When and when not to craft?

[Chdata]

The last time I logged in was before mining defense was released. Haven't tried that or crafting yet.

What items are generally good to craft, and what items are you generally going to make worse by crafting? 7*, 8*, 9*, 10*?

Is the %age change on techs random when you customize them?

[gigawuts]

Before level 40: extend away
After level 40: get a 10*
7-9*s: Maybe extend
10*s: Never extend unless you're looking for a multiclass stat

When it's worth it for techs:
PP reduction: Almost definitely, across the board
Faster charge: Usually, but not always

[UnLucky]

If you have absolutely nothing but garbage for a weapon, craft it as high as you're able (and can still equip it). Or, if you have a metric assload of Dex and can't hope to switch it all over to Atk instead, then you can use a crafted weapon but it still won't be as good as the top 10* stuff. There's also rerolling for multiclass or bringing up a trash weapon with an OP latent to compete with average gear.

If you don't have amazing 10* units, you can craft a weak set with a good set bonus for some surprisingly effective gear. Even 11* units with bad stats are better when crafted.

Tech crafting is pretty minor stuff except for the recipes which add hits (-hit interval), reduced PP cost, or faster charge time. Usually the difference in Power is negligible since it's additive (300% +30% = 330%).

[DJcooltrainer]

Yeah, once you can get a 10-star weapon, crafting is kinda worthless for most weapons. The only class it might be viable on is BR with braver mag and a pure ability mag, but I think you could get a higher DPS output with an S-atk build. It also would not give you enough s-atk at 65 for the s-atk Katanas.

[final_attack]

Try to extend weapon with rarity up to *9 (lower power one). A good latent but low power is good to craft too.

I personally went for crafted Yash2000 for GuHu (Messiah Time purpose only), and went to critical build. Well, a tmg with 996 (or is it 994?) R-Atk (R-Atk +60 included), and Zero Effort latent? Yes, please ^^;

Be warned with crafted weapon minimum damage though. in JP wiki, they gave a damage graph about crafted weapon. It's maximum and minimum damage range ...... quite far. I think you can find the picture in this forum, but, I forgot where.

So, it's better to keep *10 as it is.

Oh, and maybe if you're into cosmetics, good looking weapon you want to use a lot but low attack power? Craft away ^^;

Note: Ignore my crafted katana on my sig, haven't got time to edit it again. I went back to *10 un-crafted one since Hunter already @ lv 60.

[Chdata]

I assume the damage variance is something like, the minimum is where the weapon already was, and max is wherever you craft it to?

[Chdata]

Should I desynth common 10* units? Or even weapons?

[final_attack]

Link in this forum (http://www.pso-world.com/forums/showthread.php?t=217578&page=8)

I think it shows up there (minimum damage) o_o a few posts from top

[UnLucky]

I assume the damage variance is something like, the minimum is where the weapon already was, and max is wherever you craft it to?

Rare weapons have a minimum of 90% of their Atk (max would be 100%)

Non rare (6* or lower) and crafted weapons have a minimum of 0% of their Atk, plus Dex, but it still can't exceed 90% of the weapon's Atk.

Plus or minus some a bit because I'm simplifying it. The full damage formula is floating around.

[Zipzo]

There some occasions where crafting a 10* can be useful, but essentially all of these situations have to do with exceptional or crucial latent abilities.

I wanted to have an Evil Curst on the side for Dark techs, but as TE/HU it's basically impossible for me to equip it...my Tech just won't reach. Extending allowed me to change the requirement, so that in trade off for a bit of a higher damage variance I get to play with that juicy latent.

Aside from this, for players at cap or a decent collection of higher rank 10* weapons, crafting is basically a complicated "camo" system. So if you really care for aesthetics or you're dying to get away from your gaudy weapon to just about anything else, you have the option to do so with a very large selection available for you to choose from without totally obliterating your damage.

Unit extension is ok. It's important for you take note of any hidden inherent stats you may be losing by
extending a unit, and you can simply weigh your losses to the gains you'll make. Set bonuses still factor in after extension too, remember that. There are some cases where extension can only be a good thing, but there are debatable losses on some sets that make it worth arguing.

[Saffran]

Crafting also makes getting good gear pretty easy. Just buy one good fodder, extend it and hey presto, you're good to go.

[Sizustar]

Should I desynth common 10* units? Or even weapons?

I trade them in for Excube~
One of my guildmate already has over 500 excube.

[omegasereon]

I have a 2000H + 10 extended 5 all classes. Should I try to get a 10* wep and work on that?

[Punisher106]

Only disassemble 7-9* weapons. I'd NPC units, as extending units isn't worth it, and 10* weapons are better for cubes for 250% boosters, so you get more 7-9* weapons from TD to disassemble *Punches his fist through a wall* and trade the 10* units in for grinders.

[Walkure]

Red Weapons have a disproportionate amount of Rubiards per great success, I don't think most other weapons will even beat NPCing them on average return since the base materials are absolutely worthless afaik.

[Macman]

Never desynth a 10* as they don't give any special materials you can't get by other means. Cube/sphere them instead.

[Laxedrane]

Like in zipzo example keep in mind crafting can allow you to equip powerful weapons for lower the cost. So while your waiting on getting enough of the requirement for the good to great 10* weapons you boost a crap weapons up to hold you over.

Also be aware of the fact of the lesser cost of affixing and grinding is a factor if you have bad luck at dudu. You can +10 a 7*, unlock potentials, and affix for considerably less meseta at stake. Then craft it up.(Just remember that higher level upgrades for weapons run above 100k.)

[Chdata]

Affixing costs less now? And grinding? Wut.

Also, why is crafting 10* even an option if it makes them worse?

[WildarmsRE5]

Affixing costs less now? And grinding? Wut.

Also, why is crafting 10* even an option if it makes them worse?make them multi-class, or reduce the equip req in exchange for attack.

Affixing costs more the higher the rarity of the item. and so is grinding.

also, SEGA said themselves, that crafting was not supposed to create super uber gears.

[Zipzo]

Affixing costs less now? And grinding? Wut.

Also, why is crafting 10* even an option if it makes them worse?

It doesn't make them all worse.

Specifically, it will bring down the stats of a higher tier 10*, usually the top 5 or so. The rest below that it actually surpasses the 10*'s in base attack strength, but it widens the damage variance a bit, which can only be counter acted by using ability.

It doesn't really work as an upgrade system for 10* owners, it's technically meant to just be more cost effective (and no RNG) way to acquire strength on the level of 10* weapons for anyone else who hasn't yet had the fortune of getting them.

And as I said, in some cases it can help you use a weapon with a requirement you may not meet, or bring a weapon with a strong latent up to decent par.

[UnLucky]

Crafting is literally Red Weapons ver2.

Garbage "rares" that are easy enough for anyone to get, but they suck compared to anything actually good but hard to find/afford.

Plus now Sega never has to actually make a decent camo system because they can point at this shitfest

[Inazuma]

I think the word "Extend" is partly to blame for people thinking the crafting system was a way to strengthen or somehow improve their items. Can't really blame them since that's what extend means. It should add onto the existing stats and abilities of the item, not erase it and create new stats.

Maybe Sega should have actually looked up the definition of the English word Extend, before using it in their Japanese game. What makes this even sadder is that a few years earlier Sega released a game called Hatsune Miku Project Diva 2nd Extend for the PSP. It was originally DLC for Project Diva 2nd, but due to various problems, they ended up releasing a physical version of it. The use of the word "extend" for this PSP game was correct. They even went so far as to explain the meaning of the word in the commercials for the game.

[Z-0]

Extension was also a feature in the PSP2 games, and there it did exactly what you'd expect: Gave the weapon extra stats, and in some cases, special effects.

[Inazuma]

Extension was also a feature in the PSP2 games, and there it did exactly what you'd expect: Gave the weapon extra stats, and in some cases, special effects.

I didn't play that one. Looks like the dev team behind PSO2 forgot what that word meant really quickly.

[The Walrus]

The PSO2 team forgot a lot of things...mostly the things PSU-PSP2i actually did right...

[Zenobia]

Yeah I played the PSP2 and PSP2i and to see PSO2 do the exact freaking opposite is toxic I was mind blown. I like how when they broadcast they didn't say nothing about removing the hidden dex values and all this etc.

Then once people tell them about it they say "Yes we know it removes the dex values this is how it was intended" GG.

[jooozek]

here is a good show how bad is crafting
[SPOILER-BOX]http://mmoloda.com/pso2/image/24502.png[/SPOILER-BOX]

[UnLucky]

crafting is a bad joke

[Shadowth117]

Crafting is your character reminding themselves why they decided to fight with weapons rather than make them.

[Aine]

There are three good uses for craft:

1. Making decent gear on a really tight budget or for lower-level characters.
2. Making gear allclass/equipable on another class, either for stuff like monkey king bar, dashing daggers, or for leveling a subclass. Crafted Kalicizma is way better than an Agito.
3. Lowering stat requirements for gear. A Lucky Rise Vraolet costs around 500k, but you can craft a cheap Lambda Vraolet instead.

[GoldenFalcon]

There are three good uses for craft:

1. Making decent gear on a really tight budget or for lower-level characters.
3. Lowering stat requirements for gear.

I find it funny that you can craft a 6* and the requirement cuts in half and the max power doubles

[Zorafim]

here is a good show how bad is crafting
[SPOILER-BOX]http://mmoloda.com/pso2/image/24502.png[/SPOILER-BOX]

Oh, is that what everyone's complaining about? 50 attack points lowering your average damage by a few points? That's more than worth making an all-class weapon, or using a weapon design you like.

[Macman]

It's consistency. You can have your gun kill an enemy in 5-6 shots, or in 4 to 10 shots. Those lows are so damn low it's ridiculous.

I did some tests with a fully extended, Lv3 latent +10 Zumiuran versus a +10 siren glass hammer with zonde in tunnels.

The glass hammer would hit somewhere between 4200-4800
Zumiuran would hit around 3000-5200 but more often than not, under 4000. (with +16% lightning damage latent, mind you)

Which sounds more desirable to you?

[Zorafim]

I'd take either one, to be honest. If it takes me longer than usual to kill the mob in front of me, then I'd expect it'd take faster than usual to kill the one afterwards. This isn't exactly a game where you absolutely need to be at your highest game at every point. Even at it the game's hardest, the damage evens out over the course of the fight.

If you were doing, say, a strict time attack and had to always be at your best and know each move you'll make, it would be something to worry about. But your damage will either be padded by extended gameplay in the case of grinding situations, or other players in the case of MPAs.

So, if it'll save me stress hunting a weapon, or if I can use a superior weapon on a different class, I'd say give me the damage variance. It's still better than using an 8* from the shops.
Of course, I have a grounded and latented twin Kamui. So I'm not really one to talk.

[Horo The Wise Wolf]

Oh, is that what everyone's complaining about? 50 attack points lowering your average damage by a few points? That's more than worth making an all-class weapon, or using a weapon design you like.

I think the point being is that it takes a weapon that is supposed to be superior in every way and makes it worse. Even though the numbers look nice, that shitty (low-end) 10* Rifle outperforms it.

Imagine putting a better rifle next to it.

[Zorafim]

Yeah, that makes sense. If you have a 10*, use it. If not, craft something up. It's just, people make it out to be some horrible plague. If I didn't have a 10*, I'd take that crafted rifle. If I did, I'd just ignore crafting. It's annoying that it's not the camo replacement we've been hoping for. But you've got access to decent multiclass weapons, great ways to level up low level characters, and a decent way to gear up enough to survive super hard. What's not to love?

[Horo The Wise Wolf]

Yeah, that makes sense. If you have a 10*, use it. If not, craft something up. It's just, people make it out to be some horrible plague. If I didn't have a 10*, I'd take that crafted rifle. If I did, I'd just ignore crafting. It's annoying that it's not the camo replacement we've been hoping for. But you've got access to decent multiclass weapons, great ways to level up low level characters, and a decent way to gear up enough to survive super hard. What's not to love?

Literally all I found crafting useful for was making my MKB all class.

Other than that it is just a useless feature in the game (through my eyes)

I am a premium player, so you know I pay to win according to most. (buy 10*s)

[jooozek]

Oh, is that what everyone's complaining about? 50 attack points lowering your average damage by a few points? That's more than worth making an all-class weapon, or using a weapon design you like.

since you missed it by a mile: the crafted weapon has 50 element fire and a potential that at lvl 3 boosts standing snipe by 11%, the aq welfare weapon has only 30 element dark and no potential unlocked, it was tested on a fire weak enemy :lol:

[Zorafim]

Oh. I was wondering why its high end damage was so high.
Then give me a test where two equally powerful weapons are set against an equal target. It's not a good test unless all other variables are controlled.

[Macman]

The variables were ideal for the crafted weapon and it STILL underperformed compared to the welfare rifle. What you suggest would only make it look even worse, lol.

I'd like to see the results with an unextended fire arms. If it's lows are still higher than the extended version's lows, that's just lol.

[Alma]

Oh. I was wondering why its high end damage was so high.
Then give me a test where two equally powerful weapons are set against an equal target. It's not a good test unless all other variables are controlled.

http://www.pso-world.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3086555&postcount=47

[WildarmsRE5]

http://www.pso-world.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3086555&postcount=47you sacrificed your green duel disk (and max grinded) for the sake of science, I salute you.

I'm still wondering why it doesn't have Trap Activate latent like on the lower version and vice versa.

[Walkure]

Oh. I was wondering why its high end damage was so high.
Then give me a test where two equally powerful weapons are set against an equal target. It's not a good test unless all other variables are controlled.
In mathematical examples, I compared a +9 Discade to a crafted knuckle in an earlier thread.

So, for a rockbear with ~258 SDEF, ~300 DEX, with a player having 415 DEX and a player having ~1200 SATK without weapon attack factored in (reasonable with shifta drink which should always be on). I don't know extended knuckle weapon attack, but I'll just assume 960 or so.

You'll have [2(1200+960)-2(258 )+2(415-300)]*M/10=403.4*M for average damage with an extended weapon.
This is basically neutral-damage on a rockbear, with DEF and DEX found in this thread (http://www.pso-world.com/forums/showthread.php?t=217034).


let's say that the discade is only +9, so it's at 966 SATK, which I'll round to 960. Equal SATK comparison.

M/5*((1200+960 )+45%(960 )-(258 ))=466.8*M


So it's only a 15.59% increase in average damage to use a +9 Discade over that 960 extended weapon.

[Macmaxi]

Might as well want to push this topic, as i'm still really unsure about the whole crafting thing. Instead of reading the thread 5 times in a row and still not getting it like the smart person i am, i just going to use my own scenario.


So currently i'm maining HU still and i'm looking for a Katana that can use mainly for TD2, since that is the only place where my Sword is really a pain to play. I have a Filph Suiren available and can get a few others as well. The obvious Susano Guren is not available since that thing is really expensive...


Is there another alternative i can use with a Hunter class book that works? I have no idea what other weapon i could craft get some use out of it, at this point i might as well farm up meseta to just buy the Susano, since i want to get a Katana which lasts for a while so i don't need to bother with it anymore as i wanted to focus on HU/FI weapons.

[Rien]

Take this one. (http://pso2.swiki.jp/index.php?%E3%82%A8%E3%83%AC%E3%83%8C%E3%83%90%E3% 83%86%E3%82%A3%E3%83%B3)