.

Tetsaru
Aug 18, 2011, 10:55 AM
Or maybe I don't have money to just drop on a new PC (no job at the moment), since my piece o' shit laptop can barely play PSOBB. That, and I'm still trying to learn Japanese (for PSO2). I've been studying basic Kanji for weeks now, and still barely know any of it. It's really hard for me.

So, "just stop being lazy and join the JP servers" isn't viable for everyone.

Hey, I'm in the same boat, so don't feel bad. My 5 and a half year old PC (which ran PSU fine, btw, not sure how old your computer is) wouldn't be running FFXIV, had I not been offered a relatively new graphics card from a friend of mine. He ended up getting a better one for his PC, and offered the older one to me for less than what he paid for it, and luckily it was compatible with what I had.

Even then, there's still the fact that Japan has the free course thing - something else 360 never got, much less PC/PS2... the money one would've spent for a year's subscription probably could've bought a decent graphics card.

BIG OLAF
Aug 18, 2011, 10:57 AM
My computer is about six years old. But, that doesn't really matter, since it's not a gaming computer, anyway. It has almost no RAM. It's meant strictly as a web-browsing laptop only. And, I'm not going to have the money to get a new one any time soon. I doubt I'll even have one by the time PSO2 comes out.

Afro The Great
Aug 18, 2011, 11:14 AM
Man I went back to playing WoW after the whole Great arms race event. Psu isnt like it use to be, and with saying that i mean how you can break your weapons and still use them. I liked it better when it broke it was for ever gone, now even if you break them you can still use them. And thats the big issue with the economy on Psu. Whats the point of haveing new rare items when a person goes and breaks something and sells it for cheap and a newbie gets it and is like i got a better weapon than everyone. That isnt right.....lol

Tetsaru
Aug 18, 2011, 11:24 AM
My computer is about six years old. But, that doesn't really matter, since it's not a gaming computer, anyway. It has almost no RAM. It's meant strictly as a web-browsing laptop only. And, I'm not going to have the money to get a new one any time soon. I doubt I'll even have one by the time PSO2 comes out.

Well, I guess you can do what I do sometimes - ask for money from your relatives when Christmas, birthday, or other similar holidays roll around, and save it up as best you can. Or offer to do some work/chores on a regular basis, sometimes my folks give me some spending money for helping them out. But I guess that would depend on several factors... just a suggestion.

BIG OLAF
Aug 18, 2011, 11:26 AM
I haven't gotten birthday money or Christmas money in years. According to family members, apparently I'm "too old for that" now. Also, I don't ask for money for doing chores, since I don't pay rent anyway. The chores are my rent. The only money my dad gives me is $20 a month for my XBL Gold and PSU subscriptions, and a little extra for gas so I can go look for work.

Tetsaru
Aug 18, 2011, 11:34 AM
I haven't gotten birthday money or Christmas money in years. According to family members, apparently I'm "too old for that" now. Also, I don't ask for money for doing chores, since I don't pay rent anyway. The chores are my rent. The only money my dad gives me is $20 a month for my XBL Gold and PSU subscriptions, and a little extra for gas so I can go look for work.

Well, in that case, I'd cancel your Xbox Live and PSU subs, unless you're hellbent on still playing them. That would at least give you around an extra $20-$30 a month. Not much, but it's a start, I guess.

BIG OLAF
Aug 18, 2011, 11:36 AM
Nah, it's the only form of entertainment I have, not to mention the only way I have to be actively social with other human beings, since I don't have any friends that live near me anymore. I can't get rid of them.

I just need to keep hoping I can get a job sometime relatively soon.

EvilMag
Aug 18, 2011, 11:40 AM
Honestly I would stay on 360 since I do not wanna deal with moonrunes.

Hatemachine
Aug 18, 2011, 01:56 PM
Aye it is a shame PSO2 is only gonna be on the PC as far as we know and as indications go I would say it'll stay that way so as to avoid the mistakes that lead up to this threads very creation lol. My suggestion would be to check out Tiger Direct and newegg, and cross check with the PSO2 minimum requirements. From there build the PC part by part keeping it cheap and just SEE how much it would cost, in some cases you might be pleasantly surprised, and the requirements for FF XIV were HORRENDOUS! but I guess that suites the pile of fetid bile they spewed up and stamped the Square Enix logo onto and expected it to be glorious achievement.

Far as I know PSO2 doesn't have THAT steep a set of requirements nor will it, unless im just spinning my wheels because I haven't seen the PC requirements yet and am talking outta my a$$. But hey window shopping never hurts and with a little effort and alot of luck anything is possible, who knows, you could be ripping your hair out in frustration in 6-8 months when you have your PC built and ready when Sonic team decides to hold back the NA/EU release another 6 months for localization and game translations LOL.

Best of luck to ya'll and worse comes to worse there's always ummm......... hmmm well sh!t I can't really FIND an alternative to PSU.......that's why I bought a 360 again anyway, to play this glorious little bastard.

WELL good luck anyway!

Vintasticvin
Aug 20, 2011, 01:01 AM
Unless Sega and Microsoft can somehow churn out a massive "expansion" or something to get everyone on the same page with Japan, I think it would just be better in the long run to close the 360 servers down, and let everyone who's still interested in the game turn to the Japanese servers, or possibly future private servers that wouldn't charge people for putting up with this crap. I honestly don't see how they're still earning revenue when so many people know what's going on now... but then again, I guess there will still be those people who are diehard fans, or are too lazy/stubborn to learn Japanese and jump ship, or who are just too young to understand and/or are oblivious to how certain gaming companies work. :confused:

Yeah sounds like a winner to me... Kill the servers becasue you said so how freaking brilliant :D

Keilyn
Aug 20, 2011, 01:14 AM
The other solution would be a mass rebellion.

Rebel to decompile and get the source to the game and simply reverse engineer the game itself with improvements, then simply leak the source + server console to many groups to work on modifying the game itself to make private servers.

leak them everywhere to the point more people will leave the pay to play versions and go to private servers. This actually will force competition or shutdown between SEGA/Microsoft and private servers.

Sure, Sega could sue private server owners if they find them, but the costs of litigation and the time taken to hire and build cases and go after each server that starts up...and spreads like wildfire will be so high that SEGA would lose more money to the point they would do better to get their act together and actually compete for the best server.


Very easy for me to reprogram the game if I had the source to actually make it a lot better than this garbage we have now...

RandomTask
Aug 22, 2011, 05:07 AM
It's been excuse after excuse from the beginning. They had me going for a long time and eventually you see that nothing changes with the support of the US Xbox server. I cancelled my sub right when PSP2 came out. It was impossible going back to play PSU with no blocking, no dodging, no new stuff etc. After all this time nothing has changed for the poor PSU xboxers. Even IF we had all the content JP has, it would still be sucky to play this game without the new game mechanics PSP2 introduced. Bin the game already people haha.

TheAstarion
Aug 22, 2011, 07:52 AM
The other solution would be a mass rebellion.

Rebel to decompile and get the source to the game and simply reverse engineer the game itself with improvements, then simply leak the source + server console to many groups to work on modifying the game itself to make private servers.

leak them everywhere to the point more people will leave the pay to play versions and go to private servers. This actually will force competition or shutdown between SEGA/Microsoft and private servers.

Sure, Sega could sue private server owners if they find them, but the costs of litigation and the time taken to hire and build cases and go after each server that starts up...and spreads like wildfire will be so high that SEGA would lose more money to the point they would do better to get their act together and actually compete for the best server.


Very easy for me to reprogram the game if I had the source to actually make it a lot better than this garbage we have now...

Better than that; a PC HD remake/port/extensive mod of PSP2i.

If PSP internet connections were more stable, and the ingame chat weren't so horribad and 2001ish, I and a lot of friends would be playing that instead of PSU. Hell, instead of JP PSU even.

Also, Acromaster.

EvilMag
Aug 22, 2011, 08:11 AM
I just don't understand why don't they just revamp PSU all together to play like PSP2i without the limitations because of the PSP. With what they can do with JP PSU, it is possible. Plus Infinity is more popular than JP PSU.

Selphea
Aug 22, 2011, 08:33 AM
I just don't understand why don't they just revamp PSU all together

It's called "PSO2" I think =p

PSU Yoko
Aug 22, 2011, 08:37 AM
I say that sega company can go to hell and there fans supporter . they gonna do the same dam thing with the problem with pso2 like they did in the past and now with psu. they dont give a crap about customers only they want from you is your money. funny thing that everyone here cry like lil kids cuz u don't get what everyone want from sega and everyone is dumb enuf to support sega ether way. sega is outdated.there so stupid they cant even keep up with there own problem. if u stop your crying and bitching maybe this will end.but knowing everyone here yah will still bitch about it and does sega care fuck no they don't. because sega and there GM lost intress with everyone and PSU. soon there gonna do it with pso2 .you see its gonna be all nice and stuff give sometime there gonna go back with there bullshit again mark my word there gonna fuck up like they with other PS game

Resanoca
Aug 22, 2011, 03:40 PM
Can you repeat that in spanish? D:

PSU Yoko
Aug 22, 2011, 03:52 PM
Can you repeat that in spanish? D:
ur funny guy. I guess u don't get it :nono:

Keilyn
Aug 22, 2011, 04:45 PM
The thing is that Console Gamers accept anything.

PSO and PSU got a playerbase because in the console no action oriented online RPGs existed. Its been PSO/PSU holding them in all this time. Even in PSUJP, a lot came from the playstation 2 originally.

This remains true today.

The fanbase of PSO/PSU are die hard, blind loyalists for the most part.

PSO-2 will be a different thing. It will compete directly with a PC market, where already action oriented online RPGs exist as well as MMORPGs in many hybrids. There is also a higher demand on what PC gamers expect from their gaming and if not met, PC gamers know to stay at their present games.

Console Gamers buy many games and go through new releases. PC gamers for the most part once they enter a game they like will stick to that game for 2 - 4 years and variants.

Basically....it will be a completely different battle for SEGA.

Example Below:

I have not seen a PSU ID over 250,000 in PSUJP. This would mean that although 2 million characters can exist (250K x 8 = 2 million), the game is small and keeps getting smaller. There are 8 universes left in PSU JP. This is from a company with massive advertising because they do advertise in Japan and compete.

When ArenaNet made Guild Wars, all they had was youtube and some internet resources. They had a small budget when working to make the game and got the help of NCSOFT. In their first BETA weekend they had close to 500,000 players.

In the PC, its very important for a high subscriber base to exist in those games. A game that obtains 100 - 200K sales might be able to be OK at first, but if the player count goes down, the game will fail in a short time.

SEGA in psujp did GC to take as much money from a smaller population as that of a larger population. They also did Free Course....even with this....250K in five year period is discerning enough.

Im not saying the game is horrible, but PC-GAMING is a different beast than Console Gaming and if SEGA thinks they can apply the same Console-Gaming plan to advertise and sell a PC-ONLY GAME, they will fail.

As for Sega of America......I will laugh when they start running restriction after restriction and garbage after garbage, and their players just dont put up with it and go to other PC games.

Chibi_psu
Aug 22, 2011, 05:20 PM
So there wont be the psp2 content on the 360 server or what?

ashley50
Aug 22, 2011, 06:40 PM
So there wont be the psp2 content on the 360 server or what?
http://www.pso-world.com/forums/showthread.php?t=190357

Chibi_psu
Aug 23, 2011, 04:29 AM
ok....

Anna_Wren
Aug 23, 2011, 05:06 AM
Chances are we will get the data in a special DLC if we get it at all. I haven't lost hope in us getting it but I am damn sure it wont be before PSO2 comes out since almost all of the Phantasy Star programmers are focused on PSO2 so much that even the 360 updaters are over at it too. Since we got SU1 I see no reason we won't eventually get the others but I also think that SoA decided to plow ahead and try to provide more content and stuff to keep the user base alive. Otherwise it would be SE1, 2 years later, SE2. And no missions or anything in between. Like I said before: Once PSO2 comes out in Japan, PSU will die there and either we will get way more attention or will basically be stuck with what we have. I'm inclined to the first but most will go for the latter.

Mekimaru
Aug 23, 2011, 06:16 AM
i was using microsoft as a lose (prob not the best choise) and e.g, cus we all know microsoft isnt perfect, was just the 1st thing i trt of. i supose at the time when not alot of ppl knew why jpservs where so far ahead it caused an upset ..

I now can say i understand alot more why this was , thanks for the info =D

x

Serephim
Aug 23, 2011, 07:33 AM
The thing is that Console Gamers accept anything.



You just like drenched yourself in gasoline here...

It has nothing to do with console vs. pc. And lol, i guess you forgot that alot of the people who did play on PC got kicked off once they nuked the PS2/PC servers. Everyone doesn't have the patience to play the superior version of the game chocked full of moonrunes.

And i think Edward just all but waltzed in here and said "stop waiting for the good stuff it's never coming". I'd drop the notion of ever recieving PSP2/PSP2i stuff. Ever.

Keilyn
Aug 23, 2011, 05:31 PM
You just like drenched yourself in gasoline here...

It has nothing to do with console vs. pc. And lol, i guess you forgot that alot of the people who did play on PC got kicked off once they nuked the PS2/PC servers. Everyone doesn't have the patience to play the superior version of the game chocked full of moonrunes.

And i think Edward just all but waltzed in here and said "stop waiting for the good stuff it's never coming". I'd drop the notion of ever recieving PSP2/PSP2i stuff. Ever.

...and you forgot how SoA nuked the PSO servers in Dreamcast, Gamecube and Xbox back to back, even had the PSObb servers nuked.

http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm

Bet this link makes you feel stupid right?

100s of games on this list in the MMORPG/RPG genre and you can only find them on PC and some of them are free to play. There are some that play like PSO/PSU where you control the character and kill things without pointing and clicking, but only better.

Of course if you are a console gamer...you won't know of this list. You would expect some high sequal number...like the fact people have bought 20+ Final Fantasy Games combined on consoles + handhelds over the years. How about how 90% of the games people buy on consoles = "Title name + Sequal Number"

PC gamers are a more competitive/community bunch. Since PSO-2 is released as pure PC game, it will have to compete against PC games. If only Console Gamers buy PSO-2 as an "Upgrade" from PSOBb and PSU....the game WILL FAIL ROYALLY.

...and considering in a five year period psujp has not even reached 250K subscribers (you wont find an ID at the 250K range) then yes, it actually is a failure of a game, specially from the third largest video game software development company in the world (SEGA).

...and Guild Wars in its first BETA weekend in 2005 with just a youtube video game at the point a no name company offering a competing product had 250 - 500K players....

But sure....SEGA did nuke the PC/PS2 servers and the same people who nuked the servers will continue doing the same thing until the time comes to nuke the 360 servers. ^_^ I will be here to say "I told you so" when 360 servers go bye bye. ^_^

We can go thank SoA right?

FOkyasuta
Aug 23, 2011, 05:38 PM
I just feel stupid by looking at that post. It'd be like a Big "I Told You So" if it shows up on consoles anyway.

EvilMag
Aug 23, 2011, 06:04 PM
I wouldn't be surprised at the final minute that Sega announces that PSO2 will come on either the 360 or PS3.

ZER0 DX
Aug 23, 2011, 11:36 PM
And I will be pissed if they do.

Selphea
Aug 23, 2011, 11:42 PM
It'll be a "different version" though!

Ilikelamp7
Aug 24, 2011, 11:36 AM
It'll be a "different version" though!

Yes and SEGA will quench everyone's thirst for more reskins!

Me: PLEASE SEGA CAN I HAVE MORE RESKINS?!

SEGA: HEEEEELLLLL YEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHH.

Chibi_psu
Aug 24, 2011, 12:22 PM
so the problem is they cant patch?Then why dont they release a damn dlc and charge us?If its the only way to get more updates and items go ahead....

BIG OLAF
Aug 24, 2011, 12:33 PM
so the problem is they cant patch?Then why dont they release a damn dlc and charge us?If its the only way to get more updates and items go ahead....

That's what we're trying to get pushed on the official PSU forums.

Here's the thread. (http://forums.sega.com/showthread.php?375276-How-does-the-community-feel-about-DLC-for-PSU) Go cast your vote. It may not matter, but for now, every little bit helps.

unicorn
Aug 24, 2011, 01:04 PM
All those silly forum polls go in vain since SegaJP dun curr about what you guys want.

They'll shut you guys down in 6-8 months and you will deal.

Halcyote
Aug 24, 2011, 01:08 PM
The only forum poll that managed to have any weight was getting PSU on Games on Demand. Possibly because the lack of physical media for the game cut into their potential profits.

oh crackpot theories y u so funny

BIG OLAF
Aug 24, 2011, 01:15 PM
Well, despite the naysayers, we'll still do our best to try and get the idea through. Will it happen? Probably not. Will that stop us? No, because all anyone can do is try. Sitting there and saying "haha, you're all stupid if you think that will do anything" is just being rude for the sake of being rude, and I pity your disgusting attitudes.

Vashyron
Aug 24, 2011, 01:35 PM
When SOA actually had copied content to deliver from JP, they still managed to deliver it various unsatisfactory ways, (Not forgetting bad support, hardly listening to the community, etc.) but now people are still expecting them to crop up something very special code-wise for the 360 version if enough people throw their voice out on the forum poll? If they truly even showed they cared I would of had a different opinion at this point, such as even sticking the damn thread and posting in game announcements to get people to vote, but no, does it look like they care at this point? Seriously.

Nothing is stopping you from casting your vote there while still thinking it'll never happen. Doesn't hurt to try sure, as of course 'nothing' is impossible.

It's not rude to point this out, it's just being very realistic.

Anna_Wren
Aug 24, 2011, 07:27 PM
I find it funny that people think 360 will get shutdown "soon" because people keep posting 360 will get shut down like every other month. This is just more hilarious crap.

Ok, the skins are wrong and we will likely get the right ones later because if we got the stuff Japan has then their player base would totally die. Its economics plain and simple. I'm suprised people don't get that!

EvilMag
Aug 24, 2011, 07:29 PM
I find it funny that people think 360 will get shutdown "soon" because people keep posting 360 will get shut down like every other month. This is just more hilarious crap.

Ok, the skins are wrong and we will likely get the right ones later because if we got the stuff Japan has then their player base would totally die. Its economics plain and simple. I'm suprised people don't get that!

This, PSU 360 getting shut down I believe is also up to Microsoft and I highly doubt that they want it shut down.

Vashyron
Aug 24, 2011, 07:56 PM
I find it funny that people think 360 will get shutdown "soon" because people keep posting 360 will get shut down like every other month. This is just more hilarious crap.

Ok, the skins are wrong and we will likely get the right ones later because if we got the stuff Japan has then their player base would totally die. Its economics plain and simple. I'm suprised people don't get that!



http://dl.dropbox.com/u/12804628/Random/bert%20snaps.gif




Ok. Ok. So if I heard this correct, if 360 got JP's content, JP would die?

I would like to know how you even came up with this rationalization. Seriously I am all ears.

Serephim
Aug 24, 2011, 11:16 PM
...and you forgot how SoA nuked the PSO servers in Dreamcast, Gamecube and Xbox back to back, even had the PSObb servers nuked.

http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm

Bet this link makes you feel stupid right?

blah blah blah blah

dude...chill out, and quit trying to force your opinions down my throat.

edit: nevermind, you guys take this dumb shit way too seriously.

Lucidia
Aug 25, 2011, 12:52 AM
20+ pages later

[SPOILER-BOX]http://www.pinetarpress.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/beating-a-dead-horse-2.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]

MistyWaters
Aug 25, 2011, 02:43 AM
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/12804628/Random/bert%20snaps.gif




Ok. Ok. So if I heard this correct, if 360 got JP's content, JP would die?

I would like to know how you even came up with this rationalization. Seriously I am all ears.


Oh lawdy, I'm laughing so fucking hard I'm crying.

I gotta see how this will go. Too funny.

BIG OLAF
Aug 25, 2011, 10:13 AM
I wouldn't go as far to say that the JP servers would die. That's taking it to a bit of an extreme, Anna.

But, they would feel a bit of an impact, I'm sure. Nothing significant, but probably most (if not all) of the US/EU importers would switch back to the 360 version (if they still have a 360). You must remember that the Xbox isn't that big a deal over in Japan. I mean, shit, they recently decided to pull Xboxs off of the market over there, since they were selling so poorly. So, I don't think that many people would care enough to switch over to the Xbox version of PSU, even if it was 100% on-par with the JP servers.

TenebriS
Aug 25, 2011, 10:35 AM
I dont think that to much of importers would change back to XBOX, if at closing of PC/PS2 xbox would ahve had same content as JP PSU some would ahve gone there for sure. But soem are now on the JP PSU for a while and got some nice stuff and i guess msot of them would want to start all over again on the XBOX servers. It would take pretty long to restart the 3rd for some people. It's a guess and jsut my opinion not gonna say a lot of peopel would change, but im sure not all importers would change again.
Anyway, I would be happy if XBOX would have same content as JP PSU, since we all paly the same game (kinda even if its different versions) and it would be nice to see Western version be updated often and properly :)

Serephim
Aug 25, 2011, 10:35 AM
there are still a couple of Xbox exclusive very popular games on X360, but for hte most part, nothing popular to us appeals much to them.


Im not surprised. Our RPGs are all ridiculously western-centric, and shooters have quickly become standard in pretty much every aspect of their gameplay. Games like Call of Duty get trillions of buyers for, apparently, no reason. Most of our RPGs/Action games have wonderful lighting effects and shaders but terrible animations and particle engines, making for realistic but terribly stiff and inorganic feeling characters.

Not to say Japanese games are much better...recently this "Moe" and "Lolita" shit has completely driven me away from almost everything they do, including anime and videogames. JRPGs have quickly all become, also, standard in gameplay aspects, even Final Fantasy, and focus all on the wrong crap, like "LOL SUPER MOVIE STORYLINE". Their action games are all the same over-the-top garbage with huge combo numbers, and their characters are all generic heroes with odd looking weapons and a female interest who's either a tsundere or just ridiculously passive.

/tangent

It's like the whole world is in a creative slump. Don't even get me STARTED on hollywood, Disney, Cartoonnetwork, ect ect.


Speaking of which, has anyone noticed the whole "90s are awesome" thing that nick is doing? Bliss Nostalgia, i guess they finally realized that their recent shit is garbage.

bloodflowers
Aug 25, 2011, 03:36 PM
I wouldn't go as far to say that the JP servers would die. That's taking it to a bit of an extreme, Anna.

But, they would feel a bit of an impact, I'm sure. Nothing significant, but probably most (if not all) of the US/EU importers would switch back to the 360 version (if they still have a 360). You must remember that the Xbox isn't that big a deal over in Japan. I mean, shit, they recently decided to pull Xboxs off of the market over there, since they were selling so poorly. So, I don't think that many people would care enough to switch over to the Xbox version of PSU, even if it was 100% on-par with the JP servers.

There's few enough importers that most people know everyone else, or are only one friend connection away. Their all leaving JP would have no impact whatsoever in my opinion. The Xbox might notice them return though, there's a lot of meseta tied up in inactive and virtually inactive accounts.

And Anna, no - we won't ever get the right skins for those weapons. Stop hoping, you'll just be disappointed. I'll say that this is purely my opinion, I think it was highly irresponsible of Edward to extend to people the hope of DLC by asking what they think of the subject. Whether the intentions were good or diversionary, I don't see it happening at all unless the subject had already been raised with Japan. Maybe it has, but then - our Tiga boards are still bugged and our Cerans are still missing from DtS, and I thought those were supposed to have been raised too.

ZER0 DX
Aug 25, 2011, 07:57 PM
Even if 360 caught up by some miracle I won't be switching back. My JP character is already leagues better and almost all of my friends from back on English PC play on JP.

EvilMag
Aug 25, 2011, 08:02 PM
This comic sums up 360. lol
http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p32/Lord_Edryl/TimelyService.png

Serephim
Aug 26, 2011, 12:22 AM
the simplicity of that comic is so amazing. It's so great lol

boomadatigger
Aug 27, 2011, 06:53 AM
This comic sums up 360. lol
http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p32/Lord_Edryl/TimelyService.png

So true. So true.

Keilyn
Aug 27, 2011, 07:58 AM
there are still a couple of Xbox exclusive very popular games on X360, but for hte most part, nothing popular to us appeals much to them.


Im not surprised. Our RPGs are all ridiculously western-centric, and shooters have quickly become standard in pretty much every aspect of their gameplay. Games like Call of Duty get trillions of buyers for, apparently, no reason. Most of our RPGs/Action games have wonderful lighting effects and shaders but terrible animations and particle engines, making for realistic but terribly stiff and inorganic feeling characters.

Not to say Japanese games are much better...recently this "Moe" and "Lolita" shit has completely driven me away from almost everything they do, including anime and videogames. JRPGs have quickly all become, also, standard in gameplay aspects, even Final Fantasy, and focus all on the wrong crap, like "LOL SUPER MOVIE STORYLINE". Their action games are all the same over-the-top garbage with huge combo numbers, and their characters are all generic heroes with odd looking weapons and a female interest who's either a tsundere or just ridiculously passive.

/tangent

It's like the whole world is in a creative slump. Don't even get me STARTED on hollywood, Disney, Cartoonnetwork, ect ect.


Speaking of which, has anyone noticed the whole "90s are awesome" thing that nick is doing? Bliss Nostalgia, i guess they finally realized that their recent shit is garbage.

Funny that you should mention Call of Duty.

I play that series and even Famitsu Magazine...A Magazine known for actually discriminating against any Western Title out there actually gave Modern Warfare II a 39/40 as well as Black Ops.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Famitsu

When you play a shooter you have freedom. You don't have a bunch of attribute scores and stats limiting everything you do. You can change your role too depending on actual experience and map control.

In an MMORPG there are traditionally four roles. Nuker, Puller, Damage Dealer and Tanker. You make a character and regardless how good or bad you are, you never can get out of that role unless you make a new character. Anywhere you go, anything you do...you are system dependent. A Max level character with no equipment except fists are going to kill a level 1 character who has Epic equipment in one hit.

You then have Action Oriented RPGs where the difference between most games within the genre and PSO/PSU is that in Phantasy Star games you don't even need max grinded equipment to clear a map decently. You could run with 0/10 40% and clear a map with no real problems. The grinding is for those who want to show off their TAing, while in other Action Oriented RPGs to be able to clear the areas ALONE you will need to grind all your weapon and Equipment up from +1 to +12 - + 16...and raise your abilities to a high level.

I wonder if the Xbox version is at the point where any class can clear a map without grinding any equipment with ease.

If that is so then outside of looks the differences outside of the obvious graphics and models are not so different when it comes to gameplay.