ranger upper trap vs hard dark ragne

[soulpimpwizzurd]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4qWWWRTGf_0&feature=player_embedded

kion posted this video in the general ranger thread but i think it's interesting enough to be posted in general, mainly because it makes upper trap look really broken.

planting traps used to take a really long time in closed beta, but the plan time is much shorter now. the only bosses that this doesn't work as well against are bosses that don't really matter in the first place, rock bear and katerdan (they don't have any periods of long inactivity)

it even works on the snow panther if you can recognize if he's going to snow breath soon enough. he snow breaths for like 10 seconds, so you could just weak shot his face and then upper trap close enough but outside of the snow breath zone.

[Geistritter]

Huh. Better than I expected, actually.

I'd still say it's a niche thing, not really applicable on a large scale. Obviously effective in that niche, though.

[TRICKST3R]

That damage was incredible.

[Sigmund]

Impressive to say the least. It's always nice when people risks to try something new and results in a decent outcome.

Though he had to break Ragne's four legs to achieve this video, I can see it being devastating on Gwanada.

[Ark22]

That's cool. But it didn't pass 6k, so it is not OP. No seriously that is pretty awesome but rather just rpg the hell out of it....rpg....hehehe....Rappy propelled launcher..hehe.HEHE AHAHAHA!

[Coatl]

Rangers doing something besides weak bullet and launcher?
Makes me want to try the class. :3

[Geistritter]

...Rangers who use launchers on bosses tend to suck butt anyway. It's one of the few times you can't justify using them all the time.

[HadouMetsu]

I can't really tell whats going on here, but it looks incredibly OP

[Geistritter]

It's not, actually, but it's effective in this case.

[AlMcFly]

Wow. Situational, but wow.

[HadouMetsu]

It looks to me that he's exploiting some kind of glitch with a certain skill. Looks OP to me

[MelancholyWitch]

Too situational to be useful, might as well build up points in damage and wait till some really high stat gear comes out then numbers like that wont be anything, I can nearly do that damage and I'm not using my 9 star rifle yet.

[Alenoir]

The ranger's stats, because it's not in the YT desc.

Lv40
R-ATK 989
Tool Mastery Lv10
Upper Trap Custom Lv10

Weapon she's using is a ティグリドル (the only 9* rifle in the game so far).

[MelancholyWitch]

yeah what I'm saying is she could do even more damage choosing points elsewhere.

[soulpimpwizzurd]

Too situational to be useful, might as well build up points in damage and wait till some really high stat gear comes out then numbers like that wont be anything, I can nearly do that damage and I'm not using my 9 star rifle yet.

simply being able to achieve the same damage doesn't matter if you can't do it with the same speed and consistency. he's basically doing 10k+ every second.

it's situation-based, but considering the fact that only bosses in this game are what present any sense of challenge, and the fact that all the difficult bosses have some period of inactivity, i'd say it's broken. just because traps aren't particularly effective against mobs doesn't matter since mobs die easily enough regardless.

[MelancholyWitch]

it's not too difficult when you have others to help with the legs, I still manage to pull off damage quickly, I don't really go soloing much so I don't see myself needing something like this, bosses already die fast enough as it is.

It's more along the lines of something for those who solo more than anything.

[Ark22]

Looks like Weak bullet and mines are getting a maaajjoooor nerf.

[MelancholyWitch]

yeah I was about to add in my post reason it's not all the worth it as well is something very likely to get nerfed and isn't intended.

[Geistritter]

...Seriously guys, 6000 damage really isn't that much, and that's extremely situational. Don't expect something to be done about it yet.


ティグリドル (the only 9* rifle in the game so far).

Also, there are two nine star rifles, at least so far. The other is ディブルカーン.

[Garnet_Moon]

Situational yeah, but I'm curious how this will work on the future big bosses like Vader. If it even HAS a weak spot, being a giant tank and all.

[Geistritter]

Probably has several weak spots. Real life tanks do too, afterall.

[Garnet_Moon]

Probably has several weak spots. Real life tanks do too, afterall.
If Valkyria Chronicles taught me anything about terrestrial dreadnaughts, it's that their only weakness is plot hax and sacrifice.

[Geistritter]

Valkyria Chronicles also teaches us that as long as you're aiming at someone they'll remain perfectly still, though, and that they'll stop trying to kill you as soon as you yell out "OKAY, IT'S SOMEONE ELSE'S TURN NOW", so probably not the best source for combat advice.

[10011408V3.9]

If I remember correctly, weren't rocket-based weapons designed to counter armored vehicles and fortifications? Looks like we'll be seeing more launchers if that logic holds true.

[soulpimpwizzurd]

...Seriously guys, 6000 damage really isn't that much, and that's extremely situational. Don't expect something to be done about it yet.



Also, there are two nine star rifles, at least so far. The other is ディブルカーン.

u right dog, 6k damage isn't that much.

but the fact that it's a constant, steady stream of 6000 damage with no break to restore PP or anything, is what makes it a big deal.

and can you call something extremely situational if it's guaranteed to happen? it's pretty much guaranteed that all bosses that matter, dragon, sand beetle, ragne, and snow panther, will have periods of inactivity.

and from the looks of this video, all the boss has to do is drop/do something that makes it freeze in place for 5+ seconds, for it to already be more than half dead. pretty much every dragon/sand beetle/ragne/snow panther fight, i've been in, the dragon has always fallen, sand beetle has always reared backwards and exposed his belly weakspot, ragne has always collapsed, and snow panther has always snow breathed. you can even use it against the new mammoth boss. it's even worse for that boss, because it doesn't even have to collapse. you just have to platform your way onto its back.

i wouldn't call something that is guaranteed to happen extremely situational.

yeah, it doesn't work against mobs very well (but they die fast enough regardless,) and it doesn't work against rock bear/accordian dragon (but these bosses don't matter much anyway.)

but like i keep saying, when you consider the fact that the bosses are supposed to be what's remotely challenging (even though yeah, arguably they aren't if you play correctly, with the exception of the duo panthers if you're soloing), this is definitely broken. and seems likely to get nerfed. which is again ironic because in closed beta the plant time was way too long for traps (probably because of trauma developed from how in most past games traps always somehow managed to be op.) now it's too short. they'll probably just render it useless again looooool

[Geistritter]

u right dog, it isn't.

but the fact that it's a constant, steady stream of 6000 damage is what makes it a big deal.

and can you call something extremely situational if it's guaranteed to happen? it's pretty much guaranteed that all bosses that matter, dragon, sand beetle, ragne, and snow panther, will have periods of inactivity.

and from the looks of this video, all the boss has to do is drop/do something that makes it freeze in place for 5+ seconds, for it to already be more than half dead. pretty much every dragon/sand beetle/ragne/snow panther fight, i've been in, the dragon has always fallen, sand beetle has always reared backwards and exposed his belly weakspot, ragne has always collapsed, and snow panther has always snow breathed. you can even use it against the new mammoth boss. it's even worse for that boss, because it doesn't even have to collapse. you just have to platform your way onto its back.

i wouldn't call something that is guaranteed to happen extremely situational.

yeah, it doesn't work against mobs very well (but they die fast enough regardless,) and it doesn't work against rock bear/accordian dragon (but these bosses don't matter much anyway.)

but like i keep saying, when you consider the fact that the bosses are supposed to be what's remotely challenging (even though yeah, arguably they aren't if you play correctly, with the exception of the duo panthers if you're soloing), this is definitely broken. and seems likely to get nerfed.

First, an English lesson: "situational" doesn't refer to the probability of something happening; it refers to the circumstances under which it happens. The only circumstance under which this can happen is what you see, making it situational. Trapping a weak point can happen elsewhere, but not in the same capacity, and not to the same effect.

Secondly, Dark Ragne is one of only bosses that sit still for a lengthy period of time, and this player had to break all four of his legs to accomplish it. He's just as likely to be dead by then. Situational.

Third, you can't trap Vol Dragon's weak points easily (if at all; that's for someone else to confirm), he doesn't stay down long, and the antlion boss is stupid easy to begin with, as are the malmoths.

Lastly, anyone that gets to a boss' weak point with Weak Shot on it and with proper skills and gear is going to do this kind of damage. Anyone. This player merely found another way to do it. I've done 7500 damage with Divine Launcher by accident, and that's not even a good boss PA. This is by no stretch of the imagination "overpowered". It's neat, yes, but if you're not able to do something comparable with your own character's abilities, you're not doing a good enough job, period.

[Arika]

I mention on my Alpha reviewed that the trap is too weak. And I also write comment in JP language to SEGA about it.

in CBT, and in OB, I never tried the trap again yet, and none of my friends used them to tell me how good is it so far. This video really make me smile.

[Geistritter]

A unique style of play, but that's about it. Nice to see players trying things out for themselves of course.

Now this I'll agree with; finding your own way to do things is always to be commended.

[soulpimpwizzurd]

First, an English lesson: "situational" doesn't refer to the probability of something happening; it refers to the circumstances under which it happens. The only circumstance under which this can happen is what you see, making it situational. Trapping a weak point can happen elsewhere, but not in the same capacity, and not to the same effect.

This player merely found another way to do it. I've done 7500 damage with Divine Launcher by accident, and that's not even a good boss PA.

okay mayn, i'll admit my semantics were off and yours were on. but returning to the topic of achieving those numbers, how fast can you spam divine launcher for 7.5k damage? and how consistently?

divine launcher takes a long time to fire off. much longer than an explosion from a burst trap. then there's the issue of PP usage. most players will only be able to fire divine launcher twice. then they'll have to recharge their PP by attacking normally.

this guy is busy blasting off upper trap explosions with no break or rest. and even if ragne's period of inactivity is the longest, i'd still say 10 seconds is enough to mess up a boss real good.

also, the upper trap has a decent sized radius of range, so against dragon it still works just as well. you're right, he doesn't stay in place the entire time of his "period of inactivity." he first collapses, and then he gets up, roars, and starts drilling the ground to re-armor his tail. due to the large hitbox radius of the upper trap, i'd wager that it still hits the dragon's weak spot horn all throughout his fallen state>rise and drill to restore armor on tail action.

in terms of raw speed of boss take downs, a team of four rangers that all followed this strategy for any boss would be able to kill it the fastest compared a team of any other mix and match classes. if there is ever boss time attacks, i wouldn't be surprised if the ones with the fastest times were the ones that used traps

[Geistritter]

how fast can you spam divine launcher for 7.5k damage? and how consistently?

divine launcher takes a long time to fire off. much longer than an explosion from a burst trap. then there's the issue of PP usage. most players will only be able to fire divine launcher twice. then they'll have to recharge their PP by attacking normally.


by accident

not even a good boss PA.

So that's the end of that discussion. Just read everything the other guy says, and you don't have to mistake things as an argument.


this guy is busy blasting off upper trap explosions with no break or rest. and even if ragne's period of inactivity is the longest, i'd still say 10 seconds is enough to mess up a boss real good.

Never said anything else; just said this isn't the only way to do it, and probably isn't even the best way.


also, the upper trap has a decent sized radius of range, so against dragon it still works just as well. you're right, he doesn't stay in place the entire time of his "period of inactivity." he first collapses, and then he gets up, roars, and starts drilling the ground to re-armor his tail. due to the large hitbox radius of the upper trap, i'd wager that it still hits the dragon's weak spot horn all throughout his fallen state>rise and drill to restore armor on tail action.

Doubt it; the game doesn't have some mechanic that ignores whatever else you've hit provided you would have hit the weak point. It's just as likely to hit something else, if only because it was the closest thing to the point of damage, even if it would have reached the weak point anyway.

Again, though, not for me to confirm positively.


in terms of raw speed of boss take downs, a team of four rangers that all followed this strategy for any boss would be able to kill it the fastest compared a team of any other mix and match classes. if there is ever boss time attacks, i wouldn't be surprised if the ones with the fastest times were the ones that used traps

That remains to be seen. Big numbers and ideal circumstances for one method aren't the only means of efficiency. And again, you have to take out all of Ragne's legs to do what this video did, and again, he's probably going to be dead by then anyway. It's not like he spends the entire fight on the ground waiting for you to kill him.

It's probably easier to do this than gear yourself up traditionally to do it in a more conventional way, though; I doubt one's gear even affects trap damage. Is it the best way, though? I doubt that, too; I'd be interested to see what a well-geared, offensively-minded Force can do here.

[moorebounce]

Why if something is put in a game on purpose by the creator to give the player the slightest upper hand considered broken is beyond me. I know I'm included in the camp that thinks launchers are way too powerful in this game (which BTW was put in purposely by sonic Team) to begin with but you can't really fault people for using it. Lets face it the rangers are the new hunters of the series.

lol Being a ranger in PSO2 is so easy even a caveman can do it. Which is why I choose not to be one. I like having to change my weapons or techs in certain situations. Rangers in this game remind me of Terry Crews character in the The Expendables. I don't get mad at them but feel kind of sorry for them.

[Mike]

(which BTW was put in purposely by sonic Team)
No Sonic Team here.

[GoldenFalcon]

By the time one of you guys pulls off a PA that hits for 7.5k, the trap has already done 18k, it's already impossible to even compare to the damage of the traps. Especially once you need to do normal shots for PP, which would waste your other weakpoint bullets

[Vashyron]

Extremely situational... right. :wacko:

It's more like I'm seeing people trying to comfort themselves in their current skill tree / class choices.

[Rizen]

I've been messing around with traps lately, and I honestly say that although they are situational, it is still a heck of alot of fun to play with! If you know how enemies move and know where their weak spots are, you can place traps in just the right spot and wait for them to come across them and detonate!

The most fun I have had was using an Upper Trap vs a Cata popping out of the ground....was able to do around 3.5k damage per hit.

[ALC]

Think Vashyron hit the nail on the head. Yeah, 6k isn't much. 6k DPS for 10 seconds? That's really good. Unless your normal attacks hit that hard, you can't match that.

[UnLucky]

Isn't there a max number of traps you can take?

[Vashyron]

10, each upper trap can explode 3 times.

[Gama]

that video made me feel so under-powered :(

[Spi]

Didn't a lot of people underrate this skill before? ...I wouldn't deny it, because I think this was pretty interesting. :D

[Gardios]

Can't blame anyone for the bias because most active Ranger skills (read: everything but Weak and Jellen) were crap before.

Still waiting to see some Stun Grenade action, the only footage online right now is from CBT. D:

[Phantasma]

That's cool. But it didn't pass 6k, so it is not OP. No seriously that is pretty awesome but rather just rpg the hell out of it....rpg....hehehe....Rappy propelled launcher..hehe.HEHE AHAHAHA!

Ok, as long as he doesn't kill it solo in a quicker period of time than it would take a 12-man multi party it's not OP...O WAIT.

[Hrith]

Do not mistake damage for DPS, this is not as impressive as it looks. A Lv40 ranger with this much R-ATK and a 9* rifle can deal higher DPS without those traps (since you have to include the time it takes to reach to the point when you can use the traps on a weakened weak spot).

This is extremely situational and such a choice of skills will severely weaken your character in most situations.

Kudos on that person putting 20 skill points in the relevant skills, though.

[Spi]

Do not mistake damage for DPS, this is not as impressive as it looks. A Lv40 ranger with this much R-ATK and a 9* rifle can deal higher DPS without those traps (since you have to include the time it takes to reach to the point when you can use the traps on a weakened weak spot).

This is extremely situational and such a choice of skills will severely weaken your character in most situations.

Kudos on that person putting 20 skill points in the relevant skills, though.

If that's the case, then perhaps you have a video to back up your point? It seems pretty interesting to me how long that lasted (30 seconds), however, who knows how much damage the player did prior to killing Ragne at this point. (Plus for the fact that the video was zoomed in recording, don't really know if she/he was playing with anyone else) Personally, I would like to try this out, if I played Ranger in this game.

[Alenoir]

Do not mistake damage for DPS, this is not as impressive as it looks. A Lv40 ranger with this much R-ATK and a 9* rifle can deal higher DPS without those traps (since you have to include the time it takes to reach to the point when you can use the traps on a weakened weak spot).

This is extremely situational and such a choice of skills will severely weaken your character in most situations.

Kudos on that person putting 20 skill points in the relevant skills, though.

All it takes is probably just 500 AC, really. >_> But yeah, for 500 AC that's some fun stuffs the person's got there.

[Sizustar]

One of our guildmate decided to try it by getting a new skill tree.
He's able to deal 6k+ damage with each explosion.
0.5 to set up, each "bomb" explode 3 time for 6k each, and he can take 10 trap...

[Rizen]

One thing everyone here has to realize is that the person in that video is showing the use of an utility skill used at maximum efficiency. This doesn't mean that it can't be used in other ways. Also, this is complementary to what the Ranger already has available. It may be a bit more situational that other skills available, but doesn't mean that it needs to be over looked.

[KrankItVZ]

Damn... I'd still call it OP either way :P