PDA

View Full Version : PSE Burst during exit/entrance after Sept 4th



SisterPrincess
Sep 5, 2013, 07:59 PM
I guess people are too busy to fix HDD so no one knows about it huh?

So what did they really changed about PSE burst?

For Advanced Quests, is the current trend is stay in cul-de-sac or on a large plains?

For Forest Advance Quest, would stay behind the falls in area 2 still work?

strikerhunter
Sep 5, 2013, 08:02 PM
I guess people are too busy to fix HDD so no one knows about it huh?

So what did they really changed about PSE burst?

For Advanced Quests, is the current trend is stay in cul-de-sac or on a large plains?

For Forest Advance Quest, would stay behind the falls in area 2 still work?

The PSE entrance/exit burst part was moved to another date.

Z-0
Sep 5, 2013, 08:14 PM
No it hasn't. They've been "patched" already.

However, they can still be performed but their efficiency has been toned down, as enemies will spawn all over the block next to the entrance/exit instead of just near the player.

I believe the PSE change has made it so that enemies will spawn anywhere in the block the player is in, but I haven't had time to test this...

strikerhunter
Sep 5, 2013, 08:29 PM
No it hasn't. They've been "patched" already.

However, they can still be performed but their efficiency has been toned down, as enemies will spawn all over the block next to the entrance/exit instead of just near the player.

I believe the PSE change has made it so that enemies will spawn anywhere in the block the player is in, but I haven't had time to test this...

Wel heard from someone lelse that it was moved, but what do I care. Whatever happens happens.

Z-0
Sep 5, 2013, 09:58 PM
Okay so I just did an "exit burst" and it was a pile of garbage. All they've done is increased the range that enemies spawn to an absolutely fucking LUDICROUS range, so that enemies were even outside of Additional Bullet's range.

My question is:

Does this also affect bursts in the middle of the field? Because if so, lol...

Bellion
Sep 5, 2013, 10:06 PM
Yep, even in the middle of the field.

pkemr4
Sep 5, 2013, 10:10 PM
no wonder it was hard to maintain a constant pse burst in quarry....

Z-0
Sep 5, 2013, 10:10 PM
I took some quick pics in the middle of the field, all players are stood in the same spot:

[spoiler-box]http://i.imgur.com/Bpxok8L.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/FhhbOQK.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/ooEwXe7.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/EBG9BVZ.jpg[/spoiler-box]

All enemies are at their spawn points.

SakoHaruo
Sep 5, 2013, 10:12 PM
Did some runs with a few friends on Forest. enemies spawn at the entrance of exit lane. sticking to the wall (if there's one at exit) works fine. of course, this wont work on every map.

also, you are not at the exit, just near it.

Z-0
Sep 5, 2013, 10:16 PM
also, you are not at the exit, just near it.
I know I'm not, I said I was in the middle of the field. I was proving a point that PSE Bursts got nerfed in general.

SakoHaruo
Sep 5, 2013, 10:18 PM
I know I'm not, I said I was in the middle of the field. I was proving a point that PSE Bursts got nerfed in general.

lol that was pointed at me just in case people don't understand what I mean.

fuck I should have taken some pics. >_>

Z-0
Sep 5, 2013, 10:19 PM
o lol, you said "you" so for some reason I thought you were talking to me

> >
< <

:3

EvilMag
Sep 5, 2013, 10:29 PM
So we're back to where when the game launched, Hunters were useless in bursts?

Zorafim
Sep 5, 2013, 10:37 PM
RIP PSE bursts.

They were kind of stupid anyway.

.Jack
Sep 5, 2013, 10:40 PM
Best way to burst imo is an all force party grouped together (endless pp)spamming zonde in tunnels/desert. You can go to entrance or exit but it's not really necessary as zonde will still reach targets in most situations.

supersonix9
Sep 5, 2013, 10:40 PM
fine with me; if I can't have exit bursts, nobody can

Z-0
Sep 5, 2013, 10:41 PM
Best way to burst imo is an all force party grouped together (endless pp)spamming zonde in tunnels/desert. You can go to entrance or exit but it's not really necessary as zonde will still reach targets in most situations.
Yes, this is how I bursted before exit/entrance was discovered (although I should've cornered and spammed Zondeel or something, of course), and I guess it's how it will work now.

Still a little disappointing though.

SakoHaruo
Sep 5, 2013, 10:42 PM
OK, was a quick job lol

[spoiler-box]http://i.imgur.com/D1cdWMs.jpg[/spoiler-box]


That's pretty much how it went on forest.

Blue = player

Red = spawned the most

Yellow = sometimes

We got a triple cross burst off that corner. They're spawn patterns were similar to code protection. kill the ones to the right they spawn to the left and vise versa.

strikerhunter
Sep 5, 2013, 10:43 PM
[spoiler-box]http://i.imgur.com/Bpxok8L.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/FhhbOQK.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/ooEwXe7.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/EBG9BVZ.jpg[/spoiler-box]


Hadn't played much in the past two days (RL stuffs) but Lol dat spawn range. I tell ya, it's only a matter of time after the large uproar that Sega would go and say "We are sorry, the spawning in PSE burst distance was never meant to be that far and we are going to fix it to make it smaller." shits and stuffs that'll likely send us back to somewhere near square 1.



[spoiler-box]http://i.imgur.com/D1cdWMs.jpg[/spoiler-box]


Just saw the message on the top right corner, laughed, said GG Sega, and ignored the spawn pictures (lied, I saw the yellow ones :-P)since I've seen Z-O's post as I quoted it.

Zenobia
Sep 5, 2013, 10:50 PM
So yeah its back to corner bursting.....the lolz of those epics

.Jack
Sep 5, 2013, 11:20 PM
Yes, this is how I bursted before exit/entrance was discovered (although I should've cornered and spammed Zondeel or something, of course), and I guess it's how it will work now.

Yup, back to the old method before everyone became aware of it. It was a bit ridiculous getting 2 excubes every 2-3 runs and getting 99+ caps sometimes in 1 run.. lol

At least that still works for those that are in need of caps.

Aine
Sep 5, 2013, 11:25 PM
It's not just the spawn distance that changed, now enemies respawn very slowly. There is pretty much no point aiming for bursts now. RIP AQs

Z-0
Sep 5, 2013, 11:26 PM
Yes, I just looked at a video on Buta... fucking lol, they had a desert exit burst and the spawns were so slow it was unbelievable.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QWkXeNc8-7w

Zenobia
Sep 5, 2013, 11:30 PM
That shits hurts so much right now.....welp GG AQ's RIP.

Enforcer MKV
Sep 5, 2013, 11:35 PM
*Facepalm*

Dnd
Sep 5, 2013, 11:36 PM
*Facepalm*

Seconded, as one who did AQ's for boss's - exit bursts where nice when they happened, but its about time they got fixed for the people that abused them every-run. Should of been sooner imho

.Jack
Sep 5, 2013, 11:39 PM
Maybe they left spawns uncleared close by or something else in that vid. Something like that could've happened if that was the case even before the patch. When I tested it in a full party in post, I didn't see anything like that.

Horo The Wise Wolf
Sep 5, 2013, 11:40 PM
Wow, can you all chill?

I am glad they patched it. Now people won't be as strict in AQ parties when it comes to bursting.

Edit: Yes, I can read. Does that mean I cannot post my thoughts?

I guess not.

SakoHaruo
Sep 5, 2013, 11:45 PM
y'all crazy. There's always a plan B

in my forest run today, we manage to get a triple cross burst. It was definitely slower than before, as some enemies we're too far away for my Add. bullet, so I had to move. give it some time, PSO2 community will find a way.

Z-0
Sep 5, 2013, 11:46 PM
^_^;;;; I think some people are missing the point.

Exit/Entrance bursts were not nerfed. The entire burst system was. Enemies will now spawn further from players, which makes melee even MORE useless than it was pre-patch, and there seems to be a delay in respawns which makes bursts even more useless. It would be more efficient to find the next spawn, most likely, unless you have four forces.

@Hc4

Even when leaving enemies elsewhere on the map, I never saw anything like that. The 2 or 3 enemies would still respawn over and over and over pretty quickly, rather than having 2 or 3 second periods where the enemies didn't spawn at all.

GuardianGirth
Sep 5, 2013, 11:50 PM
Bursts are fucking stupid now for hunters. All they had to do was make this "long range spawn" crap in the entrance and exit room IDs. Anyone who thinks its better now has no opinion.

NeverDT
Sep 5, 2013, 11:50 PM
I am glad they patched it. Now people won't be as strict in AQ parties when it comes to bursting.

That wasn't very nice.

Forgive us if we wanted to be efficient about leveling and looting, which was...pretty much the two things AQs were around for.

I'm not sure what you even mean by this, most english parties were already doing full clears (which often take 30+ min of wandering around a map to the point where you burn out before you have 12 risk).

.Jack
Sep 5, 2013, 11:56 PM
@Hc4

Even when leaving enemies elsewhere on the map, I never saw anything like that. The 2 or 3 enemies would still respawn over and over and over pretty quickly, rather than having 2 or 3 second periods where the enemies didn't spawn at all.

Yeah, the nonstop spawns is still intact no matter where you are. The only thing that ruins it completely that I can think of is that drill machine code.. lol

As long as you get a 4 person tech party in desert/tunnels, you can easily continue this for those that aren't aware of it. It wont be as long as they were before but it is still pretty decent.

Zenobia
Sep 6, 2013, 12:20 AM
Seconded, as one who did AQ's for boss's - exit bursts where nice when they happened, but its about time they got fixed for the people that abused them every-run. Should of been sooner imho

Remember you bought your DS for a reason we used and abused the exit burst for these reasons because Segas drop rates were total bs and you know they were, excuse our asses because we wanted to do things the efficient way.

Besides there is always a new way to burst we will just adept and move on HU's just once again need to bring their gunslashes.



Wow, can you all cry more?

I am glad they patched it. Now people won't be as strict in AQ parties when it comes to bursting.

You read above.

TaigaUC
Sep 6, 2013, 12:23 AM
I tried doing entrance/exit bursts a few times yesterday and got 0 spawns for a whole minute.
Maybe I did it wrong, or it doesn't work when you're alone.

EvilMag
Sep 6, 2013, 12:24 AM
Maybe hope for a huge negative backlash from JP players to bring them back?

supersonix9
Sep 6, 2013, 12:40 AM
bursts are 10x better than they used to be

MetalDude
Sep 6, 2013, 12:49 AM
This patch is just full of fucking shit, isn't it.

darthvader
Sep 6, 2013, 12:58 AM
normal stuff. more power for force, less love for melees.

Cyron Tanryoku
Sep 6, 2013, 01:00 AM
Seconded, as one who did AQ's for boss's - exit bursts where nice when they happened, but its about time they got fixed for the people that abused them every-run. Should of been sooner imho


Wow, can you all cry more?

I am glad they patched it. Now people won't be as strict in AQ parties when it comes to bursting.
Read.

NoiseHERO
Sep 6, 2013, 01:07 AM
When did Yoshi become an Onion knight?

Anyhow R.I.P. PSO2.

Horo The Wise Wolf
Sep 6, 2013, 01:26 AM
Rares are meant to be rares.

They wouldn't be called rares if you found one every other run now would they?

Dnd
Sep 6, 2013, 01:31 AM
Remember you bought your DS for a reason

To match with my outfits, obviously.

MetalDude
Sep 6, 2013, 01:35 AM
Rares are meant to be rares.

They wouldn't be called rares if you found one every other run now would they?

We've gone through this argument before. The rates are absolutely abysmal and are not in any way balanced to an extent where putting in a reasonable amount of effort would actually result in you finding a rare. There's way too many stories and experiences of people putting hundreds of hours into hunting a rare only to find it long after it's been obsolete to seriously believe the rates are anything short of awful. And especially with the way this game obsoletes weapons like nobody's business, there's no excuse to have the rates be so terrible in the first place.

But I digress, you're missing the point anyways as stated by others. Burst mechanics got a general nerf despite statements made which is hilariously dumb in light of this.

Horo The Wise Wolf
Sep 6, 2013, 01:39 AM
We've gone through this argument before. The rates are absolutely abysmal and are not in any way balanced to an extent where putting in a reasonable amount of effort would actually result in you finding a rare. There's way too many stories and experiences of people putting hundreds of hours into hunting a rare only to find it long after it's been obsolete to seriously believe the rates are anything short of awful. And especially with the way this game obsoletes weapons like nobody's business, there's no excuse to have the rates be so terrible in the first place.

Sorry, lets give everyone what they want in 5 runs guaranteed.

It's only fair, after all.

I never find anything I want either. However I make due with what I have and learn to profit off of that to get the rares that I want. It's really not that hard. You don't need to hunt every rare that you want.

hurr durr pay2win

-going off your edit-

Bursts aren't that bad anyway. FO's do obviosuly well in this burst and HU's just need their gunslash. Just sit in a corner and have at it. They will never be pre-patch exit bursts (Which is good), but they are a burst after all.

Sayara
Sep 6, 2013, 01:40 AM
Bursts made for good stone/caps but thats about it. I mean, a te can just weed everything back together anyway if they spread out too far right? :???:

Horo The Wise Wolf
Sep 6, 2013, 01:45 AM
Well you guys are. You all are making a bigger deal over this than what it really is. This might effect the amount of caps you get from AQ's per run. It might possibly reduce your chances for a rare. I could also agree with that.

However for the people calling AQ's useless now? That was the group my original comment was directed to.

MetalDude
Sep 6, 2013, 01:46 AM
Calling AQs useless is a bit of a silly statement, I agree with that. It's more annoying to me that they refuse to make burst mechanics any bit intuitive or interesting instead of a lame gimmick. Half the time I'd rather just move on and see if RNG favored me and dumps a huge spawn on me instead.

My bad on lashing out, but I just don't find the rates in any way acceptable (especially coming from PSO1 where the weapon system was designed in tiers where you could reasonably find 10*s and still have other goals ahead of you like 11*s or the lofty 12*'s). If it weren't for pyroxenes, I'd have almost nothing beyond what I could afford with 10* passes (and if I didn't have premium, I'd barely play as it is).

Yutaka20
Sep 6, 2013, 01:55 AM
We've gone through this argument before. The rates are absolutely abysmal and are not in any way balanced to an extent where putting in a reasonable amount of effort would actually result in you finding a rare. There's way too many stories and experiences of people putting hundreds of hours into hunting a rare only to find it long after it's been obsolete to seriously believe the rates are anything short of awful. And especially with the way this game obsoletes weapons like nobody's business, there's no excuse to have the rates be so terrible in the first place.

But I digress, you're missing the point anyways as stated by others. Burst mechanics got a general nerf despite statements made which is hilariously dumb in light of this.

lol let's just agree to disagree lol
we all know well that rares are hard to find,and even if u do find certain rare,
u might not be able to use it or u out lvled the needed of it,
that is why items are sold in the shops,(if anyone aren't perm then too bad to them then)
it applies to many mmo games (apart wowtard)
which have rares that takes eons to find,and ppl gotta know that in pso2 ,it's kinda easier to lvl as well....to a certain point(case to case basis on playtime)
i personally enjoy the rates,anyway when u start equipping rare drop gears,rares seems to drop like nobody's business,so much so that ur inventory is flooded.
if u cant find them? buy them,
if u cant buy them (no 10* ticket)
stay calm and keep farming.
if u can't stand farming anymore(100hrs of no rare)
take ur computer,smash it and say "oh god why" and quit then LOL!


every game has a mechanic of certain difficulty,can't expect it to be all "mother of god saintly drops" lol
no patience = quit then :o

jooozek
Sep 6, 2013, 02:04 AM
there is no difficulty to dice rolls


Yes, I just looked at a video on Buta... fucking lol, they had a desert exit burst and the spawns were so slow it was unbelievable.

PSO2 ?????????????????? - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QWkXeNc8-7w)

oh god, those spawns, gotta also consider they have low pings
oh good god

Rien
Sep 6, 2013, 02:09 AM
Sorry, lets give everyone what they want in 5 runs guaranteed.

It's only fair, after all.

I never find anything I want either. However I make due with what I have and learn to profit off of that to get the rares that I want. It's really not that hard. You don't need to hunt every rare that you want.

hurr durr pay2win

-going off your edit-

Bursts aren't that bad anyway. FO's do obviosuly well in this burst and HU's just need their gunslash. Just sit in a corner and have at it. They will never be pre-patch exit bursts (Which is good), but they are a burst after all.

10* trading is pay to win. This game is hyper reliant on RNG and being able to bypass it almost entirely with some money means this is, without a doubt, one of the only two features 99% of the players would ever buy premium for.

And, really, melees have an even HARDER time reaching mobs now? I want my Sacred Skewer infinite range back.

Dnd
Sep 6, 2013, 02:11 AM
if u can't stand farming anymore (100hrs of no rare)

no patience = quit then :o

In regards to both points:

People go far, far longer then 100 hours without a 10*, even a 'bad' one. I know people who've killed over 3000 bosses without the rare versions rare drop. You claim that if you have no patience you should quit, but where does patience really end?

EDIT: Melee has an even harder time in bursts now? well could of fouled me. Done many bursts since the update and i haven't really noticed a huge difference - sure i cant stand still and spam AB till its over but thats only a good thing

Yutaka20
Sep 6, 2013, 02:20 AM
In regards to both points:

People go far, far longer then 100 hours without a 10*, even a 'bad' one. I know people who've killed over 3000 bosses without the rare versions rare drop. You claim that if you have no patience you should quit, but where does patience really end?

well easy ~
if u wanna play on = patience
i mean really now,as long as they are playing the game and continuing with it,
they know pretty well wat is coming.
"will i ever get a rare?"
or
"sick of this s**t,i am going over to another game"
^^;
so in our case referance to those killing 3000 boss and get nothing,
game on it is,
but really i mean most of the ppl complaining are mostly the ones who rarely have time to play
and wishing it was "wow's drop rate where u willl get a drop of rare"
don't u agree? and really these ppl just wanna whine for the sake of whining :(
then start blaming on p2w(pay to win systems ) lol.



What a dumbass hur derp
actually i wont say wat he said is dumb lol (maybe for answering the earlier question lol)
but many get certain weapon for the sake of novelty lol.
i am one of those ppl x.x

Dnd
Sep 6, 2013, 02:31 AM
What the fuck hur derp I hope this was sarcasm.
I could of spent less and got a jinrai, but i wanted a 790 s-atk double saber with a decent latent lol. I also wanted the weapon since before it was even released, I fell in love with the quartz caliber when I first found it and always wondered when crys drall was released if he would ever drop a better version - then i saw it on day one dropping in FC AQ and i was set on getting it.

Edit: While loosely on this subject, not a single exit burst went towards the funds getting it, lol

TaigaUC
Sep 6, 2013, 02:32 AM
Is there a thread on these forums where people aren't arguing?
I mean, a lot of this shit is pretty straightforward.
I don't see how there can logically be so much room for people to have vastly differing views on these issues unless they're being irrelevant and out of context.

You know, I bet SEGA reduced the Burst spawns as part of their "attempting to prevent rares from disappearing" fixes, like with how rares teleport to the player now.
I swear, they have the stupidest solutions to fixing game design problems that I've ever seen.

Yutaka20
Sep 6, 2013, 02:37 AM
Is there a thread on these forums where people aren't arguing?
I mean, a lot of this shit is pretty straightforward.
I don't see how there can logically be so much room for people to have vastly differing views on these issues unless they're being irrelevant and out of context.

You know, I bet SEGA reduced the Burst spawns as part of their "attempting to prevent rares from disappearing" fixes, like with how rares teleport to the player now.
I swear, they have the stupidest solutions to fixing game design problems that I've ever seen.

lol actually it's a decent addon on their part.
PSE burst really causes a lot of rares to drop from time to time
(most crap rares but still ppl wants them lol)
and having to stop atking just to look for rare is kinda bad lol.
this fix allows u to keep killing without worrying u miss the rare due to fast kill/drop rate.
i welcome this fix :3

Horo The Wise Wolf
Sep 6, 2013, 02:45 AM
This is PSOW.

We get work done by arguing.

jooozek
Sep 6, 2013, 03:06 AM
Is there a thread on these forums where people aren't arguing?
I mean, a lot of this shit is pretty straightforward.
I don't see how there can logically be so much room for people to have vastly differing views on these issues unless they're being irrelevant and out of context.

i think it's mostly because the majority plays the game for dressup :-?

yoshiblue
Sep 6, 2013, 03:08 AM
When did Yoshi become an Onion knight?


About a month ago.

Shinamori
Sep 6, 2013, 03:08 AM
I did bursts for exp. Getting (red weapons) was a nice side effect.

Chdata
Sep 6, 2013, 03:08 AM
I don't see the big issue. Pyroxenes are generally cheap and easy to obtain and some of the strongest weapons.

Also I did bursts, my last one before the update got me 8 ten star rares. Haven't gotten a chance to AQ since update though.

Zenobia
Sep 6, 2013, 03:17 AM
I could of spent less and got a jinrai, but i wanted a 790 s-atk double saber with a decent latent lol. I also wanted the weapon since before it was even released, I fell in love with the quartz caliber when I first found it and always wondered when crys drall was released if he would ever drop a better version - then i saw it on day one dropping in FC AQ and i was set on getting it.

Edit: While loosely on this subject, not a single exit burst went towards the funds getting it, lol

I actually don't like jinrai's latent myself but wouldn't you have been better off with the Flamme Icarus instead? I know Quarts Calibers latent so need for explanations I just figured if you were going to buy any DS it would be Flamme Icarus for the JA latent?

But then again I can see that you were dead set on it soooo welp I got my answer I suppose.

Shinamori
Sep 6, 2013, 03:24 AM
Generally, yeah. Not all of them are cheap.

Cyron Tanryoku
Sep 6, 2013, 03:33 AM
I like my enemies close so I don't have to travel a distance as melee
Relying on forces to pull in enemies ain't fun either, they're doing most of the work.

And saying people are making it a bigger issue than it is isn't correct at all
Burst are good because it's good exp, drops, and rares. Making larger distances and slowing down the spawn rate is a terrible idea. Melees take a hit and in general the reward is less fulfilling.

Oh, and AQs suck to begin with. It's literally only good for rares.
Bosses still suck, enemies still suck.

I'm not even motivated to do them anymore.

I strongly suggest Horo and Dnd stop thinking like super casuals.

Zenobia
Sep 6, 2013, 03:37 AM
Generally, yeah. Not all of them are cheap.

Flamme Icarus is 3-4mill on ship 2 that is cheap as hell what are you talking about?

Shinamori
Sep 6, 2013, 03:53 AM
Not everyone is rich.

Zenobia
Sep 6, 2013, 03:57 AM
Not everyone is rich.

You can be rich all you want if you aint premium and have a 10* wep pass or from when you were you can't even buy it to begin with.

Besides weren't you the same person who was selling something in the trade section of the forums assuming you also weren't under the effect of a 3 days shop ofc.

Shinamori
Sep 6, 2013, 03:59 AM
I have passes, just no meseta. All I have is 2mil to my name.

Aine
Sep 6, 2013, 04:01 AM
I do have a problem with exit bursts getting removed, but that's not even the issue being raised here so I don't know why people are busting out the EFFORT argument.

Here are the three main problems with this change:

1. Normal bursts got nerfed as well, even though they stated the changes would not affect normal bursts.

2. One of the reasons they put forward for fixing exit/entrance bursts was that players were being discriminated against and getting kicked out. However, the changes to spawn distance give Forces even more of an advantage and melee a disadvantage, and the fact that it's harder to get a good burst going now means efficiency parties are likely to become more strict.

3. Bursts aren't fun anymore. Before the update it felt good vapourizing waves of enemies, but now you're just wiping up the last few drops from grandpa's catheter. Burst respawns are even slower than normal respawns now.

Yutaka20
Sep 6, 2013, 04:04 AM
I have passes, just no meseta. All I have is 2mil to my name.

3 mil isnt hard to get -.-"
VH taco 500k x 6 days.
a full week would get u enough for a un-affixed one.
maybe u are just lazy lol
considering u already have passes and u might be a prem.
enough said

Shinamori
Sep 6, 2013, 04:06 AM
No, I tend to fall asleep on Tacos. And I can get 900k a day, it's that no one wants to do fully runs anymore. I actually have like 1 pass though, but like 7 10* rares and no premium.

ReaperTheAbsol
Sep 6, 2013, 04:13 AM
Meseta is even easier to come across now because everyone has (or should have) access to two characters for TACOs now.

OT: What's the current strategy to bursting now? Corner bursts?

Yutaka20
Sep 6, 2013, 04:13 AM
lol well i do havethe same issue,tacos are more fit so it tends to be boring .
but nevertheless u gotta do them :P
anyway u can try to join a team ,they will have more fix players doing taco.
but i will still have to ask this question lol,cos i think i know wats the prob.
which ship are u from?

Shinamori
Sep 6, 2013, 04:21 AM
Ship 2. I'm in a team, I just don't do them because me falling asleep in the middle of quest would be rude, especially tacos or AQs.

Yutaka20
Sep 6, 2013, 04:23 AM
lol too much excuses :/
i am gonna excuse myself from this lol.

locafoca
Sep 6, 2013, 04:45 AM
I do have a problem with exit bursts getting removed, but that's not even the issue being raised here so I don't know why people are busting out the EFFORT argument.

Here are the three main problems with this change:

1. Normal bursts got nerfed as well, even though they stated the changes would not affect normal bursts.

2. One of the reasons they put forward for fixing exit/entrance bursts was that players were being discriminated against and getting kicked out. However, the changes to spawn distance give Forces even more of an advantage and melee a disadvantage, and the fact that it's harder to get a good burst going now means efficiency parties are likely to become more strict.

3. Bursts aren't fun anymore. Before the update it felt good vapourizing waves of enemies, but now you're just wiping up the last few drops from grandpa's catheter. Burst respawns are even slower than normal respawns now.

Exactly this, particularly that bursts aren't fun anymore.

To add to this, melee classes, while not ideal for exit bursts in many areas before, are just about worthless during all bursts now. Really, you pretty much have two options: running up to the enemies as they spawn, or taking out a gunslash. In the first case, if your party contains one or two non-melee classes, the enemies in front of you should be dead by the time you dash into range because they spawn so far away now (I don't think that relying on un-popped zondeels is an actual solution). In the second case, you're doing very little to no damage. If melee classes were only sub-optimal for bursts before, they're worthless now, unless someone else has an idea that I don't.

I hope someone thinks of a way to make the best of this and that it catches on, or that SEGA does away with these changes. B230/231 seem to be ghost blocks now in a way that they weren't when Coast was released.

Yutaka20
Sep 6, 2013, 04:51 AM
Exactly this, particularly that bursts aren't fun anymore.

To add to this, melee classes, while not ideal for exit bursts in many areas before, are just about worthless during all bursts now. Really, you pretty much have two options: running up to the enemies as they spawn, or taking out a gunslash. In the first case, if your party contains one or two non-melee classes, the enemies in front of you should be dead by the time you dash into range because they spawn so far away now. In the second case, you're doing very little to no damage. If melee classes were only sub-optimal for bursts before, they're worthless now, unless someone else has an idea that I don't.

hmmm well not all melee class are useless.
br will still be efficent cos of it's atk speed and reaching enermies,
cant say so much for HU slow as usual ,FI's new PA for TD would still help.
yea that's all about it.
all in all Melee have have owned by SEGA's move lol .

KuroKanden
Sep 6, 2013, 04:53 AM
Just leaving some last second white day actions here , aka SEGA's way of saying goodbye to exit bursts :

[SPOILER-BOX]http://www5.picturepush.com/photo/a/13657788/img/13657788.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]

[SPOILER-BOX]http://www2.picturepush.com/photo/a/13657790/img/13657790.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]

[SPOILER-BOX]http://www5.picturepush.com/photo/a/13657798/img/13657798.jpg
[/SPOILER-BOX]
[SPOILER-BOX]http://www2.picturepush.com/photo/a/13657800/img/13657800.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]

[SPOILER-BOX]http://www2.picturepush.com/photo/a/13657805/img/13657805.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]

R.I.P. bursts 09/04

o0Kais0o
Sep 6, 2013, 06:45 AM
Honestly, so long as I don't see too big a dip in the exp I get, I really don't care. All I really use aq's for is levelling, hell knows theres no point in actively hunting crap in this game and half the pyroxene weps are stuff I have no use for.

As for regular missions I'm usually just boss rushing anyways, don't normally hang around enough to get a burst. So either way for once I'm totally indifferent to Sega's interesting way of dealing with stuff.

Xaelouse
Sep 6, 2013, 07:55 AM
Exactly this, particularly that bursts aren't fun anymore.

To add to this, melee classes, while not ideal for exit bursts in many areas before, are just about worthless during all bursts now. Really, you pretty much have two options: running up to the enemies as they spawn, or taking out a gunslash. In the first case, if your party contains one or two non-melee classes, the enemies in front of you should be dead by the time you dash into range because they spawn so far away now (I don't think that relying on un-popped zondeels is an actual solution). In the second case, you're doing very little to no damage. If melee classes were only sub-optimal for bursts before, they're worthless now, unless someone else has an idea that I don't.

I hope someone thinks of a way to make the best of this and that it catches on, or that SEGA does away with these changes. B230/231 seem to be ghost blocks now in a way that they weren't when Coast was released.

Look at it this way: Melee players are free to run around and murder spawn areas aren't covered by the rest of the group. AB spammers/FOs can't bitch anymore about them spreading out spawn points.
Melee is more fun in bursts now, although it's sad that parties still try to huddle up in a corner
Either way, everyone suffers from this.

jooozek
Sep 6, 2013, 08:27 AM
Look at it this way: Melee players are free to run around and murder spawn areas aren't covered by the rest of the group. AB spammers/FOs can't bitch anymore about them spreading out spawn points.
Melee is more fun in bursts now, although it's sad that parties still try to huddle up in a corner
Either way, everyone suffers from this.

with the terrible spawn rates forces/ranger will get stuff before melee anyway
also, melee is more fun because you are now forced to dash around even more? :no:

Z-0
Sep 6, 2013, 08:33 AM
AB spammers/FOs can't bitch anymore about them spreading out spawn points.
Yes, they can. PSE Bursts are still based on player location, and if a melee player moves far out to get an enemy, their enemy respawn will spawn even further out.

Cyron Tanryoku
Sep 6, 2013, 09:16 AM
Honestly, so long as I don't see too big a dip in the exp I get, I really don't care. All I really use aq's for is levelling
Burst were probably the biggest way to get EXP in AQs for me.
That, and bosses with their mobs. I feel it may have quite a dip, especially at later levels

Skyly HUmar
Sep 6, 2013, 09:32 AM
goodbye 800k exp forest bursts ;;.

Hrith
Sep 6, 2013, 09:40 AM
Except there is no reason a melee player would move out of the way more than any other player type.

Forces who blamed melee players for not using AB at exit bursts are despicable noobs who suck so much they can only play a game using exploits.
I have been in bursts of over 10 minutes that were neither exit nor corner. I have been a melee class in exit bursts and done three times the damage I would have done with AB, without spawning the monsters too far from a card user's Zondeel.

l2p

I'm so loving all the nubs whining, though.

gigawuts
Sep 6, 2013, 09:44 AM
30 minute pure melee burst checking in

I ain't even upset

Xaelouse
Sep 6, 2013, 09:56 AM
Yes, they can. PSE Bursts are still based on player location, and if a melee player moves far out to get an enemy, their enemy respawn will spawn even further out.

depends on how far out they go. If they stay in the general area, it changes nothing about the spawns. Some people can huddle up in a corner and melee can go out and kill, nothing changes. Everyone huddles in corner, nothing changes. Witnessed this several times.
And melee is more fun in bursts now because they aren't limited to motionless AB spamming for 15 minutes. I can actually use the weapons I want. Wow

MetalDude
Sep 6, 2013, 09:57 AM
Edit: Fuck it, I've been in a mood for starting shit and I'm just gonna chill.

~Aya~
Sep 6, 2013, 10:50 AM
It was a mistake to remove EX bursts. Don't fix things that aren't broken. Instead of "fixing" player's creative ways of being efficent, fix every other aspect of your game that are obviously broken.

Japanese community is pissed off~

gigawuts
Sep 6, 2013, 10:54 AM
Sitting in a corner shooting shit that spawns in one place for 20 minutes is boring as all fuck and I'd rather play minesweeper.

How about they make it so regularly playing the game is as efficient as exit bursting used to be? Permanently improve rates and exp, and keep future content in line with the improved rates. No more of this boost week shit. It should always be actually good.

If that crashes prices of every rare in the game that highlights the issues with the rare binding and affixing system being prohibitively expensive, now doesn't it? Everybody gets one item and clings to it for dear life - that's a major flaw. People should be buying items willy nilly because it's 2% better knowing they can improve it reliably. Not this shit where it could cost anywhere between 100k and literal infinity. THAT will create a healthy and moving economy, like the game should have already.

Skyly HUmar
Sep 6, 2013, 10:57 AM
Sitting in a corner shooting shit that spawns in one place for 20 minutes is boring as all fuck and I'd rather play minesweeper.

How about they make it so regularly playing the game is as efficient as exit bursting used to be? Permanently improve rates and exp, and keep future content in line with the improved rates. No more of this boost week shit. It should always be actually good.

If that crashes prices of every rare in the game that highlights the issues with the rare binding and affixing system being prohibitively expensive, now doesn't it? Everybody gets one item and clings to it for dear life - that's a major flaw. People should be buying items willy nilly because it's 2% better knowing they can improve it reliably. Not this shit where it could cost anywhere between 100k and literal infinity. THAT will create a healthy and moving economy, like the game should have already.

Didnt you just describe pso1 but with PDs instead? iirc only the final end game ubers were really hard to trade for.

Ezodagrom
Sep 6, 2013, 11:00 AM
The changes they did to bursts are the complete opposite of what I expected, was hoping they would make enemies spawn much closer to the players during bursts at entrances and exits, instead of making them spawn further away from players... :|

~Aya~
Sep 6, 2013, 11:01 AM
Sitting in a corner shooting shit that spawns in one place for 20 minutes is boring as all fuck and I'd rather play minesweeper.

How about they make it so regularly playing the game is as efficient as exit bursting used to be? Permanently improve rates and exp, and keep future content in line with the improved rates. No more of this boost week shit. It should always be actually good.

If that crashes prices of every rare in the game that highlights the issues with the rare binding and affixing system being prohibitively expensive, now doesn't it? Everybody gets one item and clings to it for dear life - that's a major flaw. People should be buying items willy nilly because it's 2% better knowing they can improve it reliably. Not this shit where it could cost anywhere between 100k and literal infinity. THAT will create a healthy and moving economy, like the game should have already.

Wonderful idea~

That won't happen unless by some miracle they have a change of heart~

Minesweeper? what? >>;;;

I prefer sitting in that small area, shooting things for 20 minutes over running quests for hundreds of hours to turn up empty handed and meseta-less for my efforts.

Cyron Tanryoku
Sep 6, 2013, 11:07 AM
It's funny people are even trying to defend this
It's not even rocket science. Spawn rate is slower which equals less mobs which equals less payout.
Their goal was to prevent exit bursting, but they fucked up bursting in general.

It's probably worse on Vita and you have one enemy spawning every 20 seconds.

gigawuts
Sep 6, 2013, 11:19 AM
Didnt you just describe pso1 but with PDs instead? iirc only the final end game ubers were really hard to trade for.

I actually just described a whole bunch of games.

It's funny people are even trying to defend this
It's not even rocket science. Spawn rate is slower which equals less mobs which equals less payout.
Their goal was to prevent exit bursting, but they fucked up bursting in general.

It's probably worse on Vita and you have one enemy spawning every 20 seconds.

Bursting in general is bad design. When we first heard about it we all assumed it would be on top of the rates we were familiar with from PSO, PSU, PSP, etc. Did it turn out that way?

Fuck no. How it turned out is that if you're not bursting you ain't getting shit.

How to fix bursting: Remove it and make the regular game good instead. If people still insist on keeping bursting, turn it into something other than the only real way to get items, money, and experience.

Kondibon
Sep 6, 2013, 11:22 AM
How about they make it so regularly playing the game is as efficient as exit bursting used to be?http://youtu.be/Jy7CcwnfUdU?t=22m50s

Relivant

Cyron Tanryoku
Sep 6, 2013, 11:26 AM
Bursting in general is bad design. When we first heard about it we all assumed it would be on top of the rates we were familiar with from PSO, PSU, PSP, etc. Did it turn out that way?

Fuck no. How it turned out is that if you're not bursting you ain't getting shit.

How to fix bursting: Remove it and make the regular game good instead. If people still insist on keeping bursting, turn it into something other than the only real way to get items, money, and experience.
I can't speak for money and items, because I always got rares just fine outside of burst. However I do agree with what you're saying, they should just make the game good to begin with.

However, that doesn't excuse the fact that SEGA completely butchered a system many people relied on.

Z-0
Sep 6, 2013, 11:27 AM
http://youtu.be/Jy7CcwnfUdU?t=22m50s

Relivant
When he's going on about what's good, it's what SEGA is trying to avoid.
When he's gong on about what's bad, it's exactly what SEGA is doing.

: D...

MetalDude
Sep 6, 2013, 11:28 AM
I don't play GW2 but I have mad respect for their designers. They always seem to have the player in mind and they try very hard to make sure every facet of the game works. Every time my brother talks to me about it, I take a bigger look at PSO2 and go "What were they thinking with *insert mechanic here*?".

Kondibon
Sep 6, 2013, 11:28 AM
When he's going on about what's good, it's what SEGA is trying to avoid.
When he's gong on about what's bad, it's exactly what SEGA is doing.

: D...

Exactly.

: D...

gigawuts
Sep 6, 2013, 11:29 AM
http://youtu.be/Jy7CcwnfUdU?t=22m50s

Relivant

You always manage to link very insightful videos. In this case he's exactly right, but it speaks to the problem with PSO2 that everyone is expected to do PSE bursts as efficiently as possible - and then when they do they try to take it away.

They ask players to do something, the players do it, and they nerf it. What do they even expect?

Just make the entire game actually fun and efficient to play. Bursting as a concept to really get something going is good! But as the BEST for EVERYTHING? Oh my god no.

I think what I'd like is if enemies got higher levels like with AQ risk and then players got awesome bonuses. That's a good sounding burst replacement.

Kondibon
Sep 6, 2013, 11:37 AM
Personally, I don't consider this a nerf. I consider it a fix. Exit bursting was a side effect of of the mechanics of the game not an intended way for PSE bursts to play out. So they aren't "nerfing" anything anymore than they'd be nerfing Falz hads for fixing that glitch where double the amount of hands spawn.

That said though, they do need to even out the content instead of making PSE bursts the most efficient way to do everything, like you said. I like them but I feel like there needs to be some kind of limit

On that note, remember when PSE bursts used to look like this and everyone was ok with it?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q97_tHOpehk

gigawuts
Sep 6, 2013, 11:40 AM
Mine still look like that, and I don't even care.

Z-0
Sep 6, 2013, 11:40 AM
Okay hold up, people aren't reading the thread, here is what happened:

- Exit/Entrance bursts were not patched. They can still be performed, but with less efficiency.
- During PSE Bursts, enemies will spawn -further away- from the player than before.
- During PSE Bursts, enemy respawns take longer than they used to.

In other words, what SEGA has done is made the central aspect of the game worse, as from what I can understand, the entire game was pretty much based around bursting considering how terrible the EXP Curve is and the drop rates.

The reason this bothers me isn't because it's any less boring or anything (well, it is), but because being able to find what you want has become a lot harder than it should be. The game should not be rewarding heavy luck over anything else, especially when everything is pooled into one way to get what you want.

Fleur
Sep 6, 2013, 11:41 AM
It would make the change a little less annoying if capsules didn't have the standard quest drop model. I love wasting time and running around to every corner of the block to loot 50 stones when I just want capsules.

Cyron Tanryoku
Sep 6, 2013, 11:42 AM
Okay hold up, people aren't reading the thread, here is what happened:

- Exit/Entrance bursts were not patched. They can still be performed, but with less efficiency.
- During PSE Bursts, enemies will spawn -further away- from the player than before.
- During PSE Bursts, enemy respawns take longer than they used to.

In other words, what SEGA has done is made the central aspect of the game worse, as from what I can understand, the entire game was pretty much based around bursting considering how terrible the EXP Curve is and the drop rates.
Bingo. People keep talking about how they like how the exit burst is fixed and I just facepalm. All SEGA did was make them spawn slower and farther away.
It's kinda bothersome to repeat this like...5 times and people still talk about exit bursting and ignoring what actually happened

Kondibon
Sep 6, 2013, 11:44 AM
Mine still look like that, and I don't even care.
So do mine, but you get the idea.



In other words, what SEGA has done is made the central aspect of the game worse, as from what I can understand, the entire game was pretty much based around bursting considering how terrible the EXP Curve is and the drop rates.

That's what Giga is saying. The game is based around PSE bursts, but both he, and I believe it shouldn't be, and that the standard rates for everything should be good on their own, with PSE bursts being an extra bonus, not something you HAVE to get and maintain to make any meaningful progress.

gigawuts
Sep 6, 2013, 11:44 AM
Right, the game revolves around bursting - and since some players were doing it exceptionally well bursting in general was nerfed.

This is going to punish everyone but the exit bursters, who will effectively benefit because they're still the ones bursting better than everyone else.

That's what Giga is saying. The game is based around PSE bursts, but both he, and I believe it shouldn't be, and that the standard rates for everything should be good on their own, with PSE bursts being an extra bonus, not something you HAVE to get and maintain to make any meaningful progress.

edit: Bingo, you got it perfectly.

Dnd
Sep 6, 2013, 11:45 AM
I strongly suggest Horo and Dnd stop thinking like super casuals.

What as in two people who do 50+ AQ's a week easy and are not bothered about the change is considered super casual?

Anyway, with these new bursts, i suppose its just too hard for the forces/rangers to pick off the stuff spawning in the distance and leave the closer stuff for melee to kill right?

Cyron Tanryoku
Sep 6, 2013, 11:48 AM
You can play a game for 24 hours everyday, that doesn't mean you can't be casual
I called you two super casuals because your reasonings were terrible

i suppose its just too hard for the forces/rangers to pick off the stuff spawning in the distance and leave the closer stuff for melee to kill right?
This is a good example. Because when in a burst everyone is going to go for whatever they can target. Forces and rangers are not going to leave things for melee to kill because they'll be too busy trying to kill everything quickly.
Even then, with the new spawn distance, nothing is really close to begin with now

You had your opinions and that was fine, but the way you expressed it was very comparable to a casual

Kondibon
Sep 6, 2013, 11:53 AM
You had your opinions and that was fine, but the way you expressed it was very comparable to a casual

I don't like seeing the word "casual" being used as an insult, it doesn't carry any meaning. It's like calling someone a "hipster". ._.

gigawuts
Sep 6, 2013, 11:54 AM
You can play a game for 24 hours everyday, that doesn't mean you can't be casual
I called you two super casuals because your reasonings were terrible

This is a good example. Because when in a burst everyone is going to go for whatever they can target.

You had your opinions and that was fine, but the way you expressed it was very comparable to a casual

cyron don't make me smack you, because I know you'll smack me back and I know it'll be harder and I don't want to be smacked

edit: on the face I mean, everywhere else is open season

Cyron Tanryoku
Sep 6, 2013, 11:59 AM
I don't like seeing the word "casual" being used as an insult, it doesn't carry any meaning. It's like calling someone a "hipster". ._.
Me saying casual is my way of trying to be nice and not call people idiots.
Do you want me to use such strong language?!

BlankM
Sep 6, 2013, 12:04 PM
Its pretty simple really.

SEGA wasn't giving a fuck about making the game more fun or making classes more balanced for AQs or anything like that. They straight up nerfed bursts.

Not just exit bursts, BURSTS. A mechanic THEY implemented. They're pathetic now regardless of where you do them.

Its clear SEGA just has no idea what they are doing, but that was clear a very long time ago.

Only when the backlash from this change hits hard will they provide a band-aid fix. Something trivial to hold us over. Then continue to release more skimpy costumes to brag about concurrent users logged on.

Cyron Tanryoku
Sep 6, 2013, 12:05 PM
The options are either make the game good or fix bursts


Option A clearly isn't going to happen so I'd like them to fix bursts

jooozek
Sep 6, 2013, 12:06 PM
remember when people complained about how tigredors are common
what happened to lambda tigredor
next thing you will know they will be removing the dash buttons because they'll notice that people actually use it

Kondibon
Sep 6, 2013, 12:06 PM
Me saying casual is my way of trying to be nice and not call people idiots.
Do you want me to use such strong language?!

Well it's just that... the word has such a subjective meaning that it can confuse people and cause miscommunication. I'd prefer if you didn't call people names at all.

I realized that I identify myself as a "gamer" before anything else. If someone called me gay or a tranny I'd be like "yeah, so?" but if someone uses the words "noob" or "casual" I flip my shit even though I jokingly call myself a "fucking casual" all the time... What is wrong with me? ; A;

But this is off topic. ;;

Cyron Tanryoku
Sep 6, 2013, 12:08 PM
remember when people complained about how tigredors are common
what happened to lambda tigredor
next thing you will know they will be removing the dash buttons because they'll notice that people actually use it
Wait people complained about tigredors?
That's probably why I never found lambda god damn it pso2 community

gigawuts
Sep 6, 2013, 12:10 PM
yeah a few people threw ginormous hissy fits because they weren't the sole owners of tigredors and later on elder rods anymore

they probably went on to throw a tantrum at daycare when the mean lady told them to share their blocks, too

Kondibon
Sep 6, 2013, 12:12 PM
Its pretty simple really.

SEGA wasn't giving a fuck about making the game more fun or making classes more balanced for AQs or anything like that. They straight up nerfed bursts.

Not just exit bursts, BURSTS. A mechanic THEY implemented. They're pathetic now regardless of where you do them.

Its clear SEGA just has no idea what they are doing, but that was clear a very long time ago.

Only when the backlash from this change hits hard will they provide a band-aid fix. Something trivial to hold us over. Then continue to release more skimpy costumes to brag about concurrent users logged on.

Sega obviously has a habit of over nerfing things, even when I agree they need to be nerfed. So it's not like I don't agree they overdid it with the PSE bursts, (or aculpus, holy crap!) but it wasn't exactly good in the first place. I would rather PSE bursts not exist at all than exist in their previous form. At the very least though this will get people complaining. Assuming they haven't already quit because of the patcher debacle. goddamnitsega

MetalDude
Sep 6, 2013, 12:13 PM
It's such a stupid complaint. With the sheer number of weapons we have now (disregarding that there's usually only one of each type to actually care about), I don't see people carrying many of the same weapons anymore. No excessive amount of Lambda Aristins, Elder Rods, or Tigredors anymore. And in a game with a weapon system all about finding the best stats, why should they care in the first place? I'm more inclined to believe it's a misinterpreted comment on Sega's part.

Xaelouse
Sep 6, 2013, 12:15 PM
Hopefully the japanese get a clue and demand fixes to the exp curve, droprates, etc. instead of wishing for the tumor to return

Aine
Sep 6, 2013, 12:18 PM
Fun fact: Rangers were actually better than Forces at exit bursts (even in Desert, Tunnels, and Ruins after the crab nerf). For some reason though, only Forces discriminated against other classes in tech-only parties. I only ever played AQs with my team, and I never forced exit bursts on anyone, so I'm kind of miffed that everyone is getting punished by the nerf.

[SPOILER-BOX]http://www.pso-world.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=1481&pictureid=37040[/SPOILER-BOX]


Right, the game revolves around bursting - and since some players were doing it exceptionally well bursting in general was nerfed.

What's wrong with the game revolving around bursting? Exit bursting in AQs was one of the few things you could actually get a payoff from by investing effort. If you learned the mechanics, memorized the PSE colours, fixed up your gear, and honed your party co-ordination you could reliably get exit bursts going every time, and be rewarded for it. Now you just have to be lucky enough to win the lottery and get the super rare boss drop.

Zenobia
Sep 6, 2013, 12:22 PM
No, I tend to fall asleep on Tacos. And I can get 900k a day, it's that no one wants to do fully runs anymore. I actually have like 1 pass though, but like 7 10* rares and no premium.

With a full run its 960K a day.


http://youtu.be/Jy7CcwnfUdU?t=22m50s

Relivant

Fuck you Sega Guild Warz 2 ONE UPED YOU!

Z-0
Sep 6, 2013, 12:37 PM
What's wrong with the game revolving around bursting?
Like you, I was perfectly okay with it when Exit Bursts were around. They could be done somewhat consistently, required co-ordination, attention and (sometimes) a decent party setup. They were also rewarding for the effort you put into looking for them and doing the right things.

However, in their current state, it essentially makes the game a bigger lottery than it already was, as you have to hope for a good block to burst in, hope you get the right enemies, and hope as much as you can that the enemies don't decide to randomly spawn 10,000 miles away from everyone where someone has to run out to get it, dispersing enemies even more and causing payout to become much less.

And hunting boss drops was never viable, yes. Way too rare, I don't think I've ever found a good boss drop.

I also wish I played as much as you did, I only have like 1,000 of each cap, and not much money... >:

MetalDude
Sep 6, 2013, 12:39 PM
And hunting boss drops was never viable, yes. Way too rare, I don't think I've ever found a good boss drop.
Good, so I'm not the only one who think they're a total crock. Rare enemies especially are a complete joke in this game when it comes to rates.

Zenobia
Sep 6, 2013, 12:43 PM
Well what I am asking is this cause back before this pre-nerf or w/e I always did AQ's in Vita blocks.

While AQ's became more of a pain to do is it still viable to run them in Vita blocks or just do them where ever now?

gigawuts
Sep 6, 2013, 12:48 PM
Fun fact: Rangers were actually better than Forces at exit bursts (even in Desert, Tunnels, and Ruins after the crab nerf). For some reason though, only Forces discriminated against other classes in tech-only parties. I only ever played AQs with my team, and I never forced exit bursts on anyone, so I'm kind of miffed that everyone is getting punished by the nerf.

[SPOILER-BOX]http://www.pso-world.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=1481&pictureid=37040[/SPOILER-BOX]



What's wrong with the game revolving around bursting? Exit bursting in AQs was one of the few things you could actually get a payoff from by investing effort. If you learned the mechanics, memorized the PSE colours, fixed up your gear, and honed your party co-ordination you could reliably get exit bursts going every time, and be rewarded for it. Now you just have to be lucky enough to win the lottery and get the super rare boss drop.

It isn't that the payoff for doing it is too great - it's that the payoff for not doing it isn't great enough. In being so good, it directly makes the rest of the game bad.

I felt exit bursting was fine. But not everybody likes to exit burst. It's understandably boring as fuck to a lot of people. The balance of item rewards is disproportionately higher for people exit bursting than it is for people who aren't exit bursting.

The rest of the game suffers when exit bursting is the only way to reliably get items and experience. That's just a fact. You can say you think that the existing imbalance between people who like to do nothing but stare at a bright screen and click a mouse for however many hours a night and people who prefer to see the enemies they're attacking is fine, I mean I'm not going to track down your address and beat you until you say you think it isn't fine or anything - but that doesn't mean I think it's fine.
edit:
Good, so I'm not the only one who think they're a total crock. Rare enemies especially are a complete joke in this game when it comes to rates.

Last night a few teammates and I decided to kill some ringardas. First ringarda: rare. A dude in my party found the amen double saber and amen rod.

I'm not even joking.

Probably never happened before, and probably will never happen again.

This is the same game that refuses to drop me a demo comet after easily >400 gwana nero kills.

"Crock" is an understatement. I'm not mad he found it or anything, actually I'm really glad because he did need some cool gear, I'm just irked that it's so goddamn inconsistent. He could have just as easily - more easily, actually - never seen another boss rare again.

I don't even know what to make of it, honestly.

GuardianGirth
Sep 6, 2013, 01:04 PM
Gigawutts, you lost all credibility when you said bursts shouldn't be in the game. Completely revolve around them? No
It's a great concept and all they had to do was use this "long range spawn" in the entrance and exit rooms IDs. Thats it.

So many people here have jaded opinions and simply not enough experience to say anything credible about how bursts should be.

Bursts are worse for every class and it's much more unbalanced for hunters now. Everyone likes to contribute in a party. That cant be denied and anyone is deluding themselves in thinking that having far away spawns and slower spawn rates benefits anyone.

Bursts should have the same spawn rate as before, close enough to the players within the ROOM ID and from all angles, its that simple.

Boss drops have always been pathetic.

I don't expect anything to come from this topic, so hopefully enough JPs bitch to sega to get them to realize "we could've just taken the spawns out of the exit and entrance rooms or made them have abysmal spawn rates"

gigawuts
Sep 6, 2013, 01:15 PM
Gigawutts, you lost all credibility when you said bursts shouldn't be in the game.

I'll make a note that Mr 1000 ATK Talis doesn't give me any credence.

I'll also make a note that you don't read past the first thing you dislike to see something you then agree with.

There, noted.

GuardianGirth
Sep 6, 2013, 01:30 PM
I'll make a note that Mr 1000 ATK Talis doesn't give me any credence.

I'll also make a note that you don't read past the first thing you dislike to see something you then agree with.

There, noted.

Believe it or not, I can agree with 1 point someone makes and think someone's completely silly with another.

And I hope thats my title. I'll make it rain with my Talis.

Without tone, an argument over the net gets dull and un-beneficial for almost anyone so i'll just leave it at that.

Fact of the matter is, bursts after 09/04 < before 09/04, the end.

MetalDude
Sep 6, 2013, 01:45 PM
Do I ship this too

The dock can't provide enough ships to meet your demands.

Dnd
Sep 6, 2013, 02:00 PM
While trying to stay on topic - with a force splating all the long-range spawns and me running around near a wall killing all the closer spawning mobs, we had a 10 min cross-burst with just two people, yielding well over 100k exp without a booster and I alone got 22 caps from it, without lucky rise or rare drop boosters.

If people actually stopped bitching and adapted to the situation, it wouldn't be so bad, honestly

Arkanoid
Sep 6, 2013, 02:05 PM
Okay back on topic.

The truth about the new burst system is.........................

.................................................. .....................

.................................................. .....................

*drumroll*

They will probably just change it again anyway.

On the other hand, does anyone else feel like the drop rates in the new area actually aren't completely awful?

Cyron Tanryoku
Sep 6, 2013, 02:05 PM
I haven't ran the new area
Aside from unlocking it

Horo The Wise Wolf
Sep 6, 2013, 02:06 PM
They will probably just change it again anyway.


I can see this if enough JP's complain about it.

MetalDude
Sep 6, 2013, 02:12 PM
Ultimately, the point of the thread was to state that general bursting mechanics were in fact nerfed. You can still make use of it as Zyn and dnd pointed out, but it doesn't changed that it's shittier now. Another point was then brought up by giga and reiterated by others that the focus of the game's rates and experience gains around bursts is hugely flawed especially given how much more unintuitive they are now (on top of the fact that the system is kind of stupid to begin with).

gigawuts
Sep 6, 2013, 02:14 PM
Credibility in one subject matter vs credibility in another subject...maybe that distinction is impossible to make without tone.:-?

Although no personal reflection on Giga, I come to PSO-world to tease my desire for intelligent discussions on PSO2, no wonder I always end up getting blue-balled.

P.S. My username actually has nothing to do with my dick size....that's just pleasant irony.

Tone would help, yes, but being a bit more specific would too.

You're right that I don't go around MPAs trying to burst all day erry day because, frankly, that bores me to tears. I'm sure there's tricks of the trade I'm unaware of. It's nice as an addition to what I'm already doing, and sometimes I aim for it in AQs, but I wasn't actually joking when I said I'd generally prefer to play minesweeper than approach this game as a fish in a barrel simulator. At least the mines stand a chance.

WinTroll
Sep 6, 2013, 02:31 PM
Can this be done efficiently solo? and at lower levels? Im lvl 31, and the grind feels terrible lol.

jooozek
Sep 6, 2013, 02:31 PM
this whole thread is about not being able to do burst efficiently in any form

MetalDude
Sep 6, 2013, 02:32 PM
I honestly hate solo bursts regardless of how the spawn mechanics work. I'd rather just have moderately large waves thrown at me so I can sweep them rather than spend all of my time repositioning to kill stuff.

WinTroll
Sep 6, 2013, 02:33 PM
my apologies. Im still trying to figure this game out haha. Havent played since PSO on dreamcast haha

Horo The Wise Wolf
Sep 6, 2013, 02:42 PM
this whole thread is about not being able to do burst efficiently in any form

But you can still. It is just not as autopilot as it was with pre 9/4 exit bursts.

Cyron Tanryoku
Sep 6, 2013, 02:42 PM
Less enemies spawning, less reward
It's not as effective as it use to be regardless of how you burst

And you can still exit burst

jooozek
Sep 6, 2013, 02:52 PM
But you can still. It is just not as autopilot as it was with pre 9/4 exit bursts.

your post just shows that you don't understand what actually happened this update

Z-0
Sep 6, 2013, 02:52 PM
"oh it's not too bad. just settle with what you get."

^ cut this shit out. this sort of attitude is why games get bad, because the more people that have this attitude, the more shit gaming companies will pull.

MetalDude
Sep 6, 2013, 02:53 PM
Less enemies spawning, less reward
It's not as effective as it use to be regardless of how you burst

And you can still exit burst

Which again compounds with the point brought up about bad rates being dependent on bursts in the first place. It's a poor attempt to fix an efficiency exploit in the system without in turn making bursts any better in their own right. It's just kind of mind-boggling to see the design issues there are in this game and there's literally no acceptable reason to just be ok with this and move on.

Cyron Tanryoku
Sep 6, 2013, 02:56 PM
Not gonna lie, even if SEGA fixed drop rates I still wouldn't want a burst nerf.
SEGA won't do a damn thing about rates so I'd rather get the burst back to speed

And for those who missed it

- Exit/Entrance bursts were not patched. They can still be performed, but with less efficiency.
- During PSE Bursts, enemies will spawn -further away- from the player than before.
- During PSE Bursts, enemy respawns take longer than they used to.

Horo The Wise Wolf
Sep 6, 2013, 02:57 PM
your post just shows that you don't understand what actually happened this update

I just played Several AQ's where I got the same outcome as I did before the update. I got 20-30 caps, the same amount of rares (none), and several crossbursts. One taking at least 15 minutes.

Granted it was with one other person.



"oh it's not too bad. just settle with what you get."

^ cut this shit out. this sort of attitude is why games get bad, because the more people that have this attitude, the more shit gaming companies will pull.


What do you suppose we do about it? We can't do anything. We'll just sit here and take it. No sense in complaining about it. Just make due with what you have and maybe they'll change. (With JP players complaining.)

Cyron Tanryoku
Sep 6, 2013, 02:59 PM
What do you suppose we do about it? We can't do anything.
If you don't want to see complaints stay the hell away from a forum

Horo The Wise Wolf
Sep 6, 2013, 03:00 PM
Thank you for answering my question.

Z-0
Sep 6, 2013, 03:01 PM
What's wrong with expressing your own opinion these days? Are people really so soft that any sort of negativity sets off their "crybaby radar" or some shit?

Cyron Tanryoku
Sep 6, 2013, 03:02 PM
Probably.

Horo probably assumes WE can't complain because we aren't from Japan.

At least, that's what their post makes me believe.


I quite frankly, would find that bullshit. Complaining is complaining. The more vocal the more chance they'll do something about it.

jooozek
Sep 6, 2013, 03:04 PM
I just played Several AQ's where I got the same outcome as I did before the update. I got 20-30 caps, the same amount of rares (none), and several crossbursts. One taking at least 15 minutes.

Granted it was with one other person.
anyone can tell you that PSE rates in AQs are pretty batshit insane so getting 15 minutes with duo isn't something to be amazed about and that doesn't change the fact that the randomised up spawns joined up with the delayed by 2-3 seconds spawns (lol, just lol) means that the nerf is beyond what you can imagine because you probably never were in efficient parties
take your head out of the AQ box and realise how bursts were nerfed outside of AQs/crystals

Z-0
Sep 6, 2013, 03:06 PM
man even crystals got nerfed because -I think- they removed the omen which means finding crystals = burst with however many players were on the map, rather than being able to call people.

what happened to crystals anyway, does anyone know?

MetalDude
Sep 6, 2013, 03:07 PM
Well, that's the thing. In an AQ, I had gotten the crystal omen before (couldn't find it, was at the very end). Unless you're talking about *strictly free field MPA maps.

Horo The Wise Wolf
Sep 6, 2013, 03:09 PM
man even crystals got nerfed because -I think- they removed the omen which means finding crystals = burst with however many players were on the map, rather than being able to call people.

what happened to crystals anyway, does anyone know?

I got the Crystal Omen in an AQ. From the MPA's I have done I haven't gotten a Crystal omen yet. They just kinda pop up.

Link1275
Sep 6, 2013, 03:28 PM
man even crystals got nerfed because -I think- they removed the omen which means finding crystals = burst with however many players were on the map, rather than being able to call people.

what happened to crystals anyway, does anyone know?
Didn't sega say they were nerfing crystals as well so that you couldn't get a warning and call people in to help with the code and PSE?

Zenobia
Sep 6, 2013, 04:14 PM
I just played Several AQ's where I got the same outcome as I did before the update. I got 20-30 caps, the same amount of rares (none), and several crossbursts. One taking at least 15 minutes.

Granted it was with one other person.





What do you suppose we do about it? We can't do anything. We'll just sit here and take it. No sense in complaining about it. Just make due with what you have and maybe they'll change. (With JP players complaining.)

Just stop with these casual posting you don't know how the game works when it comes to pse burst sega tried to stop the exit burst but what they was a counter productive bs move which made it worst I do shits ton of AQ's daily and I can totally see the difference from back then and until now the shit is dumb.

Ofc we will adept but that doesn't mean we like what sega has done that's like saying "We don't like what the new patch update did with our HDD(including it happened to you) but meeh I'll just take how it is and roll with it I don't see a
problem.

@Z-0 I haven't seen a crystal code in fucking days to me it feel like they removed them completely.

BIG OLAF
Sep 6, 2013, 04:15 PM
Yes, removing an obnoxious exploit like Exit Bursts was such a bad move.

jooozek
Sep 6, 2013, 04:17 PM
Yes, removing an obnoxious exploit like Exit Bursts was such a bad move.

it's been repeated a good few times in this thread already

exit bursts are still in the game

Zenobia
Sep 6, 2013, 04:18 PM
Exactly it just requires more effort duh.

BIG OLAF
Sep 6, 2013, 04:21 PM
it's been repeated a good few times in this thread already

Like I'd spend 10 minutes reading through this shitstorm, twit.

Even if they were just nerfed, good. Should be removed, though.

Horo The Wise Wolf
Sep 6, 2013, 04:22 PM
You all throw around that term far too often.

What defines a 'casual'?

I am well aware how the game works. I am also aware of how the game is abused. Exit bursts were abused. I am aware now after seeing it for myself that they are still here, but they aren't nearly as efficient. Which is good.

Crystal codes have not been removed. I just played one today. Great burst too.

Cyron Tanryoku
Sep 6, 2013, 04:25 PM
Like I'd spend 10 minutes reading through this shitstorm, twit.

Even if they were just nerfed, good. Should be removed, though.
Here is a tl;dr version:

Burst in general were nerfed and melee suffer the most.
Enemies spawn very far away, and less often.

So yeah

jooozek
Sep 6, 2013, 04:31 PM
it's funny how casuals get all riled up about "exploits" (when in reality they aren't exploits because enemies didn't spawn faster thanks to exit bursting or anything like that) because they take more than running around in circles

gigawuts
Sep 6, 2013, 04:32 PM
it's funny how casuals get all riled up about "exploits" (when in reality they aren't exploits because enemies didn't spawn faster thanks to exit bursting or anything like that) because they take more than running around in circles

itt standing still is more work than running in circles

jooozek
Sep 6, 2013, 04:38 PM
itt standing still is more work than running in circles

right, because post-setup execution is the only thing that could be allowed to take work

Z-0
Sep 6, 2013, 04:38 PM
Exit Bursts were actually about paying attention, actually.

gigawuts
Sep 6, 2013, 04:40 PM
right, because post-setup execution is the only thing that could be allowed to take work

is this one of those times we're going to make easy shit sound difficult to set ourselves up on a pedestal of skill when in reality we're not even doing anything difficult in the first place?

because if we are I can't wait to brag about how all the casual walkers are whining about how much faster I can power walk past them

gonna be some malcolm in the middle shit here

jooozek
Sep 6, 2013, 04:41 PM
considering that we are comparing it to double-v-tap sheep following in circles
yeah

BlankM
Sep 6, 2013, 05:30 PM
I dislike how the only thing people ever get out of exit bursts is "I'm standing still and spamming the same PA over and over."

Because 1) That's still what you do now, and 2) There was much more to it then that for getting the MOST you could possibly get out of them.

I've been in many AQ parties, and randoms who don't communicate don't burst nearly as well as a co-ordinated party who calls out decisions, plans out party compositions etc. Everything that happens before the burst activation and sometimes before the cross is much more significant when it comes to the 5-10 minutes you spend reaping the benefits.

Literally all I hear about people who think this patch is good is "It was something that I didn't feel like doing so they should take it away from other people." How does that make the game any better? Its just like any other exploit in video games people want removed. "I don't abuse it therefore it shouldn't be in the game so I can feel better about not abusing it." This isn't even a pvp game so why is this sentiment echoed so much?

If you're in the camp that thinks SEGA will make the game better somehow to compensate for this, well I can't say I share your optimism. AQs themselves are free explores copied over, almost as if to stall for time. XQs were an even larger stall for time(And are hardly even worth doing) So there you have it. SEGA basically just nerfed one of the only things worth doing.

The game is now more about luck then it ever was. Soon they will add in HYPER QUESTS. Every month you may roll a 10-sided dice for a chance to get into a 12-man MPA for 30 minutes!

Railkune
Sep 6, 2013, 07:14 PM
Well, some guild mates and myself randomly went into the AQ's and got chains of Cross Bursts over and over. Actually it got annoying after a bit for how long they lasted. Was my first time in an AQ, so needless to say I don't know anything about the various strategies.

Xaelouse
Sep 6, 2013, 09:25 PM
I dont think anyone is really supporting their decision. I dont even like the method they went about "nerfing" it. I do think you guys (and many other players) are spoiled by them. Good thing we can either adapt or hope sega focuses on the real problems with the game.