Techer Class advice?

[ArcaneTechs]

I plan on finally leveling this up after so long (currently Lv30) but Im in need of assistance to throw some of the future SP's toward something helpful. Can you guys recommend me some advice on what you guys did? or suggest a path to choose?

As of right now, the 30 points I've used have gone straight to the Wand gear (points ONLY used/required to unlock the next branch) and straight to the PP recovery rate which is maxed.

What I'm trying to decide is if its worth maxing out Element Weak Hit, which I don't know if that applies to only when weak bullet is up or if its just the enemies natural weakness that damage is boosted

Appreciate the help

[Syklo]

What I'm trying to decide is if its worth maxing out Element Weak Hit, which I don't know if that applies to only when weak bullet is up or if its just the enemies natural weakness that damage is boosted
Element weak hit boosts the multiplier used in for elemental weaknesses due to poor resistances.
So a Foie on an oodan would do 20% MORE damage (if EWH is maxed) since they're already weak to fire, but the damage would be the same on say, Gu Wonda's (assuming no extra/less fire resist on them).

I don't know how you deduced that it could only occur with weak bullet up (which is by far, absurd), but that isn't the case.

As for other skills,

Having 1 point in wind mastery would be quite beneficial if you main as TE.
Territory burst unless you are completely against AoE-support type techs
Deband cut - Can save lives (in few situations)
PP Convert - Debatable

[ArcaneTechs]

I don't know how you deduced that it could only occur with weak bullet up (which is by far, absurd), but that isn't the case.

As for other skills,

Having 1 point in wind mastery would be quite beneficial if you main as TE.
Territory burst unless you are completely against AoE-support type techs
Deband cut - Can save lives (in few situations)
PP Convert - Debatable


It has the weak bullet icon on it with a Tech symbol next to it, sorta why I thought that.

Territory Burst is only extended range right? Which I may avoid buffs solely because of the lousy 1 minute buff time

[MetalDude]

If you have 3 points and don't know what to do with them (if you didn't already put more than 3 into Deband Cut that is), you might as well put at least one in TB since you really only activate it when it's most useful. I really wish it was a stance timer though. There's no reason a support class shouldn't inherently have a support range booster, especially with how mobile everyone is in PSO2.

[Syklo]

It has the weak bullet icon on it with a Tech symbol next to it, sorta why I thought that.

Territory Burst is only extended range right? Which I may avoid buffs solely because of the lousy 1 minute buff time
Yes, territory burst is just extended range (90 s at lv1, 110 or 120s at lv10, forgot which. And 120s cooldown so lv1 is all you need anyway).

However it affects ANY AoE-Support-type techs. this INCLUDES:

Shifta
Deband
Zondeel
Megiverse
Resta
Anti


Also you could just go here (cirnopedia.frostsabre.com) to look at skill descriptions properly (or in-game if you can read japanese/have english patch installed)

[Maronji]

It has the weak bullet icon on it with a Tech symbol next to it, sorta why I thought that.

...That same icon is shared by Weak Hit Advance, which does not require (but is boosted by (if applied correctly)) Weak Bullet (which has a bullet icon in the corner).

@Syklo: It's 110 at max. It'd be nice if it was 120 though.

[ArcaneTechs]

decided I'm gonna throw:

10 Points into Element Weak hit (Level 40 by then)
2 points into Deband
4 points each into Deband cut and Territory Burst (Level 50)
2 points into Shifta and 3 Points into Wind Mastery (Level 55)

How does this sound to you guys?

[Syklo]

decided I'm gonna throw:

10 Points into Element Weak hit (Level 40 by then)
2 points into Deband
4 points each into Deband cut and Territory Burst (Level 50)
2 points into Shifta and 3 Points into Wind Mastery (Level 55)

How does this sound to you guys?
Bad, IMO.

Also don't forget the 2 +5SP Client orders that you can get at lv30 and lv45.
2 points in deband? lmao. You need 3 to even ACCESS the rest of the tree.
Same with shifta.

For territory burst and deband cut, you need 5 pts in deband adv.
If you're planning on maining a techer, GET WAND GEAR (which, like wind mastery, requires 3pts in shifta adv.).
4 points in territory burst is kinda stupid, you get an extra 6 seconds; SP better spent even in shifta critical.
3 pts in wind mastery 1? I'm not against taht much.

Do you even know how the tree works? Try looking at one.
It's not a simple case of "Pick-what-you-want, when you want"

EDIT

Didn't read that this is on top of what you've already spent, i'm assuming? lol.
So 2 more in deband to get territory and deband cut? Ok.
4 pts in territory is really bad investment; 6 extra seconds (90s to 96s duration), really?
Might as well put the 3 extra sp in shifta critical or t-atk up 1.

You already have wand gear so why add 2 more pts in shifta adv. if you're not getting shifta critical?

I'm not against the 4pts in deband cut, that depends on you.

Personally:
I love poison ignition.

[ArcaneTechs]

ya you went a little overboard on what you were telling me, insults werent needed so I'm letting it slide, which is why I'm asking for advice on what paths to choose, of course i dont want points just thrown anywhere.

I first went with the poison route for the PP Gauge recovery skill, since i love my HP, im not sure i wanna do it again. I love megid as well but too often things die before its poisoned for me. so i'll invest in:

Territory Boost
Deband Cut
Deband and Shifta
may do Shift Crit
and Element Weak Hit is gonna be maxed

[Syklo]

ya you went a little overboard on what you were telling me, insults werent needed so I'm letting it slide, which is why I'm asking for advice on what paths to choose, of course i dont want points just thrown anywhere.

I first went with the poison route for the PP Gauge recovery skill, since i love my HP, im not sure i wanna do it again. I love megid as well but too often things die before its poisoned for me. so i'll invest in:

Territory Boost
Deband Cut
Deband and Shifta
may do Shift Crit
and Element Weak Hit is gonna be maxed
At least you took it well, and I respect that.
It wasn't clear to me, even though it should've been (with the level landmarks in these parentheses).

I'm very much against maxing territory burst and only prefer having it at lv 1, but if you insist on investing in it, go ahead.
I just grabbed shifta crit for the looks ^^
and the crit bonus is kinda handy.....(no not really).

But it basically looks fine outside of taht.

[ArcaneTechs]

At least you took it well, and I respect that.
It wasn't clear to me, even though it should've been (with the level landmarks in these parentheses).

I'm very much against maxing territory burst and only prefer having it at lv 1, but if you insist on investing in it, go ahead.
I just grabbed shifta crit for the looks ^^
and the crit bonus is kinda handy.....(no not really).

But it basically looks fine outside of taht.

I'm not looking for an arguement with you or anyone so I mean lashing out at you wont do anything and it kinda didnt bother me, I just asked myself (did he even read what I posted in the parenthesis?)

As for Shifta Crit, the visual changes? even slightly? or just to have?

[MetalDude]

Crit is terrible, it's just that you only need 1 point to have the extra visual flare on Shifta.

[Alisha]

heh i plan to do a melee TE/HU and people are all like NO you need to be a nuker with TE.

[Seravi Edalborez]

heh i plan to do a melee TE/HU and people are all like NO you need to be a nuker with TE.

Well now you're just a HU without PAs.

[UnLucky]

decided I'm gonna throw:

10 Points into Element Weak hit (Level 40 by then)
2 points into Deband
4 points each into Deband cut and Territory Burst (Level 50)
2 points into Shifta and 3 Points into Wind Mastery (Level 55)

How does this sound to you guys?
You shouldn't waste points like that.

1 point in Wind Mastery is +5% wind damage. 3 points is 7%. Not a big difference.
2 more points in Shifta Advance is +4% better Shifta. That means 0.7% higher base Atk stats (not including gear). You won't feel it.

Did you check out the skills on Cirnopedia?

I would really recommend PP Convert, though. Best thing Techer has.

Something like this. (http://ryuhiroshi.funpic.de/pso2/skillcalc.html?03tDIEIkbdIkbdIkbdIkIYIkIzIk0lbIn00 0000ib00000ib00000ib0000Ib00000f4OdqIbfdsI2J2qquO0 006)

[SociableTyrannosaur]

yeah PP convert is one of the reasons to even go techer at all. I assume you're subbing FO?

[Sizustar]

I don't really think PP Convert is that useful.
I play mainly as a FO and Te, both are Lv.49, and I have 5 skill tree for Te, and only tried PP Convert on the first one, I don't really use it that much.

[SPOnion]

On the contrary as a 55 TE/50 FO I found myself spamming convert most of the time. Unlimited nuking is delicious, especially when someone else is drawing the aggro (usually the RA or GU).

[Sizustar]

On the contrary as a 55 TE/50 FO I found myself spamming convert most of the time. Unlimited nuking is delicious, especially when someone else is drawing the aggro (usually the RA or GU).

I don't really run out of PP, Unless I use Fire Tech, and I find it safer to use Gunslash to recover PP.

[SPOnion]

Well, even with bolt sv at 10 I still find my character running PP super fast when all one have to do is charge and release. As long as someone else is drawing the aggro, FO or TE can safely dish out PP fast enough for PP convert to be effective. The exception might be those who could afford expensive weapons and units with +5PP on every item (or even better black wings set with all +5PP), but as someone who is still using the cheap Ragne set, PP convert is a great boost.

As for gunslash, it does work but I guess it's just depends whether one likes to stop for a moment or simply rinse and repeat.

[SociableTyrannosaur]

So you like gimping yourself? "safer" is a matter of knowing how to move. PP convert will let you throw out techs non stop for 30 seconds every minute and a half. if you don't have a use for that as a Fo, you're doing something wrong.

[Sizustar]

So you like gimping yourself? "safer" is a matter of knowing how to move. PP convert will let you throw out techs non stop for 30 seconds every minute and a half. if you don't have a use for that as a Fo, you're doing something wrong.

I don't really see the advantage that it gives me, as I don't really use up all my PP that often.

[SociableTyrannosaur]

Hence why you're doing something wrong

[SPOnion]

Currently the game is not that hard for most playstyles so whether taking Convert or not does not seem to be a big deal anyway.

But I do appreciate the fact that I have Convert in many situations, such as the volcano TA where I can sneak beneath the infected vol dragon and spamming gibarta literally non-stop. Freezing the legs is part of the fun and fully welcomed by my teammates. Also Forest TA II, spamming Zan against that big spider and annoying minions is...addictive. Against DF hands a nonstop Zondel spam also helps a lot. Or poisoning that quarts dragon.

[UnLucky]

I don't really think PP Convert is that useful.
I play mainly as a FO and Te, both are Lv.49, and I have 5 skill tree for Te, and only tried PP Convert on the first one, I don't really use it that much.
Then what exactly are you getting out of Techer? Deband Cut? Occasional Territory Burst?

Why not try FO/FI if you don't have PP concerns?

[Sizustar]

Hence why you're doing something wrong

I don't think so, since I can solo and party with my team and kill Boss and mob with no problem, DF, etc.
I do have it lv.10 on one of my skill, but I just don't have a need to use it that often, as I don't run out of PP that often.

[gigawuts]

I don't think so, since I can solo and party with my team and kill Boss and mob with no problem, DF, etc.
I do have it lv.10 on one of my skill, but I just don't have a need to use it that often, as I don't run out of PP that often.

It's not about running out of PP, it's about being able to spam your best damage techs nonstop for a period of time.

Be that the best AOE, best single target, or whatever, depending on your tree. Point is, you could be doing more if you so desired.

Which if you don't is understandable, I rarely have PP issues myself and when I do it's usually lining up with my PB timing during a PSE burst.

[Sizustar]

It's not about running out of PP, it's about being able to spam your best damage techs nonstop for a period of time.

Be that the best AOE, best single target, or whatever, depending on your tree. Point is, you could be doing more if you so desired.

Which if you don't is understandable, I rarely have PP issues myself and when I do it's usually lining up with my PB timing during a PSE burst.

I only run out of PP when I use my Fire Techs, but as I hunt mainly in Ruin and SKy island, and DF currently, I use Lightning/Dark, Lightning/Light combo, and I can spam my light/Lightning Tech without running out of PP problem.


Then what exactly are you getting out of Techer? Deband Cut? Occasional Territory Burst?

Why not try FO/FI if you don't have PP concerns?

Why should I use another class, when I'm not having any problem with my current class?

[gigawuts]

That's the same thing I do, and I'm pretty stable with it due to damage:PP efficiency and waves dying before I need to replenish - then being topped off again before the next wave.

[UnLucky]

I only run out of PP when I use my Fire Techs, but as I hunt mainly in Ruin and SKy island, and DF currently, I use Lightning/Dark, Lightning/Light combo, and I can spam my light/Lightning Tech without running out of PP problem.

Why should I use another class, when I'm not having any problem with my current class?
You don't run out of PP against (mini)bosses? Melee or switching to GS counts as running out btw.

And you would "not have any problem" by subbing Hunter or Ranger or something. You could be so much more if you just reached out and gave it a try. Stop being afraid of change and break out of your comfort zone. I only want what is best for you.

[Sizustar]

You don't run out of PP against (mini)bosses? Melee or switching to GS counts as running out btw.

And you would "not have any problem" by subbing Hunter or Ranger or something. You could be so much more if you just reached out and gave it a try. Stop being afraid of change and break out of your comfort zone. I only want what is best for you.

As I already stated, I do have PP Covert on one of my Skill tree for my Tech, I tried it, and didn't really use it unless I use Fire Tech. As I mainly use Lightning/Light, or Lightning/Dark Tech currently, I don't run out of PP, Just cleared VH Falz Hunar Emergency Mission Solo twice With my Lightning/Light Te/FO.

[UnLucky]

I've used Lightning, Light, and Dark before and have had to stop using exclusively techs eventually.

But if that is the case, you'd do better as a FO/FI is what I'm saying!

Edit: Wait a minute, do you main Techer and use a Wand? If so I can see why you would never run out of PP.

[Sizustar]

I've used Lightning, Light, and Dark before and have had to stop using exclusively techs eventually.

But if that is the case, you'd do better as a FO/FI is what I'm saying!

Edit: Wait a minute, do you main Techer and use a Wand? If so I can see why you would never run out of PP.

Why would I want to raise a class I have no interest in playing?
And I'm currently using a Tali.

[gigawuts]

Why would I want to raise a class I have no interest in playing?
And I'm currently using a Tali.

Because subclasses are a thing and you get the full benefit of your sub's skilltree.

I sub fo, don't play it. I sub hu, don't play that either. I still see great benefits from raising them both.

[SociableTyrannosaur]

I've used Lightning, Light, and Dark before and have had to stop using exclusively techs eventually.

But if that is the case, you'd do better as a FO/FI is what I'm saying!

Edit: Wait a minute, do you main Techer and use a Wand? If so I can see why you would never run out of PP.

Yeah I stopped talking when they said they never run out of PP as a caster. I knew something was off. They don't even bother with raising their subclasses either and are arguing with everything we say. Pretty clear they shouldn't be offering advice since they take such a halfassed approach to playing.

[gigawuts]

Or they don't play force in the same situations as you and don't like the fire tree, and don't mind dealing a bit less damage by not using it.

Some people don't like using either the exact same thing all the time, or the most OP thing when 5 other kinds of things are offered to them that are roughly more balanced amongst eachother.

Weird, right?

If I'm ever playing in a scenario where my force would be running out of PP constantly, chances are high I'm not playing force.

[SociableTyrannosaur]

Dude I'm all for letting people play their own way but to say an invaluable skill is worthless because they basically don't tech and then following that up by saying subclasses are pointless is basically saying they're not playing the same game as everyone else and shouldn't be offering advice and arguing with people who are trying to advise someone on how to get the most out of something.

It's like they just came in here to stir the shit and I'm advising unlucky to drop it cause Sizu's not here to talk or contribute, just validate their halfassed way of playing. I don't care what Sizu does in their own group, but that's not the kind of person who should be giving advice to someone who clearly wants to make an effort.

EDIT: This to me is along the lines of someone running into a RA thread and telling the TC not to listen to anyone saying to get WB or weak hit advance and go as far into the trap trees as possible. It's one thing to play your own way, but if you know your methods are inefficient and unconventional, you shouldn't be offering advice based on those choices to someone who wants to get more out of their class unless the question is "how do I get more out of my traps?". Even then as soon as they said "no point in leveling subclasses", people should either ignore them completely or chase them off, because they're not offering real advice, they're offering lazy.

And if they DON'T know, then people need to tell them. Sizu clearly thinks everyone else is crazy and the lazy way to play is way everyone else should be swinging too. Maybe it seems intolerant to try to smack a little sense into them, but to me it's a disservice to someone not to tell them they can get more from their character if they really don't seem to know. Sizu seems to both not know and not care. Last person who should be offering input.

[gigawuts]

Yeah, that's kind of a theme around here.

But I can get opting for both light masteries (and PP Restorate + EWHA) over PP convert, due to the layout of the techer tree. That's what I decided on in the end, but if they don't add another light mastery or PP restorate in the next expansion I'm making a beeline for that PP convert (if we magically get 77+ sp :| )

[Rien]

I use TE/HU (or TE/FI) and wandgear beatdown, but that's just what I do because I have this mass of S-attack.

[UnLucky]

Kril is long gone. And so should I. All I'm doing is repeating the same thing.

Like great, you don't use techs at all. That's fine, I understand. Foie spam or Zonde pressure or Megid flinging, it doesn't matter, if you're attacking and supporting and playing the game, you will run out of PP. Techer's best trait is alleviating that problem. I'm saying a Fighter sub is more suited to your laid back playstyle than Techer would ever be, without changing any of your habits.

[SociableTyrannosaur]

Yeah, that's kind of a theme around here.

But I can get opting for both light masteries (and PP Restorate + EWHA) over PP convert, due to the layout of the techer tree. That's what I decided on in the end, but if they don't add another light mastery or PP restorate in the next expansion I'm making a beeline for that PP convert (if we magically get 77+ sp :| )

lol I suppose. I don't see much value in light mastery aside from getting down to the good stuff. Techer's tree is just plain ugly and has very little to benefit those who use it. if I could just get PP Convert PP restorate and EWHA and leave techer alone after I would.


...Oh wait I can.

For the sake of techers, I really hope they fix the skill tree a bit. A PPR2 would get me to switch back for a while to get the extra SP for it, but I mean it's just silly how even as a class who's supposed to be offering a more support oriented role than Fo, Techer falls way short. territory burst's AoE is way too small, Shifta Advance is just about worthless, Shifta Critical IS worthless. Deband Advance is just as bad as Shifta Advance. Deband Cut is ok, but (to me) just isn't worth the investment since they few times I or the friends I run with die, it's from making one too many mistakes and that 15% just isn't going to save lives that often. Resta is fine on it's own, poison ignition is meh...Even the increase in S def over T def is worthless since Fo gets better S Def through armor. it's just a shit storm of fail.

Well I digress. Maining Techer is more of a novelty than anything at this point. I'm not going to get into how to save techer cause everyone has their own views on it and I'd rather not open that can of worms.



Kril is long gone. And so should I. All I'm doing is repeating the same thing.

Like great, you don't use techs at all. That's fine, I understand. Foie spam or Zonde pressure or Megid flinging, it doesn't matter, if you're attacking and supporting and playing the game, you will run out of PP. Techer's best trait is alleviating that problem. I'm saying a Fighter sub is more suited to your laid back playstyle than Techer would ever be, without changing any of your habits.

I was gonna back you on this because I agree - if PP isn't a concern there's no reason to run Te sub. But I saw where it was going and didn't want to invest myself in that argument.

[Syklo]

erritory burst's AoE is way too small,

This seriously made me lol.

[SociableTyrannosaur]

It is too small I don't see how you can think a small boost in area like that helps anyone. I know you kids like to use it for the small increase it gives to zondeel, but to be used to actually make playing a support role (IE casting shifta and resta to help the team without chasing them around), it's not enough.

lol all you want, anyone who thinks it shouldn't be improved eats rocks.

[gigawuts]

On paper 50% is no big deal, but the reality is it becomes quite large. That, and, that extra reach is the difference between hitting and not hitting things.

Yeah, it needs some more, but it's not at all bad for 3 SP.

[Syklo]

It is too small I don't see how you can think a small boost in area like that helps anyone. I know you kids like to use it for the small increase it gives to zondeel, but to be used to actually make playing a support role (IE casting shifta and resta to help the team without chasing them around), it's not enough.

lol all you want, anyone who thinks it shouldn't be improved eats rocks.
If by "it" you mean Techer itself, yes it should be improved.

TB is good enough for me: Only have to wait for the 2nd tick before i start moving instead of the 3rd.
I wouldn't mind making it act like stances (10 min duration) or nudge the range boost a small amount, but it's fine for me.

[SociableTyrannosaur]

You shouldn't even have to worry about moving out of its radius when you're in the center of it.

Fine for you is not the same as not needing more. How egocentric can you get? "I get by with it, no one should ever want to get more out of that skill since I personally think it's 'good enough'"?

Sega, just mold the game to what Syklo says. He's the only person that matters.

The sad thing is you think "I think it's fine and he thinks it could be better" is "lol" worthy.


Troll much?

@giga I really don't even notice that extra 50% most of the time. I think they meant the area is increased by 50% which translates to only a ~20% increase in the radius. I know some of you guys swear by that skill but there are only a few times where I notice the reach doing more for me. Zondeel in particular seems to get almost nothing out of it. I do notice a difference but we're talking like...hitting falz when he's sitting back a little vs not. To compare to rl distance it feels like it's adding maybe an extra foot or two(being generous here) to my range. In most cases I don't get anything extra out of it. Maybe if I was using talis I'd appreciate it more, but as a Fo who has no issues standing right in the middle of everything or nuking from a distance, it just doesn't add anything to my game.

[UnLucky]

hey hey, we have a techer conjecher bananamana momecher (http://www.pso-world.com/forums/showthread.php?t=200744) thread for this

[SociableTyrannosaur]

it's fine, I'm done anyway

[Syklo]

[SPOILER-BOX]
You shouldn't even have to worry about moving out of its radius when you're in the center of it.

Fine for you is not the same as not needing more. How egocentric can you get? "I get by with it, no one should ever want to get more out of that skill since I personally think it's 'good enough'"?

Well I (emphasis on I) don't need more, but I welcome more. That basically sums up my (current) mindset though, mainly since all I hear/see is "More this! more that! GIMME MOAR!" without any real reason as to why.
In short: No reason; why bother?

Sega, just mold the game to what Syklo says. He's the only person that matters.
I LOVE THIS IDEA!
Maybe then I can bring hope to everyone by suggesting "BRING SABERS BACK!"


The sad thing is you think "I think it's fine and he thinks it could be better" is "lol" worthy.
That's very much different from what you said about the AoE being "way too small," meaning that my "lol" material would be "...he thinks it SHOULD be better"

Troll much?


Troll...maybe?
[/SPOILER-BOX]
You said you're done.
And I thought you said you respect other people's view on TE? You're taking my opinions of "___ is fine for me, lolwut?" seem like everyone else should comply with my opinion as if I'm that know-it-all.

[Alisha]

personally i think there needs to be more than one "best" techer build. because there are just some people that even though its derived from force dont want to use offensive techs at all except maybe to build wand gear. its kinda like when i played fomarl in pso. with the exception of grants i use techs or for aux purposes. rabarta to freeze rafoie to tag/break boxes etc.

on the subject of territory boost...that like many other abilities in this game should be a passive trait and not something you activate.

[UnLucky]

[SPOILER-BOX]

Troll...maybe?
[/SPOILER-BOX]
You said you're done.
And I thought you said you respect other people's view on TE? You're taking my opinions of "___ is fine for me, lolwut?" seem like everyone else should comply with my opinion as if I'm that know-it-all.
It seriously needs to be 2-3x bigger for buffs to land on anyone at all mobile. I can be way in front of people, cast a full Shifta, have them run through it, and maybe a single tick will land on them if I'm lucky. A bit extra 75% of the time when toggled is lol worthy. You act like it's more than enough for anyone.


personally i think there needs to be more than one "best" techer build. because there are just some people that even though its derived from force dont want to use offensive techs at all except maybe to build wand gear. its kinda like when i played fomarl in pso. with the exception of grants i use techs or for aux purposes. rabarta to freeze rafoie to tag/break boxes etc.
Well, best for what? There's certainly lots of paths to take Techer. Melee and support are both less than useful, but you can certainly build specifically for those styles. But if you do play like a Force, you're really gonna want EWH and PP Convert, then possibly Light/Dark Mastery.

[SociableTyrannosaur]

I said people can play how they want and I wasn't going to get int how te can be improved cause I don't want to get into that discussion. While everyone has a right to their opinions a lot of the "ideas" I've seen thrown out for Te are basically to make it into the most OPed class in the game(overcompensating like a mofo).

If something is fine for you it's fine for you, but just because you don't personally find a need for something, that doesn't negate the need. That's the egocentric part. "I don't see a need for it, so there is no need." like you're the only person who matters. Would you lose anything by the range being improved? No, so shut up and don't look for things to fight about. Shit like that is why so many people complain about PSOW in general and it's why I'm almost certain you just came in here looking to pick a fight with me.

I'm not the only person who feels like TB is underpowered. The buff to range IS TOO SMALL. I'm completely underwhelmed by the skill. It's so situational to me (as in the situations where I see the benefits are few and far between, I realize the skill can be active 75% of the time for only 1 SP in the skill and you only stand to gain from it) that even though it's on my subpalette, I often forget to activate it; and even though there's no penalty to having it active, the startup animation feels like penalty enough. The truth is the skill is very lackluster as a support enhancement.

I know you're a complete newb when it comes to the series but I remember a time where you'd hit a button(not hold) and you could resta someone for full health in another room. Compared to that, I feel like I need to be in someone's ass(I know it's not really that limited, it's called hyperbole) to resta them and that's after having to sit there and charge the tech for it to both have any range at all and give a worthwhile heal. By all means I don't expect PSO FOmarl ranges(not explaining this so don't ask), but I shouldn't have to be able to smell someone to heal them when playing a support class and taking a skill that is supposed to increase my support range. So no, the skill is just ok, seeing as I still can't sit at a reasonable distance from someone and resta without switching to a talis.

Anyway laughing out loud at someone who has a different view than yours is not the way someone attempts to further a discussion. That's a tactic used to shut people down. You certainly have no respect for me or anything I have to say and I really don't find any value in anything you have to offer ever really. Everything you say reeks of inexperience. You're entitled to your opinions, but you're either not the person to be commenting on skillsets or are just looking for a fight and I don't care to invest any more of my time hashing it out with you to find out which it is.


personally i think there needs to be more than one "best" techer build. because there are just some people that even though its derived from force dont want to use offensive techs at all except maybe to build wand gear. its kinda like when i played fomarl in pso. with the exception of grants i use techs or for aux purposes. rabarta to freeze rafoie to tag/break boxes etc.

on the subject of territory boost...that like many other abilities in this game should be a passive trait and not something you activate.

The thing about FOmarl was you could be a support monster and still spam techs. In Ep1&2 I had a RAcaseal a HUcaseal and a FOmarl and while playing FOmarl I would be able to buff resta and anti as needed but would otherwise spam RAfoie, RAbarta and GIzonde(or w/e else I needed as the situation called for) then switch to geist vulcans or my trusty green DS and regain my PP in a hurry only to do it all again. If something nasty popped up that needed a debuff I'd throw out jellen and zalure but really you didn't need to dedicate yourself to support. Back then you could do all of that and still contribute solid DPS. Even in PSU when I played AT, I got Giresta maxed out and was doing the same thing but realized later that I could drop some of the support in favor of the better damage techs by switching to FT and really no one would be missing much.

This game doesn't really allow for that and sadly the need for a dedicated support role is far less than it was in PSO or even PSU. Shifta 14 with advance 10 gives about 24% of your base stats which makes up for less than 50% of your total attack power. on my Fo/Te I think it's actually about 35% of my total T atk which puts the boost that shifta gives at around 8%. Shifta 14 on its own in this case gives 6-7% which is just laughable. Techer's skills as of now contribute almost nothing to the support side of teching with the only reasonably arguable counterpoint being debandcut which reduces damage by a fixed percent, but since deband like shifta only boosts base stats and base stats are often less than 50% of your total, deband cut is really doing all the work for that tech and even then this game's designed as such that you either survive the hit and heal or you die outright. that 15% may save a few lives but being able to resta the group and keep them from having to stop to use a mate is really the most you could feasibly do for your group except the range of resta is meager when fully charged, TB doesn't offer much more for it and in the time it took you to charge the tech, someone's already used a mate anyway.

I agree that techer should have more than one really good skill and a few desirables, but I just don't see sega stepping in and giving techer a proper overhaul.

[UnLucky]

^holyyyyy

I think you should have left when you said you would

[SociableTyrannosaur]

^holyyyyy

I think you should have left when you said you would

Eh...I'm tired and he doesn't quit. I thought you said you were out too. Guess we're both liars :-?

btw check your PMs

[Syklo]

[SPOILER-BOX]
If something is fine for you it's fine for you, but just because you don't personally find a need for something, that doesn't negate the need. That's the egocentric part. "I don't see a need for it, so there is no need." like you're the only person who matters. Would you lose anything by the range being improved? No, so shut up and don't look for things to fight about. Shit like that is why so many people complain about PSOW in general and it's why I'm almost certain you just came in here looking to pick a fight with me.
Eh, pretty much; it's why sandbox games like powder toy (and obviously, minecraft) appeal so much to me because I can do, well, whatever, and why I mostly solo in any game, i reckon.
Would I lose anything for range improvement? SP, perhaps but that's a different topic.


I'm not the only person who feels like TB is underpowered. The buff to range IS TOO SMALL.
I reckon I've already made my stance on this aspect, but if you could point me somewhere where support range is much larger yet not overpowered, I'd like to see (yes I've never actually experienced large-range or otherwise "buff everyone in party regardless of location" types).

I know you're a complete newb when it comes to the series but I remember a time where you'd hit a button(not hold) and you could resta someone for full health in another room. Compared to that, I feel like I need to be in someone's ass(I know it's not really that limited, it's called hyperbole) to resta them and that's after having to sit there and charge the tech for it to both have any range at all and give a worthwhile heal. By all means I don't expect PSO FOmarl ranges(not explaining this so don't ask), but I shouldn't have to be able to smell someone to heal them when playing a support class and taking a skill that is supposed to increase my support range. So no, the skill is just ok, seeing as I still can't sit at a reasonable distance from someone and resta without switching to a talis.

....oh wow....that's....pretty darn insane range, although I have no idea how big a room is in the first place. Seems quite OP to me.

Anyway laughing out loud at someone who has a different view than yours is not the way someone attempts to further a discussion. That's a tactic used to shut people down.
Really? Totally opposite throughout my whole life, but I guess that adds to my egocentric, and perhaps naive, nature
You certainly have no respect for me or anything I have to say and I really don't find any value in anything you have to offer ever really. Everything you say reeks of inexperience. You're entitled to your opinions, but you're either not the person to be commenting on skillsets or are just looking for a fight and I don't care to invest any more of my time hashing it out with you to find out which it is.
I comment on skillsets to question the reasoning behind such decisions, to further my knowledge on those skills. For instance, I initially thought Freeze Ignition was an awesome skill to get, based off some comments which I now realise may have been trolling, but I got it and noted how TERRIBLE it is. So yes, what I say mostly is inexperienced, but i wouldn't say "everything".

I'll quit when I want to (and yes I do/did want to spend some time "debating" about my nature/sentiment on the subject), which will be quite soon as I'm about to go take a shower.
Also, I didn't come here "with the sole intention on picking a fight with you." Just so you know, the reason why your statement on TB made me "lol" (which it actually did, no offence intended right now) was because, by comparison, it led to my idea of your expectation of what TB should be, seem very ridiculous (much like what you said about a time when you could heal someone a full room away)
Did you feel the need to attack my egocentricity to begin with? I can't tell you how you should handle me being around but what I can tell you is: don't attack that aspect of me; it won't change like that.

Just let me realise myself how much of an asshole I may have been; wouldn't it be more effective that way?
[/SPOILER-BOX]
I'll shut up now, but don't force yourself to read the above if you really don't want to waste the time to.

P.S. Freeze ignition should be more like poison ignition: it's awesome!

[UnLucky]

Yeah I don't think we need an all-target buff, unless it's on a cd much like TB. Or the buffs themselves aren't very good, like S/D are now. So maybe yeah actually that'd be nice. Laying down a Resta on the whole field would be way too crazy for current content, though. Pretty much invincibility for five seconds. But as it is, it's really hard to give people a Resta, even with a Talis, even with TB (already active even). They either run away or instantly pop a 'mate. Or they're dead. You could try a Megiverse, but nobody attacks when nearly dead, nobody stays in the circle, and it doesn't work when stunlocked/juggled/knocked down, the only time you'd really need healing.

The only time support reliably works is A) On yourself and B) When everyone is idly waiting around. Neither of those need extra range.

And Poison Ignition is still bad, despite being in every way better than Freeze.

[Sizustar]

Yeah I don't think we need an all-target buff, unless it's on a cd much like TB. Or the buffs themselves aren't very good, like S/D are now. So maybe yeah actually that'd be nice. Laying down a Resta on the whole field would be way too crazy for current content, though. Pretty much invincibility for five seconds. But as it is, it's really hard to give people a Resta, even with a Talis, even with TB (already active even). They either run away or instantly pop a 'mate. Or they're dead. You could try a Megiverse, but nobody attacks when nearly dead, nobody stays in the circle, and it doesn't work when stunlocked/juggled/knocked down, the only time you'd really need healing.

The only time support reliably works is A) On yourself and B) When everyone is idly waiting around. Neither of those need extra range.

And Poison Ignition is still bad, despite being in every way better than Freeze.

So a way to "target" Friends would be useful?

[NoiseHERO]

They could just make techer not suck.

give wand some PAs or something to mix in with techs!

PA's that don't suck!

[SociableTyrannosaur]

Yeah I don't think we need an all-target buff, unless it's on a cd much like TB. Or the buffs themselves aren't very good, like S/D are now. So maybe yeah actually that'd be nice. Laying down a Resta on the whole field would be way too crazy for current content, though. Pretty much invincibility for five seconds. But as it is, it's really hard to give people a Resta, even with a Talis, even with TB (already active even). They either run away or instantly pop a 'mate. Or they're dead. You could try a Megiverse, but nobody attacks when nearly dead, nobody stays in the circle, and it doesn't work when stunlocked/juggled/knocked down, the only time you'd really need healing.

The only time support reliably works is A) On yourself and B) When everyone is idly waiting around. Neither of those need extra range.

And Poison Ignition is still bad, despite being in every way better than Freeze.

Right, I'm not asking for what we had in earlier games. It's just support is so heavily gimped it hardly serves a purpose.

[Gama]

dont think territory burst affects resta. or was it fixed?

[Xaelouse]

Make support techs also build wand gear
Increase power of non-charged techs when you have bar in wand gear. Make it consume wand gear at a faster rate if there's any need of balancing. Make it a skill in the future instead, I don't care
More drastic increases from shifta/deband advance lvl10

That's all it needs.

And to the people that keep suggesting wands to have PAs, you're missing the entire point of wand melee. Unless those PAs don't consume PP

[SociableTyrannosaur]

Except wand itself is still a flawed weapon and what you're proposing doesn't do anything to make wand more viable. normal techs would have to get a significant increase in power to be worth using over charged techs in most situations. The rest of what you're suggesting only makes it a better sub.

I think wand gear should should double the effects of support buffs. Make S/D advance give a 50% increase, make the area increase from TB 100% instead of 50% and make Deband cut reduce damage by 30% when maxed. Simialr effects for Resta Advance and Shifta Critical(it would still suck unless it increased the actual proc rate and not the odds(example if the crit rate were 10% it should be 40% with wand gear not 13%), but w/e) But again this will REQUIRE that you have a wand equipped.

It doesn't have to be the best or even second best class for damage dealing it needs to be what makes support viable and a trait more inherent to maining the class, not something that can easily be imparted by taking it as a sub.

[gigawuts]

Wand is indeed an inherently flawed weapon and, unfortunately, a flawed concept at its core. It's a weak rod with amped up melee. Pure melee outpaces it, pure teching outpaces it. I understand some prefer spellsword gameplay (I actually REALLY like spellsword gameplay myself, always have), but it's just not being given the oomph it needs. A court edge probably does much better, on a hu/fo or hu/te. Even a madame's umbrella probably does MUCH better on a te/hu.

This is why it needs some baller PA's that set it apart from other weapons (that exist right now, anyway). Ideally focusing on mobility, letting you home in on a target like ground-based daggers.

[Coatl]

Except wand itself is still a flawed weapon and what you're proposing doesn't do anything to make wand more viable. normal techs would have to get a significant increase in power to be worth using over charged techs in most situations. The rest of what you're suggesting only makes it a better sub.

I think wand gear should should double the effects of support buffs. Make S/D advance give a 50% increase, make the area increase from TB 100% instead of 50% and make Deband cut reduce damage by 30% when maxed. Simialr effects for Resta Advance and Shifta Critical(it would still suck unless it increased the actual proc rate and not the odds(example if the crit rate were 10% it should be 40% with wand gear not 13%), but w/e) But again this will REQUIRE that you have a wand equipped.

It doesn't have to be the best or even second best class for damage dealing it needs to be what makes support viable and a trait more inherent to maining the class, not something that can easily be imparted by taking it as a sub.

This.

I know there are a lot of ideas floating around about giving wand fancy PAs, and that's cool and all, but I don't think it's all that necessary.
What Wand needs is to provide synergy with Techer, the class that is suppose provide support into the field.