Super Hard new skills

[Aine]

Shougai (http://www.g-heaven.net/topics/2013/09/130925a.html) posted a summary of the new skills being added in SH.

Hunter
Never Give Up - When Iron Will is activated, a 60-second S-ATK bonus and invincibility for a short time.
Pretty Good - Recover from status effects faster.

Fighter
Half Line Boost - Increase the chance of inflicting status effects when your HP is below 50%.
Chase Advance Plus - Increase damage dealt against enemies suffering from status effects.

Ranger
Weak Hit Blast Bonus - PB gauge builds up faster dealing ranged damage to enemy weak points.
First Hit - Damage bonus against enemies with full health.

Gunner
Zero Range Critical - Critical hit rate bonus when dealing ranged damage to enemies at close range.
Toughness Time - Reduces gear loss when damage is taken during Showtime.

Force
Talis Tech Bonus - Damage increase for techs casted after throwing the talis. Five levels only, the damage bonus is 50% (presumably at level 5).
T-ATK High Up - Increases T-ATK (presumably more than T-ATK Up).

Techer
Super Treatment - When healing status effects on yourself or other players, HP also heals. For a limited time, PP recovery also increases (not sure whether this is natural PP recovery or recovery from attacking).
Territory PP Save- While Territory Burst is active, reduces PP cost of support techs.

Braver
Combat Escape - Invincibility when Katana Combat is activated. Unclear how long it lasts.
Rapid Shoot Up 2 - Increases R-ATK when a Bow is equipped and Rapid Shoot is active.

[Zenobia]

Only thing I liked was Combat Escape but depending on how long it last will do it justice.


EDIT: And Talis Tech Bonus 50% sounds to good to be true another game breaker!?

[UnLucky]

Hunter
Never Give Up - Worthless
Pretty Good - Worthless

Fighter
Half Line Boost - Worthless
Chase Advance Plus - No Stance Up 2?

Ranger
Weak Hit Blast Bonus - Meh
First Hit - AB hits three times, so only the first shot gets boosted? Lame.

Gunner
Zero Range Critical - Worthless
Toughness Time - Worthless

Force
Talis Tech Bonus - WHAT
T-ATK High Up - Probably worthless

Techer
Super Treatment - Worthless
Territory PP Save- But does it Zondeel?

Braver
Combat Escape - Maybe
Rapid Shoot Up 2 - Probably worthless

[Darki]

If those are all the skills, then I guess I got covered my FO skilltree for the remaining 15 skillpoints I gotta use. 10 to flame and bolt masteries and 5 for talis tech bonus, I guess.

For HU, I'm in a pinch. I was planning on maxing both JA bonuses, but this Iron Will one seems cool. We'll have to check how good is it.

[UnLucky]

Wonder if Deband Protection (whenever that comes out) will work for Never Give Up?

[Zenobia]

Holy shit Dagash talis is going up in price LOL.

Talis tech bonus already got em going LOL!?

Went from 400k to 1mill in secs.

[Meji]

More chase advance for fighters? Don't mind if I do~
Just really hoping this one isn't badly placed in the tree, so you can get both without any hassle.

[Kilich]

Iron will and combat escape. So much invincibility.

[SakoHaruo]

Shougai (http://www.g-heaven.net/topics/2013/09/130925a.html) posted a summary of the new skills being added in SH.

Braver
Combat Escape - Invincibility when Katana Combat is activated. Unclear how long it lasts.


Hmm depending on how many points are required to max Combat Escape it might be pretty good for solo ExQ/TAs. And trash for everything else.

[UnLucky]

Holy shit Dagash talis is going up in price LOL.

Talis tech bonus already got em going LOL!?

Went from 400k to 1mill in secs.

I'm so glad I got me a Nornir Book

Commence Black Slaughter

[Rakurai]

I wonder if First Hit might work in a fashion similar to the other situational damage boosters like Standing Snipe in that the damage bonus persists for a moment after the condition is no longer met.

That would allow it to work properly with Additional Bullet and some other multi-hitting PAs.

I'm hoping the bonus is 100% or higher and works with all sources of damage, not just ranged. Namegid and Backhand Smash would be entertaining to use with it.

[Inazuma]

Holy fuck my ass! A Force using Talis is the strongest thing in the game by a mile. Sega has no fucking idea what they are doing.

[GALEFORCE]

I like the idea of first hit. I hope it's a sizable boost though, like 50%. I also wish it was for enemies with over 50% HP instead of full. This means mags could ruin it randomly. In any case, it could be a nice boost to Aiming Shot for clearing bigger mobs.

Lol at another frickin' useless crit skill. Gunner doesn't exactly need a buff anymore, so w/e.

Really disappointed with what bow braver got. Damage bonus skills are boring, but damage bonus skills that only work 20% of the time at best are boring and stupid. Rapid could use a revamp.

[GuardianGirth]

THERE WILL BE TRAP CARDS

[MetalDude]

What the fuck is even most of these skills.

[UnLucky]

Holy fuck my ass! A Force using Talis is the strongest thing in the game by a mile. Sega has no fucking idea what they are doing.

Te/Fo finally not a joke??

Stay tuned for the next episode !!

[Zenobia]

I like the idea of first hit. I hope it's a sizable boost though, like 50%. I also wish it was for enemies with over 50% HP instead of full. This means mags could ruin it randomly. In any case, it could be a nice boost to Aiming Shot for clearing bigger mobs..

Bosses sense aiming shot is single target charge skill and taking out each enemy at a time.

I wouldn't call aiming shot a mob clearing skill.

[Rien]

Hunter gets the shit end of the stick. AGAIN.

[MetalDude]

First Hit is delicious for a lot of Launcher PAs (Rodeo, Cluster, Divine).

[UnLucky]

Bosses sense aiming shot is single target charge skill and taking out each enemy at a time.

I wouldn't call aiming shot a mob clearing skill.

Well for stuff like Krabs and Fordorans. Thrillsplosion would work pretty well for that, too.

[GALEFORCE]

I meant high HP enemies like krabs, fords, kuklos, etc. It would be nice, and potentially broken, if it worked like standing snipe and lasted for all the hits. Even if it didn't, 50% on one of AB's hits is still a good 16% damage boost. Just gotta see how the numbers end up.

[jooozek]

Holy shit Dagash talis is going up in price LOL.

Talis tech bonus already got em going LOL!?

Went from 400k to 1mill in secs.

awesome, good that i didn't excube mine

[Chdata]

that talis boost... ;o...

glad I got my endgame talis to keep forever, especially when it dropped from 4m to 500k.

[Xaelouse]

from the datamine, talis boost will be 1.1 at max. Still not that good
easy bank from the dagash talises though
EDIT: Nevermind, didn't read the last part. 50% really Sega?

[jooozek]

oh, and blue floris also went up, coincdentally i had it drop from goronzoran yesterday when i was doing sanctum aq

[Xaelouse]

Territory Burst PP Save is good for HU/TE though. 20 PP Resta isn't bad.

[SakoHaruo]

Hunter gets the shit end of the stick. AGAIN.

Eventually Hunter wont need a sub, because Hunter will main and sub Hunter :disapprove:

[Zenobia]

Perfect time to make some bank I got 2 Dagash talises hohoho aww yisss.!

[KazukiQZ]

@SakuHaruo...ROFL

Ranger's skill, First Hit eh? SEGA could make it last about 50% or 1/3 of monsters' HP and call it Initial Hit :D

That Talis boost...wow, but I hope this skill is acquirable using the 5 level-ups from the new level cap.

Braver's Combat Escape- This make Katana Combat a must use everytime there's tons of mobs and its off cooldown.

Others look like some sheeety skills to me, or I didn't main that class :3

[Darki]

Damn, I was planning on buying a Liewen Book next week, to make a Nornir Book, or maybe a Gadianna. I bet now their prices skyrocketed.

[TaigaUC]

Looks mostly worthless except the Talis rebalance attempt and maybe Ra/Hu for the "first attack" thing.

[jooozek]

pb blast thing sounds amazing if you plan on support with fishes PB

[Walkure]

Dagash Talis is still hovering around 400k on Ship10, but I already got mine for 132k a while back. 'w'

btw Dagash Talis has Negative Destroyer, 2nd highest TATK for 10*, and it's a fish.

[Rehal]

Inbefore that 50% talis skill being placed at the bottom of ice tree. ~('w'~)

[MetalDude]

pb blast thing sounds amazing if you plan on support with fishes PB

Considering that RA has so little problems obtaining their PB in the first place, I'm really curious as to how quickly AB spam would get it up with this. Infinite loop of Ketos Proi would be pretty sick.

[Emp]

Is zondeel a support tech?

[fay]

Maybe I'm just not getting the full effect of the talis thing, but even with that 50% damage increase, won't they still be weaker than rods?

[ShinMaruku]

Shit like this makes me thirst for PSN more and more. Sega can't balance for shit.

[jooozek]

Maybe I'm just not getting the full effect of the talis thing, but even with that 50% damage increase, won't they still be weaker than rods?

considering that the best aq stones talis has 820 T-ATK it already beats the best aq rods by a mile

[Rexob]

I wonder what the crit % increase is on Zero Range Crit...

[fay]

How is that though? I just double checked tehre. For example I found the dagash talis which has 843 attack. I'm currently using the ameterasu rod which has 1010 attack. That's almost 200 weaker.

[Rexob]

How is that though? I just double checked tehre. For example I found the dagash talis which has 843 attack. I'm currently using the ameterasu rod which has 1010 attack. That's almost 200 weaker.

Damage is calculated by the following:

(A - D) * .2 * M

A: base attack + weapon attack + elemental dmg
D: defense
M: damage modifiers

I'll keep this very simple:

(843-250) * .2 * 1.5 = 178
(1010-250) * .2 * 1.0 = 152

I do not know all of the dmg modifiers Fo / Te have, but if everything is assumed equal, that's the basic difference. Endgame, the majority of dmg % modifiers easily trump static dmg, it's the same reason why Y9K when using its Zero Effort potential out performs other TMGs with noticeably more RATK.

[jcart953]

Whats with all these crappy skills, man I swear fighter always gets some useless crap. Where's the limit break and brave/wise 2 lol. Not looking forward to these new skills at all.

[Xaelouse]

Is zondeel a support tech?

anything that's affected by Territory Burst is also a support tech. So yeah, Zondeel is getting -10PP

[Walkure]

On a 60/60 FO/FI Newearl, 175 TATK mag, soul + TechIII on everything, on a ~300 TDEF mob,
Dagash Talis would have about ~ 1,615 net attack for looking at maximum damage
Divine Staff Ameratsu would have about ~ 1,782 net attack.

So, all other factors being equal, the rod would do about 10.3% more with their maximum damage attacks than a Dagash Talis on the same mob, no potentials being active. With Negative Destroyer L3 in effect, Dagash Talis would do about the same amount of damage.

With a +50% damage mod, the talis would deal 35.9% more damage, all other factors being equal.

[TaigaUC]

Inbefore that 50% talis skill being placed at the bottom of ice tree. ~('w'~)

Hahahaha. You're probably right.

[jooozek]

as if ice branch isn't already overloaded
watch it be separated like sroll skills for gunner

[Walkure]

Watch TATK high up be either after normal advance, or photon flare afterburst.

[gigawuts]

The only good one I see here is Never Give Up, which should've been how Iron Will functioned in the first place, and Super Treatment because rewarding stuff like that is always good. That better be a 1 sp skill, for a full resta pulse. If it's 10 sp for 10% again I'm just going to laugh.

Everything else is meh, poorly balanced, or filler (seriously, we're getting zra critical? now?)

edit: on the bright side I now have full confidence that my skilltree resets can be used now without any conflicts when they add new skills!

[TaigaUC]

The "Super Hard" probably refers to the difficulty the dev team has with brainstorming new gameplay stuff and balancing it.

"Hey, come up with some new talents."
"I know... damage up!"
"We already got that."
"Damage up 2!"
"Brilliant!"



as if ice branch isn't already overloaded
watch it be separated like sroll skills for gunner

Going by how they balance stuff, the bottom of the Ice tree will probably look like this in the future:

Ice Up: Increases damage of Ice by 10%
Ice Cost Down: Reduces cost of Ice spells by 10
Ice Up 2: Increases damage of Ice by 10%
Ice Critical: Increases critical chance of Ice spells by 10%
Ice Up 3: Increases damage of Ice by 10%
Ice Critical 2: Increases critical chance of Ice spells by 10%
Ice Up 4: Increases damage of Ice by 10%


They may as well just make this skill:
Ice Please: Encourages you to use Ice tree. Please! +500% Ice damage.

[otaku998]

Speaking of which, while i know this is not right place, but asking anyway, Super Hard min level require is?

[jooozek]

no one knows, safe bet is 60

[gigawuts]

Slight alteration:

Ice Up: Increases damage of Ice by 10%
Ice Cost Down: Reduces cost of Ice spells by 10%
Ice Up 2: Increases damage of Ice by 10%
Ice Critical: Increases critical chance of Ice spells by 10%
Ice Up 3: Increases damage of Ice by 10%
Ice Critical 2: Increases critical chance of Ice spells by 10%
Ice Up 4: Increases damage of Ice by 10%



They may as well just make this skill:
Ice Please: Encourages you to use Ice tree. Please! +500% Ice damage.

Honestly though? This remark isn't that far off. They're not thinking with a role-based system. Ice isn't unique. I still say the best way to fix Ice is to give it either a duration bonus to allow more pulses to hit or, since that would have rounding issues (this has 4 pulses, that has 3 pulses), an auto-recast chance. Maybe increase chance to 100% with Ice Gear after X ice tech castings? Maybe tie it to Photon Flare? Maybe add Ice Stance?

Whatever the means, the end goal should be ice techs lasting 50%-100% longer. Gibarta hitting for 5-6 pulses, Rabarta hitting for 6-8 pulses, Barta having a second trail, Sabarta having 5-6 icicles, deband naturally having 6-8 pulses (yes, that means 90-120 seconds without extend assist).

And, since Ice was pretty clearly originally meant to be the AOE school of techs, then give it an AOE bonus somewhere. Tied to the pulse bonus? Tied to photon flare? Just a passive skill? I don't particularly care.

If fire is the high PP for high DPS element, and lightning is the low PP but long term DPS element, then make ice the normal PP & long duration defensive element it was intended to be. Blanket an area with a tech, and enemies that walk into it will regret it.

Ice fixed.

[pkemr4]

so... whats the price for fish talis and whats a good alternative to it?

still file checking. god damn it i wanna get to B7 and reserve my spot for Super Dunk Falz elder! >:3

[jooozek]

so... whats the price for fish talis and whats a good alternative to it?

still file checking. god damn it i wanna get to B7 and reserve my spot for Super Dunk Falz elder! >:3

hold off with buying till they implement the skills because they might add some sketchy condition or shove it in some obscure place in the tree

[strikerhunter]

Wow, After the GU JA S roll update the new skills are ****. Really? Crit? We all know crit is pretty much worthless. More Showtime based stuffs? Maybe if showtime does a damage boost instead gear speed up then yea it maybe worth it.

[gigawuts]

ha ha ha wait

you don't mean to tell me you expected another meaningful damage gain on gunner

where's my fury combo up 2 on hunter sega?????

[Rexob]

Wow, After the GU JA S roll update the new skills are ****. Really? Crit? We all know crit is pretty much worthless. More Showtime based stuffs? Maybe if showtime does a damage boost instead gear speed up then yea it maybe worth it.

I'm not thrilled with it, but at the same time interested in seeing what the crit % is...if a GU could achieve 40% crit between that and Fury Critical that would be quite noticeable when using MT or even ER; sure it's kind of garbage for mobs, but most players agree the mobs in the game all die fast enough to not care. GUs have several PAs where the Crit % might actually be decent - IF, ER, MT - there are quite a few attacks in each of those.

[strikerhunter]

ha ha ha wait

you don't mean to tell me you expected another meaningful damage gain on gunner

where's my fury combo up 2 on hunter sega?????

No but at least something useful with a good utility. For gods sake, CT needs some improvements it's duration when tagged is way too short.

[Alma]

Force
Talis Tech Bonus - Damage increase for techs casted after throwing the talis. Five levels only, the damage bonus is 50% (presumably at level 5).

is this real?

i mean really sega?
50% dmg bonus? wtf?

because if its true, then no FO will ever use rod anymore...

[gigawuts]

Hahaha it's great right?

"Guys guys guys, gunner needs some damage on its mechguns. What about 200% damage after rolling?"

"Guys guys guys, talis needs some damage but 200% was way too op, what about just 50% this time?"

[Xaelouse]

is this real?

i mean really sega?
50% dmg bonus? wtf?

because if its true, then no FO will ever use rod anymore...

well at least there will be more forces willing to zondeel I guess.

[Walkure]

So, when they eventually do this or something like this for techer, should we expect 300%, 400%, or 500% damage on wand explosions?

[gigawuts]

No, 50% will be deemed too OP. When they finally get around to address Techer it'll be

Wand Gear Advance
+10% Explosion Crit Rate
10 SP

[Walkure]

I just want one patch where Techer becomes the most OP damage class, even if it gets fixed/patched out again relatively quickly.

Thermonuclear wand explosions seem like the best (and funniest) way to achieve that.

[gigawuts]

I'm still unable to understand why Wand Lovers is so hilariously...meh. You kill all of your PP just to max your gear.

I don't...it's just...

Gear was never hard to keep up in the first place, you know? One quick tech and blam, gear. Why doesn't Wand Lovers do something...better? Where's the gear AOE enlargement? Where's the gear afterblast? Why doesn't it kill PP recharge, instead of setting your PP to 0?

[Walkure]

Having PP just gets in the way of pretty explosions.

[Kondibon]

I'm still unable to understand why Wand Lovers is so hilariously...meh. You kill all of your PP just to max your gear.

I don't...it's just...

Gear was never hard to keep up in the first place, you know? One quick tech and blam, gear. Why doesn't Wand Lovers do something...better? Where's the gear AOE enlargement? Where's the gear afterblast? Why doesn't it kill PP recharge, instead of setting your PP to 0?

The worst thing about it is that you don't even need to level it. It's maintainable without using techs at level 1. >_> Since there doesn't seem to be any difference between having a sliver on your gear and having it maxed I'm not even sure what the point of it was supposed to be unless you're like... playing full support and all your pp was getting spent on that... but... who would do that?


Having PP just gets in the way of pretty explosions.

If I could tip/rep/thumbsup posts that's what I'd be doing right now.

[Z-0]

Man that Talis boost is gonna make some things kinda hard to do, such as foie grazing. . _.

[Zyrusticae]

Hahaha it's great right?

"Guys guys guys, gunner needs some damage on its mechguns. What about 200% damage after rolling?"

"Guys guys guys, talis needs some damage but 200% was way too op, what about just 50% this time?"S-roll up is actually +100%, the Talis bonus would be 150% or +50%.

50% would be a nerf, not a buff. :-P


At any rate, I'm not using it. No Talises for me. Seriously, I hate the damn things. I despise them. The very fact that they have a damage skill that strong (assuming the rumor is accurate) makes me hate them even more.

I'll just put the skill points into Tech JA Advance or something.

[jooozek]

Man that Talis boost is gonna make some things kinda hard to do, such as foie grazing. . _.

that's only if the boost will require throwing the talis, you could always JA from some cheap uncharged tech if you are worried about JAing tho with this boost you won't prolly (lol)
edit: ok, didn't see at first it requires throwing the talis

[Z-0]

The OP (and I just checked Shougai) says that you must throw the Talis to get the boost, so...

[TaigaUC]

Wand Lovers is pretty much their attempt to "fix" Techer, isn't it?
I don't recall it being there on day one.
It's like they're stubborn to admit that the base mechanic of Techer is garbage.

Damage adjustments is the laziest and simplest way to fix balance problems.
If it were me, I would come up with ways to give classes more utility.
For example, gameplay changes such as crowd control, or encourage parties to move to certain locations or use certain strategies, stuff like that. Even more focus on support would be nice.
These kinds of changes would make the game much more interesting and create more incentive to try other classes other than for the sake of effective damage.

But such changes would require a lot more work to test and balance - work that SEGA obviously isn't interested in bothering with.
Either that, or they just don't have the ability to even consider such possibilities.

It's like how more recent fighting games have more generic attacks, velocities, timing, mechanics, etc.
It makes things easier to balance, especially if there are a lot of characters.
PSO2 doesn't even have many classes, and they still can't be bothered.

Just so I'm being clear here, I'm not whining.
I'm just disappointed. And appalled. Or disgusted.

[gigawuts]

S-roll up is actually +100%, the Talis bonus would be 150% or +50%.

50% would be a nerf, not a buff. :-P

Ha ha, good point there.


At any rate, I'm not using it. No Talises for me. Seriously, I hate the damn things. I despise them. The very fact that they have a damage skill that strong (assuming the rumor is accurate) makes me hate them even more.

I'll just put the skill points into Tech JA Advance or something.

Yeah, it's thoroughly bad design. It's just going to shift force into being throw talis -> cast techs until bonus wears off (what do we think, 3 normal techs or 5-6 fire techs?) -> throw talis -> cast techs until bonus wears off

It's pretty much the same as gunner, which went from spam ER to roll, THEN use ER.

edit: And just calling it now: You'll be able to throw the talis at the ground, making it reset into your hand, and still get the bonus. It'll be rod, except you have to aim down first

[Zyrusticae]

I can only hope it's buried deep in the ice tree or something. Then I'd have a very good excuse for not bothering with it whatsoever.

[gigawuts]

I'm sure it will be. I bet the intent is for rabarta proxy casting.

Instead of making ice unique they're going to throw BIG NUMBERS at it because that's all they know how to fucking do.

[Rehal]

Yeah, it's thoroughly bad design. It's just going to shift force into being throw talis -> cast techs until bonus wears off (what do we think, 3 normal techs or 5-6 fire techs?) -> throw talis -> cast techs until bonus wears off

It's pretty much the same as gunner, which went from spam ER to roll, THEN use ER.

Throw talis -> cast tech -> throw talis -> cast tech -> ... would be more similar to gunner.

[gigawuts]

Throw talis -> cast tech -> throw talis -> cast tech -> ... would be more similar to gunner.

The conditional OP damage bonus is similar, not the exact fucking button combination.

[~Aya~]

Well now.. I am going to love this update.. /hugs my Motav Prophecy~

[Rexob]

The conditional OP damage bonus is similar, not the exact fucking button combination.

No where did Rehal use the word "exact" or even mention the button combination...

[Z-0]

On second thoughts, you're still going to need a rod.

Go use Nafoie from a Talis and you'll see what I mean.

[gigawuts]

No where did Rehal use the word "exact" or even mention the button combination...

I was wondering if someone would actually try to nitpick that, too.

Y'all are too fucking nitpicky and literal. This is why threads devolve into semantic bickering instead of anything even remotely approaching meaningful discussion.

[TaigaUC]

I wish Talis controls were more intuitive.
I've said this before, but it's like they are afraid to deviate from classic PSO basic controls or something.

We need more fun stuff, like... imagine if you could switch perspective to the Talis, then fly around as the Talis and blow stuff up.
Maybe even have specific Techs for doing such, like raining fire down on enemies or something. So many possibilities.


Y'all are too fucking nitpicky and literal. This is why threads devolve into semantic bickering instead of anything even remotely approaching meaningful discussion.

It's because everyone's lives are so meaningless that they trove through forums, looking for people to put down, so they can make themselves feel special.
Even I go around telling people off, but only because misinformation and lies frustrates me.
I don't mind if people correct me if I'm factually incorrect. Most others just want to be correct no matter what.
I'd like people to be more open-minded and consider perspectives other than their own.

I used to be really anal about grammar and spelling, but there isn't much of a point when most people can't seem to read.
When I say that, I'm not just going by what I've seen all over the net, but also every educational institute I've ever studied at.
For the record, I never use spell checks anywhere.

[Rexob]

I was wondering if someone would actually try to nitpick that, too.

Y'all are too fucking nitpicky and literal. This is why threads devolve into semantic bickering instead of anything even remotely approaching meaningful discussion.

Some of us have an appreciation for the English language, and clearly you do not have a problem with the English vocabulary. Furthermore, your post was quite rude implying Rehal said something he/she did not where you felt it necessary to use an explicit four letter word. Cursing at other forum members is far from the "remotely meaningful discussions" you mention.

[Rehal]

I was wondering if someone would actually try to nitpick that, too.

Y'all are too fucking nitpicky and literal. This is why threads devolve into semantic bickering instead of anything even remotely approaching meaningful discussion.

Oh wow sorry I didn't know you are PSOW's fuck-bomber, sorry sorry my bad.

[gigawuts]

Some of us have an appreciation for the English language, and clearly you do not have a problem with the English vocabulary. Furthermore, your post was quite rude implying Rehal said something he/she did not where you felt it necessary to use an explicit four letter word.

If it wasn't your intent to suggest that using sroll -> PA doesn't use the same pattern of button presses as throwing a talis and then casting does, by which I mean pressing one button and then another button, you sure had me fooled.

But yes I can be a dick. Sorry.

edit:

Oh wow sorry I didn't know you are PSOW's fuck-bomber, sorry sorry my bad.

Wow, two people offended that I said "fuck?" Is this really the internet? Did I sign into an alternate universe this morning?

[jooozek]

what are you expecting on this my little pony TM (C)(R) board? :argh:

[Rexob]

If it wasn't your intent to suggest that using sroll -> PA doesn't use the same pattern of button presses as throwing a talis and then casting does, by which I mean pressing one button and then another button, you sure had me fooled.

But yes I can be a dick. Sorry.

edit:


Wow, two people offended that I said "fuck?" Is this really the internet? Did I sign into an alternate universe this morning?

For someone talking about "meaningful discussions", using that kind of language is far from constructive. I don't mind dicks on the internet, it's what the internet is for and part of life, anyone trolling the forums enough knows it comes with the territory :D

[qoxolg]

I just want one patch where Techer becomes the most OP damage class, even if it gets fixed/patched out again relatively quickly.

Thermonuclear wand explosions seem like the best (and funniest) way to achieve that.

Sadly enough this is what I am expecting SEGA to do eventually, especially since the wand explosions are strong enough already imo. TE/HU typically needs one or two wand hits to kill a large group of AQ enemies.

What Techer lacks is some skills to kill bosses or powerful enemies. Maybe a skill that depletes the whole gear bar for one of those Thermonuclear wand explosions (including mushroom cloud of course) would help.

Also in terms of mobility wands should have step instead of mirage.

[Cyclon]

You need more love in your lives ladies and gentlemen.

This also happens to be an incredibly poor selection of skills for anybody who can't create lightning bolts.

[Rehal]

Wow, two people offended that I said "fuck?" Is this really the internet? Did I sign into an alternate universe this morning?
Well not everyone come from the same country as you, different culture and first language lead to different way of how they interpret that word. Or unless PSOW have a rule that ban "foreigner" that I haven't aware of.

Kinda derailed the thread so I'll leave after this post, good day to you. =/

[Krimson]

Gunner: . _ .
Hunter: D:
Ranger: o:
Fighter: Why??
Braver: Yus!
other classes skipped
Sega: trololol

[Walkure]

I don't think enough people appreciated the Dagash Talis before this new revelation.

I mean, come on.

Not only is it a fish, but it is a fish you can throw at people, and then use as a conduit for techniques. Can you even get more awesome than that? You throw a fish, and rain horrible death upon your enemies, with a fish.

The best part? It's fucking PURPLE. Which is the best color. Proven facts, right here.

[Coatl]

The best part? It's fucking PURPLE. Which is the best color. Proven facts, right here.

Amen.

[Kondibon]

Wow, two people offended that I said "fuck?" Is this really the internet? Did I sign into an alternate universe this morning?

Excessive swearing tends to cut into one's credibility, as no matter how good an argument one makes it just comes off as immature. I see so many people getting into arguments here not because of nitpicking, but because of people who seem to think it's ok to act like that just because they find their point credible. They're called expletives for a reason, they aren't needed to communicate a point. Using them too much causes them to lose their meaning and thus look silly.


On topic: I want to use Never Give up in a tank build... I know no one cares about it but it would be amazing to just never die at all ever.

Talis Tech bonus sounds stupid. It should have been something other than damage. No one would USE it but just slapping more damage onto Talii doesn't really do much to actually make them better.

Super Treatment sounds like it would be good if it worked even when you don't heal status effects but I don't see that happening.

Territory PP save is the bees knees.

Combat Escape would be useful what with how much I grazed durring during katana combat. >_>

Everything else is meh.

[gigawuts]

They're not needed, they're fun. I'm used to forums where that's ordinary and having tougher skin is kind of required to get by, so that'll happen from time to time :-?

[Kondibon]

They're not needed, they're fun. I'm used to forums where that's ordinary and having tougher skin is kind of required to get by, so that'll happen from time to time :-?

It's got less to do with having tougher skin, and more to do with sounding credible and mature, but I personally hold nothing against you for it. It's just an easy way to get people go "He curses more than he needs to, he must be an angry pubbie, therefore his argument is invalid". I just thought I'd let you know what was happening. D:

[gigawuts]

Oh yeah, I know all about that. It's an easy way to see if someone is just looking to argue, actually. If they jump on it as being out of line to say "fuck" even one time, and then get hyper defensive over that instead of even acknowledging the rest of the post it tends to indicate they haven't got much else to work with.

It's an easy out, and I do like to give people easy outs.

[Rexob]

Oh yeah, I know all about that. It's an easy way to see if someone is just looking to argue, actually. If they jump on it as being out of line to say "fuck" even one time, and then get hyper defensive over that instead of even acknowledging the rest of the post it tends to indicate they haven't got much else to work with.

It's an easy out, and I do like to give people easy outs.

Curse all you like, but you jumped all over Rehal for something he/she never said, and for someone advocating constructive discussions, that kind of language detracts from that.

[Railkune]

About those new skills though.

[Rexob]

About those new skills though.

Fair enough, Talis boost is about the only one that seems pretty nice, the others are okay, some are borderline worthless. At least we'll get skill reset tickets :D

[Dextro]

Calling it now, there'll be absolutely no way to get both Tech Charge Adv. skills, the Talis Boost skill and max out an element mastery, even with Ice.

[gigawuts]

Calling it now, there'll be absolutely no way to get both Tech Charge Adv. skills, the Talis Boost skill and max out an element mastery, even with Ice.

Probably not.

I'll be surprised if they don't try to distance ice even further from PP revival, probably by doing something like +500% PP recovered from talis normals below this new talis skill.

Watch the new go-to build be talis with rabarta and nabarta.

edit:
Curse all you like, but you jumped all over Rehal for something he/she never said, and for someone advocating constructive discussions, that kind of language detracts from that.
They did though, so there's that. Now, I've tried to drop this already, I even apologized. Kindly fuckin' stop it.

[Rexob]

Probably not.

I'll be surprised if they don't try to distance ice even further from PP revival, probably by doing something like +500% PP recovered from talis normals below this new talis skill.

Watch the new go-to build be talis with rabarta and nabarta.

edit:
They did though, so there's that. Now, I've tried to drop this already, I even apologized. Kindly fuckin' stop it.

I'll leave this be, but you obviously already knew by adding the word you did is almost begging a reply.

[Cyclon]

About those new skills though.
A'ight.

Hunter
[SPOILER-BOX]Never Give Up - When Iron Will is activated, a 60-second S-ATK bonus and invincibility for a short time.
Never been a fan of Iron Will, and seeing how point-starving the hunter tree is, I doubt people will use it for efficiency unless it's completely broken for some reason. But it's not bad otherwise.

Pretty Good - Recover from status effects faster.
Unless it's an one pointer, worthless for the most part. Status effects are not that much of an issue right now.
[/SPOILER-BOX]
Fighter
[SPOILER-BOX]Half Line Boost - Increase the chance of inflicting status effects when your HP is below 50%.
Chase Advance Plus - Increase damage dealt against enemies suffering from status effects.
These two depend on the numbers. I say why not if they don't suck.[/SPOILER-BOX]
Ranger
[SPOILER-BOX]Weak Hit Blast Bonus - PB gauge builds up faster dealing ranged damage to enemy weak points.
Good. Would be nice if it affected something else than r-damage though.

First Hit - Damage bonus against enemies with full health.
Depends on the specifics(like does it affect every hit of the attack or just the first one like somebody said). One of the only one that would actually be relevant to the actual game's meta even without absurd numbers attached to it. Plus I don't see ranged damage, which is good.[/SPOILER-BOX]
Gunner
[SPOILER-BOX]Zero Range Critical - Critical hit rate bonus when dealing ranged damage to enemies at close range.
No comment.

Toughness Time - Reduces gear loss when damage is taken during Showtime.
Eh, good for the three tankgunners out there I guess.[/SPOILER-BOX]
Force
[SPOILER-BOX]Talis Tech Bonus - Damage increase for techs casted after throwing the talis. Five levels only, the damage bonus is 50% (presumably at level 5).Absurd, though I'd sure like to know why we get the numbers on this one and no other. But Talises are underused so why not.
Would have prefered to see it on Techer though.

T-ATK High Up - Increases T-ATK (presumably more than T-ATK Up).
Very highly dependent on placement, especially with ice tree out there.[/SPOILER-BOX]
Techer
[SPOILER-BOX]Super Treatment - When healing status effects on yourself or other players, HP also heals. For a limited time, PP recovery also increases (not sure whether this is natural PP recovery or recovery from attacking).
Like I said above, status effects are mostly irrelevant. If it's neither a one pointer or overpowered, forget about it.

Territory PP Save- While Territory Burst is active, reduces PP cost of support techs.
Well, please DON'T let it affect Zondeel. Like this tech needs any kind of buff whatsoever. Of course if it doesn't affect Zondeel, it's mostly worthless.[/SPOILER-BOX]
Braver
[SPOILER-BOX]Combat Escape - Invincibility when Katana Combat is activated. Unclear how long it lasts.
Why not...? But katana braver needed something better.

Rapid Shoot Up 2 - Increases R-ATK when a Bow is equipped and Rapid Shoot is active.
Cool I guess.[/SPOILER-BOX]

My main problem with most of these is that unless they're unexpectedly solid number wise, they're completely irrelevant to the way people play the game right now.
On second thought though, if they're strong enough they could very well change a lot of things, but I don't see that happening.

Also somebody suggested a while ago that we should get a way to put status effects on ourselves, and I now full heartedly agree with this. Give us a buyable item or something. Would make quite a few talents way more interesting.

And yes UnLucky, somebody's your new name. Like it?

[ShinMaruku]

You want this game to have sensible skills? Tell sega to outsource it.
You guys been watching sonic team for over 10 years, their time is done either they outsource the game or sack the team working on it and gather a new team. Sega unlike Capcom and other actually does good outsourcing.

[Emp]

A'ight.

Hunter
[SPOILER-BOX]Never Give Up - When Iron Will is activated, a 60-second S-ATK bonus and invincibility for a short time.
Never been a fan of Iron Will, and seeing how point-starving the hunter tree is, I doubt people will use it for efficiency unless it's completely broken for some reason. But it's not bad otherwise.

Pretty Good - Recover from status effects faster.
Unless it's an one pointer, worthless for the most part. Status effects are not that much of an issue right now.
[/SPOILER-BOX]
Fighter
[SPOILER-BOX]Half Line Boost - Increase the chance of inflicting status effects when your HP is below 50%.
Chase Advance Plus - Increase damage dealt against enemies suffering from status effects.
These two depend on the numbers. I say why not if they don't suck.[/SPOILER-BOX]
Ranger
[SPOILER-BOX]Weak Hit Blast Bonus - PB gauge builds up faster dealing ranged damage to enemy weak points.
Good. Would be nice if it affected something else than r-damage though.

First Hit - Damage bonus against enemies with full health.
Depends on the specifics(like does it affect every hit of the attack or just the first one like somebody said). One of the only one that would actually be relevant to the actual game's meta even without absurd numbers attached to it. Plus I don't see ranged damage, which is good.[/SPOILER-BOX]
Gunner
[SPOILER-BOX]Zero Range Critical - Critical hit rate bonus when dealing ranged damage to enemies at close range.
No comment.

Toughness Time - Reduces gear loss when damage is taken during Showtime.
Eh, good for the three tankgunners out there I guess.[/SPOILER-BOX]
Force
[SPOILER-BOX]Talis Tech Bonus - Damage increase for techs casted after throwing the talis. Five levels only, the damage bonus is 50% (presumably at level 5).Absurd, though I'd sure like to know why we get the numbers on this one and no other. But Talises are underused so why not.
Would have prefered to see it on Techer though.

T-ATK High Up - Increases T-ATK (presumably more than T-ATK Up).
Very highly dependent on placement, especially with ice tree out there.[/SPOILER-BOX]
Techer
[SPOILER-BOX]Super Treatment - When healing status effects on yourself or other players, HP also heals. For a limited time, PP recovery also increases (not sure whether this is natural PP recovery or recovery from attacking).
Like I said above, status effects are mostly irrelevant. If it's neither a one pointer or overpowered, forget about it.

Territory PP Save- While Territory Burst is active, reduces PP cost of support techs.
Well, please DON'T let it affect Zondeel. Like this tech needs any kind of buff whatsoever. Of course if it doesn't affect Zondeel, it's mostly worthless.[/SPOILER-BOX]
Braver
[SPOILER-BOX]Combat Escape - Invincibility when Katana Combat is activated. Unclear how long it lasts.
Why not...? But katana braver needed something better.

Rapid Shoot Up 2 - Increases R-ATK when a Bow is equipped and Rapid Shoot is active.
Cool I guess.[/SPOILER-BOX]

My main problem with most of these is that unless they're unexpectedly solid number wise, they're completely irrelevant to the way people play the game right now.
On second thought though, if they're strong enough they could very well change a lot of things, but I don't see that happening.

Also somebody suggested a while ago that we should get a way to put status effects on ourselves, and I now full heartedly agree with this. Give us a buyable item or something. Would make quite a few talents way more interesting.

And yes UnLucky, somebody's your new name. Like it?

I dont see why u hv a problem if it affects Zondeel. Technically, it only a buff if it increases dmg but in this case, it reduces pp cost for the cast.

[Xaelouse]

depending on its duration, combat escape could be one of the most useful things in the game, but we all know it won't have 20 sec invincibility for the sake of BALANCE
EDIT: Hell, even a 10 sec duration would be good since that's ample enough time to get the 30 hits in without any interruptions, since the most annoying thing to do in combat is really dodging and blocking

[GALEFORCE]

Tbh, I don't see a problem with the talis boost. Talis is more situational than rod, so it should be a bit stronger (as long as you can't just toss it into the ground first). It also gives fo/te a much needed boost over the other fo combinations, since their zondeel is better.

Territory PP save isn't too big a deal. Fo/Te is really starved for PP as it is. I doubt many will fully invest in it. It'll be a nice skill for the techer hybrids. That said, what techer hybrids are really missing is damage. Techer could really use a ~20% melee/range damage bonus somewhere... or just make shifta not worthless.

[ShinMaruku]

I await the day I find them do something intelligent with the skills. Because in using skill trees they changed the balance of the game and made classes less interesting.

[Zorafim]

Welp. Looks like I'll be less point starved come superhard.


Watch the new go-to build be talis with rabarta and nabarta.

Yes please.

[Cyclon]

You want this game to have sensible skills? Tell sega to outsource it.
You guys been watching sonic team for over 10 years, their time is done either they outsource the game or sack the team working on it and gather a new team. Sega unlike Capcom and other actually does good outsourcing.Wasn't this game not made by Sonic team?

I dont see why u hv a problem if it affects Zondeel. Technically, it only a buff if it increases dmg but in this case, it reduces pp cost for the cast.In my mind a buff is anything that improves the target in a way or another, so a reduced PP cost qualifies as a buff. Plus, one of Zondeel's only shortcomings is its cost.

[strikerhunter]

Wasn't this game not made by Sonic team?


PSO2 is Fully by Sega whereas the others.................well you know already.

[jcart953]

A'ight.

Hunter
[SPOILER-BOX]Never Give Up - When Iron Will is activated, a 60-second S-ATK bonus and invincibility for a short time.
Never been a fan of Iron Will, and seeing how point-starving the hunter tree is, I doubt people will use it for efficiency unless it's completely broken for some reason. But it's not bad otherwise.

Pretty Good - Recover from status effects faster.
Unless it's an one pointer, worthless for the most part. Status effects are not that much of an issue right now.
[/SPOILER-BOX]
Fighter
[SPOILER-BOX]Half Line Boost - Increase the chance of inflicting status effects when your HP is below 50%.
Chase Advance Plus - Increase damage dealt against enemies suffering from status effects.
These two depend on the numbers. I say why not if they don't suck.[/SPOILER-BOX]
Ranger
[SPOILER-BOX]Weak Hit Blast Bonus - PB gauge builds up faster dealing ranged damage to enemy weak points.
Good. Would be nice if it affected something else than r-damage though.

First Hit - Damage bonus against enemies with full health.
Depends on the specifics(like does it affect every hit of the attack or just the first one like somebody said). One of the only one that would actually be relevant to the actual game's meta even without absurd numbers attached to it. Plus I don't see ranged damage, which is good.[/SPOILER-BOX]
Gunner
[SPOILER-BOX]Zero Range Critical - Critical hit rate bonus when dealing ranged damage to enemies at close range.
No comment.

Toughness Time - Reduces gear loss when damage is taken during Showtime.
Eh, good for the three tankgunners out there I guess.[/SPOILER-BOX]
Force
[SPOILER-BOX]Talis Tech Bonus - Damage increase for techs casted after throwing the talis. Five levels only, the damage bonus is 50% (presumably at level 5).Absurd, though I'd sure like to know why we get the numbers on this one and no other. But Talises are underused so why not.
Would have prefered to see it on Techer though.

T-ATK High Up - Increases T-ATK (presumably more than T-ATK Up).
Very highly dependent on placement, especially with ice tree out there.[/SPOILER-BOX]
Techer
[SPOILER-BOX]Super Treatment - When healing status effects on yourself or other players, HP also heals. For a limited time, PP recovery also increases (not sure whether this is natural PP recovery or recovery from attacking).
Like I said above, status effects are mostly irrelevant. If it's neither a one pointer or overpowered, forget about it.

Territory PP Save- While Territory Burst is active, reduces PP cost of support techs.
Well, please DON'T let it affect Zondeel. Like this tech needs any kind of buff whatsoever. Of course if it doesn't affect Zondeel, it's mostly worthless.[/SPOILER-BOX]
Braver
[SPOILER-BOX]Combat Escape - Invincibility when Katana Combat is activated. Unclear how long it lasts.
Why not...? But katana braver needed something better.

Rapid Shoot Up 2 - Increases R-ATK when a Bow is equipped and Rapid Shoot is active.
Cool I guess.[/SPOILER-BOX]

My main problem with most of these is that unless they're unexpectedly solid number wise, they're completely irrelevant to the way people play the game right now.
On second thought though, if they're strong enough they could very well change a lot of things, but I don't see that happening.

Also somebody suggested a while ago that we should get a way to put status effects on ourselves, and I now full heartedly agree with this. Give us a buyable item or something. Would make quite a few talents way more interesting.

And yes UnLucky, somebody's your new name. Like it?

lol not sure why you use spoiler boxes since this information is in first post.

Anyway as far as the techer pp save skill if i remember correctly from the datamine skills it was a 10 pointer with 1 pp reduction per sp with a maximum of 10PP . Depending on the placement its kind of meh.

[Valimer]

Wow, they REALLY want people to start using talis...

I really wish they would add an active ability on the Hunter skill tree for a gap closer. I think that would make them more competitive against the ranged classes.

[gigawuts]

Wow, they REALLY want people to start using talis...

I really wish they would add an active ability on the Hunter skill tree for a gap closer. I think that would make them more competitive against the ranged classes.

Step -> PA button should use level 2 charge guilty break, but without as much damage

do the same to all other weapons with things like straight charge, grapple charge, etc. Just modify them all for better ranges on some, faster animations on others, etc.

[~Aya~]

Talis zondeel spam feels SO goooood~

Nafoie took a little bit to get used to.. but you just have to think a little before you use it.

[strikerhunter]

I hope so, haha.

Anyway, like what others said, inb4 SEGA puts the Talis boost skill into the already cluttered ice tree. :-?

We will. Every time there is a class update/change they normally give them out.

[ShinMaruku]

Wasn't this game not made by Sonic team?


Given the reorganizing they did a few years ago this is Sonic Team working on the game. They are basically Sega's only development studio that get work.

[UnLucky]

Gigawuts:
The new Talis Bonus would introduce similar gameplay as was observed previously when Gunner had received SRoll JA, namely players would perform an otherwise irregular action to preface very much the same repertoire they have relied upon since the dawn of time.

Rehal:
However, I must point out that Gunner is required to perform that cumbersome action interspaced between each and every originally intended effect, which while this does draw parallels to the proposed Force habituation, the Talis user only suffers the forced conditional activation once before the normal pattern may continue.

Gigawuts:
My original point was more focused on a single instance of the respective class skills that both force an undesired preface on one's regular habits, in which it is plain to see they are quite similar. Furthermore, with the additional account for the varying measure of the benefits for said conditional prerequisite motions, Talis Bonus, being relatively less potent, would in fact only closer resemble the outcome of SRoll JA over extended periods when being interspersed evenly is not a shared property of the two skills in question. You stupid fucking bitch, Jesus Christ, I can't believe how fucking dumb you are.

[gigawuts]

Gigawuts:
The new Talis Bonus would introduce similar gameplay as was observed previously when Gunner had received SRoll JA, namely players would perform an otherwise irregular action to preface very much the same repertoire they have relied upon since the dawn of time.

Rehal:
However, I must point out that Gunner is required to perform that cumbersome action interspaced between each and every originally intended effect, which while this does draw parallels to the proposed Force habituation, the Talis user only suffers the forced conditional activation once before the normal pattern may continue.

Gigawuts:
My original point was more focused on a single instance of the respective class skills that both force an undesired preface on one's regular habits, in which it is plain to see they are quite similar. Furthermore, with the additional account for the varying measure of the benefits for said conditional prerequisite motions, Talis Bonus, being relatively less potent, would in fact only closer resemble the outcome of SRoll JA over extended periods when being interspersed evenly is not a shared property of the two skills in question. You stupid fucking bitch, Jesus Christ, I can't believe how fucking dumb you are.

You understand me <3

[Aeris]

Just recently uploaded on the PSO2 uploader, seems its on top of the lightning tree so its a easy to get skill apparently:

[SPOILER-BOX]http://www.pso2-uploader.info/uploda/src/up71309.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]

[Walkure]

So, with the PSE burst changes, RA/HU being RA/HU, GU getting huge Sroll buffs, and free talis hyperbuff, when can we say "melee sux" again?

[UnLucky]

You understand me <3
I come here mainly for the drama community, don't let anything convince you otherwise.

Just recently uploaded on the PSO2 uploader, seems its on top of the lightning tree so its a easy to get skill apparently:
Wow, and it only requires 1 SP in T-Atk Up. It is literally the first (actual) skill any Force will ever learn.

And yes UnLucky, somebody's your new name. Like it?
I thought it was giga who proposed that mechanic.

[Walkure]

Clearly would have been too overpowered at level 2.

[Z-0]

Jesus Christ, and I thought 2ch were bullshitting when they said you could max it at level 6.

Overpowered, much?

[The Walrus]

It's ok, Force needed that buff

[Shadowth117]

Jesus Christ, and I thought 2ch were bullshitting when they said you could max it at level 6.

Overpowered, much?

It may just be because of the distortion, but is it really level 6? It looks like a 5 to me. And 5 would make more sense since we haven't had a skill cap at 6 yet and the level cap will be 5 above what we have now.

[EvilMag]

R.I.P Rods.

[The Walrus]

It may just be because of the distortion, but is it really level 6? It looks like a 5 to me. And 5 would make more sense since we haven't had a skill cap at 6 yet and the level cap will be 5 above what we have now.


He's saying that because of the Prereq

[Z-0]

Character level, not skill level.

[Xaelouse]

R.I.P Rods.

...is there an option to convert love phoenix into a 忌藤袴

[Shadowth117]

Oh I see. Yeah, I didn't think of it that way, that is pretty dumb.

I wouldn't worry by the way Xaelouse. With the way 10*s are now, with the highest tier ones rivaling and generally beating the XQ 11*'s overall, I'd see Super Hard shit destroying whatever we have now. I'd wager XQ 11* trade ins will be bottom of the barrel, or low-mid tier. Which is pretty sad thinking about it. Although the shuriken talis does look cool...

[Gardios]

Never Give Up - Meh.
Pretty Good - Why can't they buff Guard Stance <status> instead...

Super Treatment - Kind of cool if status effects were more prevalent. Please please please let the PP recovery thing be activated by using Anti instead of curing status effects.
Territory PP Save - Eh. I don't really have PP problems, so I dunno... Zondeel will be ridiculous on FO/TE though.

Combat Escape - I don't think that's what katana needed, but still cool.
Rapid Shoot Up 2 - Okay, I guess.


Can they just nuke the skill trees already. :(

[otaku998]

Combat Escape - For a class that is named "Braver" , this skill name is full of irony. Other than that, if the duration is good enough i think i can dig it.

[Cyclon]

I thought it was giga who proposed that mechanic.
Well, screw me then.

So I guess the dawn of talises has come? Have fun re-learning how to play, forces.

[Zenobia]

Combat Escape - For a class that is named "Braver" , this skill name is full of irony. Other than that, if the duration is good enough i think i can dig it.

Watch it be the same length as a maxed out KC.

[Walkure]

So I guess the dawn of talises has come? Have fun re-learning how to play, forces.New dawn of haphazardly chucking talises before casting zonde repeatedly.

[UnLucky]

The Rafoie Renaissance

or

Namegid: Destroyer of Worlds

[Darki]

Unless I get an awesome rod before this happens, I think I'm going to drop my rod then. I kinda like using rods, but since I got the tech sword, I don't really need another mediocre tech weapon if Talis is going to be the new cookie cutter. More space to my palette, I guess. Now, to save money for dat Gadianna.

By the way, is that "The Tarot" talis very very rare, or not implemented yet or acount-bound or something like that? I've been checking the shops to see if I could get me one, since then all my weps would be class free and I'd be able to switch between main and sub without trouble, but surprisingly I've never seen one for sale.

[cheapgunner]

The Tarot drops form rare Zoran Goraal at lv 51+ and it is super rare, not to mention it has temptation so I'm not surprised none are in shops atm.

[UnLucky]

Oh, the crappier all-class one that drops from a crappy "boss" no one farms?

How much does the Green Duel Gaze run for? They both require fairly high Dex, so you might not be able to switch as freely as you'd like.

[Darki]

Oh, the crappier all-class one that drops from a crappy "boss" no one farms?

You're always so encouraging. <_<


How much does the Green Duel Gaze run for? They both require fairly high Dex, so you might not be able to switch as freely as you'd like.

I'm not too concerned about it being free class since I mainly go as FO/HU and the other two weapons are already, so if I can't get the Tarot I'd rather go with a Gadianna if I can get my hands on it.

It's just that it matches my other two weapons' colors. <_< I'd rather not use a Duel Gaze, they're fugly.

[otaku998]

Watch it be the same length as a maxed out KC.

LOL, so OP, i can live with 50 element Agito for a while then.

Yea..If only. And still waiting to see where they put it.

[Zenobia]

LOL, so OP, i can live with 50 element Agito for a while then.

Yea..If only. And still waiting to see where they put it.

I think it will be somewhere around KC pretty much or separate God forbid they put it somewhere on the left side where the bow stuff is.

[Rien]

Hunter
Never Give Up - When Iron Will is activated, a 60-second S-ATK bonus and invincibility for a short time.
Pretty Good - Recover from status effects faster.

http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20130109002729/planetraeth/images/thumb/1/1e/Angry-desk-flip-l.png/531px-Angry-desk-flip-l.png
Fuck this, I give up on hunter.

[Meji]

[SPOILER-BOX]http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20130109002729/planetraeth/images/thumb/1/1e/Angry-desk-flip-l.png/531px-Angry-desk-flip-l.png[/SPOILER-BOX]
Fuck this, I give up on hunter.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=txWWi2n76FI"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=txWWi2n76FI

[Atmius]

Fuck this, I give up on hunter.

Think on the upside: Now you can get a pure fury tree and STILL have enough points for at least one gear and or step attack. Makes hunter sub even better than before.

[Rien]

I'm pretty sure the level cap is only +5

[otaku998]

Is there new SP quest?

[Zenobia]

Man do they even do those anymore?


EDIT: I just wanted to point this out how duh fuck is sega gonna give us a skill that makes you recover from status effects faster on Hunter.

Where as FI's skill that gives you faster pp regen when you're under a status effect sega wtf are you doing!?

[otaku998]

Pretty Good is skill for tanking build on HU, while the Fi skill is likely for total offensive build with your life at risk. I doubt those two will actually collide given that both are for opposite build.

Unless you go total offensive on Fi and sub a tanking build Hu.

/imo anyway

[gigawuts]

Think on the upside: Now you can get a pure fury tree and STILL have enough points for at least one gear and or step attack. Makes hunter sub even better than before.

Yes, this is the big point here.

Hunter's tree is already crazy OP, and in dire need of a nerf. If they added another 10 sp damage skill it would be literally impossible to fill out all the non-crit damage skills. Even now you can't fill out all the non-atk damage skills - you run out after all the multipliers with 5 sp in fury crit.

They really need to remove 2 or so of the damage skills and condense them into other skills, then limit them somehow so they're not quite as god tier. Seeing hunter be 2x damage at all times and fighter or braver be ~1.5x damage when you're on the right side or only when you're hitting weak points is just... :disapprove:

So yeah. I'm glad they're not adding more damage for hunter. They should honestly nerf hunter's skilltree by ~40% and boost melee weapons by an appropriate amount to compensate.

Guns can get fucked :???:

[RadiantLegend]

Hey hey, leave hunter as is. I can finally get pure fury tree and sword gear with FI main.

[gigawuts]

Hey hey, leave hunter as is. I can finally get pure fury tree and sword gear with FI main.

Now imagine if you could get pure fury tree, all gears, just guard, 2 points in step advance, and a tank skill of your choice with FI main.

Because that's what I'm talking about making possible.

[RadiantLegend]

But this is SEGAC, they just make stuff up as they go and unless a lot of people REALLY complain nothing gets fixed. (Off topic but hey, we CAST finally get parts, its like we didnt exist for a while)

[gigawuts]

True, but I have a feeling the JPs aren't exactly happy that this is Hunter Subclass: The Game either.

[Rien]

Erm, Tank skill?

The strongest Tank Skill Hunter has is Just Guard and iron will/automate halfline

[Walkure]

Speaking of Hunter, and delaying attacks for a benefit:

TMGs:
For rolling between attacks, you get a massive damage benefit.

Talis (now):
For throwing your card (the point of talis), you get a massive damage bonus.

Partizan:
For twirling your weapon, you get... bonus range on your next PA.

[gigawuts]

To this day I cannot understand why you don't get a gear bar for just guarding with partisans.

[Rien]

Partizan:
For twirling your weapon, you get... bonus range on your next PA.

http://img845.imageshack.us/img845/1593/6p3.gif

[RadiantLegend]

Do you think chase adv 2 will branch off chase adv or from chase bind? I'd hate to waste SP going through chase bind.

[Terrence]

Pretty nice information and discussions we have here... Since many people already have given their opinions about those news Skills, here I go !

Never Give Up - Boost better be good since it's necessary to die in order to get the bonus. Pretty Good - Useless. Sol Atomizers will be used anyway. Half Line Boost - Rather good but it will be place in the right side of the tree with no doubt and it's sad. Chase Advance Plus - Seems pretty good. More conditional power.

Weak Hit Blast Bonus - Seems a good thing with an already fast charging Ketos Proi to stress the support role of RAnger. First Hit - Strange idea. Wait and see. Zero Range Critical - Critical LOL ?! Toughness Time - I didn't know there were Showtime users...

Talis Tech Bonus - Boost of naked power (great) or overall power (overpowered) ? T-ATK High Up - Finally a skill giving more than 50 T-ATK for 10 SP. Super Treatment - Sounds cool but let's wait to see the amount of HP/PP. Territory PP Save - If only support Techs were better, this skill would rule.

Combat Escape - As said earlier, if that skill as the same active time as Katana Combat, it will be a wonderful addition. Rapid Shoot Up 2 - No idea since I do not use Bows...=/

[otaku998]

You also get bonus dmg (+ range ) for Scared Skewer PA with Partizan gear nao , more PA like that might appears : v

[gigawuts]

Do you think chase adv 2 will branch off chase adv or from chase bind? I'd hate to waste SP going through chase bind.

You ready to laugh?

The OP didn't say Chase Advance 2.

The OP said Chase Advance Plus.

That's a different skill.

Be ready for half the bonus of Chase Advance 1

In other words

http://img845.imageshack.us/img845/1593/6p3.gif

[Walkure]

You know, it kind of makes sense that the most phallic weapon type in the game hits like a limp dick.

[Rien]

You know, it kind of makes sense that the most phallic weapon type in the game hits like a limp dick.

Because SEGA fails to get it hard?

[Agastya]

i sure love spinning cubes outclassing psycho wand

youre the best sega

[Chdata]

I just realized. Considering this talis boost, I wonder if they'll bother at all to fix how aiming works with talis. It's only really good for AoE spells.

go try to gimegid with a talis

[Zenobia]

Pretty Good is skill for tanking build on HU, while the Fi skill is likely for total offensive build with your life at risk. I doubt those two will actually collide given that both are for opposite build.

Unless you go total offensive on Fi and sub a tanking build Hu.

/imo anyway

Ehh but check this out say I do get the FI skill that increases my pp regen under a status effect the FO will cleanse me!

This means in order for me to take advantage of it I gotta tell err body in the mpa or my party HEY DO NOT CURE MY BURN STATUS! etc.

Do you know how stupid and aggravating that would be?

[UnLucky]

Don't worry, there's no way anyone will be able to manage to land Anti on you to begin with.

[Agastya]

I just realized. Considering this talis boost, I wonder if they'll bother at all to fix how aiming works with talis. It's only really good for AoE spells.

go try to gimegid with a talis
there's nothing to fix
targeted spells will still autotarget from a talis

what you do is throw the talis in tps > switch back to normal view > zondeel > whatever 'aimed' tech you want to use

it works with just about everything but nabarta, but that's because nabarta is a strong independent technique that doesn't need no man

[Chdata]

Unless it was changed recently, that didn't work for me with gimegid. With normal megid it's fine because it actually originates from the talis. I'll try again I guess.

[Z-0]

Only technique that works differently as far as I'm aware is Nafoie;

You can't actually target anything with it, it will just drop straight down, so it would only be any good for Zondeel bunches.

[TaigaUC]

Hunter's tree is already crazy OP, and in dire need of a nerf.

I've been going around saying that it's sad how, when Hunters finally got buffed, it just makes them good for everything but Hunter itself.
How many Hunters do you see out there?
Pretty much everyone just uses Hunter as a sub.

So terrible.

I mean, Hunter gameplay mechanic problems aren't simply an issue of damage.
Their overall design, the PAs, etcetra all leave something to be desired.

But hey, SEGA balance team only knows how to tweak damage values.
I'd link that laughing gif again, but I don't want to spam the topic with it.
Hell, we could link that on every thread all the time and it'd be relevant.

[Zenobia]

Don't worry, there's no way anyone will be able to manage to land Anti on you to begin with.

Nah its called Sol Atomizer and ppl actually use those to.

[strikerhunter]

Nah its called Sol Atomizer and ppl actually use those to.

I've only see people actually using them when 1 stupid player decides to play tag with their fire status effect at the MPA.

Seriously, status effects on players needs to be more threatening and buffed. Back in PSO and PSU status effects way were more scary.

[Zenobia]

I've only see people actually using them when 1 stupid player decides to play tag with their fire status effect at the MPA.

Seriously, status effects on players needs to be more threatening and buffed. Back in PSO and PSU status effects way were more scary.

Seen em use that and FO's use anti when they get hit by Soma'a Eletric wave atk and also by the mecha guys sword spin which insta burns you.

Also in the beach area and trust me ppl use those and antil with all the status ailment they have their.

[UnLucky]

Man, I don't even use Sol Atomizers on myself when playing Gu/Hu. The time it'd take for me to throw one is not worth it just for Perfect Keeper since I'd also have to eat a 'mate as well unless it's Shock. I'll even wait out Panic since I can still attack just fine through it.

The best part of Burn is you can spread it to other people, especially back onto yourself. It's the only way I can enjoy playing in Caves.

[strikerhunter]

I'll even wait out Panic since I can still attack just fine through it.

I laugh every time I get panic on me and just navigate the hell out of it like nothing happened. I mean what's so hard bout reversed controls?

[Laxedrane]

I've only see people actually using them when 1 stupid player decides to play tag with their fire status effect at the MPA.

Seriously, status effects on players needs to be more threatening and buffed. Back in PSO and PSU status effects way were more scary.

The only status effect that really needs to be stronger is mirage. Maybe burn and poison.

Confuse, freeze and shock as far as the version int his game would get you killed just as bad if implemented in pso or psu. Pso2 just not so hard that if you stopped moving for more then 2 seconds your organs will be making abstract art about the room yet. Which happened in the higher levels of pso or psu.

Less to do with the status effects, more to do with the monsters just not taking advantage of it.(Falz and falz arms make this painfully obvious. I've seen him freeze half an mpa only to have most if not everyone survive the 3-10 second freeze. That would never of happen in pso/u)

[Chdata]

Only technique that works differently as far as I'm aware is Nafoie;

You can't actually target anything with it, it will just drop straight down, so it would only be any good for Zondeel bunches.

Ah that's weird. Maybe it never worked cause I did it in 'first person' view.

I just thought of this, but what if they nerf zondeel, to make its suction just like custom guardinanes?

[Zenobia]

Man, I don't even use Sol Atomizers on myself when playing Gu/Hu. The time it'd take for me to throw one is not worth it just for Perfect Keeper since I'd also have to eat a 'mate as well unless it's Shock. I'll even wait out Panic since I can still attack just fine through it.

The best part of Burn is you can spread it to other people, especially back onto yourself. It's the only way I can enjoy playing in Caves.

Well I wasn't talking about GU/HU but rather the FI's skill in a whole none of the status ailments are harmful but it makes FI's skill useless none the less case in point.

[Terrence]

The only status effect that really needs to be stronger is mirage.
Well, if you can use Techs and you're under a SE, an uncharged Anti is really easy and fast. But that's not the case if you have to use a Sol Atomizer. And being unable to heal (or being healed) when you're under Mirage is a thing you absolutely want to cancel as soon as possible. In fact, that's the ONLY status ailment I remove immediatly. I think even the one reducing your maxHP (Falz Hunar, Blu Ringahda, ...) is less dangerous.

[Rien]

Mirage is only OP if the player is the one who is under it

when placed on actual enemies... yeah, it's not strong enough.

[gigawuts]

Re: Status effects, sol atomizers, fighter bonuses

Here's my original idea.

Add a new skill: Finger Bite (lol)
Bite your finger, inflict injury on yourself, reduce hp by 50-99% of maximum (50% at 1 sp, 75% at either 2 or 3 sp, up to 99% at 5 sp)
When the stance is active you're immune to the damage and other effects of other status effects and can't be cured by sol atomizers.
when it wears off you're rehealed to max hp...or maybe you're left at that hp, I dunno :-?

[Chdata]

Bite your finger...


become a giant!

[gigawuts]

massive hunter is a different skill m8

and it also needs work, because ha ha 25 seconds with a fistpump and another 75 seconds until you can do it again hahahahahaha

edit: Also, this update invalidates the one goddamn use I could imagine for massive hunter: using it just before using katana combat to prevent knockback, and that was at the expense of 15% damage from the hunter skills you forego. Seriously Sega has NFI what the fuck they're doing.

[Coatl]

Mirage is only OP if the player is the one who is under it

when placed on actual enemies... yeah, it's not strong enough.

I was actually miraged a few days ago and I literally had no idea what it was suppose to do to me, since it didn't affect my accuracy at all.

[Rien]

I was actually miraged a few days ago and I literally had no idea what it was suppose to do to me, since it didn't affect my accuracy at all.

It *apparently* makes it so you can't be healed.

[gigawuts]

I've had miraged 'rongos roll through me, so I'm inclined to believe it reduces your accuracy.

[Walkure]

Maybe it just made resta miss.

If so, I wonder if an Anti could also miss if you casted on yourself while miraged.

[UnLucky]

Reminds me of Ninjas in Disgaea dodging all of your own team's heals with their high evasion.
SIT STILL FOR ONE GODDAMN SECOND

"gotta go fast"

[Chdata]

Mirage can make things go through you (miss), just like monocero's skill that makes you invincible when your PB gauge is filled.

[Terrence]

It *apparently* makes it so you can't be healed.
Since I can't heal each time I'm under Mirage SE, it's a fact.

[ArcaneTechs]

So are they giving us passes for all characters or just for how many forces we have like they did with that ranger tree change (or a different class)

[strikerhunter]

So are they giving us passes for all characters or just for how many forces we have like they did with that ranger tree change (or a different class)

All classes are getting changes so I would guess everyone would be getting (with no restrictions and specifics like the Gunner changes way back).

[xEchidna]

Well since everyone else has done it, let me jump on the band wagon super late as usual lol... :/


Shougai (http://www.g-heaven.net/topics/2013/09/130925a.html) posted a summary of the new skills being added in SH.

Hunter
Never Give Up - When Iron Will is activated, a 60-second S-ATK bonus and invincibility for a short time.
Pretty Good - Recover from status effects faster.

Fighter
Half Line Boost - Increase the chance of inflicting status effects when your HP is below 50%.
Chase Advance Plus - Increase damage dealt against enemies suffering from status effects.

Ranger
Weak Hit Blast Bonus - PB gauge builds up faster dealing ranged damage to enemy weak points.
First Hit - Damage bonus against enemies with full health.

Gunner
Zero Range Critical - Critical hit rate bonus when dealing ranged damage to enemies at close range.
Toughness Time - Reduces gear loss when damage is taken during Showtime.

Force
Talis Tech Bonus - Damage increase for techs casted after throwing the talis. Five levels only, the damage bonus is 50% (presumably at level 5).
T-ATK High Up - Increases T-ATK (presumably more than T-ATK Up).

Techer
Super Treatment - When healing status effects on yourself or other players, HP also heals. For a limited time, PP recovery also increases (not sure whether this is natural PP recovery or recovery from attacking).
Territory PP Save- While Territory Burst is active, reduces PP cost of support techs.

Braver
Combat Escape - Invincibility when Katana Combat is activated. Unclear how long it lasts.
Rapid Shoot Up 2 - Increases R-ATK when a Bow is equipped and Rapid Shoot is active.

Hunter
Is a class i thoroughly enjoy (abit too much some times)
and one again it gets fked right in the pooper :/

Never Give Up~ Worthless, like i used to have iron will and 70% messing with sega's RNG is not enough for me to waste another 10pts on somthing that should have been there form the start... instead osf sega just saying "well you ALMOST died so, good job now continue with your day :'D "

Pretty Good~ AKA pretty worthless... not much else needs to be said there....

what i think should have a happened:
Like i said i like HU alot, but i feel that it needs to be slightly revamped and what i feel like needs to be done here is WAY less lag time after any thing involving the partisan, i can sacrifice my gear gear gauge to oh idk.... ACTUALLY DODGE!? since you cant step while your doing the spiny thing (you can step before it though, but some times you forget or you time it badly...)
and sword gear needs to be more knuckle gear, attack faster PAs get stronger and get less charge time gear runs out quicker simple right?....
and lastly if they wanted to give HU such a huge s-atk boost skill they should just make it like 2-4 10 drops for fury at least... because it makes no since to have that much crap for one boost and nothing else when that boost can easily be condensed...
--------------------------------------------
Fighte
I dont particularly use FI other then d-saber and some times daggers
because i have FI subed for brave/wise stances and other stuff...
so i wont really say much here

Half Line Boost~ This may prove to be VERY uesless to some, but it is actually pretty usefull for me and my build... and much needed, so i have no quarrels with tis

Chase Advance Plus~ just like with the other skill this is a much needed skill for my build, and a much appreciated addition to it.

what i think should have a happened:
most of the FI users will find both of these pretty useless im thinking.
and after abit of using FI, dont really think it needs much else other then another brave stance up or something?...maybe?.... or maybe a JA boost or 2 for during brave and wise stance?
----------------------------------------
Ranger
Weak Hit Blast Bonus~ YES! FK YES!!!! WE SO NEEDED THIS BECAUSE RA HAS SUCH A PROBLEM GETTING THEIR PB, RIGHT!!! no....
this is pretty "meh" e_e

First Hit - the first shot?... ONLY the first shot?.... so in a party... im the most useless RA ever... DATS SOME Wile-E coyote genius there sega good job! >_>

what i think should have a happened:
well i don't use RA or any of the range classes besides BR
so i am unsure.... of what could make RA better, but from what i see most RA's are good how they are... so... idk.
------------------------------------------
Gunner
Zero Range Critical~
ewww crit?... even sega should know that crit is useless in this game... i usually hit more dmg then my crits do...
now! if this were like other MMO's, and your crits only happen when you hit around your max and was like 2x dmg or something, then by all means gimme some crit!
but thats not how it works in this game so useless... e-e

Toughness Time~
now I dont use GU but almost my entire team dose, and this seems worthless IMO because well... i never see them get hit... ever...
so i don't see a point to this...

What i think should have happened:
just like with RA i don't use GU so i really dont know what GU needs
maybe some more dmg modifiers that don't require you to be in S-roll?
-----------------------------------
Force

Talis Tech Bonus~
Not this is the skill that everyone swears on right now...
and honestly i don't get the hype... it dose not seem THAT good to me... but don't get me wrong, Its not that i do not think this is a stupid OP boost for no reason. but i feel like talis did need atleast a gear, or somthing to make them worth while. and i dont think this will make them THAT much OP

UNLESS you are like the FO/TE in my team with motav and the poteintial
then for 30 sec her t-atk becomes STUPID OP then she goes PP convert from TE and for 30 sec its like... a spam of OP techs i have never seen anyone kill bosses as fast as her now she will get 50% more dmg oh hell... ._.
should a been a TE skill as it is ALOT easier to support with talis
or both should have it?... since they can both use talis

T-ATK High Up~
like FO needs anymore t-atk shoulda been a TE skill also...
srsly with my FI sub, in brave stance i can down a VH rock bear with 1 namegid.... or about 3-4 nafoie's

What i think should have happened:
maybe just the talis skill and a longer duration on flare... then i MIGHT get it, lol.
----------------------------------
Techer
this is the class i have been maining for a while now so i have alot to say here
but first lets cover the new skills....

Super Treatment~ Worthless when ppl get a status effect the use atomizers it takes to long to get ppl to stop so i can charge and anti them..

Territory PP Save~ should have been there from the start as a 2nd effect of Territory burst honestly... i would only get this if it is a 1 drop, and it probably wont be

What i think should have happened:
lol, here we go... get ready for a 20k chapter book...
IMO TE needs a total revamp, and i can sympathize with sega a little for not knowing how to make a class that can be either support or, melee/tech
but its really simple, make 2 halfs tot he ST just like for the other melee classes
make one half support and the other half melee/tech.
the support half could have all the shifta/deband territory burst n' resta advance chiz, while the other half has rand reactor and ect and maybe a stance to raise tech and melee dmg...
because as it stands techer is pretty terrible at all its jobs it sucks at support because support techs get better with your t-atk which techer lacks in (kinda)
and its tech/melee dmg are not that good after hard mode, not to mention its mobility is crap which should be compensated for by techs but TE gets no tech boosters...
wands should at least have step.... or... have a step attack out of that slow ass dash... lol

and all alot of the dmg problem could be fixed with a sub class but almost none of them really work for TE as a main class, you only have 3 real options

1.TE/HU~ full fury, but then your techs would be stupid weak in VH and you wont use them too often... so at that point you might as well just go FI/HU for melee

2.TE/FO~ opposite of HU, your techs would be stupid powerful but s-atk would be crap and make wand gear useless so... meh...

and 3. TE/FI but brave and wise don't give that larger a boost compared to HU or FO sub, its only worth while because it increases both melee and techs.

I use the FI method but with with FI i use Chase Advance +Brave/Wise, because while using techs to build your gear, you notice that you inflict a status problem quite often to mobs and bosses. it just takes knowing what bosses are vulnerable to what status's.

but its WAY too much work just to get decent dmg... so i think the class it self needs to be revamped to work on its own like every other class can but this is just my opinion...
some ppl think TE is fine how it is...
---------------------------------------------
Braver
Combat Escape~ lol, like BR needs to be invincible during KC, this is just over kill e_e

Rapid Shoot Up 2~ more then likely.... worthless
i never use anything like this unless its 200-300 because 100 is not that much a boost to be noticed, and if both are +100... it may be worth the 10pts....

What I thing should have happened:
BR needs more weps its ST is fine (other then average stance)
and maybe a hint to its next class stage >_>
I WANT SLICERS!!!!

[H.Miku]

Talis Tech Bonus - Damage increase for techs casted after throwing the talis. Five levels only, the damage bonus is 50% (presumably at level 5).

HOLY WHAT!? and I am ready to change my ranger build if the Weak Hit Blast Bonus is in a easy-to-reach place, since the last new skills for ranger were sad (good effect, too low %).


So are they giving us passes for all characters or just for how many forces we have like they did with that ranger tree change (or a different class)

We all are getting a free "all class reset pass" thingy.

[TaigaUC]

I wonder if we'll be able to throw a talis at the floor and then switch weapons and cast to get the bonus with a staff.
Don't know if it works that way (I lag too much to do anything fancy with switching weapons).

[UnLucky]

What should have happened

Hunter:
Remove Fury Stance Up 2 and JA Bonus 2.
Give each weapon Gear +5% damage per gauge level.

Fighter:
Brave/Wise Up 2
Active skill that gives yourself a status effect that cannot be cured

Ranger:
Make traps good somehow?
A general bullet passive that increases ammo count for all related skills
Individual bullet skills increase in effectiveness from 1-5, or only as single point investments if they can't be improved.

Gunner:
Just needs more SP, or fewer/lower requirements in crappy skills.
Reverse Aerial Advance to deal bonus damage while in the air.

Force:
Ice needs a great modifying skill like Flame S Charge and Bolt PP Save.
Photon Flare needs the Fury Stance treatment.

Techer:
S/D Advance need to be 2-3x, not just 25% of 20% of less than half of your total stats. You barely notice the difference between a full support Techer and a full DPS Force's buffs.
Increased Striking and Tech damage, and even better if it's both in one skill.

Braver:
Stanceless Charge bonus
Dex to crit rate/damage conversion

[Sp-24]

I wonder if we'll be able to throw a talis at the floor and then switch weapons and cast to get the bonus with a staff.
Don't know if it works that way (I lag too much to do anything fancy with switching weapons).

Talis disappears if you switch weapons. In fact, even your techniques do, unless it's the exact same weapon.

Just like the Gunner's bullshit buff, this is an attempt to force you to do that thing you don't want to. The only thing they learned from Hunter's Fury JA Bonus was to prevent any creativity with subclasses.

But seriously, Lambda Vis Burn, used by someone who can barely equip it, will do more damage than a PW user who specifically made a build to equip it, if the 50% bonus is real. The XQ rod will do just barely more damage in sunny weather. Oh, and wands? Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha.

[xEchidna]

Ranger:
Make traps good somehow?


I Loled so hard xD....

[Inazuma]

After we get the new stupid OP talis skill, rods will become just as useless and horrible as wands. On the bright side, it won't suck having to level Tector anymore.

[Sandmind]

Imo, Talis tech bonus will eitheir work in a similar manner to GU JA Sroll or it's only active as long as the card is out in the air. Regardless of which one, or even if I'm wrong, being able to switch to a rod should be next to impossible.

That tech atk high up sound like a hit or miss.

Not too sure about those SE related skills, sound worthless, unless sega is going to make them more common and/or deadly in the future.

Territory pp save might be deemed worthless for most FOTE, with possible exception of multi skill tree user who don't mind getting a new TE tree for it. TEHU and other variations will be able to put it to better use depending of their style and build.

[UnLucky]

Well Psycho Wand and Seitenheise are still good for their PP managing potentials, but yeah, anything but Talis is a joke weapon now. At least rods cast as fast as tali, though.

I want to say Te/Hu gets a pass, but I think they're just falling further behind "real" melee or tech classes.

[Sp-24]

Well Psycho Wand and Seitenheise are still good for their PP managing potentials, but yeah, anything but Talis is a joke weapon now. At least rods cast as fast as tali, though.

I want to say Te/Hu gets a pass, but I think they're just falling further behind "real" melee or tech classes.
New skill: Wand Humpers. Increases Wand Gear effect's damage. Prerequisite is Wand Gear, 3 levels, 2.0 modifier at lv.1, 4.0 at lv.2 and 7.0 at level 3.

...It's like I really am a PSO2 dev.

[Sandmind]

I want to say Te/Hu gets a pass, but I think they're just falling further behind "real" melee or tech classes.

Yeah, my own alt TEHU is mostly for fun, since I like the mixed gameplay. She can hold her own for mobbing, but that's about it as a low lv in VH with budget gears played by an average player like me.


New skill: Wand Humpers. Increases Wand Gear effect's damage. Prerequisite is Wand Gear, 3 levels, 2.0 modifier at lv.1, 4.0 at lv.2 and 7.0 at level 3.

...It's like I really am a PSO2 dev.

Sound legit.

[TaigaUC]

Talis disappears if you switch weapons. In fact, even your techniques do, unless it's the exact same weapon.


Yeah, but what about a damage up bonus from throwing a talis then switching to rod to cast a spell?

[GALEFORCE]

PWand Nafoie still seems like it'd be incredibly good.. not that I'll ever get to use it.

The addition really warrants a rod gear now.

[UnLucky]

Yeah, but what about a damage up bonus from throwing a talis then switching to rod to cast a spell?

Really depends on how they implement it. I doubt it'll be a persisting buff. It could check to see if a card was thrown, or only work for the first tech if JA'd off of throwing a card. Something like that.


The addition really warrants a rod gear now.

+50% tech damage bonus at Zero Range!

[MetalDude]

Yeah, but what about a damage up bonus from throwing a talis then switching to rod to cast a spell?

Running under the assumption that the talis needs to be out, the bonus only applies then and would then be lost upon switching weapons.

[Inazuma]

Rods and talises are balanced just fine in our current game. Rods are stronger but talises let you cast techs from a thrown card. Both have their pros and cons; both are best depending on the situation. Good forces use both.

Sega looks at the game and sees that 90% of the forces never use talis and they only spam zonde from a rod. Sega creates a skill that boosts the damage of talises by an absurd amount in an effort to fix this.

The problem here is not the weapon types being unbalanced. The vast majority of forces are just awful and don't have any interest in being good at the game. They aren't interested in strategy or teamwork. They are content with mindlessly using one attack over and over, and slowing down the forces who care about playing well. And despite doing more harm than good overall, they are stubbornly convinced they are amazing strong forces.

After the new talis skill comes out, instead of using both rods and talises and each having their uses, no one will touch rods again, including the good forces. Not even Psycho Wand would be worth using.

What will the rod using zonde spamming forces of today do after this change? Spam zonde with a thrown talis instead? Probably. It seems like nothing can stop them from spamming zonde all day long.

I hope the lv 16 Photon Art/Tech rebalance makes the shit forces switch to a non-lightning tech to spam. I'm OK with most people being terrible at video games. That's normal. It just pisses me off when they constantly activate my zondeel and slow me down.

[UnLucky]

EDIT: Ninjas.

No, put it back, it was a real post different enough from the others that contributed to the discussion.

[Sp-24]

Yeah, but what about a damage up bonus from throwing a talis then switching to rod to cast a spell?Considering that, for example, your techniques don't get affected by the strictly R.Atk based skills like ZRA, I'd expect a Talis-exclusive skill that requires a Talis to be present to not apply to other weapons when the skill's trigger conditions aren't even met.

+50% tech damage bonus at Zero Range!Nah, +300% tech damage bonus after hitting two consecutive melee JA attacks while in the air and while Photon Flare is active. Gotta promote that variety in playstyles.

[strikerhunter]

The problem here is not the weapon types being unbalanced.

It's not the weapons that are unbalance but it's their PAs and skill trees that are.



The vast majority of forces are just awful and don't have any interest in being good at the game. They aren't interested in strategy or teamwork. They are content with mindlessly using one attack over and over, and slowing down the forces who care about playing well. And despite doing more harm than good overall, they are stubbornly convinced they are amazing strong forces.

I'm not going even to argue with this on how you said this but will say that 99% FOs follows with just damage and troll force activate zondeels rather than support.

[MetalDude]

No, put it back, it was a real post different enough from the others that contributed to the discussion.

Ah dammit, if I wasn't scrubby and knew how to revert back I actually would now.

EDIT: Threw in what I remembered saying.

[Sp-24]

I hope the lv 16 Photon Art/Tech rebalance makes the shit forces switch to a non-lightning tech to spam. I'm OK with most people being terrible at video games. That's normal. It just pisses me off when they constantly activate my zondeel and slow me down.
A serious rebalance? In PSO2? Haha, right. It'll either change nothing at all or make one technique that is not ice elemental stupidly OP, just like how it was every single time before that, because Sega literally cannot be assed to actually work on gameplay when there are girls' costumes and hairstyles to model.

[UnLucky]

It's not the weapons that are unbalance but it's their PAs and skill trees that are.

Uh, talking only about tech weapons here, which don't have PAs.

Right now, rod is the strongest, talis is weaker but can be faster/safer, wand is weaker and casts slower and needs SP to make it any better.

After the update, talis is the strongest and can be faster/safer, rod is weaker but does nothing special, and wand is just terrible all around for casting.

So yeah, the skill trees aren't unbalanced yet. They will be once one weapon gets a +50% bonus and the others don't. And Wand Gear isn't very good.

[MetalDude]

Makes you wonder why they didn't just keep everything around the same T Atk power and simply give Rods a very fast cast animation and Wands a shit ton more S Atk than they already have.

[Cyclon]

The vast majority of forces are just awful and don't have any interest in being good at the game.If only, if only this statement was only true for forces.

Also I'm pretty sure lv 16 PAs will be rebalanced. What's the point otherwise?

[UnLucky]

To make people farm unpopular rare bosses endlessly for a chance of a chance to get a 3% damage boost?

[Aine]

They've already stated they'll be doing another major rebalance with PAs at level 16.

[Inazuma]

They've already stated they'll be doing another major rebalance with PAs at level 16.

This is why there is a chance of a different tech to replace zonde for all the shit forces. Some techs will get large boosts in power at lv 16, while others, like zonde, will get minor incremental boosts.

And since we also get a free skill tree reset item at the same time, if the new "best" tech ends up being something like foie, everyone can change their tree from lightning to fire. Please let this happen, Sakai san!

I want to use zondeel, goddamnit!

[Z-0]

I am totally expecting Ice to finally be king.

Barta will do 10,000 damage casually with no proper gearing up and a hybrid tree.

!

[Inazuma]

I am totally expecting Ice to finally be king.

Barta will do 10,000 damage casually with no proper gearing up and a hybrid tree.

!

Photon arts/techs that are weak, unpopular and/or hard to use are the most likely to get larger power boosts. If I remember correctly from the live stream, that's how they described the rebalance.

If Barta is gonna do 10,000 damage, then Sabarta will do 30,000 damage. Nabarta, Nagrants and Nazonde will likely get huge boosts since they are "hard to use".

[Yutaka20]

lol actually forthe ice tree i would really love to see a even larger aoe and dmg boss or at least freaking make sure ice can freeze everyone >.> at least that will make it more fun lol.
i mean if zondeel can 100% pull

give any ice skill 100 freeze and dafuq let TE's terratory skill work on all ice skill in return :/
or that freeze explosing skill be rangeless -.-"
it just makes ice so useless becos of lack of dmg and the utilitises arent doing any use cos of restriction and wtf range lol

[Xaelouse]

I'm willing to bet rods will get a special skill that's more PP oriented than damage oriented.

[Rien]

Swords need a buff. >.>

[Zenobia]

Swords need a buff. >.>

Sword just need to be faster like they did in PSP2I.

[o0Kais0o]

Sword just need to be faster like they did in PSP2I.

This, please. Small as it was, this was one of my favourite things about that game lol.

[gigawuts]

Hunter:
Remove Fury Stance Up 2 and JA Bonus 2.
Give each weapon Gear +5% damage per gauge level.

Fighter:
Brave/Wise Up 2
Active skill that gives yourself a status effect that cannot be cured

Ranger:
Make traps good somehow?
A general bullet passive that increases ammo count for all related skills
Individual bullet skills increase in effectiveness from 1-5, or only as single point investments if they can't be improved.

Gunner:
Just needs more SP, or fewer/lower requirements in crappy skills.
Reverse Aerial Advance to deal bonus damage while in the air.

Force:
Ice needs a great modifying skill like Flame S Charge and Bolt PP Save.
Photon Flare needs the Fury Stance treatment.

Techer:
S/D Advance need to be 2-3x, not just 25% of 20% of less than half of your total stats. You barely notice the difference between a full support Techer and a full DPS Force's buffs.
Increased Striking and Tech damage, and even better if it's both in one skill.

Braver:
Stanceless Charge bonus
Dex to crit rate/damage conversion

re: Braver

I've had Stance Advance on my mind for a little while now. +10% to all damage while using a stance - any stance. Main class, sub class, it doesn't matter. The question is what class should get it - either hunter or braver. Maybe hunter because its damage skills are too dependent on Fury, and Guard's damage is too crippled as a result. Braver because its stances are too terrible, and pretty soon the class will be strapped for SP (assuming they balance it right). I mean, it's already strapped for SP. 20 sp for 21% damage or 33 sp for 33% charged damage? Wt actual f is that?

I'd like to lose fury stance up 2 on hunter, crop Fury Crit to 5 SP (still 20%), turn the JABs into 20% each, and turn Fury Combo Up into -20% PP Cost on JA'd attacks while using Fury Stance.

Now reduce the JAB sp reqs in hp up and fury stance to 3 or even 2. If someone wants to keep hp up and fury stance as low as possible for a hybrid guard stance/JAB build fucking let them.

Give Absorption a slight PP gain too, just 5 at the most. If it only works when I'm using Guard Stance it better be great.

And where's my HP/PP/both bonus for just guarding? A brief period of invuln is all fine and dandy but let's be real here - the game launched with that and we need more to work with on the class's core functions.

Hunter has problems, but none of them can be fixed with more damage. At least they realize this...kind of. What they're adding fixes nothing, it just lets you invest more sp into situational mediocre skills to make them slightly better in even more situational instances at the expense of being better 100% of the time.

So long as the Fury tree can soak up 70 sp Hunter will never be balanced.

[Aine]

Shougai posted an update on Twitter, apparently Talis Tech Bonus is getting nerfed to +20%. Guess a lot of people who traded in stones for Love Phoenix complained.

Also unrelated, but respawn interval in bursts will be shortened. Hopefully back to pre-nerf levels.

[gigawuts]

Haaaahahahaha, talis tech bonus relegated to "meh" status; probably not worth it for most players; Sega proves it still can't balance around utility instead of making this BIG NUMBERS: THE GAME.

[Sp-24]

I don't have my precious numbers at hand, but I think all the 20% adjustment does is make the best rod and best talis equal in power. So now, you either put 5 SP into the skill, spend time to throw a card, and then use a technique that is casted from your character instead of talis, like Zonde, anyway (but only do it 3-4 times, then it's time for another card), or just use a rod.

Brilliant.

[Zenobia]

I figured they were going to do that LMFAO!

[Xaelouse]

but 20% is still good. It would be meh if it was nerfed to 10%

[Sp-24]

Yeah, just checked - now the XQ talis is ~10% stronger than the XQ rod, and Psycho Wand is once again the best. Hooray for strategic tech placement, I guess.

Lambda Vis Burn is still stronger than Love Phoenix, by the way.

[~Aya~]

Might actually use FO again.. motav prophecy has been collecting dust recently~

[Zyrusticae]

Oh thank goodness, there's no way in hell I was going to switch to Talis just for that absurdly high bonus.

Now if only we had more good news...

[jcart953]

Aw I was kind of looking forward to that 50% buff, I wonder will be even change to talis now. Oh and how come these people don't complain about these other skills especially fighter they get the shittys skills each time. Gooooo SEGA....

[Sp-24]

Guess that between a useless skill and a blatantly broken one, people chose the bigger evil to complain about.

[gigawuts]

Aw I was kind of looking forward to that 50% buff, I wonder will be even change to talis now. Oh and how come these people don't complain about these other skills especially fighter they get the shittys skills each time. Gooooo SEGA....

We do, it's just rod forces outnumber fighters by a fairly large margin.

[Coatl]

This is just depressing. Not only because this change doesn't change the fact that talis will still be better than rods, but because they couldn't give rods a similar skill to make them at least comparable to the talis skill. :I

[Emp]

This is just depressing. Not only because this change doesn't change the fact that talis will still be better than rods, but because they couldn't give rods a similar skill to make them at least comparable to the talis skill. :I

As said awhile back, where Sega places the skill on the tree will determine if talises will be better than rods. Also 20% aint that much. I only see them useful for zondeeling, all other techs are better used on rods.

[Z-0]

It's branched off T-Atk 1, this was found established a while ago.

[Coatl]

As said awhile back, where Sega places the skill on the tree will determine if talises will be better than rods. Also 20% aint that much. I only see them useful for zondeeling, all other techs are better used on rods.

It's 20% dmg to all elemental techs which is a pretty big deal. This will easily the best Force skill next to PP Charge Revival in terms of usefulness to all techs. And the only techs I can think of that are inherently worse to use on talis vs rods are nafoie on a boss and foie on mobs. And you don't even need to foie on mobs all the time now that you can just zondeel + nafoie them.

Obviously if the skill is placed under a horrible skill it will not be worthwhile. That much is inarguable. But if it is placed in a convenient place then talises will outclass rods.

[Emp]

It's 20% dmg to all elemental techs which is a pretty big deal. This will easily the best Force skill next to PP Charge Revival in terms of usefulness to all techs. And the only techs I can think of that are inherently worse to use on talis vs rods are nafoie on a boss and foie on mobs. And you don't even need to foie on mobs all the time now that you can just zondeel + nafoie them.

Obviously if the skill is placed under a horrible skill it will not be worthwhile. That much is inarguable. But if it is placed in a convenient place then talises will outclass rods.

U still have to throw the card tho right? Lol

[Coatl]

Why does that even matter? Normally a FO would normal attack to JA into a tech anyway. :I Unless, of course, if they have Shifta in one of their weapon tech slots. In which case IDK.

[Emp]

Why does that even matter? Normally a FO would normal attack to JA into a tech anyway. :I

U can cast early off the throw but normal atk with rod just seems a bit faster.