Thoughts about the New Falz?

[Raymee]

I didn't get to kill Falz cause we ran out of time.

Welp, there goes my rare boost haha...

[TaigaUC]

Killed Loser on the hour. Coincidence?

[Horo The Wise Wolf]

Killed him.

Got nothing.

Oh you know, the usual.

[Tomo-Kinji]

My 1st run did ate about 25mins of time :/ 2nd run is ongoing tho.. new falz is kinda buggy. can't see him.

PS: Doing it right now.. Still no signs of seeing him, but I can see others getting hit and killed :/

[NotRankin]

Buncha 10*s

Don't nerf please. Fun as hell.

[Niagara]

Pretty epic. We killed him, i got two 10* and one of his unit...

The matterboard cutscene is creepy... I wonder if Luther can came back with the twins...

[The_Brimada]

Took so long to find a party on my first char that I made it to my second char with only one min to spare. Problem was I was the only one in the party lol. So yeah wasn't even going to do that...and the rare boost I already had running ran out 5 seconds before he died -.-

[TaigaUC]

Coincidence then. Takes about 25 minutes to kill him.
I got a trashy ten star (no boosts).

[Shinamori]

My party had no wbers, managed to kill him in 20mins. yay pugs!

[Sanguine2009]

so much hp! this is how bosses should be! so how long ya think till sega takes the fun out of him and nerfs into the ground?

[supersai8]

He's very neat, and I was laughing as I was watching people (and myself) wipe from his attacks. That time freeze gimmick sucks though, got selected twice (Among other players) to attempt to destroy those swords, and needlessly to say we failed on both attempts.

Curious as to how that ending pose works; is the MvP the foremost player out of all the groups, or...?

EDIT: Also, trashy 7-9 stars. Thanks SEGA.

[musicmf]

28~ minute Falz fight, ran out of moons cause my Random Multiparty sucked.

Does the center part break or something? It seems weird that it takes so much less damage than everything else, I just have the urge to attempt to break it >_>;

Got a 10* Talis (no boosts), and like 5 7* crap...

The length of the fight and the strong attacks made it kinda feel like a real boss fight! Now, I wonder how many months it will be for the random mpa to be complete ass in this fight...

--------

Oh, and I fought 1 of the rare uh... boss you fight multiple times. It pops like a red container, I got a level 16 deband from it. (Low level shifta, and sazan only, can't even decraft)

Does anybody know what the % is for the duration of the EQ? It seems uh... too hard to build to 100%. If this was primetime AND the first Loser appearance... I don't know how we'd break 100%.

[Daiyousei]

everyone just keep quiet about the game being too hard and all will be well.

[spoiler-box]http://i.imgur.com/NGuB1vK.png[/spoiler-box]

[wefwq]

Failed because there's no WB and less OP class.
But it's fun as hell, keep losing does not matter anymore to me for this fun battle.

[Meji]

In my own honest opinion, SEGA finally realized what this game needed.

If this keeps up, we'll most likely have more bosses like this one in the future. Man, this battle was so awesome, it's awoken my love for PSO2 anew.

[Skyly]

This the plate on his chest break able?

[omgwtflolbbl]

Got some random 10* and a 10* arm unit that I have no clue what it is.

If I didn't have the free half doll from wherever I got it, we might have wiped lol.

Edit: What are the new stones or whatever that drop for?

[Xaeris]

0 minute mark: "Oh this guy looks awesome, it's go time!"

3 minute mark: "Ha ha wow, he's sturdy. Good, this is crazy fun!"

8 minute mark: "Huh, wow, they really took off the kid gloves for this one. Good, good..."

13 minute mark: "This is getting obnoxious."

16 minute mark: "ffs, die already!"

20 minute mark: "Diediediediediediediediiiiiieeeeee!"

22 minute mark: "Oh my ****ing Christ, finally."

That about sums up my experience.

[infiniteeverlasting]

Curious what the new 10 stars are, mind for some screens?

[Skyly]

Got some random 10* and a 10* arm unit that I have no clue what it is.

If I didn't have the free half doll from wherever I got it, we might have wiped lol.

Edit: What are the new stones or whatever that drop for?

New stones for 11*'s

[Aurorra]

This the plate on his chest break able?

Don't think it's breakable, but at one point it will open allowing you to hit the core inside.

[dr apocalipsis]

Ship 2 failing at 93%, then over 20 minutes falz, and some retard cancelled pic scene to break crystal before I was able to use booster.

So much fail on ship2.

[SPOILER-BOX]http://i.imgur.com/oozHE8f.jpg [/SPOILER-BOX]

[musicmf]

Oh right a couple things I forgot!

- When Luther was leaving lava on the ground, zomg it really shows who can pay attention and adapt to the fight, and who facerolls their keyboard. So many people in my MPA were just standing around being burned to death. Not wasting moons on you morons!

- The miniboss before Luther... Was it just me, or did his attack pattern change as it got closer to Luther time? I could swear in the 5~8 fights I did on him, he never did this giant AoE ice, or Spinning Laser. But all of a sudden... O_o Caught me off guard.

[Shinamori]

That why I use boosters when he has little health.

[Raymee]

wow, Jenny Talia

best name ever xd

[mctastee]

Don't think it's breakable, but at one point it will open allowing you to hit the core inside.

Just got done doing this with AIDA, according to her one of the tips says if you break the shoulder blades, it opens up the core.

[Aurorra]

Oh right a couple things I forgot!
- The miniboss before Luther... Was it just me, or did his attack pattern change as it got closer to Luther time? I could swear in the 5~8 fights I did on him, he never did this giant AoE ice, or Spinning Laser. But all of a sudden... O_o Caught me off guard.

Yeah, it seems like the first 10 minutes are lightning, second 10 are ice, and last 10 are fire.

[Kikikiki]

This feels like a form of TD, because they also give out titles and such, and the loot system is kinda similar.

[Rakurai]

I'm surprised by how durable both of the bosses were despite how gunner/braver heavy the groups were and multiple weak bullet users being present.

I honestly didn't mind Loser taking as long to kill as he did (13 minutes or so), because he has enough variety in attacks to keep it from getting dull, unlike pretty much every other boss in the game.

And yeah. You need to button mash to get out of the time stop. That or be a Braver with lol Katana Combat which ignores it completely if it's active when it happens.

[oratank]

i solo the flying egg no normal with hunter and can't break his fucking shield wtf was that

[gigawuts]

So it sounds like Sega's attempt to combat people running falz 3+ times is to just give him a shithouse of hp.

[Skyly]

To not get 1 shot by loser just save your PB blast and hold it as if you're gonna use it for a chain.

[Arialle]

Time stop move can be easily countered...

mash movement keys to break out of it ...kill off one of the 4 swords and hide in that corner...that area where the sword was broken wont be hit by it

it only took me 1 shunka to destroy one

[Chdata]

I think you get frozen longer the closer you are to the center.

also http://i.imgur.com/3DsUIDH.png

[Rakurai]

So it sounds like Sega's attempt to combat people running falz 3+ times is to just give him a shithouse of hp.

I could see two runs being doable once people get used to the fight, but three seems kind of unlikely.

[gigawuts]

I don't care what its HP is (no, I haven't run it yet), but I have full faith that people will manage 3 runs. If people can get 5 runs of TD, people can get 3 runs of this.

[Rakurai]

It took a little over 20 minutes for the kill I was on.

There was gunners, bravers, and weak bullets aplenty, and his core got exposed four times throughout the fight.

[omgwtflolbbl]

To not get 1 shot by loser just save your PB blast and hold it as if you're gonna use it for a chain.

Yeah, just save PB for if you can't break a sword.

The attack itself lasts a pretty long time so just keep holding it. The first time, I let go of it in the middle of the attack (thought it was over) and died anyway lol.

Edit: Which Fi stance should you use? I wasn't really paying attention to how my damage output was depending on location. Is it like Elder where the whole stage is one stance, or does it actually change depending on where you are in relation to him?

[Yden]

Oh right a couple things I forgot!

- When Luther was leaving lava on the ground, zomg it really shows who can pay attention and adapt to the fight, and who facerolls their keyboard. So many people in my MPA were just standing around being burned to death. Not wasting moons on you morons!

- The miniboss before Luther... Was it just me, or did his attack pattern change as it got closer to Luther time? I could swear in the 5~8 fights I did on him, he never did this giant AoE ice, or Spinning Laser. But all of a sudden... O_o Caught me off guard.

The lava thing is pretty bullshit if you're in TPS mode since it's hard to see the ones come from behind you since you're that much more zoomed in.

[SakoHaruo]

GJ Sega. I'll stay quiet until we learn how to speed run Loser.

[Rakurai]

The lava is a joke for gunners and dagger users to deal with, since they can just stay off the ground forever.

Everyone else isn't so lucky.

[FireswordRus]

2440 strike damage from time freeze attack
avoidable with PB

[Aine]

First run took 14 minutes, second and third runs took less than 10, so four is doable. If we can figure out how to force him to open up his weakpoints then we can get into 5~ run territory.

[Rakurai]

I'm curious as to what percentage everyone managed to reach before the Loser fight came up.

Ship 6 only made it to around 85%, which is a long way off from the max of 200% (And the drop rate bonus). Considering how many blocks were full, I'm thinking they might've made it a little too hard to raise.

[fay]

There is no such thing as too hard, personally. It just means you need to get better to rise to the challenge.

I remember everyone complained about Dark Souls when it first came out. Everyone was screaming about how hard it was, but people stuck at it, got better and loved it.

[Xaeris]

Ship 2 was around 93% I believe.

[Titan]

I'm curious as to what percentage everyone managed to reach before the Loser fight came up.

Ship 6 only made it to around 85%, which is a long way off from the max of 200% (And the drop rate bonus). Considering how many blocks were full, I'm thinking they might've made it a little too hard to raise.

I always see complaints about difficulty the first day. Then, 2 months down the year, these same people will complain that its too easy. Just go with it for now and see what its like later on.

[omgwtflolbbl]

It's too early to wonder if it's too hard, I think. People need to be able to figure out what to do first.

The first Apostle group I was in actually failed to destroy the arm/bomb things lol even though it was super obvious what to do. Every group I was in after that wrecked them immediately.

Also, the rainbow jewels or whatever he sports are FABULOUS.

[Rakurai]

Does Panic do anything to the Apos?

It's so aggressive and mobile that it's hard to get a decent chance to attack it for long outside of the stun when its ultimate attack is interrupted, which naturally prolongs its death.

[Yden]

Ship 10 got to around 90%

[Tyreek]

Does Panic do anything to the Apos?

It's so aggressive and mobile that it's hard to get a decent chance to attack it for long outside of the stun when its ultimate attack is interrupted, which naturally prolongs its death.

It makes it stumble. Happened twice in a run. And I also heard confirmation that Loser is vulnerable to Mirage.

[TaigaUC]

The 25 minute Loser fight I was in was half EN, and it was our first time, so I'm pretty certain that it's possible to get much lower times.

I don't think the new encounters are that hard (especially not as a Gunner with Guld Mira), just kinda long.
I only died a few times in total, mostly because I'm tired and can't see the screen properly.

Not a big fan of the Loser designs (still prefer PSO1 Falz), but the environments are really nice.

[pkemr4]

i can only imagine how bad B20 did.

[Melodys]

Does anyone have strategies where to aim for/use wb on both bosses? For the first boss, I think it was tail and then body. After that, the boss' belly when it has flipped over after the pillars are destroyed. Then, the body again.

For Loser, I think it's the upper arm, the glass around its head when it lowers and then the core? I'm not too sure.

[nathanielzor]

i can only imagine how bad B20 did.
Dear god, I'm sure they got party wiped in 5 minutes.

[Dugs]

My first was... well, we beat the guy despite not knowing what we were doing.

Second? Worst time I ever had playing this game, 3 people left in like the first 5 minutes and 9 people wasn't enough to beat him, just get into music change.

I'm still pissed.

[fay]

Dear god, I'm sure they got party wiped in 5 minutes.

Probably not. You have to remember. Even the lobby dancing bad B20 players think they're better than the average B20 person as well, so they move to other blocks as well. Actually, I have a theory that B20 might not even be that bad. All the B20 people move to another block so when the rest are full, B20 fills with actual good players.

[Z-0]

It doesn't, trust me. B20 doesn't even get 3 run TD1s (or didn't, when I ran it there a month ago). Got to 3rd run with a couple of friends and we were 5/12, lol.

[gigawuts]

I'm pretty sure I was the only ranger in my luther run, and I didn't know what to do so I just kept weak bulleting the arms. On the rare occasion I was in front of him when his core was exposed I weak bulleted that, but usually I wasn't. I don't know what breaks and what doesn't, so I mean...I just kept WBing stuff that looked like it might. Most of the time the WB reverted to the same central point on the arms, but I'm pretty sure things did break on them so I'll have to find out what the deal there is.

I got a nice and clean chunk of 192k experience at the end though, between my 50% exp booster and 100% tribooster.

[Kantalope]

Probably not. You have to remember. Even the lobby dancing bad B20 players think they're better than the average B20 person as well, so they move to other blocks as well. Actually, I have a theory that B20 might not even be that bad. All the B20 people move to another block so when the rest are full, B20 fills with actual good players.

I assure you, this is not the case. I recently came back played only b20 eqs until a couple days ago. I was amazed at how fast SH arms died on other blocks. Never again, b20.

[WildarmsRE5]

i can only imagine how bad B20 did.


Dear god, I'm sure they got party wiped in 5 minutes.they didn't get wiped according to my teammate who always AFKs in B-20.

they got timed out. LOOOOOOOOOOOOOL

[ShinKai]

My first game was a wash, the entire mpa pretty much left 5 minutes in.

And then my second game, our one and only WB user dropped early. ;_; Y u do dis?

That said, somehow we finished my first Byrd Falz with almost no time to spare after using a Half Doll. That was amazing. This boss is long as heck, but I like it.

A photo finish, when the mpa doesn't give up, even when the chips are down. This is a good day.

[Yden]

Hmm can you force a victory pose using that 3 tab in chat settings?

[Xaelouse]

why are people leaving in the middle of the fight? what is going on over on that ship
Everyone stays till the very end here

[Aine]

First form - Break his arm, and he'll start regenerating the armour on it. During this time you can climb on the arm to hit the shoulder (although you can reach it by jumping normally). If you break the shoulder before he finishes regenerating he sinks down and you can hit the core on his head. You should be able to do enough damage to send him to his second form.

Second form - Spam Sazan on his stomach-plate, and it will open up when Mirage procs. Then apply WB and spam Shunka.

Strategy for the second form is kinda haphazard, but with this you can beat him in under 6 minutes.

[Chdata]

why are people leaving in the middle of the fight? what is going on over on that ship
Everyone stays till the very end here

Lots of people not being able to beat him before the game completely times out.

[nathanielzor]

Probably not. You have to remember. Even the lobby dancing bad B20 players think they're better than the average B20 person as well, so they move to other blocks as well. Actually, I have a theory that B20 might not even be that bad. All the B20 people move to another block so when the rest are full, B20 fills with actual good players.
No trust me, it is literally that bad. The newer English players don't know theres actually blocks for specific things, such as B10-14 being SH blocks, etc etc. I do MPAs in B20 occasionally when I'm bored and feel like carrying people through stuff. But they are down right atrociously horrible. They're the type of people that don't even know what JA is.

[Aine]

why are people leaving in the middle of the fight? what is going on over on that ship
Everyone stays till the very end here

There's a bug where you can't see Falz at all, you don't take any damage from his attacks and you can't attack him. So either you stand around until everyone else beats him, or you leave.

[Chdata]

That's been happening to me a lot. Wild Easter? Ringahda doesn't spawn. You do see a frozen version of his in-game model but you can't interact. I've also had TD with no visible Goldrahdas.

[oratank]

^
redownload patch form 4/23 that's 3gigs patch

[Sizustar]

why are people leaving in the middle of the fight? what is going on over on that ship
Everyone stays till the very end here

Some people seems to have PC that can't show everything that Loser is doing, and they get disconnect it seems.
Happened to a few teamate, till they turned down effect.

[Dammy]

Please, call him "Luther", not "Loser", thank you.

[Z-0]

ダークファルス【敗者】 is Dark Falz [Loser]. It cannot be translated as Dark Falz [Luther].

If you want to be fancy, call him Dark Falz [Vanquished] or Dark Falz [Defeated] or something like that.

I will say that the soul is "Luther Soul", though, not "Loser Soul".

edit: I haven't actually played the quest because I woke up late and had to patch, so I don't know if the Kanji is used in the quest itself.
edit2: been told the katakana is used in the quest, so it is actually Dark Falz Luther (cuz it's ダークファルス・ルーサー, not ダークファルス・ルーザー). It's like how Elder has the name Dark Falz [Colossus] or something like that, I forgot.

[reaper527]

on the 7am run, finished with my first char in about 25 minutes, finished with my 2nd in about 16 (and i had 17 minutes of 250% rare boost, 100% triboost going in, and came out with the 11* bow and some cubes).

on the 9am run, i wound up in a god awful mp for his first stage, (ended up dropping a little after 10 minutes in after the mp dropped to 8/12), got the normal 5 minute kill, but when i switched chars all the pc sh blocks were full (lowest open block was block 27 or 28, which ever is the taco block) and it was only 5-10% full. wound up in a vita block, and we quickly went from 12/12 to 11/12 (within the first minute or two) and the proceeded to time out. didn't even get to try with my 2nd char.

i think the kill time will go down drastically once it's figured out how to expose his cores.

[MidCap]

This fight, including the Ebon Winged Warrior, solidifies Automate Halfline HU as the superior build. It's a slog that requires longevity.

Also, Territory Burst FO/TE is very helpful here. You actually get down to the point of needing heals from someone else (for the first time in the game's history), and it's beautiful.

Cleared my first run with 4 minutes left. It was a hell of a fight.

Didn't have time to do a 2nd run because of stupid work =/

[btw-Niji]

Dark Falz "Loser" has to be the dumbest translation I've seen so far.

Well done.

[Kikikiki]

I don't have the event tabled so I'll just take it from the video and

http://puu.sh/8CVoZ.png

[敗者] ~ [Loser]

However, the voice still reads [ルーサー] ~ [Luther]

Might have been a pun by SEGA, I don't know Japanese culture that well, I don't know why they would do that because they're spelled completely differently.

Anyway, goddamn, Swords need to get that PA next.

[Gardios]

They've been doing the same with Elder, text says 【巨躯】, but they pronounce it as Elder. On top of that, Luther/Loser is a wordplay in Japanese.

If he's called ダークファルス・ルーサー though we should just stick with "Luther".

[Terrence]

Truly magnificent. Finally a REAL Boss ! :-D

[btw-Niji]

[敗者] can also mean:
[(The) Defeated]
[Vanquished]

As always, lazy translation.

[Kondibon]

[敗者] can also mean:
[(The) Defeated]
[Vanquished]

As always, lazy translation.Isn't it a pun? It's difficult to translate a pun while still keeping the meaning and connotations.

[Meteor Weapon]

They might be using Loser on purpose, similar concept with Lucifer and some shit and giggles. Not that I know anything about it.

Well we're probably just overananalyzing it. Loser or not, he still kicks our ass left and right.

[Ezodagrom]

[敗者] can also mean:
[(The) Defeated]
[Vanquished]

As always, lazy translation.
Cutscene from after the fight, so for those that aren't at MB16 yet, this contains spoilers.

[spoiler-box]The name appears in kanji in the text, but he says "ruusa", or something like that.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d1BwbTD3ZxM#t=2m57s
[/spoiler-box]

[DJcooltrainer]

I'm kinda surprised how long he takes to take down, it's really fun. Though, it was super laggy this morning and I got killed a few times from attacks I couldn't see. I'm sure it'll get better as it becomes less popular.

It was more challenging that I expected, which is a good thing.

[Vampy]

I am happy with it and sure any run can be speed run. The difference is this guy actually puts up a fight and does not have blatantly obvious weakpoints you have to work to get them.

[Boltzmann]

Isn't it a pun? It's difficult to translate a pun while still keeping the meaning and connotations.
I thought that too. Correct me if I'm mistaken, but can't it be considered an instance of gikun? In that they tack some reading onto a written word because the two are related in meaning, even if the reading is incompatible with the readings of the components of the written word?

[Kondibon]

I thought that too. Correct me if I'm mistaken, but can't it be considered an instance of gikun? In that they tack some reading onto a written word because the two are related in meaning, even if the reading is incompatible with the readings of the components of the written word?That's what I was thinking of, though I didn't know what it was called until now. :P

Given that if you put Loser into google translate you get 敗者, I think they back translated it to find Kanji that had that definition.

[Alenoir]

Luther/Loser

It's a word pun, yeah. You got to know about that during story quest, which I think it made a lot of Japanese players laugh or facepalm or something. Story spoiler: It may also refer to him being a "fake"/non-pure Dark Falz or something, since Kugyuu...Double mentioned how he was imitating them.

[Kamekur]

I kinda wanted an actual boss in pso2. And sega gave it to us, which I'm really happy with it. I just hope people don't complain about him being too hard and nerf him >: .

[GosamerWings]

So glad he just doesn't roll over and die. It feels me with joy to see people running out of mates, running low on moons, and running for their life from hits.

30 second bosses no thanks, (although I'm sure as people get things down it will get faster). But in no way should we be fighting 15-20 of the first form like hands in 30 mins. 5 -7 seems more reasonable, with the last fight taking about 15 mins +.

I really felt the epic as I jumped around in the air following his every move as a dagger Hu/Fi, and when he fell over break out the fists for some God fist action. Not just walk in portal, wb, smash face against weak point, run to teleporter refresh.

The tohou dodge section while smashing totems was a nice add in as well.

If a nerf in any way is thrown at his I feel only the percentage to get higher drop rates (100 should boost rate).

This was the first boss (besides seabed), that made me appreciate my Daggers. 10/10 fun will run again :)


I kinda wanted an actual boss in pso2. And sega gave it to us, which I'm really happy with it. I just hope people don't complain about him being too hard and nerf him >: .

Lets hope the only true nerf he will get is people at higher level fighting lower versions.

[gigawuts]

[敗者] can also mean:
[(The) Defeated]
[Vanquished]

As always, lazy translation.

The best I've seen is Dark Falz Fallen.

He had such high goals (apparently godhood), but he settled for being the Profound Darkness's bitch after we wiped the transparent space photon floor with him.

So people are trying to say it's a pun, and that's okay I guess, but it's still a terrible name. Fallen, Lost, Defeated, all of it is better than "Loser."

[omgwtflolbbl]

Currently running it on ship 10 right now. While I was fine running it the two EQs this morning on ship 2, I just had 2 runs in a row where I couldn't see the apostles. In the first run, there was at least one other person there who couldn't, and another flat out left that run at the start, it was basically 9/12 with me and the other guy running around throwing moons and stuff. It was kind of sad... the second run, I just simply restarted my client.

Edit: Relogging at least let me see the apostles and stuff, but I couldn't see like half the projectiles or the lava. Super buggy.

[Rakurai]

Luther/Loser

It's a word pun, yeah. You got to know about that during story quest, which I think it made a lot of Japanese players laugh or facepalm or something. Story spoiler: It may also refer to him being a "fake"/non-pure Dark Falz or something, since Kugyuu...Double mentioned how he was imitating them.

Well, I guess that would explain how Regias was able to just murder him so easily.

[Kondibon]

So people are trying to say it's a pun, and that's okay I guess, but it's still a terrible name. Fallen, Lost, Defeated, all of it is better than "Loser."Well it IS a pun. I don't think anyone is trying to deny it sounds really dumb though. This is why puns are so hard to translate.

[Rakurai]

Well, it seems like Mirage turns him into a joke, as the clock weak point becomes exposed permanently if you damage it enough.

I just hope that none of his good drops are tied to the crystals on his cloak, because I know a lot of people will probably be too lazy to bother breaking them.

[oratank]

Well, it seems like Mirage turns him into a joke, as the clock weak point becomes exposed permanently if you damage it enough.

I just hope that none of his good drops are tied to the crystals on his cloak, because I know a lot of people will probably be too lazy to bother breaking them.

this is bad(´・ω・`)

[Mysterious-G]

Well, it seems like Mirage turns him into a joke, as the clock weak point becomes exposed permanently if you damage it enough.

[spoiler-box]http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-ut5RqJ2dyb4/UXuRQU_QmWI/AAAAAAAALcw/5l_1qUwwnVY/s1600/black-kid-crying.gif[/spoiler-box]

[KiddKon]

I honestly thought he was quite fun, similar to how I felt when I first fought Falz Angel. That Time Stop attack was easier to dodge then I expected, looking forward to more tomorrow!!! Apos is just so....OP, especially that shield.

[gigawuts]

My new Mirage V Egg Blasters are a go.

[Cyron Tanryoku]

so what does new falz drop

anything of interest for ranger or gunner?

[Rakurai]

People are currently too braindead to bother attacking the crystals once his weak point is exposed, as I predicted they would be.

I'm guessing that's probably where the dozens of grinders come from, because he didn't drop any on either of two runs I did just now.


so what does new falz drop

anything of interest for ranger or gunner?

There's a new 11* launcher with the same latent as Niren Kamui, but that's pretty much it.

[gigawuts]

The Red Scorpio has PP slayer and it is amazing and I want it, ranger equippable only.

[LordKaiser]

it's on right now but B16 don't fills up so I may never do it. Will have to w8 till 2 am...

[Vintasticvin]

I have yet to play DF2 but it sounds to me more like ruusa than losa

[DJcooltrainer]

I have yet to play DF2 but it sounds to me more like ruusa than losa

There's discrepancies in the way it's written and the way it's pronounced. I'm not sure if this is laziness on Sega's behalf, or some kind of terrible word pun. I'm just going to keep calling him Luther... always and forever.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xm4wAmsGyN0

[Rakurai]

Japanese doesn't have a proper "L" sound, so they just use a "R" sound instead.

[Zeik2006]

Ok, what's up with the % and Timer at the top of the screen.

[DJcooltrainer]

Japanese doesn't have a proper "L" sound, so they just use a "R" sound instead.

Right, but they use the katana "ルーサー", which could really be interpreted as Luther or Loser. Tie that in with the fact that the Kanji used (敗者) means Vanquished/Fallen (or whatever other word you want to use), I could see how someone would draw the conclusion that it's "Loser" and not "Luther". Jenglish words can be wonderfully confusing like that.

To me, Luther also seems like an add choice of name. Why would they name an evil boss after the dude who started the Protestant Reformation? Or an R&B singer? It's not exactly a sinister sounding name.

[Z-0]

ルーサー cannot be Loser, because ルーザー is Loser.
Katakana is done purely by pronunciation, and the word "Loser" uses a Z sound.

[Reiketsu]

Right, but they use the katana "ルーサー", which could really be interpreted as Luther or Loser. Tie that in with the fact that the Kanji used means Vanquished/Fallen (or whatever other word you want to use), I could see how someone would draw the conclusion that it's "Loser" and not "Luther". Jenglish words can be wonderfully confusing like that.

ルーサー is Luther.
ルーザー would be Loser.

They pronounce it as the former. So it's pronounced Dark Falz Luther.
They obviously made a pun here with the meaning of the Kanji and Luther and Loser sounding almost similar but if you go purely by pronounciation, it's definitely Luther.

Edit: Bleh... I need to stop taking forever to check if the spelling in my posts is correct.

[Unnamed Player]

エヴァレカーサ got Zero Effort.
[SPOILER-BOX]http://mmoloda.com/pso2/image/32520.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]

[BIG OLAF]

I know that these Shunka-spamming pieces of shit can go rot in a hole somewhere. The Braver nerf can't come soon enough. WTB Weak Bullet, holy shit. Boy, would that make the new Falz a lot easier.

[The_Brimada]

My new Mirage V Egg Blasters are a go.

Lol I made a Mirage V Rescue gun. Also finally got to do and clear it on my main. Was a cakewalk thanks to mirage(and wb)... too bad I didn't even do Apos Dorios on my alt this time.

[Arksenth]

Boo, can't try this since I'm overseas for a few weeks.

Any interesting new wands? Or did TE get shafted again?

[gigawuts]

This fight should not have a time limit.

Bad parties are inevitable. Not everyone plans ahead or should be expected to plan ahead in a casual game like this. Picking up and just going for an EQ is the norm.

Pretty soon players will see no rangers in the MPA and just drop, leaving idiots who don't look at that shit with 8/12 MPAs, and considering that's probably the majority of the playerbase Sega better fix this shit up.

I'm cool with missing a second run due to a bad draw, that's the nature of pugging. Losing my boosters - also okay. Not completing at all, while the victory music has been playing for 10 minutes? Ok no, remove the time limit or raise it to an hour to give the bads a chance.

[Gardios]

Fought him for the first time now, he seems pretty fun. For once, I didn't feel completely useless with Guard Stance! Too bad his more damaging attacks deal tech damage, though...


Boo, can't try this since I'm overseas for a few weeks.

Any interesting new wands? Or did TE get shafted again?
+40% dmg to Darkers wand.


This fight should not have a time limit.

Bad parties are inevitable. Not everyone plans ahead or should be expected to plan ahead in a casual game like this. Picking up and just going for an EQ is the norm.

Pretty soon players will see no rangers in the MPA and just drop, leaving idiots who don't look at that shit with 8/12 MPAs, and considering that's probably the majority of the playerbase Sega better fix this shit up.
I wish they would nerf Weak Bullet already (and consequently lower his HP). <_<

[DJcooltrainer]

ルーサー cannot be Loser, because ルーザー is Loser.
Katakana is done purely by pronunciation, and the word "Loser" uses a Z sound.

I suppose what I mean is that people with different accents put different emphasis on different sounds. Where I live (General American/Newscaster accent), there's a little more emphasis on the hard "S" sound in the word loser, so it sounds less like a Z and more like an S and Z smashed together.

But, the name "Luther" is written out as "ルーザー", which is the spelling used in the story quests.

But again... why the name Luther? Was it picked solely because it sounds like the word loser? The only people that come to mind when I hear the name are a Protestant reformist, a civil rights activist, and an R&B singer.

[Dnd]

This fight should not have a time limit.

Pretty soon players will see no rangers in the MPA and just drop, leaving idiots who don't look at that shit with 8/12 MPAs, and considering that's probably the majority of the playerbase Sega better fix this shit up.

I agree, while I haven't failed due to time limit, I know alot of people who have and, while I think 30 minutes is enough in most cases, its unfair for people to sit through a marathon-ass fight and get 95% of the required damage just to fail...

Also, abandoning quest should drop your flag for being a prick >_>;

[Rakurai]

Is there some way to skip the victory screen?

I don't like having to sit around with my Vraolet equipped once Falz's HP is very low in order to avoid having untekked drops due to some moron breaking the crystal before everyone is ready.

[Dnd]

Fought him for the first time now, he seems pretty fun. For once, I didn't feel completely useless with Guard Stance! Too bad his more damaging attacks deal tech damage, though...



+40% dmg to Darkers wand.
Damage reduction
[SPOILER-BOX]http://imageshack.com/a/img838/5072/unxk.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]

[DJcooltrainer]

I enjoy the time limit, personally. A higher chance of losing makes me enjoy playing that much more. If I'm pretty much guaranteed a win, how much fun is that? The uncertainty of victory is half of the fun.... right?

[BIG OLAF]

The uncertainty of victory is half of the fun.... right?

No, not right at all in this case. Why should other people be punished for being dropped in a party full of shit players? If it takes longer, then whatever. But, if you plain ol' can't finish the run because of something out of your control, then...

[Gardios]

Damage reduction
[SPOILER-BOX]http://imageshack.com/a/img838/5072/unxk.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]
Oh, it's reduction? Should've figured, so much additional damage would've been way too good.

I want it even more now though. lol

[Maenara]

I wish they would nerf Weak Bullet already (and consequently lower his HP). <_<

Apos Dorios has a chance to reflect any weakbullet used on it onto a random person in the MPA. It's pretty hilarious.

[Rakurai]

Damage reduction
[SPOILER-BOX]http://imageshack.com/a/img838/5072/unxk.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]

A pity such a nice looking wand had to have such a mediocre latent.

All of the other Loser themed weapons have the same latent, as well.

[Zeik2006]

Apos Dorios has a chance to reflect any weakbullet used on it onto a random person in the MPA. It's pretty hilarious.

WELP

That explains why I would randomly get hit with WB. Was terribly confused as to what was causing it.

[gigawuts]

I enjoy the time limit, personally. A higher chance of losing makes me enjoy playing that much more. If I'm pretty much guaranteed a win, how much fun is that? The uncertainty of victory is half of the fun.... right?

In your opinion maybe. The fight and items are the fun part. When I rely on 11 other people to not be idiots I don't want quests to run out of time because they've got diarrhea for brains.

[Goukezitsu]

This fight should not have a time limit.

Bad parties are inevitable. Not everyone plans ahead or should be expected to plan ahead in a casual game like this. Picking up and just going for an EQ is the norm.

Pretty soon players will see no rangers in the MPA and just drop, leaving idiots who don't look at that shit with 8/12 MPAs, and considering that's probably the majority of the playerbase Sega better fix this shit up.

I'm cool with missing a second run due to a bad draw, that's the nature of pugging. Losing my boosters - also okay. Not completing at all, while the victory music has been playing for 10 minutes? Ok no, remove the time limit or raise it to an hour to give the bads a chance.


Nah. The bads need to stop being bad. If there's nothing to challenge a player, they will never see the need to improve. TD and this are finally some incentive to do that and to show players maybe they should stop dressing up and learn how to play (or at least do both at the same time haha).

Now lets get some non EQ content like this and we're all set!

[LordKaiser]

Well it seems it shoots waves of dark energy from the hole of it's swords when he splash them on the middle making some sort of cross. I still have problems when he begins to teleport like crazy. when he's calmed and you destroy 1 arm it begins to radiate evil energy so I gess that if you destroy the other hand it exposes the core? Sorry people but I'm not good at this. I went out with 0 items...... I need to practice more at evading everything...

[DJcooltrainer]

No, not right at all in this case. Why should other people be punished for being dropped in a party full of shit players? If it takes longer, then whatever. But, if you plain ol' can't finish the run because of something out of your control, then...

I see where you're coming from, it is kinda BS when people drop out in the middle of the MPA. Kinda like when you see people drop out during wave 4 of a completely salvageable TD run :/

At the same time, if there was no time limit on the fight, I don't think I would enjoy it nearly as much as I do. My adrenaline was pumping during the first run this morning when we cleared with only a few minutes to spare. The thought of actually being able to fail made it a little more fun, at least to me.

[Rakurai]

I'm kind of surprised that my ship managed to reach 100% before Falz came up, despite the low number of players online. I could see 200% realistically happening in the peak hours.

I guess they just had to get used to fighting Apos Dorios.

[Aurorra]

Apos Dorios has a chance to reflect any weakbullet used on it onto a random person in the MPA. It's pretty hilarious.

I don't think he's reflecting it, that's just an attack he does. A red spherical rune will appear around players being targeted by it, you think need to avoid the small laser blast he shoots you with a just guard or something similar.

[gigawuts]

Nah. The bads need to stop being bad. If there's nothing to challenge a player, they will never see the need to improve. TD and this are finally some incentive to do that and to show players maybe they should stop dressing up and learn how to play (or at least do both at the same time haha).

Now lets get some non EQ content like this and we're all set!

This is an amusingly closed-minded stance.

The thought that bad players should and will get better at a casual game where 99% of content is pick-up-and-go, combined with the reality that instead of improving they merely disperse into blocks populated with a typically higher ratio of good players, is so laughably disconnected from reality that I don't even know how to followup.

Yes, bad players should get better, because this will A. totally happen and B. help those of us who unluck into MPAs with them in the meantime.

Way to be unhelpful.

[Gardios]

Nah. The bads need to stop being bad. If there's nothing to challenge a player, they will never see the need to improve. TD and this are finally some incentive to do that and to show players maybe they should stop dressing up and learn how to play (or at least do both at the same time haha).

Now lets get some non EQ content like this and we're all set!

From what I've seen, it's not even bad players, it's bad parties. If you don't have Weak Bullet bots in your party, might as well try another one.

[gigawuts]

From what I've seen, it's not even bad players, it's bad parties. If you don't have Weak Bullet bots in your party, might as well try another one.

Party composition is indeed the greater evil here, and I've agreed with the stance that WB needs a nerf since the beginning, but somehow I don't quite think Mr Blizzaxe in my last MPA was pulling his weight.

I could get it if Weak Bullet was on other classes, but tying something like that to 1 class is just ugh.

[Maenara]

I don't think he's reflecting it, that's just an attack he does. A red spherical rune will appear around players being targeted by it, you think need to avoid the small laser blast he shoots you with a just guard or something similar.

No. That is definitely a weak bullet reticule:
[spoiler-box]http://i.imgur.com/FCQoeb1.png[/spoiler-box]

I used weakbullet a lot of times, and a fair amount of them never showed up.

[gigawuts]

No. That is definitely a weak bullet reticule:
[spoiler-box]http://i.imgur.com/FCQoeb1.png[/spoiler-box]

I used weakbullet a lot of times, and a fair amount of them never showed up.

He has a special attack that WBs, like goldrahdas can. I'm not saying you're wrong, just that there is indeed an attack he has that he can seemingly use regardless of his own WB status.

[musicmf]

No. That is definitely a weak bullet reticule:
[spoiler-box]http://i.imgur.com/FCQoeb1.png[/spoiler-box]

I used weakbullet a lot of times, and a fair amount of them never showed up.

Maybe your missing, the part is breaking, or its being overwritten in a location your not looking.
He marks (4?) players with a reticule (I believe to the players doing the most damage, like Elder Meteors), then fires semi-homing tiny-dark-arrows at those players. If they are hit Weak Bullet appears on them. He's not reflecting anything.

--------------

I agree that time limit shouldn't screw people out of victory. While I haven't failed by time limit yet, the limit should be people's moon atomizers and skill, not lacking Rangers or people quitting.

Btw, anyone notice that your booster items don't count down in the pre-Luther waiting room? Why aren't all emergency quests with a wait to them like this so people don't hide in the campship until the teleport starts?

============

My second go at Luther went a lot better. Played FO/TE this time and stuck him with mirage to open his core. He dropped MUCH quicker then just playing Braver and attacking the arms.

[Kietsu]

Terrible Br/Ra here. Just ran the EQ for the first time and spent much of it running around wondering where the hell do I land my weak bullets?

Apos Doritos (which has more than one moveset apparently and that's really cool) seemed to have vulnerable spots on its shoulders (which the Shunka half of the party can't reach) and on its tail (which did seem to work decently) - is there any point in going for all the little arms?

Bird Falz is like the most complicated fight we've had so far, and I still can't quite wrap my head around it. From what I could figure out:

- Breaking the arm guards makes him fall on said arm and start going all chargey-energy with it. Are we supposed to go for the glowing upper arm section in this case in order to expose his weak point?

- If he gets Mirage'd, you dump a weak bullet in his clock and hope the rest of the party notices.

- I have no idea what to do during the dual-swords blue mode or lol teleporting red mode.

- Eventually he starts floating with half his body through the floor, ala Phantasy Star Portable's version of Olga Flow. I know you can start killing all the little crystals during that segment, but where's the weak spot, exactly? I was assuming it was the spot under his beak, but that seems to deflect attacks half the time.

Edit:

Btw, anyone notice that your booster items don't count down in the pre-Luther waiting room? Why aren't all emergency quests with a wait to them like this so people don't hide in the campship until the teleport starts?

The other Falz and similar EQs already do this as well, don't know about Varder / Easter ones.

[Cyron Tanryoku]

i want to do male model walk for the congrats screen

but the game wont let me

[Lego]

Finished within 15 min. his clock was exposed around 5 min. No idea how. Somebody was saying to spam Sazan so i guess mirage?

Oh and I would die soo many times without Guld Milla. Thank you blue gun!

[Gardios]

Party composition is indeed the greater evil here, and I've agreed with the stance that WB needs a nerf since the beginning, but somehow I don't quite think Mr Blizzaxe in my last MPA was pulling his weight.

Oh my god, I feel so sorry for your party. =/

[musicmf]

Terrible Br/Ra here. Just ran the EQ for the first time and spent much of it running around wondering where the hell do I land my weak bullets?

Apos Doritos (which has more than one moveset apparently and that's really cool) seemed to have vulnerable spots on its shoulders (which the Shunka half of the party can't reach) and on its tail (which did seem to work decently) - is there any point in going for all the little arms?

Bird Falz is like the most complicated fight we've had so far, and I still can't quite wrap my head around it. From what I could figure out:

- Breaking the arm guards makes him fall on said arm and start going all chargey-energy with it. Are we supposed to go for the glowing upper arm section in this case in order to expose his weak point?

- If he gets Mirage'd, you dump a weak bullet in his clock and hope the rest of the party notices.

- I have no idea what to do during the dual-swords blue mode or lol teleporting red mode.

- Eventually he starts floating with half his body through the floor, ala Phantasy Star Portable's version of Olga Flow. I know you can start killing all the little crystals during that segment, but where's the weak spot, exactly? I was assuming it was the spot under his beak, but that seems to deflect attacks half the time.

Edit:


The other Falz and similar EQs already do this as well, don't know about Varder / Easter ones.

IMO (Although, I don't play RA main) on the Apos the Tail and Stomach are the two main points to weakpoint.

The tail is a much easier target, you can lock onto it easily, and breaking it reduces tail size so his attacks with its tail cover less of the map. (Breaking parts might mean more drops? idk)

The core lets you do more damage, but IMO its harder to target the core since its damn 6 hands keep hogging the lockon. IDK whether to just tell people to suck it up and FPS aim on the core (I was doing that as Force when Rangers Weakpointed that) or to break the tiny 6 hands first to make it easier.

When he summons the towers, IMO weak point the two closest to you (But only make sure to leave 1 bullet) to let them break faster.
Then proceed to weakpoint his stomach when he's flipped over.

------

On Luther, IMO break Lower Arm > Upper Arm > Lower Arm > Upper Arm > Core. (Nevermind, apparently just breaking one side opens the core)
If the party is competent and are trying to mirage it, definitely go straight for the Core.

When he's starting his teleport pattern, it can be quite hard IMO for melee to hit the core, so I would just target one of the arms. Probably his left because IIRC he stabs the ground often with that one. Leaving it slightly more vulnerable than his right.

When Luther sinks down and exposes himself, I don't know which you want to pick. His core would yield the better damage, and many people are going to flock to it... But the crystals on his armor are breakable... so it might be worth attacking? If they end up causing good extra drops, IMO break them. If they are useless, go for the core for faster kills.

----

(Oh cool, I thought the only change they did was to start boosters as the quest started to urge people to get out of the campship, I didn't know the boosters never counted down anymore while waiting)

[Goukezitsu]

This is an amusingly closed-minded stance.

The thought that bad players should and will get better at a casual game where 99% of content is pick-up-and-go, combined with the reality that instead of improving they merely disperse into blocks populated with a typically higher ratio of good players, is so laughably disconnected from reality that I don't even know how to followup.

Yes, bad players should get better, because this will A. totally happen and B. help those of us who unluck into MPAs with them in the meantime.

Way to be unhelpful.

So the solution to the bad player problem is to simply brush it aside and baby them into a win and to punish those who actually play the game to test their best gear?

Okay lets take your approach. I'll play. Unlimited time in that same shitty party. Now it takes 1 hour to actually finish. How many people do you think would be complaining about that? More or less? How many people would drop out? How much more of a negative stigma will a bad run have when it could take that long? If you think people drop out now, can you imagine you much they would drop out if they had to sit in a party for an HOUR (which is what you suggested and COULD happen).
Did we improve much? We might have made the minority that fail 30 min runs feel better, but we lose the tension of a good run for the higher end players and the potential detriments of a much longer and still bad run.

Spoon feeding isn't going to do it. They aren't going to get better overnight but they will get better as we teach them strats, help them, and lead by example. You know.... The stuff you are supposed to do in an online community. Threads like the one AIDA(?) posted are a great start to helping those "diarrhea for brains" learn something they didn't know before. Posts like yours are simply rage posts from a failure and your projection of what you think Sega should do when the majority's perception says otherwise.

[Cyber Meteor]

I need to practice how to dodge his slow motion attack with Dive Roll, especially the spinning sword and the double crushing swords which makes large red waves, i get hit multiple time and die frequently with those ones.

On the other hand, it seems that I can manage the general pattern, just need to learn the strategy better to be more effective with Ranger.

[Chdata]

Damn noobs, it's everyone else's fault that we didn't get 6mins so I could falz on 4 alts.

Also how the hell do classes without mirage escape / Katana Combat / Katana Counter / Guld Mila / SROLL even dodge all this crap. Wdf.

[gigawuts]

So the solution to the bad player problem is to simply brush it aside and baby them into a win and to punish those who actually play the game to test their best gear?

Okay lets take your approach. I'll play. Unlimited time in that same shitty party. Now it takes 1 hour to actually finish. How many people do you think would be complaining about that? More or less? How many people would drop out? How much more of a negative stigma will a bad run have when it could take that long? If you think people drop out now, can you imagine you much they would drop out if they had to sit in a party for an HOUR (which is what you suggested and COULD happen).
Did we improve much? We might have made the minority that fail 30 min runs feel better, but we lose the tension of a good run for the higher end players and the potential detriments of a much longer and still bad run.

Spoon feeding isn't going to do it. They aren't going to get better overnight but they will get better as we teach them strats, help them, and lead by example. You know.... The stuff you are supposed to do in an online community. Threads like the one AIDA(?) posted are a great start to helping those "diarrhea for brains" learn something they didn't know before. Posts like yours are simply rage posts from a failure and your projection of what you think Sega should do when the majority's perception says otherwise.

These are people who do not, and probably just can not, think for themselves.

They'll get "better" when we spoon feed them strats, help them, and lead by example - just like everything else that's ever come out in this game. They can not and will not use cognitive skills to figure out anything about the game.

They are idiots. Many of them have played the game since it came out. They are just inherently bad at video games. They don't want to get better. They won't get better. They buy their dances and hats and bikinis, stare at their anime protagonists and disgusting pedobait lolis that the FBI would love to know they fetishize, and stink up every MPA they enter with their shitty inability to do anything that requires two or more buttons correctly. If it's not a dance in a lobby they can't fucking do it right, and even then half the time they can't.

Placing hurdles in front of them won't make them better, it'll just slow every MPA they join down until they're told exactly what to do and how to do it.

They are bad. They were bad. They will continue to be bad. This is because they just plain don't care to be good. If you can't understand why, well, it doesn't really matter that you do. It just matters that you understand that players who are bad exist, and they will continue to be bad. If the only requirement to accessing this quest is reaching level 50 and mooching a single Apos run off of someone else then they will get into the Falz mission. Players who aren't skilled at video games, and aren't interested in becoming skilled at video games, exist. This is a free to play game, these players are a permanent and unchangeable fact.

Maybe if they had to jump a hurdle to get to the Falz mission I could agree, but leveling is a joke.

So, I don't rightly fucking care if these people get loot. I don't give a shit if they get 11*s or if they ~undeservedly~ clear the quest, it's not my prerogative to care about what they do or don't get. It's my prerogative to care what happens to me. When a handful of shitstains enter my MPA and draw out a fight I finished in 20 minutes this morning to actually run out of time because they're all inept and undergeared, through no fault or control of my own, I want shit changed.

[GosamerWings]

No problems in ship 4 -smiles-

First time came down to the last 4 mins

2nd time group did it in 15.

As for 1st form, managed to get in 5 runs.

He doesn't need a nerf, the 100% needs to be removed or lowered in required kills for less populated ships. -shrugs-

(side note no mirage spam used since ship 4 apparently likes braking points. Like on elder where people will use symbol chat for arms to go for XD)

Edit: put block 4 in first sentence, meant ship 4)

[Arksenth]

Damage reduction
[SPOILER-BOX]http://imageshack.com/a/img838/5072/unxk.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]

Every 11 star wand other than Elysion is absolutely worthless.

Whyyyyy SEGA whyyyyy.

[Goukezitsu]

These are people who do not, and probably just can not, think for themselves.

They'll get "better" when we spoon feed them strats, help them, and lead by example - just like everything else that's ever come out in this game. They can not and will not use cognitive skills to figure out anything about the game.

They are idiots. Many of them have played the game since it came out. They are just inherently bad at video games. They don't want to get better. They won't get better. They buy their dances and hats and bikinis, stare at their anime protagonists and disgusting pedobait lolis that the FBI would love to know they fetishize, and stink up every MPA they enter with their shitty inability to do anything that requires two or more buttons correctly. If it's not a dance in a lobby they can't fucking do it right, and even then half the time they can't.

Placing hurdles in front of them won't make them better, it'll just slow every MPA they join down until they're told exactly what to do and how to do it.

They are bad. They were bad. They will continue to be bad. This is because they just plain don't care to be good. If you can't understand why, well, it doesn't really matter that you do. It just matters that you understand that players who are bad exist, and they will continue to be bad. If the only requirement to accessing this quest is reaching level 50 and mooching a single Apos run off of someone else then they will get into the Falz mission. Players who aren't skilled at video games, and aren't interested in becoming skilled at video games, exist. This is a free to play game, these players are a permanent and unchangeable fact.

Maybe if they had to jump a hurdle to get to the Falz mission I could agree, but leveling is a joke.

So, I don't rightly fucking care if these people get loot. I don't give a shit if they get 11*s or if they ~undeservedly~ clear the quest, it's not my prerogative to care about what they do or don't get. It's my prerogative to care what happens to me. When a handful of shitstains enter my MPA and draw out a fight I finished in 20 minutes this morning to actually run out of time because they're all inept and undergeared, through no fault or control of my own, I want shit changed.

Fair enough. I can't argue that caring about your personal interest is bad. But, you seem to be a sensible person. You do understand that taking away the timer is going to ruin a good portion of the fun here? Sure we've got people in my team who've hit 2:56 loser runs already but I think part of the thrill comes from the mission as a package. You don't really believe taking it away is going to make it more fun right?

Don't get me wrong. I know the people you are talking about and it does suck badly. I do groan when i see DING lv 6-15 sub class level in TD2. Yea it pisses me off, but I'm not going to ask that the bases have more heals or the walls have more HP because a few retards want to have a fuck party in my mpa. I get mad at THEM not the game creators for trying to make shit fun instead of me mashing my dick on right click half asleep in an mpa.

I think we both dislike the same shit, but simply deal with it differently. But hey, when I don't wanna be stuck with em I just don't play with em. I have a team for a reason and if there's not enough members I grab a full party worth. If my 4/4 party, 1/3rd of the MPA, can't win then to me we don't deserve it.

[Rakurai]

He doesn't need a nerf, the 100% needs to be removed or lowered in required kills for less populated ships. -shrugs-

The only purpose that number serves is to provide a drop rate boost at 100% and 200%.

It would be dumb if people couldn't fight Loser if his EQ popped at a time where a low number of players were online.

[musicmf]

Think destroying Normal-Mode Apos over and over would build the % up as much as a SH version would?
If so, do you guys think that the community would trend to that to get better Luther drops instead of w/e the Apos can give?

[Meteor Weapon]

EXP for Apos, rare drops for Loser.

[Rakurai]

Apos doesn't seem to have any rare drops worth mentioning.

The only thing I've ever actually gotten from 15+ kills was a Dio Aristin from the rare version.

[gigawuts]

Fair enough. I can't argue that caring about your personal interest is bad. But, you seem to be a sensible person. You do understand that taking away the timer is going to ruin a good portion of the fun here? Sure we've in my team we got people who've hit 2:56 loser runs already but I think part of the thrill comes from the mission as a package. You don't really believe taking it away is going to make it more fun right?

Don't get me wrong. I know the people you are talking about and it does suck badly. I do groan when i see DING lv 6-15 sub class level in TD2. Yea it pisses me off, but I'm not going to ask that the bases have more heals or the walls have more HP because a few retards want to have a fuck party in my mpa. I get mad at THEM not the game creators for trying to make shit fun instead of me mashing my dick on right click half asleep in an mpa.

I think we both dislike the same shit, but simply deal with it differently. But hey, when I don't wanna be stuck with em I just fdon't play with em. I have a team for a reason and if there's not enough members I grab a full party worth. If my 4/4 party, 1/3rd of the MPA, can't win then to me we don't deserve it.

Well, I'm glad you know what I mean, but the thing with tower is it's great because it does force a victory if the quest is drawn out long enough. Even vibras will die as soon as the timer reaches 0. If your MPA is just the fucking worst, but you can keep the towers alive, you're guaranteed a completion. That ticking clock? Some people don't seem to know it, but that's not a timer until something times out - that's a timer until enemies start despawning. The wave is over, full stop. Next wave begins in 30 seconds.

That's all I want here. If you're in such a horrifically terrible MPA that you're still around after X time, then you just get it for free. Just like in minebase defense. This way bad players don't drag everyone they're around down so far that they can't even complete the quest once.

I don't have anything against bad players, they're not even on my list of things to care about. They can be bad all they want, for whatever reason they want. Some people get blackout drunk and play video games - I sure couldn't play dark falz luther well in that condition. Other people just have other things they do the rest of the day, and don't care about improving in a video game since they're busy improving IRL. That's fine. Some people just aren't very good at games because it's not what they're good at - we're all different.

The problem is when their lack of caring/capability converges with poor MPA composition (which is only a problem as a result of poor game design - weak bullet is a crutch of game design if I've ever seen one). My last run probably would've been fine with even one WBer. This morning I was the only WBer and we did splendidly even though I had no idea what I was doing besides WBing arms and big red things that looked like weak points.

As for teams, well, I've been in many teams in PS, and they've always been the same. I've tried numerous times, but in Phantasy Star teams have just never really been the sort of thing that appeals to me. In other games I helped lead organizations and was a regular part of any group I was in, but in those games people were a bit more...organized and grounded. Here teams are led almost exclusively (as opposed to merely partially) by people with inflated heads who want the glory of having their name at the top of a big team, and are manned by people who go on endless hunts for items they know they won't get because they're unable to derive pleasure in this game without that pretty best in slot item in their hand. Instead of addressing conflict with the intent to resolve it, it's typically completely ignored or the person who's friends with the leadership gets to stay regardless of what's going on. It's just a bunch of children validating eachother.

I don't have the energy to deal with teams that demand I do team runs, nor demand that I gather team points, nor endlessly shittalk people who aren't in their team, nor borderline exclude people who aren't in their team. If that means I run pugs 99% of the time, then that's what that means. Right now I'm in a team full of chill people who tend to do their own thing as much as I do. If I want to get involved with teams I have games I can resub for.

[Rakurai]

Apparently, you fight a "fake" Loser if that number you boost prior to the fight is less then 100%.

It's identifiable by the lack of a crown and lack of large wings on the back.

Whether it has different drops or not remains to be seen.

Guess that also explains why Double referred to the one that "died" as an imitation in the post-fight scene you can watch.

[Z-0]

Dark Falz' required defeats are based on population. Having more people on the server will not improve things.

This is the same for both Falz.

Just learn to get better at fighting the bosses and speed up your own runs rather than try and make excuses.

[Shinamori]

It can get to 200%, for 200% rdr? Yeah, ship2 is never gonna reach it.

[Maenara]

It can get to 200%, for 200% rdr? Yeah, ship2 is never gonna reach it.

Not with that attitude!

[Aurorra]

Apos doesn't seem to have any rare drops worth mentioning.

The only thing I've ever actually gotten from 15+ kills was a Dio Aristin from the rare version.

Rare version of Apos drops all the red box tech discs.

[Chdata]

I just noticed that the miniboss drops shifta/deband/sazan.

Huzzah for people hunting those!

[omgwtflolbbl]

WHELP.

I can't see the boss... AGAIN. Only this time it's the actual DF Loser, not just an Apostle.

I was looking forward to trying the fight out as a Ranger, too T_T

[buri-chan]

Good news! He's already piss easy now that we know what to do. Random MPA killed him in a little under five minutes.

[Evangelion X.XX]

The fight... was a big chaotic mess....

[Rakurai]

Too bad those sub-five minute runs almost never bother going for full breaks due to them typically being so Braver heavy that it takes forever for the crystals to be destroyed (As most melee can't reach them if he's not stunned).

[Aurorra]

I hate that this fight is impossible to do correctly without a ranger that knows what they're doing, 15+ minutes in and the ranger is still going from weak bulleting one wrist to the other instead of the glowing bicep or the clock when it opens and I just had to quit in disgust.

[Chdata]

oh no, my 1050 meseta unit drops!

Actually, I'm curious if breaking those swords and other stuff increases drop rates of any of his weapons like Falz Hunar.

[Yden]

I hate that this fight is impossible to do correctly without a ranger that knows what they're doing, 15+ minutes in and the ranger is still going from weak bulleting one wrist to the other instead of the glowing bicep or the clock when it opens and I just had to quit in disgust.

That's kinda mean. The encounter hasn't even been out for a day so many people are still learning it.

[Aurorra]

That's kinda mean. The encounter hasn't even been out for a day so many people are still learning it.

It's just bad game design that one class is a requirement, when you have 11 people hitting the bicep and they can't stun it because the damage requirement is so great that weak bullet is a necessity something's wrong.

[Mysterious-G]

The Loser fight is starting to get on my nerves. Dodging some of his attacks is just impossible.

SUP I AM ABOVE YOU *OHKOS YOU*
LOOK, SHINY SWORDS EH? *triple roundhouse swipe OHKO*
YOU LIKE PONDS? *spawns OHKO pond underneath you*

It'd be a little easier if the stage just wasn't so freaking busy. I can't see shit, and it's really taking away from this fight for me. Really frustrating at times. :disapprove:

[Aurorra]

oh no, my 1050 meseta unit drops!

Actually, I'm curious if breaking those swords and other stuff increases drop rates of any of his weapons like Falz Hunar.

Breaking the wrist and bicep in sequence or breaking the opening on the clock are required to expose his weak spot, without doing that you are looking at a very long fight, it's not about getting units to drop. The jewels on the headdress on the other hand are completely optional but I'm pretty sure destroying them drastically increases his drops.

[Rakurai]

oh no, my 1050 meseta unit drops!

Actually, I'm curious if breaking those swords and other stuff increases drop rates of any of his weapons like Falz Hunar.

His unit drops aren't tied completely to the crystals, as I still got one on a run where none of them had been destroyed.

Until an official verdict comes out, there's no reason not to spend a minute or two breaking them, plus doing so makes some of his more dangerous attacks tickle and/or create less projectiles.

[Chdata]

Meanwhile I'm finding the fight to actually be pretty easy (especially when you know how to open the weak point) despite dying twice or thrice to some things.

Also I know about the weak points, but he was talking about full breaking as opposed to just opening the clock (which I have no trouble with, got a mirage TMG for Remi and Nue can spam sazan).

[Rakurai]

I don't think anything can be considered properly difficult as long as it's so easy to revive other players.

The closest thing I had to a wipe was people failing to interrupt Apos' attack, which killed everyone except for a FO who somehow managed to avoid it and bring everyone back.

[omgwtflolbbl]

I don't think anything can be considered properly difficult as long as it's so easy to revive other players.

The closest thing I had to a wipe was people failing to interrupt Apos' attack, which killed everyone except for a FO who somehow managed to avoid it and bring everyone back.

The explosions have a radius I think. I was on my Hunter and we failed to break the bombs or whatever the heck they are, and I noticed that the red areas both appear at different times and have an actual radius to them. I waited on top of one and stepped over to another area that had appeared earlier but already disappeared.

Or you can just Katana Combat, because 20 seconds of invulnerability - why not?

[Rien]

Scored the entire loser set as well as a meteor cudgel just now

not gonna affix though that bullshit costs more meseta than I'm willing to handle.

also, I've managed to just guard through the whole apos pillar thing.

[WildarmsRE5]

pls don't nerf this guy, just pls no.

[Naizuya Tatzubani]

Just fought this boss. Why is he so based? Why is he everything I wanted? Do I even want to fight Elder anymore? I don't think I can go back now guys.

[Goukezitsu]

Well, I'm glad you know what I mean, but the thing with tower is it's great because it does force a victory if the quest is drawn out long enough. Even vibras will die as soon as the timer reaches 0. If your MPA is just the fucking worst, but you can keep the towers alive, you're guaranteed a completion. That ticking clock? Some people don't seem to know it, but that's not a timer until something times out - that's a timer until enemies start despawning. The wave is over, full stop. Next wave begins in 30 seconds.

That's all I want here. If you're in such a horrifically terrible MPA that you're still around after X time, then you just get it for free. Just like in minebase defense. This way bad players don't drag everyone they're around down so far that they can't even complete the quest once.

I don't have anything against bad players, they're not even on my list of things to care about. They can be bad all they want, for whatever reason they want. Some people get blackout drunk and play video games - I sure couldn't play dark falz luther well in that condition. Other people just have other things they do the rest of the day, and don't care about improving in a video game since they're busy improving IRL. That's fine. Some people just aren't very good at games because it's not what they're good at - we're all different.

The problem is when their lack of caring/capability converges with poor MPA composition (which is only a problem as a result of poor game design - weak bullet is a crutch of game design if I've ever seen one). My last run probably would've been fine with even one WBer. This morning I was the only WBer and we did splendidly even though I had no idea what I was doing besides WBing arms and big red things that looked like weak points.

As for teams, well, I've been in many teams in PS, and they've always been the same. I've tried numerous times, but in Phantasy Star teams have just never really been the sort of thing that appeals to me. In other games I helped lead organizations and was a regular part of any group I was in, but in those games people were a bit more...organized and grounded. Here teams are led almost exclusively (as opposed to merely partially) by people with inflated heads who want the glory of having their name at the top of a big team, and are manned by people who go on endless hunts for items they know they won't get because they're unable to derive pleasure in this game without that pretty best in slot item in their hand. Instead of addressing conflict with the intent to resolve it, it's typically completely ignored or the person who's friends with the leadership gets to stay regardless of what's going on. It's just a bunch of children validating eachother.

I don't have the energy to deal with teams that demand I do team runs, nor demand that I gather team points, nor endlessly shittalk people who aren't in their team, nor borderline exclude people who aren't in their team. If that means I run pugs 99% of the time, then that's what that means. Right now I'm in a team full of chill people who tend to do their own thing as much as I do. If I want to get involved with teams I have games I can resub for.


Well teams are an ordeal in most MMOs. In FFXIV 1.0 I ran the number 1 ranked linkshell on my server and top 30 (I think 17th? I dont remember anymore) across all servers. It was a nightmare to lead, but it was rewarding to make something with principals instead of these shit fiestas where people just linkshell hop and betray one another. I made mine with some sort of morals and comradery which is why it lasted.

Here I help lead a team and we do well. I'm not the master of it nor did I make it but I now take a large responsibility for it and we do well. I don't mandate anything on them. It's just a big group of friends of mine and friends of friends and all the content is volunteer. They come because they want to and because we're all good players so we know it will be successful. We don't go recruit actively and we only now let peoples friends join.

I haven't been a part of these other teams. but I can see what you're talking about. I wouldn't have joined this one when I did if my family member didn't lead it / had some irl friends join and even then I kept saying no for a while lol. It takes some work to get a decent team going, but when it does get going it's a pretty good deal. No team in any game will be perfect because a group of humans in a room are going to shit storm no matter what you do. You just have to reduce the shitstorm and make it manageable and use the remove from team feature lol.

To be honest I think PSO 2s English community is very good in some regards , but completely shit in the coming together to play the game part. There's zero leadership for endgame activities or shutting down that poison splurging from peoples mouths from b20. Tons of misinformation and a lot of needless entitlement. I miss PSO1 days (while of course the game had better things) because the community seemed to love to play the game, hunt stuff, and have fun. Now it seems everyones favorite activity is to talk about the game and playing dress up (nothing wrong with that but then we get this whole DF loser situation to begin with). Shit sucks.

I blame PSU. I think those fans fucked it up for the PSO 1 ones. (I loved PSU and played it until the PC/PS2 servers died but I knew it was shit and the community was shit cept mah friends cuz I'm biased and y'all are lovely and I miss you <3)

[GosamerWings]

Damn noobs, it's everyone else's fault that we didn't get 6mins so I could falz on 4 alts.

Also how the hell do classes without mirage escape / Katana Combat / Katana Counter / Guld Mila / SROLL even dodge all this crap. Wdf.

Fighter Dagger (spin at right moment then dash out of spin if you need extra inv frames, follow with 2nd spin if needed), if in combat with boss Falcet gives you inv frames, stop getting yourself killed with Bloody, super armor does not = def.

Fighter Fist: Sway with a little bit of gear up refreshes itself before the inv frames run out. Use meteor Fist when pp is available, will get you most damage. Consider bringing an all class range weapon to replenish pp, but not a necessity

Techer: Wand lovers gives you maxed step. or just stay in normal mode and m.step.

Hunter Sword, Partisan, W.Lance : Just guard.

Most of it comes second nature from playing monster hunter with evade+1 gear. Also Dark souls... lol

Everyone has their unlucky deaths things happen, but honestly I maybe die at worst about 3-4 times, and that will just be in situations where Iron Will/Never give up/PB max/I'm not in the air as dagger, or swaying doesn't save me. He is a little too mobile for me to bother with sword/Wire lance... Partisan Sacred spear maybe but if you would need ranged weapon to get pp back, and at that point whatever your using, would of just did more damage if you used it's class weapon primarily instead of hunter things.

[Hobu]

Just fought this boss. Why is he so based? Why is he everything I wanted? Do I even want to fight Elder anymore? I don't think I can go back now guys.

I dropped atomizers during one round and they started passing atomizers around based on that idea.

I love the JP community.

[Sizustar]

I dropped atomizers during one round and they started passing atomizers around based on that idea.

I love the JP community.

That's been going on since the last one I did.
But it's being asked to do in 2ch and wiki it seems.
Fo/Te that can heal themself, buy the healing item, and drop them for the other class that can't heal themself.

[Agastya]

That ticking clock? Some people don't seem to know it, but that's not a timer until something times out - that's a timer until enemies start despawning. The wave is over, full stop. Next wave begins in 30 seconds.eeeeexcept for goldrahas in waves 1~5 doing 5k dmg explosions on anything around them if they still have their bombs. i know that's still technically despawning, but still, you are penalized at first. i'm honestly surprised the last wave timeout doesn't do that as well but i guess sega was feeling generous.

[Akakomuma]

Absolutely, positively awesome. Punishes over offense players and rewards defensive players.

[Xaelouse]

can't wait until he's introduced as a rare stage in extreme quests

[GosamerWings]

can't wait until he's introduced as a rare stage in extreme quests

Seems your minding your own business... Here's form 1st form of Loser XD Tripple infected and rare ready to eat your soul XD

[DJcooltrainer]

Absolutely, positively awesome. Punishes over offense players and rewards defensive players.

Actually, the best strategy against him is to be incredibly aggressive. Getting him to expose his core over and over is the key to completing it quickly, I believe. At least that's how the best runs I've had so far have gone. Last night the MPA I was in cleared him in about 8 mins, which isn't bad. (Considering the very first one I joined took 28 mins...)

[Daiyousei]

Seems your minding your own business... Here's form 1st form of Loser XD Tripple infected and rare ready to eat your soul XD

Throw on some katana resistance while you're at it.

[gigawuts]

Throw on some katana resistance while you're at it.

They should do this for the entire game, actually.

[UnLucky]

Absolutely, positively awesome. Punishes over offense players and rewards defensive players.
Yeah, except if you take too long you just lose no matter what.

There's no chance to take it slow. No room to play it safe.

Zerg hard, zerg fast.

[Hobu]

Seems your minding your own business... Here's form 1st form of Loser XD Tripple infected and rare ready to eat your soul XD

And here I thought getting clumped together with 2 banthers and 2 zeshraydas was a pain enough.

[UnLucky]

They should do this for the entire game, actually.
So long as doing an insurmountable challenge such as "defeat 3 enemies" reverses that resistance and makes everything in the game weak to katana instead.

[Kietsu]

Had my second go at Bird Falz last night. After spending about 25 minutes watching Hunters wailing on his clock (which was, um, not broken.) while I desperately WB'd his arms, my party decided to just straight out bail and see if we could find another MPA before the EQ ended.

Ended up in a party with a few ultra-competent players who apparently had the same idea, and we took him down in just under 10 minutes.

So yeah, PSO2 community not yet prepared for boss fight that requires brain.

[DJcooltrainer]

Had my second go at Bird Falz last night. After spending about 25 minutes watching Hunters wailing on his clock (which was, um, not broken.) while I desperately WB'd his arms, my party decided to just straight out bail and see if we could find another MPA before the EQ ended.

Ended up in a party with a few ultra-competent players who apparently had the same idea, and we took him down in just under 10 minutes.

So yeah, PSO2 community not yet prepared for boss fight that requires brain.

I mean, I can understand why some people were confused during the first couple of runs. There's a lot going on on-screen all at once, and he switches up his attack patterns. It's a lot to take in at once. There's still probably tons of people who haven't had the chance to participate in one of the EQ's yet, so you're still going to encounter a bunch of people who are fighting him for the first time.

I'm willing to give people the benefit of the doubt, at least for now. Did you actually tell any of them to stop attacking his center clock? Maybe they really didn't know what his weak points are? I know I really didn't completely get it the first time I ran it.

Give it a few weeks, I guarantee it'll get a lot better once people have some more experience fighting him. It's really not that difficult once you figure out how he works.

[ShinMaruku]

http://www.chatslang.com/images/shortcuts/twitch/admins/omgscoots.png
My reaction.

[Melodys]

The only time you should attack his center clock covering his core is if you have a Mirage weapon (preferably mechs or rifle) or Sazan/Zan (not sure which one prots better). It may be the only way to defeat Bird Falz if you don't have Wb in your MPA even (before the 30 minute mark or using all moons. Whichever comes first). Two successful mirages expose his core permanently I believe. With Wb, it'll take around 5-10 mins.

[Rien]

Mirage V bow, Million Storm

I have it set up, but now I have to wait for loser to show up again and not attend as a hu/fi for exp >.>

[UnLucky]

I'm willing to give people the benefit of the doubt, at least for now. Did you actually tell any of them to stop attacking his center clock? Maybe they really didn't know what his weak points are? I know I really didn't completely get it the first time I ran it.
His protected core takes like, 1/5th the damage as practically anywhere else. You have no excuse to attack that five minutes into your first run.

[Shinamori]

The only time you should attack his center clock covering his core is if you have a Mirage weapon (preferably mechs or rifle) or Sazan/Zan (not sure which one prots better). It may be the only way to defeat Bird Falz if you don't have Wb in your MPA even (before the 30 minute mark or using all moons. Whichever comes first). Two successful mirages expose his core permanently I believe. With Wb, it'll take around 5-10 mins.

I think Nizan has 22 percent chance.

[UnLucky]

I think Nizan has 22 percent chance.
Yes, but Sazan hits three times per cast, even uncharged, and Zan can hit like infinity times so long as you keep jumping over your own blades. Each hit is a 20% chance for Mirage.

Nazan hits only once, and for pitiful damage.

[Aine]

His protected core takes like, 1/5th the damage as practically anywhere else. You have no excuse to attack that five minutes into your first run.

The fastest way to kill Luther is actually to proc Mirage on his clock right at the start and just go all-out on the core until he dies. Mirage only opens up the clock for a brief duration (and each time it procs he builds up a resistance, like Shock on Elder), but if you deal enough damage while it's open it breaks permanently, exposing the core for the rest of the match. If you're co-ordinated properly it only takes one go to break the clock.

And regarding the name, he's both Loser and Luther, just like the old DF is both Colossus and Elder. But we only call the old DF by his phonetic name. So it would be more consistent to call him Luther.

[UnLucky]

Yes, because you'll totally have Mirage weapons for your very first time fighting the boss when you don't know any better.

[LonelyGaruga]

Yes, but Sazan hits three times per cast, even uncharged, and Zan can hit like infinity times so long as you keep jumping over your own blades. Each hit is a 20% chance for Mirage.

Status rates listed on techs work like power notations. They don't represent the status application rate on a per hit basis, but whatever combination the devs put it as. Sazan's three hits add up to 22% with the efficient 2 recipe (so each hit is actually closer to 7%), while Nazan is a single hit with a flat 22% rate.

This is listed on the swiki in the section on status and weather (http://pso2.swiki.jp/index.php?%E7%8A%B6%E6%85%8B%E7%95%B0%E5%B8%B8%E3% 83%BB%E5%B1%9E%E6%80%A7%E3%83%BB%E5%A4%A9%E5%80%99 %E5%A4%89%E5%8C%96).


開発へのインタビューによれば、武器の特殊能力による状態異常の付与判定が、攻撃がヒットする都度行われる のに対し、 テクニックによる状態異常の付与判定は、攻撃のヒット数とは独立している とのこと。
したがって、状態異常の付与を目的とする場合、多段ヒットするテクニックが必ずしも有利とは限 らない。

Google translated version


According to the interview with the development, grant judgment of state abnormality due to special ability of the weapon, while is done each time the attack hit, grant judgment of state abnormalities due to technique is independent of the number of hits of attack thing with.
Therefore, for the purpose of imparting the abnormal state, techniques for multi hit not always necessarily advantageous.

With that in mind, it becomes a little difficult to determine the actual affliction rates of techs that don't accurately demonstrate their status infliction rates. Zan in particular is relevant here, since it boomerangs the way it does. It certainly isn't 20% per hit, but it's more than 20% per cast. Zan and Nazan are probably the "best" at inflicting status, but Sazan is obviously easier to land.

[UnLucky]

Oh, good, so they're completely arbitrary. Which means Nazonde might be completely impossible to actually work on Elder really early on due to slightly increased resistance, and something like Zan where its Power notation is for 2 hits (wtf?) would be absolutely ridiculous.

I take it somebody tried getting Rabarta to 98% Freeze but it wasn't even close?

[Gardios]

I've spammed Zan for 30 minutes with another Force in the one attempt I had and we never managed to mirage him. Elder had 80% shock resistance already, I assume Luther's resistance is much higher... or RNGesus just really didn't like us.

[Chdata]

Of course everyone avoided the clock the first time because it seemed to take very little damage. But after one day mirage has already been monopolized and people already switched over to mirage TMGs. I have a pair myself.

Video of me opening the clock within like a minute with sazan spam:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J7ylgoXjnkQ

If you're taking 30 minutes with zan or something you're really unlucky.

Also, I've seen Dark Falz Elder get the burn status before. He turned redish blue, it was pretty weird. I also think I've seen him get poisoned but have it disappear almost immediately.

Edit: Read the strategy thread, it's already been discussed that you have 3 chances to open the clock with mirage, and deal enough damage to break it thus keeping it open for the rest of the fight.

[Yden]

How do you avoid Luther's rapid teleport attack ground slam move?

[Kietsu]

Did you actually tell any of them to stop attacking his center clock? Maybe they really didn't know what his weak points are?

I managed to find space to shout out that just hitting the clock doesn't break it open, and they didn't seem to be using Mirage weapons - although he'd already been miraged twice (with not enough followup to break the clock), so the chances of it happening anyway were low.

Really though, paying even the slightest attention to their damage numbers should tell them they're doing something wrong.

On another note, I'm still loving how Apos has three different attack sets. Makes it a much more varied battle than Falz Arms.

[Walkure]

Oh cool, time to get some new status TMGs.

Also, I've seen Dark Falz Elder get the burn status before. He turned redish blue, it was pretty weird. I also think I've seen him get poisoned but have it disappear almost immediately.
Gonna call Jellen Shot on that.

[Chdata]

<dodge tactics>

Huh, didn't know wand lovers gave max step.

So uh... RaHu are still stuck with trying to dodge everything purely by placement right?

[Reyva]

In reference to some other post on this thread, I'll continue to play barbie with my characters until the game is actually a challenge lol. However, this new falz, its a step in the right direction. It actually gave people a challenge (however, after you do it 30483048308 times, its not really a challenge probably at that point) and still does.

Now if you continue to go in this direction and make even more difficult/challenging content along with all the other issues with the game, then maybe I'll play this game more and maybe I'll have the same motivation I did in PSU/PSO to hunt for rarez. But if I can continue to rape stuff with shit weapons if I wanted and OP classes, then nope. Esp with weak bullet bish. I'll just afk the run lol.

So tbh, for me, it didn't really bring me back to this game playing actively. Its like, cool, challenge, fun, etc, but its not like its all the time nor does it make me want to play that much more or become "addicted" and play a ton.

My only concern however is will they nerf him because he is a challenge lol? I remember good ol snow banther/banshee got a nerf because they were apparently "too hard." Unfortunately, since this is the English community, I have to take whatever you say with a grain of salt since what matters is the JP community. Not like Segac JP gonna listen to the Eng community.

Bad parties/people? Thats always going to be the case for life. Doesn't matter what you say or do, its always there for any game. We could always go back to the FFXI days and be sitting there making a group / lfp for hours and finally get that elite party haha. But the problem is, this is a different setup and its random. Not like a raid. Well probably not random anymore since its posted usually what EQs.

In Vindictus, when making parties, we have more flexibility so most people will have stat requirements just to get into the party lol. If you don't meet like 50000000 s-atk, you won't be getting in.

Sad thing bout that is the dumbasses who base everything off a person's stats and say well thats just the norm when that player could suck so much ass and thats the case with any game. Go play some more pay to win F2P games and see those decked out players who spent thousands of dollars just to get pwned in PvP or suck in PvE. I was living proof in one game since I was kickass with shit gear in PvP vs this other guy who was decked out haha.

All I can say is, get 12 nabs you know who can pwn 24/7 and just do it all the time with them. Chances are however, majority won't read up on when a EQ is going to pop, have other things going on, sleep, etc etc etc so a full 12 elites probably not ALWAYS possible. So gotta play with nabs haha.

Anyways, I await more from Segac is all. Step in right direction for sure, just don't fuck it up.....which probably will happen.

[KatsuraJun]

I'm kind of sad that it's pretty simple to drop him in 5-10 minutes now.

I preferred the 20 minute slogfest.

He isn't really hard but he can actually kill people with his speed and mechanics unlike a certain hamtastic falz so it was fun seeing people drop left and right to his flashy attacks.

I also liked the fact that his "core" (not the clock) was fairly difficult to expose, having to break the arms and then deal enough damage to the glowing shoulders, and that it'd only be exposed for a few seconds.

Unlike a certain falz with a giant HIT ME sign right on his chest,

[Yoona]

My fight against him went to him. On very hard difficulty. Wailed on the clock and nothing seemed to happen, was a very strange fight, no sign we were doing anything aside from the millions and millions of damage flying out of him.

[Gardios]

If you're taking 30 minutes with zan or something you're really unlucky.

Yeah, guess we were just unlucky (or simply didn't notice). I was the only tech class just now, managed to expose him permanently the second attempt with just Zan.

In other news, I appreciate Luther inflicting status ailments. Super Treatment has never been as handy. <3

[Rakurai]

Huh, didn't know wand lovers gave max step.

So uh... RaHu are still stuck with trying to dodge everything purely by placement right?

More or less.

Even though they fixed the lag on the end of dodge roll, it's still easily the worst evasion move out of all the classes.

Amusingly, I noticed that I can actually go underneath the Apos Dorios' annoying tail spin attack while I'm kneeling during Satellite Cannon. Would be funny if you could dodge some of Loser's attacks by using lobby actions.

[LonelyGaruga]

My fight against him went to him. On very hard difficulty. Wailed on the clock and nothing seemed to happen, was a very strange fight, no sign we were doing anything aside from the millions and millions of damage flying out of him.

It is 100% impossible to break the clock without Mirage, and it takes reduced damage compared to normal hitzones, so it's very unlikely that your MPA was actually doing substantial damage to him.

I guess the phrasing "break" is confusing people. Basically, when the clock is affected by Mirage, it opens up. Breaking it doesn't actually cause any physical damage to the clock itself, rather, I guess it's closer to jamming it. Gameplaywise, it's obviously a break, but aesthetically, jamming would probably be a better description of it.

[gigawuts]

It is 100% impossible to break the clock without Mirage, and it takes reduced damage compared to normal hitzones, so it's very unlikely that your MPA was actually doing substantial damage to him.

I guess the phrasing "break" is confusing people. Basically, when the clock is affected by Mirage, it opens up. Breaking it doesn't actually cause any physical damage to the clock itself, rather, I guess it's closer to jamming it. Gameplaywise, it's obviously a break, but aesthetically, jamming would probably be a better description of it.

Is it visibly damaged? If yes, I think "break" or "broken" fits.

[Punisher106]

[spoiler-box]http://puu.sh/8EojQ.jpg[/spoiler-box]

FUCK EVERYTHING.

[LonelyGaruga]

Is it visibly damaged? If yes, I think "break" or "broken" fits.

It's visibly damaged, sure, but the confusion seems to be that people think it's possible to break it without Mirage. It should be completely unnecessary to actually word it differently, but it's amazing how many people throughout all the threads discussing Loser know that the clock can be broken, but don't know Mirage is necessary. I think the problem is that they're being confused about the wording, but really, I don't get how it can be so difficult to understand that you need Mirage. Just seeing it break once should give enough information for this to be intuitive, and it's been repeated so frequently on the forum that I can't imagine anyone that actually reads any of these threads doesn't know this yet.

Basically, I'm trying to dumb it down so it doesn't confuse people into thinking "break" means "As long as I keep hitting this, something will happen!". Jamming is an unusual word that I hope makes these people think a little harder, but really, the understanding that "break" does not always mean "hit it until something happens!" should suffice. I don't know what to do to make it easier for people that don't understand this yet, though.

[Maenara]

Is it visibly damaged? If yes, I think "break" or "broken" fits.

The mechanism that covers the core usually (I call it the clockblocker) loses its ability to close. There's no real damage, though the design on the core is different when the clockblocker is jammed than when it's simply opened.

[RollTheDice]

After fighting this boss four times...my thoughts are that this boss is very fucking easy.

[omgwtflolbbl]

How do you avoid Luther's rapid teleport attack ground slam move?

Watch the ground. Whenever DF does an attack, that targets a specific area, the ground changes color (for some attacks, that's the entire arena).

My first time as a Ra/Hu in DF, it was actually really easy even though I was unsure of where to WB when he went into fabulous mode (we failed to break the core - he only got mirage'd once and we didn't do enough damage). All of his slow mode attacks are pretty easy to dodge, and his map wide AoEs in sped up mode are very easy to dodge simply by jumping before the attack.

The most annoying thing by far for me were actually the slow tracking balls. Too used to Hu/Fi where I could just block the things and they would disappear (which I gotta say... if you're a blocking class, I'd say block them, it helps clear up screen clutter!). If I just walked around them, they would sometimes curve around and hit me in the back later.

I died twice on this first Ra/Hu attempt: once to the time stop thing (the second one went off really fast for some reason), and once to that vortex + projectile spam combo. I was actually expecting a lot worse since my defense really sucks and I'd never done it before without a block, and Dive Roll really sucks.

I didn't test it, but how usable is Satellite Aim there? I imagine the hitboxes are really wonky here.

[gigawuts]

Yeah it's great when your MPA doesn't consist of uncrafted blizzaxe overenders, shunka berserkers, and ilgrants spamming forces with broken evasion buttons.

[Xaeris]

Decided to have a go at alt runs this hour. It went pretty well, managed to do three characters*. The second Loser bugged out and sat there doing nothing while we went ham on his WB'ed arm from 100 to 0, so that was kind of cheap hence the asterisk.

I was overwhelmed by my first couple of attempts at Loser, but with further attempts, I think this will be business as usual within the month. He's never going to be a pinata quite like Elder, but we should see a vast reduction in 10+ minute runs over time. It's kind of stupid just how crucial Mirage is to the fight though.

[Daiyousei]

the juxtaposition of the above two post reminds me, I used to have a blizzaxe with mirage 5 on it, +10ed and really just dumped it into desynching it, kinda a hilarious in hindsight moment for me now.

[lilibat]

Timed out first attempt the other day.

Came here, read stuff. Got a +mirageIII talis, SaZaned my little heart out as the only force on attempt 2 (VH) & opened the hell out of the chest piece like a dozen times. One other player was saying instructions at people about how this goes as was I. Didn't matter no one paid any attention. They just hit whatever, LF never even fell down.

Time out #2, very frustrated.

I know I still kind of suck, I feel I am paying karmic penance for rocking PSO so hard back in the day, but I do try to learn & get better. So many just seem to want to SPAM DPS & not pay attention to any subtlety of procedure. :-(

It's like Molten Core with the pick up raids all over.

[gigawuts]

the juxtaposition of the above two post reminds me, I used to have a blizzaxe with mirage 5 on it, +10ed and really just dumped it into desynching it, kinda a hilarious in hindsight moment for me now.

I've found a couple Mirage 5 items, which is cash money. I think I'll keep the Egg Blasters for my own use in this fight, though.

I don't really think higher SE levels matter though; it doesn't against Elder since the SE is meant to last longer but it merely activates a unique animation. I'm sure it's the same for DF Luther.

[Chdata]

You use mirage to open it.

When it's been opened you can then proceed to try and break it.

If it closes, you need to open it again.

[gigawuts]

You use mirage to open it.

When it's been opened you can then proceed to try and break it.

If it closes, you need to open it again.

Yes, I'm aware; none of that involves attacks randomly whiffing which is Mirage's normal effect.

Which suggests SE level has as much of an effect on DF Luther as it does to DF Elder: None.

[Rockmanshii]

[spoiler-box]http://puu.sh/8EojQ.jpg[/spoiler-box]

FUCK EVERYTHING.
Was on that mpa too, saw you dead but ran out of moons. I think next time I'll just go back to campship and buy some after dying...

[Chdata]

That was in response to everyone's confusion over what breaking the clock means.

Dunno why you're mentioning the actual status effect mirage causes.

[gigawuts]

That was in response to everyone's confusion over what breaking the clock means.

Dunno why you're mentioning the actual status effect mirage causes.

I don't know why I'm mentioning what a status effect has done since it was added to the game, to literally every single other enemy it can infect in the entire game barring only Malluda either.

I mean, how could people be confused that Mirage is used to stun DF Luther if it's never been known for its stun effects before, they have no idea what the hell is going on in the fight, they can't even see his core is open because he's turned away from half the MPA, and after DF Elder's hands and DF Elder himself are weak to the same SE then Mirage is used on DF Luther while Panic is the SE to use on Apos Drios (and it's much more obvious since he's much smaller and there's a visible graphic, the same one you see on any other panicked enemy).

It's totally intuitive and obvious that you would do Mirage, that it wouldn't do what it normally does, and it's not at all still an obscure fact to many people what Mirage even does to begin with.

Hm. Why did I do that...

[Rakurai]

People are pretty dense when it comes to breaking the crystals.

Even when I WB them repeatedly, I usually see only one or two players bothering to target them instead of the core.

[omgwtflolbbl]

How much does it actually weaken him by, though? The homing projectiles did ~160 damage to me after breaking them on my Ra/Hu setup, but I never got hit by one of them beforehand so I don't have any comparison.

[Rakurai]

It's for the extra drops, not so much the damage reduction, but his projectiles went from 440 damage to 120 after I broke them.

[Yoona]

It is 100% impossible to break the clock without Mirage, and it takes reduced damage compared to normal hitzones, so it's very unlikely that your MPA was actually doing substantial damage to him.

I guess the phrasing "break" is confusing people. Basically, when the clock is affected by Mirage, it opens up. Breaking it doesn't actually cause any physical damage to the clock itself, rather, I guess it's closer to jamming it. Gameplaywise, it's obviously a break, but aesthetically, jamming would probably be a better description of it.
Thanks for clearing that up. Mirage wasn't even mentioned in my multiparty so that's probably why we failed.

[Punisher106]

Was on that mpa too, saw you dead but ran out of moons. I think next time I'll just go back to campship and buy some after dying...

I wanted to break that MPA's neck, I exposed the core three times, and I only saw someone WB it once, but it was overwritten for an arm.

[Gardios]

So, uh, before I waste time on useless stuff I gotta ask: Would a symbol art like this be useful?

http://i.imgur.com/kEYeBng.jpg

[Sanguine2009]

i cant help but think the bads would ignore it but it cant hurt

[Rakurai]

I think one for telling people to break the crystals would be good, too.

On a side note, I can confirm that killing the Apos Dorios on Normal has just as much of an effect on the counter as killing it on Super Hard does, so it's probably more productive just spam the quest solo to raise the counter as high as you can if you don't need EXP, since its drops are both rare and garbage. It only has around 300K HP or so, which would take only a minute or two tops to burn through.

[Punisher106]

So, uh, before I waste time on useless stuff I gotta ask: Would a symbol art like this be useful?

http://i.imgur.com/kEYeBng.jpg

Best do it in Symbols. Have the first one have the Mirage Symbol pointing to the clock. Then do another one with it open, with the Weak Bullet symbol pointing to it.

[Sizustar]

So, uh, before I waste time on useless stuff I gotta ask: Would a symbol art like this be useful?

http://i.imgur.com/kEYeBng.jpg

There's already these two
http://wikiwiki.jp/pso2sa/?plugin=ref&page=sa48&src=Untitled2.png
http://wikiwiki.jp/pso2sa/?plugin=ref&page=sa48&src=%C7%D4%BC%D4%A5%B5%A5%E0%A5%CD.png

[Gardios]

Ah, those seem fine.

[Punisher106]

There's already these two
http://wikiwiki.jp/pso2sa/?plugin=ref&page=sa48&src=Untitled2.png
http://wikiwiki.jp/pso2sa/?plugin=ref&page=sa48&src=%C7%D4%BC%D4%A5%B5%A5%E0%A5%CD.png

I demand the .sar files. Now.

[LonelyGaruga]

I don't really think higher SE levels matter though; it doesn't against Elder since the SE is meant to last longer but it merely activates a unique animation. I'm sure it's the same for DF Luther.

That's correct. Status affixes indicate the severity of the status, and have no bearing on the proc rate. For bosses that have special reactions to status effects, the difference between a I and a V is zilch.

Also, about that other, more recent post, I think it's worth pointing out that status effects, when they work on larger bosses, exclusively have abnormal reactions to them. Only mid-bosses and below ever have the standard effects applied to them (though Shock seems to do absolutely nothing to flinch mid-bosses), and even then, Decol Maluda, as you named, is an exception. So I would think it's more intuitive to expect an unusual effect to be applied to a boss than to expect the standard application.

[Sizustar]

I demand the .sar files. Now.

You can find them in My room's SA display or the SA wiki
And I've been spamming them in the Loser EQ to get more people to use them too.

[Gardios]

http://wikiwiki.jp/pso2sa/?sa48

[Renvalt]

IMO, this is how I rank the Falzes as of now:

Falz Elder = Falz For The Retarded/Absurdly Oblivious
Falz Loser = Falz For The Enlightened/Immensely Observant

If Apprentice is next, then my predictions are that she will be the "Falz For The Foolish/Insanely Masochistic".

[ArataWata]

It's a fun.... time... 8D

But yeah, I tried doing this on Very Hard for my first run, I wish I picked Hard first since it ended tragically with wasting 30 minutes and we didn't kill him.

We even wiped on the second boss.

It was horrible.

[Chdata]

I don't know why I'm mentioning what a status effect has done since it was added to the game, to literally every single other enemy it can infect in the entire game barring only Malluda either.

I mean, how could people be confused that Mirage is used to stun DF Luther if it's never been known for its stun effects before, they have no idea what the hell is going on in the fight, they can't even see his core is open because he's turned away from half the MPA, and after DF Elder's hands and DF Elder himself are weak to the same SE then Mirage is used on DF Luther while Panic is the SE to use on Apos Drios (and it's much more obvious since he's much smaller and there's a visible graphic, the same one you see on any other panicked enemy).

It's totally intuitive and obvious that you would do Mirage, that it wouldn't do what it normally does, and it's not at all still an obscure fact to many people what Mirage even does to begin with.

Hm. Why did I do that...

I think it's obvious when hours after the strategy thread was made, people pointed how to use mirage and what it does.