Elysion - All-class weapon for real?

[Mysterious-G]

The wiki states it's useable by all classes, can someone confirm that? o3o

[BIG OLAF]

Yes, I believe that it is. But, the requirement to equip it is insane unless you're super-spec'd into S-ATK.

[EvilMag]

I thought the only non-force class that can equip it is Techer.

[Z-0]

Elysion is a Wand which is a Techer weapon anyway...

But force can equip it, and the other classes cannot, judging from what I'm reading on the wiki comments page.

[Skye-Fox713]

I thought the only non-force class that can equip it is Techer.

Not quite, its an 'all class' weapon so any class can equip it. However the minimum requirement of 500 S-atk the only class that can equip it straight up would be the hunter and fighter classes. I would also Imagin that the player would have to have a Hunter/Fighter class as the main class with Force or Techer as the sub to use techs.

[Ezodagrom]

According to the Arkive, it's Force and Techer only:
http://arkive.info/weapons/Elysion

[Skye-Fox713]

According to the Arkive, it's Force and Techer only:
http://arkive.info/weapons/Elysion

If so the only way I can see a Force, Techer combo being able to equip it at our current level cap is to have a pure S-atk mag that is 150 lv's of pure S-atk and no other stat.

[leezy]

so this the new Elysion?

[gigawuts]

so this the new Elysion?

It's the old one

And yeah, with an satk req of 500 even a male cast has trouble with that - being 55 satk shy at 50/50.

[D-Inferno]

Why does SEGA keep trying to enforce melee properties on Techer? It's quite clear that we only want to use Techs on this class.

[gigawuts]

^

If I had to guess, because a pure-teching class already exists. The force.

If anything they should be giving techer tank-based strengths, or powerful secondary bonuses to melee (high chance of inflicting status effect based on wand-element, etc.).

More raw atk just ain't gonna cut it.

[Xaeris]

If it were up to me, I'd have made Techer a class focused on using uncharged techs by putting skills in the tree that makes them not suck. That way, they could realistically be woven into a melee combo.

[Kirine]

If it were up to me, I'd have made Techer a class focused on using uncharged techs by putting skills in the tree that makes them not suck. That way, they could realistically be woven into a melee combo.

Maybe the 3rd tier class will be like Magic Fighter...

Where the PA is you strike the enemy multiple times before finishing them off with a magic attack.

Think gunslash PA except of bullets you fire magical damage.

Like slashing the enemy, kicking them back, then finish magic with a rafoie as a PA.

[Omega-z]

Elysion is easily equip-able with a Te/Hu combo (with out a Pure Mag or even a single stat in S-atk on your Mag if your a Male Cast) and seem's to be made for that set up. I can still use 10* gear in both melee and Tech, Except for a few weapon's. And having decent range power. I went Def with my Mag but If I went ATK with it I could still equip every weapon still.

[Syklo]

Maybe if they improved wand gear by adding melee range and possibly melee swing speed, techer'd be much better.
Or even add a skill that converts the type of damage applied (SO converting T-atk damage to S-atk or vice versa, for instance)
And it's not all-class?

[spoiler-box]NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO[/spoiler-box]
Now the +5 SP quests are going to be even more annoying.
Freaking rappies....

[Omega-z]

Syklo - With Wand Gear, wand's have great range which hit's more then 6 target's and Sega increased the Speed of it. They also use both S-atk and T-atk with Wand Gear, so all those bases are covered. I agree with a Normal Tech boost/Rapid chain spamming of some sort's and More Buff/Def abilities though.

[Macman]

If they made the Normal Tech Boost skill in the Force tree 300% instead of a mere 110% at 10 SP it might be worth something, if just novelty.

[Syklo]

They also use both S-atk and T-atk with Wand Gear, so all those bases are covered. I agree with a Normal Tech boost/Rapid chain spamming of some sort's and More Buff/Def abilities though.

I know, but what I meant was an actual SKILL that SWAPS or otherwise partially converts S-atk and T-atk based attacks. For instance, usage of said skill will cause my foie to do 50% of it's damage based off S-atk instead of T-atk. Might sound ridiculous but it's something I'm interested to see.
And SEGA increased the wand speed already? o.o Ok then..

What I'd really like to have is either a faster mirage escape, or techer to be able to use EITHER mirage escape or step (where pressing shift+dash will use the other).
That's probably going too far as to make FI/TE or HU/TE subclassing redundant and just having them all in one class...

[SociableTyrannosaur]

Now I'm thinking about 3rd tier classes.

...might be time for a new topic.

[gigawuts]

Now I'm thinking about 3rd tier classes.

...might be time for a new topic.

This was covered in a thread about new weapons, and some nice ideas were floated in there.

Buuuut...I think we should make techer actually useful as a main first. It's golden as a sub, and as a pseudo force when doing te/fo, but yeah. Not that great when maining.

My thoughts for techer:
A skill to refund PP for uncharged techs of ALL elements (either 1 PP per level or 25% at 10, since someone thre wa fit over how crazy OP uncharged techs are)
A couple wand PA's that mix t-atk and s-atk like gunslash PA's (I don't know 1 per element maybe, leave techs bindable to wand as well)
Bump up t-def to s-def levels
Mirage Attack (step attack for mirage escap, massively reduces mirage invuln frames when you actually use the attack, does not change mirage escape without attacking)
Wand gear fills with its own explosion damage.
A new line of techs (or special wand PA's) based around defense, with some arbitrary pre-existing penalty that wand gear reduces, or a miniscule bonus that wand gear massively boosts. Charge time, PP usage, I don't know. Something to the effective usefulness of just guard.

Any number of those additions would go a long way to making techer viable as its own class, but in its current form it's pretty much just a nice sub.

[Skye-Fox713]

Though on the Topic of wands, Sega really needs to get on making a true 'all class' wand as I think it may be the only weapon class with out one.

[SociableTyrannosaur]

What thread is that?

As for techer, I definitely think T def needs to be raised an dif it is supposed to offer better support than FO I think the S/D Adv skills need another buff. 25% is nothing when it's augmenting an already low number.

Personally I think techer's skill set encourages charging techs even more than FO since wand gear wont charge of normal techs but Fo at least has a skill to boost normal tech damage. if that's what they intended, I'd say the third class may want to lend itself to normal techs and offer a new weapon class specifically designed for speed casting.

[Rien]

Elysion, you even exist bro?

[Arada]

I'm currently TE/FO (as newman male) and it feels like my DPS is higher than FO/TE.

But you have to make sure you don't play TE like you would play FO.

I have a specifically prepared Mag and armor set (with Ragne Soul/Technique III/Power III and such) and it's turning out great.

I'm dealing double 700's with my basic 3-hit combo (and wand gear) which really isn't bad at all and I can resist whatever is coming at me when they're close and I swing to refill my PP bar.

Yes, my techs are dealing less damage than force but my survival is much higher and it feels like my DPS is at least on par with FO, when attempting to refill my PP bar, my damage is quite high (for a class mainly using techs).
TE suits my play style as I'm using all close range techs (Safoie, Gi-techs, ...).

It's a shame that with this class combo (and a Mag with 50 S-ATK) I'm not able to equip Elysion but if I can ever get one (which is not granted ;D), I'll just wait patiently until new level caps are unlocked (or I'll switch to TE/FI for a while).

[SociableTyrannosaur]

I do ~ 1200 per hit (x6 with gear) using my divine tsukiyomi and I still feel my damage is better as a FO I swear techs charge faster on FO and I deal 2.3-4.6k per hit on most techs 1.2-1.6 per hit with safoie lv12. I also can use my Snow set as fo, which isn't possible with Te unless I dump 5 points in to T def.

overall FO just feels more fluid though.

[Z-0]

Techs charge at the same speed, it's just that wands have a delay at the end of their casting animation, so techs do come out faster as a FO.

[gigawuts]

Yup, it's one of those oversights that works against techer. There's a few things like that working against the class, but even if they were fixed they wouldn't make it all that much better. They're just nuisances.

Honestly I really feel like territory burst should just be a static bonus to range. Between losing a tech slot on the subpalette and having to actually activate it with an animation and everything, it's...another chore force doesn't have to deal with to do its role.

[Syklo]

Yup, it's one of those oversights that works against techer. There's a few things like that working against the class, but even if they were fixed they wouldn't make it all that much better. They're just nuisances.

Honestly I really feel like territory burst should just be a static bonus to range. Between losing a tech slot on the subpalette and having to actually activate it with an animation and everything, it's...another chore force doesn't have to deal with to do its role.
As a FI/TE im constantly switching between subpallettes every couple of minutes so I'm use to that and i have no problem with that.

I can see how that's a nuisance to many others though

[RocK_M]

IMHO the buffs just need a duration tweak for techers Shift/Deband/Territory burst would be fine as is if it wasn't a damn chore to keep the buffs up.

[Gama]

certain tweaks on techer would be welcome, buff duration and resta behavior need to be tweaked to make support classes actually viable.

[Pandarino]

Wow 500 S-atk Very difficult to equip if yourare maining TECHER.

I'd totally put some points into territory burst if it was a passive ability.

[Jakosifer]

If you're maining Techer and subbing FO, sure. If you're subbing Fi or Hu its somewhat naturally mitigated, and with a few points into S.Atk skills you'd be good to go.

[Syklo]

IMHO the buffs just need a duration tweak for techers Shift/Deband/Territory burst would be fine as is if it wasn't a damn chore to keep the buffs up.

I would be fine with either removing the 1 minute cap or just raising it to something like 3 or 5 minutes.

Then there'd be a reason for everyone to buff everyone at a boss teleporter.

[Rien]

I would be fine with either removing the 1 minute cap or just raising it to something like 3 or 5 minutes.

Then there'd be a reason for everyone to buff everyone at a boss teleporter.

And wreck my framerate for doing so :<

[Syklo]

And wreck my framerate for doing so :<
Only for 30 seconds >:D

But it's not like i can play much today....if at all.

Stupid heatwave.