Is FI/FO practical?

[DarkRenge]

I really like the fighter class's weapons but I also want to use techs.
Am I putting chocolate in my peanut butter with FI/FO, or am I better off FI/HU when I want to get my beat down on and FO/FI when I want to get my tech on?

My goal with it would be to self buff and heal while bringing the pain with fighter weapons. Maybe go on the tech offensive when it'd be un-wise not to.
I figure I could do that as FO/FI with universal weapons, but I feel the tech power would make the striking part redundant. In the same sense, am I just gimping myself with FI/FO?

Also, knuckles look really cool to me, are they viable to use?

Note that this is all coming from someone who has never really played PSO2 before.

[SociableTyrannosaur]

Fi/Fo is by far the best melee/tech hybrid option, but I still feel like it takes too much away from either with weapon limitations and additional stats being what they are.

[DarkRenge]

S-ATK goes up by 70 for the FI/FO while T-ATK only goes down 30. (compared to FO/FI)
If I did my MAG right, I'd be able to get all FI weapons while being able to Umbrella Stick. Switching the FO sub for HU only brings S-ATK up another 30.

I appears to me you gain more than you lose, but you say it still doesn't pan out well? D:

[SociableTyrannosaur]

meaning you dont get access to better rods so your teching suffers and you have to build your mag around S atk so teching suffers more and if you aren't raising multiple mags your Fo/Fi game gets the shaft.

Furthermore "gain" is a relative term since you lose out on Hunter stances and survival skills by subbing Fo for inconsequential buffs and mediocre healing. remember shifta only adds to base stats, so the stats you get from shifta for your melee you'd have almost out right gotten by subbing Hu even before stances.

Also dont forget your affixes which can donate up to and sometimes more than 240 points into a single stat will either be spread out or largely favor one over the other, T atk affixes increase the effectiveness of resta substantially while all other resta bonuses come from base stats and class skills.

You end up spreading yourself thin this way and it ends up not being particularly good at either, but better at doing both than any other mix.

This is has been a repeated point of discussion, so check out other threads for more information.

[UnLucky]

If you absolutely must have melee with techs, I wouldn't recommend anything other than Fi/Fo.

Pocket Shifta is abouts the gain from Fury Stance, but with no penalty, and you've got Deband too. Though if you run with another tech user, you run the risk of having their Shifta touch you, which renders your advantage moot. You could also eat Shifta consumables regularly for damn near the same effect.

Main drawback, however, is missing out on the JA Advances from Hunter. Together, these multiply your melee and PA damage by 121%, which stack multiplicatively with Brave/Wise Stance as well as Chase Advance.

[Coatl]

I think I'm actually starting to like it more than FI/TE. It would be much more optimal if good all-class force weapons weren't so rare. Same thing with FI/GU.

[DarkRenge]

So it's like PSO ep 1 and 2 where being a HUmar would be superior up until online play where you can have someone shifta your HUcast.

Alright, I guess I'll go into this with FO/FI in mind, maybe get a second mag for efficient FI/HU action once I have a 1000% desire to punch something in the face until it stops being.

Side note: Do all classes benefit from giving up 16 points to T-ATK to get Lepus's PP recovery? Or is it superfluous?

[SociableTyrannosaur]

My personal feeling is PP recovery J is worthless unless you cast techs regularly and have Fo as your main or sub. you dont recover PP while charging or using PAs - that includes techs. The exception is a Fo with PP Charge revival DOES regen PP while charging techs, but not while casting them and even techer without Fo can't do that, so what do you gain?

It's not something you can control, it's not a percent chance. it's an interval of i think about 10 minutes and it only lasts about 5 seconds. 90% of the time or more it will go off and you'll have gotten nothing from it and when those 16 points could have allowed you to equip your new toys sooner or at all with the level caps what they are, you'll be kicking yourself.

[ShinMaruku]

I only wished Hu/Fo was worth it's salt. If they had done shifta and deband properly with a proper 3-5 min duration and they bring stats up better Hu/Fo would be interesting.

[SociableTyrannosaur]

not really. Not with shifta as god awful as it is. Duration isn't the issue

20% to base stats or 38% + more damage? yeah I thought so

[ShinMaruku]

That's what I ment. Not just duration but a much better boost.

[DarkRenge]

Doesn't that just bring in the "well, party with a FO" stance again?
If shifta got a boost, then Fi/Hu would just dig FO's using it more.

FI is applicable to everything because its stances apply to everything.
If it were just S-ATK and R-ATK, then FO's wouldn't even touch it.

If GU or RA opened up their abilities beyond R-ATK damage, I could see them being more heavily considered for combos.
Consider a PSO2 where WB could be applied to gunslashes.

But given what this thread suggests, FO's have a monopoly on tech usage just as they're limited to tech usage. Gah, I'm having a weird moment. I just got done finishing a paper comparing Max Webber and Karl Marx's stances on capitalism @_@

[UnLucky]

It's kinda funny how only melee classes' passives provide some benefit for hybrids.

Hunter: Fury gives S+R-Atk, JA Advance boosts melee and ranged PAs
Fighter: Stances boost all damage

Ranger: WHA/SS are for R-Atk based attacks only
Gunner: ZRA/AA are for R-Atk based attacks only

Force: Tech damage exclusively, obviously
Techer: Tech damage/wands only, and requires Force's tech PP regen skill

[DarkRenge]

Curious: If GU/RA is a boss slayer due to WB and CT and FO/Whatever is mob clean up and burst damage, where does the FI/HU fit into the team equation? Is it they exist in a useful medium between the two, or do they got a cool defining thing going for them?

Don't say survival unless that really does become an issue later in the game. So far in playing I've only died when my mouse decided to have me keep attacking when I wanted to dodge, which is slowly becoming a problem ^^; (like, I can click attack once, even lightly, and my character will just keep swinging, making both JA's and dodging hard)

[Skyly HUmar]

Fi/Fo is actually the tech class i use lol, but only because i can use my lucky spikes and umbla stick that way. I can take stuff out pretty quick with melee and techs but tbh if youre interested in a hybrid, the techer is there for you.

[UnLucky]

that would be true if Techer was any good at teching without Force

[SociableTyrannosaur]

Curious: If GU/RA is a boss slayer due to WB and CT and FO/Whatever is mob clean up and burst damage, where does the FI/HU fit into the team equation? Is it they exist in a useful medium between the two, or do they got a cool defining thing going for them?

Don't say survival unless that really does become an issue later in the game. So far in playing I've only died when my mouse decided to have me keep attacking when I wanted to dodge, which is slowly becoming a problem ^^; (like, I can click attack once, even lightly, and my character will just keep swinging, making both JA's and dodging hard)

Melee is a bit of both, really. high single target sustainable DPS with very respectable mid-close range AoE. Their issue is getting there before the forces burn everything to the ground.

Survival is really something only melee needs, tbh. Gu/Ra gets Automate Deadline (not as good as halfline, but still saves lives if you screw up somewhere). Forces kinda have no excuse for dying ever. I mean it happens, but invincible dash plus best distance game?

Anyway that's my take on it.

[ShinMaruku]

that would be true if Techer was any good at teching without Force
Are they really that bad or is it that force is that much better? There is a difference there.

[UnLucky]

Are they really that bad or is it that force is that much better? There is a difference there.

PP Charge Revival is mandatory for technic usage. Any Force player who does not get this skill is a clueless idiot totally compromising their build and are strictly inferior to anyone who does have the skill no matter how they spent their other points.

It's akin to a Hunter or Fighter not taking any weapon Gears, or a Ranger without Weak Bullet, or a Gunner without Chain Trigger. You may as well not be playing your class at all if you do not have this skill.

Other than that, Techer isn't so bad. It has equivalent Mastery levels in different elements, it has 120% damage from EMW for 10 SP instead of 133% for 30 SP, but it can't get faster casting nor cheaper techs, or anything interesting for its elements. Its PP regen skills are worthless without Force, and support skills are incredibly minor save for Deband Cut. Plus wands suck.

[ShinMaruku]

That is why you should say they are subpar and not just go and say it's bad.

[UnLucky]

Ok, I'll rephrase my statement:

Techer is the worst standalone class in the game.

With a Force sub they are alright, and as a sub for Force they are pretty good, but with neither they are trash.

[ShinMaruku]

That's much more palatable to new people when advising someone some tact will help greatly. :)