Strongest/most viable class combo

[Typhoeus]

As an antithesis to the other thread, I thought it would be interesting to know (given all the latest patches and updates) what everyone's thoughts are on the the "best" class (perhaps, strongest burst or sustain, trash clearing, solo or most utility in a wide array of situations, etc.). Any takers?

[Aquayoshi]

I know that Forces/Techers can be absolute beasts when it comes to clearing out mobs. Whenever I'm in a party with a caster, I see tons of four-digit numbers, everywhere.


On the other hand, I know from personal experience as a Gunner/Ranger that GU/RA is seriously broken against bosses. Chain Trigger + Weak Bullet + Elder Rebellion = LOL. If done correctly, every boss except Falz will die in seconds.

[dablacksephiroth]

This way, Z-0!

[Tenlade]

a force/techer with pp charge revival and hp/pp conversion on the other hand is murder for mobs. Add in the other pp regen skill and bolt saver and you will almost never have to stop spamming techs.

[Zyrusticae]

Force with Charge PP Revival, Techer with PP Restorate (or whatever it's called) = constant tech spam.

Now just pick your poison - Fire, Wind, or Darkness? (Or light if you're a pansy)

Nobody can beat gunner/ranger for raw boss-killing potential, though.

[Kondibon]

I know that Forces/Techers can be absolute beasts when it comes to clearing out mobs. Whenever I'm in a party with a caster, I see tons of four-digit numbers, everywhere.


On the other hand, I know from personal experience as a Gunner/Ranger that GU/RA is seriously broken against bosses. Chain Trigger + Weak Bullet + Elder Rebellion = LOL. If done correctly, every boss except Falz will die in seconds.Point and Case.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mNjmzvLa4No

[Typhoeus]

Does Fo/Te stand up against Gu/Ra vs. bosses? Or does any class for that matter?

[CelestialBlade]

FI/HU is very well-rounded for fast mob killing and boss slaying. Far more survivability than most other classes too.

[Skye-Fox713]

Does Fo/Te stand up against Gu/Ra vs. bosses? Or does any class for that matter?

Not that I know of. Plus i've seen a video of a Gu/Ra take down a VH rockbear in under 10 seconds to yeah that would be kinda hard to beat.

[Vylera]

GU/RA takes the cake for fastest boss killing, but personally I'd say they're a little too specialized in boss killing/1v1 to be considered the "strongest" in more categories than other classes.

Seamless boss killing is kind of just a novelty since no one struggles against trash mobs.

I'd much rather be a FI/HU for rare farming and PSE bursts. Plus it's way more fun than pew pewing with little to no risk

[Kondibon]

I'd much rather be a FI/HU for rare farming and PSE bursts. Plus it's way more fun than pew pewing with little to no risk

I prefer Fo/Te for PSE bursts, but I like Fighter and Hunter, Though I prefer mixing them with another class. Fi/Te or Fi/Fo is fun.

[NoiseHERO]

Gu/RA is the new launcher ranger.

As in the new most over powered class that everyone jumped ship to.

But can you blame em? It's also a FUN class *_*

[SolRiver]

Both Fo/Te and Gu/Ra have redundancy issue, as more of the same class won't be nearly as beneficial than just having one. (more so for Gu/Ra than Fo/Te)

I think that is their only down side, though not much of a disadvantage.

[Cyclon]

Both Fo/Te and Gu/Ra have redundancy issue, as more of the same class won't be nearly as beneficial than just having one. (more so for Gu/Ra than Fo/Te)

I think that is their only down side, though not much of a disadvantage.
I don't see how Fo/Te has any redundancy issue. They are pure, safe damage. You never get too much of that in a party. I can agree for Gu/Ra, though you have launchers. But indeed, for weak bullet/chain trigger specializations, having someone else who's the same in the mpa can greatly lower your utility(not that big of a deal though, you just go from "godlike" to "still OP"). The bad thing is, they're everywhere, so that's bound to happen a lot.

Anyway, even though Gu/Ra is impressive at boss killing, my vote goes for Fo/Te for overall excellence at everything this game has to offer.

Favorite is still Hu/Fi though

[SolRiver]

Because boosted shifta provide a big boost, and you really only need 1 or 2 shifta techer in a mpa. Then shifta become redundant.

But like I said, not much of a disadvantage and redundancy more on gu/ra than on fo/te.

[Cyclon]

But like I said, not much of a disadvantage and redundancy more on gu/ra than on fo/te.
Oh, right, I read that wrong, sorry.
Then again though, Shifta repeatidly struck me as pretty unimportant in PSO 2, especially if you compare it to how it was in PSO or PSZ. But I guess you could say that anyway.

[Alenoir]

Subbing a HU with Iron Will totally increases your survivability by ten-fold. I thought of subbing TE on my FO, but man, think I'm sticking with HU.

[gigawuts]

Subbing a HU with Iron Will totally increases your survivability by ten-fold. I thought of subbing TE on my FO, but man, think I'm sticking with HU.

I seem to be saying this a lot lately, because people either don't think of it or don't really want to do it, but:

Try te/fo. They get pretty meaty. My te/fo walks around with a better tank than some melee classes.

[Alenoir]

I seem to be saying this a lot lately, because people either don't think of it or don't really want to do it, but:

Try te/fo. They get pretty meaty. My te/fo walks around with a better tank than some melee classes.

TE lv22. It'll be a while. >_> But yeah, I don't think a TE/FO can survive a full palm slamming from the back.

[Kirine]

RA/GU is no longer an option compared to GU/RA. Why?

-RA/GU-
+Can Equip the Strongest Rifle (Elder Rifle/Avenger)
+Can Equip the Strongest Launcher (Flame Visit)
-Can Only Equip Mediocre Twin Mech Guns (Lamda Aresvis)

-GU/RA-
+Can Equip the Strongest Rifle (Elder Rifle/Avenger)
+Can Equip the Strongest Launcher (Flame Visit)
+Can Equip the Strongest Twin Mech Guns (Yasminkov9000)


Even if you plan to play like a ranger in MPA, being a GU/RA at least gives you access to the best twin guns, meaning when you need to do single DPS on a boss enemy or tough enemy, it's there to use.

[gigawuts]

If we're talking about class balance based around the best items in the game

Only force/fighter is any good

Dat psycho wand

edit:

TE lv22. It'll be a while. >_> But yeah, I don't think a TE/FO can survive a full palm slamming from the back.

With unground units and shifta drink I can survive 3 smacks. With deband drink I've taken 4 smacks and walked away just fine.

[Gama]

ive found my fi/te or fo combination interesting in mob control.

zondeel and then kill them all at the same time.

its also fun to watch all the numbers.

[Rien]

-GU/RA-
+Can Equip the Strongest Rifle (Elder Rifle/Avenger)
+Can Equip the Strongest Launcher (Flame Visit)
+Can Equip the Strongest Twin Mech Guns (Yasminkov9000)


Assuming you can, um, get them, lol.

[Kirine]

Assuming you can, um, get them, lol.

At the moment, Craft Psliosin is quite devestating, but the Ranger's Lamda Aresvis, not so much.

[Alenoir]

With unground units and shifta drink I can survive 3 smacks. With deband drink I've taken 4 smacks and walked away just fine.

I can survive 3 smacks on RA/FO w/o Deband too. :T But if you get caught in the slam from the beginning then yeaaah.

[gigawuts]

I can survive 3 smacks on RA/FO w/o Deband too. :T But if you get caught in the slam from the beginning then yeaaah.

If you get caught in the slam from the beginning you need to work on your observational skills. They travel quite a distance, the AOE overlap from the first hit to the last hit is very small, you'd need to be directly in front of the first smack - close enough to see the fingers raise above you even if it's behind you.

Being that you seem to be comparing a geared up character to one that hasn't even ground its units to +1 yet, what you're saying is kind of moot. If I were to actually go all in with this I'd be tanking like a mofo for how effective techs are at all ranges.

[Cry0]

FI/HU is very well-rounded for fast mob killing and boss slaying. Far more survivability than most other classes too.

This guy. I like him.

HU/FI or FI/HU. Good in both cases (mob/bosses), just not the best. And I'm okay with that.

[Z-0]

FI/HU
RA/FI
FO/FI

All you need.

GU/RA
FO/TE

Good in certain situations (boss killing and Amduscia TA for GU/RA, bursts if there isn't a constant stream of many Ketos Proi for FO/TE), but the top three are usually better overall.

Other combos are just for "fun", and are not really the strongest/most useful.

[UnLucky]

Because boosted shifta provide a big boost, and you really only need 1 or 2 shifta techer in a mpa. Then shifta become redundant.

But like I said, not much of a disadvantage and redundancy more on gu/ra than on fo/te.

Boosted Shifta equates to about +5% base Atk stats, which while useful, isn't an amazing advantage. Having any Shifta at all, even lv1 with no mastery (note the difference between lv1 and lv14 Shifta is +1.3%), is a bigger boost over nothing, so the more players taking it means a better chance those who didn't will have it applied regularly.

And Shifta Critical? With very little Dex, let's say your lowest rolls are 80% of your max. With maxed Shifta Crit (and the buff applied), at best, your damage increases by 3.75% (15% chance to deal 25% more damage if you crit when you would have otherwise rolled really low). #wow #whoa


I seem to be saying this a lot lately, because people either don't think of it or don't really want to do it, but:

Try te/fo. They get pretty meaty. My te/fo walks around with a better tank than some melee classes.

But techer gets no more s-def than any melee class, so that's a damn lie. The difference is like maybe 20 damage per hit, so I don't see that being the only thing keeping you alive. Biggest survivability they get is from Deband Cut, which you can get from sub classing TE while using a good weapon.

[gigawuts]

I meant players. Half the hunters or fighters you meet are A. not casts, B. not opting for defense-oriented units, and C. don't have mirage escape on their primary weapons so they can lazily and easily evade attacks they would have survived anyway. It's also much lower maintenance, and all of this is assuming you're in position to be hit with attacks anyway - which, as a tech class, you typically aren't.

[UnLucky]

So a Diffuse Shell spamming RA could be a better dodge tank than a fully defensive spec FI/HU. It's possible, but that says nothing about the viability of the class combo. :L

[gigawuts]

So a Diffuse Shell spamming RA could be a better dodge tank than a fully defensive spec FI/HU. It's possible, but that says nothing about the viability of the class combo. :L

No, absolutely. A variation of fo/te with a different blunt force casting weapon oriented around dealing considerably more damage with melee but a bit less damage with techs, while retaining the exact same other weapons (which many players prefer) with a better tank is absolutely not a viable option.

At all.

You have converted me.

[Jakosifer]

Fi/Hu

Can use the strongest Double Wabers for insane ST DPS, can use the strongest Fists... Don't give a fuck, Straight Charge is amazing against the Falz Hands, keeps you mobile and I generally get up to 40k damage with a weak spot + WB applied. Then there's the Lambda Convenientisn, giving you Sonic Arrow for your CC needs. Hell, if you don't have that, get it, before you do so Whirlwind + Whorenado Dance on Wabers is serviceable but less efficient.

Fo/Fi

I have only seen this in action and haven't used it myself, but a friend of mine with Maxed Brave/Wise obliterates everything that we come across. Though apparently PP can be a problem in bursts if they can't get the PB back in like 5 seconds, which I guess Gigrants does a good enough job of shredding everything sufficiently enough to that end. Bosses get eaten alive.

[GreenArcher]

I'm not sure that RA/FI beats out RA/HU

FI gives 20% x2 boost to frontal damage, 20% reduction to back damage / gives 30% x2 boost to back damage, 20% reduction to frontal damage (max stances)
or gives (15%)(20%) boost to frontal damage, 15% reduction to back damage / gives (25%)(30%) boost to back damage, 15% reduction to frontal damage, +100 RATK at 50% health (max halfline slayer)
+Fast travel through knuckle PAs/knuckle gear

HU gives 10% x2 to just attacks, +250 RATK / -150 SDEF

The FI damage boost is a little higher but is situational, requires some forethought/positioning, and needs time to switch stances when necessary. The HU damage boosts are innate (should be just attacking everything anyway), and the -150 SDEF is definitely mangeable

[SociableTyrannosaur]

you know the bonuses to damage are not additive, but multiplicative, right?

I dunno the situational aspect of FI stances is really more about personal awareness...as in knowing where the hell you are in relation to the monsters. If you can handle that, I don't see much of an issue. Thiing is the FI stances will only keep getting more potent with better equipment while Fury stance you have to put in 30 points NOW to get just the stance and the boosts and another 20 into the JA, to make Fury relevant in 2 months you'll have to probably put in another 20 points while B/W stance get more brutal as you get better equipment AND will see upgrades in the future which (based on patterns) will get another 20% and 30% boost respectively; making that 144/169 -> 173/220.

Pretty hard to validate Fury stance at this point imo. if you have an extra skill tree, then maybe. Otherwise I vote FI all the way.

[UnLucky]

No, absolutely. A variation of fo/te with a different blunt force casting weapon oriented around dealing considerably more damage with melee but a bit less damage with techs, while retaining the exact same other weapons (which many players prefer) with a better tank is absolutely not a viable option.

At all.

You have converted me.

Not sure what you're even arguing for now.

"Techer main has a lot more survivability"
"Little*"
"It's a lot if you change race and gear and l2p"
"So what does that have to do with Techer's survivability?"
"Some people like wands, ok? Techer is great, shut up"

I'm sure you're totally fine with trading T-Atk for S-Atk/Def for those situations where you're in position to be hit with attacks anyway - which, as a tech class, you typically aren't.

FOnewearl w/ 10* rod -> TEcast w/ 10* wand is roughly +210 S-Atk, +100 S-Def, -160 T-Atk, -120 T-Def. Considering you have absolutely nothing multiplying your strike damage compared to every skill being geared towards tech damage, I don't find the trade worth it at all.

But even completely ignoring the point for point comparisons, wands cast noticeably slower. If you want a melee class with gimped techs, go HU/TE or FI/TE.

[gigawuts]

Not sure what you're even arguing for now.

"Techer main has a lot more survivability"
"Little*"
"It's a lot if you change race and gear and l2p"
"So what does that have to do with Techer's survivability?"
"Some people like wands, ok? Techer is great, shut up"

I'm sure you're totally fine with trading T-Atk for S-Atk/Def for those situations where you're in position to be hit with attacks anyway - which, as a tech class, you typically aren't.

FOnewearl w/ 10* rod -> TEcast w/ 10* wand is roughly +210 S-Atk, +100 S-Def, -160 T-Atk, -120 T-Def. Considering you have absolutely nothing multiplying your strike damage compared to every skill being geared towards tech damage, I don't find the trade worth it at all.

But even completely ignoring the point for point comparisons, wands cast noticeably slower. If you want a melee class with gimped techs, go HU/TE or FI/TE.

I never said or implied said half the shit you're arbitrarily putting in quotes, and you're really drawing this out quite a bit more than would have ever been necessary. There are things I could say in rebuttal, but I'm sure they'd be taken out of context, ignored, rephrased, or shot down as opinion despite being of actual consequence. Honestly, people like you seem to take things like these to silly lengths. I'm not really interested in trying to convince you of anything. There's not really any point.

I find te/fo as viable as fo/te for various reasons. You evidently don't share them, and I don't particularly find talking to you about it worth the hassle if this is how you're going to go about it. Have fun.

[GreenArcher]

you know the bonuses to damage are not additive, but multiplicative, right?

I dunno the situational aspect of FI stances is really more about personal awareness...as in knowing where the hell you are in relation to the monsters. If you can handle that, I don't see much of an issue. Thiing is the FI stances will only keep getting more potent with better equipment while Fury stance you have to put in 30 points NOW to get just the stance and the boosts and another 20 into the JA, to make Fury relevant in 2 months you'll have to probably put in another 20 points while B/W stance get more brutal as you get better equipment AND will see upgrades in the future which (based on patterns) will get another 20% and 30% boost respectively; making that 144/169 -> 173/220.

Pretty hard to validate Fury stance at this point imo. if you have an extra skill tree, then maybe. Otherwise I vote FI all the way.

Indeed I do, hence for most of those lines of text I listed the numbers in parenthesis. But my arguments are about right now (I also got a separate HU tree just for this).
Anyway most of the reason I brought this up is because I'm considering leveling FI to 50 to sub, wanted to hear what others thought.