Late game MPA's are killing this game...

[Silver Crow]

It's actually disgusting...

There is no other thing to do in this game at the cap than to constantly MPA in floating continent or Volcano. And it's so ridiculously boring to do. Gets old real quick after the first few days. I could even equip the weakest launcher on my Ranger or the weakest partisan on my hunter and it would make little to no difference. Even random Duels are a joke. All it takes is one ranger to put weakbullet on the bosses weakspot and its dead within seconds.

The only thing that is remotely fun to do is solo as a HUNTER (solo'ing as any other class is just as boring as going with a group). But you get nothing out of it. No rewards. You get 4 meseta drops for killing a boss. You want higher drops? You have to S-rank before killing the boss. As a solo player that takes a lot of time since you get less monster spawns so you have to roam more... And that isn't enjoyable in the least.

So it all comes down to 2 things. Either you constantly do MPA's and become rich and buy the best weapons for no reason since you'll just MPA again and it won't really make a difference. Or you solo content and become filthy poor. You could do both i guess but for me the contrast of 'fun' between the two makes me hate MPA's. After 15 mins of an MPA i just Alt+F4 and watch something funny to lighten my mood again.

If only they could make solo'ing bosses as good as in Monster Hunter... You still got the same drops as in a group and it was more fun. Right now solo'ing anything just feels pointless... if anything it's deducting my meseta for all the healing items i had to buy.

What to do... anyone else feeling the same or have a solution? :/

[Fox2Tails]

Play another game

[watersea]

wow you must suck at this game

[BIG OLAF]

I hate running around in MPAs, but sadly, it's the only way to make meseta in a respectable amount of time.

Probably why I'm pretty poor compared to most people. Running in circles around a map for hours isn't my idea of fun, so I don't do it. Sometimes I secretly wish that PSO2 had PSU-style mission with linear spawns. Maybe they'll add something like them later down the line.

But, for now, trying to farm meseta (or anything) is just too boring for me.

[Arika]

For anybody against MPA.

When SEGA have the survey, put this message for it:
マルチパーティーエリアは今一番メセタを稼ぎやすい場所なのでみんながそこに溜まってしまいま す。　シング ルパーティーエリアでしかできないこととか何かマルチパーティーエリアで溜まりにくくする方法 をPSO2に 追加してほしい。

It is a suggestion to nerf down MPA, which is current method that everybody is doing to farm meseta, and make single party become better.

[Vashyron]

Oh yes, it's great when the most boring and mindless thing to do is the most rewarding.

[Sephirah]

The game was released early for a short term monetary gain to help them continue their development. There is no "end-game" yet. The level cap will steadily be increased and more content will be released as time goes on.

[Silver Crow]

Play another game

I've played many games that are no better than this. League of Legends to name one, I bought all the champions on that game and it doesn't feel fun, feels more like a job. Everyone playing so seriously, no roleplaying. If you stray from a build you get reported. I may aswell go earn me some money instead.. Then you have all the Monster Hunter games, name one i've played it. They're the best and at the moment the only good Monster Hunter game is Tri and i've finished it over 4 times getting to Hr 300+ on each character for no good reason. It was fun but there is no content release on that game at all. Tried to join Monster Hunter frontier but they are strict with banning foreigners, you slip up once and your hard earned character gets banned. I've read many sob stories and not really motivated to pay over £20 pounds a month for a private vpn and the monthly fee after all those warnings.

Oh and i'm sick of any mmorpg, especially tera and wow. God even mentioning them makes me want to hurl from boredom.

I did enjoy a game back in the day called Gunz, now it's dead, hardly any people play it. Had so many flaws though such as laggers, hackers, underclockers, lead shooting etc.

Either i'm growing out of games or they've just made worse games as i've grew older (i'm 19)

[NoiseHERO]

I like the MPA...

I'd rather farm an MPA over a White Beast...

Massive brainless killing to your play list. Just like any other game except the battle system is actually fun (well I still find it fun enough to justify half of this game...)

But they do seem to make all of the other MPA's useless compared to Free. Yet Free is the least interesting one. Hmm...

[Mizunos]

MPAs make 4-people parties pointless and overall, they make the game boring as hell. Terrible game design really, they should completely remove them or bring them back only for the soon-to-come gigantic bosses.

[Coatl]

They should just make the bosses themes start up when a mini boss/boss appears in an MP.
Would make fighting them a lot more exciting.

Also, I like MPs. It's not always I have exactly three other friends I want to run with, and it is fun just farming a field and chit-chatting with them at the same time. Why does everything always have to be so exciting for you guys?

[Silver Crow]

One time i do admit i was having fun in a huge MPA in Tundra, we had a cross burst then after a few minutes we got Emergency Duel Ragne and Emergency attack De Malmoth x2 with a cross burst RIGHT after. Was orgasm on a screen. Didn't get much meseta out of it and the only rare drops were from the emergency trials i think... they weren't worth much either. So it felt wasted... well atleast i enjoyed the fight. Tundra is amazing with all it's emergency code protections, makes PSE bursts so easy to get.

I wish that would happen in Floating continent MPA's though .. I have yet to enjoy an MPA in floating continent.

[Fox2Tails]

Portable 3rd >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Tri. Go play it

[Chik'Tikka]

For anybody against MPA.

When SEGA have the survey, put this message for it:
マルチパーティーエリアは今一番メセタを稼ぎやすい場所なのでみんながそこに溜まってしまいま す。　シング ルパーティーエリアでしかできないこととか何かマルチパーティーエリアで溜まりにくくする方法 をPSO2に 追加してほしい。

It is a suggestion to nerf down MPA, which is current method that everybody is doing to farm meseta, and make single party become better.

oh great, make the bot using antisocial players even more antisocial and split up the few remaining people that play this game to play with other people, my idea is rather to merge the blocks so that larger segments of the community can play from the same lobby, this will in turn create more missions people can join as well as more MPAs in missions for people hunting that one particular rare they want+^_^+ if the antisocial people want to be antisocial, put a password on and click the no multiparty request button+^_^+

[Silver Crow]

Portable 3rd >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Tri. Go play it

Isn't that japanese only? Could you tell me more about it or link me a good website?

[gigawuts]

I just do solo MPA, or bring NPC's in a passworded MPA.

So what if other people make a ton of money, I'm not really bothered. Actually, I benefit directly, since the rares they find flood the market in a matter of days after every area is released.

[Jakosifer]

Just make them more challenging. As it is now, its the easiest, fastest, most rewarding thing in the game...and extremely boring.

Know what. Bring back White Beast. That shit was about the same amount of entertainment. Seriously though, event missions would be cool.

[gigawuts]

A good solution is to upgrade an enemy's stats and make it stun-resistant based on the number of players in the immediate vicinity. Not the entire map, just the adjacent grids.

Before anyone says that players can grief by following but not helping, just hide behind them if that happens so they act as meatshields. Or find a new MPA.

[kkow]

^i think there was also an eng patch released if you look hard enough. cfw only obviously. and yes that game was far superior to tri (no underwater crap, etc)


this has nothing to do with being impatient because of no end game content, not being my idea of fun, or anything of the sort. this should be sega's priority, especially since no amount of new content can cover up this glaring flaw.

edit: oh and i really miss psp2. what a perfect game. yes i'm biased, go away

[Silver Crow]

^i think there was also an eng patch released if you look hard enough. cfw only obviously. and yes that game was far superior to tri (no underwater crap, etc)


this has nothing to do with being impatient because of no end game content, not being my idea of fun, or anything of the sort. this should be sega's priority, especially since no amount of new content can cover up this glaring flaw.

edit: oh and i really miss psp2. what a perfect game. yes i'm biased, go away

well i've been cheered up with the portable 3rd, gonna buy it. also looked at the new subclasses and i think i'll just let my character wait in arks lobby till they come out

[NoiseHERO]

I'd still rather run around in circles for 3 hours and have 12 people to annoy...

Over running the same LINEAR mission over and over and over until I felt literally sick, like in PSO/PSU..

[Sizustar]

Why should there be limit be placed on how one enjoys the game, if it doesn't break the TOS?

[gigawuts]

I'd still rather run around in circles for 3 hours and have 12 people to annoy...

Over running the same LINEAR mission over and over and over until I felt literally sick, like in PSO/PSU..

Most quests and maps in PSO weren't linear. There were multiple forks, typically resulting in dead ends but frequently being a shortcut or alternate path.

I mean, after a while you'd learn how to speed run it since there weren't many variations of the area's map, but that was your choice to not check out the forks. I always did.

In the end MPA's are pretty much the same as pubbing in PSO: You're with unfamiliar people, running through familiar territory, the only difference is how many people you're with. The only time an MPA isn't familiar is when you're first checking it out. After that you just run the same thing again and again, making it familiar. Bosses randomly spawn in the field, but in PSO you could randomly decide to stop going to a deadend and hit up the boss.

The basic vibe is exactly the same to me.

[gravityvx]

I've played many games that are no better than this. League of Legends to name one, I bought all the champions on that game and it doesn't feel fun, feels more like a job. Everyone playing so seriously, no roleplaying. If you stray from a build you get reported. I may aswell go earn me some money instead.. Then you have all the Monster Hunter games, name one i've played it. They're the best and at the moment the only good Monster Hunter game is Tri and i've finished it over 4 times getting to Hr 300+ on each character for no good reason. It was fun but there is no content release on that game at all. Tried to join Monster Hunter frontier but they are strict with banning foreigners, you slip up once and your hard earned character gets banned. I've read many sob stories and not really motivated to pay over £20 pounds a month for a private vpn and the monthly fee after all those warnings.

Oh and i'm sick of any mmorpg, especially tera and wow. God even mentioning them makes me want to hurl from boredom.

I did enjoy a game back in the day called Gunz, now it's dead, hardly any people play it. Had so many flaws though such as laggers, hackers, underclockers, lead shooting etc.

Either i'm growing out of games or they've just made worse games as i've grew older (i'm 19)

Two things here, one, League of Legends isn't an rpg it's a highly competitive MOBA so of course there is no role playing. And if a game like that feels like a job then yeah you should not be playing, I've been playing it for about 2 years and still find it very fun. So yeah, many people take it seriously, and a lot of players have bad attitudes as this is the kind of crowd most if not all competitive video games draw in. Secondly, I agree the mmo genre in general is getting pretty...stale. PSO2 was a refreshing change for a while, but the whole roaming in circles for hours got old after a bit. I'm really hoping they add some kind of new modes with some sort of challenge to break the monotony. And I'm not talking just slap on a challenge mode and call it a day, something new & different.

[NoiseHERO]

Most quests and maps in PSO weren't linear. There were multiple forks, typically resulting in dead ends but frequently being a shortcut or alternate path.

I mean, after a while you'd learn how to speed run it since there weren't many variations of the area's map, but that was your choice to not check out the forks. I always did.

In the end MPA's are pretty much the same as pubbing in PSO: You're with unfamiliar people, running through familiar territory, the only difference is how many people you're with. The only time an MPA isn't familiar is when you're first checking it out. After that you just run the same thing again and again, making it familiar. Bosses randomly spawn in the field, but in PSO you could randomly decide to stop going to a deadend and hit up the boss.

The basic vibe is exactly the same to me.

Even with PSO's stages being more distinct, it still had a beginning and an end and after it ends you just jump back in.

PSO2 there's DEFINITELY a problem with MPA's being uninteresting, but for me the past games were no better even if they were different. At least this time I don't have to keep going back to the entrance. :/

Which is what I'm saying, running in circles > running in a line over and over again. Probably why I enjoyed PSU's longer missions too... until they nerfed the balls out of everything in that game.

[gigawuts]

Well, that varies from person to person. Eventually running in a line again and again IS running in circles, because it's the same crap again and again. The only difference is circles are a curved line.

I liked the hand-crafted nature of the PSO1 maps, and how gal da val island looked. That really sold me on the game when I was new to it. Also, the scale of the music.

But I do know what you mean. I find the floating continent particularly bland. All the colors are bright, but washed out. There's no contrast. It actually starts giving me a headache due to how bright and washed out it is. Thank god I have bloom off, I can only imagine how much worse it'd be for me ha ha.

I do wish boss fights had better drops, but then we're in the same boat aren't we? Most people seem to metagame to get the best possible drops without stopping for anything. Me, it was always more about the journey than the destination, so I'm content to chillax and look at the scenery.

[Mystil]

oh great, make the bot using antisocial players even more antisocial and split up the few remaining people that play this game to play with other people, my idea is rather to merge the blocks so that larger segments of the community can play from the same lobby, this will in turn create more missions people can join as well as more MPAs in missions for people hunting that one particular rare they want+^_^+ if the antisocial people want to be antisocial, put a password on and click the no multiparty request button+^_^+

I have similar thoughts, but it's not along the lines of anti-socialism. More like exclusion. Yeah, let's exclude the people that aren't in our circle! So they're stuck with "left over" players who care nothing for them, because THEIR "circle" hasn't logged in yet. So soloing is just fine by them, while you get frustrated as shit, running an empty as hell free map.

Edit: I like MPA's. It's the greatest thing ever.


I'd still rather run around in circles for 3 hours and have 12 people to annoy...

Over running the same LINEAR mission over and over and over until I felt literally sick, like in PSO/PSU..

The only time I was ever annoyed in such a way in PSO was Phantasmal World IV. If you ever ran that thing, then you know what I mean. But if you haven't, you have absolutely no idea what nerve wracking really is until run that thing 50 times in a single day. Oh my god, and I only did it because I was the only FO the other 3 knew that would actually stick around and not let anyone die. But Ruins? even Caves... I'd run them ALL DAY LONG and never get tired of it.

[Zyrusticae]

I think they only need to do a few things to make MPAs more interesting:

1. Bigger spawns
2. Boss themes playing when a boss appears
3. Bigger spawns
4. Multiple bosses spawning on the field at once when more than 1 party is on the field
5. Bigger spawns
6. Slight scaling based on the number of players within certain range of a cell (for example, 5% more HP per mob per player past the first, or something like that) so that monsters don't just die instantaneously
7. BIGGER SPAWNS

...And then it would be great. IMO, of course.

[Xaeris]

I think they only need to do a few things to make MPAs more interesting:

1. Bigger spawns
2. Boss themes playing when a boss appears
3. Bigger spawns
4. Multiple bosses spawning on the field at once when more than 1 party is on the field
5. Bigger spawns
6. Slight scaling based on the number of players within certain range of a cell (for example, 5% more HP per mob per player past the first, or something like that) so that monsters don't just die instantaneously
7. BIGGER SPAWNS

...And then it would be great. IMO, of course.

I agree with this. I'm okay with the idea of what we do in an MPA. It just needs to scale better. A lot better. As it is, we often get these pathetic little spawns of 5 grunt enemies when we have a 12 person party, and good luck getting a chance to do anything before the Rafoie spam melts everything.

[Coatl]

I think they only need to do a few things to make MPAs more interesting:


4. Multiple bosses spawning on the field at once when more than 1 party is on the field



This is possible though I think.
I mean, I've had a vol dragon and a dark ragne appear at the same time, as well as Quartz dragon and 3 Caterdran'sa (is that how you spell it? Idk) appear.

These have been the only times though. Would be cool if it was more often.

[NoiseHERO]

I think multiple bosses spawning has become more rare compared to CBT...

[Coatl]

Even if multiple boss spawnings happened more often, we'll never get a Banther & Quartz Dragon Dual code. :c
Only they can bring a whole MP to 0 HP.

[NoiseHERO]

I still wanna see a Quartz own the shit out of a Ragunee-chan.

[TetsuyaHikari]

There is no other thing to do in this game at the cap than to constantly MPA in floating continent or Volcano.

Did you honestly expect anything different? One of the areas is the newest we currently have, which in turn drops the newest (and best in some cases) equipment around and the Volcano drops the current best sword in the game (I'd know. I'm on my 5th week hunting it >_<).


And it's so ridiculously easy and boring to do. I could equip the weakest launcher on my Ranger or the weakest partisan and it would make little to no difference. Even random Duels are a joke. All it takes is one ranger to put weakbullet on the bosses weakspot and its dead within seconds.

It's easy? So what? You're capped and you're running with a bunch of other players that are most likely capped as well, just farming. Why would it be difficult? We don't even have Very Hard mode yet.

As far as the boredom is concerned... I don't see how this is any different from when you were leveling between 20 and 40, probably saying to yourself, "This is soooo boring...", now look at you. You're saying the same thing, just because of a different situation. Something tells me your expectations were a bit different when going into this.


The only thing that is remotely fun to do is solo as a HUNTER (solo'ing as any other class is just as boring as going with a group). But you get nothing out of it. No rewards. You get 4 meseta drops for killing a boss. You want higher drops? You have to S-rank before killing the boss. As a solo player that takes a lot of time since you get less monster spawns so you have to roam more... And that isn't enjoyable in the least.

If your idea of fun is to play solo in an online game, then maybe you should consider just sticking with offline RPGs. Why are you going to play online if you don't want to play with other people? That seems counter-productive if you ask me. Sure, I solo the Volcano sometimes (only because there isn't an MPA available at the time), but I certainly don't think it's fun since I'm searching for a sword I'll probably never find, lol. I also only go solo if it's to join an MPA on the Floating Continent.

I don't know why you think the game should give you bigger rewards for soloing though. That's just ridiculous. The game doesn't understand your rules of what a 'challenge' is. Naturally, an online title is going to reward those better that stick together as a team as opposed to a player running solo. That's how these games work and it's how they've always worked (except for in some cases where exp can be more rewarding for one player rather than having it split amongst the party).


So it all comes down to 2 things. Either you constantly do MPA's and become rich and buy the best weapons for no reason since you'll just MPA again and it won't really make a difference. Or you solo content and become filthy poor. You could do both i guess but for me the contrast of 'fun' between the two makes me hate MPA's. After 15 mins of an MPA i just Alt+F4 and watch something funny to lighten my mood again.

Soooo... what you're saying is, you don't like being rich? You need to think outside of the box, man. What's so bad about getting better equipment? Sure, it may not change much of what's going on currently, but it helps you prepare for the future.

If you're level 40 and they release a new area which requires you to be level 45 to join, do you want to still be stuck with your crap gear or would you rather have the best stuff you already can get your hands on, so you'll be prepared for whatever is in that new area? It's called "thinking ahead" and I'm sorry, but if you're getting bored in 15 minutes, you really need to find something better to be doing with your time. You're obviously not enjoying yourself and you've got a list of complaints about the game, so just do us all a favor and don't sign on until you're ready so someone who actually wants to play the game can take your place in a block/party/MPA/etc.


If only they could make solo'ing bosses as good as in Monster Hunter... You still got the same drops as in a group and it was more fun. Right now solo'ing anything just feels pointless... if anything it's deducting my meseta for all the healing items i had to buy.

What to do... anyone else feeling the same or have a solution? :/

I know someone in here already set you up with an MH game, but I just want to point out that maybe that was one of your problems right there. You came into this comparing it to Monster Hunter of all things. Apples and oranges, man. Sure, they share similar elements, but it would be like comparing Gran Turismo 5 to Burnout.

Yes, they are both racing, much like these are both RPGs, but underneath the surface, they are different. If you would have come to this game with a clear head and just accepted it for what it was rather than comparing it to this or that, maybe you'd be enjoying yourself right now. It's like the guys with the nostalgia goggles getting mad because this isn't PSO.

I have just one question for all of you.

Why can't you just like both?

[gigawuts]

Even if multiple boss spawnings happened more often, we'll never get a Banther & Quartz Dragon Dual code. :c
Only they can bring a whole MP to 0 HP.

Quartz Banshee.

All attacks cause confusion.

Somebody get Sakai on the fucking phone!

[Crysteon]

So now people complain about the MPA feature after overplaying the game? Jeez...you guys will never be satisfied with anything.

[TetsuyaHikari]

So now people complain about the MPA feature after overplaying the game? Jeez...you guys will never be satisfied with anything.

It's always something, man. ALWAYS something, lol. I'd understand if it was a glitch, game breaking, whatever, but it's not... most of these complaints are just fueled from personal preference of how the player wishes to play the game with their own set of rules.

[Laxedrane]

I agree that the game needs to scale better for MPA however I really do like the idea and hope that sega does a better job of scaling it instead of scrapping the concept. Because I for one really enjoy them.

[Coatl]

mang, all dese bosses so ez i soloed ALL of dem dis gaem so boring who does matterburds matturburds so boring ugh story quests so useless and boring ugh farming MP so boring ugh affixing weapunz so boring fk u doodoo dis gaem has no content & is booring

/thread

[Xaeris]

If that's your comprehension of the thread, I imagine Spark Notes must have saved your life in high school.

[redroses]

As soon as the new classes come out and more people start to level again, they will all be very happy that MPA exist.

I really don't think they need to be removed. What they should do is scale the enemies strength, hp etc. depending on the party members and the same for bosses. Or make double duels appear, like two ragnes at once. Because the bosses die so fast it's really sad.

Either way, MPA are great for leveling, and without them I think it would be disgusting to lv (especially if you have start a new character and don't have all the client orders open for it).
At least on lower levels you benefit from all the exp. But on lv cap all you are hoping for is drops, which just makes it more boring because of that.

[Skyly HUmar]

I won't exactly call MPAs fun (cuz i know they can get old), but i wont call them boring either. As a force, i can blast the crap outa everything and get money, as a ranger, i make bosses easier then they already are (my opinion), and as a hunter, i can sit back, and watch everyone else do all the work while I just reap the rewards XD.

At the moment Im just making money for new clothes and grinding. Theres really nothing much more to do when youve done everything.

Crow buddy, if you hate MPAs dont do them, lock the room and make it MPA locked too. If you find it pointless to do runs as a ranger and force, dont do them. If you find soloing too boring, wellp, youve experienced the whole game, find something else to do while you wait for updates. Such is the PSU way.

[Ueno54]

I'm playing EVE online till fall when they release the big content patch. Didn't feel like ruining PSO2 for myself.

[Sizustar]

I think they only need to do a few things to make MPAs more interesting:

1. Bigger spawns
2. Boss themes playing when a boss appears
3. Bigger spawns
4. Multiple bosses spawning on the field at once when more than 1 party is on the field
5. Bigger spawns
6. Slight scaling based on the number of players within certain range of a cell (for example, 5% more HP per mob per player past the first, or something like that) so that monsters don't just die instantaneously
7. BIGGER SPAWNS

...And then it would be great. IMO, of course.

Those are good ideas, I'll send it to Sega in the next survey...
And also a better way to keep tab on all 12 member of the party is good too.
Or a room that is 12 people from the start?
And the difficulity and spawn is changed to meet the 12 people party.

[Carillon]

Crow buddy, if you hate MPAs dont do them,

...if only that were a reasonable option.

too bad the skill point quest requires you to go to MPAs to even get ragne to spawn.
and since you get more codes with more parties... ugh.

leveling is trivial. getting enough cash for most things is pretty easy. but having progression cock-blocked by a "get lucky, or cry in a corner" quest is frustrating.

[jooozek]

Those are good ideas, I'll send it to Sega in the next survey...
And also a better way to keep tab on all 12 member of the party is good too.
Or a room that is 12 people from the start?
And the difficulity and spawn is changed to meet the 12 people party.

Please send them also a suggestion to block NPCs/partners in multiparty areas and generally to isolate all the NPC runners to separate blocks, oh, and, instead of green dots, red dots on the radar for rares (!!!); seriously important!

[EvilMag]

Please send them also a suggestion to block NPCs/partners in multiparty areas and generally to isolate all the NPC runners to separate blocks, oh, and, instead of green dots, red dots on the radar for rares (!!!); seriously important!

This and a 1000 times this.

[ScottyMango]

Please send them also a suggestion to block NPCs/partners in multiparty areas and generally to isolate all the NPC runners to separate blocks

this. Yes please, yes.

a MILLION times this.

[Valkyrie Lovrina]

Please send them also a suggestion to block NPCs/partners in multiparty areas and generally to isolate all the NPC runners to separate blocks, oh, and, instead of green dots, red dots on the radar for rares (!!!); seriously important!I gotta say I agree with this. as much as I won't like not being able to use Echo and friend NPC's in some blocks(I stopped using NPC's in farming MPA's). it burns me when there are 10+2NPC/12 rooms also if its a person using Zeno(:argh:) and Echo. I just lose it.
Seriously? When I'm trying to make Meseta since I don't have My Shop....I mean really?

[gigawuts]

Please send them also a suggestion to block NPCs/partners in multiparty areas and generally to isolate all the NPC runners to separate blocks, oh, and, instead of green dots, red dots on the radar for rares (!!!); seriously important!

Yes!

And then put regular players on the entire map as grey dots, like on the local minimap!

[Inazuma]

A lot of good suggestions in this thread.

I hate morons who use NPCs in multiparty areas as well. Not only does it negatively affect the other players, but it even hurts the person doing it. It's one thing to be selfish, but doing something that harms everyone, including yourself, is just dumb.

Someone else made this suggestion in another topic but I will repeat it:

Sega needs to designate some blocks for MPA (like how they have blocks for certain level ranges, solo/parties, etc), and in these MPA blocks, NPCs should not be allowed.

[Aremt]

A lot of good suggestions in this thread.

I hate morons who use NPCs in multiparty areas as well. Not only does it negatively affect the other players, but it even hurts the person doing it. It's one thing to be selfish, but doing something that harms everyone, including yourself, is just dumb.

Someone else made this suggestion in another topic but I will repeat it:

Sega needs to designate some blocks for MPA (like how they have blocks for certain level ranges, solo/parties, etc), and in these MPA blocks, NPCs should not be allowed.
Using NPC' in multiparty areas, really? Honestly whats the problem in this? Am I a moron to go into a mission that's difficult for me, with NPCs, and that mission just so happens to have a multiparty area? I mean in a free field I guess I wouldn't take NPCs if that's what you mean.

Also: NPCs aren't allowed in emergency events, so stop complaining.

[Dan Maku]

http://i47.tinypic.com/1so8rm.jpg

[Brus]

Using NPC' in multiparty areas, really? Honestly whats the problem in this? Am I a moron to go into a mission that's difficult for me, with NPCs, and that mission just so happens to have a multiparty area? I mean in a free field I guess I wouldn't take NPCs if that's what you mean.

Also: NPCs aren't allowed in emergency events, so stop complaining.

I believe they implicity mean people who bring NPCs to farm in an MPA, which is indeed dumb.

[Inazuma]

Using NPC' in multiparty areas, really? Honestly whats the problem in this? Am I a moron to go into a mission that's difficult for me, with NPCs, and that mission just so happens to have a multiparty area? I mean in a free field I guess I wouldn't take NPCs if that's what you mean.

Also: NPCs aren't allowed in emergency events, so stop complaining.

If you are playing through the level like normal, on your way to the boss, using NPCs is totally fine. I am talking about people who are there specifically for MPA, and they stick around for hours doing it.

The other day I was doing MPA for hours in the same spot. There were other parties there the entire time, using NPCs the entire time. All 12 slots were full, and these NPCs were just slowing everyone down. I even tried to ask them to remove the NPCs but they called me an idiot and said they can play however they want.

If Sega doesn't give us NPC free lobby blocks, we will just have to wait for the English version to come out. The asshole players will make the switch, and we shouldn't have problems like this anymore.

[Aremt]

If you are playing through the level like normal, on your way to the boss, using NPCs is totally fine. I am talking about people who are there specifically for MPA, and they stick around for hours doing it.

The other day I was doing MPA for hours in the same spot. There were other parties there the entire time, using NPCs the entire time. All 12 slots were full, and these NPCs were just slowing everyone down. I even tried to ask them to remove the NPCs but they called me an idiot and said they can play however they want.

If Sega doesn't give us NPC free lobby blocks, we will just have to wait for the English version to come out. The asshole players will make the switch, and we shouldn't have problems like this anymore.Maybe you could go to a different block and try finding one where people aren't using NPCs?

[Inazuma]

Maybe you could go to a different block and try finding one where people aren't using NPCs?

If they insist on being jerks and won't boot NPCs when asked, there's not much else I could do, I guess. I'll have to deal with it until they move to English version.

[Zyrusticae]

Maybe you could go to a different block and try finding one where people aren't using NPCs?
You know, it is extremely difficult to find large multiparties in this game. There are usually only just a handful close to 12/12 on the entire ship. So when one guy's being a dick and not putting a password on his game or bringing NPCs to farm in a MPA (wtf is that shit? seriously!), it is very hard to just "deal with it" or "find a different (multi)party".

So yeah, I second the others. There should be blocks designated specifically for NPC use so that those of us who aren't interested in being held back by a bunch of bots can fully enjoy ourselves.

[jooozek]

Maybe you could go to a different block and try finding one where people aren't using NPCs?
And just why should we go to different blocks instead of you? Say, there is an MPA that is at 8/12, 4 free slots. You come there with your bots and fill the all 4 slots. Here come I to browse the parties at quest counter and I see only one multiparty area with people in it and some ignorant prick filling 3 slots with bots. You are being a prick to everyone who wants to join that multiparty area by filling the slots with bots. Don't tell people to go to different blocks, asshole.

[ScottyMango]

Maybe you could go to a different block and try finding one where people aren't using NPCs?

No, maybe YOU should go to a different block where people aren't trying to get a good MPA farm going. It's really annoying when people are trying to scrape up a PSA and some asshat joins with 3 useless bots.

All it does is slow things down and take up room which could be used a lot more efficiently. If you're so anti-social that don't wanna party with people... fine, but please play your offline MMO in a way that doesn't burden other people's experience.

[TetsuyaHikari]

No, maybe YOU should go to a different block where people aren't trying to get a good MPA farm going. It's really annoying when people are trying to scrape up a PSA and some asshat joins with 3 useless bots.

All it does is slow things down and take up room which could be used a lot more efficiently. If you're so anti-social that don't wanna party with people... fine, but please play your offline MMO in a way that doesn't burden other people's experience.

Or maybe you should just learn to deal with the way the game was made and quit trying to tell others how to play the game. Like I said before, most of these complaints aren't game breaking (no, the MPA system does not break this game, regardless of how much you disagree with the system), they're merely based on personal preference and wanting others to play the game based on their own set of rules they have written in their head.

I don't like people having NPCs in their party, taking up space in a MPA as much as the next guy, but it's a part of the game. So you can either learn to live with it or keep bitching about it, hoping SoJ will hear you complain and do something about it (spoiler: this isn't likely to happen).

[ScottyMango]

Yes, let's just sit back and accept everything wrong with that game because it is currently 'part of the game'.

I never thought about it that way, before. Makes PERFECT sense.

...no it doesn't.

[TetsuyaHikari]

Yes, lets just sit back and accept everything wrong with that game because it is currently 'part of the game'.

I never thought about it that way, before. Makes PERFECT sense.

...no it doesn't.

I'm not telling you to sit back and accept everything the way it is. I'm telling you to get your fucking priorities straight. There are things to complain about which need to be adjusted in this game, yes, but this should not be on top of your list.

You remind me of the people who would rather put the spotlight on the 'fight against homosexuality' rather than 'solving hunger in third world countries'. I don't see altering the parameters of MPAs being that high of a priority since, once again... it is not game breaking (how many times must I reiterate this?).

Go complain about something worth complaining about.

[Enforcer MKV]

-Looks at Tetsuya's sig- *thinks* ......

Holy crap, I played with you the other day in a Floating Isles MPA! :D

But yeah, I'd prefer MPA blocks....that'd be cool. Right now all we can do is complain and wait for the survey, though. >_>;

and start compiling a list of everything we'd like. I think that's a good idea. ^^;

[ScottyMango]

Go complain about something worth complaining about.

I could say the same thing to you.

Lol excuse me for not having a list that I should follow to complain about things in a specific order. Sorry that the way I complain doesn't fall in line with how you think I should complain.

Point is it's annoying, and I/lots of people want it fixed.

The idea that we can't complain about certain things because there are other things to complain about is just... lol.

[TetsuyaHikari]

-Looks at Tetsuya's sig- *thinks* ......

Holy crap, I played with you the other day in a Floating Isles MPA! :D

But yeah, I'd prefer MPA blocks....that'd be cool. Right now all we can do is complain and wait for the survey, though. >_>;

and start compiling a list of everything we'd like. I think that's a good idea. ^^;

Ohhhh... right. ENFORCER. I remember seeing you, but I guess it just slipped my mind that there was a similar name on the forums, so I didn't piece the two together, lol. I was probably a little out of it anyway. I've been trying to save up money for the 29th @_@

Anyway, I guess if adding 'MPA blocks' would shut some people up about this and stop them from acting as if the MPA is a doomsday device causing them to not enjoy their games, then that could work, but you see... the Premium blocks are a privilege. Setting MPA specific stuff in blocks of their own seems like you're just isolating them for playing the game differently from other players.

If someone doesn't want to participate in a MPA, fine, don't. Just don't try to stop others from doing it. I know they're not saying we shouldn't do it, but it is kind of ridiculous they expect to just push people like me aside just because they don't want to take full advantage of gaining rewards and would rather choose to solo or whatever. Aren't you guys part of a team or something? Don't you want to run MPAs with them?

I just don't understand how some people can be so against the idea of multi-parties and think it's ruining their experience of the game.

EDIT:
I could say the same thing to you.

Lol excuse me for not having a list that I should follow to complain about things in a specific order. Sorry that the way I complain doesn't fall in line with how you think I should complain.

Point is it's annoying, and I/lots of people want it fixed.

The idea that we can't complain about certain things because there are other things to complain about is just... lol.

Go ahead and say the same thing to me, but keep in mind, I'm only complaining because you are. Had you (and the others) not started this shitstorm, then I wouldn't be complaining and I can assure you, if I was to complain, it would be about something with a bigger importance than, "OMG MPAS MUST DIE!!!111ONE". You don't have to be a smartass in regards to the list though. I know you were merely complaining about this specific thing because that is the topic of this thread, however... the thread shouldn't have even got this far to begin with.

The whole idea is ridiculous. It doesn't have anything to do with how "I think you should complain". It's a simple logistic thought pattern of, "Hmmm... this weapon doesn't work properly" and "I personally don't like MPAs". Why would you complain about the one which is just a personal preference to you rather than something that will help change the game in a good way? You're just here to complain about your hate for MPAs because you're hoping to justify it as a valid one by surrounding yourself with people who are in agreement with you.

Well, guess what. Just because you have a lot of people backing you doesn't mean your way of thinking it correct. All of the ones who have complained about MPAs just choose not to like them because they would prefer to play in a different manner, which is fine. However, it is not fine to expect SoJ to do something about this and cater to them, as if to punish players who do enjoy reaping the rewards from MPAs.

So yeah, you can go ahead and keep complaining all you want, and "lol" for not complaining about something else when you could be, but I'd have a much better appreciation for your thoughts and higher respect for you as a person if you'd stop thinking about what you want for a change and think about what's good for the game.

[Coatl]

Yeah Tetsuya's sig is pretty memorable. o=
I notice the characters after a few seconds in-game.

I disagree though. I do find it to be a priority thing to fix in-game currently. Say you come home and just want to play PSO2 like everyone else. Your team greets you. All is well and dandy. One team member proposes, "hey, let's farm floaty islands :D". You are with four other people. There is an MP with 10/12 people, and you spot one person with 3 npcs with him. Well shoot.

Well what do you do then? You make a brand new MP yourself and invite your team members. But wait, one person joins and brings 3 NPCs into the MP. Oh well, I guess I'll just suck it up because if I tell them to remove their NPCs, I am attacking their privilege to play how they want to. :C dis is a democracy guise ;(

In reality, your freedom extends as far as another person's begins. It's so easy to cause great damage by bringing your NPCs. The amount of inconvenience ONE person can cause for THREE other people, not counting the people in the MP, is just unfair. And a lot of us don't want to take that lying down.

[gigawuts]

Really Tetsuya? You're going to tell people they can't enjoy games the way they want to because they just don't want to be around people enjoying games a different way they want to?

Are you joking?

This is exactly as valid of a request as having different lobbies for different level brackets, maybe even more so.

[Inazuma]

So just because the game allows someone to be inconsiderate to others, that makes it OK?

Speaking of game rules, another idea to solve this problem would be to have a checkbox for NPCs on the party creation window. If you select to not have NPCs, you won't be matched up with a party that has them.

[Silver Crow]

Did you honestly expect anything different? One of the areas is the newest we currently have, which in turn drops the newest (and best in some cases) equipment around and the Volcano drops the current best sword in the game (I'd know. I'm on my 5th week hunting it >_<).



It's easy? So what? You're capped and you're running with a bunch of other players that are most likely capped as well, just farming. Why would it be difficult? We don't even have Very Hard mode yet.

As far as the boredom is concerned... I don't see how this is any different from when you were leveling between 20 and 40, probably saying to yourself, "This is soooo boring...", now look at you. You're saying the same thing, just because of a different situation. Something tells me your expectations were a bit different when going into this.



If your idea of fun is to play solo in an online game, then maybe you should consider just sticking with offline RPGs. Why are you going to play online if you don't want to play with other people? That seems counter-productive if you ask me. Sure, I solo the Volcano sometimes (only because there isn't an MPA available at the time), but I certainly don't think it's fun since I'm searching for a sword I'll probably never find, lol. I also only go solo if it's to join an MPA on the Floating Continent.

I don't know why you think the game should give you bigger rewards for soloing though. That's just ridiculous. The game doesn't understand your rules of what a 'challenge' is. Naturally, an online title is going to reward those better that stick together as a team as opposed to a player running solo. That's how these games work and it's how they've always worked (except for in some cases where exp can be more rewarding for one player rather than having it split amongst the party).



Soooo... what you're saying is, you don't like being rich? You need to think outside of the box, man. What's so bad about getting better equipment? Sure, it may not change much of what's going on currently, but it helps you prepare for the future.

If you're level 40 and they release a new area which requires you to be level 45 to join, do you want to still be stuck with your crap gear or would you rather have the best stuff you already can get your hands on, so you'll be prepared for whatever is in that new area? It's called "thinking ahead" and I'm sorry, but if you're getting bored in 15 minutes, you really need to find something better to be doing with your time. You're obviously not enjoying yourself and you've got a list of complaints about the game, so just do us all a favor and don't sign on until you're ready so someone who actually wants to play the game can take your place in a block/party/MPA/etc.



I know someone in here already set you up with an MH game, but I just want to point out that maybe that was one of your problems right there. You came into this comparing it to Monster Hunter of all things. Apples and oranges, man. Sure, they share similar elements, but it would be like comparing Gran Turismo 5 to Burnout.

Yes, they are both racing, much like these are both RPGs, but underneath the surface, they are different. If you would have come to this game with a clear head and just accepted it for what it was rather than comparing it to this or that, maybe you'd be enjoying yourself right now. It's like the guys with the nostalgia goggles getting mad because this isn't PSO.

I have just one question for all of you.

Why can't you just like both?

Hmm maybe you're right on the comparison thing with Monster Hunter and this game... Originally i was looking for how-to's on joining Monster Hunter Frontier and found this game on a random forum, people saying its the next best thing.

Though... the only thing you can do productively in this game is MPA. And it just doesn't feel like a game in an MPA sometimes, just running around clicking this PA that PA. I mean sure, it's fun for the first 2-3 days but after that it's the same pattern... I just want variety. It's lovely when you get a massive cross burst and boss monsters spawning (gosh i'd love if multiple bosses spawned constantly) but there's another thing, those damn rangers and their weakbullet. Even the bosses drop like flies nowadays.

And what i mean by solo'ing is it is the only thing that actually makes use of all the good gear you have. You definitely don't need top end gear for MPA's, maybe decent gear for 4 man parties to kill a certain boss yeah. And so what if this game is online, solo'ing is a big factor in this game too. Look at all the client orders which encourage solo'ing such as solo Fang bro's, solo BV etc. And it's real fun when you manage to solo them. I don't mind if they make it less rewarding in terms of 'time taken to defeat' but it also strips that boss loot from you if you don't s-rank before the quest (which as i've said takes a hella long time to get on your own due to reduced spawn rates and more roaming).

On a different note, i wish they'd remove the weakbullet mechanic from the game... or atleast nerf it a bit... I don't know, it's a bit too extreme. Downing most 'duel' bosses in seconds because a ranger weakbulleted it is a bit too much... What they could do is nerf the damage a bit and make it so it won't do any additional damage when put on a weakspot. I get the mechanic of it if it's to place a weakpoint on a random body part, but a weakspot on a weakspot? To me that doesn't make too much sense. Gotta admit, the first time i hit a weakbulleted weakspot i was having the time of my life, but now it's removing the challenging element of killing these super-bosses.

All in all, if you're not doing MPA's at lvl40 you're not doing anything productive. And people who aren't bored yet i really envy you, keep going!

That is all, i hope i've clarified some of my points there...

[ScottyMango]

I just don't understand how some people can be so against the idea of multi-parties and think it's ruining their experience of the game.

What? I'm not, I was discussing people bringing useless bots into MPAs, not the removal/relocation of MPAs themselves.

I love MPAs, I'd be pissed if they were removed. I just find it incredibly annoying how people drag full parties of bots into them and screw it up for everyone else who is trying to have a successful farm.

[Ceresa]

It's easier for one person that wants to solo to tick that private MPA box than it is for 1+ people to make a 12/12 with real people.

Basic human decency should compel the soloist to take that 3 seconds to make it private, ensuring that everyone gets what they want without aggravation.

I guess that's too much to hope for in a f2p game though.

Oh and Monster Hunter is the finest franchise in gaming history, expecting some offering from the current Sega to reach that lofty pinnacle is a bit too optimistic, delusional even.

[Reyva]

Lol funny how this thread got turned into the typical NPC bot argument.

Pretty much agree with what the OP said and anything following that. Kinda feels like a retarded version of a MMO lol. Its fun at start, but after a while, it really does get old. Then again, you can use the same argument about PSU/PSO, but I dunno, I actually liked doing 304830483043048304380 White beast runs lol. Just go in and Jabroni it all and paradi and we would try to top our speed run times.

Can't do that here in PSO2 since everyone stays in the MPA all the time.

And lastly, once again, its the whole rare factor thing. I mean like I said in past posts, in PSU/PSO I did those mindless missions/quests/etc because of something I really wanted. But for some reason, in PSO2 right now, there isn't really anything that "I must have." Like in PSU with the har/quick and the power charge units and so on. IN other words, for weapons/armor, they got to stand out (i.e Psycho wand in PSU vs most other rods = crap).

As for the npc bot thing, just another rehash. Complain complain complain and feel free to do it and I don't mind, but nothing is going to change.

Anyways, just sayin, I know how you feel OP. Its not like I'm going to quit playing the game as I do love it, but there are some flaws in the game that need to be pointed out/taken care of.

[Silver Crow]

Lol funny how this thread got turned into the typical NPC bot argument.

Pretty much agree with what the OP said and anything following that. Kinda feels like a retarded version of a MMO lol. Its fun at start, but after a while, it really does get old. Then again, you can use the same argument about PSU/PSO, but I dunno, I actually liked doing 304830483043048304380 White beast runs lol. Just go in and Jabroni it all and paradi and we would try to top our speed run times.

Can't do that here in PSO2 since everyone stays in the MPA all the time.

And lastly, once again, its the whole rare factor thing. I mean like I said in past posts, in PSU/PSO I did those mindless missions/quests/etc because of something I really wanted. But for some reason, in PSO2 right now, there isn't really anything that "I must have." Like in PSU with the har/quick and the power charge units and so on. IN other words, for weapons/armor, they got to stand out (i.e Psycho wand in PSU vs most other rods = crap).

As for the npc bot thing, just another rehash. Complain complain complain and feel free to do it and I don't mind, but nothing is going to change.

Anyways, just sayin, I know how you feel OP. Its not like I'm going to quit playing the game as I do love it, but there are some flaws in the game that need to be pointed out/taken care of.

Mm... really refreshed me when i heard a bunch of new classes are coming out and new weapons, that's the change i'd like. I was enjoying transitioning between hunter and ranger a lot. I bought 2 new mags for this (a new one for my hunter since i screwed that one up). Think i'm going to ignore forces in this game. T'was was my first character, got it to 36 then deleted and changed ship. Don't feel like going back or leveling my force at all so not picking up techer unless it's insanely fun (wand gear sounds quite nice though). Seriously can't wait for fighter and knuckle gear! Gunner doesn't sound tooo appealing so far since it's gear is just a damage increase but we'll see :>

[TetsuyaHikari]

I disagree though. I do find it to be a priority thing to fix in-game currently. Say you come home and just want to play PSO2 like everyone else. Your team greets you. All is well and dandy. One team member proposes, "hey, let's farm floaty islands :D". You are with four other people. There is an MP with 10/12 people, and you spot one person with 3 npcs with him. Well shoot.

Well what do you do then? You make a brand new MP yourself and invite your team members. But wait, one person joins and brings 3 NPCs into the MP. Oh well, I guess I'll just suck it up because if I tell them to remove their NPCs, I am attacking their privilege to play how they want to. :C dis is a democracy guise ;(

In reality, your freedom extends as far as another person's begins. It's so easy to cause great damage by bringing your NPCs. The amount of inconvenience ONE person can cause for THREE other people, not counting the people in the MP, is just unfair. And a lot of us don't want to take that lying down.

You know what you do? You wait. That's what. You wait.

Go find something else to do in the meantime. A different mission, go watch TV, just sit around and chat in the meantime. Whatever, really.

You can't expect the game to hold your hand every step of the way, then cry and complain every moment it lets go. The fact of the matter is, you're not always going to get what you want in online games because it's no longer about you any more. Now you have to worry about the wants of others as well.

It's like walking into a fast food place, but not wanting to wait in line, so you suggest to the manager they need to open a new line just because you don't want to be inconvenienced. While this is a nice concept, it's just that. Hell, in an ideal world, we'd all get to party with people whenever we want and do whatever we want, whenever we want, but that's just not how it works.

There are multiple variables to take into consideration outside of yourself. Things which you cannot control. The world doesn't revolve around you or I, it revolves around everyone. I'm not condoning this sort of behavior from those who would bring NPCs, but it's just something we have to deal with. Sure, it would be nice if we didn't have to, but we do and that's the reality of the situation.

Pushing those people away into different blocks won't make these problems disappear.


Really Tetsuya? You're going to tell people they can't enjoy games the way they want to because they just don't want to be around people enjoying games a different way they want to?

Are you joking?

This is exactly as valid of a request as having different lobbies for different level brackets, maybe even more so.

No, I'm telling people, "If all you're going to do is bitch, whine, moan, and complain, then please gtfo the game and let someone who wants to play get on instead". Just because you're not having a pleasant experience doesn't give you the right to come piss in my cereal. We all have complaints, I'm sure, but does that mean we should throw them in everyone's faces, trying to make these complaints out to be the worst thing since the Doomsday of 2012 was "forseen" ? No.

If you've got all these complaints, why the hell are you even playing the game right now? Just go play something else or do something else in the meantime. Don't bore us with your complaints as to why you think the game is terrible or whatever. Also, this isn't even the same thing as requesting different blocks for levels.

Judging from the posts here (someone correct me if I'm wrong), they want the MPA blocks to be mandatory (otherwise, how would it solve anything, unlike the optional level blocks, right?)... and to me, that's just, no. It's not fair to those of us that do enjoy MPAs, to have us cast aside as if we're some kind of inconvenience to those that are trying to enjoy the game.

You don't like MPAs? Fine, don't join them. You do like them, but can't because of NPCs? Alright, you can either start a new one and have your other friends drop their map or wait. That's as cut and dry as I can make it. Complaining won't solve either of your problems though, so just save your energy.


So just because the game allows someone to be inconsiderate to others, that makes it OK?

Speaking of game rules, another idea to solve this problem would be to have a checkbox for NPCs on the party creation window. If you select to not have NPCs, you won't be matched up with a party that has them.

I never said it was okay for people to be inconsiderate. I said, you have to learn to live with it. If it's not NPCs being brought along for MPAs, it's always going to be something else. It just comes with the territory. It's a sad, but true part of any online game, unfortunately.


What? I'm not, I was discussing people bringing useless bots into MPAs, not the removal/relocation of MPAs themselves.

I love MPAs, I'd be pissed if they were removed. I just find it incredibly annoying how people drag full parties of bots into them and screw it up for everyone else who is trying to have a successful farm.

My mistake. Well, some of my points still remain though. See above.


It's easier for one person that wants to solo to tick that private MPA box than it is for 1+ people to make a 12/12 with real people.

Basic human decency should compel the soloist to take that 3 seconds to make it private, ensuring that everyone gets what they want without aggravation.

I guess that's too much to hope for in a f2p game though.

Oh and Monster Hunter is the finest franchise in gaming history, expecting some offering from the current Sega to reach that lofty pinnacle is a bit too optimistic, delusional even.

This is why it baffles me as to why people are having trouble with NPCs in MPAs. If these guys were in teams, they would never run into this issue. They would just run locked MPAs with their team and that would solve all of their problems right there.

Making MPA specific blocks isn't going to get rid of the NPC problem, guys. The 'tick-box' is a better idea, but requires coordination between joining members, which leads me back to the team. Just join a team. Trust me, you'll find a lot of your headaches will disappear once this happens (although, don't be surprised if new ones take their place from arguing with other members and whatnot, lol).

[gigawuts]

Er, no. People just want the ability to go somewhere that nobody can bring an NPC into the farming MPA. Nobody's saying you can't do your thing, just that they'd like to do their thing.

[Zyrusticae]

You know what you do? You wait. That's what. You wait.

Go find something else to do in the meantime. A different mission, go watch TV, just sit around and chat in the meantime. Whatever, really.
OH MY GOD THIS IS INCREDIBLY STUPID.

No. Screw that. It's SO EASY to just LOCK YOUR DAMN GAME that there is ZERO EXCUSE for NOT DOING IT. NO EXCUSE. NO EXCUUUUSE!

Why the FUCK should THREE PEOPLE (OR MORE) have to sit and WAIT for more people to join an entirely new multiparty just because ONE DICKHEAD decided to be a DICKHEAD? Or for EIGHT OTHER PLAYERS to be inconvenienced by ONE GUY who lacks the COMMON DECENCY to not be a DICKWEED.

I AM INCREDIBLY INCENSED BY THIS RIDICULOUS "DEFENSE" AND REFUSE TO LET GO OF THE SHIFT KEY. YOU HAVE CROSSED THE LINE.

STOP DEFENDING IDIOCY. THERE IS NO DEFENDING IDIOCY. THERE IS NO DEFENDING IDIOCY. THERE IS NO DEFENDING IDIOCY! STOP THAT. IT IS PHYSICALLY PAINFUL TO READ.

THE INCONVENIENCE OF READING THIS POST IN ALL CAPS IS NOT EVEN CLOSE TO THE LEVEL OF INCONVENIENCE CAUSED BY THAT ONE DICKHEAD.

APPLY HIGHER STANDARDS TO YOURSELF AND EVERYONE YOU MEET. THE WORLD WILL BE BETTER OFF FOR IT. IF YOU CANNOT DO THAT, YOU INVITE THIS SORT OF IDIOCY UPON YOURSELF. IT REALLY IS THAT SIMPLE.

SO STOP DEFENDING IDIOCY.

STOP IT.

NO REALLY. STOP IT!

[Enforcer MKV]

[SPOILER-BOX]
OH MY GOD THIS IS INCREDIBLY STUPID.

No. Screw that. It's SO EASY to just LOCK YOUR DAMN GAME that there is ZERO EXCUSE for NOT DOING IT. NO EXCUSE. NO EXCUUUUSE!

Why the FUCK should THREE PEOPLE (OR MORE) have to sit and WAIT for more people to join an entirely new multiparty just because ONE DICKHEAD decided to be a DICKHEAD? Or for EIGHT OTHER PLAYERS to be inconvenienced by ONE GUY who lacks the COMMON DECENCY to not be a DICKWEED.

I AM INCREDIBLY INCENSED BY THIS RIDICULOUS "DEFENSE" AND REFUSE TO LET GO OF THE SHIFT KEY. YOU HAVE CROSSED THE LINE.

STOP DEFENDING IDIOCY. THERE IS NO DEFENDING IDIOCY. THERE IS NO DEFENDING IDIOCY. THERE IS NO DEFENDING IDIOCY! STOP THAT. IT IS PHYSICALLY PAINFUL TO READ.

THE INCONVENIENCE OF READING THIS POST IN ALL CAPS IS NOT EVEN CLOSE TO THE LEVEL OF INCONVENIENCE CAUSED BY THAT ONE DICKHEAD.

APPLY HIGHER STANDARDS TO YOURSELF AND EVERYONE YOU MEET. THE WORLD WILL BE BETTER OFF FOR IT. IF YOU CANNOT DO THAT, YOU INVITE THIS SORT OF IDIOCY UPON YOURSELF. IT REALLY IS THAT SIMPLE.

SO STOP DEFENDING IDIOCY.

STOP IT.

NO REALLY. STOP IT![/SPOILER-BOX]

Woah. o.o;

Okay, people, lock it down.....

Zyru, you seem stressed. I mean more than usual....

[Gardios]

I AM INCREDIBLY INCENSED BY THIS RIDICULOUS "DEFENSE" AND REFUSE TO LET GO OF THE SHIFT KEY. YOU HAVE CROSSED THE LINE.

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/68/207148984_e22b7668f4.jpg

But seriously, just lock up yer MPAs, dudes.

[gigawuts]

[SPOILER-BOX]http://farm1.static.flickr.com/68/207148984_e22b7668f4.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]

But seriously, just lock up yer MPAs, dudes.

As I said, that doesn't work. If you advertise the password people just join up and bring bots if they feel like it.

[Lyric]

Zyru is completely correct, all with glorious caps.

How about just making certain blocks automatically lock NPC parties from Multi-party areas since people can't take two seconds of their time to mash their hands on the keyboard for a password and click a check box before starting a mission? Do this in conjunction with an update designating certain lobbies as NPC areas.

I lock mine all of the time when I bring NPC characters. This takes no effort to do. If people can't do that then something simple like what I said above would work, no? Everyone needs their hand to be held these days...

[Carillon]

I just don't understand how some people can be so against the idea of multi-parties and think it's ruining their experience of the game.


because the rewards for doing it are so far out of line with everything else (especially considering how easy it is)

it's not so much that they exist, as that they're not balanced correctly with the rest of the game.

boss runs are pointless. time attack is a joke. very few client orders give enough anything to care about leaving the area to "reload" (or to do at all, once you cap). the story/matterboard is a steaming pile of crap, offering up nothing unique at all. Speed runs are punished by the mechanics of how loot is handed out.

having one thing be the best thing for everything is bad for the game.

[Arika]

If they insist on being jerks and won't boot NPCs when asked, there's not much else I could do, I guess. I'll have to deal with it until they move to English version.

Midori, in lobby-11, I don't think anyone dare to use NPC, if it is not for rush to boss. so you can do it there I think. It has been so long that I never seen NPC to roam in multi party. Most of the party lock password with requirement to get in anyway. (from JP time perspective, never seen NPC join in multi for a month already)


About suggestion to have more enemy spawn in multi area.
I don't think that is a good solution. Because that would make item to drop even more and make better meseta, therefore, shift the momentum between single pt to multi pt to even worse rate. (currently it is already 3x reward or more/hour. If want more challenge, it is better that they make monsters stronger instead. with same drop rate.)

Anyhow, this is always the problem that SEGA have in any of their game. They could try their best to balance all mission and all method to make nothing best, and that would allow players to enjoy the game for the longest period. But they always not be able to balance it well, and have some mission or method that grant 3x of the reward and make everybody spam it until players starting to quit. Toward the future was the flaw in PSO, White beast was the flaw in PSU, and MPA is the flaw here. Fortunately tho, there are many missions for MPA, so it is not as bad as it used to be at those games. Still, it is pointless to even have single party mission, if there reward is so suck. They need to make it more useful.

[KEV1N]

If they insist on being jerks and won't boot NPCs when asked, there's not much else I could do, I guess. I'll have to deal with it until they move to English version.

Are you implying it's only foreign players taking NPCs into multiparty maps?

HAHAHAHA!!

Oh wow.

[ScottyMango]

When I ventured out of block 20 to find multiparties, a good 80% of the games were filled with like 6 bots and 2 players... so yeah lol, Japanese people do it just as much, if not more.

I love Japan and its culture, but those people who hold it next to godliness are just obnoxious.

[Garnet_Moon]

NPCs are more reliable in an MPA than most people you bump into. We're all going counter clockwise, while swinging off to the outside dead ends in our MPA tour, and some people go in reverse, ignore the dead ends(which the mob of people are going to), or just follow on people and don't do a damn thing.

I'll take 3 bots who I know will follow me with the main group in the right path over 3 idiots who want to do things their own way.

[ScottyMango]

Yeah (correct me if I'm wrong here) but don't bots have zero effect on spawn-rate, which is the entire point of MPAs?

More players = more spawns = more drops/money.
More bots = same spawns/sameblahblah.

[MelancholyWitch]

I think there just needs to be longer maps/missions, only 3 areas with quick access to the next area is what's killing it, yeah it's fun to farm and make tons of Meseta hoping to get lucky for a rare, but how many people are actually doing runs of a certain mission for a certain rare? Maybe some are doing that but most are just farming Area 1 of FI, if the maps were much longer and not as spread out, more closer to each other, (multiple rooms instead of wide areas) then I think that most would just run missions over and over again instead of farming multiparty.

[IndigoNovember]

Yeah (correct me if I'm wrong here) but don't bots have zero effect on spawn-rate, which is the entire point of MPAs?

More players = more spawns = more drops/money.
More bots = same spawns/sameblahblah.

Japanese wiki says a bot = 7/10 of a player if I'm reading this correctly. Plus I can attest to getting more spawns with 3 bots than by myself.

[Zyrusticae]

When I ventured out of block 20 to find multiparties, a good 80% of the games were filled with like 6 bots and 2 players... so yeah lol, Japanese people do it just as much, if not more.

I love Japan and its culture, but those people who hold it next to godliness are just obnoxious.
Fortunately, most of those players are not getting into parties explicitly marked in their description as "No NPCs allowed".

Actually, it would be nice if the English players would also adopt the practice of putting a password on the multiparty with the pass in the description to keep out random solo players. (And making them complicated English words so JP players can't get in OH WAIT *totally not bitter - fuggin' KANJI!!*).

[Mystil]

..Am I the only one that just plays because it's fun and not specifically playing to hunt rares..? Or even farm..

[Sizustar]

..Am I the only one that just plays because it's fun and not specifically playing to hunt rares..? Or even farm..

Everyone have different idea on what's fun.

Whether that's hunting specific rare for self or friend.
Trying to get as high damage,
Just fighting monster with friends
etc.

[sugarFO]

..Am I the only one that just plays because it's fun and not specifically playing to hunt rares..? Or even farm..

I'm starting to only log on just to help my friends (or friends of friends) do stuff. Lol. There's like nothing to accomplish on my character atm.

[NoiseHERO]

I just log in to play dress up and punch space demons then go home.

[Sparzyle]

I just log in to play dress up and punch space demons then go home.
^This.

[Xaeris]

I log in to have fun.

Excuse me, I misspoke. That should be, I log in to get FUN.

[Chik'Tikka]

I just log in to play dress up and punch space demons then go home.

remember back when i said i wouldn't use your bot no more??? well, i like you again+^_^+ so ima use you bot in missions again+^_^+

[Mystil]

Everyone have different idea on what's fun.

Whether that's hunting specific rare for self or friend.
Trying to get as high damage,
Just fighting monster with friends
etc.
I can see why you said that(am referring to the first line), but I don't think like the majority here. Whatever is fun for them, go for it. No one has a right to take that away. It's not all that fun, when I kill mobs by myself, but it is something I like to do. Games like Warriors Orochi, etc(your basic beat em up games) is what I love. I don't wont to be stressed out trying to find rares. I've had my fill of that with PSOver1. The comments in this thread, especially the OP, baffles me. It's like nothing they do is fun at all to them and that the game is nothing but a large fault with hardly anything about it that creates fun-factor. Talks like these have been commonplace for as long as I can remember. In PSU it was worse. I don't get it. What will it take to satisfy players?

[Fox2Tails]

I log in to have fun.

Excuse me, I misspoke. That should be, I log in to get FUN.

This.

[Coatl]

I can see why you said that(am referring to the first line), but I don't think like the majority here. Whatever is fun for them, go for it. No one has a right to take that away. It's not all that fun, when I kill mobs by myself, but it is something I like to do. Games like Warriors Orochi, etc(your basic beat em up games) is what I love. I don't wont to be stressed out trying to find rares. I've had my fill of that with PSOver1. The comments in this thread, especially the OP, baffles me. It's like nothing they do is fun at all to them and that the game is nothing but a large fault with hardly anything about it that creates fun-factor. Talks like these have been commonplace for as long as I can remember. In PSU it was worse. I don't get it. What will it take to satisfy players?





I have plenty of FUN on PSO2 just killing stuff and doing some boss runs with my friends. ;p
MPs are really fun too sometimes. We had three, yes three Quartz dragons spawn consecutively in floaty islands just the other day and they would one-shot anyone who wasn't built like a tank. I saw 900 damage being inflicted a few times there. Was really fun. x3

That's what I like about PSO2. Farming doesn't feel like work like most MMOs make it feel. Getting better gear doesn't feel like a necessity, just something to do when you want to feel more optimal. And if you don't have the best gear, no worries, no one will kick you out of their party for it. You can just chill out and enjoy yourself, without anything over your head.

[Ryoten]

Well there is an option to play the mission without meeting others *well only friends* in MPAs. *just putting that out there*

[Zyrusticae]

I can't help but feel that it is incredibly silly to want soloing to be viable as a means of getting loot in this inherently multiplayer-focused game.

Certainly, boss runs could be encouraged better (easy fix - just make bosses drop more at the end of runs), and there could be more variety in the events, but if MPAs are boring, it's probably more likely that they just need to be fixed to be more entertaining rather than the focus being shifted to some other part of the game.

I see absolutely nothing wrong with MPAs being the big focus of the game, or for developers to encourage players to play with other players as much as they possibly can. People should want to play with others, and it should be fun to do so. If someone wants to solo... fortunately, they can, but they are gimping themselves (in more ways than one) to do it. The whole point of soloing in this game is exclusively for the challenge of doing so, or because you can't find actual people to play with, nothing more. No one should ever expect to be able to keep up with loot from a MPA running solo - how the hell would it be fair for one guy soloing to out-loot 12 people working together? Seriously, now.

I blame the wave of solo-happy MMOs for engendering players who think it should be a focus of inherently multiplayer-focused games. Recognize a game for what it is, rather than what you think it should be. The devs will most likely have a different idea.

[gigawuts]

I find literally nothing wrong with an MMO trying to appeal to more audiences than those that love to pack in as many sardines players to a map as possible.

In fact, I dare say it's a good strategy to appeal to a wider audience.

Part of appealing to a wider audience is to literally make the game appealing. That means balance and fairness.

[Zyrusticae]

Certainly, but it remains completely unrealistic to expect to be able to gear up by soloing in a multiplayer RPG. Or at least, not with any efficiency.

I can't think of a single one that actually lets solo players keep up with groups. I would think there would be much, much rage to be had if one could.

[gigawuts]

Well I'm not saying that it should be the same, but it should be possible to a degree.

Which it is.

I play solo and make plenty of money to buy what I need to stay decently geared up. It's the affixes where I get shafted and simply can't afford the "standard" soul+atkIII on even one thing.

And I'm not really bothered by that, if I was I'd be in a 12 player MPA getting money to throw at the void that is the RNG.

[Carillon]

Certainly, but it remains completely unrealistic to expect to be able to gear up by soloing in a multiplayer RPG. Or at least, not with any efficiency.

I can't think of a single one that actually lets solo players keep up with groups. I would think there would be much, much rage to be had if one could.

Guild Wars.
Elsword.

I'm sure there's plenty of others.

[youcantcatchtheblue]

My hopes of finding rares keeps me going~

I love the thrill when a red item drops, so i need my weekly fix of rares =P

[Zyrusticae]

[spoiler-box]Well I'm not saying that it should be the same, but it should be possible to a degree.

Which it is.

I play solo and make plenty of money to buy what I need to stay decently geared up. It's the affixes where I get shafted and simply can't afford the "standard" soul+atkIII on even one thing.

And I'm not really bothered by that, if I was I'd be in a 12 player MPA getting money to throw at the void that is the RNG.[/spoiler-box]
Yeah, that's pretty much how it is. I just don't see the point of complaining that you're not doing it as well as a full party of players.



Guild Wars.
Elsword.

I'm sure there's plenty of others.
Didn't play either.

Every single bog-standard WoW/EQ-style MMO (and there are a LOT of them) have all of the top-end gear coming from the 12-or-more-players raids. Even group instances don't drop stuff as good.

Guild Wars 2 outright encourages you to play with others as much as humanly possible since rewards actually improve when you play with others. There's no benefit to running solo.

[Flame]

I can't help but feel that it is incredibly silly to want soloing to be viable as a means of getting loot in this inherently multiplayer-focused game.

Certainly, boss runs could be encouraged better (easy fix - just make bosses drop more at the end of runs), and there could be more variety in the events, but if MPAs are boring, it's probably more likely that they just need to be fixed to be more entertaining rather than the focus being shifted to some other part of the game.

I see absolutely nothing wrong with MPAs being the big focus of the game, or for developers to encourage players to play with other players as much as they possibly can. People should want to play with others, and it should be fun to do so. If someone wants to solo... fortunately, they can, but they are gimping themselves (in more ways than one) to do it. The whole point of soloing in this game is exclusively for the challenge of doing so, or because you can't find actual people to play with, nothing more. No one should ever expect to be able to keep up with loot from a MPA running solo - how the hell would it be fair for one guy soloing to out-loot 12 people working together? Seriously, now.

I blame the wave of solo-happy MMOs for engendering players who think it should be a focus of inherently multiplayer-focused games. Recognize a game for what it is, rather than what you think it should be. The devs will most likely have a different idea.

For me the reason is that while MPA is fun, it involves little to no skill what so ever. It's basically chaos. Most of the time I'm not even sure what I'm shooting at. Maybe the answer is stronger enemies or smarter enemies that use area of effect attacks that force players to spread out? I like multiplayer as the focus but with the current gameplay pacing there's barely any team work or coordination which is the most satisfying part of co-op play in the first place.

[Spellbinder]

Let's not forget we haven't even gotten a very hard mode, let alone an ultimate mode if this game follows in its predecessor's footsteps. Hard mode wasn't exactly intimidating in PSO1 either.

[Laxedrane]

Let's not forget we haven't even gotten a very hard mode, let alone an ultimate mode if this game follows in its predecessor's footsteps. Hard mode wasn't exactly intimidating in PSO1 either.

This. I remember my first trek into very hard and going :-o at the fact the enemies had double the movement speed.

[Macman]

..Am I the only one that just plays because it's fun and not specifically playing to hunt rares..? Or even farm..
I play to help newbie friends for now. All my capped friends are taking a hiatus until the next update, and pubbing is meh at best.

[Mystil]

I'm leaning towards a yes to that question. I'm capped, but I've never set goals in the game(and in FFXI the only goal I had was to beat Serket and that took 6 years to accomplish) and I'm not "waiting" for updates - I don't play for updates. If I did that, there is no point in me playing any online game. I play for the fun of it. I don't know how to put that in a more understandable way.

Edit: Ninja'd and stand corrected.

[Enforcer MKV]

..Am I the only one that just plays because it's fun and not specifically playing to hunt rares..? Or even farm..

No, I do that too. Usually the best way for me.

On the other side of the token, farming and hunting rares IS fun for some people. There's nothing wrong or weird about it, it's just another way of playing.

[Lostbob117]

Oh man people bitching about bots again...

[gravityvx]

My fun diminished after over a month of hunting for Andiru still no drop. Haven't been playing very much anymore. My hunters been using a +10 Vol sword since like a few days after the damn thing was put into the game, and literally no other sword has dropped since then, cept maybe 6 or 7 tuna. -_-

[moorebounce]

I love the MPAs because once you hit level 30 the clients order exp goes up but not enough. Do a few emergency quests and you're at level 40 before you know it.

I get a few pieces a armor to drop but as far as weapons go I get a ass load of freakin Braolet gunslashes. I have like 8 of them just sitting in my bank needing tekked. I wish I could sell them before having them tekked. I might as well toss them because nobody even buy them anymore.

[Blundy]

I dont think the idea of MPA's are bad, just the execution, if that many players are on the map together they should get completely overwhelmed with so many things that they'll have their backs to the wall trying to slaughter it all.

I think the city missions are pretty good about getting this vibe across.

[Silver Crow]

I dont think the idea of MPA's are bad, just the execution, if that many players are on the map together they should get completely overwhelmed with so many things that they'll have their backs to the wall trying to slaughter it all.

I think the city missions are pretty good about getting this vibe across.

city missions are definitely more fun but they could use harder content too... it's just way too silly when a ranger puts weakbullet on a weakspot, 12 people on a weakbulleted weakspot with the top end rangers doing 9999 dmg etc..

[sexyslut]

It doesnt matter how much hp you put on the boss if theres 12 ppl fighting it at once.

[TaigaUC]

Didn't read through the entire topic, but as a game designer, I personally feel that relying on progression (equipment, levelling, etc) inevitably leads to boredom.

This game also has a clear imbalance between solo and partying. Partying is too easy and boring, but extremely rewarding. Solo is difficult but has virtually no rewards. I also want to state that I am always against "nerfing". It's always better to raise the bar of everything else to match the imbalance, rather than to send people backwards.

[Panzaera]

Sorry for that question, but what does MPA stand for? :)

[Darki]

Didn't read through the entire topic, but as a game designer, I personally feel that relying on progression (equipment, levelling, etc) inevitably leads to boredom.

This game also has a clear imbalance between solo and partying. Partying is too easy and boring, but extremely rewarding. Solo is difficult but has virtually no rewards. I also want to state that I am always against "nerfing". It's always better to raise the bar of everything else to match the imbalance, rather than to send people backwards.

Well, personally, I'm of the oppinion thst the game should try to appeal to both solo and party players, but considering that this is a "massive multiplayer online" game, I believe the game should encourage the socialization -without trying to shove it down our throats.

I agree with what you said about partying being too easy. Partying should be much more diffiicult in comparision to soloing, but taking in account that there are going to be more than 1 players there killing the same stuff. If you can solo a mission and a boss with relative ease, 4 people (12 in MPAs) wouldn't have any hard times with it.

Increasing monster spawn when there are many players together doesn't help much if they're as weak as usually. I think the "easiest" solution would be that each player had some sort of permanent AoE around them that would cause all newly spawned monsters inside to have a good stat boost to match the threat. So if there are two players, those AoEs would overlap and give the monster twice that boost, and so on.


Sorry for that question, but what does MPA stand for? :)

Multy Party Area.

[Angelo]

Hate to get all tinfoil hat here... but I honestly feel like the main reason MPAs are boring is because of Launchers.

They need to be toned down.

[Coatl]

Hate to get all tinfoil hat here... but I honestly feel like the main reason MPAs are boring is because of Launchers.

They need to be toned down.

Gigrants aren't any better.

[Arika]

SEGA won't be able to hear your opinion by posting it here, so...


since player survey is up: http://www.pso-world.com/forums/showthread.php?t=200330

If anyone want them to make single party (4 people) become as reward as MPA. Then put this in your comment:

マルチパーティーエリアは今一番メセタを稼ぎやすい場所なのでみんながそこに溜まってしまいま す。　シング ルパーティーエリアでしかできないこととか何かマルチパーティーエリアで溜まりにくくする方法 をPSO2に 追加してほしい。

That is all.

[Spellbinder]

SEGA won't be able to hear your opinion by posting it here, so...


since player survey is up: http://www.pso-world.com/forums/showthread.php?t=200330

If anyone want them to make single party (4 people) become as reward as MPA. Then put this in your comment:

マルチパーティーエリアは今一番メセタを稼ぎやすい場所なのでみんながそこに溜まってしまいま す。　シング ルパーティーエリアでしかできないこととか何かマルチパーティーエリアで溜まりにくくする方法 をPSO2に 追加してほしい。

That is all.

I appreciate your wanting there to be unique things in single party areas, but your ending piece sounds like a call to nerf multi party areas, so I can't agree with having people blindly paste that in without knowing what they're asking SEGA to do.

[Darki]

I don't want a single party as rewarding as MPA. Why would we MPA then?

I just want MPAs HARD. Most times when I play a hunter and I'm not using Sonic Arrow or Speed Rain I don't even touch anything.

I'd prefer that the mission dificulty varies depending on the number of players on the map.

[Slidikins]

Well, personally, I'm of the oppinion thst the game should try to appeal to both solo and party players, but considering that this is a "massive multiplayer online" game, I believe the game should encourage the socialization -without trying to shove it down our throats.I think PSO did this well with the mixture between online play and solo quests, but PSO2 decided to follow the PSU structure. Story exposition and quest rewards were the reward for solo'ing back then, but now rewards come in one flavor and MPA gives the most of it.


I agree with what you said about partying being too easy. Partying should be much more diffiicult in comparision to soloing, but taking in account that there are going to be more than 1 players there killing the same stuff. If you can solo a mission and a boss with relative ease, 4 people (12 in MPAs) wouldn't have any hard times with it.

Increasing monster spawn when there are many players together doesn't help much if they're as weak as usually. I think the "easiest" solution would be that each player had some sort of permanent AoE around them that would cause all newly spawned monsters inside to have a good stat boost to match the threat. So if there are two players, those AoEs would overlap and give the monster twice that boost, and so on.PSO gave the monsters a hearty boost "online" that helped even the field a bit. Perhaps SEGA could re-implement that health bonus (if they haven't already). Other games have some magical algorithm, but why change things at all? As a player you have access to NPC partners, friend partners, boosting drinks... just make the enemies at one strength outside of story missions and let it be.

If you want the challenge of solo'ing it'll still be there with the same rewards, but you'll still be more efficient if you choose to socialize and play with other people.

[Coatl]

I don't want a single party as rewarding as MPA. Why would we MPA then?

I just want MPAs HARD. Most times when I play a hunter and I'm not using Sonic Arrow or Speed Rain I don't even touch anything.

I'd prefer that the mission dificulty varies depending on the number of players on the map.

I am hoping very hard mode will actually be, you know, harder.
Hard mode as it is now should just be called more HP mode.

[Cyrusnagisa]

I like how when this question is asked, and the logical, rational answer of "play something else for a while" is given, people act like it is a sin ;p

[gigawuts]

I like how when this question is asked, and the logical, rational answer of "play something else for a while" is given, people act like it is a sin ;p

Why shouldn't a game try to appeal to all of its players? Why should it never ever change?

[Angelo]

I don't want a single party as rewarding as MPA. Why would we MPA then?

I just want MPAs HARD. Most times when I play a hunter and I'm not using Sonic Arrow or Speed Rain I don't even touch anything.

I'd prefer that the mission dificulty varies depending on the number of players on the map.

Yeah, to be honest I'm not understanding this mentality. It's like people who want to reap the same rewards for soloing as opposed to a team.

I don't think the problem is MPAs themselves.

[Kanivakil]

This game does become boring after awhile of playing it. The best option is to place the game asides for awhile and come back to it in the near future. If you are one of those players that play numerous hours in one setting, make sure that you limit that time. It takes discipline, but it's probably the best solution for those who have a love and hate relationship with the game.

[gigawuts]

Well, a lot of us are the kind that could play PSO1 for 10+ hours a day 7 days a week if given the opportunity. School breaks, etc.

But I think what made that possible was the map design. That's what made it enjoyable for me, anyway.

[Ezodagrom]

I don't want a single party as rewarding as MPA. Why would we MPA then?

I just want MPAs HARD. Most times when I play a hunter and I'm not using Sonic Arrow or Speed Rain I don't even touch anything.

I'd prefer that the mission dificulty varies depending on the number of players on the map.
This, in my opinion the problem with MPAs is that everything dies way too fast with alot of players.

[Vashyron]

Interesting.

My problem with Multiparties is just that it is Mindless killing of trash enemies that don't exactly fight back.

Even if you somehow manage to die, be it to a boss or whatever, what exactly is the penalty with 11 people around to res you? While I don't actually want some huge penalty currently it just adds onto the boredom by throwing out a possible incentive to not die and pay attention.

Plus this being the most rewarding and easiest task to do, where exactly is my incentive to be doing these to upgrade my equipment when even cheap 5* weaponry works very well here? Time Attack? E-peen? Meseta to dress up my character all pretty? Just for the sake of it?
I don't see any reason so far that actually makes me enjoy them. Though I will say I did enjoy MPA at first as it was a nice novelty, but it wore off.

What I would like to see is scaling with MPAs, no not by adding more trash enemies that die instantly when spawned, but by increasing aggressiveness in their AI and increasing their stats. Possibly scaled by how many people are in X grid part of the current Map. (Or any good scaling idea which would not annoy players which are scattered about and just passing trough.)

It's a shame, I actually like the battle mechanics the game has, just not the challenge it throws out. It may improve in the future sure, but after seeing the route they are going with nerfing the Story bosses I'm not too hopeful.

[Zyrusticae]

Seriously, they don't need more attack power. They only need more opportunities to use it, and perhaps more stagger resistance.

I already get hit for 100+ on my Force... when she only has 400 HP, and is wearing the best +10'd units available to her. I think it would be horrifically overkill if I died in two hits from trash mobs.

[Coatl]

I feel like asking for smarter AI is a bit too much to hope for though.
A bit overly ambitious even.

[gigawuts]

I feel like enemies should stop doing 100 meter dashes backwards every time I try to follow them after one backwards leap. Jesus christ stop leaping backwards seven goddamn times and let me hit you learn to attack jesus.

Honestly, all I want to fix MPA's:
Less stun (For EVERYTHING - it is NOT fun stunlocking 15 enemies and it is NOT fun BEING stunlocked by 15 enemies that happened to aggro on you, just another way hunters get the shaft for having to get close with only another 200-300 hp)
Scaling HP based on player count in adjacent grids (When enemies spawn players one grid away = half of a player in the actual grid) or
For each additional enemy spawned, change that to +1 level of enemies spawning (I believe level affects rare droprate - if it doesn't, make it so it does to make up for the reduced number of enemies)
Remove the lifting effect from divine launcher, it's already far too rewarding to spam between its damage and that lift (even for 40 PP), put the lifting effect on either rodeo drive or cluster bullet

Then give the story quests difficulties with alternate paths to force spawns of certain enemies. Not chance of spawns, forced spawns. Make them the offline mode of PSO1. MPA's would have more enemies in total with better rewards, but when it comes to farming one specific enemy (discounting the enemies with uber rares, such as ford ran with its ardillou). Give bosses the uberest rares again

Oh yeah, and for the love of christ start making souls useful on that boss's rare. No more ragne soul on ragne answerer kind of shit, that's just awful. More stuff like the quartz dragon and its wired lances and vol dragon with its vol scale sword.

Then shift most uber rares to bosses to give a reason to actually fight them.

[Vashyron]

Seriously, they don't need more attack power. They only need more opportunities to use it, and perhaps more stagger resistance.

I already get hit for 100+ on my Force... when she only has 400 HP, and is wearing the best +10'd units available to her. I think it would be horrifically overkill if I died in two hits from trash mobs.

Understandable.

Though from how I see it in theory as a Force you should be cautions and trying to not get hit at all instead of absorbing hits. If changes were done on enemy AI to be way more aggressive, plus heavy hitting hits (Emphasis on both Ranged attacks and attacks without tells), I would understand complaints about it.


I feel like asking for smarter AI is a bit too much to hope for though.
A bit overly ambitious even.

Even the simplest AI is effective, remember what Booma AI consisted of in PSO?
Make a beeline to the player, then attack when close enough. It worked well for the game despite being so simple. Then there were enemies with AI closer to what we have now, such as Savage Wolves that danced around the player and attacked.

I never found them as threatening as the enemies that made a beeline to the player and/or those that constantly attacked when in range.

Though this would not work well being this simple in PSO2 though thanks to dodging and being incredibly predictable. It would need to be mixed up a bit, but I would already find it a improvement.

[Arika]

I don't want a single party as rewarding as MPA. Why would we MPA then?


I would reply the same that if MPA is rewarding as 5 times of single party, then why would people play party then?

It is a lot easier to join random MPA run than calling 3 friend to make party too. You can also leave any time when u want to log off from it! MPA is much more flexible, more accessible, higher reward and easier compare to making a normal party. (this is out of choice)

For short:

Oh yes, it's great when the most boring and mindless thing to do is the most rewarding.
This should explain enough how OP it is.


As what it should be from my suggest in JP : make reward equal 1 to 1 reward, nothing should be better.

A. Log in -> see no friends or lazy to bother them -> join random MPA party -> enjoy -> log off whenever.

B. Log in -> ask friend to come for full party -> start ur party and play with friend -> log off together with friends.

So it is depend on your mood of the day whether you wanna call party with friend(B) or join in MPA straight away (A). that is a real choice that both equal good. and what it should be.

For those who worry that if thing is equal then nobody will do MPA, no worry about it. Because Japanese culture trend to rely more on random people rather than call for friends. Majority will favorite MPA way regardless. (log in quick -> play quick -> log off without involve friend = what they love)

[Darki]

Understandable.

Though from how I see it in theory as a Force you should be cautions and trying to not get hit at all instead of absorbing hits. If changes were done on enemy AI to be way more aggressive, plus heavy hitting hits (Emphasis on both Ranged attacks and attacks without tells), I would understand complaints about it.

The problem is that as a force you're encouraged to be in melee range, at least to a certain degree. Rangers don't need to get closer to their targets unless they wanna make sure they're hitting the enemy in the right place, but they can reload PP from as far as they can use their PAs. In the other hand, Forces are given a tech weapon that has to be recharged by melee damage. It's true that you can switch to gunslash or talis to do so, but the thing is that many techs also require you to be in closer range.

As Zyru said, they don't need more attack power. The problem is that "hard mode" seems to mean just that literally, a mode where things "hit harder" and that's all. If you go to a MPA depending on your class and weapon you might not even touch 80% of the monsters because when you get to them they're already dead. When I play as a Hunter in city missions, unless I do Sonic Arrow I barely touch anything, and as a Force, I can't even try to use Gigrants most of the time and have to end using Rafoie constantly so I can hit stuff.


I would reply the same that if MPA is rewarding as 5 times of single party, then why would people play party then?

It is a lot easier to join random MPA run than calling 3 friend to make party too. You can also leave any time when u want to log off from it! MPA is much more flexible, more accessible, higher reward and easier compare to making a normal party. (this is out of choice)

For short:


Oh yes, it's great when the most boring and mindless thing to do is the most rewarding.

This should explain enough how OP it is.

As what it should be from my suggest in JP : make reward equal 1 to 1 reward, nothing should be better.

A. Log in -> see no friends or lazy to bother them -> join random MPA party -> enjoy -> log off whenever.

B. Log in -> ask friend to come for full party -> start ur party and play with friend -> log off together with friends.

So it is depend on your mood of the day whether you wanna call party with friend(B) or join in MPA straight away (A). that is a real choice that both equal good. and what it should be.

For those who worry that if thing is equal then nobody will do MPA, no worry about it. Because Japanese culture trend to rely more on random people rather than call for friends. Majority will favorite MPA way regardless. (log in quick -> play quick -> log off without involve friend = what they love)

I'm sorry but I don't see any sense on that. For me is just obvious that a mission with three times the size of a single party would be more rewarding than the later. The problem is not the rewards. In fact I believe the rewards are fine. This game should encourage multipartying, because that's why it's a MULTIPLAYER game.

On your quote from Vashyron you actually picked the "rewarding" part and forgot about the "boring" part. The problem, as has been stated, is the difficulty. A party of 4 people can already wipe everything short of a bos in less than 10 seconds, a full MPA can destroy a boss in less than 30 if well done. THAT is the wrong part.

Missions should escalate the dificulty based on the number of players, giving the monsters more HP and stagger defense so they might survive a barrage of 3 Gigrants, 2 Divine Launchers and 4 Sonic Arrows for a bit more than 2 seconds. And bosses should have a similar bonus so a multy party wouldn't kill them in 30 seconds flat.

For shorts: MPA of course should be more rewarding than single parties or soloing. What it shouldn't be is so easy that it ends being boring as fuck.

[Cyrusnagisa]

Why shouldn't a game try to appeal to all of its players? Why should it never ever change?

Did I say that at all in my post? No..... The game is not "finished" it was released early as a cash grab, some do not want to accept this, but it is true. The "end game" if that is what you would call it in a type of game like this, is not here yet.

So logically, if you are getting bored, take a break, play something else, and come back a little later, or play a bit more sparingly while weaving other games into your game time.

[gigawuts]

Stagger defense is something I dearly want implemented as a hunter skill, and certain enemies added that effectively have it maxed out.

Don't necessarily completely eliminate it, but don't have it interrupt PA charging and reduce the amount of time you're stunned. Also, convert the complete knockdown to a stagger after a certain point.

[Arika]

I'm sorry but I don't see any sense on that. For me is just obvious that a mission with three times the size of a single party would be more rewarding than the later.

lol, don't even compare MPA to that kind of raid logic from other games.

In other MMO game, they reward more players = more gain, because it is harder to gather and organize big party. So it is for the rule of "harder to do = more reward"


In here, PSO2, it is different. you can go to the specific lobby and join any MPA you like right away, and can also leave any time you want. This is as simply as solo. It is much easier to do this than call 4 people in your team. There is no wait time, there is requirement.

True to be told, MPA is the fancy way of solo. The system actually more anti-social compare to real single party. Most people just solo in the packed of stranger that not really communicate with you. JP are often saying that PSU community were much nicer, because it force people to join into the same party of 4-6. When you got into party, you would have some basic communication at least (so I m sure that there will be people complain in this already)

Anyway, many MPA leader make a request in their room nowadays to require 3x PT of 4 instead of 12x PT of solo now to try to fix 2 issue : 1. = easier to control. 2. = bring back social. but not really work well right now, because most still favor the easiest choice of 12x solo. (just get meseta quick and go off)


So I dunno how does MPA in NA-EU way work, but in JP, they are mostly 12x of solo party that not talk unless it is to tell position. Each person log in and log off whenever they want. Easy join, easy win. truly a kind of lala hello kity land. And lol, highest reward is gain from this bullshit?

if there could be a mission that is made for 12 people size, and need everybody to join the party before start it. Then I wouldn't mind it to have best reward at all. because it would be as hard to organize as other MMO that you refer to "more people = more reward" idea. MPA is too different to compare to that.

So just wait until SEGA implement PSO2 raid or something.

[Darki]

I'm sorry again, but I don't see any sense on what you say. I'm not comparing this game to any other MMO. I'm actually comparing it with ANY multiplayer game.

In PSO2 you can also go to a specific lobby and join any party (not multiparty) you fucking want without the need of organizing it beforehand. What you're saying is, like if I said that running on a party of 2 should be more rewarding than a party of 4, because it's unfair that a party of 4 is easiest and therefore, more rewarding on the long term.

We might as well just make it solo playing more rewarding than anything else and leave partying and MPAs to "the asian mentality".

Lol, no.

My problem with MPAs is not that is more rewarding. You say that is easy to jump in a MPA and do "cake walk", but tell me, how easy is to find a decent MPA were there are no 3 players and 12 NPCs; and where they actually play in a cooperative way, sticking together with someone leading the way to maximize spawns in EC, bursts and bosses and not just running around each one in a sector like headless chickens?

For that you need as much organization as you might need to form a normal party, even more considering that you gotta bring more people. A random MPA hardly is as rewarding as you want to make it.

I repeat myself: the problem is not that MPAs are more rewarding. That for me is a given. The problem is simply that MPAs are too easy, and sometimes outright boring, compared to other game modes, because enemies die too fast. And is that rewarding simply because the only thing that gets increased in MPAs is monster spawn (therefore, drops), but monsters die too easy. If they increased the dificulty of the monsters, making them tougher, with more HP and stagger resistance, bosses included, MPAs would be probably a bit less rewarding (as monsters wouldn't die that fast so drops would pop slower), more challenging, and much more fun.

By simply doing something stupid like lowering drop rates or spawns or whatever similar things to directly making MPAs less rewarding you're just fucking off one part of the game from the wrong side. Your solution simply sounds like the typical half-assed shit that trashed PSU. It reminds me of the typical issue there: "Oh noes, melee is stronger than techs or guns, Guntechers are getting too weak, what can we do? *gives double sabers to Guntecher* "Yay problem solved!"

[Mystil]

I repeat myself: the problem is not that MPAs are more rewarding. That for me is a given. The problem is simply that MPAs are too easy, and sometimes outright boring, compared to other game modes, because enemies die too fast. And is that rewarding simply because the only thing that gets increased in MPAs is monster spawn (therefore, drops), but monsters die too easy. If they increased the dificulty of the monsters, making them tougher, with more HP and stagger resistance, bosses included, MPAs would be probably a bit less rewarding (as monsters wouldn't die that fast so drops would pop slower), more challenging, and much more fun.



..You're really convinced that this will fly well with the rest of us. I'm sorry, but it wont. While you will like that, I can imagine the amount of people who will bitch and moan about it now being too hard. This will degrade interest in MPAs, but that then falls in line with what Arika said as this will then promote single 4 person teams. However that too carries its own issue.

The system the way its set up now is probably best to stay that way.

[Zyrusticae]

..You're really convinced that this will fly well with the rest of us. I'm sorry, but it wont. While you will like that, I can imagine the amount of people who will bitch and moan about it now being too hard. This will degrade interest in MPAs, but that then falls in line with what Arika said as this will then promote single 4 person teams. However that too carries its own issue.

The system the way its set up now is probably best to stay that way.
That... makes no sense. At all.

This is not an "either or" thing. There are gradations. They can very easily strike a middle point between "braindead-easy" and "soul-crushingly difficult". Even something like 5% more HP and stagger resist per player past the first would help immensely as players would then be able to actually get attacks in before everything is dead.

I'm getting really, really tired of people jumping to extremes like this. It's a very poor mindset to have. Not everything is black and white (actually, most things aren't), and there are spaces in-between. Stop jumping to one or the other. It does no one any favors.

[Slidikins]

..You're really convinced that this will fly well with the rest of us. I'm sorry, but it wont. While you will like that, I can imagine the amount of people who will bitch and moan about it now being too hard. This will degrade interest in MPAs, but that then falls in line with what Arika said as this will then promote single 4 person teams. However that too carries its own issue.

The system the way its set up now is probably best to stay that way.I'm afraid I have to agree here with most of this. As easy as MPAs are now, you can't do much to change it. Firstly, with 12 players on the map you're going to have a huge spectrum on what to expect as far as power is concerned (e.g. a balanced party of Lv40s with amazing gear vs. 4-5 players with NPCs and mediocre gear) and you can't play around it. Secondly, with so many players difficulty will come from strategy since adding 5-10% health won't really stop the carpet bombing launchers from killing them, but it's too chaotic to introduce a strategic element. Or is it...?

There's a thought: give the MPA map E-Codes that require organization. Multiple Protect codes at once, for instance. Force the groups to split up evenly to cover everything. The challenge can still exist but the kill rate doesn't decrease, so PSEs are still possible. The number of objectives can be tied to the number of players on the map as well, so that people aren't overwhelmed if there aren't 12 people on the map.

Would something like that be better, in your opinion? Map-wide E-codes?

[Darki]

That... makes no sense. At all.

This is not an "either or" thing. There are gradations. They can very easily strike a middle point between "braindead-easy" and "soul-crushingly difficult". Even something like 5% more HP and stagger resist per player past the first would help immensely as players would then be able to actually get attacks in before everything is dead.

I'm getting really, really tired of people jumping to extremes like this. It's a very poor mindset to have. Not everything is black and white (actually, most things aren't), and there are spaces in-between. Stop jumping to one or the other. It does no one any favors.

I couldn't have said it better. People love to jump to the extremes instead of thinking in a more moderate way.


I'm afraid I have to agree here with most of this. As easy as MPAs are now, you can't do much to change it. Firstly, with 12 players on the map you're going to have a huge spectrum on what to expect as far as power is concerned (e.g. a balanced party of Lv40s with amazing gear vs. 4-5 players with NPCs and mediocre gear) and you can't play around it. Secondly, with so many players difficulty will come from strategy since adding 5-10% health won't really stop the carpet bombing launchers from killing them, but it's too chaotic to introduce a strategic element. Or is it...?

If 5% is not enough, then raise it to 20%. You're posing problems that you yourself could reason a logic and simple solution if you wanted to. Spectrum problem? Well, I didn't say that NPCs should be considered outright as "players" (as they arent). The thing is, that a game should have missions that even a team of 12 players at level 40 with awesome gear would find challenging, because if not, then, what's the use for that? We're not talking here about a single MPA, there are many, that can (and should) vary in dificulty.

If the most difficult mission in the game now can be wiped clean by a multiparty to the point that some peple might not even touch some of the monsters, then I'm sorry, but you gotta give me that there might be a neccesity to scale enemy dificulty to the number of players, so that some of the players can actually touch stuff.


There's a thought: give the MPA map E-Codes that require organization. Multiple Protect codes at once, for instance. Force the groups to split up evenly to cover everything. The challenge can still exist but the kill rate doesn't decrease, so PSEs are still possible. The number of objectives can be tied to the number of players on the map as well, so that people aren't overwhelmed if there aren't 12 people on the map.

Would something like that be better, in your opinion? Map-wide E-codes?

But why should that be the only solution? I like codes like Protect, or Burst with tons of people killing monsters in the same area, what I don't like is that I can't touch anything sometimes because things die too fast.

You have already codes like what you're mentioning, for example you have Code Protect, with the crystals, where people must split to 4+ places to do stuff, and I don't see missions where this code pops to get better as you believe.

[Mystil]

That... makes no sense. At all.

This is not an "either or" thing. There are gradations. They can very easily strike a middle point between "braindead-easy" and "soul-crushingly difficult". Even something like 5% more HP and stagger resist per player past the first would help immensely as players would then be able to actually get attacks in before everything is dead.

I'm getting really, really tired of people jumping to extremes like this. It's a very poor mindset to have. Not everything is black and white (actually, most things aren't), and there are spaces in-between. Stop jumping to one or the other. It does no one any favors.

An extreme? It isn't an extreme..

This is from experience.. It's not something I made up. People will complain about it being too hard. They will desire it to be either toned down or reverted back to the way it was. Really, is PSO2 the only MMO you've played in you entire life? Please don't answer that. It's a rhetorical question. Stick with what works.

@Darki


By simply doing something stupid like lowering drop rates or spawns or whatever similar things to directly making MPAs less rewarding you're just fucking off one part of the game from the wrong side. Your solution simply sounds like the typical half-assed shit that trashed PSU. It reminds me of the typical issue there: "Oh noes, melee is stronger than techs or guns, Guntechers are getting too weak, what can we do? *gives double sabers to Guntecher* "Yay problem solved!"Speaking of PSU;
A lot of those game killing ideas were thought up by you players, ya see, Devs do listen to a certain extent. They didn't add that shit on their own. As Sting in TNA would say, TATA for now!

[Darki]

An extreme? It isn't an extreme..

This is from experience.. It's not something I made up. People will complain about it being too hard. They will desire it to be either toned down or reverted back to the way it was. Really, is PSO2 the only MMO you've played in you entire life? Please don't answer that. It's a rhetorical question. Stick with what works.

So, you're saying that is better to have people complaining already, anyways, that MPAs are too easy and rewarding, and that because of that, we should leave them as they are so people complain about that instead of complaining about the new mechanics? You know, if people are going to complain anyways, what makes you think that them complaining about this is going to be better than complaining about that? Because, now, is not that they will, is actually that they do desire it to be changed. We are in that situation already. Maybe the ones who didn't play enough MMOs are not us.

Also, you say "stick with what works". But does it work? For me joining a MPA where half the time I can't reach the enemies alive is not the most accurate definition of "working", y'know.


Speaking of PSU;
A lot of those game killing ideas were thought up by you players, ya see, Devs do listen to a certain extent. They didn't add that shit on their own. As Sting in TNA would say, TATA for now!

And what does that have to do with anything? A lot of those game killing ideas were also thought up by the developers, too. Yes, they did add shit on their own. Most of the shits they added were actually stuff they added on their own.

An idea is an idea, regardless of who thinks it, and devs are as human as we are, they are as perfectly capable of thinking crap ideas as any of us here. In fact the ones in PSU probably were even better at it that many people I debated with in the official PSU forums back in the days.

[Slidikins]

If 5% is not enough, then raise it to 20%. You're posing problems that you yourself could reason a logic and simple solution if you wanted to. Spectrum problem? Well, I didn't say that NPCs should be considered outright as "players" (as they arent). The thing is, that a game should have missions that even a team of 12 players at level 40 with awesome gear would find challenging, because if not, then, what's the use for that? We're not talking here about a single MPA, there are many, that can 8and should) vary in dificulty.The way I saw it was if there was a mission that was challenging to the upper echelon of players then it would outright flatten the casuals. That's when people start complaining that the game is too hard. But you're right, there is a simple solution to some of those problems. Ramping up HP is one though I do like that stagger resist idea as well.


But why should that be the only solution? I like codes like Protect, or Burst with tons of people killing monsters in the same area, what I don't like is that I can't touch anything sometimes because things die too fast.

I didn't mean to pose that as the only solution but it's the idea that came to mind, probably because I'm not a huge fan of the "overwhelming force" tactic that's currently in the game. Again, ramping up HP is a solution but will that really increase the difficulty? I get the feeling it will just let everything live an extra couple of seconds so you have the satisfaction of hitting it once or twice. It's still going to be wiped clean, the way I'm picturing it.


You have already codes like what you're mentioning, for example you have Code Protect, with the crystals, where people must split to 4+ places to do stuff, and I don't see missions where this code pops to get better as you believe.I've only seen this code once and it sucked. Point taken.

[jooozek]

I've only seen this code once and it sucked. Point taken.

You (r party) sucked :yes:
Had you completed it successfully, it would net you a double crossburst from killing the monsters in the few minutes shortly after it :yes:

[Darki]

The way I saw it was if there was a mission that was challenging to the upper echelon of players then it would outright flatten the casuals. That's when people start complaining that the game is too hard. But you're right, there is a simple solution to some of those problems. Ramping up HP is one though I do like that stagger resist idea as well.

As I said, the problem is that we can't have one simple mission that should please both casuals and high-end players. There's a limit to what can be adapted, but think also from the opposite side. It's true that you can't have missions so hard that casual players can't beat, but you can't have missions that are so easy that high-end players find boring.

But you can have both.


I didn't mean to pose that as the only solution but it's the idea that came to mind, probably because I'm not a huge fan of the "overwhelming force" tactic that's currently in the game. Again, ramping up HP is a solution but will that really increase the difficulty? I get the feeling it will just let everything live an extra couple of seconds so you have the satisfaction of hitting it once or twice. It's still going to be wiped clean, the way I'm picturing it.

Well, it would depend on how you apply those changes. For me even the fact that I could touch the enemy before it dies would be a little more satisfactory than what we have now.

There are monsters that are cannon fodder and will be wiped out as easy as now (thart's the idea), but what kills MPAs for me is also that some bosses don't even last 5 minutes with enough people. Another easy solution for this could be to make some monsters to have critical non-staggerable moves that they use more often the more players are around, to avoid getting stun-locked and pose some threat. For example, imagine that you can't grab, throw or stagger a Breahda when it uses that kinda goo aimed splat shot, and it uses it very often when there are many players around. That paired with a crapload more of HP so the monster is actually a challenge for 12 players, for me would be a good thing.

And if you actually want to do a MPA "a la old style" where everything dies within 5 seconds, then you just need to go to an easier mission.


TI've only seen this code once and it sucked. Point taken.

Well, the good thing of it is the following almost-insta-PSE Burst. xD But anyways, I think the point of a MPA is to go as a group, going everyone on a different sector is pretty much like if they were in separated missions, and for that you don't need MPAs. I like that MPAs encourage cooperative behavior, they need just to be a bit harder so 12 people can take their time at it.

[Macman]

You (r party) sucked :yes:
Had you completed it successfully, it would net you a double crossburst from killing the monsters in the few minutes shortly after it :yes:

I rarely succeed those, but thats mostly because I'm not hardcore MPA'ing and only have maybe 3 other people in the map, making guarding 5+ crystals damn near impossible.

They should scale the amount of crystals depending on how many people are in the area. More people means more crystals which are a bit harder to guard, but provide more PSE boosts on success compared to MPAs with few people.

[Slidikins]

You (r party) sucked :yes:

Mhmm... from what I remember it was me and a friend and more than 2 points to cover. We were doomed from the start. Nice to know there's a good reward for completing it but that's neither here or there.

(Also, good points above Darki, but I need to focus on my work before the day is over. Will reply later.)

[jooozek]

I rarely succeed those, but thats mostly because I'm not hardcore MPA'ing and only have maybe 3 other people in the map, making guarding 5+ crystals damn near impossible.

They should scale the amount of crystals depending on how many people are in the area. More people means more crystals which are a bit harder to guard, but provide more PSE boosts on success compared to MPAs with few people.

One can crystal can be destroyed, so 4 people is enough, but then again, not like a burst would do you any good in such a small party. A chat macro for crystals really helps, you can just roll then ctrl+Fn. I always remind people that new crystals spawn when there is one minute left and generally I rarely fail.

[Mystil]

Well darki, I don't see many people complaining about it in the MPAs I've been in..or even out in the open in lobby 20. Or in team..or anywhere. Must be a "to my friends" thing.. Maybe the majority just don't notice. I'm not denying that its easy, or sure it is. But not being able to hit things doesn't bother me because it comes with being a hunter in a group of forces and rangers. Not much I could do about that..



Well, the good thing of it is the following almost-insta-PSE Burst. xD But anyways, I think the point of a MPA is to go as a group, going everyone on a different sector is pretty much like if they were in separated missions, and for that you don't need MPAs. I like that MPAs encourage cooperative behavior, they need just to be a bit harder so 12 people can take their time at it.

And then you point out the single thing that pisses me off the most about MPAs. When there is no cooperation. We're all just there doing our thing. I hate that. They all go on different paths and it gets all disorganized. I had just came out of a Floating Island MPA where the person request we all follow each other. Guess there is more like minded people than I thought.. Social aspect is still not where I'd like it to be..

As for the crystal protect, have only seen that in forest and city. Would be nice to see it elsewhere..but again its one of those codes people usually don't care for. In one city run, one guy actually organized everyone to go every point, and they all did. Now that's something I like.

[Darki]

Well darki, I don't see many people complaining about it in the MPAs I've been in..or even out in the open in lobby 20. Or in team..or anywhere. Must be a "to my friends" thing.. Maybe the majority just don't notice. I'm not denying that its easy, or sure it is. But not being able to hit things doesn't bother me because it comes with being a hunter in a group of forces and rangers. Not much I could do about that..

Well, it might be a "to my friends" thing, but you know, you're in a thread about it with more than 15 pages, so it might not. xD

Still, I also understand it happening to a Hunter, but the thing is that it also happens to other Forces, me for example. When I MPA in a city mission I hardly hit stuff in ECs like Protect (ship one) unless I just spam Rafoie, and not even then I manage to hit much.

I still don't see why would it be bad to escalate the dificulty of the monsters so they're a bit more challenging for 12 people than for 1. I can beat most common enemies all by myself in less than 30 seconds, and that with not too high-end equipment. 12 people don't have enough meat to bite there.

[Mystil]

Well, it might be a "to my friends" thing, but you know, you're in a thread about it with more than 15 pages, so it might not. xD



We aren't the entire PSO2 playerbase. But don't bank on them making any gameplay changes to your liking. I have nothing else to say on the matter as I'm the minority here.

[Aegea]

And then you point out the single thing that pisses me off the most about MPAs. When there is no cooperation. We're all just there doing our thing. I hate that. They all go on different paths and it gets all disorganized. I had just came out of a Floating Island MPA where the person request we all follow each other. Guess there is more like minded people than I thought.. Social aspect is still not where I'd like it to be..

We just need more assertive people willing to lead. A little while back I was in a group and a player that had link in the username just spoke up and said if it's okay he'll lead the group and he did just that for the next several hours. Even better was that his shortcut words contain coordinates he would say every little while so the group doesn't get lost or separated. Most players will naturally follow others, but few are willing to command. It doesn't surprise me the Japanese players have passworded MPA maps geared towards "efficiency".

City emergency seems to be worst though due to the openness and randomness.

[sexyslut]

The general rule to follow is if I'm in the room, you follow me. No questions asked.

[Arika]

This thread really go too fast over a night with wall of text.

Anyway, you guys notice that SEGA won't hear you guys complain it here right? whether which side you are. Just do the survey, argument here not gonna bring you anything.

[Darki]

Wrong. Discussing here is a great help, we can hear what others think about the matter and find suggestions, improvement and criticism to our ideas before we submit them to SEGA.

By running to SEGA with an idea that only you yorself consider awesome without even trying to see what others think on the matter, you're probably not doing much either.

[Arika]

It is not helping when people not listen to other and become endless argument.
I don't see how people hear each other here at all, especially in you case that seem to be very solid that you are totally right and other people idea must be wrong. Nobody really has right to say which is right or wrong when it come down to opinion really.

Plus, SEGA never ask you to sum up all the forum people opinion for them, they only ask "what do you think?" Individually!
it clearly label in the survey to "please review base on your opinion" it is not "base on forum people opinion"

Just write it as what you feel, you want this or that. Your own choice. (if you have someone to translate for you. that is it)

[Darki]

This didn't become an endless argument. I've found a great source of ideas to improve my original suggestion by discussing here, and as you can see, many other users seem to agree with it to a certain degree. In the other hand, you just came with your one-line-wonder in japanese telling people to copy&paste it without even trying to discuss what did others think on the matter. I don't think SEGA asked you either to collect a horde of zombies to imput the exact same sentence in the survey, but well. I have my own opinion, but considering that this is a MMO, you know, that word, "multiplayer", I wanna hear what others think too.

I don't know if you're aware of it but the only "argument" right now is what you're making. I didn't see any hostility for a while here.

And of course I believe I'm right, if I didn't I wouldn't be sharing my idea with the rest of the people. Actually is not even "my idea", because others have suggested this earlier, I'm just agreeing with them, so it's not that I believe that I'm right, but that the idea is. I still believe that a system that makes MPAs harder the higher the number of players in it, to make their better rewards to pose a challenge, is a much better idea than yours. You just want MPAs to be fucked off so the addition of 8 players to the area means nothing, and make them worth playing just for the "nostalgia lovers" and "japanese mindset", nothing more.

In any case, how do you know that I didn't fill up the survey already and I'm just discussing my ideas with the rest, for the pleasure of doing it, and also to try to convince more people to add similar ideas? You know, is not yopur same method of "copy&paste this" but I kinda prefer it. Also, you complaining about us discussing the matter is not going to achieve anything either, so, by your own words, why even try?

In any case, I'm not even the only one who thinks about a similar solution. If I'm correct there was a similar system in PSO where monsters would get stronger the more the people in the party. I don't really remember that, but I've seen this suggestion for quite a while too.

[Arika]

Fine, up to you then. If you think this will be useful in anyway at all.

[Slidikins]

Discussing here is a great help, we can hear what others think about the matter and find suggestions, improvement and criticism to our ideas before we submit them to SEGA.As much as I hate saying it: This.

I've posted a few ideas in this thread and thanks to discussion I've seen the flaws in those ideas. Now I can suggest something better on my survey. It's not the same thing everyone else is posting and it's still my personal opinion, it's just a refined opinion.

Discussing it here lets us turn good ideas into great ones, which in turn gives SEGA better ideas to work with. I don't see any downside to discussing things here so long as we actually make our voices heard in the end.


In any case, I'm not even the only one who thinks about a similar solution. If I'm correct there was a similar system in PSO where monsters would get stronger the more the people in the party. I don't really remember that, but I've seen this suggestion for quite a while too.The system in PSO was just an offline/online switch. Online had stronger monsters, but there was no difference between 2 people playing and 4 people playing. Offline knew you were alone and kept the monsters manageable. I'm sure it's feasible to implement a similar system in MPA but I can't conceptualize it myself.

[Iduno]

How about making actually completing missions worth doing for more than the odd quest?

For instance have some items only drop from bosses in the boss block, or have some collectable thing kind of like whatever you got for doing S missions on PSU (forgot what they were called) for S ranking hard missions under a certain time which could go towards something cool.

Or failing that, how about having the game check for number of players in an area (say a space of two letters across and 2 numbers vertically on the map) and doing things like adding more traps or when more than one boss would spawn one after another in a changover code, have them spawn together as the number of players gathering together increase.

[IzzyData]

I really thing that completing missions needs to have a purpose. Zone 3 bosses could have a higher chance to drop rares. There are plenty of things they could do to make it worthwhile to complete, but they have to do something because right now there is no reason to not sit in an MPA all day.

[Hrith]

MPAs have killed this game since CBT, always thought so.

The entire system needs to be rethought, the MPAs should disappear altogether.

[Monkeyx]

MPAs have killed this game since CBT, always thought so.

The entire system needs to be rethought, the MPAs should disappear altogether.

then you couldnt call this an mmo (hell you can hardly call it one now), you would have to call it an online multiplayer party based game

[BIG OLAF]

then you couldnt call this an mmo (hell you can hardly call it one now), you would have to call it an online multiplayer party based game

Kind of like what PSO and PSU were.

[gigawuts]

Yeah, erm, PSO, PSU, and PSO2 are not MMO's. We just don't say that because the rabid fans will get all up in arms over it.

[Darki]

MPAs have killed this game since CBT, always thought so.

The entire system needs to be rethought, the MPAs should disappear altogether.

Look, another of those "Oooh I dun liek dis, so nawbody shuld play it" posts.

I love how you claim that the system should be rethought, then state what should be done without that "rethinking". MPA concept is good, if it's broken what has to be done is to fix it, not eliminate it, at least until proven impossible to fix.

[Hrith]

I shall not apologise for having better ideas than SEGA, if that's what you meant.

There might be a way to fix it: make missions with MPAs that cannot be cleared, and missions that can be cleared without MPAs, but then you'd have to balance the fact that only MPAs get PSE bursts and boosted drop rates, so yeah, they pretty much need to disappear.

[Darki]

I shall not apologise for having better ideas than SEGA, if that's what you meant.

I wouldn't ask you to apologize for something I didn't see happening. Disabling MPAs is a pretty lame idea.

[BIG OLAF]

There might be a way to fix it: make missions with MPAs that cannot be cleared, and missions that can be cleared without MPAs, but then you'd have to balance the fact that only MPAs get PSE bursts and boosted drop rates, so yeah, they pretty much need to disappear.

This is probably the best idea anyone on this forum has ever had in regards to mission structure. Anyone who hasn't filled out their Player Survey should include this idea if/when they fill one out.

[Darki]

What's the best part about it? Personally, I don't see the reasoning behind that action. In what would affect the imbalance in MPAs that you couldn't "clear" the mission?

[gigawuts]

This is probably the best idea anyone on this forum has ever had in regards to mission structure. Anyone who hasn't filled out their Player Survey should include this idea if/when they fill one out.

This is precisely why I'm still holding off. That is a good idea. I've heard of separating MPA's and missions, but not making MPA's a mission that can't be completed. This should also squash the issue of a party of 4 doing a boss run in your MPA, leaving you with just 8 players.

edit: Darki, it feels like you're against the idea of changing MPA's just for the sake of being against the idea of changing MPA's. Do you have any rationalizations for why the easiest gameplay mode should be the most profitable?

[Chik'Tikka]

This is precisely why I'm still holding off. That is a good idea. I've heard of separating MPA's and missions, but not making MPA's a mission that can't be completed. This should also squash the issue of a party of 4 doing a boss run in your MPA, leaving you with just 8 players.

edit: Darki, it feels like you're against the idea of changing MPA's just for the sake of being against the idea of changing MPA's. Do you have any rationalizations for why the easiest gameplay mode should be the most profitable?

i do+^_^+ it makes people play with.... OTHER PEOPLE!!+^_^+ one thing i remember about PSU was the many small and fragmented communities out there, clicky little social groups that more often then not were not new player friendly (and I'm not talking just about noobs but just other people outside your friend circle) if someone joined a mission and no one knew them it was instant "who the F are you" MPAs are a great way not only to meet new people, but to actually experience playing with them without the risk of them popping in to steal potential rares or mess with your own little team+^_^+ i think the most rewarding aspect of MPAs is the MP part, apparently Sega thought so and that's good enough for me+^_^+

[IndigoNovember]

What's the best part about it? Personally, I don't see the reasoning behind that action. In what would affect the imbalance in MPAs that you couldn't "clear" the mission?

I feel it's less of a balance change and more of a "I don't want to deal with it if I don't like it" change. Sure you can always search the current parties and pick one that's low on members or generally full of AI partners, but going through the trouble just to avoid joining a Multi Party seems kind of silly.

Plus it would split the players between those who want to grind and those who just want to do the quest. For those who grind, they don't need an end to the quest, whereas those who just want to do the quest don't need the Multi Party Area. When you're in one mindset, you generally don't want to run into those of the other mindset since it runs counter to your goals and can end up quite frustrating.

Plus if they make this distinction in their quests, they could make better maps geared towards each goal. You won't ever end up with tiny 5 room Multi Party Areas when you're trying to grind and huge 10+ room when you just want to get to the boss.

[gigawuts]

Yeah, that's a bad reason. 4 player parties function for that, and just relaxing also functions just fine.

Money gains should always be proportional to effort exerted. Blobbing everything so hard that nothing has any chance to attack whatsoever, even with hyper armor for all their attacks since they never manage to even begin an attack, is just ridiculous, boring, unfun, and generally awful.

Make MPA's the relaxation and client order mode. Make 4 player boss runs the money mode.

edit: Toned down some unnecessarily harsh wording.

[BahnKnakyu]

I like the MPA...

I'd rather farm an MPA over a White Beast...

Massive brainless killing to your play list. Just like any other game except the battle system is actually fun (well I still find it fun enough to justify half of this game...)

But they do seem to make all of the other MPA's useless compared to Free. Yet Free is the least interesting one. Hmm...

This. They need to make multiparty areas for other missions more viable.

I do NOT want them to nerf MPAs - that's the whole reason why I liked PSO2 and it's one of the prime features I'm advocating.

They just need to make doing multiparties in other areas better, or as fun as City Mop Up Emergency Mission.

[gigawuts]

But then you break up the groups even more than if you put in boss runs being more profitable.

[Jungo Torii]

MPAs are not killing this game.

The lack of engaging and new content is.

I think MPAs are the only reason to keep playing this game, because the only enjoyment I get out of it now is playing with friends. Soloing would probably be pretty damn boring since all there is to really do is make money for the next update in a few weeks.

So...yeah, I don't think MPAs should be "nerfed", but I wouldn't mind maybe a few overhauls of the system to make it that MPAs aren't always the most profitable option. Maybe it would create some much-needed variety in the game.

[Darki]

edit: Darki, it feels like you're against the idea of changing MPA's just for the sake of being against the idea of changing MPA's. Do you have any rationalizations for why the easiest gameplay mode should be the most profitable?

I don't have any racionalization for what you ask because that's not what I defend. Maybe I didn't make my point clear enough, but the idea is that I'm just saying that if MPAs are "broken" maybe the solution would go through fixing them, not to disable them right off. Also, I don't see why making MPAs something "other than missions" would stop people from playing them. Like if finishing them carried the best rewards?

I never said that MPAs are fine now. In fact if you read my posts in the oter thread that is pretty much about the same as this, I'm the first one who would like to see the dificulty of MPAs adjusted so there's a bit more of a challenge to back up those "profits".

As to why MPAs should be profitable (not easy, I never said that) I just consider that MPAs should be the best example of what the "MMO" concept takes to this game. MPAs would be pointless if normal partying or soloing were more rewarding.

[gigawuts]

But is anyone even saying to remove them? I've missed it if they are.

[Darki]

Did you even read the previous page then? Unless Hrith's choice of words in "MPAs should disappear altogether" had a different meaning than what I'm used to...

[gigawuts]

Oh, I did miss that. Yeah, I disagree there.

[Z-0]

I honestly have no problems with MPAs; I just have a problem with the fact that Caves and Continent are pretty much the only worthwhile MPAs going around.

If I could do some different areas and find very nice stuff (akin to the fabled Ardillo and Gramasciento), I wouldn't mind the mindless spamming of MPAs so much. I enjoy doing them quite a bit, but only being able to spam 2 of the 6 areas for anything particularly worthwhile is what kills it for me.

[Coatl]

I honestly have no problems with MPAs; I just have a problem with the fact that Caves and Continent are pretty much the only worthwhile MPAs going around.

If I could do some different areas and find very nice stuff (akin to the fabled Ardillo and Gramasciento), I wouldn't mind the mindless spamming of MPAs so much. I enjoy doing them quite a bit, but only being able to spam 2 of the 6 areas for anything particularly worthwhile is what kills it for me.

This please. I really wish they made all free roam MPs of the same difficulty equally worthwhile to farm.

[gigawuts]

Something that direly needs to change is top ranking items varying in drop locations and frequency as drastically as tigredors versus ardillous. Seriously, look at that god damn price gap. Tigredors are so common that bringing one to +50 element is comparable to owning an Ardillou at all.