NicoNico Live Broadcast #22 Info threads - Added skill tree and Balance change slide

[Sizustar]

http://i.imgur.com/Nud9yRb.jpg
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Today's Live Event EQ is TD3 at JST 10:30PM with 260% Drop rate and EXP.

[Sizustar]

Preview information magazine for Episode 3
[SPOILER-BOX]http://i.imgur.com/VqAfZgq.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/GYBFf89.jpg
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http://i.imgur.com/JbmlFqO.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]

[Sizustar]

http://i.imgur.com/kAbqMQV.jpg
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http://i.imgur.com/FWNhZnw.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/spGBvds.jpg
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[Sizustar]

Skill Trees

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYrFMTFmIIE"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYrFMTFmIIE

[SPOILER-BOX]
http://i.imgur.com/iqcYRFw.jpg
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http://i.imgur.com/zvJSKWo.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]

Balance Change Slide

[SPOILER-BOX]http://i.imgur.com/gSdqrVf.jpg
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http://i.imgur.com/SJKu7VG.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]

Key Word
http://i.imgur.com/7Ffld2z.jpg

[Shiyo]

Translations please!
For balance changes and skill trees mainly.

[GHNeko]

Shiyo. You are the thirstiest of us all right now lmfao.

[UnLucky]

Fury nerf, costs less points
No penalty on Guard

WB nerf, WHA buff. Can keep WB on weapon switch

Photon Flare duration increased.
Can charge during Mirage Escape

Brave/Wise buffed. No penalty. (Passive? Faster?)
Chase nerfed

SRoll JA nerfed
Showtime/Hightime buffed

Territory Burst passive, 1SP
Super Treatment, 1SP
Shifta Strike, percentage based damage increase
Shifta Crit buffed, Wand Lovers buffed

Average/Weak buffed
Rapid Shoot Up buffed


Or something like that

[musicmf]

Am I seeing this right, do all of the following skills no longer require players to put points into them?
- Step/Diveroll/Mirage Escape (Well, this was always the case)
- Step Attack
- Just Reversal
- Guard
- Just Guard
- Just Counter
- Trap Search
- Extend Assist

[Vampy]

Wow seeing those changes is giving me hope not sure how I feel about Sroll JA yet but they guy really does seem to know what he is doing.

[Unnamed Player]

Fury nerf
SRoll JA nerfed
Showtime/Hightime buffedWell, looks like Gunner is done for.

[nanakatrin]

ohgod my heart it can't take this sega you forever have my money.......FORCE FREEDOM TO EVERYONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Vampy]

Give it time maybe he buffed them enough to compensate for the loss if damage looking at the trees they look glfar better than what we have currently.

[UnLucky]

Am I seeing this right, do all of the following skills no longer require players to put points into them?
- Step/Diveroll/Mirage Escape (Well, this was always the case)
- Step Attack
- Just Reversal
- Guard
- Just Guard
- Just Counter
- Trap Search
- Extend Assist
Nice, I didn't catch that one. You're right, the player has 70 skill points left to assign as a lv70 (no SP CO?) yet still has all those skills unlocked.

Still need to spend points on Step/Roll Advance, Snatch Step, Just Reversal Cover, and a new Healing Guard skill.


Wow seeing those changes is giving me hope not sure how I feel about Sroll JA yet but they guy really does seem to know what he is doing.
There was something about Chain Trigger getting better too, but I didn't quite get what they were showcasing. Your own PAs increase the combo maybe?

Oh, and a new skill called "Twice Chain"

[Rakurai]

Am I seeing this right, do all of the following skills no longer require players to put points into them?
- Step/Diveroll/Mirage Escape (Well, this was always the case)
- Step Attack
- Just Reversal
- Guard
- Just Guard
- Just Counter
- Trap Search
- Extend Assist

That would seem to be the case, and I'd say it's about time. No reason katanas should get built-in guard and just guard capabilities and not the hunter weapons.

On a side note, FO is going to be stronger then ever now that they have easy access to all of the general damage boosts, probably moreso then the other classes. I just hope they rebalanced the damage of the different techs so that they're each better then the others in different situations, though I kind of doubt that Na Megid is ever going to beaten as the go-to single target damage tech outside of certain Elysion boosted normal techs.

[Vampy]

I really hope he takes player feedback as well maybe he could have missed something another player caught ig he can do that and not be "I play this game too and helping with development" he has my full support.

[Rayokarna]

Ranger Skill Tree Changes:

Upper and Poison Trap Booster now is now one SP to max
All trap and tool skills only take one SP to open them up.
Bind, Mirage and Panic bullet need 5SP to max.
Trap Search by default

[Rakurai]

I guess Territory PP save is just a passive 7 PP reduction on support techs now.

Sounds legit.

[Sizustar]

That would seem to be the case, and I'd say it's about time. No reason katanas should get built-in guard and just guard capabilities and not the hunter weapons.

On a side note, FO is going to be stronger then ever now that they have easy access to all of the general damage boosts, probably moreso then the other classes. I just hope they rebalanced the damage of the different techs so that they're each better then the others in different situations, though I kind of doubt that Na Megid is ever going to beaten as the go-to single target damage tech outside of certain Elysion boosted normal techs.

Photon Flare getting buffed too.

Last 45 second, No HP penalty, CD 100 second

[SJRKnowledge96]

WB is nerfed, even though you can keep it upon weapon change? Sure, the second part is useful, but my only use aside from healing has been mitigated. >.>

[Sizustar]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYrFMTFmIIE"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYrFMTFmIIE

[musicmf]

Still disappointed that FO tree still has Charge PP Revival on its tree, and there isn't a point invested into it by default.
Further saddened by the fact that TE still doesn't have Charge PP Revival on it's tree at all... it will almost always (TEHU, and hopefully TEBO/BOTE) be forced to partner with FO.

I do like that PP Convert is no longer hidden deep within the Dark Tree.
Also I can finally use Super Treatment! I sure as hell wasn't going to invest into the Light Tree to make use of that.
Similarly, Wand Lovers is now able to be gotten on Non-Melee TE builds. (Btw, was it mentioned if this is stance status now? Or is it still going to have lots of downtime and plenty of fistpumps?)

[Ce'Nedra]

Preview Scratch Content, Lobby Actions and Accessories

That is all.

[Kikikiki]

That is all.

All of what?

If you mean that those are all that you care about why do you even bother posting?

[Mysterious-G]

All of what?

If you mean that those are all that you care about why do you even bother posting?

You mean he isn't allowed to share what impressed him most? OK. Sure.

[Sizustar]

That is all.

http://i.imgur.com/VOPTerh.gif

[Horo The Wise Wolf]

http://i.imgur.com/VOPTerh.gif

After seeing that, I have been completed.

[Ce'Nedra]

http://i.imgur.com/VOPTerh.gif

Segawhy...

[Mysterious-G]

http://i.imgur.com/VOPTerh.gif

Typing will be considerably more difficult now with just one hand...

[IndigoNovember]

Ricardo uploading translations on his blog. As of this post, Hunter and Fighter are up.

Hopefully Limit Break will work well with Deadline Slayer. If done right, it'll be a guaranteed method of obtaining Deadline Slayer's damage bonus.

[Kikikiki]

You mean he isn't allowed to share what impressed him most? OK. Sure.

Sorry but his post doesn't make any sense. Are you sure he's impressed by them the most? No. You just interpreted it yourself. Just like how I interpreted it like how he only cares about those stuffs. I'm trying to get a clarification here, why are you up all in your pants defending his post? You need to calm down and stop seeing almost everything as an offense to your buddy.

[Ordy]

WB is nerfed, even though you can keep it upon weapon change? Sure, the second part is useful, but my only use aside from healing has been mitigated. >.>

WB weapon switch, that's awesome !!! WB, Launcher switch, back to rifle, still have bullets <3
WB, Impact slide, swicth AR for ZRA one and still have bullets.
WB, dagger dash to target, still have bullets
perma WB for some high HP mobs *kyaaaa*

Also ...

WHA buff? and something like 16 extra skill points after core RA skills, can't handle all the love!

http://i.imgur.com/ZfUN8Si.jpg

[Totori]

Sorry but his post doesn't make any sense. Are you sure he's impressed by them the most? No. You just interpreted it yourself. Just like how I interpreted it like how he only cares about those stuffs. I'm trying to get a clarification here, why are you up all in your pants defending his post? You need to calm down and stop seeing almost everything as an offense to your buddy.

Just try reading it a bit slower, you'll understand it then. It's saying that the user is happy with hearing that, something the user was looking forward to.

[Kikikiki]

Just try reading it a bit slower, you'll understand it then. It's saying that the user is happy with hearing that, something the user was looking forward to.

It is not. There isn't a lot of content in the post to read slower. The implication is hidden so far away behind his screen that I can't understand. I'm not someone that close to him to be able to figure it out. Your explanation is also just an interpretation of yourself.

Why are people here always getting their pants up when their buddies look like they are about to be offended? I don't even mean any harm.

It would be much faster if you let the person in question answer my concern instead.

[Unnamed Player]

There was something about Chain Trigger getting better too, but I didn't quite get what they were showcasing. Your own PAs increase the combo maybe?They let you lock on to the Cain Trigger.


Oh, and a new skill called "Twice Chain"They should have changed this skill into a passive one instead of giving us a second activation. v.v

[Sonatina]

I got these. (Hope this works)

Hu：http://i.imgur.com/EF0jdgT.jpg
Fi：http://i.imgur.com/VUK9VzV.jpg
Ra：http://i.imgur.com/e2xJoIB.jpg
Gu：http://i.imgur.com/uPH8lAK.jpg
Fo：http://i.imgur.com/yck9etA.jpg
Te：http://i.imgur.com/aTV4Khe.jpg
Br：http://i.imgur.com/8vc57T9.jpg
Bo: http://i.imgur.com/w4977md.jpg

[strikerhunter]

Ra new skill called Gravity Bomb and works like Zondeel? I swear if Cosmos Breaker gets nerfed badly..........

[Stealthcmc1974]

I wonder if, when they say no penalties/demerits on the stances, they mean that you only take the boosts from the stance and the weaknesses were removed.
Because if so, that's great for Guard Stance, seeing as how the damage isn't nerfed, we only get a defense boost.

Also, no SP required for Just Guard, plus less point needed for fury, plus a just guard heal, plus new defensive skills for hunter:
Hell Yes. This gives me a reason to be a tank.

[Yden]

Ra new skill called Gravity Bomb and works like Zondeel? I swear if Cosmos Breaker gets nerfed badly..........

Watch it use grenade items vastly limiting its use in quests.

[Ordy]

Launcher ground shooting speed increased. /o/ More Standing Snipe /o/

WB going from 300% to 250% but WHA 1 and 2 from 125% to 135%. 250% that's still good.

All these changes in HU tree make me think that "maybe" there will be a better alternative to sub-HU :|

[Xaelouse]

I wonder if, when they say no penalties/demerits on the stances, they mean that you only take the boosts from the stance and the weaknesses were removed.
Because if so, that's great for Guard Stance, seeing as how the damage isn't nerfed, we only get a defense boost.

Also, no SP required for Just Guard, plus less point needed for fury, plus a just guard heal, plus new defensive skills for hunter:
Hell Yes. This gives me a reason to be a tank.

No, tanks are still worthless in this game. However, war cry just got a lot more useful

Looking at the new skill tree, the choices seems to be between getting fury combo+war brave, fury combo+automate halfline, war brave+automate halfline, fury combo+iron will/ngu, or war brave+iron will/ngu. Fury combo is the new FSU2 in terms of taking 15 points for a 10% damage boost.

[Mysterious-G]

All these changes in HU tree make me think that "maybe" there will be a better alternative to sub-HU :|

New Braver skill according to bumped:
Charge Shot: Charged normal attack’s power and bullet speed increased.

That better includes arrows too lol, but I'd think so.

[EspeonageTieler]

will this really make playing tank hunter worth it? you still wont do much damage and the game is kill shit asap also can you even agro bosses?

[angrysquid]

Launcher ground shooting speed increased. /o/ More Standing Snipe /o/

WB going from 300% to 250% but WHA 1 and 2 from 125% to 135%. 250% that's still good.

All these changes in HU tree make me think that "maybe" there will be a better alternative to sub-HU :|

RA/FI/Flame Visit revival!!!!!! :D
No but for reals, I think FI will be a viable sub if stances will be passive/no penalty.
And RA/BR with special bullet keep will allow lots of Wb+BA+LN combos :)

[Sanguine2009]

hu should have some sp freed up by the tree revamp and fury reductions, its entirely possible you can still go full fury and max that new skill

[Ordy]

Right now, we don't need a Tank class. When we get Ultimate mode ... maybe (I really hope we'll need one).

All the new skill trees (Low Quality):


http://image.swiki.jp/img1/?host=pso2&page=%E7%94%BB%E5%83%8F%E7%BD%AE%E5%A0%B4&src=%E3%83%8F%E3%83%B3%E3%82%BF%E3%83%BC.pngHUNTER (http://i.imgur.com/Q1NAaNk.png)

http://image.swiki.jp/img1/?host=pso2&page=%E7%94%BB%E5%83%8F%E7%BD%AE%E5%A0%B4&src=%E3%83%95%E3%82%A1%E3%82%A4%E3%82%BF%E3%83%BC. pngFIGHTER (http://i.imgur.com/rv056wc.png)

http://image.swiki.jp/img1/?host=pso2&page=%E7%94%BB%E5%83%8F%E7%BD%AE%E5%A0%B4&src=%E3%83%AC%E3%83%B3%E3%82%B8%E3%83%A3%E3%83%BC. pngRANGER (http://i.imgur.com/lHFTwGH.png)

http://image.swiki.jp/img1/?host=pso2&page=%E7%94%BB%E5%83%8F%E7%BD%AE%E5%A0%B4&src=%E3%82%AC%E3%83%B3%E3%83%8A%E3%83%BC.pngGUNNER (http://i.imgur.com/1LkfOBN.png)

http://image.swiki.jp/img1/?host=pso2&page=%E7%94%BB%E5%83%8F%E7%BD%AE%E5%A0%B4&src=%E3%83%95%E3%82%A9%E3%83%BC%E3%82%B9.pngFORCE (http://i.imgur.com/ury6gZW.png)

http://image.swiki.jp/img1/?host=pso2&page=%E7%94%BB%E5%83%8F%E7%BD%AE%E5%A0%B4&src=%E3%83%86%E3%82%AF%E3%82%BF%E3%83%BC.pngTECHER (http://i.imgur.com/QurCEv6.png)

http://image.swiki.jp/img1/?host=pso2&page=%E7%94%BB%E5%83%8F%E7%BD%AE%E5%A0%B4&src=%E3%83%96%E3%83%AC%E3%82%A4%E3%83%90%E3%83%BC. pngBRAVER (http://i.imgur.com/PTOsLPW.png)

[Stealthcmc1974]

hu should have some sp freed up by the tree revamp and fury reductions, its entirely possible you can still go full fury and max that new skill

Thank you. The war cry skill is mainly why tank is more appealing. I never maxed Fury to begin with (ignored the crit stuff). Dealing more Dave while attracting enemies (something that'd be useful in, say, TD3), sign me on! But if you thought I was forgoing fury stance, you're out of your mind!

Besides, this will be for fun really. I'm making a dedicated HU/FI Cast. The idea for my main character is to have a BR/BOdewearl

[final_attack]

That Twice Chain ..... isn't that ..... add 2 hits for each hit you do? ._. If that's true .... it'll be much easier to use :D

[strikerhunter]

Right now, we don't need a Tank class. When we get Ultimate mode ... maybe (I really hope we'll need one).

All the new skill trees (Low Quality):


http://image.swiki.jp/img1/?host=pso2&page=%E7%94%BB%E5%83%8F%E7%BD%AE%E5%A0%B4&src=%E3%83%8F%E3%83%B3%E3%82%BF%E3%83%BC.pngHUNTER (http://i.imgur.com/Q1NAaNk.png)

http://image.swiki.jp/img1/?host=pso2&page=%E7%94%BB%E5%83%8F%E7%BD%AE%E5%A0%B4&src=%E3%83%95%E3%82%A1%E3%82%A4%E3%82%BF%E3%83%BC. pngFIGHTER (http://i.imgur.com/rv056wc.png)

http://image.swiki.jp/img1/?host=pso2&page=%E7%94%BB%E5%83%8F%E7%BD%AE%E5%A0%B4&src=%E3%83%AC%E3%83%B3%E3%82%B8%E3%83%A3%E3%83%BC. pngRANGER (http://i.imgur.com/lHFTwGH.png)

http://image.swiki.jp/img1/?host=pso2&page=%E7%94%BB%E5%83%8F%E7%BD%AE%E5%A0%B4&src=%E3%82%AC%E3%83%B3%E3%83%8A%E3%83%BC.pngGUNNER (http://i.imgur.com/1LkfOBN.png)

http://image.swiki.jp/img1/?host=pso2&page=%E7%94%BB%E5%83%8F%E7%BD%AE%E5%A0%B4&src=%E3%83%95%E3%82%A9%E3%83%BC%E3%82%B9.pngFORCE (http://i.imgur.com/ury6gZW.png)

http://image.swiki.jp/img1/?host=pso2&page=%E7%94%BB%E5%83%8F%E7%BD%AE%E5%A0%B4&src=%E3%83%86%E3%82%AF%E3%82%BF%E3%83%BC.pngTECHER (http://i.imgur.com/QurCEv6.png)

http://image.swiki.jp/img1/?host=pso2&page=%E7%94%BB%E5%83%8F%E7%BD%AE%E5%A0%B4&src=%E3%83%96%E3%83%AC%E3%82%A4%E3%83%90%E3%83%BC. pngBRAVER (http://i.imgur.com/PTOsLPW.png)


War Cry isn't locked by Guard Stance this time around? That's it, time to drop my Gu and pick up my Fi again and begin leveling him up.

[Kikikiki]

New Braver skill according to bumped:
Charge Shot: Charged normal attack’s power and bullet speed increased.

That better includes arrows too lol, but I'd think so.

What.

It says charged normal attack.

Only Bow's normal attack can be charged.

Obviously it's for bow.

[Sizustar]

What.

It says charged normal attack.

Only Bow's normal attack can be charged.

Obviously it's for bow.

To add to that, the bow is called Bullet Bow

[Rakurai]

Tech Arts JA bonus sounds interesting, especially because it works for techs, too.

Depending on how big the damage bonus is, it might be practical to throw down a Zanverse then use a tech to get a double damage boost.

[landman]

Doesn't FO already have a tech JA bonus? what's the new one?


Checking those Skill trees, I'm impressed with the FO and TE ones, mastery 1 + 2 just 20 skill points, anything else that is not status effect direct access. That will transform into a lot of free skill points!

[Sizustar]

Doesn't FO already have a tech JA bonus? what's the new one?


Checking those Skill trees, I'm impressed with the FO and TE ones, mastery 1 + 2 just 20 skill points, anything else that is not status effect direct access. That will transform into a lot of free skill points!

That's a new skill for Fighter.

[strikerhunter]

New one (Fi tree) gives bonus for any PA or Techs used in a combination.

[Meji]

Oh wait, HU get Just Guard and Step Attack per default now?

[Sanguine2009]

yeah, a number skills like that are being made innate to their classes

[Bellion]

Aiming at a Rockbear face was so hard that they decided to make a lock-on to it, okay. I'm going to assume they're making nerfs to the Grenade Shell and Crazy Smash Satellite Cannon and Cosmos Breaker, duh.

Photon Flare is still bad, wonderful. Probably Il Barta, IRUMEGIDO, and Namegid nerf.

[The_Brimada]

Keeping wb upon weapon switch is awesome, and also I agree that previewing scratch content is great too. It took long enough.

[The Walrus]

Aw man did they kill la kill Gunner ;_;

[Xaelouse]

PF may be bad but it's very accessible now if you dont want Bolt PP Save for whatever reason

[Jaqlou Swig KING]

That sprint doe


Aw man did they kill la kill Gunner ;_;

That's just a liiiiiiiil dramatic tbh, not many things are that bad

[Gama]

http://i.imgur.com/VOPTerh.gif


i'd sit on that.

[Mysterious-G]

To add to that, the bow is called Bullet Bow

Oh, that's true. The wording of the translation as "bullet speed" put me off then. To begin with though, I was only referring to the speed boost. Average Stance is close to Fury Stance now, and if there was an additional speed boost for bullets... But this means ranged weapons other than bullet bows aren't even included in the speed increase then? Or are they? Thank you for the clarification in advance.

[Stealthcmc1974]

will this really make playing tank hunter worth it? you still wont do much damage and the game is kill shit asap also can you even agro bosses?

Honestly, tank hunter would be more support to agro stuff away in things like TD3, or to solo stuff if you want to just take hits. But I wouldn't make it your primary hunter tree, offensive overall is still better. If you have another character or skill tree, go for it. The thing is, with the reduction in points needed to max fury and new defensive skills like that just guard heal, those defensive options are more appealing. :)

[Xaelouse]

Massive Hunter apparently got 5 points knocked off of it too. If they did something about its awful cooldown it could end up being useful and cheaper than automate and iron will

[Gardios]

Why is Fury S Up only 5 but Guard S Up 10

Why are you so mean to me, SEGA

[Zyrusticae]

With regards to techer PP management, it's pretty obvious they intend techers to restore PP by whacking things to death with wands instead of constantly casting all day. The change to Wand Lovers to make it into a stance pretty much assures that. If you want to play techer as a pure caster you're just going to have to deal with it and sub force. On the other hand, this is a straight buff to Te/Hu or Te/Fi or even Te/Br.


Aw man did they kill la kill Gunner ;_;
Knee-jerk reactions like this are bloody hilarious.

Yes, they nerfed S-Roll JA Up by 40%. They also nerfed the fuck out of Fury Stance, which means every single physical attack class will be doing less damage than before. PLUS they nerfed all the most problematic techs and PAs.

Repeat after me: everything you know is wrong. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KThlYHfIVa8)

I'm not sure Weak Hit Advance actually needed that buff however, but I guess they wanted to throw rangers a bone since the WB nerf is going to hurt a bit. Also lol @ rangers getting a zondeel grenade.

Also, fucking 122 PA buffs and 5 nerfs. That number. Absurd. Ridiculous. (Btw are we supposed to count techer techniques separately from force techniques, i.e. fire-ice-lightning vs wind-light-dark? Because that makes the number even higher...).

[WBMike]

Oh, that's true. The wording of the translation as "bullet speed" put me off then. To begin with though, I was only referring to the speed boost. Average Stance is close to Fury Stance now, and if there was an additional speed boost for bullets... But this means ranged weapons other than bullet bows aren't even included in the speed increase then? Or are they? Thank you for the clarification in advance.


Video says it's when Bullet Bows are equipped; the slide just gives a basic explanation to get everyone up to speed. The more detailed explanation is found within the game.

[starwind75043]

i am certainly happy to see at least attempting a tank build will be easier. Will it work i guess we will have to see once the put it in

[gigawuts]

Skill Trees[SPOILER-BOX]http://i.imgur.com/gTToyTq.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/1yNV6LJ.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/p1FtRwU.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]

hmm, this looks familiar...


Some ideas I've aggregated over the long while I've played this game.

This is a work in progress. Input welcome as always.

[SPOILER-BOX]http://i.imgur.com/tW3AO9P.png[/SPOILER-BOX]

Skill Changes:
[SPOILER-BOX]Old Skill Changes:
[SPOILER-BOX]JA Bonus: 5% to 10% JA damage
Flash Guard: 10% to 20% Strike & Range Resist and 1% to 15% Tech Resist (Tech has delayed growth, going 1,2,3,4,5,7,9,12,15)
Step Advance: 0.11 to 0.20 seconds
Fury Stance: +20% damage at level 10 (deal with it)
Fury Critical: +10% to +20% crit rate
War Cry: 15 to 30 second duration, 120% to 200% hate, still 30 second cooldown
Massive Hunter: 20 to 35 Second Duration, 90 Second cooldown, no damage resistance
Iron Will: 35% to 75% chance to survive with 1 hp, unless you have 1 hp
Guard Stance: Same as now
Absorption: Same, just 5 SP less to max
Automate Halfline: 40% to 100% chance to automatically use a mate at 50% hp
[/SPOILER-BOX]
New Skills:
[SPOILER-BOX]Block-related Skills:
Normal Guard PP Save: Normal Guard PP cost reduced from 10 to 5/3/1
Just Guard Buff: Just Guarding applies one Shifta & Deband pulse (S&D 16, 20 seconds duration, stacks infinitely)
Just Guard Bonus: When Just Guarding you recover 1% to 7.5% HP and 5% to 15% PP

Fury-related Skills:
Gear Blast Bonus: Each gear bar grants +10% to +25% to PB Gauge fill rate [and damage?] (Fury Stance not required to be active)
Fury Charge Speed Up: -5% to -20% charge time for all chargeable attacks (PAs, Techs, Normals) during Fury Stance
Fury Gear Boost: +25% to +30% gear gained during Fury Stance
JA PP Save: -10 to -15% PP cost for all PAs & techs (Fury Stance not required to be active)

War Cry Skills:
Warzone: A field is projected around the player applying hate to nearby enemies continuously (1sp is low hate & the size of uncharged zondeel, 5 sp is medium hate & the size of territory burst charged zondeel)
En Garde: While holding a melee weapon, the enemy you target lock will feel Warzone's hate at any range

Massive Hunter Skills:
Resilient Pumper: Hyper armor during all fistpumps (Massive Hunter not required to be active)
Fast Pumper: All fistpumps animations are faster (Massive Hunter not required to be active)
Massive Charger: While Massive Hunter is active, charging an attack pauses Massive Hunter's countdown until attack is prepared

Iron Will Skills:
Sturdy Hunter: When at 100% to 95% hp Iron Will will always proc (Variance only because switching weapons with different affixes will change your max HP, but will leave that HP unhealed)

Guard-related Skills:
Status Tolerance: SE effects (shock's knockdown, freeze's...freeze, burn/poison's damage, etc.) have a 30-70% chance to do nothing to you (Guard Stance not required to be active)
Guard Time Bonus: When Guard Stance is active Massive Hunter, War Cry, and Never Give Up last 25-100% longer
Guard Gear Boost: When Guard Stance is active taking damage raises gear similar to how Mechgun gear is reduced (no flinch = small, flinch = medium, knockdown = large) (I can't base gains off of damage since better tanks take less damage)
Hated Hunter: +25% to +80% to all Hate (Yes, that includes War Cry & all of its related skills) (Guard Stance not required to be active)[/SPOILER-BOX][/SPOILER-BOX]

Goals:
Flesh out concepts, make sure things meet expectations
Allow players to choose the combinations of skills they want
Make sure things are able to be combined effectively
Reward specialization, but not too much
Make skills that can combine well with other classes

I focused on separating active or functional skills, so that you can pick and choose what you want and don't want in any combination (Maybe you want a glass cannon that won't be 1shotted, maybe you want offense with war cry, I don't know). Skills are good at 1 SP, and get better as you invest. Skills that shouldn't get better than a certain point (e.g. iron will), but don't warrant 10 sp for that point (e.g. iron will), are reduced to 5 SP. They usually expand into at least one additional skill that complements the parent skill. Handling JA Bonus sucked because Guard Stance users need a source of damage, but JA Bonus shouldn't be too powerful, and I don't really think 10% is worth 10 sp if it's unable to achieve the current +~100% damage (all combined multipliers reach +~60%). I want that extra SP to be spent on utility skills, the class should be about options and versatility.

There are some skills that are in Guard or Fury that I feel should be bonuses for players using those stances, but still available to users of the opposing stance if they want to invest for them. If someone really really really wants to do Fury, War Cry, and Hated Hunter for max aggro I won't tell them not to, but they won't get other goodies if they do it.

I had other ideas, but most of them would be better suited to other classes. Maybe I'll get around to those.



well it's not 1:1, but it's still an improvement

[Atmius]

Photon Flare is still bad, wonderful. Probably Il Barta, IRUMEGIDO, and Namegid nerf.

Nope, el barta, il megid, and.... il grants. On the flip side, while no changes were mentioned about photon flares damage, it could well be in for a change since limit break was datamined to be a flat s-atk boost like photon flare currently is, and now is not. If it does get changed to a %, it could well be worth it, but if it stays as a flat 400 it's' not worth 20 points.

[D-Inferno]

Hopefully the Ilgrants nerf is only to it's confusion rate. They probably considered it to be too easy of a Vibrace stunner.

[Enforcer MKV]

Hell, I might have to invest in a VPN now...

[gigawuts]

Hell, I might have to invest in a VPN now...

If they allowed us to reset skilltrees for free (or for some meseta fee, like 1k per class level) that would be a "definitely."

That and reducing the multipliers on HU are all that's needed, really.

[Zyrusticae]

Quick arithmetic, Fury Stance with all boosts (including JA up) will be 1.76x/176% vs the 2.2x/220% we have now. An extremely hefty nerf (and given this, it makes more sense that S-Roll JA Up is down by 40% as well, from 2.0x/200% to 1.6x/160%).

And then there's Wise and Brave stances no longer have penalties for hitting the wrong side. I wonder if they're going to do something about the stance switching animation?

[gigawuts]

Quick arithmetic, Fury Stance with all boosts (including JA up) will be 1.76x/176% vs the 2.2x/220% we have now. An extremely hefty nerf (and given this, it makes more sense that S-Roll JA Up is down by 40% as well, from 2.0x/200% to 1.6x/160%).

And then there's Wise and Brave stances no longer have penalties for hitting the wrong side. I wonder if they're going to do something about the stance switching animation?

Oh, cool. I figured it was the same.

Hmm...

Any mention of the fighter stance cooldowns? They could be 10 seconds and it would still be annoying, but a huge improvement.

They should also really get a JA circle after the pump, but only because the pump shouldn't be there at all.

[The Walrus]

If they're removing the penalties from brave and wise stances then they might as well just combine them into one stance or something.

Btw Zyru, that post you quoted wasn't serious

EDIT: are they nerfing the ranged bonus for fury stance too?

[Enforcer MKV]

If they allowed us to reset skilltrees for free (or for some meseta fee, like 1k per class level) that would be a "definitely."

That and reducing the multipliers on HU are all that's needed, really.

Seriously...gaaaaaaaah, this is actually making me want to play again.

[ReverseSeraf]

Right now, we don't need a Tank class. When we get Ultimate mode ... maybe (I really hope we'll need one).

All the new skill trees (Low Quality):


http://image.swiki.jp/img1/?host=pso2&page=%E7%94%BB%E5%83%8F%E7%BD%AE%E5%A0%B4&src=%E3%83%8F%E3%83%B3%E3%82%BF%E3%83%BC.pngHUNTER (http://i.imgur.com/Q1NAaNk.png)

http://image.swiki.jp/img1/?host=pso2&page=%E7%94%BB%E5%83%8F%E7%BD%AE%E5%A0%B4&src=%E3%83%95%E3%82%A1%E3%82%A4%E3%82%BF%E3%83%BC. pngFIGHTER (http://i.imgur.com/rv056wc.png)

http://image.swiki.jp/img1/?host=pso2&page=%E7%94%BB%E5%83%8F%E7%BD%AE%E5%A0%B4&src=%E3%83%AC%E3%83%B3%E3%82%B8%E3%83%A3%E3%83%BC. pngRANGER (http://i.imgur.com/lHFTwGH.png)

http://image.swiki.jp/img1/?host=pso2&page=%E7%94%BB%E5%83%8F%E7%BD%AE%E5%A0%B4&src=%E3%82%AC%E3%83%B3%E3%83%8A%E3%83%BC.pngGUNNER (http://i.imgur.com/1LkfOBN.png)

http://image.swiki.jp/img1/?host=pso2&page=%E7%94%BB%E5%83%8F%E7%BD%AE%E5%A0%B4&src=%E3%83%95%E3%82%A9%E3%83%BC%E3%82%B9.pngFORCE (http://i.imgur.com/ury6gZW.png)

http://image.swiki.jp/img1/?host=pso2&page=%E7%94%BB%E5%83%8F%E7%BD%AE%E5%A0%B4&src=%E3%83%86%E3%82%AF%E3%82%BF%E3%83%BC.pngTECHER (http://i.imgur.com/QurCEv6.png)

http://image.swiki.jp/img1/?host=pso2&page=%E7%94%BB%E5%83%8F%E7%BD%AE%E5%A0%B4&src=%E3%83%96%E3%83%AC%E3%82%A4%E3%83%90%E3%83%BC. pngBRAVER (http://i.imgur.com/PTOsLPW.png)


Good find, Ordy!

I took the liberty to translate the update skill trees along with the new skills we are going to get. Plan your skill builds now!

Forgive the poor MS Paint job lol

Hunter: [SPOILER-BOX]http://i.imgur.com/jGfUyoZ.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]
Fighter: [SPOILER-BOX]http://i.imgur.com/JdxnVnD.png[/SPOILER-BOX]
Ranger: [SPOILER-BOX]http://i.imgur.com/8zf5P8q.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]
Gunner: [SPOILER-BOX]http://i.imgur.com/ebA0DD6.png[/SPOILER-BOX]
Force: [SPOILER-BOX]http://i.imgur.com/SdWk4Ej.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]
Techer: [SPOILER-BOX]http://i.imgur.com/yaQmw8N.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]
Braver: [SPOILER-BOX]http://i.imgur.com/bhaFAOZ.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]

EDIT:
Wrong spoiler things :v

[Zyrusticae]

Apparently by "•Sped up attack animations, Recovery Frames, and improved attack range." they actually included stance animations in that. Stance dancing fighters can rejoice!



EDIT: are they nerfing the ranged bonus for fury stance too?
No mention of this for the core skill. However, since both Fury Stance Ups now cap out at level 5 (1.05x) and Fury Combo Up is now 1.1x, that's a direct nerf to the ranged bonus as well.

[Enforcer MKV]

GDI, Seraf, spoiler boxes!

[ReverseSeraf]

GDI, Seraf, spoiler boxes!

I'm sorry! ;w;

[SakoHaruo]

Fighter: [SPOILER-BOX]http://i.imgur.com/JdxnVnD.png[/SPOILER-BOX]
v

Brave/Slayer build is now a thing.

Also, rip step advance.

[spoiler-box]http://img.gawkerassets.com/img/196frnnzysficgif/original.gif[/spoiler-box]

[The Walrus]

No mention of this for the core skill. However, since both Fury Stance Ups now cap out at level 5 (1.05x) and Fury Combo Up is now 1.1x, that's a direct nerf to the ranged bonus as well.

Hmmmm, guess GU/RA will be making a comeback then with this nerf and the RA buffs...

Should be interesting now.

[Bellion]

It's probably just an SP cap of 5 and still getting 10% for the Fury Stance Ups.

[HIT0SHI]

I took the liberty to translate the update skill trees along with the new skills we are going to get. Plan your skill builds now!

HU/RA Temjin build let's go! :-D

[Mega Ultra Chicken]

If they allowed us to reset skilltrees for free (or for some meseta fee, like 1k per class level) that would be a "definitely."

They usually hand out free reset passes every time they change the skill trees, don't they?

[Dinosaur]

GU tree is easy

max:
ZRA1
ZRA2
APPR
PK
High Time
S-Roll JA
Chain Finish

Others:
Chain Trigger (lvl 8 )
Showtime (lvl 1)
TMG gear
Chain F Bonus
Twice Chain
Rare Mastery

Prereqs:
R-atk 1 (lvl 3)
S-Roll up (lvl 2)
S-Roll Arts (lvl 2)

Perfect 80 points

[final_attack]

Er ....... after looking at Fi's Limit Break .....

Will that buff will proc Perfect Keeper, Halfline, and Deadline Slayer? Since .... we didn't get hit, right? :wacko: I might use GuFi if that's true (after doing some research later of course) XDD

[Bellion]

Perfect Keeper needs your hp to be at 100%, so nope.

[gigawuts]

They usually hand out free reset passes every time they change the skill trees, don't they?

One per character, yes.

So if you click on one too many SP cg on wasting a reset or mucking up a build.

[ReverseSeraf]

Er ....... after looking at Fi's Limit Break .....

Will that buff will proc Perfect Keeper, Halfline, and Deadline Slayer? Since .... we didn't get hit, right? :wacko: I might use GuFi if that's true (after doing some research later of course) XDD

Limit Break increases your attack for every enemy who has aggro on you after War Cry. So yes, those other skills can proc, but they won't proc with each other (Perfect Keeper requires 100% HP, Halfline requires under 50%, Deadline requires under 25%).

EDIT:

... I was thinking of a completely different skill. Disregard this

[infiniteeverlasting]

is there a need to put SP into step advance now that you dont need it to unlock step attack just reversal etc?

[Kondibon]

is there a need to put SP into step advance now that you dont need it to unlock step attack just reversal etc?Nope. :wacko:

[Evangelion X.XX]

I definitely like the revamped-streamlined skill trees; we're not really forced to get "useless" skills as prerequisites nor are any particular skills buried deeply within their respective tree.

Overall, I think there are many good changes.

[Zyrusticae]

It's probably just an SP cap of 5 and still getting 10% for the Fury Stance Ups.
That's a possibility, but given that everything else (except the base stance skill) now follows the formula of +1% per 1 SP, it is rather unlikely.

[final_attack]

Aw ..... too bad .....

I thought Limit Break just reduce max HP, so it still counted as 100%, and who knows, maybe Halfline + Deadline looks at current HP percentage compared to before it's reduced lol ....

But, it saved a lot of time if it's unusable ...... to grind Fi :D Didn't have the time to grind lately :/

Time to look into WarCry ..... and maybe Iron Will >_>

[Kondibon]

So I'm reading the translations on bumped.

"Elemental Stance: Strikes the elemental weakness."

Does this sound as awesome to anyone else as it does to me? Combined with the changes to techer I can see why they would say it'd be a good sub for Bouncer.

[Xaelouse]

That sounds like a rainbow set of jet boots and dualblades
Break Stance seems way too conditional to be a stance. Hopefully it has an unconditional boost for non-breakable parts

[The Walrus]

In exchange for increased rewards, Chroto TA orders will become once a week.


I'm game

[Kondibon]

That sounds like a rainbow set of jet boots and dualblades
Break Stance seems way too conditional to be a stance. Hopefully it has an unconditional boost for non-breakable parts
Siwtch strike seems to be what was causing the jet boots to change element in the trailers, so it's likely the element on the actual boots doesn't matter. I kinda wish Wand gear worked like that too. :/

[ReverseSeraf]

So I'm reading the translations on bumped.

"Elemental Stance: Strikes the elemental weakness."

Does this sound as awesome to anyone else as it does to me? Combined with the changes to techer I can see why they would say it'd be a good sub for Bouncer.

That, combined with a (EDIT: skill, not stance) that intentionally makes Jet Boots into striking type (instead of by default), will make Hu a not so obvious choice as a sub for Bouncer.

[ReverseSeraf]

Siwtch strike seems to be what was causing the jet boots to change element in the trailers, so it's likely the element on the actual boots doesn't matter. I kinda wish Wand gear worked like that too. :/

I think you're referring to Elemental Stance, since it is a stance that requires players to kind of stand there switching. Switch Strike seems to be completely different.


Aw ..... too bad .....

I thought Limit Break just reduce max HP, so it still counted as 100%, and who knows, maybe Halfline + Deadline looks at current HP percentage compared to before it's reduced lol ....

But, it saved a lot of time if it's unusable ...... to grind Fi :D Didn't have the time to grind lately :/

Time to look into WarCry ..... and maybe Iron Will >_>

No no, you were right. I was thinking of War Brave. Why on earth I would do that...

[Kondibon]

The wording is wierd for both of them on bumped.

[ReverseSeraf]

The wording is wierd for both of them on bumped.

It is weird, but...


Switch Strike: Changes the Jet Boots to striking-elemented.

It would make more sense that Jet Boots would change to striking-type. The word "elemented" at the end is a bit confusing, but I'm sure that would fit more with Elemental Stance.

[Kondibon]

It would make more sense that Jet Boots would change to striking-type. The word "elemented" at the end is a bit confusing, but I'm sure that would fit more with Elemental Stance.I was reading it as changing to elemental striking damage. Like wand gear.

[Mega Ultra Chicken]

Well damn... Now I don't know which subclass to take for Luca's Gunner class now that Fury Stance is getting the Nerfbat.

[final_attack]

And ...... time to grind Ranger ...... That Weak Hit Advance buff ...... and those grenades ......

I wonder if the conserved WB will be gone if I changed to tmg ...... well, it didn't gone by changing to Launcher .....

And ..... should the wb is still loaded, and changed my weapon to tmg ..... I wonder if Power Bullet and PP Save Bullet will proc :wacko:

[Kondibon]

And ..... should the wb is still loaded, and changed my weapon to tmg ..... I wonder if Power Bullet and PP Save Bullet will proc :wacko:I think they just meant that as long as you don't completely remove the weapon from your palette you'll keep the bullets. It'll be kinda lame if the only other weapons you can keep it up with are launchers/gunslashes.

I want my super amazing pp save support TE/RA build.

[final_attack]

True.

I'm doing support role when I'm not playing as Gunner, so, I want that too XD

[Kondibon]

True.

I'm doing support role when I'm not playing as Gunner, so, I want that too XDThe best thing about it is that with the buffs to TE's offense I probably won't be losing that much damage. I just hope they actually buff grenades/traps in a way that lets us carry more and makes them easier to use.

[un1t27]

damn damn damn


i feel bad for taco spammers & im starting to feel silly to even still be playing this game now.

[Rayokarna]

I think they just meant that as long as you don't completely remove the weapon from your palette you'll keep the bullets. It'll be kinda lame if the only other weapons you can keep it up with are launchers/gunslashes.

I want my super amazing pp save support TE/RA build.

It was possible before, now it's super easy.

[WBMike]

I was reading it as changing to elemental striking damage. Like wand gear.

Switch Strike, switches the boots over to striking basically.

The other stance skill seems more in line for Dual Blades. Not sure if Jet Boots apply to it yet. I'll probably have to go back and gather whatever was missed.

So because of that I'll change the wording to make it less confusing.

[Kondibon]

damn damn damn


i feel bad for taco spammers & im starting to feel silly to even still be playing this game now.Anyone who spammed TACOs for fun still can...


It was possible before, now it's super easy.Yeah but it was also super bad because of all the damage you lost by combining ranger and techer.


Switch Strike, switches the boots over to striking basically.

The other stance skill seems more in line for Dual Blades. Not sure if Jet Boots apply to it yet. I'll probably have to go back and gather whatever was missed.

So because of that I'll change the wording to make it less confusing.Oh I see. Thanks for the clarification.

[KuroNeko77]

Those Fighter changes please me, although I was hoping for some tweaking on the t.daggers and knuckles gears.

Now to wait and see if Bouncer is viable as a sub for Fi.

[ReverseSeraf]

I think they just meant that as long as you don't completely remove the weapon from your palette you'll keep the bullets. It'll be kinda lame if the only other weapons you can keep it up with are launchers/gunslashes.

I want my super amazing pp save support TE/RA build.

I think it actually means as long as you have a Ra weapon in your hand. It'd be ridiculous to switch to Sword and still maintain WB as long as you have a rifle in your palette. Yet again, that could be interesting... VERY interesting, in fact.

Gunslash isn't really considered a Ra weapon, I think.

[Kondibon]

I think it actually means as long as you have a Ra weapon in your hand. It'd be ridiculous to switch to Sword and still maintain WB as long as you have a rifle in your palette. Yet again, that could be interesting... VERY interesting, in fact.

Gunslash isn't really considered a Ra weapon, I think.Well if bullet PP save still works with it then it'll have it's uses for saving PP with launchers.

[Rayokarna]

Yeah but it was also super bad because of all the damage you lost by combining ranger and techer.



To be honest anyone doing it, wouldn't be doing it for damage and to be honest the damage would still be considerably low unless a lot of stuff changes. An improvement to Traps and tools will only really work if it scales better off R-Atk (Which I'm hoping it was the case) and improved start up and recovery. Other than that, while you might be able tag on a few extra damage abilities, the main difference is the wide range of utility Ra/Te (or whatever combination) has. If anything the Fury nerf inadvertently helps with the damage gap.

This coming from a Ra/Te (PP Battery Trap build) main.

[ReverseSeraf]

Well if bullet PP save still works with it then it'll have it's uses for saving PP with launchers.

Power Bullet too! Spam Cluster Bullet / Cosmos Breaker all day errday

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

WB nerf

http://static.fjcdn.com/pictures/Black_5eb287_771726.gif

[Asellus]

I like the TA restriction coming with the update.

I'm to lazy to run TA and I think its a huge advantage for other players who do, and more so with alts.

Why shouldn't I be rewarded for being lazy? Punish those who try to hard.

Finally PSO2 gets something right. :yes:

[Kondibon]

To be honest anyone doing it, wouldn't be doing it for damage and to be honest the damage would still be considerably low unless a lot of stuff changes. An improvement to Traps and tools will only really work if it scales better off R-Atk (Which I'm hoping it was the case) and improved start up and recovery. Other than that, while you might be able tag on a few extra damage abilities, the main difference is the wide range of utility Ra/Te (or whatever combination) has. If anything the Fury nerf inadvertently helps with the damage gap.

This coming from a Ra/Te (PP Battery Trap build) main.Eh? I know it's for support, my point was that I can play a support build but still dish out decent damage compared to more offensively built characters.


Power Bullet too! Spam Cluster Bullet / Cosmos Breaker all day errdayDid they buff power bullet? Cause if not then it's still no good due to the durration not lasting as long as you have a bullet loaded. x:


I like the TA restriction coming with the update.

I'm to lazy to run TA and I think its a huge advantage for other players who do, and more so with alts.

Why shouldn't I be rewarded for being lazy? Punish those who try to hard.

Finally PSO2 gets something right. :yes:You realize there's still gonna be stuff to do for money. It's just not gonna be the exact same set of predictable quests over and over again. I know you're joking but still.

[ReverseSeraf]

Did they buff power bullet? Cause if not then it's still no good due to the durration not lasting as long as you have a bullet loaded. x:

You still need 3 points to get to PP Bullet Save, so might as well include that into the equation

[Mega Ultra Chicken]

I like the TA restriction coming with the update.

I'm to lazy to run TA and I think its a huge advantage for other players who do, and more so with alts.

Why shouldn't I be rewarded for being lazy? Punish those who try to hard.

Finally PSO2 gets something right. :yes:

Oh, come on. With a group, TAs are easy. Doing TAs is hardly "trying too hard."

[Kondibon]

You still need 3 points to get to PP Bullet Save, so might as well include that into the equationFair enough. XD

[DrCatco]

Switch Strike, switches the boots over to striking basically.

The other stance skill seems more in line for Dual Blades. Not sure if Jet Boots apply to it yet. I'll probably have to go back and gather whatever was missed.

So because of that I'll change the wording to make it less confusing.

Then, one moment you can kick mobs, switch, and then throwing techs with your feet? I'm in. ^^

BO will be at the forefront in the battle, loading PP, returning back, throwing techniques, bouncing betw-

oh.

OOOOOOOOH.

[Rayokarna]

Eh? I know it's for support, my point was that I can play a support build but still dish out decent damage compared to more offensively built characters.



I'm hoping so too, with the increase of the other PA buffs, Tool changes and Shifta Strikel it will be much better than before. Bullet Switch is probably Ra's best buff since it now makes them a very good class to sub.

[Kondibon]

Then, one moment you can kick mobs, switch, and then throwing techs with your feet? I'm in. ^^

BO will be at the forefront in the battle, loading PP, returning back, throwing techniques, bouncing betw-

oh.

OOOOOOOOH.
I don't think it's going to actually change the weapon's stats, just the damage type it deals with normal attacks and PAs.

[Maenara]

Did Photon Flare Afterburst always need only 1 SP?

[Kondibon]

Did Photon Flare Afterburst always need only 1 SP?Nope. Unless they change the way it works entirely though people still probably aren't going to spec for it. I've personally always wanted to do a photon flare build, so I might try it anyway.

[Cyron Tanryoku]

Hmmmm, guess GU/RA will be making a comeback then with this nerf and the RA buffs...

GURA went somewhere?

[ShinMaruku]

Then, one moment you can kick mobs, switch, and then throwing techs with your feet? I'm in. ^^

BO will be at the forefront in the battle, loading PP, returning back, throwing techniques, bouncing betw-

oh.

OOOOOOOOH.

http://a.pomf.se/cwsthr.gif

[The Walrus]

GURA went somewhere?


I guess not, always assumed most Gunners subbed Hunter.

[ShinMaruku]

My gunner subs ranger sometimes. Now She will be all the time. Good riddance HU

[final_attack]

Considering .... Photon Flare After Burst was +100 (50% of basic Photon Flare) ..... It might use that too. So, 1 point ...... Adding T-Atk by 50% of basic Photon Flare Bonus.

At any rate, I'm gonna use that build, since Photon Flare is reached easily, and I don't have to raise Flame Mastery ..... So, I got spare points (I got broken Mag, originally spec'ed for Hybrid Braver ^^; 145 Dex, 29 T-Atk, 1 S-Atk ...... So, that amount of T-Atk bonus is amazing ...... I can catch up a little bit, even if it's just for a while.)

Time to raise Ra for my Gu (prepping for Ep 3) tomorrow XD

[Kondibon]

http://a.pomf.se/cwsthr.gifhttp://i.imgur.com/tOqBm8G.gif


I guess not, always assumed most Gunners subbed Hunter.
I sub ranger because fuck all these people subbing hunter so hard that no one ever has WB MPAs. >_>

[ShinMaruku]

Yes all worship the water tribe princess. (Yeah really Korra is their princess her parents are leader of both north and south, she could claim to be their princess :E)

I sub ranger and I tell people I have weakbullet and they praise me. :P

[Kondibon]

I sub ranger and I tell people I have weakbullet and they praise me. :PWe are a sacred blessing from the gods.

[ShinMaruku]

And now we shall be more so.
http://abload.de/img/f70aa995832cd48259f91zsxfs.gif Yeah man Bouncer needs to be made by platinum. Until I can ORA ORA ORA" a boss I feel weak. :(

[Mega Ultra Chicken]

We are a sacred blessing from the gods.

Either way, keeping WB even after switching weapons will be a pretty major plus for GU/RA's nuking.

I might know what I want Luca's Gunner spec to be... although I've already played GU/RA before. They're squishy. (Then again, I was a GU/RAnewearl.)

[The Walrus]

Isn't that weak bullet keep for RA weapons only though? At least that's what I saw on bumped

[KazukiQZ]

^Hope it's as long there's Ranger weapon on your weapon palette :)

[moorebounce]

I'm liking some of the changes so far. It won't suck major balls to be a Hunter. Trap search should've been by default for all Casts anyway like in PSO. Once they fix Casts being poisoned (because machines aren't organic) I'll be happy. Shocked yes poisoned no. Automate Halfline should be default for Casts too IMO.

Can't wait for the skill tree reset tickets.

[Kondibon]

I'm liking some of the changes so far. It won't suck major balls to be a Hunter. Trap search should've been by default for all Casts anyway like in PSO. Once they fix Casts being poisoned (because machines aren't organic) I'll be happy. Shocked yes poisoned no. Automate Halfline should be default for Casts too IMO.
I'm pretty sure that's all for balance reasons anyway. Or do you want casts to not be able to use techs too?

Besides, all the mechs on Lilipa are like... super weak to poison for some reason. ._.

EDIT: also, based on what someone said about Lisa's backstory casts might be semi-organic anyway

[SakoHaruo]

Once they fix Casts being poisoned (because machines aren't organic) I'll be happy. Shocked yes poisoned no.

Think of it... as a virus. :-?

But I agree with you.

[ShinMaruku]

Since casts drink they have some organic parts. :P

[KazukiQZ]

Mahouka scratch related, Miyuki's CAD camo is for Wand...wtf? Or anyone can confirm if it's for Talis too?

And Tetsuya's Silver Horn CAD is for TMG, AR and GS. Awesome! (may gonna cost alot tho...)

[obsexed]

bruh, these changes... cant even.

[Daiyousei]

https://m.facebook.com/groups/470211779656493?view=permalink&id=840733385937662

Someone on Facebook helpfully translated the new tree layout.

[gigawuts]

Think of it... as a virus. :-?

But I agree with you.

I prefer corrosive venom.

[obsexed]

https://m.facebook.com/groups/470211779656493?view=permalink&id=840733385937662

Someone on Facebook helpfully translated the new tree layout.

already translated on this thread though, you is late my brutha

[Omega-z]

^Casts are Android's which do have a level of Bio-mass/chips...etc. in there bodies and minds. The amount is small tho around 5 ~ 15%. This allows them to use Techs but just weaker or different, drink monomates....etc. . Also it allowed them to Transform, Sommon and Swap Parts as well since there bodies aren't set to one shape. The mean reason why Casts couldn't use Techs in PSO (Besides Sega Programming it that way) was the current sociability of the people and government at that time. So Casts can be Poisoned, Virus'd, Megid, Hacked and Mind Controlled...etc. .

[ReverseSeraf]

https://m.facebook.com/groups/470211779656493?view=permalink&id=840733385937662

Someone on Facebook helpfully translated the new tree layout.


Hunter: [SPOILER-BOX]http://i.imgur.com/jGfUyoZ.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]
Fighter: [SPOILER-BOX]http://i.imgur.com/JdxnVnD.png[/SPOILER-BOX]
Ranger: [SPOILER-BOX]http://i.imgur.com/8zf5P8q.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]
Gunner: [SPOILER-BOX]http://i.imgur.com/ebA0DD6.png[/SPOILER-BOX]
Force: [SPOILER-BOX]http://i.imgur.com/SdWk4Ej.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]
Techer: [SPOILER-BOX]http://i.imgur.com/yaQmw8N.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]
Braver: [SPOILER-BOX]http://i.imgur.com/bhaFAOZ.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]


A bit more complete :D

And the pictures aren't so small lol

[gigawuts]

^Casts are Android's which do have a level of Bio-mass/chips...etc. in there bodies and minds. The amount is small tho around 5 ~ 15%. This allows them to use Techs but just weaker or different, drink monomates....etc. . Also it allowed them to Transform, Sommon and Swap Parts as well since there bodies aren't set to one shape. The mean reason why Casts couldn't use Techs in PSO (Besides Sega Programming it that way) was the current sociability of the people and government at that time. So Casts can be Poisoned, Virus'd, Megid, Hacked and Mind Controlled...etc. .

Casts were fully artificial in PSO1 afaik, with the technical and processing limitations of an old model of a caseal being the main focus of an entire quest (Shino, being unable to comprehend having free will).

[Edson Drake]

I'm super hyped for this! So many desirable changes.

I don't think we'll get reset tickets this time, since there's so many structural changes, making impossible to keep some of the stuff we currently have(like Fury Stance). After the maintenance before all of these changes, we'll probably get an auto-reset.

It would be amazing if Sega even after the auto-reset would still give us tickets though, so we can try out the new things.

[HeyItsTHK]

I like what I'm seeing, all the offerings on various playstyles is exciting. Bouncer looks fun too. Also are they increasing the level cap for Ep 3?

[Omega-z]

@gigawuts - Shino actually had some level of Bio-mass and she was also not the first. Also PSO1 Casts came from Alissa III (going off art book for PSO1 which had Searren/Wren in it) which also had Bio-mass since they could use techs. On top of that PSZ also had Casts using Techs and this was post PSO1. It was because the people of Coral and Pioneer's were racist to the other races (sound familiar to other series in the PS franchise) and made Casts inferior to them and turn them into slaves...or thought of them as machines. Even if they did try to remove the Bio-mass form them it wouldn't be all of it since the Mind would need it to function. Also making something artificial can still be Organic in a test tube and not by Natural means.

Edit:
(Shino, being unable to comprehend having free will).

Why would you say that? She had Free Will the whole time even up to the end, Even tho Falz was messing with her. Every Cast in PSO1 had Feelings and thought for themselves but couldn't act on everything based on the people and government.

[obsexed]

I'm super hyped for this! So many desirable changes.

I don't think we'll get reset tickets this time, since there's so many structural changes, making impossible to keep some of the stuff we currently have(like Fury Stance). After the maintenance before all of these changes, we'll probably get an auto-reset.

It would be amazing if Sega even after the auto-reset would still give us tickets though, so we can try out the new things.

auto-reset fosho... (`-`)

[Stealthcmc1974]

I'm excited that we don't have to unlock classes like fighter anymore... that was a pain in the butt.

[Mega Ultra Chicken]

I'm excited that we don't have to unlock classes like fighter anymore... that was a pain in the butt.

Wait, what?!

---

FO and TE have much better trees now. Instead of being forced to pick an element for a top-priority skill, we can now just get those in the beginning and then pick skills from whichever element we're looking to specialize in. Not sure if the elements will ever be fully balanced, but the new setup is a good start at least for encouraging an actual choice.

[Stealthcmc1974]

Wait, what?!

http://www.bumped.org/psublog/pso2-livestream-22-recap/

It says every class is available from the start now.

[NoiseHERO]

Wait, what?!

---

FO and TE have much better trees now. Instead of being forced to pick an element for a top-priority skill, we can now just get those in the beginning and then pick skills from whichever element we're looking to specialize in. Not sure if the elements will ever be fully balanced, but the new setup is a good start at least for encouraging an actual choice.

I'm curious on how a lot of specific PA's/techs were balanced. More than likely to help make more builds/playstyles viable.

Like mixing up combos actually being useful on fighter + the movement speed and attack range increases so you don't have to worry about "which PA gets there first" as badly. And a new skill to reward you for it.

Fighter may actually become fun.

Or at least a lot better than before. >_>

[Kondibon]

I want to do a chase build for a BO/FI...

[Stealthcmc1974]

I want to do a chase build for a BO/FI...

FI, TE, and BR are the classes (IMO) are obvious choices to pair with BO. Another would be HU I guess...
I'll have a BR/BO and a BO/BR for 2 characters, just cause. :)

[Mega Ultra Chicken]

FI, TE, and BR are the classes (IMO) are obvious choices to pair with BO. Another would be HU I guess...
I'll have a BR/BO and a BO/BR for 2 characters, just cause. :)

I'd be more partial toward BO/TE. I could sling Techs, bounce in to regenerate PP by literally kicking ass, and then bounce out to continue casting.

[Stealthcmc1974]

I'd be more partial toward BO/TE. I could sling Techs, bounce in to regenerate PP by literally kicking ass, and then bounce out to continue casting.

For me, BR/BO is perfect because I can do striking, ranged, AND techs whenever needed. I'm more a fan of versatility.

Overall though, there are quite a few good combos with BO, due to it being another hybrid :D

[infiniteeverlasting]

how is bo/hu going or bo/br going to work? I'm so reliant on auto halfline nowadays...

[Kondibon]

how is bo/hu going or bo/br going to work? I'm so reliant on auto halfline nowadays...Same as anything/HU or anything/BR works. Stances.

[infiniteeverlasting]

Same as anything/HU or anything/BR works. Stances.

average or weak? i really don't like splitting between the 2

[Stealthcmc1974]

average or weak? i really don't like splitting between the 2

I'll be shooting for average myself.

[XrosBlader821]

T-this Balance update.
I-I think I came just now.

This month is going to be long...

[UnLucky]

Switch Strike, switches the boots over to striking basically.

The other stance skill seems more in line for Dual Blades. Not sure if Jet Boots apply to it yet. I'll probably have to go back and gather whatever was missed.

So because of that I'll change the wording to make it less confusing.

If it switches to Striking... what were they before?

[Maenara]

I compiled all of the balance changes I'm aware of here:
www.pso-world.com/forums/showthread.php?t=220987

Should be easier to read through than this topic.

[kyouyaenzan]

average or weak? i really don't like splitting between the 2

I go mainly for average, I have a braver that's focused on katana weak stance, but it's not as well-rounded.

[IndigoNovember]

135% on weak points with 95% on everything else VS 115% on everything. Going Weak Stance might not be that bad of an idea if you have Weak Stance katanas.

[obsexed]

going for weak stance would be good if you have an extra tree and youre doing boss type quests like Falz or shit like that

[Gardios]

If it switches to Striking... what were they before?

Technique.

[LonelyGaruga]

If it switches to Striking... what were they before?

Pretty much what I'm wondering too. It can't possibly use any formula besides striking as is, unless Jet Boots use a completely new damage formula for normals/PAs. As I recall, didn't one of the developers say there would be a large number of Jet Boots that had S-ATK as well as T-ATK? Seems like this skill would swap from running off T-ATK to S-ATK instead. Either that, or it switches the weapon palette from techs to PAs. Or both.

Whatever it is, the explanations being discussed don't really make sense. A pity that the explanation is so poor.


Technique.

Unless it switches from calculating from T-ATK to S-ATK, this can't be it. Techs have their own damage formula that vastly differs from striking attacks, and are restricted to techs exclusively.

[Zyrusticae]

135% on weak points with 95% on everything else VS 115% on everything. Going Weak Stance might not be that bad of an idea if you have Weak Stance katanas.
The problem with weak stance and anything melee is how many enemies don't have any melee-accessible weak points to begin with, and some of those monsters are a pain in the ass to kill with no damage boosts (i.e. pretty much all of the caves and floating continent, everything that's not a garongo in the forest, most mechs on Lilipa, etc.).

At least Darkers and most bosses aren't quite so bad about this, but I'd only bother with it if I knew most of my enemies were going to be such. When you start getting the gulfs and oodans into the mix, Weak Stance just starts to look kind of bad.

[Laxedrane]

Unless it switches from calculating from T-ATK to S-ATK, this can't be it. Techs have their own damage formula that vastly differs from striking attacks, and are restricted to techs exclusively.

I would guess that it's either going to have the S attack stat and T attack stat on the weapon and/or player switch. Or possibly give a bonus to S attack same way wand reactor works at a guess.

Very happy with the adjustment to the skill trees. Will be ecstatic if this guy somehow manages to make all PAs and techs viable.

[Gardios]

@LonelyGaruga: We know that Jet Boots are technique attribute from the reveal and the slide literally says that it converts it to striking. It's not like there's anything else anyway, because it sure as hell isn't shooting.

[UnLucky]

@LonelyGaruga: We know that Jet Boots are technique attribute from the reveal and the slide literally says that it converts it to striking. It's not like there's anything else anyway, because it sure as hell isn't shooting.
They revealed that their main stat will be T-Atk, and scale damage based on that. Some would have S-Atk also, for unknown reasons.

The normal, physical attacks would be Striking type. Whatever blast waves or whatever that emanate from the boots could be considered Tech damage, but it'd be a drastic change from everything thus far.

They also said that (some) PAs would be Striking type, so unless that requires Strike Switch then I wouldn't think any of the PAs would count as Tech damage unless you cast actual techs off your boots.

[Gardios]

The normal, physical attacks would be Striking type.

When did they say that? I can't remember them actually saying this when I rewatched the stream back then.

[LonelyGaruga]

They literally can't be anything else, because the damage formula for techs only works for techs. Striking is the "default" damage formula.

[Gardios]

That doesn't matter, because we're talking about the attribute. Stuff can be technique attribute without being techniques. Technically, everything uses the same damage formula anyway...

[Fatalystic]

Like mixing up combos actually being useful on fighter + the movement speed and attack range increases so you don't have to worry about "which PA gets there first" as badly. And a new skill to reward you for it.

About that...

(Hu): 攻撃範囲 (attack range/reach)
(Fi): 攻撃性能 (attack performance/efficiency)

So it seems that Fi doesn't get increased reach, but increased damage instead.

[UnLucky]

So far nothing that isn't shot out of a gun/bow is Shooting, and nothing that isn't literally a Technic counts as Tech damage.

Everything that makes physical contact with the player character or the equipped weapon counts as Striking.

And anything that doesn't fit any of the above is also Striking.

So if Jet Boot normals and/or PAs count as Techs, then a lot of other stuff needs to be changed for consistency.

[Sizustar]

About that...

(Hu): 攻撃範囲 (attack range/reach)
(Fi): 攻撃性能 (attack performance/efficiency)

So it seems that Fi doesn't get increased reach, but increased damage instead.

Correct.

Hu - Balance between Offense/Defense, able to tank attack for the party
Fi - Highest damage Melee class that sacrafice Speed, Defense, agility for offense power.

[IndigoNovember]

The problem with weak stance and anything melee is how many enemies don't have any melee-accessible weak points to begin with, and some of those monsters are a pain in the ass to kill with no damage boosts (i.e. pretty much all of the caves and floating continent, everything that's not a garongo in the forest, most mechs on Lilipa, etc.).

At least Darkers and most bosses aren't quite so bad about this, but I'd only bother with it if I knew most of my enemies were going to be such. When you start getting the gulfs and oodans into the mix, Weak Stance just starts to look kind of bad.

Yeah, it still has the same problems as before, but it's a bit more appealing now. If you have a second tree that is, as was said earlier.

[infiniteeverlasting]

i'm very unclear on how a tech based main would be affected by hunter sub, doesnt hunter fury stance only boost s/r atks?? so if you have the bouncer skill that switches boots from t-atk to s-atk will fury stance start to work?

[gigawuts]

The problem with weak stance and anything melee is how many enemies don't have any melee-accessible weak points to begin with, and some of those monsters are a pain in the ass to kill with no damage boosts (i.e. pretty much all of the caves and floating continent, everything that's not a garongo in the forest, most mechs on Lilipa, etc.).

At least Darkers and most bosses aren't quite so bad about this, but I'd only bother with it if I knew most of my enemies were going to be such. When you start getting the gulfs and oodans into the mix, Weak Stance just starts to look kind of bad.

You know, a lot of this could be fixed with something that converts all of your damage to the element of your weapon. That could be a feature of Techer, or Bouncer, or Fighter, or honestly I don't see why it couldn't be all three. Have it be a somewhat shared function of the more mobile-oriented melee classes.

[Zyrusticae]

I REALLY hope Megid (the original) got a big buff. All I've ever wanted to do as a Fo/Te is spam that shit everywhere I go. Big black balls of exploding liquid agony beats out literally everything else in the game in terms of flavor IMO.


i'm very unclear on how a tech based main would be affected by hunter sub, doesnt hunter fury stance only boost s/r atks?? so if you have the bouncer skill that switches boots from t-atk to s-atk will fury stance start to work?It would, yes, but only for the boot attacks that it applies to. Techniques would obviously still work off of T-Atk, in which case they'd be pretty heavily nerfed relative to a Force or Techer.

Speaking of techniques, how does that work with Bouncer anyway? I still don't understand how this class functions...

[UnLucky]

I really really wish people would take care to distinguish between All Damage (威力), Striking Damage (打撃威力) and S-Atk (打撃力), along with the Shooting (射撃) and Tech (法撃) denominations as well.

That includes official announcements by Sega, the people translating them on Bumped or otherwise, and everyone posting about them here. It's only a couple of characters, but it makes a world of difference.

[LonelyGaruga]

That doesn't matter, because we're talking about the attribute. Stuff can be technique attribute without being techniques. Technically, everything uses the same damage formula anyway...

What? No. There's three different damage formulas depending on the attack, and "attribute" is synonymous with which formula it uses. The regular PSO2 JPN wiki has a page on it (http://pso2wiki.net/%E3%83%80%E3%83%A1%E3%83%BC%E3%82%B8%E8%A8%88%E7%A E%97), along with some additional links for extra information on it. Jet Boots use T-ATK, but they're striking attribute, the same as Talis normals (despite triggering headshot noises and being projectiles) and Wand Gear explosions.

Though, Bumped clarified that it's striking "ability", which really sounds like switching from tech usage to PA usage, which further cements my opinion of that being its actual meaning.

[UnLucky]

Ok, looking at the slide again, they called it「打撃性能」which means pretty much what Bumped said: Striking ability/performance.

That is... nothing. It's not in the game as an actual stat or a concept. It's so vague it could mean anything.

So Jet Boots will convert/transform into something something Striking or another mumblemumble.

[Gardios]

What? No. There's three different damage formulas depending on the attack, and "attribute" is synonymous with which formula it uses. The regular PSO2 JPN wiki has a page on it (http://pso2wiki.net/%E3%83%80%E3%83%A1%E3%83%BC%E3%82%B8%E8%A8%88%E7%A E%97), along with some additional links for extra information on it. Jet Boots use T-ATK, but they're striking attribute, the same as Talis normals (despite triggering headshot noises and being projectiles) and Wand Gear explosions.

Just look at those formulas. They can be condensed into a single one. It's just split up to make it more simple for the reader.

[LonelyGaruga]

If they were condensed into a single formula, then they wouldn't be able to differentiate between different multipliers and hitzones. The formulas are split up like that because they check for different multipliers and hitzones, not just because they don't use portions of the damage formula. It's why techs can trigger Weak Stance by elemental weakness, and striking/ranged attacks can't. It's why Fury Stance doesn't work on techs, but works on Wand Gear explosions, despite using the same ATK stat. They basically are split based on attribute, since the attributes determine which multipliers and hitzone to check, along with other things like the aforementioned Weak Stance instance.

While the damage formulas given are simplified for easier reading, there are still three different damage formulas because of the three different attributes that attacks fall under.

[ShinMaruku]

They revealed that their main stat will be T-Atk, and scale damage based on that. Some would have S-Atk also, for unknown reasons.

The normal, physical attacks would be Striking type. Whatever blast waves or whatever that emanate from the boots could be considered Tech damage, but it'd be a drastic change from everything thus far.

They also said that (some) PAs would be Striking type, so unless that requires Strike Switch then I wouldn't think any of the PAs would count as Tech damage unless you cast actual techs off your boots.

They should look hard at Dungeon Fighter,s bellatrix where int scales into damage with her strikes with her moves.

[Gardios]

If they were condensed into a single formula, then they wouldn't be able to differentiate between different multipliers and hitzones. The formulas are split up like that because they check for different multipliers and hitzones, not just because they don't use portions of the damage formula. It's why techs can trigger Weak Stance by elemental weakness, and striking/ranged attacks can't. It's why Fury Stance doesn't work on techs, but works on Wand Gear explosions, despite using the same ATK stat. They basically are split based on attribute, since the attributes determine which multipliers and hitzone to check, along with other things like the aforementioned Weak Stance instance.

Of course they check for different things, but that doesn't mean the underlying formulas are actually different—some stuff is jsut automatically set to 0 or 1. What differentiates techniques from other stuff is that the element is inherent to them, which doesn't apply to everything else. This doesn't mean they use completely different formulas because they are technique attribute—there are plenty enemy attacks of technique attribute that aren't techs that "use striking attribute damage formulas".

[UnLucky]

Strictly technique modifiers don't apply to purely elemental things by default.

In fact, nothing elemental so far gets elemental masteries nor tech JA except for Techniques. PAs and Techniques are opposite sides of a coin, and no existing weapon deals Tech damage for its normal attacks.

I suppose that could change, but it still wouldn't make any sense.

[LonelyGaruga]

This doesn't mean they use completely different formulas because they are technique attribute—there are plenty enemy attacks of technique attribute that aren't techs that "use striking attribute damage formulas".

Enemy damage uses a completely separate formula. Why would they be restricted to how it works for players?

[Sandmind]

A random thought crossed my mind about BO's Switch Strike, what if it made FO and TE's element mastery apply to Jet Boot's normal atk and PA's full damage when matching weapon element like EWH does for enemy weakness? Probably wishfull thinking.

[Gardios]

Enemy damage uses a completely separate formula. Why would they be restricted to how it works for players?

Why the hell would you think they would program it so enemy damage used another completely different set of formulas? If you assume player characters already have 3 different ones depending on damage attribute, does that mean you honestly want to tell me there's a formula for striking/shooting attribute damage by players dealt to enemies, techniques used by players on enemies, striking/shooting attribute damage by players dealt to other players, techniques used by players on other players, striking/shooting/technique attribute damage by monsters dealt to players and lastly striking/shooting/technique attribute damage by monsters dealt to other monsters?

[UnLucky]

—there are plenty enemy attacks of technique attribute that aren't techs that "use striking attribute damage formulas".
What does this even mean?

[Gardios]

That those attacks don't use the technique formula but the "normal" one, obviously with only technique attribute stuff applying instead of striking or shooting.

[UnLucky]

Like what?

[Gardios]

Like what what? The formula?


Just look at those formulas. They can be condensed into a single one. It's just split up to make it more simple for the reader.

[HeyItsTHK]

They should look hard at Dungeon Fighter,s bellatrix where int scales into damage with her strikes with her moves.

Since when? I thought chasers were int and non chaser related skills were strength. In which you had to decide if you wanted to go a chaser route or an int route (poles and spears both having str, int and phys attack and mag attack but poles having more int/mag and spears having more str/phys). Was there a change?

It'd be sorta kinda neat to do this with Bouncer (though such an optimal mag would be a large pain in the behind to raise).

[UnLucky]

No, the attacks!

[Gardios]

Zesh's projectiles (or Ragne's—I remember wondering why one of those weren't shooting instead), Ragne's explosion I believe, lots of Luther's attacks off the top of my head.

[gigawuts]

I really do wish they'd just remove tech damage from enemies, and give forces elemental resist instead :/

The distinction is so completely arbitrary. This laser is ratk but this laser is tatk because photons.

[UnLucky]

What, do you mean the damage is reduced by Tech Resist but not T-Def or vice versa?

Or you think that the attack they're using isn't a Technique, but actually a PA or neither?

[Shiyo]

I really do wish they'd just remove tech damage from enemies, and give forces elemental resist instead :/

The distinction is so completely arbitrary. This laser is ratk but this laser is tatk because photons.

I want every enemy to have elemental resistances and absorbs. Shoot a fire tech at a volcano mob? Absorb 100% of damage.

Please do it.

[HeyItsTHK]

I want every enemy to have elemental resistances and absorbs. Shoot a fire tech at a volcano mob? Absorb 100% of damage.

Please do it.

I actually wouldn't mind all this elemental stuff mean something. Maybe not as much as absorbing damage, but having severely reduced (or no) damage for using fire on fire.

[GHNeko]

That'd make the game a lot more interesting vs grind 50 element with no penalty.

But they'd have to make it clear what enemies are strong against what.

I mean it's obvious (for most enemies) if you have critical thinking skills, but there is no reason not to make that information visible.

[UnLucky]

That'd affect absolutely nobody except Force

[Shiyo]

That'd affect absolutely nobody except Force

That's the entire point. Force has gone from spamming Rafoie to spamming Sazan(I didn't play during this, just what I seemed to have read) to spamming illmegid(and illbarta only on bosses). If there were bigger bonuses for hitting an enemy weak to an element(say 30%+ without elemental weak hit) and HUGE negatives for using the same element as the enemy(absorbs) or element the enemy is strong against, you'd see a lot more varied techs for force and actually have to do more than spam 1 tech on everything in the entire game for all of eternity.

It'd make the game more fun and interesting for Force players. I love having to think before what I cast, personally.

[Rehal]

I want every enemy to have elemental resistances and absorbs. Shoot a fire tech at a volcano mob? Absorb 100% of damage.

Please do it.

Wouldn't this make 50% fire melee/ranged weapon do 50% less damage to them too?

edit:nvm i thought you meant they would get healed for 100% of the elemental damage

[Shiyo]

Wouldn't this make 50% fire melee/ranged weapon do 50% less damage to them too?

Make element on weapons ignore absorbs and instead just do greatly reduced damage, or make this only work for techs.

[Bellion]

So, you would almost be forced to buy Force skill trees, cool. Or do mediocre damage everywhere.

SEGA make mils now $_$b

[Shiyo]

You can max every elemental trait as a force in Ep3 skill trees, you only miss out on 20% JA tech damage and photon flare.

It's not like my idea would actually exist, and if I was in charge of the game, you wouldn't need to spend 60 skill points to increase all 3 of your elemental spells damage by 40% each.

[Rehal]

You can max every elemental trait as a force in Ep3 skill trees, you only miss out on 20% JA tech damage and photon flare.

It's not like my idea would actually exist, and if I was in charge of the game, you wouldn't need to spend 60 skill points to increase all 3 of your elemental spells damage by 40% each.

But missing out 20% of damage for fo is like missing a whole element mastery already.

[Shiyo]

But missing out 20% of damage for fo is like missing a whole element mastery already.

Which also wouldn't exist if i was in charge, but doesn't matter!

Elemental resistances and absorbs would be a cool concept.

[Zyrusticae]

That's the entire point. Force has gone from spamming Rafoie to spamming Sazan(I didn't play during this, just what I seemed to have read) to spamming illmegid(and illbarta only on bosses). If there were bigger bonuses for hitting an enemy weak to an element(say 30%+ without elemental weak hit) and HUGE negatives for using the same element as the enemy(absorbs) or element the enemy is strong against, you'd see a lot more varied techs for force and actually have to do more than spam 1 tech on everything in the entire game for all of eternity.

It'd make the game more fun and interesting for Force players. I love having to think before what I cast, personally.
Yeah, HELL NAW.

It's already bad enough that I have to keep multiple skill trees explicitly for the purpose of switching elements between missions, but you want to make it MANDATORY as well?

Look. There is nothing interesting about being pigeon-holed into a single element at a time. There is nothing complicated about that decision. You either do it, or you fail. It's BORING AS HELL. There's damn good reason they largely excised that shit from the game (aside from a few odd cases like Dark Falz Elder's ridiculous dark resist).

If anything, I'd vouch for the opposite: a skill that exists explicitly to allow you to use whatever the fuck element you want against whatever fucking enemy you want. I'd much rather have element choice be an aesthetic or playstyle-specific choice, instead of it being FORCED upon you by game mechanics. If I want to try to kill absolutely everything with only dark techniques, what the hell's wrong with that? The whole dark element technique collection has its own strengths and weaknesses, and that alone is enough reason to look at other elements if you don't like what it brings to the table. Not because you MUST switch to it on Floating Continent or forever do shitty damage, but because it happens to be suited to your playstyle or is good at fighting the enemies you're aiming to fight.

Of course, with EWH your dream is already a reality; you're literally gimping yourself by NOT taking EWH and just using the element that is optimal for the stage you're fighting in. All your proposed change would do is make anyone who doesn't do this even more disadvantaged, and that would be terrible. Absolutely terrible.

[Shiyo]

I can see your argument against my idea and I agree with you as well.

Doing what they're doing and just making all techs equally strong and viable is probably for the best, actually.

[UnLucky]

Wouldn't this make 50% fire melee/ranged weapon do 50% less damage to them too?

edit:nvm i thought you meant they would get healed for 100% of the elemental damage

If half of your Atk is from your weapon, and half of your weapon's Atk is bonus elemental damage, then a striking or shooting weapon would deal:

130% to weak enemies
125% to neutral enemies
112.5% to resistant enemies
100% to immune enemies
75% to aborbing enemies

Meanwhile techs would deal:

120% to weak enemies
100% to neutral enemies
50% to resistant enemies
0% to immune enemies
-100% to absorbing enemies

Yet for a melee or ranged class, all they need to do is swap to a different weapon.
You can max every elemental trait as a force in Ep3 skill trees, you only miss out on 20% JA tech damage and photon flare.

It's not like my idea would actually exist, and if I was in charge of the game, you wouldn't need to spend 60 skill points to increase all 3 of your elemental spells damage by 40% each.
Yeah, just pretending for a second that anyone would use fire techs without S Charge, you have 20 SP left over for both Charges, JA, Talis, Element, T-Atk (both prereq and High), Rare Mastery, and PP Charge revival.

It's 50 SP to get everything that isn't an elemental mastery (or Photon Flare), so you can't even get Charge Escape with a pure fire or lightning build without losing out on DPS or PP management.

[Shiyo]

The only fire tech that needs S charge is Illfoie.

Force skill tree still screams "We want you to buy more skill trees because we're scummy".

[GHNeko]

Or you know, you could have elemental penalties and add skills to negate said penalties at the cost of reduced potential max damage.

Or you can choose to forsake negating penalties, work on maxing out elements for insane damage, but deal with penalties that pull your damage down to something decently below someone who negated the penalties.

This way you have specialists without the power creep.

You can even allow for mixing and matching of the two. Negating the penalties to a certain degree which gives you room to specialize in a single element of your preference as opposed to all or most.

See? Everyone gets something without the insane power creep!

[UnLucky]

Yeah, and lightning doesn't need PP Save despite costing way more than equivalent techs. 26PP for Razonde? Fuck outta here wit dat!

But if you're spending 20SP on fire, you're going to probably want to hurt things with fire techs, right? So 2x cast speed is probably better than 20% more damage for that purpose.

[GHNeko]

Tbh, that is a terrible idea and they should be ashamed for forcing people to use Bolt PP Save to get subpar techs to cost what they should.

[Shiyo]

Bolt PP save is really stupid, I agree. Lightning techs are essentially unsuable(outside of zondeel/illzonde) for damage without it. Cost far too much PP.

[UnLucky]

See, other games have a "non elemental" spell family for the express purpose of using it against heavily resistant or immune enemies but can never grant bonus damage since nothing is ever weak to it.

You would have that in addition to one or more elements that are susceptible to fluctuating damage.

Or you could choose to bring a majority of the elements at the same time, as in you're more likely than not going to be able to target a weakness (like 2/3). Or at the very least, your backup element(s) would do more damage to enemies resistant to your main element.

Or you'd be able to flip resistances into slight weaknesses, proccing other skills that deal bonus damage to weak enemies, which would still end up less than if that enemy were naturally weak to your element spec but it's a lot better than doing heavily reduced damage.

[GHNeko]

YEP.

PSO2 would need Ultima.

PSO2 would need Almighty.

PSO2 would need Megido/Megidolaon or Meteo/Ultima.

Light/Dark doesnt cut it.

If PSO2 had this, then we could have elemental resistances that MEAN something, and if you didnt want to deal with it, you'd just go Ultima/Almighty element and deal with the lack of weaknesses/resistances for okay damage.


I think the biggest interesting factor of Almighty/Ultima were that they were also very powerful, and very MP costly.

That would be super neat to see in PSO2, but the PS franchise doesnt have an element akin to this to my knowledge.

[Sanguine2009]

Bolt PP save is really stupid, I agree. Lightning techs are essentially unsuable(outside of zondeel/illzonde) for damage without it. Cost far too much PP.

lightning techs are unusable either way due to igniting zondeel. if they dont fix that im still auto kicking/blacklisting any lightning forces

[GHNeko]

Daamn. That's cold blooded.

You act as if there arent any Tech Crafts that make Lightning Tree worth using. >:

Efficient Gizonde is the type of things that miracles are made out of.

[Sanguine2009]

Daamn. That's cold blooded.

You act as if there arent any Tech Crafts that make Lightning Tree worth using. >:

Efficient Gizonde is the type of things that miracles are made out of.

honestly unless lightning techs become stronger than prenerf shunka with il megids crowd control people would be better off with the lightning force doing nothing than the lightning force igniting zondeel, at least with a halfway decent party(TA aside). nothing makes me more annoyed than trying to zondeel mobs in TD only to have someone ignite my zondeel doing very little damage and causing the mobs to scatter.

not to mention a single lightning tech user completely breaks techers greatest(and really only atm) selling point, something i cannot forgive

[LonelyGaruga]

Why the hell would you think they would program it so enemy damage used another completely different set of formulas?

Because it is. The JPN wiki has a separate section on it on the same page. This isn't uncommon practice, I've seen it done in several other RPG games too. For what reason would they not do this?


If you assume player characters already have 3 different ones depending on damage attribute, does that mean you honestly want to tell me there's a formula for striking/shooting attribute damage by players dealt to enemies, techniques used by players on enemies, striking/shooting attribute damage by players dealt to other players, techniques used by players on other players, striking/shooting/technique attribute damage by monsters dealt to players and lastly striking/shooting/technique attribute damage by monsters dealt to other monsters?

I'm not making assumptions based on zero evidence. The only things I'm aware of are three different formulas for player use, and one formula for enemy use. Everything else is indeterminate, so I don't see a need to speculate on them.


Zesh's projectiles (or Ragne's—I remember wondering why one of those weren't shooting instead), Ragne's explosion I believe, lots of Luther's attacks off the top of my head.

Dunno about Zeshrayda (as in, don't know whether it's ranged or tech, and whether they're elemental or not), but Ragne's tech based attacks are dark elemental, despite not triggering Poison, and all of Luther's tech attacks are also elemental, varying on the attack. Just because some enemy tech attacks don't trigger status doesn't make them non-elemental. And the few elemental striking/ranged attacks that do exist ([De] Malmoth snowballs are the only ones I can think of) are equally affected by elemental resistances as the tech ones, which is irreconcilable with the damage formula used for players.

Also, I should have mentioned this before, but Weak Stance, Element Weak Hit, and the two EWH potentials used to work the same way (techs only, that is) until Element Weak Hit (and the related potentials) were changed to work on weapons too, but not Weak Stance, which kinda implies to me that it has nothing to do with how striking/ranged attacks can be non-elemental (which only applies to 1-6* stuff nowadays anyway), so I don't really see what the existence of non-elemental tech based attacks on the enemy side would have to do with it anyway.

On an unrelated note, Shiyo, your ideas for how builds should be done are amateurish and a good example of why "fan dumb" is a term. Please stop and learn how to play the game before making clearly self-centered decisions on how you think the game should work. Ideas born of such a mindset are always short-sighted and tell everyone that reads them that you don't know what you're talking about. I don't agree with anyone's ideas here 100%, and I'm not stupidly arrogant enough to claim a single idea I've ever had about the game would undoubtedly make it better, because I know better than to think that such a thing can exist. There will always be people complaining about the most perfect things in the world, because that's how people are. But some ideas are good nonetheless, and I enjoy reading them, simply because it's interesting to see another person's viewpoint on matters, regardless of whether I agree with them or not. But your ideas, they're bad. They're poorly thought-out, they're designed with how you want the game to be, and pay no heed to whether that's a good path to follow or not. They're unsightly and poorly constructed, and demonstrate nothing more than a poor grasp of PSO2 and game design in general.

Your ideas are bad. Stop sharing them.

[GHNeko]

#shotsfired


That being said, Gargua, you should subscribe to chitchat with me about this game and its design. Yes? <3

[Sizustar]

New Skill simulator out~
http://pso2skillsimulator.com/

[GHNeko]

OH shiiit.

The new trees!

Hype!

[Edson Drake]

YEP.

PSO2 would need Ultima.

PSO2 would need Almighty.

PSO2 would need Megido/Megidolaon or Meteo/Ultima.

Light/Dark doesnt cut it.

If PSO2 had this, then we could have elemental resistances that MEAN something, and if you didnt want to deal with it, you'd just go Ultima/Almighty element and deal with the lack of weaknesses/resistances for okay damage.


I think the biggest interesting factor of Almighty/Ultima were that they were also very powerful, and very MP costly.

That would be super neat to see in PSO2, but the PS franchise doesnt have an element akin to this to my knowledge.

Oh no! If Megidolaon ever comes to PSO2, I'd want a COMP and a Demon summoning program. Also, I'd like the end of Arks ship by Thor's almighty hammer ICBMs.

But then, we already have Megido. We would need a Sega's official new tech naming scheme. Megido was non-elemental, but now it's dark.
I wonder how could they name it without any copyright issue.

[Sanguine2009]

if we get a COMP we better also get Alice and uber-pixie as summons.