Techs no longer linked to weapons

[Ark22]

It's been confirmed. Did anyone else know this o.O Or am I late xD

[BioWarrior]

It was confirmed about a week ago, but tech charging requires the bind. I'm really torn on what class I want to play.... Forced binding turned me off from force in PSU. Thinking about starting with FOnewearl or FOmarl. Forces were amazing in PSO/PS0 but I hated them in PSU/PSP2

[Ark22]

Dang I really need to read more...But Work and...college..LOL anyways I since there is no TECH LINKS FORCE ALL THE WAY!!!!!!!!!!

But since this is pretty old..Could a mod delete this for me =D

Please and thanks. Hate to get flamed but at the same time wouldn't care.

[condiments]

Dang I really need to read more...But Work and...college..LOL anyways I since there is no TECH LINKS FORCE ALL THE WAY!!!!!!!!!!

But since this is pretty old..Could a mod delete this for me =D

Please and thanks. Hate to get flamed but at the same time wouldn't care.

It was actually one of my chief problems with PSU, and when I learned I could cast freely I got more excited for this game. The fact that you can link techs to your staff and charge adds more depth to forces as well. Now I can bring back my Fomar in his full glory!:D

[KingBeeb]

It was confirmed about a week ago, but tech charging requires the bind.

I'M TOTALLY CONFUSED WHAT DOES THIS MEAN

I'll always play as a Force anyway. Even if they're total crap.

[Justyn_Darkcrest]

Force players around the world wept tears of joy when we heard this news, and though we knew already, it never hurts hearing it again ^.-

@KingBeeb, in order to charge a tech (increase it's power/change it to the RA version) you have Bind, or "Link" it to a Rod or Wand. At least that's what they've told us so far.

[Pillan]

I really wonder how useful unlinked techniques will be. If this game's stats are anything like PSP2's, a rod will essentially more than double the tech damage/resta output. And then the charge effect probably doubles the utility as well. It makes me wonder if unlinked techs will be worthwhile outside of self-target shifta, deband, (PSU) reverser (anti), and ryuker.

[Alnet]

Have they said what charging does? Does it just improve damage, or does it improve range, velocity, AOE size, how long the effect lasts (for support techs) or anything? And does it cost more TP to charge?

[Justyn_Darkcrest]

Supposedly, it will increase the damage output at no additional PP cost. I believe it also changes the AoE as well, possibly might be like PSZ was for charging up foie to use rafoie.

Edit: Just checked and it says that a techs power, range, and effect change when charged.

[r00tabaga]

It makes me wonder if unlinked techs will be worthwhile outside of self-target shifta, deband, (PSU) reverser (anti), and ryuker.

Ahhhh Ryuker, how I missed you.
Q: I wonder if you can link 3 different techs to a different rod so that when U select it from your action palette, it gives you an extra set of charged techniques?
A: ?

[Justyn_Darkcrest]

Ahhhh Ryuker, how I missed you.
Q: I wonder if you can link 3 different techs to a different rod so that when U select it from your action palette, it gives you an extra set of charged techniques?
A: ?

Most likely yes. Unless they break up the linking system in order to seperate techs from melee/ranged PA's, since I don't imagine that one melee PA will work for all weapon types, it wouldn't make sense to have the PA carry over to a different weapon.

Of course, there's always that little broken record saying of "We just don't know yet so we have to wait and see".

[r00tabaga]

That's the next thing I wanna see in a video (besides mags of course). I am curious how the sub palette works when you choose a different weapon type from your action palette. I agree w/Justyn in that it prolly let's you customize different charged techs to different rods, but we will have to wait and see in the next updates.
I'm pretty sure the hotkeys (0-9) are the same when a different weapon is used but even that is not in stone.

[thebelovedkid]

This is great news that you have to have a force to be able to use tech again, when they enable casts in the PSU to use tech (because it was linked to the actual weapon) it really turned me off of the game. anyways FOnewmearl all the way for PSO2. Though i really hope they will make it so that you need to do more than just ''bind'' with the tech...

[Pillan]

There has not been any news that says only Force can use techs. However, they still have not shown anyone using techs that has not equipped a rod. I assume they are Force characters, but there has been no news that says Hunter and Ranger cannot use rods either.

And Cast can play Force (and thus use techs) in this game as well. There has been no note that Casts cannot add techs to the number keys.

[r00tabaga]

And Cast can play Force (and thus use techs) in this game as well. There has been no note that Casts cannot add techs to the number keys.

How and why would they be different from any other force as far as hotkeys are concerned?

[Zyrusticae]

I'm pretty sure the hotkeys (0-9) are the same when a different weapon is used but even that is not in stone.
Actually, I recall from the video when they switched weapons that the hot keys changed to something completely different.

If you mean the actual keys (0-9), they are of course the same, but if you mean the skills, they seem to save a different set for every weapon you have. Which makes sense, because different weapons are NOT going to have the exact same PAs.

[Malachite]

Well, I always called the (0-9) keys 'hot keys'. But yeah, you're right. Different weapons carry different sets of skills, and the 0-9 keys remain the same at all times.

I don't see a better way to handle it than that, honestly. Good stuff, imo.

Shame though, I'll be using a controller. Maybe I can work some setup in xpadder or joy2key to find a way to set those all to my controller on the lower shoulder buttons (if they're even unused, that is).

[Neith]

As long as I can map Shifta/Deband/Jellen/Zalure and Anti/Reverser to the number keys as a Hunter, I'll be happy. :wacko:

[Malachite]

Reverser as a hunter?

Is that a thing? lol have I been out of the loop that long?

[Pillan]

How and why would they be different from any other force as far as hotkeys are concerned?

Personally, I would hope not. But a desire for this does stem over from that idea that "Casts can only use techs in PSU because they are linked to weapons." (I do not recall that being the official PSU reasoning either.) However, they really do not need to use it as an excuse and can just say "Casts can use techs naturally in this game, sorry PSO purists."

I am always in favor of minimizing racial differences to the point that they are non-existent.

[Malachite]

I disagree heavily. There would be no point to have multiple races if not for their positives and negatives when compared to another race. Otherwise it'd just be 'long ears or short ears?'.

[Jinketsu]

I actually like this idea! It was interesting how techs were bound to weapons in PSU and that determined what you had available at your arsenal, but it never sat completely satisfying to my gameplay tastes. Now tech binding is specifically for making certain spells more powerful? There's still a lot of gear swapping in my FO-ture, but I'm used to that with FFXI... haha.

[r00tabaga]

The more disparity between the races the better IMHO. The FOcasts & FOcaseals should not need to have their techs bound to rods. That was a PSU thang and is improved upon in pso2 apparently.
When I said hotkeys, I meant 0-9...not the action palette. PAs will obviously change for different weapons used. So what I want to know is are the 0-9 "shortcuts" locked or do they indeed change when a new weapon is equipped?

[Malachite]

Pretty sure they're locked, r00t.

Lol I used to find you annoying as hell but now I agree with almost every post you make.

[condiments]

I really wonder how useful unlinked techniques will be. If this game's stats are anything like PSP2's, a rod will essentially more than double the tech damage/resta output. And then the charge effect probably doubles the utility as well. It makes me wonder if unlinked techs will be worthwhile outside of self-target shifta, deband, (PSU) reverser (anti), and ryuker.

I absolutely hope this isn't the case. Having such an imbalanced power disparity would create another situation like the normal/PA system in PSU. Charging techs should be useful, but not to the point where it makes non-linked techs irrelevant. Otherwise it would remove any possible depth this feature could add.

[•Col•]

It's been confirmed. Did anyone else know this o.O Or am I late xD

Would've known if you read the sticky. And like someone else already said, techs can be linked to weapons.


Have they said what charging does? Does it just improve damage, or does it improve range, velocity, AOE size, how long the effect lasts (for support techs) or anything? And does it cost more TP to charge?

Also would've been answered if you read the sticky.



IId. TECHNIQUES(SPELLS)/PHOTON ARTS:

Techniques are chargeable, and may be cast while in the air
Techniques cost PP to cast, but don't require any additional PP when they are charged
Techniques may only be charged when linked to a magical weapon.
Techniques may be set and cast from the sub-pallete(which implies that you may not need a magic type weapon to cast Techs)
A Technique's power, range and effect change when charged

[Neith]

Reverser as a hunter?

Is that a thing? lol have I been out of the loop that long?

Reverser is the name of Anti in PSU. Giresta was the revival technique (but in PSP2 Infinity, Reverser is revival again. Anti is called 'Regene' in PSP2 JP/PSP2i).

I know Reverser was revival in PSO, and that Hunters couldn't use it. To the PSO crowd, I mean Anti. :wacko:

[Ark22]

I don't read the update :P, I read everything else xD I mean I just want a thread for everyone to see :P. Not look in the update section every 24/7. Not fun for me.

[Poubelle]

and that's why youre a retard.

LOLOLOL xD :P

[Ark22]

and that's why youre a retard.

LOLOLOL xD :P

This is correct

[•Col•]

I don't read the update :P, I read everything else xD I mean I just want a thread for everyone to see :P. Not look in the update section every 24/7. Not fun for me.

You don't have to look in the update section every day. Just look in the section pertaining to your question, which in this case, obviously, was the Technique section. :l

[Ark22]

Lol I will look next time. Sorry :P. But What's the point of making threads when everything is in ONE thread. I understand for questions but, it kills the fun for me =/

[Pillan]

You could easily just make a thread to discuss how the change makes you feel, as this thread has already become. And I see no reason not to add that, as there is not another one that is a direct discussion on this topic.

[BioWarrior]

The more disparity between the races the better IMHO. The FOcasts & FOcaseals should not need to have their techs bound to rods. That was a PSU thang and is improved upon in pso2 apparently.
When I said hotkeys, I meant 0-9...not the action palette. PAs will obviously change for different weapons used. So what I want to know is are the 0-9 "shortcuts" locked or do they indeed change when a new weapon is equipped?

In one of the conference videos you can see the 0-9 pallet change along with the weapon. I don't remember which specifically it was. But I'm pretty sure it was the one that was mostly force gameplay.

[Rizen]

My question is are hunters and rangers going to be able to use techs? If so, which ones and to what limitation? I know techs on hunters weren't the greatest, but they did provide some utility.

PSPo2 allowed pretty much granted access to techs for all classes via rods, wands, and T-Mags, but seeing as techs no longer have to be linked to the weapon, I wonder how it would work out if they decide to allow classes outside of forces to use techs.

[•Col•]

My question is are hunters and rangers going to be able to use techs? If so, which ones and to what limitation? I know techs on hunters weren't the greatest, but they did provide some utility.

PSPo2 allowed pretty much granted access to techs for all classes via rods, wands, and T-Mags, but seeing as techs no longer have to be linked to the weapon, I wonder how it would work out if they decide to allow classes outside of forces to use techs.

We don't know.

However, there are subclasses, so I'd be VERY surprised if we didn't see ones for Hunter/Ranger that allow the use of techs.

[Pillan]

My personal expectation is that Hunter and Ranger can use techs freely up to an equivalent HUmar tech cap. And then to equip tech weapons to charge techs and do reasonable heals/damage, you have to hybridize the class toward Force with subclasses. But that is all conjecture based on how PSP2 worked out.

[Alnet]

Also would've been answered if you read the sticky.
Ugh, yeah, amateur mistake on my part.

I suppose that if techniques charging makes their effects change, we'll end up with more uniqueness among their attack animations and usage ala PSO as opposed to PSU's tech series. Unless we somehow end up with techs that do the same thing when charged (such as Zonde and Barta both doing a linear piercing attack, for example). I wonder if this means that we'll be foregoing a lot of technique learning and leveling? Like if we charge Foie, then instead of it just becoming a stronger Foie, it'll become Gifoie or Rafoie. It would cut out the need to learn those techniques, since we'd have them already, in a sense.

But that's just wishful thinking for brand-new attacks, what with so many details left in the air.

[•Col•]

My guess is that they'll just be beefier types of the base technique. So for charged foie would just be a bigger, faster fireball.

[thebelovedkid]

Well i let's just say, wait for PSO2 and do a fresh start :) i mean it's not going to be like PSO,PSU ,PSPo2 but i think they will manage a fair middle...either way the game will be amazing i am pretty sure of it n_n'

[Randomness]

My question is are hunters and rangers going to be able to use techs? If so, which ones and to what limitation? I know techs on hunters weren't the greatest, but they did provide some utility.

PSPo2 allowed pretty much granted access to techs for all classes via rods, wands, and T-Mags, but seeing as techs no longer have to be linked to the weapon, I wonder how it would work out if they decide to allow classes outside of forces to use techs.

If HUs/RAs can't use techs, that's basically the whole point of rolling newman gone right there.

Thus, I conclude they can use techs. Newmans may be able to use more than other races (in general and as non-force classes).

[BioWarrior]

Techs seem like a mix of PSO/PS0 and PSU this time around. Also did anyone notice Barta is a projectile now? If you look closely it's a block of ice shooting out like foie or diga. I'm also hoping diga doesn't return, I preferred the rock paper scissors of Foie, Barta, and Zonde.

[Randomness]

Techs seem like a mix of PSO/PS0 and PSU this time around. Also did anyone notice Barta is a projectile now? If you look closely it's a block of ice shooting out like foie or diga. I'm also hoping diga doesn't return, I preferred the rock paper scissors of Foie, Barta, and Zonde.

What rock paper scissors? It was always a matter of resists, nothing more. For instance, Zonde was effective against all of mines, while Barta was limited to it's higher forms' utility (FREEZE!!!!) and Foie was of limited use.

[Rizen]

Techs seem like a mix of PSO/PS0 and PSU this time around. Also did anyone notice Barta is a projectile now? If you look closely it's a block of ice shooting out like foie or diga. I'm also hoping diga doesn't return, I preferred the rock paper scissors of Foie, Barta, and Zonde.
I love rock paper scissors mechanics in games, but the Foe, Barta, and Zonde one never made sense to me. It just became something I accepted.

Personally, I would like to see more elements. II would help make the game a bit more complex and versatile to situation with enemies and the environment.

Also, inb4reskinfordiffernetelements.

[BioWarrior]

The problem I have with more elements is Sega loves to neglect being able to pull down a menu with all your techs like PSO had. I love forces, but PSU was too convoluted for me. I honestly wish the pallet system was more PSO than PSU, but atleast it doesn't have to be bound to be used.

[Ark22]

Foie was perfect against Bosses. Just Foie alone in pso. Prime example 3rd form of Dark Falz

[Rizen]

0-9 keys for binding + 3 slot for combination/other skills? I think that's enough to cover the techs you need for whatever situation you are in.

Granted, I preferred the drop down menu in PSO over PSU any day. Made it easier to access all of your equipment, techs, and items while in combat. I do understand why PSU went to set palette system, but it was poorly executed and by no means a better replacement for the one in PSO.

[BioWarrior]

Real question is how will tech charging effect support techs? In zero it only effects your party when charged. I HATED PSU for the sole fact I needed to bind my support techs instead of using the drop down menu PSO had for stuff like shifta, deband, jellen, and zalure.

[Rizen]

It wasn't too bad...just slap it on one rod and you were good to go.

[Randomness]

Real question is how will tech charging effect support techs? In zero it only effects your party when charged. I HATED PSU for the sole fact I needed to bind my support techs instead of using the drop down menu PSO had for stuff like shifta, deband, jellen, and zalure.

PSOBB was lovely for having 1-0 as hotkeys. Could keep a lot of less-used techs there, and then re-sort the tech list to put everything not bound at the top/bottom to be easier to reach.

[Rizen]

A bit off topic......

One thing I am hoping for techs is unique animation for casting...so many MMOs use the same repetitive animation for every single spell...gets kinda dull. Maybe it is wishing for too much, but don't want hunters having all the fun!

[BioWarrior]

I atleast like the casting animations shown so far. FOmarl using the cane like a gun for Foie and Barta, and holds it up in the air for Razonde I'm guessing? Looks nice so far.

[Rizen]

I atleast like the casting animations shown so far. FOmarl using the cane like a gun for Foie and Barta, and holds it up in the air for Razonde I'm guessing? Looks nice so far.
The casting so far does look nice...but its not the only two casting animation!

[BioWarrior]

I'm hoping RA and GI techs aren't clones but different elements like PSU. I'm hoping they end up more varied like PSO so they each have a use. Zonde seems like it's back to it's old PSO style instead of a projectile like PSU. Also noticed I made a mistake in my last post lol pretty sure it's GIzonde and not RAzonde.

[•Col•]

I atleast like the casting animations shown so far. FOmarl using the cane like a gun for Foie and Barta, and holds it up in the air for Razonde I'm guessing? Looks nice so far.

Most likely is tech-dependent. Certain techs can be aimed, like foie, while others are AOE around the caster.

[Randomness]

PS0 had a nice variety of effects from skills. The closest to being identical in function were Zonde and Grants. (Can't remember how Megid fired, though) All the charged forms were unique (Explosion, chain lightning, icicle spam, black hole, and a fast/weak burst around self).

[BioWarrior]

Megid was a foie clone without being charged. But all the charged versions were like the RA versions in the original PSO.

[Hucast-Kireek]

Can you cast a spell with no weapons on like in PSO or PSZ? that's the question.

[Rizen]

The way it has been stated, yes they can be casted without weapons.

[BioWarrior]

Yes, that's what was asked at the start of this topic~ we don't know if HU and RA can use techs though, but the existence of FOcast and FOcaseal is confirmed. Binding to your rod/cane like in PSU is just for a charged attack this time around.

[Kent]

I'm hoping RA and GI techs aren't clones but different elements like PSU. I'm hoping they end up more varied like PSO so they each have a use. Zonde seems like it's back to it's old PSO style instead of a projectile like PSU. Also noticed I made a mistake in my last post lol pretty sure it's GIzonde and not RAzonde.
This is one thing that I really think is essential to making playing as a caster fun at all.

Techniques in PSU were boring as hell - because outside of the basic techniques and the randomly-inconsistent Nos- techniques, everything was just a different-colored variation of another element's technique grade.

In PSO, we had most of the techniques actually functionally-different from each other - similar to how one might compare various spells in, say, Diablo II. It seems to be pretty well-understood that unless different types of weapons are going to be functionally-different from each other, they may as well not exist in an action-oriented game - it should stand to reason that techniques should also be different on an individual level so as to make the considerations for using them happen on a similar level as weapons.

I would say the best example of how this is done properly in PSO would be the Gi-level techniques, which were all radically different from each other, while still fitting into their respective series' styles. Gizonde was a fast attack that instantly hits all of its applicable targets (and even got sniping distance at very high levels), Gibarta is your traditional "cone of cold" with its piercing conal AOE, and Gifoie stands out as one of the more underrated techniques due to the finessing it really requires, compared to its spammable basic and Ra-level series entrants.

But that aside, the fact of the matter is, using these techniques effectively required the player to actually consider how the technique works, rather than simply "press this button for damage." That's what made technique usage fun and interesting in the first place.

Though I don't really agree with the directions of Razonde and Rabarta (which were unfortunately-similar in how they really worked, they could have been much more interesting), and to a lesser extent Grants (which was really just a slow and unwieldy version of Zonde), just because they weren't functionally-different enough from each other to remain very interesting at all. PSU may have had more techniques total, but all it really accomplished on this front was saturating the technique list with a bunch of soulless copies of basic ideas, and was never any fun to actually try and use. I would much rather have a somewhat-small number of offensive techniques, than have a bunch that are effectively just different-colored copies of each other.

[Fayorei]

I DIDN'T KNOW! I think I love you Ark. FFFFF yesssss day freaking one, even if it only comes out in Japan!:D

[Ark22]

Hehe :P I am happy I am not the only one who doesn't read the latest update thing.

[•Col•]

Hehe :P I am happy I am not the only one who doesn't read the latest update thing.

The thing is, you posted several times in the thread that first announced/talked about it.

http://www.pso-world.com/forums/showthread.php?t=189701

You were too busy going on about a bulge slider again to notice, though. :l

[Ark22]

I will only look at it when the Bulge slider is announced dammit! But honestly I rather just look at a thread and see it say [Insert something I like in here and tried to find] thread. :P Plus We can have a dedicated thread just for THAT instead of it all piled up into one thread. xP

[moorebounce]

I think since Yuji Naka left the remaining developers were trying to stray away from the PSO model to keep people from thinking they were riding Yuji Naka's work. Some of it was good but most of it was bad. It's nice to see they came to their senses and are making their way back to the goodness of PSO.

I didn't really play with forces until playing PSOBB. Not even on PSU so I had no idea the forces couldn't cast techs w/o a weapon. lol just more badness I didn't know about PSU. I know this news will make a few friends of mine happy about PSO2.

[Fayorei]

Hehe :P I am happy I am not the only one who doesn't read the latest update thing.

Honestly, I don't have time to keep up with every single latest update, and I think this kinda merits a topic on its own being such a huge mechanic. But eh man, just me.:-?

ITT: People who hate using discussion boards for discussion.:P

[Jinketsu]

Guess I gotta chime in on that note.

[RemiusTA]

I think since Yuji Naka left the remaining developers were trying to stray away from the PSO model to keep people from thinking they were riding Yuji Naka's work. Some of it was good but most of it was bad. It's nice to see they came to their senses and are making their way back to the goodness of PSO.

Naka left Sega so long ago....unfortunately one too many of their good products came from his mind or under his management...

[Ark22]

Honestly, I don't have time to keep up with every single latest update, and I think this kinda merits a topic on its own being such a huge mechanic. But eh man, just me.:-?

ITT: People who hate using discussion boards for discussion.:P

In my opinion it kinda kills the whole Ideas of topics. It's like writing an essay about a game, but put everything you know about it in the first Paragraph.

But again my opinion =)

[KingBeeb]

You guys don't read every single post on this forum? What casuals! ;)

[Hucast-Kireek]

I liked Forces, but PSZ made me love them, Now I will Always have a HUcast my fav class, HUmar my 2nd Favorite and a FOnewm but the HUnewm is also cool...hmm.

Guess HUnewms are my 4th choice...or is it 3rd..ugh Ill think it over heh.

[Padium]

It was actually one of my chief problems with PSU, and when I learned I could cast freely I got more excited for this game. The fact that you can link techs to your staff and charge adds more depth to forces as well. Now I can bring back my Fomar in his full glory!:D

I guess a lot of forces were in this boat as well. I'm glad to hear they won't be linked, it has restored a little of my faith in humanity.

[Enforcer MKV]

Yeah, my main isn't even a force (He's a guntecher - more of a hybrid. :p) But I'm really glad this choice was made. If nothing else, it means I don't have to delay my heals as much. No more switching to a tech weapon to save someone's life.

[voxie]

Gah, I don't mind how they change the techs up, as long as it feels like I'm casting something... I reckon the new charging up feature will definitely help that.

In previous PSO/U's, sometimes I just felt like a fireworks display, rather than an actual wizard...

But hey I'm being overly picky there - Hunters were always my default :P