February 28th list of improvements for the future

[Ezodagrom]

The list of changes set for a future update near the end of March through April.

I wish we could exchange 10 star weapons and units.


We’ll add a feature that will allow you to display 10 star weapon and units in My Shop
While Premium Set is active, you can purchase 10 star weapons/units in My Shop in exchange for a 10 star weapon/unit. You will be able to trade a 10 star weapon and unit at the Recycle Shop to receive a pass that enables you to purchase a 10 star weapon/unit.

What about Hunter Balance Changes?

We’ll buff hunters in the following ways.

Change the effectiveness of Guard Stance to percentage increases.
Change the effectiveness of Fury Stance to percentage increases.
Warcry users will take priority as the target
Since we make continued efforts to adjust the game’s balance, we will address these changes in a future update and ask that you wait a while.

I want to see Parallel Areas more often.


We’ll add a feature for it to appear in the boss’s arena after you clear the quest.
Since we will address this in a future update, we ask that you wait a while.

You should allow us to reset our skill trees when you add or make changes to skills.


Whenever skills are added and major skills are changed, we will distribute skill tree reset items.
Since we will address this in a future update, we ask that you wait a while.

There are too many titles dealing with weapon grinding.


We will stop adding new titles for (grinding) specific weapons.
We’ll establish new titles based on the number of times you reach +10 for weapons 7 star or higher.
We will establish new rewards when grinding weapon to +10.

I want you to increase the EXP you acquire when there’s a large gap in enemy levels.


We will raise the minimum amount of reduced EXP you acquire when there’s a large difference in enemy levels.

I want you to reduce the risk when failing a grind.


We will reduce the chances of risk when failing a grind.
We will proceed cautiously and address this in a future update.

http://bumped.org/psublog/pso2-jp-future-game-improvements/

More details about the 10* trading system and a few other things.


So Sakai received many comments about those future changes, so lets take a look at some of them below.

I want to be able to trade 10 star Weapons and Units

Excluding some items, you will now be able to place 10 star weapons and units in your My Shop. [As it stands now, 11 star and higher weapons take no part in the transaction.] (You can see where this is going.)
Prior to players being able to purchase these items, they can visit the recycle shop and exchange a 10 star weapon or unit to receive a [★10武器購入パス] or [★10ユニット購入パス]. In other words, in exchange for a 10 star weapon or unit, you will receive a [10★ Weapon Purchasing Pass] or a [10★ Unit Purchasing Pass]. Using the pass and meseta in this way allows you to purchase the item at the My Shop. Active Premium Set is required. However, some 10 star weapons and units do not qualify for this pass.
Basically, only the person who obtains a 10 star weapon/unit by themselves, can purchase another player’s 10 star weapon/unit.

Hunter Skill Changes


A percentage effect will be applied for Guard Stance and Fury Stance. (For example: ##%.)

Grind Risk Failure


By examining the situation when failing a grind, they have decided to reduce the chances of Risk that occurs.

When Skills are Added and Changed


When major changes occur, they will distribute an item that “Resets All Skill Trees.”

These changes should be addressed sometime near the end of March through April.
http://bumped.org/psublog/ship-1-is-full-pso2-vita-cm-future-changes/

[gigawuts]

HOW IS THE TITLE THING IN THE TOP FIVE LIST?

WHO ACTUALLY COMPLAINED ABOUT THAT?

[Ezodagrom]

HOW IS THE TITLE THING IN THE TOP FIVE LIST?

WHO ACTUALLY COMPLAINED ABOUT THAT?
JP players... :-?

[UnLucky]

It's a major concern for completionists.

Also what do they mean by the EXP thing? Like instead of a 5 level gap, it'll be 6-10? Or instead of garbage exp with more than a 5 level gap, you now get garbage+1?

[Drifting Fable]

Well, parallel areas in the boss room should help me hunt down Burn Draals.

10* trading for premium only is till just as stupid as regular trading being premium only. But I suppose it was expected.

[Ezodagrom]

It's a major concern for completionists.

Also what do they mean by the EXP thing? Like instead of 5 level gap, it'll be 6-10? Or instead of garbage exp over a 5 level gap, you now get garbage+1?
Seems like it's the 2nd one, if an enemy is 5 levels or higher than the player, you get garbage+1 exp (I hope I'm wrong, but it seems like that). :x

[The Walrus]

They really don't want to do the smart thing and just remove the exp nerf do they :/

[jooozek]

someone explain to me how is tying endgame weapons to premium a improvement
do tell

[The Walrus]

It's basically allowing premium users to trade 10 stars.

[gigawuts]

It's a major concern for completionists.

I think it's more likely that players complained it was too hard to obtain and grind the rares to get all the titles, so instead of fixing the actual problems in this scenario they just stopped adding titles :wacko:

You know, like when players said rares were so hard to find that it was easier to buy them, so to resolve that issue they made it impossible to buy them :wacko:

F2P design hard at work.

[UnLucky]

They really don't want to do the smart thing and just remove the exp nerf do they :/Well the idea behind the exp penalty is to prevent powerleveling, though you're already locked out of later areas based on your current level, and joining certain VH quests right at lv40 punishes you, even if, no, especially if you're soloing. Lv50 mobs in the brand new area you just unlocked? Nope, go back to Hard mode, kid, you'll get better exp there. ???


It's basically allowing premium users to trade 10 stars.
Worth noting is you absolutely need premium to do this, not just a shop license. I fucking called it. And you can't even trade or sell them the normal way.

[Z-0]

So people were asking for 10* trading to be part of premium, and now that it is, people are complaining it's going to be part of premium.

?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ????????????????

pso-w at its finest

(PS: You're not locked out of certain areas at levels anymore. All normal has no restriction, all hard has 20, all VH has 40.)

[UnLucky]

Yeah, but the exp penalty is still set up as if those restrictions were there. It's essentially still heavily discouraging you from later areas instead of outright banning you.

You still can't join a room with lv50 mobs as a lv1 for fast levels, so why can't you join a VH room at lv40 without being punished for doing so?

[Ezodagrom]

So people were asking for 10* trading to be part of premium, and now that it is, people are complaining it's going to be part of premium.

?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ????????????????

pso-w at its finest
Different people have different opinions?

Personally I'm fine with it requiring premium, now it all depends on how the trading system will work.


You still can't join a room with lv50 mobs as a lv1 for fast levels, so why can't you join a VH room at lv40 without being punished for doing so?
I don't like the exp penalty too and I think a penalty should only start if an enemy is like 10 levels or higher than the player, but, it's not like there's only VH areas with lvl 50 enemies, there's VH areas with enemies below lvl 45 too.

[gigawuts]

So people were asking for 10* trading to be part of premium, and now that it is, people are complaining it's going to be part of premium.

?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ????????????????

pso-w at its finest

(PS: You're not locked out of certain areas at levels anymore. All normal has no restriction, all hard has 20, all VH has 40.)

The highlight is that not everyone wanted it.

Of course, many were saying free players should get it. They are to be completely ignored.

Me, I wanted it and I'm happy about it - if you can use premium's player-trading without an additional cost. I have a lot of items I'd trade 1:1 with other items, numerous friends have found things I'm hunting for and v.v.

If they REALLY go with a market-only and/or sacrificial 10* system...fuck no. Just fuck no. I really don't think there would be a sacrificial 10* thing, it's probably just poor wording on their part, but...good god that would be terrible. Maybe they intentionally worded it ambiguously to get feedback so they can go "yeah that's what we meant all along!" when they side with the players. It wouldn't be their first time doing exactly that.

[UnLucky]

I don't like the exp penalty too and I think a penalty should only start if an enemy is like 10 levels or higher than the player, but, it's not like there's only VH areas with lvl 50 enemies, there's VH areas with enemies below lvl 45 too.

VH ranges from like 42-56 or whatever AQs can reach (with a requirement of 45 I believe).

The level requirements being reduced to 40 for all VH areas just sets players up for unneeded frustration since it seems to promote quick progression but then impedes it due to the level gap and exp penalty.

[Zorafim]

What about Hunter Balance Changes?

We’ll buff hunters in the following ways.
Increase the effectiveness of Guard Stance
Increase the effectiveness of Fury Stance
Warcry users will take priority as the target

I really don't see a change. The stances are pretty pointless right now, so I guess them having bigger numbers would be alright. And that warcry thing, how is that different?


You should allow us to reset our skill trees when you add or make changes to skills.
Whenever skills are added and major skills are changed, we will distribute skill tree reset items.
Since we will address this in a future update, we ask that you wait a while.

Oh sweet jesus yes. This sounds magical.


I want you to increase the EXP you acquire when there’s a large gap in enemy levels.
We will raise the minimum amount of reduced EXP you acquire when there’s a large difference in enemy levels.

Considering how easy normal is when you have a high level mag and subclass, and considering you can go up to lv30 areas on normal, this is pretty nice news.


I want you to reduce the risk when failing a grind.
We will reduce the chances of risk when failing a grind.

Ah... huh. Thanks. This is really, really nice. I'm still using 5*s simply because 10*s are so difficult to grind.

[TehblackUchiha]

So people were asking for 10* trading to be part of premium, and now that it is, people are complaining it's going to be part of premium.

?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ????????????????

pso-w at its finest

(PS: You're not locked out of certain areas at levels anymore. All normal has no restriction, all hard has 20, all VH has 40.)

LOOOOOOOL i don't get these guys. I honestly welcome it since you have to be PREMIUM to even TRADE anything. 10* trading sounds like a trade deal after all (offer a 10* to get a different one) instead of just purchasing one with meseta from the player shop like other people were saying. As for the exp penalty they just don't want people to reach the cap so fast they stop playing because there is nothing else to do. Maybe when the level cap reaches 100 or so they will remove it completly?

[UnLucky]

I really don't see a change. The stances are pretty pointless right now, so I guess them having bigger numbers would be alright. And that warcry thing, how is that different?
Warcry gives the user increased hate gain for a duration. It doesn't attract mobs to the user on its own, so it still relies on pure DPS. I expect that to change with this update.


Oh sweet jesus yes. This sounds magical.Waiting for the catch.


Ah... huh. Thanks. This is really, really nice. I'm still using 5*s simply because 10*s are so difficult to grind.
Watch the risk rate increase "but at least you won't lose 3 grinds each time!" No, you just lose 2 a lot more often.


As for the exp penalty they just don't want people to reach the cap so fast they stop playing because there is nothing else to do. Maybe when the level cap reaches 100 or so they will remove it completly?
Or they unlock all the areas by lv42 and anything they want to do gives them worse returns than older areas, then they quit before ever reaching the level cap.

[Cyron Tanryoku]

So...I will be able to sell 10* items for other 10* items?

But only those with premium can buy it?

[Zyrusticae]

I really don't see a change. The stances are pretty pointless right now, so I guess them having bigger numbers would be alright. And that warcry thing, how is that different?
Right now, War Cry only increases the aggro you generate when you attack.

This change will probably cause enemies to switch to you when you activate the ability.



Watch the risk rate increase "but at least you won't lose 3 grinds each time!" No, you just lose 2 a lot more often.
That would completely defeat the point and I'm absolutely sick of you fuckers making shit like this up.

Seriously, no one is this stupid, not even anyone at SEGA. Give me a fuckin' break.

[Darki]

I'm happy for the HU upgrade but I think the exp nerf should simply go to hell and plan better the level caps for missions. Exp nerfs are meant for open-world MMOs where you'd be able to walk into any area without having to apply for it using your level as a requirement.

If I'm able to get into a missions with level 50 monsters when I'm level 40, why the hell wouldn't I be able to earn the exp I get from them...? Why don't they simply limit the missions in a smart way instead...

[gigawuts]

Honestly, I won't be satisfied with warcry until it's pretty much a TB'd zondeel radius perma-aggro magnet, where everything in the AOE is stuck on the hunter, and lasts up to 10 minutes or until you turn it off, plus there should be an advanced skill to let you steal damage you deal as health. I don't know, 1% or something.

Why such a thing isn't a pre-existing ability of hunters already is beyond me, because lord knows HP steal was a major balancing point of past installations in the series for melee classes being that they had limited healing and took way more hits (in before ~but you can dodge and never ever get hit~)

edit: No but really warcry needs more. Gunners get showtime, which is warcry plus free gear boost, and that's still a fucking joke. Yet hunters are meant to take half of that skill like it's a good thing? Eh?

[Z-0]

Elder Pain is your answer.

Good luck though. =]

[gigawuts]

Well that's my point. They threw in Elder Pain as a complete afterthought and until it was added in absolutely nothing existed to patch up that hole.

Turning it into something where you heal a little but get a whole lot of attention while doing it? That's something closer to balanced (and fun sounding). A lot closer than a crazy powerful sword that drops, like, once a week, so 16 at most will have dropped in total by the time ultimate is out.

[Xaeris]

Very nice list of changes. The skill tree reset thing should have been there from the beginning of the game, but better late than never. Now I can spend my points with impunity. And reducing the scope of the exp penalty is also pretty nice. Hopefully, these changes don't take too long to go into effect.

[BIG OLAF]

I really like the 10* "barter system". It's a pretty neat idea, but of course weapons are going to tier-out and only certain ones will even be sought after.

Tweaking grinding and/or making it 'easier' again, SEGA? Why don't y'all just admit you fucked it up and rework the whole system, instead of going "okay okay we'll make it slightly easier" every few months?

[kabutozero]

well the skill point thing was just pretty obvious , most modern mmorpg you can reset your talents/skillpoints/whatever without having to pay real money... and being in pso2 where useful skills appear in every tier, it's really hard to decide if spend the points or wait till something better appears

[Soultrigger]

@Z-0, TehBlackUchiha, gigawuts

Im going to repost this from the other thread:

I think this would ruin the economy. What would end up happening is you essentially organize a circle of close friends, and each share your best 10* weapons. You simply share funds in order to upgrade god-tier weapons, because you're getting x amount of utility per people in the circle.

The point of binding (besides the fact companies monetize on it) is to make you commit to your weapon, and give you "ownership". The weapon represents how much you were willing to pay (or not profit from selling) to wear/upgrade it. With unlimited 10* trading, this feeling is nulled and you can be sure JP players are going to whine to no end their weapons no longer feel "unique"/representative of their "work".

And then there's Team Storage, which is the equivalent of trading. So what ends up happening here is some Team trusts its members to pool 10*s together. Then some beef happens with a Common member, who happens to have premium. Said person withdraws all the 10*s in storage and sells it to randoms for cheap keeping all the profit to himself. Then people whine when they realize how exploitable this is, and SEGA compensates everyone with 2 (-1) Protects.

If you don't impose binding, then what you end up with is not a barter system, you end up with a borrow system.

Which is horribly stupid, in my opinion, for more reasons than one.

[NoiseHERO]

So basically they're making 10* trading like pokemon's global trade station?

So every rare put up is going to be asking for the best rares! : D

[Insane food dish]

So basically they're making 10* trading like pokemon's global trade station?

So every rare put up is going to be asking for the best rares! : D

Almost but not close enough, if it was like the gts it would let you put any trash weapon up for trade.

Trading Vraolet for Psycho wand+108-)

[gigawuts]

I really like the 10* "barter system". It's a pretty neat idea, but of course weapons are going to tier-out and only certain ones will even be sought after.An intermediary is required to resolve this problem, and until we have a de facto currency such as Photon Drops back in the day this will remain a glaring flaw in the system, which is why I'm glad they opted for the market setup. Better to just use the market than implement a half broken barter system.


Tweaking grinding and/or making it 'easier' again, SEGA? Why don't y'all just admit you fucked it up and rework the whole system, instead of going "okay okay we'll make it slightly easier" every few months?

Man some of us have been saying it since day 1. They will keep tweaking and tweaking and tweaking it to pretend to be listening to player feedback. I was really surprised by the grinder cost reduction, like really surprised it was all brought down to 1 for 7-9* and 2 for 10*...but that was still just a bandaid. The flaw is in the losses. I don't think anyone would be nearly this frustrated if you never ever lost grinds, or losses were capped at 2 below the max achieved grind. Just replace all the ways to get grind protects with more grind rate boosters (chance for +2 at once, that sort of thing), then turn all of the existing grind protects into something else that's pretty useful. Maybe give new recycle shop options to count -1 protects as AC scratch items for recolor tickets (price would be set to ~200k+) and then 2x 0 loss protectors = 1 recolor ticket (each set at 50% of a rappy costume).

I am very, very, very much against games designed to intentionally frustrate players until they feel no other option than to buy something that cost either them or someone else real money. Make it voluntary, man. Make it an "I've had a lot of fun, and I'd really like to support this game" kind of thing. This game would benefit so much from that. I think people would be surprised just how much money companies make doing that, and for the people who said that wouldn't work for a freshly launched game...nobody can say PSO2 isn't well established by now.

If they revamp the grind system I bet it'll be in a major, sweeping rebalance update. Like, when they bring in the second story, with huge changes to core mechanics that result in class imbalances. Think v1->v2, and the way forces went from meh to having level 30 techs (still meh in ultimate according to people I know, but it was a huge step in the right direction and the best that could be done until a complete rerelease due to CD's not being updateable, lol).

[Sizustar]

So basically they're making 10* trading like pokemon's global trade station?

So every rare put up is going to be asking for the best rares! : D

That's not how I see it, How I see it is
only premium can sell "10* rare
And to "buy" one from a My shop, you need to have a 10* to give to the system, whether it be a unit or weapon isn't certain at this time, only that you be premiuma nd have a 10* to give to the system to enable you to "buy" from someone selling.

[Noc Codez]

Do we even have a choice as to what is traded? I have some really good units with 5+ affixes.. I don't want players giving me a crap 10* with 0 affixes I would be really mad lol

[gigawuts]

Due to iffy wording and the nature of Sega's sudden responsiveness to player feedback, not even what's been said tells us anything concrete.

[Sizustar]

Do we even have a choice as to what is traded? I have some really good units with 5+ affixes.. I don't want players giving me a crap 10* with 0 affixes I would be really mad lol

We don't know the specific till it's implmented or if they show it off at the next niconico video.
As it currently is, it can be.
1. Player A. has a 10* item to trade, Player 2 needs to offer a 10* to trade either to Player A or to the system.
2. Player A place an item in My shop, Player 2 in order to buy it, need to offer a 10* to either Player A my shop(Automatic) or the system in order to buy said 10*

[EvilMag]

So basically they're making 10* trading like pokemon's global trade station?

So every rare put up is going to be asking for the best rares! : D

Offer: Pico Pico Hammer
Want: Yas 9000M +10 with 50 light with Mizer Soul + Shoot III on it.

[Angelo]

Wow, just about every single request I had during the player survey was answered, including the Warcry buff and 10* trading.

I'll definitely be coming back once these changes go live.

[NoiseHERO]

regardless I still don't like the need for premium, if anything I'd rather they sell the option to trade IN GENERAL seperate or merged it with my-shop. e_e

The only reason they told us we needed premium to trade to begin with was to combat bots.

[Xaeris]

Something I'm concerned about is how they're going to hand out reset tickets. As far as I know, reset tickets only reset one tree. I imagine they're not going to want to just hand them out like candy, so will they hand out only one per account? Two, to account for subclass? What if you've bought additional characters or trees? Do you get extra tickets? Will they make a new ticket entirely that wipes every single tree you have?

Well, there's a lot of ways they can go about this, some stupid, some intelligent. I'll wait to see how they do it, since I'd rather not get carried away like last time, with the announcement for capsules. Still, I'm concerned.

[Sizustar]

Something I'm concerned about is how they're going to hand out reset tickets. As far as I know, reset tickets only reset one tree. I imagine they're not going to want to just hand them out like candy, so will they hand out only one per account? Two, to account for subclass? What if you've bought additional characters or trees? Do you get extra tickets? Will they make a new ticket entirely that wipes every single tree you have?

Well, there's a lot of ways they can go about this, some stupid, some intelligent. I'll wait to see how they do it, since I'd rather not get carried away like last time, with the announcement for capsules. Still, I'm concerned.

Most likely 1~3 handed out to the system storage.
Anymore beside the one or 3 class effected.
Or they can just do a whole server reset, and you'll have to reset your whole skill tree(Unlikely)

[UnLucky]

@Z-0, TehBlackUchiha, gigawuts

Im going to repost this from the other thread:


If you don't impose binding, then what you end up with is not a barter system, you end up with a borrow system.

Which is horribly stupid, in my opinion, for more reasons than one.

Other than the Team bank thing, which is still a problem no matter what you put in it, I don't see that being a huge problem.

Each player still needs a full set of rares for their class. So what if you can toss them around all your alts, or let someone have it for a week when you're away? That's good. That's healthy. But to all play together all with good equipment... you all need good equipment. At the same time. So what's the problem here?

The trading stops once you stop getting the Rare Trade License giga was proposing. Some players would only buy this once in order to get the only rare they want. This is a virtual currency sink, a real money profit for Sega, and the rare gear still effectively "gets used up" with that transaction. The economy doesn't get ruined unless everyone always had free trade with no tax.

[Dnd]

Something I'm concerned about is how they're going to hand out reset tickets. As far as I know, reset tickets only reset one tree. I imagine they're not going to want to just hand them out like candy, so will they hand out only one per account? Two, to account for subclass? What if you've bought additional characters or trees? Do you get extra tickets? Will they make a new ticket entirely that wipes every single tree you have?

Well, there's a lot of ways they can go about this, some stupid, some intelligent. I'll wait to see how they do it, since I'd rather not get carried away like last time, with the announcement for capsules. Still, I'm concerned.

There has been an item called 'All skill-tree reset' pass (Or something similar to this effect) has been datamined recently, in addition it mentions it on the website itself.

"Comments from the development team: (Google translate go! xD)
For here is that if there is a significant change of the specification of the skills and adding new skills, skill tree reset of all is the distribution of items that can be scheduled."

Anyway, once again sega actually surprises me, a set of updates that isn't completely missing the point, keep this up and 'some' hope maybe returned soon

[Zyrusticae]

'All skill-tree reset' pass
YES PLEASE.

I have like 10 bought skill trees, I would LOVE a chance to get to refine them. And come on - I paid for every single one of those skill trees, so why shouldn't I get the chance to reset all of them?

[Kion]

The price of the skill reset ticket is stupid in the first place. You can buy a new one, but heavens forbid you tweak it! Blasphemy!

[Emizel]

Yeah I'm confused as to why buying a new tree costs less than resetting one. doesn't really make sense. I posted it in another thread, but I think premium users who pay $15 should be able to reset for meseta.

as for the OP stuff, kinda disappointing, especially the clarification on "10* trading" and the Hunter balancing... (seems like they don't even understand what's wrong with Hunter).

[Sizustar]

Yeah I'm confused as to why buying a new tree costs less than resetting one. doesn't really make sense. I posted it in another thread, but I think premium users who pay $15 should be able to reset for meseta.

as for the OP stuff, kinda disappointing, especially the clarification on "10* trading" and the Hunter balancing... (seems like they don't even understand what's wrong with Hunter).

They want you to fill up with additional tree before reseting, same as Mag, it's cheaper to get a new one, then to reset one.

[Laxedrane]

This is great news. I am also kind of chucking though. Anyone think about the people who don't have additional skill trees. Because you know you can't reset the original right?>.> Unless they changed that.

[Soultrigger]

Each player still needs a full set of rares for their class. So what if you can toss them around all your alts, or let someone have it for a week when you're away? That's good. That's healthy. But to all play together all with good equipment... you all need good equipment. At the same time. So what's the problem here?

The implications of such a borrow system is much worse what it sounds on paper.

First of all, you pretty much destroy any incentive to use 7*~9*. This would essentially be the final nail in the coffin for said weapons outside magic stone recycling because it's much more cost efficient AND advantageous to share 10*s.

Secondly, you force people into forming networks. Solo players have it bad enough having to run maps by themselves. With this, solo players will now hardly be able to match other people in equipment because they have to front all the costs of upgrading themselves.

Another issue with a borrow system is that it invites a lot of needless drama: The Team Storage was an extreme example, but if people share money to upgrade one weapon and then a falling out occurs, who gets to keep the weapon? The person who held onto it last?

And then of course, because of the major advantages of such a system, you're pretty much forcing people to get premium on top of being part of a "premium network". It's an extremely shady way into forcing people to play premium that I can see causing many people to just flat out quit.

An unbind system (or server-wide unbind upon the introduction of 10* trading) is the most reasonable solution. With unbind items, it's profitable for SEGA and it doesn't introduce a bunch of needless problems to players.

[gigawuts]

The implications of such a borrow system is much worse what it sounds on paper.

First of all, you pretty much destroy any incentive to use 7*~9*. This would essentially be the final nail in the coffin for said weapons outside magic stone recycling because it's much more cost efficient AND advantageous to share 10*s.

Secondly, you force people into forming networks. Solo players have it bad enough having to run maps by themselves. With this, solo players will now hardly be able to match other people in equipment because they have to front all the costs of upgrading themselves.

Another issue with a borrow system is that it invites a lot of needless drama: The Team Storage was an extreme example, but if people share money to upgrade one weapon and then a falling out occurs, who gets to keep the weapon? The person who held onto it last?

And then of course, because of the major advantages of such a system, you're pretty much forcing people to get premium on top of being part of a "premium network". It's an extremely shady way into forcing people to play premium that I can see causing many people to just flat out quit.

An unbind system (or server-wide unbind upon the introduction of 10* trading) is the most reasonable solution. With unbind items, it's profitable for SEGA and it doesn't introduce a bunch of needless problems to players.

Why don't you describe PSO1's system and tell me about how it worked, then review the differences here.

Because this is a lot of noise and mixed terminology.

[Xaeris]

I'm having trouble believing that this borrow system would even catch on to begin with. The logistical hurdles and inconveniences seem to far outweigh any benefits, to me.

[Soultrigger]

Because PSO1, a game that was released like idk a decade ago, should be the norm?

PSO2 is F2P, don't compare those models as if they're 1:1.

[gigawuts]

I'm having serious issues grasping all this bullshit you're describing when all I said was "10*'s would be tradable but not able to be put on the market" Which is the gist of what is happening. Only premium users can trade. Sounds like only premium users can buy 10*'s. I'm failing to see the difference.

You're blowing shit way out of proportion and creating a pretty convoluted method for hating it when normal people go "I dislike that idea." All of your made-up-on-the-spot issues with it can all be defeated by common sense or, failing that, looking at how people have already solved said issue. Because you're not the first one to notice them.

Back in the day - a few years ago I mean - there were these things called forums, by the way. On these forums people communicated. They would, if they so desired, communicate that they wanted certain items and had certain other items they would be willing to exchange for them.

This system also existed in PSZ and a variety of other games, and I don't know how the PSP games worked. Nor do I really care to find out, or argue something that has been proven to work. I just wanted to see if you could manage to justify saying it doesn't work when evidence points to the contrary. Saying "it's F2P so it's different" is bullshit and you know it. 15 dollars minimum are needed for a 30 day access to have trading.

So...keep on typing I guess. I'm sure you'll be right eventually.

[Aine]

Something that was lost in translation is that Fury Stance is being changed from a base stat bonus to a percentage bonus.

[Xaeris]

Something that was lost in translation is that Fury Stance is being changed from a base stat bonus to a percentage bonus.

Yessssss.

[Soultrigger]

I'm having serious issues grasping all this bullshit you're describing when all I said was "10*'s would be tradable but not able to be put on the market" Which is the gist of what is happening. Only premium users can trade. Sounds like only premium users can buy 10*'s. I'm failing to see the difference.

Premium-restricted buying/selling/trading is another issue entirely. The point I'm arguing is that unlimited 10* trading is flawed.


You're blowing shit way out of proportion and creating a pretty convoluted method for hating it when normal people go "I dislike that idea." All of your made-up-on-the-spot issues with it can all be defeated by common sense or, failing that, looking at how people have already solved said issue. Because you're not the first one to notice them.

The point of all those issues is A) they're unnecessary and B) they alienate a large percentage of the userbase. A borrow system can be extremely advantageous if you use it. There are some people, on this forum included, that are so rich they can fund an entire party with godly equipment with their money alone.


This system also existed in PSZ and a variety of other games, and I don't know how the PSP games worked. Nor do I really care to find out, or argue something that has been proven to work. I just wanted to see if you could manage to justify saying it doesn't work when evidence points to the contrary. Saying "it's F2P so it's different" is bullshit and you know it. 15 dollars minimum are needed for a 30 day access to have trading.

The reason it wouldn't work is because all of PSO1 is designed around that fact that you are "premium". PSO2 is not, it's F2P, so you can't just take specific parts of a "premium" feature that worked in the past and apply it now as if it's 1:1.

How about addressing the 7~9* issue? Why should 7~9* have to be binded to accounts when 10* enjoy the luxury of circulating everywhere? That doesn't make any sense, even if you account the fact that 7~9* are becoming completely obsolete with the eventual introduction of higher rarity weapons.

[gigawuts]

Something that was lost in translation is that Fury Stance is being changed from a base stat bonus to a percentage bonus.

I know this was rumored on the PSO2 Facebook page a while back, and that it mentions percentage in the google translated text, but are we sure it's actually being converted to a percentage?

Because if yes, the fury stance up skills just got amazing...maybe. They could be like fighter stances with like x% bonus damage full stop, or they could be x% to your atk stats.

Both would be nice, but the latter has potential to be pretty bad depending on the percent. With 5 SP in fury stance you get 100 atk, which is nice when you can first get it, but later on it's not quite as nice. Which would it be scaling from?

There potential for both greatness and terribleness...but sega's rarely halfway boosted whatever it is that it boosts. The grinder cost reduction, vendor nerf, and matter board fix were all pretty big changes that were anything but half-way.

[Cyclon]

Good news for people wanting premium to be more valuable, and also for those who asked for exactly this buff for warcry... what? These people are still complaining? Uh okay.
Also hunter is getting more damage, so... woohooh I guess? Now we can spam the same overpowered PAs and be even more efficient:3

Waiting for the catch.
I can see a relatively obvious one sadly. Like someone said, if that's skill tree reset tickets we get, people with a single tree are basically screwed. I'm not too worried though. That'd bring up so much complaining from JP if that was to happen that they'd probably change it soon after.

[gigawuts]

Premium-restricted buying/selling/trading is another issue entirely. The point I'm arguing is that unlimited 10* trading is flawed.

The point of all those issues is A) they're unnecessary and B) they alienate a large percentage of the userbase. A borrow system can be extremely advantageous if you use it. There are some people, on this forum included, that are so rich they can fund an entire party with godly equipment with their money alone.

The reason it wouldn't work is because all of PSO1 is designed around that fact that you are "premium". PSO2 is not, it's F2P, so you can't just take specific parts of a "premium" feature that worked in the past and apply it now as if it's 1:1.[/SPOILER-BOX]Well it's a good thing nobody said anything about unlimited 10* circulation. Moreso with players requiring premium, so yeah. Some would get 10*'s and sit on them as they became worthless and replaced by new items, effectively becoming the new uncommon tier of weapons.

Also, it looks like I misunderstood what you meant by "borrow system," which is why I asked you to clarify it in the first place. Do you mean you could just loan out items to teammates? I'd like that, especially if they implemented what I get into in my block of text below.


How about addressing the 7~9* issue? Why should 7~9* have to be binded to accounts when 10* enjoy the luxury of circulating everywhere? That doesn't make any sense, even if you account the fact that 7~9* are becoming completely obsolete with the eventual introduction of higher rarity weapons.
This is one of those points that I never even commented on, at all. I didn't bring it up in the first place. I said 10*'s don't currently have a binding mechanism.

But if you want to know, I think binding is fucking retarded full stop, and that weapons should each have a unique property or behavior tied to them. Damage vs. utility is a balancing point that probably predates computer RPG's. You could get a sword that killed shit fast, or a sword that did less damage but also did something useful - and no I don't just mean +40 sdef with guard stance enabled. I mean actual unique behaviors. Some obvious examples off the top of my head are giving weak weapons things like flinch immunity during attacks that have dealt damage, tiered (mono-di-tri, in that order) mate replenishment on successful just guard in exchange for JG not dealing damage, a series of spike units that may inflict injury on the enemy when you take a hit but you also take extra damage...maybe an awesome thing to combine with automate halfline. Maybe one weapon has low damage but crits always knock down an enemy. This list could keep going. My ideal change to this game would be making many weapons desirable for many reasons, and making them more attainable in the short term - yet since there would be more to look for, hunt times would be roughly the same if not longer but players would overall be more satisfied since they're finding new abilities as they play.

Then the difference between 7,8,9,10* rarity becomes grind difficulty, and perhaps actual rarity. Weapons would be balanced according to +10 damages and their utility/bonuses/whatnot. PSO1 was, for me anyway, a game about finding things that did things, and that part of it was a lot of fun. A few games have done that since, and they were fun too. I'd very much like it if PSO2 became a game about finding things that do things.

If you don't want that, well, I bet you love that this game doesn't have them. That's fine, everyone has different tastes. I'd sure like to see them here, though. You seem to feel very fervently on this topic, which I really just don't. I hope you're not expecting anything else out of this, because I probably won't really deliver.

[Aine]

I know this was rumored on the PSO2 Facebook page a while back, and that it mentions percentage in the google translated text, but are we sure it's actually being converted to a percentage?

Because if yes, the fury stance up skills just got amazing...maybe. They could be like fighter stances with like x% bonus damage full stop, or they could be x% to your atk stats.

It literally says that Guard and Fury Stance will be changed to a percentage bonus, but it doesn't mention anything about the penalties, or whether it's a bonus to damage or base stats. Never considered the latter possibility, I just naturally interpreted it as a bonus to damage like the Fighter stances.

[gigawuts]

Ah, great. Thanks for clarifying then.

It would be a nice distinction between the two. Having fury stance be +30% striking & ranged damage dealt, +20% striking damage taken would be easy to implement, and pretty intuitive.

But with that said, guard stance edges into the role of the flash guard 1 & 2 skills. Plus, there's the nature of the damage formula. Higher def can mean taking MUCH less damage from some attacks, but not quite as much less from others. The opposite is true with fury stance too, of course. 200 less s-def might bump up a 500 damage hit to 600, but also bump up a 50 damage hit to 150.

So, having them be percentage boosts to the stats sounds better to me, to make them unique and separate from fighter stances and the flash guard skills.

Now the question would be whether these are applied to only your base race+gender stats (and your mag & skilltree too, probably), or is it applied after your gear? It gets harder to balance by this point.

[Zyrusticae]

You know, it would be nice if they would just take out the penalties on the stances.

They add needless complexity, often penalize the player more than the bonuses provide, and are generally just not very nice to have.


200 less s-def might bump up a 500 damage hit to 600, but also bump up a 50 damage hit to 150.

I just felt like noting that this is not necessarily how the math works out.

Defense is applied before PA damage multipliers, so any PA damage is dramatically reduced by even small increases in defense. However, I have no idea how the math works out on the monster side, as I don't even know what enemy attacks have PA multipliers, if any of them do (though judging by the way defense scales in this game, every attack by a monster has a PA multiplier of some sort).

[SociableTyrannosaur]

At that point why bother even having stances? why not just passive "bonus when X is true" or just "bonus" at that point. Having stances at least somewhat requires an attention span, being aware of your situation, position and willingly givingup one thing to get something else

[Zyrusticae]

At that point why bother even having stances? why not just passive "bonus when X is true" or just "bonus" at that point.
Because you can only have one stance for your primary and secondary classes at a time? That's the one thing that differentiates them from passives where they're active at all times and stack with one another.


Having stances at least somewhat requires an attention span, being aware of your situation, position and willingly givingup one thing to get something else
Neither fury stance nor guard stance require the first three, and both brave stance and wise stance would still require you to be mindful of your positioning because you'd get no bonus at all attacking from the wrong direction (as opposed to doing half damage like you do now). Getting rid of the penalties would just make them more worthwhile to put points into. Especially brave and wise stances, which actually are not worth putting points into past the first five until you max out the stance advance skills because of that stupid penalty (why it scales UP when you put points into them, I will never, ever understand).

[Gama]

i did like the skill reset thingi , so i can well fix my skill trees xD

[Ezodagrom]

Updated the first post with some changes that were made to the bumped article:

The list of changes set for a future update near the end of March through April.

While Premium Set is active, you can purchase 10 star weapons/units in My Shop in exchange for a 10 star weapon/unit. You will be able to trade a 10 star weapon and unit at the Recycle Shop to receive a pass that enables you to purchase a 10 star weapon/unit.

Change the effectiveness of Guard Stance to percentage increases.
Change the effectiveness of Fury Stance to percentage increases.

[EvilMag]

Updated the first post with some changes that were made to the bumped article:

I assume you need premium to use that pass?

EDIT: Ok you do. How Ricardo worded it sounded like Premium doesn't need that pass to trade them but free users do if they want. God damnit.

[Ce'Nedra]

Wish I didn't cubed 3 PicoPico hammers and Latria Rain now =/

[D-Inferno]

The tree reset sounds cool, but I hope it resets the trees on all of your chars, and not just one of them. Or they could give us a tree reset pass that is locked to each char.

[Ezodagrom]

Wish I didn't cubed 3 PicoPico hammers and Latria Rain now =/
Well, there's the Falz pyroxene weapons. :>

EDIT: Nevermind, there's a new article in bumped, most likely those won't work.



I want to be able to trade 10 star Weapons and Units
Excluding some items, you will now be able to place 10 star weapons and units in your My Shop. [As it stands now, 11 star and higher weapons take no part in the transaction.] (You can see where this is going.)
Prior to players being able to purchase these items, they can visit the recycle shop and exchange a 10 star weapon or unit to receive a [★10武器購入パス] or [★10ユニット購入パス]. In other words, in exchange for a 10 star weapon or unit, you will receive a [10★ Weapon Purchasing Pass] or a [10★ Unit Purchasing Pass]. Using the pass and meseta in this way allows you to purchase the item at the My Shop. Active Premium Set is required. However, some 10 star weapons and units do not qualify for this pass.
Basically, only the person who obtains a 10 star weapon/unit by themselves, can purchase another player’s 10 star weapon/unit.http://bumped.org/psublog/ship-1-is-full-pso2-vita-cm-future-changes/


There's also a few notes about some of the other changes.



Hunter Skill Changes


A percentage effect will be applied for Guard Stance and Fury Stance. (For example: ##%.)

Grind Risk Failure


By examining the situation when failing a grind, they have decided to reduce the chances of Risk that occurs.

When Skills are Added and Changed


When major changes occur, they will distribute an item that “Resets All Skill Trees.”

[Coatl]

Why didn't they address Weapon camouflages? I'm curious as to how they will go about this. Will they make it so that the weapon skin you want to put over the real weapon will be used up? That's very limiting if the weapon skin you want is worth 1mil+, or a *10. Even worse, when it would be time to upgrade that weapon you won't have the weapon you used up for the skin anymore.

I'm hoping you don't have to sacrifice a weapon to slap on its skin onto another.

[gigawuts]

You know, it would be nice if they would just take out the penalties on the stances.

They add needless complexity, often penalize the player more than the bonuses provide, and are generally just not very nice to have.


I just felt like noting that this is not necessarily how the math works out.

Defense is applied before PA damage multipliers, so any PA damage is dramatically reduced by even small increases in defense. However, I have no idea how the math works out on the monster side, as I don't even know what enemy attacks have PA multipliers, if any of them do (though judging by the way defense scales in this game, every attack by a monster has a PA multiplier of some sort).

Right, that was just an example. I don't have the formula on hand, but a loss in def can mean considerably higher damage from regular hits. Something that's many low damage hits, such as mizer missile barrage or quartz' grants rain for two examples, can go from lots of 1 damage hits to death because of this (edit: that's not to say these are 1 damage hits for your normal player, but with enough def they would be and a loss of 200 would turn them into instadeath again). That said, neither of those are striking. I can't think of anything that's a dozen rapid melee strikes off the top of my head right now.


Because you can only have one stance for your primary and secondary classes at a time? That's the one thing that differentiates them from passives where they're active at all times and stack with one another.


Neither fury stance nor guard stance require the first three, and both brave stance and wise stance would still require you to be mindful of your positioning because you'd get no bonus at all attacking from the wrong direction (as opposed to doing half damage like you do now). Getting rid of the penalties would just make them more worthwhile to put points into. Especially brave and wise stances, which actually are not worth putting points into past the first five until you max out the stance advance skills because of that stupid penalty (why it scales UP when you put points into them, I will never, ever understand).
While I initially agree, it's also worth considering NO stance as a stance. You can bonus your damage while penalizing your defense, you can penalizing your damage while bonus your offense, or you can penalize neither. In some cases penalizing neither is the best way to go. But, then again, this isn't a balanced game, and melee in particular calls for some seemingly imbalanced changes. If we're going to turn stances into semi-permanent by intention, without penalty, I'd rather see some of that go into the base stats so you don't even need to turn stances on.

In fact...that would be pretty nice and it would handle the whole sdef unit issue too. Sdef high enough so even newearls could equip zan units with base stats (rdef and tdef raised too?), and atk equally higher on fighter would be a nice adjustment (Nerf fighter weapon damage accordingly? Or at least dubs, they hit pretty hard. Whatever, not really the thread. I'll take this to the hunter thread).

Back on topic though, maybe more active effects need to be added to guard and fury stance. The poison/burn removal could become a permanent immunity with guard stance enabled, for example. I wish there was a "Refresh Stances" button, by the by. It can be annoying to need to stand there for four animations while your stances are blinking red.

[Zyrusticae]

Why didn't they address Weapon camouflages? I'm curious as to how they will go about this. Will they make it so that the weapon skin you want to put over the real weapon will be used up? That's very limiting if the weapon skin you want is worth 1mil+, or a *10. Even worse, when it would be time to upgrade that weapon you won't have the weapon you used up for the skin anymore.

I'm hoping you don't have to sacrifice a weapon to slap on its skin onto another.
^ That is literally how every other game with weapon reskinning on the planet works. I can't think of a single game that lets you reskin a weapon without the skin being consumed in the process. Not a single one.

[Zorafim]

None of the games which used that system destroyed the original. Nothing happened to the original, in fact. So I'm sure your expensive items won't be wasted every time you want to look pretty.

edit:

^ That is literally how every other game with weapon reskinning on the planet works. I can't think of a single game that lets you reskin a weapon without the skin being consumed in the process. Not a single one.

Obviously, we have never played any of the same games. Which games are you talking about? I don't remember this problem in WoW or Aion.

Overall, I'm liking these changes. I always thought it was pointless for hunters to have a static increase in stats with the stances. I'm sure fury and brave/wise will be a beautiful combination now. I have no idea how to spec though, since I've found so many beautiful things I want to spec into as hunter already, and this will probably make the fury+ skills great.

[gigawuts]

^ That is literally how every other game with weapon reskinning on the planet works. I can't think of a single game that lets you reskin a weapon without the skin being consumed in the process. Not a single one.

While so much of me wants to say "Great, so now's Sega's opportunity to make something better and show people how to do things right" the rest of me goes "My joke about having to sacrifice a 10* because that would be fucking horrendous wound up completely true."

[Coatl]

^ That is literally how every other game with weapon reskinning on the planet works. I can't think of a single game that lets you reskin a weapon without the skin being consumed in the process. Not a single one.

Spiral Knights. :B

[Anatha]

Why didn't they address Weapon camouflages? I'm curious as to how they will go about this. Will they make it so that the weapon skin you want to put over the real weapon will be used up? That's very limiting if the weapon skin you want is worth 1mil+, or a *10. Even worse, when it would be time to upgrade that weapon you won't have the weapon you used up for the skin anymore.

I'm hoping you don't have to sacrifice a weapon to slap on its skin onto another.

If you skin weapon A to look like weapon B, it loses its original skin. All you have left are the stats.

So if you need to upgrade you just skin the upgrade with weapon A.

[SociableTyrannosaur]

Courtesy of Ricardo at Bumped:


I want to be able to trade 10 star Weapons and Units

Excluding some items, you will now be able to place 10 star weapons and units in your My Shop. [As it stands now, 11 star and higher weapons take no part in the transaction.] (You can see where this is going.)

Prior to players being able to purchase these items, they can visit the recycle shop and exchange a 10 star weapon or unit to receive a [★10武器購入パス] or [★10ユニット購入パス]. In other words, in exchange for a 10 star weapon or unit, you will receive a [10★ Weapon Purchasing Pass] or a [10★ Unit Purchasing Pass]. Using the pass and meseta in this way allows you to purchase the item at the My Shop. Active Premium Set is required. However, some 10 star weapons and units do not qualify for this pass.

Basically, only the person who obtains a 10 star weapon/unit by themselves, can purchase another player’s 10 star weapon/unit.

Fail/10

[gigawuts]

If you skin weapon A to look like weapon B, it loses its original skin. All you have left are the stats.

So if you need to upgrade you just skin the upgrade with weapon A.

The problem is this probably wouldn't work and, let's be honest, 10*'s are most of the best looking weapons. That is, they were, until they coincidentally announced this and then suddenly released a whole swathe of weapons that are bad in normal.

So if you still want to skin something with a 10*, you're probably deleting the superior 10* weapon to do it. The only reason you'd do this is you can't use the 10* yet. By the time you can, the 10* is gone.

This is why it should not delete the original weapon. Maybe it should permanently bind it to you, I don't know. But it shouldn't delete it.

edit:

Courtesy of Ricardo at Bumped:



Fail/10

The thing is, this line...

Basically, only the person who obtains a 10 star weapon/unit by themselves, can purchase another player’s 10 star weapon/unit.
...is totally sensible. That's how it should work. You get a 10*, but you get the wrong one. Now you get to amend that. Great! Everything else they try to extrapolate off of that is HORRIBLE. Trading 10*'s 1:1, sure. DELETING 10*'s?
[spoiler-box]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=31g0YE61PLQ[/spoiler-box]

[Zyrusticae]

Obviously, we have never played any of the same games. Which games are you talking about? I don't remember this problem in WoW or Aion.
I never played WoW, so I don't know about that one. Looking it up, apparently it indeed does not consume the item in the process, but rather only makes it soulbound and unsellable.

In Aion the item you're using as a skin is consumed in the process. However, the reskinned item can also be used as a material for reskinning in the future if it's a skin you particularly like. I wouldn't be surprised if PSO2's method works in almost the same way.

Tera works the same way, with the added caveat that the item you're using as a skin must be "eligible as a template" (which basically means only crafted items and certain particular drops can be used, the former of which is irrelevant to PSO2).

Guild Wars 2 consumes the item you're using as a skin in the process, plus it requires a special item ("Transmutation Stones") to begin the process in the first place. The max-level version of these stones can only be attained through the cash shop (though they're fairly cheap).

EQ2 is a notable exception in that they have separate "appearance slots" where you simply slot items into them to override your stat item skins. (Unfortunately, they only allow you to hide your helmet, so there's no way to go for a "lightly equipped" look in the game - not that it matters, with how awful the armor designs are).

I wish more games used Champions Online's system, though. Y'know, where you create your own costumes from a huge array of parts and you can choose from a big list of weapon skins for every weapon type, along with recoloring parts of those items to your liking. But that game's all about customization and takes it to extreme degrees... which... is totally what PSO2 should be about. Sigh! Oh, well.

[gigawuts]

EQ2 is a notable exception in that they have separate "appearance slots" where you simply slot items into them to override your stat item skins. (Unfortunately, they only allow you to hide your helmet, so there's no way to go for a "lightly equipped" look in the game - not that it matters, with how awful the armor designs are).

Ah man, I don't know what game it was (it wasn't EQ2, I didn't play that), but some game I played used this exact system and it was perfect. It's completely simple, totally intuitive, and everyone liked it. Nothing came with any catch and you got to look how you wanted.

We need that.

[SociableTyrannosaur]

Snip




Right, that's just it though, it appears that we have to sacrifice (and thereby remove from circulation) a 10* item and you know pyroxene and and EXcube 10*s are on that "ineligible" list.

[Soultrigger]

Realistically, I think weapon consumption for reskin makes the most sense from SEGA's point of view. It gives value to obsolete weapons and serves as a sink. I don't think using this feature is very practicable for 10*s unless it's a design that you really like and haven't spent a lot of money upgrading it. If you did upgrade it then uh, just use it until it's completely obsolete I suppose.

In terms of 10* exchange, from what it sounds like, anyone with a MyShop can sell them, but in order to buy them, it requires the respective pass AND premium feature.

Well, guess premium is now mandatory for anyone who wants to be part of the economy. >_> *sigh*

Also, the fine print makes it obvious Iristia stone weapons do not qualify. And here I thought I had it easy with hundreds of stones stocked up. Least I have still have a bunch of useless 10*s...

[gigawuts]

Yup.

People laughed when I was saving my dupe and unwanted 10*'s for trading.

Yeah, well who's laughing now?

Sakai.

edit: Soul, those can at least still be used for excubes. When I finally decided to get Lucky Rise units, I only had 18 excubes but was sitting on nearly 300 iritistas. Then the only problem was wondering why they set the two shops so far apart.

[Z-0]

*has 11 10*s in bank*

:grin:

Now to debate whether to sell them or cash them in... unfortunately, my 10*s are older ones (none are AQ rares), so they might not go for much. :/

[SociableTyrannosaur]

Yeah well I'll be selling my 10*s...can't say I'll be buying any.

[Zyrusticae]

I don't get why you would use a 10* as a template anyway, it's not like any of them have piss-poor stats (unlike 7-9* weapons, especially the base versions of the lambda weapons which generally look better due to superior color choices). Surely you'd just use the 10* instead of using it as a template? Unless you found an 11*+ weapon that you really dislike the skin of, in which case you should probably just suck it up and eat the 10* anyway because you no longer have a use for it. Assuming you can actually grind the sucker, that is...

[Soultrigger]

Oh yea, forgot to bring this up despite being relevant to that topic I brought up:

There's no mention of binding. It sounds like sacrificial 10*s is SEGA's answer to prevent limitless circulation of 10*s.

Makes sense but...buying is premium only? >_> If you think this is justified, then I hope they release a Premium+ in the future that allows 11* buying. Then Premium++ if you want that Psycho Wand.

[SociableTyrannosaur]

I don't get why you would use a 10* as a template anyway, it's not like any of them have piss-poor stats (unlike 7-9* weapons, especially the base versions of the lambda weapons which generally look better due to superior color choices). Surely you'd just use the 10* instead of using it as a template? Unless you found an 11*+ weapon that you really dislike the skin of, in which case you should probably just suck it up and eat the 10* anyway because you no longer have a use for it. Assuming you can actually grind the sucker, that is...

...What if I wanted to make my Jinrai look like a Demo or Gwana Double??

[Z-0]

You don't, 'coz BKB looks way better.

:>

[SociableTyrannosaur]

But I don't have BKB >_>

[gigawuts]

SociableTyrannosaur nailed one point - lateral 10* skinning.

There's also the issue with the one unique property in this entire game: Whether or not a weapon is allclass.

I mean, I like the lambda hyp and lambda aristin, but if they were hideous monstrosities I'd reskin them in a heartbeat.

edit: Also, convenience. I'd more readily grind up a 9* 4 times to get its latent than grind a 10* once.

[NoiseHERO]

Courtesy of Ricardo at Bumped:



Fail/10

hurr hurr you guys are dumb you've been asking for it now you finally get it, I'm so clever by white knighting sega by typing overused complaints about complainers~

Jesus this is fucking terrible.

Oh and yeah obviously the pity 10* from iristia stones are the ones you can't use for "10* pass" fodder.

[UnLucky]

Picture this:

You are hunting an extremely rare 10*

Your friend, who is helping you, finds the exact item you are looking for

Great! 10*s are tradeable! So your friend goes and buys a My Shop pass, or waits nearly a month to get one from FUN scratch.

At some point in your journey, you come across a completely worthless 10* to you, which you loudly exclaim your dissatisfaction from finding to your friend, who is still helping you on these runs. Turns out, he could make use of it.

Great! You can use that 10* you just found to get a one-off Trade License, purchase Premium, and pay a nominal fee to your friend who would very much want to simply give you that 10* you were looking for, but if he lists it for cheap, someone else will buy it out from under you.

But oh wait! Your friend wants that 10*, you can't use that for the trade! So now each of you need two 10*s, and both of you need Premium (not just a My Shop!) in order to sell the damn things to each other.

[gigawuts]

Picture this:

You are hunting an extremely rare 10*

Your friend, who is helping you, finds the exact item you are looking for

Great! 10*s are tradeable! So your friend goes and buys a My Shop pass, or waits nearly a month to get one from FUN scratch.

At some point in your journey, you come across a completely worthless 10* to you, which you loudly exclaim your dissatisfaction from finding to your friend, who is still helping you on these runs. Turns out, he could make use of it.

Great! You can use that 10* you just found to get a one-off Trade License, purchase Premium, and pay a nominal fee to your friend who would very much want to simply give you that 10* you were looking for, but if he lists it for cheap, someone else will buy it out from under you.

But oh wait! Your friend wants that 10*, you can't use that for the trade! So now each of you need two 10*s, and both of you need Premium (not just a My Shop!) in order to sell the damn things to each other.

It's funny because I'm facing this exact scenario for two 10*'s and it'll cost me the exact dupe 10*'s my friends want to get the dupe 10*'s they have that I want, that they need to spend to get the dupe 10*'s I have that they want that I have to spend to... :wacko:

[NoiseHERO]

Picture this:

You are hunting an extremely rare 10*

Your friend, who is helping you, finds the exact item you are looking for

Great! 10*s are tradeable! So your friend goes and buys a My Shop pass, or waits nearly a month to get one from FUN scratch.

At some point in your journey, you come across a completely worthless 10* to you, which you loudly exclaim your dissatisfaction from finding to your friend, who is still helping you on these runs. Turns out, he could make use of it.

Great! You can use that 10* you just found to get a one-off Trade License, purchase Premium, and pay a nominal fee to your friend who would very much want to simply give you that 10* you were looking for, but if he lists it for cheap, someone else will buy it out from under you.

But oh wait! Your friend wants that 10*, you can't use that for the trade! So now each of you need two 10*s, and both of you need Premium (not just a My Shop!) in order to sell the damn things to each other.

Exactly, needing premium is one thing, fine we needed it to trade to begin with. But adding this step to it just makes things unnecessarily complicated. Unless they also made it so that we can trade normally if BOTH users want a specific weapon you're going for and you JUST need premium and this is just describing the 10* purchasing system. Then I definitely won't be buying premium just to trade 10* any soon.

[Anduril]

I honestly don't think this is going to fly very long. I'm sure in a few month's time they'll cave and just let you trade them without these 10* passes because of complaints regarding situations like UnLucky's scenario.

[gigawuts]

Maybe there's still hope to get 1:1 10* trading, with no ability to put in money. It'd be like link cable pokemons trading.

It could be circumvented with 1,000,000 meseta monomates, sure, but...that won't matter if Sega doesn't enforce rules for 10* trade agreements that aren't honored.

[Coatl]

Or just make it so that you can only trade *10s and nothing else.
No mates, no material. Nothing.

[NoiseHERO]

> get premium

> buy cheapest 10*

> trade in for pass

> your friend puts up 10* for whatever fair-trade amount

> shop bot, or someone acting like one intercepts and buys it


"OKAY! You send me yours now! : D"

"I-I never bought your's, dude."

"What?"

"..."

"FUCCKK!!!!!!!!!!!"

[gigawuts]

> get premium

> buy cheapest 10*

> trade in for pass

> your friend puts up 10* for whatever fair-trade amount

> shop bot, or someone acting like one intercepts and buys it


"OKAY! You send me yours now! : D"

"I-I never bought your's, dude."

"What?"

"..."

"FUCCKK!!!!!!!!!!!"

This is the other reason to need trading. You could avoid this by trading for the actual market value of the more expensive item, but then you both lose out on tax for simply wanting to do a 1:1.

[NoiseHERO]

This is the other reason to need trading. You could avoid this by trading for the actual market value of the more expensive item, but then you both lose out on tax for simply wanting to do a 1:1.

I just wanted YOUR'S. ;o;

[Coatl]

Reminds me of the time I tried to give my friend a rare that was worth 100k for 20k via shop.
Didn't turn out well, and neither will this most likely.

[UnLucky]

It'd be funny if the person "sniping" your listing just wanted it to trade in for a 10* license

[gigawuts]

It'd be funny if the person "sniping" your listing just wanted it to trade in for a 10* license

But that's just a wasting a 10* to get a 10*.

You can only buy a 10* if you delete a 10*.

So doing that means you lose meseta and a pass to...get a pass.

[Saffran]

>So doing that means you lose meseta and a pass to...get a pass.

I can picture trolling bots doing precisely that, to keep certain weapons rare for RMT purposes.

[gigawuts]

If they want to set a price floor on items common enough to demand a price floor I would be more than happy to watch them have to buy up every single one for 1m each to be able to sell the only one they've found at 3m...and more than 3 other players will have found one.

[Saffran]

On second thought, even for RMT purposes it would be dumb.
Never mind...

[Ce'Nedra]

Reminds me of the time I tried to give my friend a rare that was worth 100k for 20k via shop.
Didn't turn out well, and neither will this most likely.

Get your friend in your room at the shop counter room deco, set up till the final step before making it appear int he shop, let friend get ready, count down if you must, and put it up. Friend can instant buy from your shop that way.

I've done this about 6 times now, even with Seitheise that goes for like 7 mil back then and I sold it to my friend for 1050.

[UnLucky]

And I've had less contested items stolen when I've already got the person's shop in the list, mashing the enter key to make the purchase as fast as possible after they list it.

It's not instant nor guaranteed.

[Ce'Nedra]

Oh I'm sure its not guaranteed but this is the best course of success I can think off. I've never had items ninja'd this way before personally. Was just handing out a way to do it =D

[UnLucky]

Only real reliable way is to list it for more than the currently cheapest, then refund your friend's money by buying their monomate for the same cost.

Requires you both have a shop license and you eat the 5% brokerage fee both times, but it's the safest way to trade without trading privileges.

[TehblackUchiha]

New update from bumped about mag cap


Mag Update

Sakai made a comment about mags in the March 14th Issue of Famitsu Weekly. The current plan is to raise the mag level cap beyond level 151+ but they are currently investigating whether they should allow you to feed them 7 star weapons. Shougai speculates that perhaps at level 151+ you could only feed them 7 star weapons? We’ll probably have more details in a few months.

[Rien]

>Active Premium set required

I want to know what the japanese say about this. I really do. Someone link me to where they talk about this.

[MetalDude]

Shougai speculates that perhaps at level 151+ you could only feed them 7 star weapons?
Please fucking don't.

[Blackheart521]

Please fucking don't.

Not that bad... oooh a big 3150 meseta from trash rares to feed them 3 times for a full feeding... actually, this would actually give a reason for people to buy trash rares ^^;

[Rien]

Just run AQs....

[BIG OLAF]

Red weapons will finally have a use! Huzzah!

[The Walrus]

Welp, guess I have a use for all the red weapons I find now.

EDIT: HEH

[Crystal_Shard]

Sega: After we update, you can't sell Red Weapons anymore! Nyah, nyah, nyah!


Oh I'm sure its not guaranteed but this is the best course of success I can think off. I've never had items ninja'd this way before personally. Was just handing out a way to do it =D

Pretty much depends on the time of day and item though. I've been able to transfer stuff as expensive as the Long Twin Tails before, but I've also been sniped for stuff like the Blitz Ace and I did lose one Heartbreaker to sniping once.

Really, if you and your friend have enough meseta on hand, it's much safer to eat the costs of putting it up for near the normal market price and refund via the million dollar monomate method.

[MetalDude]

I wouldn't mind if 7*s gave a substantially greater boost, not that they were the only way. Plus, then that brings up the question of lowering DEX through room items.

[gigawuts]

Let's be honest, we know they're just going to increase the items required to level up yet again - was anyone here going to feed them anything OTHER THAN 7* items if they gave us the option?

Because I sure won't be waiting 35% fucking longer (or however big the difference is) just to feed them 6*'s.

[D-Inferno]

I don't completely feel bad about having +55 Dex on all my mags (well, I do a little for my Ranger mag, but if the best Gunslash ends up requiring a ton of Dex, then things might work out).

[Soultrigger]

Let's be honest, we know they're just going to increase the items required to level up yet again - was anyone here going to feed them anything OTHER THAN 7* items if they gave us the option?

For pure mags, yes.

[gigawuts]

For pure mags, yes.

Yeah. Obviously.

Any weapons besides 7*'s?

(Seriously, did that even need to be stated?)

[Soultrigger]

Well, the statement is ambiguous, possibly referring to a restriction solely to weapons or all items in general (probably the former).

But yea, you can imagine 7* weapons jacking up in demand if it is implemented, so either way I'd like the freedom of 5/6* weapons.

[gigawuts]

That's actually a really good point. I guess we DO have the stat removal devices (like the food devices), but...

oh god those cost real money

no no no no no

edit: Hold on, are those even implemented? Or are they in the PD shop? I don't actually know.

[Aka]

In Aion the item you're using as a skin is consumed in the process. However, the reskinned item can also be used as a material for reskinning in the future if it's a skin you particularly like. I wouldn't be surprised if PSO2's method works in almost the same way.


This is a bit of a late response and probably irrelevant but I'd like to point out that not everything in Aion was reskinnable for a second time. A lot of Unique Weapons, Clothing and Headgears (Empyrean Crucible, Event items, Fashion Clothing shop, Aion store, etc) could only be used for reskinning once. This is clearly stated on the original item information box as well as on the newly remodeled item if such a skin was used.

[Maronji]

That's actually a really good point. I guess we DO have the stat removal devices (like the food devices), but...

oh god those cost real money

no no no no no

edit: Hold on, are those even implemented? Or are they in the PD shop? I don't actually know.

If you mean the Down devices (the only ones I can find on Cirnopedia), then those are in the Net Cafe shop, and they don't decrease the mag's level; they just knock off 30 points in whatever stat (depending on the device). They're essentially the exact opposite of the normal Food devices you can get in the AC Scratch (except they can't change the mag's level).

If you're talking about something else, then I'm afraid I can't comment on the matter.

[gigawuts]

If you mean the Down devices (the only ones I can find on Cirnopedia), then those are in the Net Cafe shop, and they don't decrease the mag's level; they just knock off 30 points in whatever stat (depending on the device). They're essentially the exact opposite of the normal Food devices you can get in the AC Scratch (except they can't change the mag's level).

If you're talking about something else, then I'm afraid I can't comment on the matter.

Nope, those were the ones. That's how I meant to say they worked, bit ambiguous though.

So they're from the netcafe? They may as well not even exist.

[Macman]

Vraolet hunting for mags. I never thought I'd see the day.

[Hrith]

someone explain to me how is tying endgame weapons to premium a improvement
do tellThis =/

SEGA is just handing out reasons to quit.

[Agitated_AT]

someone explain to me how is tying endgame weapons to premium a improvement
do tell

They're not, because you can still find them. For every person complaining they'd quit because they couldnt find an easy way to get that one item, whether via the playershop or premium, there'll 100 that are actually gonna invest more time and money into the game because of it. So yeah at the end of the day its gonna profit from the shallow casual group this game has aimed itself to.

To me?

I dont care about rares because i dont see their merits or value outside of being Overpowered collectors items. Which at this point isnt nescesary unless you wanna make the game even more boring easy than it already is. In other words, this game isn't for me. I'd say at this point, even with my dislike at that point when it came out, psu and all the expansions felt more right

[SociableTyrannosaur]

I don't completely feel bad about having +55 Dex on all my mags (well, I do a little for my Ranger mag, but if the best Gunslash ends up requiring a ton of Dex, then things might work out).

best gunslash as of now is emperor axeon which requires 450 Dex. as a cast Gu/Ra you need at least 27 Dex on your max to equip it if you're taking the optimal skills.

[lostinseganet]

I want my mag to be able to attack and evolve. At least attack like partner machines. i want digimon!

[Soultrigger]

They're not, because you can still find them. For every person complaining they'd quit because they couldnt find an easy way to get that one item, whether via the playershop or premium, there'll 100 that are actually gonna invest more time and money into the game because of it. So yeah at the end of the day its gonna profit from the shallow casual group this game has aimed itself to.

I don't think the issue is just "accessibility", but lack of trading. Trading is pretty much a core aspect of many MMOs, and yet SEGA manages to nickel and dime people for simply wanting to do this. (Not being able to trade also serves as artificial lengthening to force people into rare hunting even longer)

Personally speaking, I used to enjoy making use of My Shop since I made a fairly good business upgrading stuff and reselling them. In doing so, I didn't have to deal with rare drop RNG BS and instead just with Dudu (which, in terms of RNG, is a lot better than spending weeks looking for one rare you're not even guaranteed to drop). But now, the only things that reasonably sell on market are essentially real money items.

You can still make stupid profits flipping things. But there's no longer that feeling of trade.

[moorebounce]

Yeah I'll just post my list without reading the 13 pages.

1. Parties need to be able to go from block to block together.

2. Parties need to be able to go to team rooms together.

3. Once you open a higher medical drink to lower ones shouldn't
show up in list for purchase.

A).Or you can let people use up to three of the small drinks,
two of the medium drinks or one large drink.

4. Import pictures for team flags like PSOBB did.

5. You should be able to choose a block when leaving your team
room, my room and campship.

6. Scape dolls should be a rare drop like they were in older pso games.

7. Teams should be able to decorate their team room like My Room.

8. When premium players are trading the players involved should be
able to see each others entire inventory (if agreed upon before
hand by both parties involved).

9. There should be a "Teammate" tab in the partner list.

10. Teammates should automatically be in your friends list and/or
there should be a "Team" tab.

11. You should be able to accept an party invite from anywhere then
be transported to that block, campship to team room.

[gigawuts]

Why can I still not sort my friends list in ABC order?

[BIG OLAF]

Why can I still not sort my friends list in ABC order?

It's funny how the game sorts your offline friends into alphabetical order, but your online friends is a fuckin' free-for-all.

[Requiem Aeternam]

It's funny how the game sorts your offline friends into alphabetical order, but your online friends is a fuckin' free-for-all.

I always thought both lists were arranged alphabetically. Maybe I just didn't notice since my Friend List is pretty short.

[gigawuts]

Online players seems to sort by player ID ABC order, but I don't even know some of my friends' player ID's off the top of my head and would much rather they sort by character name :/

Or let me group them. Or sort the ones I have notifications for at the top.

[Requiem Aeternam]

Online players seems to sort by player ID ABC order, but I don't even know some of my friends' player ID's off the top of my head and would much rather they sort by character name :/

Or let me group them. Or sort the ones I have notifications for at the top.

That would be helpful especially to players with a lot of friends. Sega should consider adding sort options for it.

[Ezodagrom]

There's options to order by player ID ABC, and to order by registration, but the ABC order, it separates IDs that start with upper case and those that start with a lower case.
Those that start with lower case come after all the ones that start with upper case (for example, A, B, C, ..., Z, a, b, ...).

[gigawuts]

Is that what that does? That's indescribably stupid.