So more free grinders and reducing grinders needed to grind weapons...

[The Walrus]

Didn't see it on the front page so yeah. (http://bumped.org/psublog/pso2-jp-grinders-grinders-grinders/)

50 free grinders in collection storage now and

But that’s not all, to help ease your pain, next week, the number of grinders you’d win in FUN Scratch will be increased to 5. Also sometime next year, near the end of January, he will ease the amount of grinders needed to strengthen your weapon.

[Zyrusticae]

Holy shit.

THANK YOU SAKAI YOU ARE A GOD AMONG GREEDY OLD MEN

[gigawuts]

Leave the average cost, remove or cap the RNG. Fixed.

[Zyrusticae]

Yeah sorry guys, that ain't gonna happen as long as they have success rate boosters and risk protectors in the AC Scratch. I'LL TAKE WHAT I CAN GET, THANK YOU VERY MUCH!

[gigawuts]

I didn't say WHAT to cap it at, you could cap it at 10x the average rate.

This reduction to grinders used was expected. I saw this coming as soon as they announced the free 99 grinders. They were trying to the medical equivalent of treating a severed limb with a bandaid. 99 grinders for this kind of demand? Hell no, 99 grinders can't even get some people to +8 on a 9*. This was a last ditch attempt at resolving the issue, it failed, so they finally had to cave and take real action.

Well, this "real action" won't do much either in the long term. This is because the system is fundamentally flawed.

[The Walrus]

At least we'll be getting more chances at it now provided it's one grinder a shot for everything. I'd laugh if they make the RNG even worse without telling us to compensate for this

[NoiseHERO]

Please... don't jump at joy for a 33% off on grinders...

Those rates are still gonna be terrible....................

Don't let them trick you... D:

When 15* weapons come out we'll be right back where we started with this grind hell, but even WORSE rates. *_*

The endgame on weapon upgrades is forever doomed till they nerf the actual rates.

[Jakosifer]

<_<

/sells them

[Agitated_AT]

What are grinders?
What are they for?
Why do I need them?

I am really serious about these questions. I've invested around 300 hours into pso2 total and had never heard about these grinders until I saw people complaining about them at the forum. I don't feel like I really needed them so far

[Keyblade59]

Once we hit a certain level we need dudu grinder stamps so we get grinders.

[The Walrus]

What are grinders?
What are they for?
Why do I need them?

I am really serious about these questions. I've invested around 300 hours into pso2 total and had never heard about these grinders until I saw people complaining about them at the forum. I don't feel like I really needed them so far

:/

I doubt your seriousness

[Heat Haze]

But that’s not all, to help ease your pain, next week, the number of grinders you’d win in FUN Scratch will be increased to 5. Also sometime next year, near the end of January, he will ease the amount of grinders needed to strengthen your weapon.

Great, I always thought that getting just ONE grinder from FUN was pretty stupid to begin with. That's really about the best change so far.

I can see them easing the amount of grinders, accompanied with worse rates. After all, how can we tell the specific grinding rates on the weapons anyway?

But hey, I'll take what I can get.

[eharima]

That feel when grinding cost 3 grinders will cost 2 grinders
Premium becomes slightly more valuable
Wish I hadn't blasted 22k of fun before the previous scratch update

[Meji]

I'm flippin' out! This is extremely good news, indeed!!

[Xaeris]

Anything short of improving the success rates substantially or softening the penalty for failure is just throwing water onto a brush fire. But, 50 grinders is free money, at least.

[Tenlade]

If they're gonna make grinders so common, so minor, and so cheap, why not just remove them altogether? why not just make grinding a straight cost?

maybe they're just trying to devalue them before doing so , to make it so no one complains.

[gigawuts]

If they're gonna make grinders so common, so minor, and so cheap, why not just remove them altogether? why not just make grinding a straight cost?

maybe they're just trying to devalue them before doing so , to make it so no one complains.

I think this is their very last option. I do expect it to be on the list, but they probably want to see how much they can get away with.

When (not if) the changes are overcome by player demand for the new wave of items, I expect them to either put in a new item for grinding rares that's separate from the non-rare grinding system (digrinders and trigrinders?), because AFAICT the biggest issue with grinding was that the top end items were interfering with low end item costs.

But that's the fundamental flaw. A lambda 9* costs the same to grind as its non-lambda 9* counterpart, same with 8*'s and 7*'s. Everyone is after the items that are 50% stronger, and the cost effectiveness of that grinding is way above anything below them. This makes last month's rares, well, pretty much useless, but leaves them at roughly the same costs ( plus the market value - which is not actually that much for many weapons).

So they're experimenting. I'm not sure if they expected this current outcome or not, but it was pretty fucking hard to not see coming. Makes me wonder about who's in charge of this part of the game.

But, even if it's not good right now, them experimenting is a pretty good sign.

[eharima]

If they're gonna make grinders so common, so minor, and so cheap, why not just remove them altogether? why not just make grinding a straight cost?

maybe they're just trying to devalue them before doing so , to make it so no one complains.

They are trying to reduce the inflation price of grinders.
Grinders are about 14k each. Not only is that fucking ridiculous, the money is just swilling around from player to player and not into dodo to actually take the money out of the economy.
cheaper grinders = more people using grinders = money out the economy

The problem stands that its little effort too late, it will be hard to bring down the price
They will either be more access able by other means and there will be no point in buying them, as I doubt they will come below 10k ever
Or they will have to implement a way to cap price to stimulate competition by vending them from an NPC for example at 10k so player shop has to offer 9k the next.person cuts them for 8700, the next 8500 ect
There is currently no reason to drop prices even if you have 10000 grinders put them in for 12k each someone will buy and relist for 13k the next man does it again
Every seller WANTS the high price and will keep it that way regardless of how awash the server is with grinders.
I used those 99 campaign grinders in what? 2minuets? And went from +7 to +5
Its a long and delicate road.
Inb4synthesizerrecycle1:1

[Zyrusticae]

Inb4synthesizerrecycle1:1
lol, I can see this happening, too.

There's such an obscene flood of synthesizers... um... everywhere, that they really should add something to sink them. Convert to grinders -> get rid of excess synthesizers -> decrease value of grinders -> everybody wins!

[Rien]

Grinders are my only stable source of income.

Every 999 grinders I get I grab a myshop ticket (which, by the time I get that many, definitely would have) and go sell em' all at the lowest price I see a grinder going for.

No other way to get good items ._.

[yoshiblue]

Careful. Dodo might pull a fast one on you.

[Rien]

Careful. Dodo might pull a fast one on you.

But I only buy +10 items? o.o

[eharima]

although i could eat my words, looks like there is some panic selling going down in light of this news people are trying to maximize profit and offload their stacks.

grinders currently at 10.5 -11k, lets see how the weekend closes out.

[Agitated_AT]

:/

I doubt your seriousness

Why do you doubt it? I really am serious. Is it weird that I haven't felt like I had been missing something that was probably essential? I mean when I read the forums it does seem like it's essential.

[gigawuts]

Why do you doubt it? I really am serious. Is it weird that I haven't felt like I had been missing something that was probably essential? I mean when I read the forums it does seem like it's essential.

Are you even in VH yet?

[Cry0]

I think this is their very last option. I do expect it to be on the list, but they probably want to see how much they can get away with.

When (not if) the changes are overcome by player demand for the new wave of items, I expect them to either put in a new item for grinding rares that's separate from the non-rare grinding system (digrinders and trigrinders?), because AFAICT the biggest issue with grinding was that the top end items were interfering with low end item costs.

But that's the fundamental flaw. A lambda 9* costs the same to grind as its non-lambda 9* counterpart, same with 8*'s and 7*'s. Everyone is after the items that are 50% stronger, and the cost effectiveness of that grinding is way above anything below them. This makes last month's rares, well, pretty much useless, but leaves them at roughly the same costs ( plus the market value - which is not actually that much for many weapons).

So they're experimenting. I'm not sure if they expected this current outcome or not, but it was pretty fucking hard to not see coming. Makes me wonder about who's in charge of this part of the game.

But, even if it's not good right now, them experimenting is a pretty good sign.

Though I pretty much agree with this, I'd urge you to let go of your hope to ever have them remove the RNG. It's not happening, you'll only hurt yourself wishing it. Trust me, I knwo that feel.

[gigawuts]

I'm not even arguing for the removal of RNG, so much as a more proper tiering of rares. If something is 50% better, why is it grinding at the same rates?

That's the only reason old rares are so worthless within 24 hours of every patch. If there was a linear cost proportional to the damage gained things wouldn't be quite so out of whack.

[Agitated_AT]

Are you even in VH yet?

I've done only forest on VH. Do things really get that crazy?

[The Walrus]

Well unless you want stuff to take forever...

[gigawuts]

I've done only forest on VH. Do things really get that crazy?

If everyone is saying you're green, you might want to look in a mirror.

IOW yes, evidently. If you haven't even seen it yet, why the hell are you talking about whether or not it's fine?

[Agitated_AT]

What do you mean? I thought i've been doing exactly what a person is supposed to do when he doesn't know any better, which is asking questions

Anyway thanks for clarifying. I appreciate it

[Mysterious-G]

7*-9* rares should not be able to be sold in myshop nor be tradeable in the first place, just like in PSP2. It's due to that that people get them so easily and feel the only worthy find are 10* weapons and now even above that, bitching that they only manage to get a "crappy" 8* weapon when that in itself should already be an amazing find. When I am able to find a 7*-9* rare while hunting for a 10*, then I have to say that the droprates are just fine.

[gigawuts]

7*-9* rares should not be able to be sold in myshop nor be tradeable in the first place, just like in PSP2. It's due to that that people get them so easily and feel the only worthy find are 10* weapons and now even above that, bitching that they only manage to get a "crappy" 8* weapon when that in itself should already be an amazing find. When I am able to find a 7*-9* rare while hunting for a 10*, then I have to say that the droprates are just fine.

While playing VH I have found exactly 2 VH sub-10* rares . Lambda Hard Quartz and Court Edge. Everything else is from hard and outclassed by 6*'s. Seriously, I don't know what you're hunting or for how long but if it beats what I've got then congratulations.