Old pro at PSZ looking for advice

[Arrow]

EDIT: 2/4/13
Ok so my initial questions have been answered, now I'm going to move into trying to figure out character build.

What I'm considering:
- Fighter main class with either Force or Techer subclass
- Double Sabers main weapon with Gunslash backup (I'm also curious about the twin daggers...because they don't look like daggers...)
- Use of Resta (Megiverse?) and Anti, or anything similar, as leisure heal and mates as emergency heal.
- A mag with emphasis on the "Skill" stat...maybe...(looking at how the mags look alittle...)

Some advice on if this is a decent build idea or if there's an alternative way of going about this.


>Old questions that I feel have been answered quite well.
[SPOILER-BOX]Well, after about 2-3 yrs I'm trying to get back into things with PSO2 but I have a few questions that probably wouldn't be avoidable even if it was out in NA with English everything.
Primarily I'm trying to figure out the differences between PSZ game mechanics and PSO2.

For starters:

Mags

In PSZ, everyone had a mag floating about them. So far, I've noticed that this is not the case in PSO2. So is there a "timer" system or something that keeps the mags from being equiped all the time? (And I realize there's probably a guide for this, but I'm having fun trying to find it ^^;)
Weapons

Gunblades/Gunslashes: Gravitated to these due to being a familiar sight from PSZ and something I was ":evil:" with. So far I am back in my element with them (just sad it's not the same "shotgun" style as in PSZ). I would actually like to know some pros and cons on the future versions of these. Also I want to know how I could balance out the ATP for both the melee and range aspect, as I tend to use both equally in combat.
Double Sabers: The reason why I want to know more bout these is because these wer my weapons of choice in PSZ due to ATP rate and splash range
Sabers: Don't know if these are in PSO2 at all... I'm again trying to find similarities with PSZ. Those regular short swords with a mean attack rate, (I forgot some of the acronyms...)
Techs.

Ok so main question here is that in PSZ you could alwasy use techs. In PSO2, is it only available for force weapons, cause I can't seem to set them...probably just me...
Resta and (ugh been too long...the status cure tech.): These was my godsend in PSZ as a HUmar. Will I have access to them as a HUmar? (or are they called something else?)
Tech elements: Bit more than just Fire, Ice, and Electric...so I want to know the pros and cons for all.
Classes

Sort of ties in with the techs...I noticed that I can change my class at will? is this true? no catch? (haven't tried it because I am worried about a catch since I saw scape dolls require money money. (paranoid))


*To be continued* I has more questions...
Unless there is a complete guide that I can't seem to find, could someone just give me the link and I'll be on my way ^^;[/SPOILER-BOX]

[Rayden]

In PSZ, everyone had a mag floating about them. So far, I've noticed that this is not the case in PSO2. So is there a "timer" system or something that keeps the mags from being equiped all the time?
Everyone gets a mag (once you get to a certain level, I think), but you can't see the mags on other players when you're in the lobby. You can see them in games.


Gunblades/Gunslashes: Gravitated to these due to being a familiar sight from PSZ and something I was ":evil:" with. So far I am back in my element with them (just sad it's not the same "shotgun" style as in PSZ). I would actually like to know some pros and cons on the future versions of these.
They're not that great in my opinion. Hunters and fighters get better melee weapons (again, in my opinion). I can't comment on how the gun side compares to ranger or gunner weapons, but I doubt it's very good there either.


Double Sabers: The reason why I want to know more bout these is because these wer my weapons of choice in PSZ due to ATP rate and splash range
Double sabers have great DPS and mobility, but they can also be risky to use as none (or at least very few) of the PAs can be cancelled after they are started. Their attacks are good at hitting multiple targets at a fair range, and they come with a special attack that can create a whirlwind around you which damages nearby targets.


Sabers: Don't know if these are in PSO2 at all... I'm again trying to find similarities with PSZ. Those regular short swords with a mean attack rate, (I forgot some of the acronyms...)
They don't exist, unfortunately. :( I wish they did. Gunslashes are the new sabers.


Ok so main question here is that in PSZ you could alwasy use techs. In PSO2, is it only available for force weapons, cause I can't seem to set them...probably just me...
You don't need a force weapon equipped to use techniques. They can be set on the subpalette and used no matter what weapon you have equipped. However, only forces and techers can cast techniques. If you want to have access to techniques as a melee character, you would need to subclass either force or techer.



Sort of ties in with the techs...I noticed that I can change my class at will? is this true? no catch? (haven't tried it because I am worried about a catch since I saw scape dolls require money money. (paranoid))
Yes. You can change at any time, at no cost, with no permanent consequences. Keep in mind that anything you have equipped will get unequipped and/or removed from your palettes if the new class can't use them, which can be a bit of a pain. It just means you need to set it up again though, not a huge deal. Each class has a separate level, so if you change to a new class you'll be starting back at level 1. If you change back to your original class, you'll go back to whatever level you have for that class.

[Arrow]

Everyone gets a mag (once you get to a certain level, I think), but you can't see the mags on other players when you're in the lobby. You can see them in games.

Ok thanks for clearing this up. The thing was is that I thought I saw one in the lobby, hence my confusion there.



They're not that great in my opinion. Hunters and fighters get better melee weapons (again, in my opinion). I can't comment on how the gun side compares to ranger or gunner weapons, but I doubt it's very good there either.

hm so if it were possible (but appears it isn't) using a ranged weapon in one "palatte" and a good melee weapon in another would be a better solution? But I remember seeing that ranged weapons can't be equiped for a HUmar, unlike PSZ...?



Double sabers have great DPS and mobility, but they can also be risky to use as none (or at least very few) of the PAs can be cancelled after they are started. Their attacks are good at hitting multiple targets at a fair range, and they come with a special attack that can create a whirlwind around you which damages nearby targets.

So pretty much the same as in PSZ...good.



They don't exist, unfortunately. :( I wish they did. Gunslashes are the new sabers.

It seemed like the Gunslashes replaced them, cause they seem to have decent melee...



You don't need a force weapon equipped to use techniques. They can be set on the subpalette and used no matter what weapon you have equipped. However, only forces and techers can cast techniques. If you want to have access to techniques as a melee character, you would need to subclass either force or techer.

So when I tried to set a tech...it wouldn't let me. I'll have to tinker more with that...
And then by "can use a tech but can't cast a tech" that means like instead of in PSZ, where I could charge, say...resta, it would affect the party, It would not be an AOE tech and only affect me?

Also, I noticed that everything doesn't work off of lvl, but rather stats. So when would I be able to get Resta?



Yes. You can change at any time, at no cost, with no permanent consequences. Keep in mind that anything you have equipped will get unequipped and/or removed from your palettes if the new class can't use them, which can be a bit of a pain. It just means you need to set it up again though, not a huge deal. Each class has a separate level, so if you change to a new class you'll be starting back at level 1. If you change back to your original class, you'll go back to whatever level you have for that class.

So stats would not carry over if I did change to say RAmar in order to boost Gunslashes' ranged ATP?


And thanks for helping me out. Guess it's impossible to transition from one game to the other without some learning curve... ^^;

[UnLucky]

Ok thanks for clearing this up. The thing was is that I thought I saw one in the lobby, hence my confusion there.You can see your own. Maybe you can see special mags people paid real cash for (appearance only) but I can't say for sure.


hm so if it were possible (but appears it isn't) using a ranged weapon in one "palatte" and a good melee weapon in another would be a better solution? But I remember seeing that ranged weapons can't be equiped for a HUmar, unlike PSZ...?The Gunslash can be equipped by any class, but you're right, there aren't many ranged weapons you can equip as a Hunter. Specific items can be designated as all-class, though, so lots of people hunt for those.


It seemed like the Gunslashes replaced them, cause they seem to have decent melee...Decent maybe, but they're more focused on the ranged aspect, and you generally have better melee options available.


So when I tried to set a tech...it wouldn't let me. I'll have to tinker more with that...
And then by "can use a tech but can't cast a tech" that means like instead of in PSZ, where I could charge, say...resta, it would affect the party, It would not be an AOE tech and only affect me?

Also, I noticed that everything doesn't work off of lvl, but rather stats. So when would I be able to get Resta?
If you have the required Atk stat, you can learn any technic or photon art. You won't be able to use them unless you have the proper class as a main or sub. And you can only equip your main class's weapon types. So even if you found an all-class Double Saber, you can't use its PAs unless you have Fighter on you somewhere. Same thing goes for technics, which stay largely the same as long as you can cast them (just a difference in T-Atk for damage/heal values). Oh also, you can still use techs/PAs if your stat falls below the required amount to learn them in the first place.


So stats would not carry over if I did change to say RAmar in order to boost Gunslashes' ranged ATP?
You gain 20% of your subclass's base stats, up to the equivalent level of your main class if your sub is higher. As in, a lv20 main and lv20 sub would see the same bonus as a lv20 main and lv40 sub. You keep the entire skill tree, though.

[Arrow]

You can see your own. Maybe you can see special mags people paid real cash for (appearance only) but I can't say for sure.

Ok that would make more sense.


The Gunslash can be equipped by any class, but you're right, there aren't many ranged weapons you can equip as a Hunter. Specific items can be designated as all-class, though, so lots of people hunt for those.

Rare items I presume?


Decent maybe, but they're more focused on the ranged aspect, and you generally have better melee options available.

If you have the required Atk stat, you can learn any technic or photon art. You won't be able to use them unless you have the proper class as a main or sub. And you can only equip your main class's weapon types. So even if you found an all-class Double Saber, you can't use its PAs unless you have Fighter on you somewhere. Same thing goes for technics, which stay largely the same as long as you can cast them (just a difference in T-Atk for damage/heal values). Oh also, you can still use techs/PAs if your stat falls below the required amount to learn them in the first place.

You gain 20% of your subclass's base stats, up to the equivalent level of your main class if your sub is higher. As in, a lv20 main and lv20 sub would see the same bonus as a lv20 main and lv40 sub. You keep the entire skill tree, though.


So if I were to persue Gunslashes, I would then want a backup melee...
And you mentioned subclasses. So I can not only be a HUmar only at one time, I could be like a hybrid between, say HU and RA or FO? And I'm detecting that those are not the only 3 designations?

PSZ was so much simpler...
So if I wanted say Resta, I would want to lvl up Force class? Again...this whole concept of subclasses is going to throw me for a loop...especially considering I can't see where that designation would be (due to lack of being able to read Japanese).

- Can't get my thoughts organized... -

And so when I look at the menu, I see the "Change Class" option and then I see the HU, RA, and FO classes. Is the subclass system based on this, where if I lvled up say the FO class, I would then have the sub option of using better techs/ using force weapons? Or is it only stats?

[Rayden]

And you mentioned subclasses. So I can not only be a HUmar only at one time, I could be like a hybrid between, say HU and RA or FO? And I'm detecting that those are not the only 3 designations?
There are currently six classes: hunter, fighter, ranger, gunner, force, and techer. Three of those classes need to be unlocked by getting the closely-related class to level 30 and completing a client order. You can choose any two separate classes to have at the same time, with one of them as a main class and the other as a subclass. For example, you could be a fighter/hunter or a hunter/force or a hunter/techer.


So if I wanted say Resta, I would want to lvl up Force class?
Yes. If you wanted to be a hunter with Resta, you would need either force or techer as your subclass. The subclass would need to be levelled up separately. Only your main class can gain experience, so if you wanted to be a hunter/force, you would also need to run as a force/hunter (or at least force/something) sometimes to level up the force class. Personally, I don't think it's worth it just for Resta.


Again...this whole concept of subclasses is going to throw me for a loop...especially considering I can't see where that designation would be (due to lack of being able to read Japanese).
Get the English patch.


And so when I look at the menu, I see the "Change Class" option and then I see the HU, RA, and FO classes. Is the subclass system based on this, where if I lvled up say the FO class, I would then have the sub option of using better techs/ using force weapons? Or is it only stats?
Your subclass gives you three things: stat bonuses, access to its photon arts or techniques, and skills. The last two are much more important than the stat bonuses, in my opinion.

[Arrow]

There are currently six classes: hunter, fighter, ranger, gunner, force, and techer. Three of those classes need to be unlocked by getting the closely-related class to level 30 and completing a client order. You can choose any two separate classes to have at the same time, with one of them as a main class and the other as a subclass. For example, you could be a fighter/hunter or a hunter/force or a hunter/techer.

Ok makes sense now...



Yes. If you wanted to be a hunter with Resta, you would need either force or techer as your subclass. The subclass would need to be levelled up separately. Only your main class can gain experience, so if you wanted to be a hunter/force, you would also need to run as a force/hunter (or at least force/something) sometimes to level up the force class. Personally, I don't think it's worth it just for Resta.

Well, I'm working off of the PSZ mentality, where Resta is the heal tech.
And then there's the other tech that cures status...can't remember off the top of my head right now what it's called.
So, again, working off of PSZ, I would figure Resta would be beneficial in comparison to the mates (as a non-emergency thing, even though I would use Resta in PSZ as almost a primary to conserve mates unless I ran out of PP)...
unless there's a catch.



Get the English patch.
I have an english patch that translates the menu items (is there a more complete one I don't know about?)



Your subclass gives you three things: stat bonuses, access to its photon arts or techniques, and skills. The last two are much more important than the stat bonuses, in my opinion.

But weapons would not be available (unless the all-class), just the PA and Techs...
ok makes sense now.

[blace]

Just throwing in that the patch only translates things that are client sided. Weapons and units remain server sided.

[Arrow]

Just throwing in that the patch only translates things that are client sided. Weapons and units remain server sided.

Ok so the patch is THE patch...
And something told me that would be the case.

[Rayden]

Well, I'm working off of the PSZ mentality, where Resta is the heal tech.
And then there's the other tech that cures status...can't remember off the top of my head right now what it's called.
It's called Anti.


So, again, working off of PSZ, I would figure Resta would be beneficial in comparison to the mates (as a non-emergency thing, even though I would use Resta in PSZ as almost a primary to conserve mates unless I ran out of PP)...
unless there's a catch.
I haven't actually played Phantasy Star Zero, but I have played other Phantasy Star games and can compare it to those. Sure, Resta can be useful. It's nothing amazing though, in my opinion. It needs to be charged to be effective, and that takes time. It's not like in the original PSO where you could cast it extremely fast and get a massive heal. I find it to be quite a hassle. There are also a lot of ways to avoid taking damage in this game (the basic dodge, weapon evasion actions, and weapon blocking actions), so healing isn't such a frequent task as it was in the original PSO. I've played a melee character all the way to level 55/55 and mates have always worked fine for me, and I've never found myself using up my entirely supply.

There's also a hunter skill called Automate Halfline, which in my opinion is very useful. It automatically uses one of your mates for you when you fall below 50% health, with no healing animation. If you get that skill to level 10, you'll almost never have to worry about healing.

[Arrow]

It's called Anti.
THANK YOU! I am now not going to go insane over that :lol:



I haven't actually played Phantasy Star Zero, but I have played other Phantasy Star games and can compare it to those. Sure, Resta can be useful. It's nothing amazing though, in my opinion. It needs to be charged to be effective, and that takes time. It's not like in the original PSO where you could cast it extremely fast and get a massive heal. I find it to be quite a hassle. There are also a lot of ways to avoid taking damage in this game (the basic dodge, weapon evasion actions, and weapon blocking actions), so healing isn't such a frequent task as it was in the original PSO. I've played a melee character all the way to level 55/55 and mates have always worked fine for me, and I've never found myself using up my entirely supply.

There's also a hunter skill called Automate Halfline, which in my opinion is very useful. It automatically uses one of your mates for you when you fall below 50% health, with no healing animation. If you get that skill to level 10, you'll almost never have to worry about healing.

I have to work on dodging... I tend to do ok then fail when its a super powerful attack.^^;
but so here resta charges to become potent...in PSZ it was charge for party effect...

So when does resta and anti come in? both need the one stat at a certain point...right? or is there an approx. lvl?

[UnLucky]

Charging Resta takes a second and heals four times as much per tick and has twice as many ticks (four) than uncharged, as well as a wider area. Costs 30 PP to use, and you might want more immediate healing through item use instead. Also it'll be weaker if you're not a Force or Techer main. Higher levels of the tech don't change it too drastically.

I never see much Anti use. You can just use items to cure status effects, or just live with it until it passes. Won't change much, if at all, with higher level versions of the tech or T-Atk stat.

[Arrow]

Charging Resta takes a second and heals four times as much per tick and has twice as many ticks (four) than uncharged, as well as a wider area. Costs 30 PP to use, and you might want more immediate healing through item use instead. Also it'll be weaker if you're not a Force or Techer main. Higher levels of the tech don't change it too drastically.

I never see much Anti use. You can just use items to cure status effects, or just live with it until it passes. Won't change much, if at all, with higher level versions of the tech or T-Atk stat.

well I'm crazy enough I would try and get them anyway. Cause I use healing stuff...too much for my own good. Plus I tend to gravitate more towards support anyway.

So now new question would be, what would be the pros/cons of a HU/FO combo?
Or because I use Gunslash, should I aim for RA/FO?

[Arrow]

Oh and thanks to everyone that's helped me out thus far.
The answers and advice is much appreciated.

[UnLucky]

well I'm crazy enough I would try and get them anyway. Cause I use healing stuff...too much for my own good. Plus I tend to gravitate more towards support anyway.

So now new question would be, what would be the pros/cons of a HU/FO combo?
Or because I use Gunslash, should I aim for RA/FO?

HU/FO. Pros: you're a Hunter with techs. Cons: Neither is very strong.
HU/FI (or FI/HU). Pros: Your melee attacks are really powerful. Cons: No techs.

If you wanted to go RA/FO, try subbing Techer instead. The PP regen is great when you have Weak Bullets loaded (which replace your regular attack). RA/HU, RA/FI or GU/RA would give you better damage, though.

[Arrow]

HU/FO. Pros: you're a Hunter with techs. Cons: Neither is very strong.
HU/FI (or FI/HU). Pros: Your melee attacks are really powerful. Cons: No techs.

If you wanted to go RA/FO, try subbing Techer instead. The PP regen is great when you have Weak Bullets loaded (which replace your regular attack). RA/HU, RA/FI or GU/RA would give you better damage, though.

Ok...
So lets see if I understand,
FI has double sabres...
And I know that double sabres are always going to be good for ATA.
So a FI/FO would be like HU/FO but slightly different...

Also when does the ability to make a class a subclass kick in? I can't seem to do it yet.

[Seravi Edalborez]

Level 20. Koffee client order.

[Syklo]

The only thing anti has over sol atomizers is that it actually has a duration.
Meaning that you cannot be "ailment'ed" in the anti-field for its duration.

Oh and if you're looking for healing techs, i suggest looking at megiverse
Heals 20-25% of damage dealt as HP (depends if you have dark mastery or not, as techer) when in megiverse field, uncharged or not.
Charging it just increases field range and duration
and only costs 20pp

[Arrow]

Level 20. Koffee client order.

Ok so I have a bit to go then before I really have to worry about subclasses.


The only thing anti has over sol atomizers is that it actually has a duration.
Meaning that you cannot be "ailment'ed" in the anti-field for its duration.

Oh and if you're looking for healing techs, i suggest looking at megiverse
Heals 20-25% of damage dealt as HP (depends if you have dark mastery or not, as techer) when in megiverse field, uncharged or not.
Charging it just increases field range and duration
and only costs 20pp

And when approx. in terms of lvls does that become available? Is it availabe when the techer class becomes available?

[Sp-24]

And when approx. in terms of lvls does that become available? Is it availabe when the techer class becomes available?

Techs are available as soon as you learn them, both Force and Techter can use the same ones with no problems.

Subclasses become available as soon as you complete the subclass order at, I think, level 20. You'll be able to sub Force right away. However, you'll need to unlock Techter by reaching level 30 as a Force and completing 2 orders to be able to sub it.

[Arrow]

Techs are available as soon as you learn them, both Force and Techter can use the same ones with no problems.

But in order to learn it the stats must be met for it, correct? And that would be dependent on lvl and class?

[blace]

But in order to learn it the stats must be met for it, correct? And that would be dependent on lvl and class?
You can learn techs and PAs on any class and level so long as you meet the requirements. Mags boost your stats depending on how you feed it.

[Arrow]

You can learn techs and PAs on any class and level so long as you meet the requirements. Mags boost your stats depending on how you feed it.

So lvls do increase the stats still...at least it seems like that (I would presume it would)
And I would guess that each class has different growths in terms of stats...

Ok so then my final question is:
What class or combination of classes is best with Gunslashes that still focuses a bit more on melee but keeps the gunslashes' ranged ATA high?
Or is it not really possible to have a balance (that favors melee slightly) of Melee and range?

[blace]

So lvls do increase the stats still...at least it seems like that (I would presume it would)
And I would guess that each class has different growths in terms of stats...

Ok so then my final question is:
What class or combination of classes is best with Gunslashes that still focuses a bit more on melee but keeps the gunslashes' ranged ATA high?
Or is it not really possible to have a balance (that favors melee slightly) of Melee and range?
Stats like ATA no longer take effect and instead is combined into 3 attack stats, S-ATK, R-ATK and T-ATK. Striking, Range and Technic. Gunslashes will most likely get the most out of being a Ranger or Gunner, but Gunner won't benefit from using a gunslash as its skills utilize twin mech guns. Rangers do have R-ATK boosts in their skill tree, but again not as useful unless you're using actual guns on the class. It's more of a support weapon if anything, as Forces and Techer/Techter have a few gunslashes that emphasizes on T-ATK rather than R-ATK.

Edit: to clarify on what I mean, ATA is no longer neededbas your attacks will always hit, albeit depending on the level of the enemies, your attacks might not be as effective.

[Arrow]

Stats like ATA no longer take effect and instead is combined into 3 attack stats, S-ATK, R-ATK and T-ATK. Striking, Range and Technic. Gunslashes will most likely get the most out of being a Ranger or Gunner, but Gunner won't benefit from using a gunslash as its skills utilize twin mech guns. Rangers do have R-ATK boosts in their skill tree, but again not as useful unless you're using actual guns on the class. It's more of a support weapon if anything, as Forces and Techer/Techter have a few gunslashes that emphasizes on T-ATK rather than R-ATK.

Edit: to clarify on what I mean, ATA is no longer neededbas your attacks will always hit, albeit depending on the level of the enemies, your attacks might not be as effective.

So it would be more beneficial to just focus on the melee...(which is S-ATK?) and not really worry about R-ATK? (As I'm considering if Double sabers are as good as I think they'll be...then I'd want melee)

*PS. when I said ATA I meant ATP...but you still answered the question ^^;

[blace]

So it would be more beneficial to just focus on the melee...(which is S-ATK?) and not really worry about R-ATK? (As I'm considering if Double sabers are as good as I think they'll be...then I'd want melee)

*PS. when I said ATA I meant ATP...but you still answered the question ^^;

Most of the PAs for it are melee and as such deals damage based on S-ATK. If you plan on using double sabers, a gunslash as a backup range weapon helps with PP recovery.

[Arrow]

Most of the PAs for it are melee and as such deals damage based on S-ATK. If you plan on using double sabers, a gunslash as a backup range weapon helps with PP recovery.

Ok so my strategy isn't too insane...
but I'm curious about the "PP recovery." To me the PP regen seems pretty fast...so I'm curious about how the strategy works?

[Seravi Edalborez]

Normal attacks generate PP. Gunslash gun-mode normals are quick and long-range, making them a good PP generator for any class. Most other weapons, even if they generate the same or better PP per hit, can't do it as quickly.

[blace]

Another thing to add to that is that shots fired in the air will bypass the reload animation after the third shot. Effectively you could recover your entire PP gauge by firing in the air as opposed to the ground with the pause.

[Seravi Edalborez]

Weird thing about that, it's not the third shot that's doing it. That's just the startup for the first shot. When I do (PA) > normal > normal, I never see the delay. But for just PP generation air shots would be better, yes.

[Arrow]

Normal attacks generate PP. Gunslash gun-mode normals are quick and long-range, making them a good PP generator for any class. Most other weapons, even if they generate the same or better PP per hit, can't do it as quickly.


Another thing to add to that is that shots fired in the air will bypass the reload animation after the third shot. Effectively you could recover your entire PP gauge by firing in the air as opposed to the ground with the pause.


Weird thing about that, it's not the third shot that's doing it. That's just the startup for the first shot. When I do (PA) > normal > normal, I never see the delay. But for just PP generation air shots would be better, yes.


So you all are saying that PP regen is caused by using regular, non PP attacks? It's not just an overtime regen?

[Seravi Edalborez]

5 PP/sec natural regen when you're not using PAs or Techs (increased by some Techer skills, can regenerate while charging Techs with a Force skill)
Normal attacks are the significant source of PP regen (can be increased with a Gunner skill)

[Arrow]

5 PP/sec natural regen when you're not using PAs or Techs (increased by some Techer skills, can regenerate while charging Techs with a Force skill)
Normal attacks are the significant source of PP regen (can be increased with a Gunner skill)
Ok that makes more sense now...


So lets see if I got a weapon/tech build set idea...
Double sabers primary melee with gunslash back-up for PP regen.
Resta and Anti for standard healing with mates for emergency heal.
And then I would just have to worry about class/subclass and skill trees...

From there I would need to experiment with the skill tree calculator...

Ok I must thank everyone again for helping me out here, just alittle more before I say I know everything I need to know.

[Rien]

Double Sabers normal attack regenerates PP fast enough...

[blace]

Double Sabers normal attack regenerates PP fast enough...

Not fast enough to get you out of trouble.

[SociableTyrannosaur]

really not worth switching to GS just for PP regen, especially on fighter. Step attack alone restores significant PP and switching weapons like that is just cutting into DPS.

[Arrow]

Double Sabers normal attack regenerates PP fast enough...


Not fast enough to get you out of trouble.


really not worth switching to GS just for PP regen, especially on fighter. Step attack alone restores significant PP and switching weapons like that is just cutting into DPS.

I guess at this point it would be more of my own personal tastes in terms of playstyle...
Plus I think I'll be still using GS just because my playstyle has me doing ranged until an openning presents itself, then move in with melee for the kill.

I think I'm at the point where I'll be now looking more at stats/mag and skill trees now.

I've put these new questions in the first post.

[UnLucky]

Plus I think I'll be still using GS just because my playstyle has me doing ranged until an opening presents itself, then move in with melee for the kill.Well the problem with that is attacking at range puts you "in combat" so you'll be slower in the approach. Unless your ranged damage is high, you'd do better just running up to melee.


What I'm considering:
- Fighter main class with either Force or Techer subclass
- Double Sabers main weapon with Gunslash backup (I'm also curious about the twin daggers...because they don't look like daggers...)
- Use of Resta (Megiverse?) and Anti, or anything similar, as leisure heal and mates as emergency heal.
This should work, though if you really want the most out of the Gunslash, you should be part Ranger. Plus then the only healing you'd really need would be emergency.



- A mag with emphasis on the "Skill" stat...maybe...(looking at how the mags look alittle...)Nooooooooooooooo. Ability/Dex/Skill is the least important stat, outside of completely incompatible types for your class. With only one mag, I'd rather have it be useful for just one purpose rather than none at all.

[Arrow]

Well the problem with that is attacking at range puts you "in combat" so you'll be slower in the approach. Unless your ranged damage is high, you'd do better just running up to melee.

So I would guess then my better strategy would be to charge in, spam PAs, fall back and use ranged to charge PP, rinse and repeat?



This should work, though if you really want the most out of the Gunslash, you should be part Ranger. Plus then the only healing you'd really need would be emergency.

So maybe FI/RA and not really worry bout tech heal?
Also I discovered I had Resta, and could learn it, but I can't use it...


Nooooooooooooooo. Ability/Dex/Skill is the least important stat, outside of completely incompatible types for your class. With only one mag, I'd rather have it be useful for just one purpose rather than none at all.

So should I go with a Striker mag or Range mag? If I went with FI/RA, and focused on melee with character, I would want a Range mag then?

[Rien]

So I would guess then my better strategy would be to charge in, spam PAs, fall back and use ranged to charge PP, rinse and repeat?

So should I go with a Striker mag or Range mag? If I went with FI/RA, and focused on melee with character, I would want a Range mag then?

I think we should familiarize you with the general Double Saber fighting style.

The style focuses entirely on Deadly Archer (A close-mid range PA that hits harder than any other melee PA for it's speed), and closing the distance between you and the opponent to use Deadly Archer.

How do you close the distance? Well, you generally run straight at it, then when close enough you perform a Step Attack (Dash > Attack button), then use the JA frame (the blue circle around your character that turns red as it shrinks... it appears when you attack or press shift with the DS.) to boost your Deadly Archer damage.

Because the Double Saber puts constant pressure on a single enemy (or multiple if they ever bother lining up), there is no point to back up, ever. If an attack is aimed at you and you don't have the time to move out of it's whole range, you can use the short invincibility frame granted by Slide Step Advance (You have to level it to 3 to attain Step Attack anyway) to move through the attack unharmed.

So why would you ever pull out the gunslash? Well, there are a few moments:
If the enemy is airborne
If the boss moves too fast to catch up to (Fang and Snow Banshee/Banther)
If you require a ranged mode of attack to shoot otherwise unreachable panels in a Time Attack quest
If you forgot to bring your Double Saber


Now remember this time that the mag you raise is entirely for giving you the stat boosts you need to equip the best gear for your playstyle.

I... don't think I'm going to go into gear this post. Maybe the next one.

P.S: Sorry for putting spoilers over the bracketed stuff. I felt like it was too much clutter. Just highlight it to view.

[SociableTyrannosaur]

really there's little reason to sub Ra as a fighter. you're better off taking a sub with actually useful traits rather than trying to offset R atk in such a sad manner. you dont need weakbullet which is the only reason to sub RA in the first place. if you really want to use gunslash you're still better off subbing HU and using Fury stance for the R Atk boost and equipping a GS that uses Dex to equip. honestly though you'll find that using a GS is really just slowing you down and preventing you from doing the damage you COULD be doing.

[Rien]

you dont need weakbullet which is the only reason to sub RA in the first place.


you dont need weakbullet

I should slap you for neglecting one of the biggest (and quickest to set up) damage boosts in this game.

The only thing that tops that is Chain Finish from Gunner, but I'm not going into that.

[UnLucky]

On a melee character, you'd never have the rifle out for the full load. It wouldn't be worth it outside of preloading for a single boss fight.

[SociableTyrannosaur]

I should slap you for neglecting one of the biggest (and quickest to set up) damage boosts in this game.

The only thing that tops that is Chain Finish from Gunner, but I'm not going into that.

You're also assuming he's running solo. WB for 15 seconds isn't really worth it imo and it's certainly not worth taking a sub over if that's all you plan to get out of it. Why dont you slap yourself for telling someone that a single debuff is worth gimping everything else you have?

[Rien]

There's also Weak Hit Advance you can get out of it. Single-Boss Fights are generally what everything boils down to in the end anyway, right?

At the end of the game we're still charging at Falz Hunar/Elder and soon the Chrome Dragon.

[Seravi Edalborez]

WHA only applies to shooting, though.

[SociableTyrannosaur]

And again you're still assuming he's running solo.

Notice how you're the only one pushing WB?

[Arrow]

I think we should familiarize you with the general Double Saber fighting style.

The style focuses entirely on Deadly Archer (A close-mid range PA that hits harder than any other melee PA for it's speed), and closing the distance between you and the opponent to use Deadly Archer.

How do you close the distance? Well, you generally run straight at it, then when close enough you perform a Step Attack (Dash > Attack button), then use the JA frame (the blue circle around your character that turns red as it shrinks... it appears when you attack or press shift with the DS.) to boost your Deadly Archer damage.

Because the Double Saber puts constant pressure on a single enemy (or multiple if they ever bother lining up), there is no point to back up, ever. If an attack is aimed at you and you don't have the time to move out of it's whole range, you can use the short invincibility frame granted by Slide Step Advance (You have to level it to 3 to attain Step Attack anyway) to move through the attack unharmed.

So why would you ever pull out the gunslash? Well, there are a few moments:
If the enemy is airborne
If the boss moves too fast to catch up to (Fang and Snow Banshee/Banther)
If you require a ranged mode of attack to shoot otherwise unreachable panels in a Time Attack quest
If you forgot to bring your Double Saber


Now remember this time that the mag you raise is entirely for giving you the stat boosts you need to equip the best gear for your playstyle.

I... don't think I'm going to go into gear this post. Maybe the next one.

P.S: Sorry for putting spoilers over the bracketed stuff. I felt like it was too much clutter. Just highlight it to view.

So based on everything I'm hearing, I'm going to guess my better options would be to just go all out melee with FI/HU.

And I'm going to possibly hold out on the mag deal till I know what equip I really want...

As for everything else, I would keep RA or GU as a back up class altogether (just because Classes can be changed and because I sorta can do ranged combat good...well who can't?)

...End result I'm thinking here now:
1) Class: FI/HU
2) Main Weapon: Double Saber
Secondary: Gunslash (until I'm completely familar with the DS)
3) Wait on mag until I know what to do with equip
4) Figure out Skill trees. (I think I'll throw in a screenshot of what I have and what I think I want.)

Ultimate reason why I'm asking so many questions is because now I'm just worried about getting things right the first time through. Also I'm treating my JP account as though I might be able to use it with the NA version (someone tell me this isn't true so I can just experiment on my own with this account...)

[UnLucky]

Yeah you can definitely play around with class combinations without worries.

Just not specific skill trees or your mag.

Unless you're made of money.

or have lots of accounts.

[Arrow]

Yeah you can definitely play around with class combinations without worries.

Just not specific skill trees or your mag.

Unless you're made of money.

or have lots of accounts.

Yeah I figured that much...really wish that the mags at least didn't require money...but eh they have to make money somehow.
but If this JP account doesn't work for the NA version of the game, (ie can't log in for some strange reason from NA client) Then I would treat the JP account as an experiment untill then.
(if this answer is somewhere obvious I completely missed it)

[blace]

Different server, different version, wouldn't make sense for log in info from one version to work on another. This version and the english version are entirely independent of one another.

A few of us are pretty much using the Japanese version as a test anyhow.

[Arrow]

Different server, different version, wouldn't make sense for log in info from one version to work on another. This version and the english version are entirely independent of one another.

A few of us are pretty much using the Japanese version as a test anyhow.

Alright so I'm not going to worry about this account.
So I'm going to go in and just experiment like crazy and wind up making the perfect build that I will never be able to replicate (because that's my stupid luck).

But I still would want to know some of the things just for NA release, so I could get it right the first time.

[Rien]

Well you only get one mag per character without paying, so here's the base stats for a level 50 FImar:

416S-att 329R-att 360T-att 299Ability/DEX

That's pretty low, but it doesn't take subclass into account. With a level 50 sub Hunter:

499S-att 403R-att 424T-att 358Ability

Both Lambda Jareid (The best tradeable gunslash at time of this post) and Lambda Failnaught (Best tradeable Double Saber) require 578S-att to wield.

This means your mag must have at least 79 S-att (topmost stat) to use.

For armor, you would probably want something like the Fanblair set (gives +45 s-att bonus) to start with before moving on to 10* rarity units. You would already meet the requirements to wear it by level ~42 or so.

[Blackheart521]

Well you only get one mag per character without paying, so here's the base stats for a level 50 FImar:

416S-att 329R-att 360T-att 299Ability/DEX

That's pretty low, but it doesn't take subclass into account. With a level 50 sub Hunter:

499S-att 403R-att 424T-att 358Ability

Both Lambda Jareid (The best tradeable gunslash at time of this post) and Lambda Failnaught (Best tradeable Double Saber) require 578S-att to wield.

This means your mag must have at least 79 S-att (topmost stat) to use.


I'd like to point out that max level is now 55 so you wouldn't need as many extra points for that gear.

[Rien]

yeah but 50-55 is worse of a gap than 40-50.

It's so slow that you should be wielding those weapons by the time you start on it.

[Arrow]

Ok so me thinks I'll go ahead with the FI/HU class set up and go with a Striker Mag...and maybe a pure one...though I would probably instead of going pure manipulate it for cosmetic reasons.

[UnLucky]

Ok so me thinks I'll go ahead with the FI/HU class set up and go with a Striker Mag...and maybe a pure one...though I would probably instead of going pure manipulate it for cosmetic reasons.
There's a neat trick to do this optimally but it's kind of a hassle and involves some planning and food juggling.

But the idea is simple. Don't let your mag fall onto a level divisible by 5 if it will evolve into the "wrong" form. This way you can get the evolution you like with (mag level)/2 +1 in the required stat(s), then only boost the stat you want afterwards, with one point every 5 levels in a secondary stat.

You probably won't care enough to do this, but there are more in depth mag guides available.

[Arrow]

There's a neat trick to do this optimally but it's kind of a hassle and involves some planning and food juggling.

But the idea is simple. Don't let your mag fall onto a level divisible by 5 if it will evolve into the "wrong" form. This way you can get the evolution you like with (mag level)/2 +1 in the required stat(s), then only boost the stat you want afterwards, with one point every 5 levels in a secondary stat.

You probably won't care enough to do this, but there are more in depth mag guides available.

Yeah I was reading those, and was tinkering with the mag "calculator/simulator"
I saw more varieties of mags than I saw in the guide so I was confused slightly when I saw that.
But I figured there would be a way (PSZ had the same "work around") to manipulate the evolution while keeping up the desired stats.

Primarily I'm looking at Cygnus, cosmetically speaking and because I would think that it would help with the "if I wanted to do ranged for fun" deal.

So I think at this point I'm going to say I'm done asking questions because
1) The JP account won't be useable in the NA version
2) I think I know enough to move on with just doing things
3) Everyone has answered my questions
and 4) I don't exactly care that for some stupid reason I managed to learn Resta but I can't use it...

...Ok I care about that last one, so my last question here is:
I learned Resta as a HU but can't use it...Is that because I'm not a FO? Is this dealing with stats again, where I need x amount of T atk (or w/e) to learn but y amount of T atk to use it? or is it dealing with wepons?

[blace]

Not being able to use your Japanese account isn't theoretical, Sakai himself in an interview said servers are going to be segregated.

Most online games with designated servers for other regions require a different account and are not linked to one another in any way.

[Arrow]

alright.
Dunno why I put that there to begin with...
guess I was still hoping for it to not be the case somehow.

[blace]

The reasoning behind it is also lacking, since there are games that use a similar system to PSO2's AC scratch. A unified server is moot at this point and the lack of updates from SoA is concerning. Things may change, but I wouldn't wait with bated breath.

[UnLucky]

and 4) I don't exactly care that for some stupid reason I managed to learn Resta but I can't use it...
Yeah uh, you need to be Force or Techer (main or sub) to use technics. Anyone can learn them with enough T-Atk, but as long as you are not currently a Force or a Techer, in full or in part, you cannot cast them, even with an all-class rod/talis/wand.

Also I mentioned cosmetic mags you can buy. They don't change anything else, and I think they might even revert back to their standard form if they evolve. You can also put any Photon Blast on any mag with an item, but that I know will revert. Best to do those kinda things when your mag is capped so they're more permanent.

[Arrow]

Yeah uh, you need to be Force or Techer (main or sub) to use technics. Anyone can learn them with enough T-Atk, but as long as you are not currently a Force or a Techer, in full or in part, you cannot cast them, even with an all-class rod/talis/wand.

So I really shouldn't worry about it unless I wanted to try out those classes.


Also I mentioned cosmetic mags you can buy. They don't change anything else, and I think they might even revert back to their standard form if they evolve. You can also put any Photon Blast on any mag with an item, but that I know will revert. Best to do those kinda things when your mag is capped so they're more permanent.

Ah, so I could just go with a pure mag and then give it the cosmetic item. These items are real money items I presume? Or are they tradeable for meseta?

[blace]

AC scratch or premium boxes that you need to import.

[Arrow]

Alright so that just means that'll be something I'll look into when NA version comes out.
Ok, I deem all questions thus far sufficiently answered.
...and I would say until NA release...but then I would wind up playing some more and come up with more questions.
I know myself too well. :lol:

[blace]

You could try buying them with meseta, but mag devices usually go for millions.

[SociableTyrannosaur]

I dunno on my ship they usually go for about 1.2mil certainly not cheap but not "millions"