What happened to beasts?

[CreamTurk3y]

Am I the only one who misses beasts? I'm not too big on the PS lore so if anybody knowledgeable enough to fill me in on the details, please do so.

PSO2 is lacking some serious beast action.

[CultOfPersonality]

This should stay as far away from PSU as possible.

[blace]

To put it simply, PSO and PSU take place in different parts of the universe.

[Jonth]

This should stay as far away from PSU as possible.

Quit being silly.

[Blizz3112]

I ate them.

Don't post if you can't give a clear answer, please...

[Angelo]

To be honest I do miss them and initially I wanted them in PSO2. I got pretty excited when people found Beast and Duman data in the alpha client.

But there are a few reasons I don't really want them in anymore.

1. the 'limit breaks' of PSU (Nanoblasts, SUVs, summons) have been replaced with Photon Blasts. If beasts can't transform then they lose half of their appeal.

2. As of the last PSU installments (PsPo2) Beasts stats were altered to be high in attack but not the highest in Defense, instead they were given beefed up 'Agility' to (I guess) make them seem more like feral animals and less like meatshields, it actually balanced out the classes but in a game where you manually dodge every attack, I can't really see what their forte would be.

3. A lot of people seem to be happy with the 3 current races, for whatever reason, whether it's that they feel the current spread is balanced, they didn't like the look or concept of beasts, or that they're irrational PSO purists that want the game to stick as close to PSO1 as possible.

[Gardios]

To put it simply, PSO and PSU take place in different parts of the universe.

They should send a spaceship filled with beasts to PSO's universe, then!

[Vashyron]

May interest you to know that the game got more internal references to both Dewmans and Beasts in the last update, though Dewmans having their own listed stats and referenced heavily in character creation data while Beasts are just referenced by name thus far. I suspect they got much more work done on Dewmans at this point.

[BIG OLAF]

Don't post if you can't give a clear answer, please...

I thought that was pretty clear, honestly.

[gigawuts]

Lillipas.

[Agitated_AT]

beasts = not PSO so go back to PSU if you want em

[RogueA]

What happened to them? Short answer: We don't know.

Speculative answer: This is PSO2, not PSU2. PSO did not have the Beast race, just Human, Newman, and Cast. PSU didn't have mags, so they needed to add in abilities like photon blasts, and the Beast race came from that essentially.

[UnLucky]

just make a newman with a big nose

[Gama]

like it was said previously, without the nanoblast, beasts would be less appealing,

unless they have some sort of stat bonus tht makes them more suited for "insert class here" i dont know if would just be an image modification from human.


more curious about dewmans.

[Kylie]

They were neat, but I would have been a newearl if they weren't so useless as hunters. That's the only reason I was a beast.

[Kous]

I think its because all the beast died because Sega locked them in the closet and they were too stupid to open the door

So they starved to death

You happy >.>

[CreamTurk3y]

Thanks for all the info, I had no idea about beasts not being in PSO, I started with PSU and went on from there :P

[BahnKnakyu]

Nobody's reading Vashyron's post...

[ScottyMango]

Thanks for all the info, I had no idea about beasts not being in PSO, I started with PSU and went on from there :P

You poor soul :c

And I read Vash's post, but datamined information could mean a million different things.

[RogueA]

Nobody's reading Vashyron's post...

I read it, but that's just some loose files inside the client. Cut content frequently appears inside release clients for tons of games. You can still find The Emerald Dream 's map inside the WoW client too, and it's been there since the game's release years ago.

Finding that stuff doesn't mean jack other than the devs at once point entertained the idea of those races, and then put them on the backburner/cut them for whatever reason.

[gigawuts]

I'd be kind of surprised if we never got DLC races like the datamined info seems to suggest, and even though I despised beasts in PSU I think they could be done right if they're given a complete revamp.

As it stands, races have lost their core abilities, but the framework for temporary stuff is there. PB's and skills like fury stance and photon flare would just need to be set as a race-based thing. Just give casts confusion and freeze traps pls, beasts can go furry hulk all they want~

[Vashyron]

You poor soul :c

And I read Vash's post, but datamined information could mean a million different things.

What else comes into your mind if you find internal references such as "Race_Dewman" "Race_Beast" piled upon the other 3 races currently available?

If anything them updating new references to them in the last update shows that they are at least both still planned.

[Ana-Chan]

The funny thing is, right at the very start, races didn't have their core abilities anyway.

[ScottyMango]

What else comes into your mind if you find internal references such as "Race_Dewman" "Race_Beast" piled upon the other 3 races currently available?

If anything them updating new references to them in the last update shows that they are at least both still planned.

Like I said, it could mean anything. It could mean we're getting beasts/dewmans as playable races, sure, or it could mean they'll show up in the game some other way.

Regardless of what it is, I just prefer not to take datamined phrases as actual fact of what might come to be.

[CreamTurk3y]

I have to agree, if beasts can't transform, it feels pointless to even ask for them.

[D-Inferno]

Real quest about beasts is if they can even match the power of HUcast. While they likely will hve a bit more ATP (like maybe 107), their ability could end up being rather low.

Dewman probably isn't too far off. Beast might be a year or two away though.

[MelancholyWitch]

This should stay as far away from PSU as possible.

but it's already more like PSU than PSO =(

[Garnet_Moon]

Ya'll are all just mad that we Beasts had the sexiest walk, with just enough fur to cover our funbits.

Some of you wouldn't know because you used WASD.... but to those of us who used an analog stick controller, we knew what we had, and we Nanoblasted ONLY to sexy walk.

[Sinue_v2]

They're chilling with the Motavians, Dezolians, and Dewmans. Personally, I'd rather see them add in Motavians and Dezolians, even if I wasn't a complete nutter for the classic series, simply because I'm goddamned sick and tired of the "humans with funny ears syndrome". Is it too much to ask for alien races in our sci-fi space RPGs?

[spoiler-box]
Bob Barker voice: Remember folks, keep the pet population under control. Get your Beasts spayed or neutered.
[/spoiler-box]

[ShinMaruku]

Nobody's reading Vashyron's post...

Of course not. The gutter can't read :E

[LeynasMoon]

Ya'll are all just mad that we Beasts had the sexiest walk, with just enough fur to cover our funbits.

Some of you wouldn't know because you used WASD.... but to those of us who used an analog stick controller, we knew what we had, and we Nanoblasted ONLY to sexy walk.

This, haha.
Beast women are the best.

I do hope for a Beast race revival within PSO 2, though. Sega seems to have made the Beast races look less and less bestial over the course of the last few games that featured them, so that may be a sign as to their possibly not returning, but, who knows. None of us do, for certain.

[Lostbob117]

I ate all the beast, sorry.

[Jonth]

I personally think Beasts are more appealing without their transformation. That is, they are more appealing to a player who won't play them, if they don't have an ability that makes them completely broken. That is the only thing about Casts and Beasts that I thought was absolutely stupid in PSU; they had amazing abilities that the other two races completely lacked.

So yeah. Add in beasts, but forget about transformations altogether.

[Angelo]

I personally think Beasts are more appealing without their transformation. That is, they are more appealing to a player who won't play them, if they don't have an ability that makes them completely broken. That is the only thing about Casts and Beasts that I thought was absolutely stupid in PSU; they had amazing abilities that the other two races completely lacked.

So yeah. Add in beasts, but forget about transformations altogether.

Later installments of the series gave Humans and Newmans Photon Blasts and Dewmans their... big laser thing...

[Darki]

They could solve the nanoblast thing by making the beast "animal form"part of the normal form of the race. Same way that you can have "fleshie" or "gundam" casts, you could have beasts that can vary in furyness and animal features, so you can even have a beast that resembles a full nanoblasted form from PSU as your main character.

Personally I loved beasts but I always though that they didn't play a very good card that they'd have there, which is the race possibilities. You have four races that are practically the same, except for ears/eyepatch. I'd like beasts to be something original.

[NoiseHERO]

/Read this thread as "What happened to breasts?"

[Crimson Exile]

They died with that horrible PSU game

[Akaimizu]

Ya'll are all just mad that we Beasts had the sexiest walk, with just enough fur to cover our funbits.

Some of you wouldn't know because you used WASD.... but to those of us who used an analog stick controller, we knew what we had, and we Nanoblasted ONLY to sexy walk.

Just to let you know. I hated that walk. It was soo 'Out of character' for me. I purposely used the analogue stick at only the extreme positions after nanoblasting, for that very reason. When Mufonna nanoblasted, it was because she completely lost it. No way was she going to be even remote composed enough to do that walk.

Though if they do have the beasts as of their PSP2 PSP2i version, there would be a lot less need for them without transformations. By the time they got to PSP2/PSP2i, they were more like humans with different ears. Given that humans can just put on ears, in this game, it's kind of even less distinct.

I think the idea of going back to basic PSO classes is a good start. They always had trouble with balancing races between your (Power race, Tech Race, Hybrid Race) distinction of Casts, Newmans, and Humans. The idea being that they often undermined statistical reason for picking another race (overwriting) or they end up being such a minute hybrid between one of two initial races that you're unsure where they stand or whether there is even a statistical reason for them. I always felt, if you want to introduce other races and truly balance them in, you need to increase the amount of primary supporting stats for gameplay. (or simply have them as different race looks which borrow statistically from the others as a simple aesthetic choice)

Phantasy Star kept things simple. A little too simple and race/class balance suffered for it. But with only the few races, it works. I think, in this case, they are taking things slow and not adding stuff like that without a real long consideration as to how they fit distinctly into the gameplay model.

[NoiseHERO]

The "I don't need no man because I'm a strong woman, but I'm still sexy" walk?

I wouldn't say a girl walking like that after turning super saiyan is out of character... For how cheest PSU was...

Well this game is gonna get cheesier too.

I gotta stop stealin' Jako-chan's jokes.

[Akaimizu]

^ It was for Mufonna. Seriously. Like certain actual characters in PSU, Mufonna only did it when she "lost it". At that point, she was possessed only with thoughts about tearing stuff limb from limb. A personality snap fueled by pure unbridled anger. Total destruction. She returned to normal the moment there was downtime from that mental state hardly remembering a thing she did moments ago. Thus why I avoided the walk like the plague. (Storywise, she always was a danger to monsters and guardians when she transformed. Though it was interesting that ST, later, turned that into a true game mechanic in PSP2 with the black/silver transformations. I gotta stop predicting the future. :) )

[darkante]

If Beasts gets here with transformations then i'm gonna reroll my alt.
No transformation, then i have to think real hard and judge looks carefully...

In the case they do get here, i find the tails should be available as an option.

[zOObie1]

This should stay as far away from PSU as possible.

I'm with this guy.

PSU was a disaster of a game, especially at launch. I know many of you have never played the original PSO series and that your only experience with the Phantasy Star games is PSU. And that you hold it high in regards to being a 'good game'. In fact, that game sucked, it sucked bad. I don't even know where to start...

Maybe it was the launch that left a sour taste for me. 50 dollar game, pay for Hunter's License, connect to terrible servers, then do dragon runs. There was absolutely zero content at launch. Even after the first couple content updates no one would do anything besides dragon runs because the new content was less rewarding.

Being a crappy spinoff of PSO, they had to throw in a bunch of terrible SEGA ideas too. Hybrid classes and Limit Breaks. Sadly, most of you think those were good and to me it's extremely unfortunate (if true) that Beast data was found in the game files. I really hope the subclasses of PSO2 do not function like PSU's did.

PSO2 so far is the first thing SEGA has done right in a very, very long time. I hope they don't mess it up in the near future. They've finally made a good, true, and fun sequel to the original PSO games.

Please SEGA... don't mess this one up.

[ThePendragon]

PSO2 owes more to PSU than PSO. You people may not like it it, but PSU is more a sequel to PSU than it is to PSO. SEGA was just smart for once and knew you'd all flock to it if they changed the U to an O.

[gigawuts]

PSU was intended to be a sequel to PSO, and thus shared a lot in common. Most of what PSU had for its framework was taken directly from PSO, and a considerable amount of what PSO had was taken from PS I - IV. They tried mixing things up and adding onto PSO to modernize it and innovate, but a lot of the changes pushed away fans of PSO. Many of those same changes drew in new fans. Some fans would have been drawn to both, but didn't discover the franchise in time.

PSO2 game takes many good parts from both games, combines them, and adds onto them. It borrows from both. Some things are more like PSO, other things are more like PSU. This is...ideal for us fans.

It was inspired and built on both games, and that's a pretty good thing.

[jooozek]

You people may not like it it, but PSU is more a sequel to PSU than it is to PSO.
Oh, I'm sure it is.

[Darki]

Everytime someone posts the "TIS SHOULDNT BE ON MAH PSO2 BECOZ ITZ FROM PSU11!!!!1" argument, Dark Falz kills a newman loli.

Please, don't.

[gigawuts]

Everytime someone posts the "TIS SHOULDNT BE ON MAH PSO2 BECOZ ITZ FROM PSU11!!!!1" argument, Dark Falz kills a newman loli.

TIS SHOULDNT BE ON MAH PSO2 BECOZ ITZ FROM PSU11!!!!1
TIS SHOULDNT BE ON MAH PSO2 BECOZ ITZ FROM PSU11!!!!1
TIS SHOULDNT BE ON MAH PSO2 BECOZ ITZ FROM PSU11!!!!1
TIS SHOULDNT BE ON MAH PSO2 BECOZ ITZ FROM PSU11!!!!1

Just doing my part.

[Cyron Tanryoku]

I have no issues with that, Darki

[Darki]

Damn I should have used a different victim.

... Then it kills a Shato?

[Cyron Tanryoku]

As long as I don't die I'm totally fine

[Darki]

K then. =(

It's a dumb argument anyways.

[gigawuts]

Damn I should have used a different victim.

... Then it kills a Shato?

Better than Nidras!

NIDRA SUPREMACY

[Darki]

You guys just don't get my point. D:

[gigawuts]

Is your point that we should all stop hating and just be cool and admit both games had good mechanics that with some refinement could be made into fantastic mechanics that almost all of us would like to see in PSO2?

[Blastifyys]

yea I'M A BIG BEAST FAN ALL MY CHARACTERS WERE BEAST in psu im sad there not in but i mean they were for high attack but pso2 attack is fineee especially with weak-shot and they put photon blast to sub for suvs and such

[Darki]

Is your point that we should all stop hating and just be cool and admit both games had good mechanics that with some refinement could be made into fantastic mechanics that almost all of us would like to see in PSO2?

pretty much.

Actually, my point was just that the fact that it was in PSU doesn't make it bad just because of that. I hope those PSU haters are not changing outfits or using PAs, because TIS SHOULDNT BE ON MAH PSO2 BECOZ ITZ FROM PSU11!!!!1

[ScottyMango]

I understand why anything from PSU should be kept a million miles away from PSO2, but weren't beasts, or beast-like people in the original Phantasy Stars?

It's been awhile since I've played them.

[Jonth]

Later installments of the series gave Humans and Newmans Photon Blasts and Dewmans their... big laser thing...

Yes, I know... Years after release. In any case, a beast transformation just doesn't fit in IMO, what with photon blasts present. What, Your going to have beasts that can transform and use photon blasts while every other race only has photon blasts? Broken. Or you're going to include all of the late game specials of all the races in addition to photon blasts? Extremely cumbersome. I'm all for beasts, even though I didn't and won't be playing one, but there really shouldn't be transformations.


I understand why anything from PSU should be kept a million miles away from PSO2, but weren't beasts, or beast-like people in the original Phantasy Stars?

It's been awhile since I've played them.

No, Beasts were not present in the original Phantasy Stars. However, original Numans were more like beasts, at least in capability, than modern Newmans. Maybe you are thinking of Motavians?

Oh, and quit being silly. PSU was a good game. The only arguments I have heard about PSU being bad are of it not living up to PSO (so what? it is still better than WoW and most other online games), it had a bad launch with poor content (so what? it had good content after a while, if it didn't at the time, you should have quit playing until there was), or it had inevitable flaws that every game could have, but that I was easily able to overlook (letting Beasts have transformations and CASTS have SUVs while Humans and Newmans have nothing is a good example).

[Slidikins]

I'd rather not have any more races until there's actually something to differentiate them other than 1% of a stat here and there. I don't mind PSU's beasts coming over to PSO2 but if all they get is 1% more ATP and no nanoblast, what's the point?

As it's been said before, you can tweak facial features to make something look beastly enough if you really wanted to.

[Sano]

I did enjoy Beasts in PSU, but I feel that they weren't included because:

A: If they were given their Transformation, they would be OP since they would have that AND Photon Blast.

B: If they weren't given their Transformation, they wouldn't have anything special about them. They would just be the flesh version of a Cast, minus Trap Vision? (Not sure if they have it in PSO2, but pretty sure they probably do since they've always had it hehe).

[Slidikins]

B: If they weren't given their Transformation, they wouldn't have anything special about them. They would just be the flesh version of a Cast, minus Trap Vision? (Not sure if they have it in PSO2, but pretty sure they probably do since they've always had it hehe).


CASTs don't have trap vision/laying, hp regeneration, nor status immunity in PSO2. Likewise Newmans lack tp regeneration (well, there's no TP...). The races are pretty much just for looks in PSO2. There's slight stat variation but nothing too major.

(Also, since EVP is effectively gone HUcaseals don't really have an edge over any other Hunter... I don't get it either.)

[Mega Ultra Chicken]

CASTs don't have trap vision/laying, hp regeneration, nor status immunity in PSO2. Likewise Newmans lack tp regeneration (well, there's no TP...). The races are pretty much just for looks in PSO2. There's slight stat variation but nothing too major.

(Also, since EVP is effectively gone HUcaseals don't really have an edge over any other Hunter... I don't get it either.)

I think HUaseals have more R-ATK and R-DEF than HUcasts.

I probably wouldn't care too much about Beasts. They're the canine equivalent of the feline Newmen, but I never really used Beasts much in PSU (and even then, I never really saw my Beast as a Beast, probably because she was too human-like.)

If they do bring in Dewmen, they should be a little more inhuman. Seriously, how awesome would it be to play as a half-Darker abomination? It would cover the cosmetic difference aspect, at least. As for stats, they could have higher attack stats all around and lower defense stats all around.

[Darki]

As I said once, beasts would be a very original concept if they weren't humans with fluffy ears, but actual beast-like humanoids with their own set of costumes and unique apperance, similar to CASTs.



If they do bring in Dewmen, they should be a little more inhuman. Seriously, how awesome would it be to play as a half-Darker abomination? It would cover the cosmetic difference aspect, at least. As for stats, they could have higher attack stats all around and lower defense stats all around.

Damn that would be awesome, too.

[Blizz3112]

I agree, Dewman would be nothing like the PSPo2i variant... but, at the same time, don't make them look too Ragne-like, please... They should be bleak, red-eyed creepy people that look brittle but pack a punch...

Beasts can be included, but more, you know... beast-like... Give them fangs and claws, make them very hairy and beast-like... and let them live on Naberius in a secret society ready to fight against the forces of Dark Falz...

Then also include reptilian variants (from Amduscia) with maybe similar stats to satisfy everybody...

[Coelacanth88]

The CAST forced them to interbreed with the other species until they no longer existed.

Seriously though, I agree with most here. The only real difference between races is their appearance (except for CAST jet legs) and Beasts slightly different look couldn't be justified. Maybe they'll eventually work them in some how, but right now I think they're more worried about new missions and stuff.

[NoiseHERO]

"Adding anything from PSU would ruin this game"

Because PSO was perfect and half of the best new ideas added to the Phantasy Star series didn't come from the universe series, right?

Psht!

[Xaton]

hmms maybe beasts nanoblast is the photon blast thus useing photon blast gauge to beast morph. maybe its not controlable like more like werewolf like. but i do like idea of them haveing the beast like faces like stuff more wolf like or somthing.

[GoldenFalcon]

There are beast ears of 3 varieties to turn your human into a beast look-alike
What more do you need? Higher S-Atk than casts?

[Reyva]

There are beast ears of 3 varieties to turn your human into a beast look-alike
What more do you need? Higher S-Atk than casts?

Yeah.

Was a beast fan in PSU, but without nanoblast, the only reason to level one to cap again is mainly for the s-atk. Without that, adding them would probably only be for new players. In other words, you need some kind of incentive to level them.

Same thing with Dewmans. Don't care what the incentives are, but there needs to be something to actually get older players to level one.

[Enforcer MKV]

"Adding anything from PSU would ruin this game"

Because PSO was perfect and half of the best new ideas added to the Phantasy Star series didn't come from the universe series, right?

Psht!

http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/044/778/hatersgonnacat.jpg?1318992465

[redroses]

I would like to have beasts, if they would have tails, their faces be more animal like (would be awesome if you could choose between it being more wolf, bear or tiger like), maybe have their feet be paws and going up from the foot the fur would turn to skin (their outfits would be different and they would never wear shoes), the samy for the hands being more beast like with claws and fur and towards the upper arm the fur thins out and becomes skin.
I'm not sure about stats, but maybe you could make them really strong at bare hand combat and later when knuckles come out, give them a bonus with those. And maybe their jumps faster and/or higher. I think that would be really interesting and nothing that would imbalance the game, but would make them stand out in a way that would fit them.

I would just love to have beasts (and other races) for more varity. With all the races being so similiar in stats, adding more races is wouldn't cause any balance issues. I would even be for some weird aquatic like race.

[GoldenFalcon]

Well, you can wear the Forest Panther armor and have a furry tail and claws and stuff

It's very clear (to me) that beasts won't be coming out, sadly

[NoiseHERO]

Well, you can wear the Forest Panther armor and have a furry tail and claws and stuff

It's very clear (to me) that beasts won't be coming out, sadly

I actually saw someone with the whole forest panther set + cat ears.

Looked pretty cool.

(On girls at least...)

[redroses]

Well, you can wear the Forest Panther armor and have a furry tail and claws and stuff

It's very clear (to me) that beasts won't be coming out, sadly

But that is not the same :c Also those units are an ugly yellow!

And like said, I don't care what, but I just would like more races in general.

[Flame]

Like others have mentioned, there's hardly any difference between the three classes as it is. I assume you're more or less asking for a beast skin then? I thought the cat ears were added for that reason. Plus, there's no reason more clothes that are beast reminiscent could be released in the future. Have hope!

[ShadowDragon28]

I'd rather have warrior-clan Motavians instead of Beasts.
in PSO2.

http://www.pscave.com/fanart/ps/nak/gryz1.jpg

[NoiseHERO]

Either way the game's only been out officially for a month.

And Sakai did say himself, that they could or would add new races in the future.

Personally I'm fine with the ones we have.. unless they're actually some benefit or different in playing a different race. Still won't pick one.. But no complaints with interesting party members.

[Enforcer MKV]

Either way the game's only been out officially for a month.

And Sakai did say himself, that they could or would add new races in the future.

Personally I'm fine with the ones we have.. unless they're actually some benefit or different in playing a different race. Still won't pick one.. But no complaints with interesting party members.

I honestly wish that had kept the racial differences intact. Oh, well. :/

[Flame]

yeah I really wish they'd differentiate the races we have more.

[Zorafim]

I'm surprised nobody has asked for dragon-clansmen yet. They're already set up in the story as the next playable race, and they look awesome. I think the series needs to get more used to aliens as playable races.

[chaoelite]

maybe it will be a quest where you can get mutated into a beast or dewman(but it would have to be exclusive to humans i think). Not a fan of beast personally but if they are added id like more races added too like draconian like someone else said or nekomata.

[The Walrus]

But then we'd have ugly aliens helping out our kawaii animu characters

[GoldenFalcon]

I'm surprised nobody has asked for dragon-clansmen yet. They're already set up in the story as the next playable race, and they look awesome. I think the series needs to get more used to aliens as playable races.

You mean the Dinians? In what way are they "set up"

[Shadowth117]

I honestly wish that had kept the racial differences intact. Oh, well. :/

I actually like not having to worry about one particular race having an OP 7 second insta-kill weapon along with the overall best stats out of any race on any class aside from Force based variants kthxbye

I would not mind seeing some more interesting looking races though by any means. Having the Dinians for instance as a race would be cool, if you could customize them a bit and they looked more detailed. I could see people playing as the "ewoks" (not sure of their real name. Lillipians?) too which would be hilarious. Probably not going to happen, but a very different looking race would be cool.

[Chik'Tikka]

I'm surprised nobody has asked for dragon-clansmen yet. They're already set up in the story as the next playable race, and they look awesome. I think the series needs to get more used to aliens as playable races.

them Dinians from caves and islands? put some proper clothes on them and they'd be great ARKS members+^_^+

[Zorafim]

You mean the Dinians? In what way are they "set up"

Erm, spoilers ahoy. Feels strange saying that in an online game.

[spoiler-box]
Story mission four mentions that they worked along with the ARKs in the past, but recently became violent. The good ending was a step in improving relations. From here, it's not a huge jump to a playable race, story wise. At least, I've heard worse.
[/spoiler-box]


Also, I wouldn't mind seeing nanoblasts come back. There's not really much need to worry about balance, since you could just assume it uses the same resource as photon blasts do.

[Shadowth117]

Also, I wouldn't mind seeing nanoblasts come back. There's not really much need to worry about balance, since you could just assume it uses the same resource as photon blasts do.

As long as that never reaches Ares Espada stupidity than that sounds cool.

[GoldenFalcon]

Erm, spoilers ahoy. Feels strange saying that in an online game.

That's just somebody's comment on it (speculation, if you will)
Working along with ARKS most likely just means they were okay with us being on their planet and doing things

[iTz PooKiie xx]

As long as that never reaches Ares Espada stupidity than that sounds cool.

I hope you mean EPD stupidity.

InB4 3 paragraph long defense of the EPD

[yoshiblue]

If beast ever return and don't want a trans, they could just add a feral mode. Up some stuff, sacrifice some other stuff. If not that, then they could give weapon specialty bonus for Dewmens for using the same weapon over and over again. Beast can get adaptability bonus for using different weapons a lot.

You have to pay extra just to make one.

[Enforcer MKV]

I actually like not having to worry about one particular race having an OP 7 second insta-kill weapon along with the overall best stats out of any race on any class aside from Force based variants kthxbye


I have to admit, reading this made me laugh. Of course, I was taking a drink right when I laughed, so I ended up choking on it. Bleh. Not good.

I just personally wish that something other than looks mattered. I mean, I don't want it to be broken, just something to set each race apart.

*shrugs* Well, different people like different things.

[Gardios]

I have to admit, reading this made me laugh. Of course, I was taking a drink right when I laughed, so I ended up choking on it. Bleh. Not good.

Better than spitting out the drink! Unless you choke to death, I guess.

[Enforcer MKV]

Better than spitting out the drink! Unless you choke to death, I guess.

Indeed.

[GoldenFalcon]

If beast ever return and don't want a trans, they could just add a feral mode. Up some stuff, sacrifice some other stuff.

Hunters already have Furry Stance..

[yoshiblue]

Heh heh, well back to the drawing board.

[Cypher_9]

Well... from a blog report by Sakai in the past... they did say:

"PSO2 started development back in 2008, back then they were discussing whether the title should be PSO2 or PSU2."

http://bumped.org/psublog/phantasy-star-producer-satoshi-sakai-addresses-his-foreign-fans/

So with that in mind, it might as well be a sequel rather than a prequel... which I want to see it as a sequel... thinking PSU is the last game is... o. o

But, hey... I can't complain... ._.

[BahnKnakyu]

I read it, but that's just some loose files inside the client. Cut content frequently appears inside release clients for tons of games. You can still find The Emerald Dream 's map inside the WoW client too, and it's been there since the game's release years ago.

Finding that stuff doesn't mean jack other than the devs at once point entertained the idea of those races, and then put them on the backburner/cut them for whatever reason.

It's not loose files. As Vashyron pointed out, they've been adding more references to Beasts in each successive patch. Also, they've datamined a ton other info that showed content that was to come, including weapon types, quests, clothing, weapons, etc.

I know you're using WoW as a reference, but this isn't WoW. They've already pulled a lot of info that has come to fruition, just saying. If we don't get beasts and dumans in a year or two, feel free to call me out on it. :)

[Galax]

^In a year or two probably nobody will remember this topic/care to bring it up.
Maybe.

At this point in time, nanoblasts WOULD be broken, even if they ate the PB bar or you were made to choose between PB and Blast - It's powerful. If it were rebalanced, maybe. But the thing is, I don't believe we have all our weapon types yet - Every class uses Gunblades, Hunters get exclusive use of Swords and (wired) lances, Rangers get Launchers and Rifles, and Forces with Rods and Cards. I know we're back down to the main 3 (for now?), but these aren't the "master" classes PSU had - they're Hunter, Ranger and Force. My opinion (and hope) is that more weapon types will be added. Perhaps we'll later get more attack styles for unarmed, and therein could lie the attraction for Beasts; If they have claws, that's an option only they would have. A style that focuses on scratching and stabbing with your fists and feet. Newman unarmed could have the option to incorporate elements - Say, punching with your fist explodes a low-level Rafoie if you connect, but it costs a small amount of PP, maybe 5-10. Humans could have the option to learn martial arts, or gain an inherent boost to unarmed attacks, while CASTs would be able to do the laser thing Gilchics did in PSO - You can't move, but it knocks down a target with each hit, and you can pivot and change targets mid charge/combo.

...I doubt any of that will happen, but since I'm just throwing out ideas...whatever.

As to the people hating on PSU, hey, your PAs. Guess what? Right out of PSU. They're damned useful, too, aren't they? I'm just one more person getting a little tired of seeing "AH MA GAWD STOP ASKING FOR PSU SHITZZ!!!11!1!!1ONE!". PSU wasn't a complete failure - there are STILL people playing, doing runs on the 5th floor - I checked yesterday, out of sheer boredom. I expected there to be nobody on or at least no runs, what with Uni 2 being down to one star etc. And PSO wasn't perfect - I, personally, spent half my time lobby whoring out of boredom with the same options after a while. When SEGA BB got shut down, I was upset for 30 seconds. I quickly mourned my character and got over it - Because it being gone meant I could finally move on. It was almost a BAD thing to discover...(a) certain server(s). People are going to ask, because some of it was good, and even among what was terrible, there are things that COULD have been good if implemented better or balanced more.

[Tenlade]

the thing is I cant really imagine story wise how other races would factor in. It would just be really jarring to have beasts or dewmans just suddenly pop up out of nowhere on Arks. Not to mention, the story mode would just be bizarre with an entire race absent from it or blatently shoved in after the fact.

[Gardios]

They find a planet with intelligent life > they are attacked by Darkers > they join forces with ARKS

And suddenly, beasts/dewmen.

[Jonth]

If beast ever return and don't want a trans, they could just add a feral mode. Up some stuff, sacrifice some other stuff. If not that, then they could give weapon specialty bonus for Dewmens for using the same weapon over and over again. Beast can get adaptability bonus for using different weapons a lot.

You have to pay extra just to make one.

And how does this not make them broken compared to other races? Heck, the fact that you say you have to pay a premium for them implies that they are broken. And then we have to turn this discussion into an argument about allowing power be bought in the cash shop. Please don't do that.

You can't give two races racial bonuses without giving the other races comparably equivalent bonuses. Even then, there will always be discussion about balance. I think that is why SEGA has thus far chosen not to make the races too different stat wise. There is very little room to have race superiority complexes.

[Darki]

Personally, I wouldn't care that beasts had nanoblast back intead of photon blast, or that you could chose between them. It would even make sense, that if they appear later to the series as Gardios suggested, they wouldn't be part of the "Photon Blast system" yet, somehow.

While I love PBs, I liked the fact that in PSU each race had it's own perks. Yes, that brings balance issues, but that's an issue that all games have to deal with, they can't fear balancing issues.

The thing I loved the most from my beast in PSU was the fact that I could express my own anger at the middle of a hard fight, and literally "explode" into an invincible mode that would let me whoop my enemies' asses for one minute. I didn't even care that in the long term weapons were more effective, but sometimes in this game I really feel like nanoblasting. It was something that somehow got into my subsconciousness really well.

[Mystil]

I share your feelings on that(I used Adaka Val though). I do miss my eternia who died with the PC version, but oh well.

[EXPFULL]

I'd like to see Beasts and Dumans in something like an expansion. Unlike AOTI - I bet it would be available to all in the free client, but uses AC to allow you to create/use the new features.

[lostinseganet]

Am I the only one who misses beasts? I'm not too big on the PS lore so if anybody knowledgeable enough to fill me in on the details, please do so.

PSO2 is lacking some serious beast action.I wish humans could turn into beast and newmans could henshin into magical school boys and girls who excel in a specific element. I also wish for a scriblenaughts type of power.

[Shadowth117]

I hope you mean EPD stupidity.

InB4 3 paragraph long defense of the EPD

That would have never had to exist if that crap was balanced in the first place. Ares came into the game months before even the Rutsu. They even buffed it. Come on now. I don't think either of those needed to exist to be completely honest. Its stupid to put that much favoritism into a class. I don't even wanna go into how moronic PA boosted weapons were...

More on topic, main thing I wanna see with new races is aesthetic variety and minor racial abilities whether they be stats or whatever. Ridiculously powerful Super Saiyan transformations, I could do without. Now a special race exclusive dodge, slight attack speed increase, or something along those lines? Why not?

[Galax]

That would have never had to exist if that crap was balanced in the first place. Ares came into the game months before even the Rutsu. They even buffed it. Come on now. I don't think either of those needed to exist to be completely honest. Its stupid to put that much favoritism into a class. I don't even wanna go into how moronic PA boosted weapons were...

More on topic, main thing I wanna see with new races is aesthetic variety and minor racial abilities whether they be stats or whatever. Ridiculously powerful Super Saiyan transformations, I could do without. Now a special race exclusive dodge, slight attack speed increase, or something along those lines? Why not?

Something along the lines of Newmen gaining a small tech boost with rods, Humans getting a slight speed boost with, say, sword, and CASTs getting a smallish PP reduction on Launcher PAs?

Or am I misinterpreting you?

[oifjustus]

They died years ago with psu :o

[Kimil Adrayne]

They exist though the wonders of cat ear accessories and hair that covers ears. Exhibit A, Caelis in my Sig

[Jonth]

Even though I am not a huge fan of beasts, I can't really see how people think that modding a Human or Newman through accessories and what-not would be an acceptable alternative. It wouldn't be for me at least. If I wanted to make a beast man, I would not be okay making a Human with cat ears and calling it a Beast. I would know, that in reality, it's not.

Also, I have also noticed a lot of people saying that there is no reason to bring back beasts without their nano-blasts, because there wouldn't be anything to distinguish them from the other races. Nonsense. They would have the exact same uniqueness that every other races has: appearance, and minuscule stat differences that only perfectionists care about. Considering that is the only thing making the current races of any difference, how is this a valid argument that a new race would need something else in order to be added?

[LoN_Lina]

Beasts were a bad after thought in PSU that was supposed to make people happy about them removing mags. Though initially no one liked beast as they had crappy stats and nano was not that great. Sega did many patches to weaken one of the most popular races/class and massively push the least popular. This is why for the first 50 updates you can see beast/hunter increase and Newman/force nerf. Basically the only thing you liked was the after 9000 buffed broken stated beast as opposed to originally balanced races. So When PSO2 which Sega billed as an alternate universe; thus all the close but different names; came out that scrapped the worst headache they forced into popularity. Also beast had almost no love in Japan and since Sega only loves Japan your “I love beast argument’s are invalid.

[Chacron]

Beasts were a bad after thought in PSU that was supposed to make people happy about them removing mags. Though initially no one liked beast as they had crappy stats and nano was not that great. Sega did many patches to weaken one of the most popular races/class and massively push the least popular. This is why for the first 50 updates you can see beast/hunter increase and Newman/force nerf. Basically the only thing you liked was the after 9000 buffed broken stated beast as opposed to originally balanced races. So When PSO2 which Sega billed as an alternate universe; thus all the close but different names; came out that scrapped the worst headache they forced into popularity. Also beast had almost no love in Japan and since Sega only loves Japan your “I love beast argument’s are invalid.

So what if you liked beasts do to their astetics rather then stats? Thats what it seems to be the case with many of the people here. I don't see their arguements being invalidated from your citationless last sentence either.

[Nikury]

I'm glad they didn't put beasts into this game, whew....^^; Don't want it to turn into PSU

[Kimil Adrayne]

I'm glad they didn't put beasts into this game, whew....^^; Don't want it to turn into PSU

Having Beasts, or a race like them, would in no way make this game PSU2.

Also, I did love beasts. I played one as my main from the get go, even when they were terrible as a Wartecher ( arguably the worst class). Why? I likes the aesthetic and class role. Good enough reason for me.

[gigawuts]

Something along the lines of Newmen gaining a small tech boost with rods, Humans getting a slight speed boost with, say, sword, and CASTs getting a smallish PP reduction on Launcher PAs?

Or am I misinterpreting you?

I hope they don't do this. Maybe small abilities, or ideally just PSO1's traps and techs with limited effectiveness, but please no bonuses to something like actual damage with ordinary weapons.

[Darki]

I'm glad they didn't put beasts into this game, whew....^^; Don't want it to turn into PSU

I hope you don't like either the costume, grind, PA, emote and probably class system, then, because they come directly from PSU.

Seriously, stop with that stupid argument. Or use it right.

[Chacron]

I hope you don't like either the costume, grind, PA, emote and probably class system, then, because they come directly from PSU.

Seriously, stop with that stupid argument. Or use it right.

Erm, pretty sure grinding, PA's and emotes started from PSO1. At any rate, things are quite different enough that having beasts as another choice for character race wouldn't make the game PSU.

[Darki]

PSO2 ginding system resembles more to PSU than to PSO. In PSO you had the grinders and used then whenever you wanted. PAs didn't exist in PSO. If you're referring to techs, that's a different thing, but in any case I don't remember doing acrobatics in 6 different flavors with my Flowen Sword in PSO. In fact, all the combat system is more PSU-like than PSO-like, and thank godness because PSO battle sustem was probably almost the most boring system ever made into a videogame.

For the emotes, honestly I don't remember if you could do those motions in PSO, but in any case, is the only thing of my list that is mistaken.

In any case, what I meant is that the argument "I don't like this because it was in PSU" is one of the most retarded arguments you can use here, because PSO2 is the sum of both series, it has elements from both games, and it seems very childish to me saying that of one feature and not of another. If you don't like beasts because they were in PSU then you shouldn't like combat system either because it resembles more to PSU's.

[Chacron]

PSO2 ginding system resembles more to PSU than to PSO. In PSO you had the grinders and used then whenever you wanted.

PAs didn't exist in PSO. If you're referring to techs, that's a different thing, but in any case I don't remember doing acrobatics in 6 different flavors with my Flowen Sword in PSO.

For the emotes, honestly I don't remember if you could do those motions in PSO, but in any case, is the only thing of my list that is mistaken.

No no, just realised that I was thinking of the photon bursts not PAs. But yeah, PSO had grinding first and though it was pretty simplistic its what PSU built off of. Also, I could have sworn making poses and the like in PSO1.

[Darki]

What I mean is that they pick the best elements of the previous installments and use them, revamped if neccesary, for the next game. It's undoubtable that PSO2 has elements from both games, and that exactly is what makes it a great game. If they hadn't pick things that worked from PSU it wouldn't be as good as it is.

The concept of grinding system in PSU of course comes from PSO, the act of upgrading a weapon beyond its original capabilities. But in PSO you just used an item, while here you have a whole system with chances of failure and NPCs that was implemented first in PSU. Same with most of the game features.

Personally, I like beasts because I like the concept of one race being the best at each main role, with humans in between. I don't really like that CASTs are the best at two jobs, and they did that pretty good in PSU. I don't really want the same beasts as in PSU, because without nanoblast they'd lost most of their uniqueness, but a new "beast" race that is more animalistic, less human. I don't want this game to have 4 races that look the same except for ears/eyepatches.

[Shadowth117]

No no, just realised that I was thinking of the photon bursts not PAs. But yeah, PSO had grinding first and though it was pretty simplistic its what PSU built off of. Also, I could have sworn making poses and the like in PSO1.

Yeah you could make poses in PSO. But PSU's grinding ended up being nothing like PSO's. Initially, grinding in PSU was just idiotic since getting a weapon to 10 was so difficult and failing would destroy your weapon. Later, they added the /X system so that failing a grind brought your weapon's maximum allowable grinds down each time... which combined with an ability that made your weapons far more powerful only at 10/10 caused a lot of frustration.

In short, the only thing similar about PSO's grinding system to PSU's is the name of it. Grinding is wholly different in PSU and far more frustrating. Upgrading weapons is a common idea in many games; you can hardly link that itself to PSO.

[Ana-Chan]

Also, I could have sworn making poses and the like in PSO1.

PSO had lobby actions. IIRC it was rather simplistic on PSO V1 and V2, but was expanded upon with Ep1&2 and BB.

[Jonth]

PSU was a good game. It often times had bad implementation, and certain features that were undeniably completely stupid, but it was a good game. Even if you think PSO was better than PSU (never really played PSO, so maybe it was), PSU is the best online game I have ever played.

[Nikury]

Maybe it wouldn't, but i'm glad they kept it original with the classes. Adding other classes would seem stupid.

[Chacron]

Guessing you didn't hear about the new classes coming in the fall?

[Nikury]

I hope you don't like either the costume, grind, PA, emote and probably class system, then, because they come directly from PSU.

Seriously, stop with that stupid argument. Or use it right.
Well, i guess i should've said "don't want to make it anymore like PSU"
I don't see where i'm argueing when i posted that comment.

[ShinMaruku]

Beasts, dewmans,newmans all just modified humans. They'd still be Homo ______

[Jonth]

Maybe it wouldn't, but i'm glad they kept it original with the classes. Adding other classes would seem stupid.

You see, it's so weird how different people can be. You think it is stupid to add more than three classes, and I think it is stupid only having 3 classes. Something about liking variety. But yeah, new classes have been confirmed.

[Chacron]

Beasts, dewmans,newmans all just modified humans. They'd still be Homo ______

Homo____? You sayin' I like dudes!?


(Just so happen to be playing Persona 4 Arena)

[ShinMaruku]

Homo in latin means man. :E

[Ark22]

If I can go Dark Mode and kill my teammates, I'll take that as some form of pvp and a good way to troll my teammates. Happiness = Met.

[Chacron]

Homo in latin means man. :E

It saddens me you didn't get the joke. *sigh*

(Continues to play Persona 4 Arena)

[Nikury]

You see, it's so weird how different people can be. You think it is stupid to add more than three classes, and I think it is stupid only having 3 classes. Something about liking variety. But yeah, new classes have been confirmed.
Well, you have never played PSO i can see how you would dislike only having 3 classes, but people who played the original PSO like that it has got three classes (well most of them i'm sure) it's PSO2 not PSU2 thats the reason i'm playing it.

[Kimil Adrayne]

With all due respect, PSO had 12 classes. The Race/Gender/Job combos (12 of them total) were very different from each other.

HUmar - All around Hunter with basic healing techs. Role: Basic Hunter
HUnewearl - Hunter with moderate tech ability Role: Frontline Medic/Fighter
HUcast - Hunter with highest ATP/DEF, able to use traps, no techs. Role: DPS Hunter Highest ATP in game
HUcaseal - High ata/eva hunter, trap able, no techs Role: Ninja/ranged/fighter

RAmar - High ata ranger with basic healing and buffing techs Role: Well rounded Gunner
RAmarl - Rounded ranger with moderate tech ability Role: Guntecher
RAcast - High atp ranger, trap able, no techs Role: DPS Ranger
RAcaseal - High def ranger, trap abl, no techs. Role: Defensive Ranger Highest DEF in game

FOmar - Moderate melee ability, boosted Gi-techs Role: Melee force
FOmarl - Heal and buff specialist Role: Healer
FOnewm - Boost to Ra-techs, good def Role: Well rounded force
FOnewearl - Highest TP, boost on normal techs. Role: Glass Canon Highest TP in Game

[GoldenFalcon]

Your use of the words Medic/Healer irks me
Many might be offended

[Jonth]

Well, you have never played PSO i can see how you would dislike only having 3 classes, but people who played the original PSO like that it has got three classes (well most of them i'm sure) it's PSO2 not PSU2 thats the reason i'm playing it.

As Kamil already stated, PSO did have more than three classes considering how the Race/Gender/Class system was set up. I had done enough research into the game to know that. Since a Force plays the same regardless of which gender/race you are in PSO2, there is currently less classes than there were in PSO at the moment. Hence why there needs to be more classes.

Also, from what I have heard a lot of PSO players say, they want more classes in the form of sub-classes, so they can have their Hunters and Rangers cast techs like they could in PSO.

[Nikury]

With all due respect, PSO had 12 classes. The Race/Gender/Job combos (12 of them total) were very different from each other.

HUmar - All around Hunter with basic healing techs. Role: Basic Hunter
HUnewearl - Hunter with moderate tech ability Role: Frontline Medic/Fighter
HUcast - Hunter with highest ATP/DEF, able to use traps, no techs. Role: DPS Hunter Highest ATP in game
HUcaseal - High ata/eva hunter, trap able, no techs Role: Ninja/ranged/fighter

RAmar - High ata ranger with basic healing and buffing techs Role: Well rounded Gunner
RAmarl - Rounded ranger with moderate tech ability Role: Guntecher
RAcast - High atp ranger, trap able, no techs Role: DPS Ranger
RAcaseal - High def ranger, trap abl, no techs. Role: Defensive Ranger Highest DEF in game

FOmar - Moderate melee ability, boosted Gi-techs Role: Melee force
FOmarl - Heal and buff specialist Role: Healer
FOnewm - Boost to Ra-techs, good def Role: Well rounded force
FOnewearl - Highest TP, boost on normal techs. Role: Glass Canon Highest TP in Game
I'm talking about the main classes (Hunter) (Force) (Ranger)

[gigawuts]

With all due respect, PSO had 12 classes. The Race/Gender/Job combos (12 of them total) were very different from each other.

HUmar - All around Hunter with basic healing techs. Role: Basic Hunter
HUnewearl - Hunter with moderate tech ability Role: Frontline Medic/Fighter
HUcast - Hunter with highest ATP/DEF, able to use traps, no techs. Role: DPS Hunter Highest ATP in game
HUcaseal - High ata/eva hunter, trap able, no techs Role: Ninja/ranged/fighter

RAmar - High ata ranger with basic healing and buffing techs Role: Well rounded Gunner
RAmarl - Rounded ranger with moderate tech ability Role: Guntecher
RAcast - High atp ranger, trap able, no techs Role: DPS Ranger
RAcaseal - High def ranger, trap abl, no techs. Role: Defensive Ranger Highest DEF in game

FOmar - Moderate melee ability, boosted Gi-techs Role: Melee force
FOmarl - Heal and buff specialist Role: Healer
FOnewm - Boost to Ra-techs, good def Role: Well rounded force
FOnewearl - Highest TP, boost on normal techs. Role: Glass Canon Highest TP in Game

This is one thing I really liked about PSO1. It wasn't as easy as choosing H/R/F, you had a whole spectrum even in those classes. I hope that at the very least they bring back these classes in some form or another (obviously sans jellen/zalure, or maybe not?). Subclasses is the easiest way to do it, but I guess they could try it like PSU and risk having classes in dire need of rebalancing that they may never get.

Although I know it's semantics, just wanted to add that FOmar also had S&D range boosts and FOnewearl had R&A boosts, and FOnewm had Gi-tech boosts too. RAmar also had the highest ATA in the game (Which makes me wish humans outperformed casts with R-ATK or perhaps ability on rangers instead of sticking to this bad cookie cutter +/- percentage system). Not particularly important for the discussion, I'm just a stickler for details like that.

[Darki]

My problem with PSO mechanics were the fact that you HAD TO lock yourself into a race and even a gender to get the character role you wanted, even if you didn't like it. I prefer bbeing able to be what I want, even if it's a Cast "wartecher" rather than needing to be a newman female ONLY for it.


I'm talking about the main classes (Hunter) (Force) (Ranger)

That are just names. In reality, a HUcast was a whole different class as a HUnewearl, their whole mechanics were different.

You're just using the same retarded "PSU is bad because it is" argument, and it makes no sense. In this game they could have then called HUmar "Hunter", HUnewm "Assassin" and HUcast "Paladin" and they would be still the same exact class, just with a different label on your stat window.

In PSO2 we have a problem, and that is that classes are exactly the same regardless of race, unlike your precious PSO where a HUnewearl could nuke things with techs while a HUcast couldn't. If they don't add something, be it sub-classes, be it new classes, the only difference between those two would be that the newman girl is weaker. Period. Nothing else. Nothing odf the tech advantage that she'd have in PSO.

[Macman]

Correct me if I'm wrong (never played HUne) but weren't attack techs in PSO absolute garbage unless you were playing a FO who had access to level 21+ techs?

People played HUnewearl because she had access to decent levels of de/buff techs, which made her great for soloing. RAmarl had the same situation.

I know the only techs I used on my HUmar were Resta, Jellen/Zalure, Rafoie/Razonde for EXP tagging, and Gifoie for stopping those obnoxious Zus. Never used them for damage potential.

[Zipzo]

With all due respect, PSO had 12 classes. The Race/Gender/Job combos (12 of them total) were very different from each other.
This statement is incorrect.

Although each character had a set of differences most if not all in the form of passive stat differentiations or strengths & weaknesses in certain usages of certain TECHs for characters that could use them, there were only 3 different classes available from a mechanical standpoint.

Whether you rolled a FOmarl, FOnewearl, or FOmar, despite the subtle differences between the 3 based on stats or strengths in certain spells, the game play was for the most part identical, and the play styles were universal.

[Nikury]

I'll just stop, I don't want this to turn into a flaming war. I honestly didn't mind PSU it was good, story was enjoyable, it wasn't as good as PSO but it's a different game they wasn't trying to top PSO. This is PSO2 i'm saying i don't want it to become more like PSU I'd rather it not change from the original, i know most has changed but the i'd like it to stay as close as possible to the PSO.

[Darki]

Correct me if I'm wrong (never played HUne) but weren't attack techs in PSO absolute garbage unless you were playing a FO who had access to level 21+ techs?

People played HUnewearl because she had access to decent levels of de/buff techs, which made her great for soloing. RAmarl had the same situation.

I know the only techs I used on my HUmar were Resta, Jellen/Zalure, Rafoie/Razonde for EXP tagging, and Gifoie for stopping those obnoxious Zus. Never used them for damage potential.

Still those were techs that casts couldn't use. <_<


This statement is incorrect.

Although each character had a set of differences most if not all in the form of passive stat differentiations or strengths & weaknesses in certain usages of certain TECHs for characters that could use them, there were only 3 different classes available from a mechanical standpoint.

Whether you rolled a FOmarl, FOnewearl, or FOmar, despite the subtle differences between the 3 based on stats or strengths in certain spells, the game play was for the most part identical, and the play styles were universal.

From a mechanical standpoint they could have called those three class/race/gender combinations as if they were three different classes and it would have made sense too. It's just a name.

It's like in PSO2 with your theory that the three new classes are just "2nd clases" that apply on top of you previous one. They could sell them as a simple skill tree & weapon access expansion and leave the classes with the same 3 names and it would still make sense. In fact for me it would feel much better. I don't wanna be a "techer", I wanna be a "Force".


I'll just stop, I don't want this to turn into a flaming war. I honestly didn't mind PSU it was good, story was enjoyable, it wasn't as good as PSO but it's a different game they wasn't trying to top PSO. This is PSO2 i'm saying i don't want it to become more like PSU I'd rather it not change from the original, i know most has changed but the i'd like it to stay as close as possible to the PSO.

But the problem is that there were many features in PSU that "topped" PSO. Combat system would be the easiest example. Cosmetic features were much better in PSU. We can argue about class system if you want, but for me the important part would be the possibility to choose any race/gender/class combination freely unlike in PSO (and hybrid classes, that in PSO were not as explicit but were there). Rasce system, for me, was also better in PSU. Without beasts you'd have a race that would be the best at two jobs (casts) while one of them wouldn't be good at anything, with newmans there for the force part. With beasts for me there's equilibrium. One race specialized on each class, a "jack-of-all-trades" race for hybrids (and if you count dumands too, then you'd have a glass cannon race too).

What I mean is that PSO wasn't "objectively better" than PSU. The environment and plot elements are a very subjective thing. That doesn't make a game better than other. The most important flaw in PSU was the way SEGA managed it, which of course affected the outcome, but the concept of the game and most of its mechanics were advanced versions of PSO's

[Nikury]

Still those were techs that casts couldn't use. <_<



From a mechanical standpoint they could have called those three class/race/gender combinations as if they were three different classes and it would have made sense too. It's just a name.

It's like in PSO2 with your theory that the three new classes are just "2nd clases" that apply on top of you previous one. They could sell them as a simple skill tree & weapon access expansion and leave the classes with the same 3 names and it would still make sense. In fact for me it would feel much better. I don't wanna be a "techer", I wanna be a "Force".



But the problem is that there were many features in PSU that "topped" PSO. Combat system would be the easiest example. Cosmetic features were much better in PSU. We can argue about class system if you want, but for me the important part would be the possibility to choose any race/gender/class combination freely unlike in PSO (and hybrid classes, that in PSO were not as explicit but were there). Rasce system, for me, was also better in PSU. Without beasts you'd have a race that would be the best at two jobs (casts) while one of them wouldn't be good at anything, with newmans there for the force part. With beasts for me there's equilibrium. One race specialized on each class, a "jack-of-all-trades" race for hybrids (and if you count dumands too, then you'd have a glass cannon race too).

What I mean is that PSO wasn't "objectively better" than PSU. The environment and plot elements are a very subjective thing. That doesn't make a game better than other. The most important flaw in PSU was the way SEGA managed it, which of course affected the outcome, but the concept of the game and most of its mechanics were advanced versions of PSO's

Okay, well we can argue about anything with PSU and PSO because i find the combat system in PSO was great, it's ashame they changed it but they needed to upgrade it so others who are just into to the graphics and combat system and didn't know about the original would play it.

[redroses]

I really loved PSO, but it's combat system is outdated. If they would have stayed with that combat system from PSO they might aswell could have made the game point and click.
Of course, when PSO came out the combat system felt new and different. But that was long ago, now I find it very very hard to still play PSO because the combat is just so stiff.
I am really happy that they made the combat so fluid and fun in PSO2.

So saying that only people who don't know of PSOs combat system would like the new one is wrong. It might be for you that way, but not for everybody.

[RemChu]

Okay, well we can argue about anything with PSU and PSO because i find the combat system in PSO was great, it's ashame they changed it but they needed to upgrade it so others who are just into to the graphics and combat system and didn't know about the original would play it.

Dude this is 2012, where have you been? PSO combat system is so outdated, there is no way a game developer in their right mind would keep the old combat system.

Just wow.

[Flame]

I don't personally mind if there are beasts but it would be nice if the different classes played different roles on the battle field. As it is Hu, Ra, and Fo are all capable of dealing out mega damage. There is practically no incentive for support roles. Maybe later on as more powerful enemies are introduced there will be more opportunities for coordination and collaboration.

as for the original PSO's combat, sometimes less is more. It was stiff yes, but tactile and deliberate as well. The fluid and fun combat of PSO2 can be a little too sloppy and chaotic at times.

[Darki]

Okay, well we can argue about anything with PSU and PSO because i find the combat system in PSO was great, it's ashame they changed it but they needed to upgrade it so others who are just into to the graphics and combat system and didn't know about the original would play it.

I played PSO from the GC release, and I'm the first one who will describe you how boring as fuck combat system in PSO was. It was just the same 3 attacks over and over and over for each category, with only a "schwoosh" between them to tell between normal and strong attacks.

If you consider that better than PSU or PSO2 system, well, as I said it's something subjective, but you'd have to understand that for most players, the new system is an improvement. It would have happened even if there hadn't been PSU, one way or another because that's where most action games go.

But you shouldn't assume that whoever didn't like PSO more than PSU did so because they didn't play PSO -or didn't play it enough, or didn't play for the right reasons- because I could say the same to you about PSU.

If you consider something from PSU worse than the PSO counterpart, I have nothing against it. But saying that you don't like it because "it was from PSU" is bullshit. I don't say I don't like PSO battle system because it isn't PSU's. I have good reasons behind my argument.

[Zipzo]

Still those were techs that casts couldn't use. <_<



From a mechanical standpoint they could have called those three class/race/gender combinations as if they were three different classes and it would have made sense too. It's just a name.

It's like in PSO2 with your theory that the three new classes are just "2nd clases" that apply on top of you previous one. They could sell them as a simple skill tree & weapon access expansion and leave the classes with the same 3 names and it would still make sense. In fact for me it would feel much better. I don't wanna be a "techer", I wanna be a "Force".



But the problem is that there were many features in PSU that "topped" PSO. Combat system would be the easiest example. Cosmetic features were much better in PSU. We can argue about class system if you want, but for me the important part would be the possibility to choose any race/gender/class combination freely unlike in PSO (and hybrid classes, that in PSO were not as explicit but were there). Rasce system, for me, was also better in PSU. Without beasts you'd have a race that would be the best at two jobs (casts) while one of them wouldn't be good at anything, with newmans there for the force part. With beasts for me there's equilibrium. One race specialized on each class, a "jack-of-all-trades" race for hybrids (and if you count dumands too, then you'd have a glass cannon race too).

What I mean is that PSO wasn't "objectively better" than PSU. The environment and plot elements are a very subjective thing. That doesn't make a game better than other. The most important flaw in PSU was the way SEGA managed it, which of course affected the outcome, but the concept of the game and most of its mechanics were advanced versions of PSO'sPhantasy Star Online was more critically successful than Phantasy Star Universe.

You can debate amongst yourselves as to why all you wish...but none of it changes the fact that PSO garnered massive positive appeal, and PSU was always considered (even by professional critics) to be in PSO's shadow, and an outright flop.

The only subjective part of the argument is why you think it flopped/didn't appeal to the PSO crowd. Even the Gamecube version received great reviews, and that was simply a re-release, essentially.

Sure, Phantasy Star Universe had features that are of no particular burden to the PSO series overall, but that's obvious...it was a newer generation game and if it had not changed anything that would have been developer suicide. It's a given that some improvements made were positive, but in the same vein those improvements would likely have been made in a "PSO2" released back then as well, and then we'd all be playing PSO3...I don't think anyone really combats the idea that PSU brought about at least a few positive changes. That doesn't mean the game didn't suck.

[Kimil Adrayne]

Woo! Unexpected PSO v PSU argument time!

I played both religiously. In the end, looking back, each had something going for it that the other didn't.

PSO
Environment - Underlying story, setting, music, feeling, mood
MAGs - Added some stat and appearance customization
Specific Class Roles - The 12 class/gender/race combos each had significant differences to them
Better Rare Hunting - Dem red boxes

PSU
Character customization - the three-part costumes made for really unique looking characters
Dual weapon system - Gotta love the Akimbo
Additional Races - Beasts and later Dewmans
Class combination freedom - Newms could become rangers and Casts Forces

I wish that these "best of both games" were combined in PSO2, but somethings were left out.

[Zipzo]

Woo! Unexpected PSO v PSU argument time!

I played both religiously. In the end, looking back, each had something going for it that the other didn't.

PSO
Environment - Underlying story, setting, music, feeling, mood
MAGs - Added some stat and appearance customization
Specific Class Roles - The 12 class/gender/race combos each had significant differences to them
Better Rare Hunting - Dem red boxes

PSU
Character customization - the three-part costumes made for really unique looking characters
Dual weapon system - Gotta love the Akimbo
Additional Races - Beasts and later Dewmans
Class combination freedom - Newms could become rangers and Casts Forces

I wish that these "best of both games" were combined in PSO2, but somethings were left out.
You neglect to mention that a lot of the "positives" you wrote were not executed in the best way they could have been.

There's a reason PSU failed in comparison to PSO.

[Kimil Adrayne]

...

each had something going for it that the other didn't.

...


Didn't say they were perfect. Best if you read before commenting.

[eharima]

There's a reason PSU failed in comparison to PSO.

Ps2 and eathan waber.

[Darki]

Phantasy Star Online was more critically successful than Phantasy Star Universe.

You can debate amongst yourselves as to why all you wish...but none of it changes the fact that PSO garnered massive positive appeal, and PSU was always considered (even by professional critics) to be in PSO's shadow, and an outright flop.

The only subjective part of the argument is why you think it flopped/didn't appeal to the PSO crowd. Even the Gamecube version received great reviews, and that was simply a re-release, essentially.

Sure, Phantasy Star Universe had features that are of no particular burden to the PSO series overall, but that's obvious...it was a newer generation game and if it had not changed anything that would have been developer suicide. It's a given that some improvements made were positive, but in the same vein those improvements would likely have been made in a "PSO2" released back then as well, and then we'd all be playing PSO3...I don't think anyone really combats the idea that PSU brought about at least a few positive changes. That doesn't mean the game didn't suck.

I'm not denying anything that you're saying there. I just highlight my point.

You can turn that last sentence around and you have it right too: the fact that PSU sucked as a game overall doesn't mean that it didn't bring any positive changes to the series. Which is what seems to be implied everytime someone says stuff like "I don't like beasts because they're from PSU and I don't want PSU in mah PSO". Beasts are not bad JUST because they appeared in PSU. If they're bad indeed, look for real reasons to justify that opinion.

Personally, for me PSO was not a memorable game, and playing it from the GC release, we can agree that I played it long enough to get the buzz of the game. Maybe I was too young for it. PSU, however, did hook me much more than PSO. I'm the first one who admits that PSU sucked, but it did because the developers destroyed it in the end, adding senseless changes and mechanics that smelled like desperate attemps to sell the game, even sacrificing the little balance they achieved before AotI.

[Flame]

I'm the first one who admits that PSU sucked, but it did because the developers destroyed it in the end, adding senseless changes and mechanics that smelled like desperate attemps to sell the game, even sacrificing the little balance they achieved before AotI.

it sucked even worse on release though. They scrambled to add things like just attacks, madoogs, and even PSO skins because people hated it.

[ShinMaruku]

If PSU was made by a more skilled developer it would have been much better than PSo just by the changes that could have come from it.
Main reason why pso2 looks so good is because it's the Phantasy Star Portable people not the PSU people.

[gigawuts]

PSU was destined to fail from the moment they went with those god awful graphics and environments.

I'm not a graphics whore or anything but holy shit I have to at least somewhat like what I'm staring at.

Put some crisp edges on something jesus.

[Darki]

I don't remember it being that bad. You do have a point on the just attacks and madoogs, but I played as a Wartecher and never noticed it being THAT bad. And just attacks broke the game even more, making the differences between tech/gun damage versus melee even wider at first. As it was said it depends on each personal opinion.

About the skins, that has nothing to do with the game sucking. That was just because of the hordes of nostalgia addicted players who wanted PSO2 to be PSOI servers open again. I've seen people asking for those skins for PSO2 already and the game didn't have too much of a chance to suck.

[ShinMaruku]

PSU was destined to fail from the moment they went with those god awful graphics and environments.

I'm not a graphics whore or anything but holy shit I have to at least somewhat like what I'm staring at.

Put some crisp edges on something jesus.
Nah PSO was not quite good looking either. So dont go after any of these games for looks.

[Darki]

In any case, that might be a valid opinion (although I don't think that PSU graphics were that bad). Saying that you don't like beasts because they were in PSU it's a retarded opinion. It's the only thing I'm trying to say here, even with the topic being dragged to a PSU vs PSO argument.

[Vashyron]

It's funny because PSO's Forest Textures were higher resolution than PSU's "PSO" Forest.

[ShinMaruku]

You expect too much from the PSO rats in here Darki.
Then again I bet they spent more money on psu than I ever did in pso or psu I never thought either game was worth a sub fee. XD

[gigawuts]

Nah PSO was not quite good looking either. So dont go after any of these games for looks.

Except I loved PSO's art style. It was crisp, vibrant, and lively. PSU was just easter egg pastel diarrhea.

[ShinMaruku]

Art style and graphics are two different things. WoW has ass graphics but art style hides shit.

[Flame]

context is important too. When PSO launched the graphics were considered top notch. When PSU launched the graphics were considered mediocre. They were better than PSO's for sure (not art direction wise but technical output wise) but were behind the curve compared to other ps2 titles from 2006 which is why they've been immortalized as poor.

[gigawuts]

Art style and graphics are two different things. WoW has ass graphics but art style hides shit.

I know.

I hated both. The shaders, polycount, and texture resolution were dire in PSU for its time. Its art style and color selection were also pretty bad in my opinion.

PSO had good graphics for its time, and even now I prefer what was done with graphics in PSO Ep 1 to what was done with graphics in PSU. They did more, with less.

But that's my opinion, I really don't feel like arguing over which was objectively better (because that will never end).

[Jakosifer]

and eathan waber.

Oh HELL no.

[NoiseHERO]

Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat?

PSU looked awesome, just that it was all the "unimportant" parts that looked awesome.

[spoiler-box]

http://japangamingguide.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/08/phantasystaruniverse.jpg

http://ps2media.ign.com/ps2/image/article/611/611874/phantasy-star-universe-20050511064639716.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1381/1185527526_26e2bcc2b2.jpg

http://www.pso-world.com/gallery/data/700/medium/holy_light_festival-2.png

http://www.pso-world.com/gallery/data/648/medium/3screens.jpg

[/spoiler-box]

The setting for PSU STILL makes me jealous as an artist working on trying to draw environments, backgrounds and settingss. The only places in PSO I ever cared about were in ep 2. Everything else was overrated or just as good/bad as PSU's stuff.

[eharima]

Oh HELL no.

Haha OK ok

How about tha
t really aquwa
rd chat box th
at was HORRI
BLE to read.

[Chik'Tikka]

http://www.unseen64.net/wp-content/gallery/pso/hunewm.gif

Considering you can now make the original HUnewm a reality, yes. Watch out Rika + Nei.

I remember a while ago, people were speculating that 'scrapped' concept is where SEGA got the basic inspiration for Beasts in PSU, and eventually 'perfected' it in Infinity:

[SPOILER-BOX]http://www.pso-world.com/images/news/09-09-10/psp2_beast.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]



+^_^+ just cause this thread reminded me of the posts in this thread (http://www.pso-world.com/forums/showthread.php?t=195008&page=2) that talked about the transition from HUNewm to beast+^_^+