PDA

View Full Version : PSO2 NICO NICO LIVE BROADCAST No.23 Details



Pages : [1] 2

Manta Oyamada
Aug 11, 2014, 11:20 PM
Date: August 16, 2014 (Saturday)

Time: 12:00 (Japanese Standard Time)
Official Nico Live Streaming Link: http://live.nicovideo.jp/watch/lv181786496

Main Game Features in Broadcast:

1. Episode 3 Information and unveiling of the future roadmap
2. PSO2es Episode 3 Information
3. Arks Grand Prix Finals
4.PSO2 2nd Cosplay Contest
5. PSNova Information


More live links:

1- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k4x7DGYiTZk
2- http://live.nicovideo.jp/watch/lv189572606?ref=ser&zroute=search&track=niconico_search_keyword&keyword=pso2&btm=r
3-http://live.nicovideo.jp/watch/lv189878166?ref=ser&zroute=search&track=niconico_search_keyword&keyword=pso2&btm=r

The Walrus
Aug 11, 2014, 11:26 PM
The 26th is a tuesday yo

It takes place on the 16th according to youtube and nico.

NoiseHERO
Aug 11, 2014, 11:26 PM
huh? I thought we just got the virtua on stuff...

Lyrise
Aug 11, 2014, 11:27 PM
I do believe you mean to say August 16th (as in this week).

Xaelouse
Aug 11, 2014, 11:48 PM
geez OP you make this topics real early like
but thank you! I expect they will finally show off more of what bouncer can do

ArcaneTechs
Aug 12, 2014, 02:39 AM
thanks again Manta for the heads up, can make some plans to watch the stream, hopefully they'll wow us with something at the end of the stream or even the beginning

Manta Oyamada
Aug 15, 2014, 09:43 PM
Today

saraishadow
Aug 15, 2014, 09:59 PM
current time is 12pm JST August 16th, so I really wouldnt say this post was too early.

Shinamori
Aug 15, 2014, 10:07 PM
Wow, hasn't started yet? lol

Terrence
Aug 15, 2014, 10:21 PM
It has bugun.

Manta Oyamada
Aug 15, 2014, 10:26 PM
They are already selling the outfit dambo

oratank
Aug 15, 2014, 10:27 PM
Episode 3 Information and unveiling of the future roadmap?

any schedule about it

Sizustar
Aug 15, 2014, 10:46 PM
Episode 3 Information and unveiling of the future roadmap?

any schedule about it

Final of the Ark contest > Cosplay >Phantasy Star Nova > Episode 3

LordKaiser
Aug 15, 2014, 11:22 PM
Oops! Remove the HTML tags and try again... -_- . can't comment... NVM you can't post long lines on youtube stream it seems.

oratank
Aug 16, 2014, 12:08 AM
ep3 info is around 16.30jst
some nova after cosplay

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 01:00 AM
Can we discuss how badass that Cast cosplay was? sure he kinda fell appart a few times, but holy crap he earned that win.

Edson Drake
Aug 16, 2014, 01:01 AM
Yes that rotating Avenger deserved to win. Lisa was great too, but the woman didn't look like her much, top-class costume though.

yoshiblue
Aug 16, 2014, 01:02 AM
Was pretty nice. Looked cool without the mask too. Yeah, was rooting for the Luthers and Lisa Risa too.

SakoHaruo
Aug 16, 2014, 01:03 AM
Can we discuss how badass that Cast cosplay was? sure he kinda fell appart a few times, but holy crap he earned that win.

The LED eyes and LED lining on the body was hawtness. 8-)

Shiyo
Aug 16, 2014, 01:03 AM
Final of the Ark contest > Cosplay >Phantasy Star Nova > Episode 3

The only stuff that matters last.

:|

Guess I was wrong about not wasting 2 hours on worthless TA's and cosplay. Yay, will just check bumped tomorrow.

musicmf
Aug 16, 2014, 01:05 AM
Can we discuss how badass that Cast cosplay was? sure he kinda fell appart a few times, but holy crap he earned that win.

A handful of them looked really nice, but yes the Cast definitely deserved 1st place.
Was #33 an original player character, I liked that one. I also thought the Apprentice looked nice too.

So, is anyone going to bother pausing the trailer to try and get screenshots of the Bouncer Skill tree? I only snapped 1 picture during the repeat viewing. (http://www.pso-world.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3177020&postcount=37)
It's 3 1/2 hours until more Episode 3 news right?

Dark Emerald EXE
Aug 16, 2014, 01:06 AM
I really liked the Cosplay part and yes the Avenger Cast took the show...

I know he was sweatin in that thing

Surprised Rare Drop Guy didn't get up haha

GHNeko
Aug 16, 2014, 01:08 AM
The only stuff that matters last.

:|

Guess I was wrong about not wasting 2 hours on worthless TA's and cosplay. Yay, will just check bumped tomorrow.

I'm sorry

But the top 9 cosplayers were god like.

That CAST was off the chain.

Shiyo pls.

Just see the light with me.

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 01:09 AM
My other favorites were the Luther with the tyluda and apprentice.


So, is anyone going to bother pausing the trailer to try and get screenshots of the Bouncer Skill tree? I only snapped 1 picture during the repeat viewing.
It's 3 1/2 hours until more Episode 3 news right?I dunno if we'll be be able to get a good look with that text in the way. 3: They'll probably show it off when they get to the episode 3 stuff though.

oratank
Aug 16, 2014, 01:13 AM
i feel really sorry for orther cosplayer people in there didn't clap for them. i feel suck when cast guy got the hall attention and left orther like dump. but well 10k ac ∩( ・ω・)∩

Edson Drake
Aug 16, 2014, 01:16 AM
The amount of cash that guy must've spent to build the costume(despite that it was falling to pieces, it happens) is no small feat. That's true dedication and cast love for you.

Shinamori
Aug 16, 2014, 01:21 AM
Did I miss any EP3 information?

GHNeko
Aug 16, 2014, 01:22 AM
No not yet.

Azazel7108
Aug 16, 2014, 01:29 AM
a boxing match now?

Manta Oyamada
Aug 16, 2014, 01:36 AM
EPISODE 3 Video promotional

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZRzJSF1AZck

GALEFORCE
Aug 16, 2014, 01:39 AM
Dat shifta air attack boost tho. I'm guessing it's a damage bonus if you have shifta active and are airborne? I really hope neither of the s/d skills are bo main only.

Sizustar
Aug 16, 2014, 01:40 AM
Phantasy Star Nova slides - Xeno, Echo and Alfin can be used as NPC in the PS Nova game, and other collab with PSO2
[SPOILER-BOX]http://i.imgur.com/1C8uCix.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/E1cSHjp.jpg
[/SPOILER-BOX]
Phantasy Nova will have a new demo that comes with the Tokyo Game Show

GHNeko
Aug 16, 2014, 01:44 AM
Is it just me or does this look like an EP3 demo? Some PAs looked faster.

Also Sizu. SPOILERBOX PLS.

Dark Emerald EXE
Aug 16, 2014, 01:46 AM
Hmm? Are they done?

If so didn't appear to show much of anything ep3 related :o (Unless i missed it)

SakoHaruo
Aug 16, 2014, 01:46 AM
Is it just me or does this look like an EP3 demo? Some PAs looked faster.

Was that a new EQ or LQ?




Also Sizu. SPOILERBOX PLS.

Nah. He does that all the time, so get use to it. o3o

Sizustar
Aug 16, 2014, 01:47 AM
Hmm? Are they done?

If so didn't appear to show much of anything ep3 related :o (Unless i missed it)

Semi-final of the Ark Grand prix next, I believe.

musicmf
Aug 16, 2014, 01:47 AM
I dunno if we'll be be able to get a good look with that text in the way. 3: They'll probably show it off when they get to the episode 3 stuff though.
Yeah, the text is rather obnoxious, but still...


EPISODE 3 Video promotional

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZRzJSF1AZck
Thanks, pieced the Bouncer Tree together a bit in MSPaint.

If I'm seeing right, I think I see... (Or just look at the 2nd picture)
[SPOILER-BOX]- ??? Up (? Points)
- SATK Up 1 (10 Points)
- SATK Up 2 (10 Points)
- TATK Up 1 (10 Points)
- Jet Boot Gear (1 Point)
- Dual Blade Gear (1 Point)
- Elemental PP Restorate F (5 Points)
- Critical Field (5 Points)
- Shifta Air Attack Boost (5 Points)
- Deband PP Restorate (5 Points)
- ?Heel Bonus? (? Points)
- Rapid Boost (5 Points)
- Rapid Boost JA Bonus (5 Points)
- Elemental Burst (5 Points)
- Elemental Stance (10 Points)
- Elemental Stance Up 1 (10 Points)
- Elemental Stance Critical (10 Points)
- Break Stance (10 Points)
- Break Stance Up 1 (10 Points)
- Break Stance Critical (10 Points)

Oh, and with Bumped's picture;
- ?Heel ....? (? Points) [Above Heel Bonus]
- Photon Blade Escape (5 Points)
- Jet Boots Strike (? Points)
- Photon Blade Fever (? Points)
- Photon Blade Fever Up (5 Points)


We also know from the skill preview that they have; Don't know if they are in those spots I mentioned above, or if there is even more of the tree I'm not aware of.
- Switch Strike (? Points) [Unless this is actually "Jet Boots Strike"]
- Bouncer Mag (? Points)
- Craft Mastery (? Points)


Also not stated but found after pausing the video several times:

Photon Blade Fever Gear

Description for Rapid Boost
During (can't read the condition), Jet Boots attack speed and PA/Technic charge speed increases
[/SPOILER-BOX]
There seems to at least be a solid 3 on the right that is blocked off by the text wall.
And I would assume a couple in the top right corner (Their Dodge, Just Reversal, Bouncer Weapon Mastery, and Bouncer Mag if I were to guess). But I can't really see how many skills there seem to be up top thanks to the text and 360p.

*** Edit; Added second picture, now with more MS Paint! ***

*** Edit #2; See this post in the Bouncer Class Talk (http://www.pso-world.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3177193&postcount=253) for a text-based, more complete tree ***

Azazel7108
Aug 16, 2014, 01:51 AM
Also Sizu. SPOILERBOX PLS.

Agreed.

Rien
Aug 16, 2014, 02:18 AM
Also not stated but found after pausing the video several times:

Photon Blade Fever Gear

Description for Rapid Boost
During (can't read the condition), Jet Boots attack speed and PA/Technic charge speed increases


new face スッキリ顔

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 02:25 AM
Description for Rapid Boost
During (can't read the condition), Jet Boots attack speed and PA/Technic charge speed increases

http://i.imgur.com/pbmPwiW.gif
This has my attention even if it ends up being just for boots.

NoiseHERO
Aug 16, 2014, 02:36 AM
unless passive then, prolly gonna be like katana combat.

Rien
Aug 16, 2014, 02:39 AM
http://i.imgur.com/pbmPwiW.gif
This has my attention even if it ends up being just for boots.

I hope it isn't an active

They have a lot of actives

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 02:42 AM
I don't mind if it's active but now that you mention it bouncers do have a lot of actives and I only have so much subpalette space even with my magical joy to key setup.

Kilich
Aug 16, 2014, 02:48 AM
Oh, the trailer showed something, that looks like mothership, explode.

Arialle
Aug 16, 2014, 03:12 AM
i refuse to buy that stupid overrated noisy dance that is gangnam style

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 03:13 AM
i refuse to buy that stupid overrated noisy dance that is gangnam styleWhat does that have to do with anything? ._.

musicmf
Aug 16, 2014, 03:20 AM
Can anyone who can see through the blur tell what element the toy darkers are weak to?
I think I see the natives of that planet as weak to light (sometimes fire as well), and I think the toy darkers were light/dark? But it's just too hard to tell on the 360p youtube mirror stream.

Yay on new TA to run. 5 was too little to rotate through.

Oh, and with the new Kuna song... were they saying Character Song CD? Is this being included on it?
If not, I know Aida and others have ripped sound effects and stuff from the game (http://www.pso-world.com/forums/showthread.php?t=214269); I wonder if it's possible to rip Kuna's 2 (later on, 3) songs as well. I want to keep high quality (aka, not youtube rips) ones myself, I like Kitamura Eri's singing.

Sacrificial
Aug 16, 2014, 03:22 AM
Combat escape mainclass only seems reasonable if i heard that right.

GHNeko
Aug 16, 2014, 03:25 AM
That's super reasonable until you realize that BR is still one of the most popular classes in the game so it'll affect things less than you'd think. Esp since there is too much more reason to main HU over BR kek.

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 03:26 AM
The natives of the new place seem to be weak to dark, not light. It's likely that the white ones are weak to dark and the black ones are weak to fire. And don't anyone dare bring up the implications of me saying that because I don't care right now.
I can't tell with the toy darkers though.

Shinamori
Aug 16, 2014, 03:32 AM
Toy Darkers are likely weak to ice.

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 03:33 AM
Toy Darkers are likely weak to ice.Likely, still can't get a good look though. 3:

EDIT: THE CHEERING WHEN THEY SHOWED THE DUDU PUNCHING BAG!

musicmf
Aug 16, 2014, 03:40 AM
Oh god... that punching bag.

Vintasticvin
Aug 16, 2014, 03:40 AM
LMFAO Dat Dudu punching bag xD All y'alls dream come true =[ Now stop being so mean to Mr. Dudu

Sacrificial
Aug 16, 2014, 03:40 AM
Dudu fcking punvhbag OMG

GHNeko
Aug 16, 2014, 03:41 AM
inb4ACscratchitemonly

the reaction was so desirable i wouldnt be surprised.

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 03:50 AM
*suddenly concert*
https://img.4plebs.org/boards/pol/image/1387/70/1387705020387.png

SakoHaruo
Aug 16, 2014, 03:53 AM
カルサネス/Calzanes, ネックジェンヌ/Neckgenn, チェイドラーケン/Chey Draken, ディッツアルビー/Ditts Arby has a purpose. Better get them while they're cheap.

GHNeko
Aug 16, 2014, 03:54 AM
BURNING RANGERSS OH MY GOD HYPE

oratank
Aug 16, 2014, 03:58 AM
BURNING RANGERSS OH MY GOD HYPE

sorry quna steal the show

Vintasticvin
Aug 16, 2014, 04:00 AM
ARRRRGH I want that costume from the new kuna song!!!!!

Xaelouse
Aug 16, 2014, 04:02 AM
カルサネス/Calzanes, ネックジェンヌ/Neckgenn, チェイドラーケン/Chey Draken, ディッツアルビー/Ditts Arby has a purpose. Better get them while they're cheap.

they always had a purpose? and you forgot Karl Desta

Rakurai
Aug 16, 2014, 04:10 AM
I wasn't watching the stream so...why exactly do those items have a purpose now?

Sparzyle
Aug 16, 2014, 04:11 AM
Dat Live Burning ANGEL also a song from Quna that doesn't sucks!!! HYPE!

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 04:11 AM
I wasn't watching the stream so...why exactly do those items have a purpose now?Vopar TA probably.

oratank
Aug 16, 2014, 04:14 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=k4x7DGYiTZk#t=23890

the time for quna song

kill loser and apostlein 3.17 min didn't they low their hp for competition?

Aurorra
Aug 16, 2014, 04:25 AM
Grand Prix final doing a good job of showing why weak bullet needs to be nerfed to the ground and things not balanced around having it.

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 04:27 AM
Grand Prix final doing a good job of showing why weak bullet needs to be nerfed to the ground and things not balanced around having it.Word. I don't think decreasing it to 255% is gonna be enough.

Vintasticvin
Aug 16, 2014, 04:28 AM
Grand Prix final doing a good job of showing why weak bullet needs to be nerfed to the ground and things not balanced around having it.

Weak bullet is fine as it is shush Rangers been getting shafted for a while its their time to shine D: Just gotta know how to play and adapt.

Rakurai
Aug 16, 2014, 04:29 AM
I'm not really sure what team 1 was thinking with not taking Weak Bullet, especially since they were going for the same strategy of piling burst damage on the chest core instead going for the clock.

Rien
Aug 16, 2014, 04:30 AM
The clock doesn't open since Loser is not mirage-able for the grand prix.

GHNeko
Aug 16, 2014, 04:32 AM
Weak bullet is fine as it is shush Rangers been getting shafted for a while its their time to shine D: Just gotta know how to play and adapt.

I cant tell if you're joking or not. @_@;;

Aurorra
Aug 16, 2014, 04:32 AM
I'm not really sure what team 1 was thinking with not taking Weak Bullet, especially since they were going for the same strategy of piling burst damage on the chest core instead going for the clock.

Were they even told in advance what they'd be facing? And how do you expect a Fi/Fi team to break the clock?

Rien
Aug 16, 2014, 04:33 AM
Were they even told in advance what they'd be facing? And how do you expect a Fi/Fi team to break the clock?

Yes. They were told it's HP was being nerfed and Mirage was not usable.

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 04:34 AM
Weak bullet is fine as it is shush Rangers been getting shafted for a while its their time to shine D: Just gotta know how to play and adapt.Ranger's entire existence shouldn't hinge on one skill anymore than hunter's should. I'm not sure how "knowing how to play" has anything to do with a 300% multiplier that stacks with weakpoints. It turns a 4 man party into a full MPA. >_> A single skill shouldn't be doing that kind of stuff.

EDIT: Also ranger got buffed recently, and is getting buffed again outside of weakbullet. What do you mean they've been getting shafted?

Aurorra
Aug 16, 2014, 04:38 AM
Yes. They were told it's HP was being nerfed and Mirage was not usable.

Then yeah, super silly to do a boss fight competition and not have weak bullet. Even if they had no idea how to play a Ranger and did 0 damage all they would need to do was put up WB to increase there partner's effectiveness three times.

Vintasticvin
Aug 16, 2014, 04:40 AM
Ranger's entire existence shouldn't hinge on one skill anymore than hunter's should. I'm not sure how "knowing how to play" has anything to do with a 300% multiplier that stacks with weakpoints. It turns a 4 man party into a full MPA. >_> A single skill shouldn't be doing that kind of stuff.

EDIT: Also ranger got buffed recently, and is getting buffed again outside of weakbullet. What do you mean they've been getting shafted?

I was talking of iterations of the past name PSZ >_< And these guys are making me wanna retire being a FOcassy and start RAcassing D:

GHNeko
Aug 16, 2014, 04:40 AM
Maybe one side had to fight without weak bullet.

Because the PC round was a repeat of the Vita route lmfao.


I was talking of iterations of the past name PSZ >_< And these guys are making me wanna retire being a FOcassy and start RAcassing D:

Yeah RAs got fucked in PSZ, but did you forget the dominance of PSO?

RAs ruled PSO. FOs ruled PSZ. Melee Ruled PSU/P (afaik).

We've come full circle with a new cycle.

Rien
Aug 16, 2014, 04:41 AM
I thought pc both sides had WB but the winner had a TE/FO

And the loser had 2x braver

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 04:44 AM
I was talking of iterations of the past name PSZ >_< I don't see how that's relevent to PSO2's class balance. >_>

GHNeko
Aug 16, 2014, 04:45 AM
I didnt see WB on left side.

If there was, then why was their performance 2x as slow?

At least without WB you could go, "yeah we were slow, but we didnt have WB."

with WB, what is your excuse then?

Vintasticvin
Aug 16, 2014, 04:48 AM
Maybe one side had to fight without weak bullet.

Because the PC round was a repeat of the Vita route lmfao.



Yeah RAs got fucked in PSZ, but did you forget the dominance of PSO?

RAs ruled PSO. FOs ruled PSZ. Melee Ruled PSU/P (afaik).

We've come full circle with a new cycle.
xD I still member how Ranger jammed their dicks in everything back in PSO1 its was hiliarious

I don't see how that's relevant to PSO2's class balance. >_>

I admit you kinda got me there and I blame the hype and excitement of watching my first pso2 live event >_<

GHNeko
Aug 16, 2014, 04:50 AM
If anything, the fact that all rangers have IS ONLY WB shows that they're getting fucked now.

Get shoehorned into abusing WB or get yelled at by everyone for not having WB and pursuing your true self and playing with mirage shot and traps and launchers and traps and shit.

HeyItsTHK
Aug 16, 2014, 04:51 AM
Uhh so does Loser take full damage to his face as if you were hitting his neck weak point? I was watching the fighter fly up there and just beat his face in for pretty high damage for non optimal gear.

Aurorra
Aug 16, 2014, 04:52 AM
Left side definitely had weak bullet, they just failed to break the bicep.

GHNeko
Aug 16, 2014, 04:52 AM
Left side definitely had weak bullet, they just failed to break the bicep.

Shameful Display.

Rakurai
Aug 16, 2014, 04:55 AM
Uhh so does Loser take full damage to his face as if you were hitting his neck weak point? I was watching the fighter fly up there and just beat his face in for pretty high damage for non optimal gear.

He takes slightly more damage once it's broken, but not as much as the neck weakspot.

Ranged classes can also headshot him for the standard 2.0x damage bonus, though it's pretty inconvenient compared to aiming for the clock if it's available.

Aurorra
Aug 16, 2014, 04:56 AM
Probably would've been better to Shunka into it than try to Hatou it, but I'll probably be flamed for suggesting Hatou isn't the absolute best katana PA to use on a boss.

GHNeko
Aug 16, 2014, 04:56 AM
He takes slightly more damage once it's broken, but not as much as the neck weakspot.

It's just that the neck has a damage limit before it turns itself back off (on?), right?


Probably would've been better to Shunka into it than try to Hatou it, but I'll probably be flamed for suggesting Hatou isn't the absolute best katana PA to use on a boss.

Hatou has better DPS than Shunka but it's a PP dump. If you're looking for DPS bursts, Hatou has been the go to choice, even more so now with the Shunka nerf.

Vintasticvin
Aug 16, 2014, 04:57 AM
Shameful Display.

Both blue teams made me ashamed to wear blue </3

Rien
Aug 16, 2014, 04:59 AM
Probably would've been better to Shunka into it than try to Hatou it, but I'll probably be flamed for suggesting Hatou isn't the absolute best katana PA to use on a boss.

They don't have access to shunka for grand prix

GHNeko
Aug 16, 2014, 05:00 AM
Question

Is the separation of region in the chats for the nico livestream something that Sega does or Nico?

Because if its the prior then that'd be really on on top of the fact that the description is 100% english.

Daiyousei
Aug 16, 2014, 05:00 AM
I thought pc both sides had WB but the winner had a TE/FO

And the loser had 2x braver

both sides had a Ra sub, the winner had a Te/Fo while loser didn't.

Probably Shifta skills.

Rakurai
Aug 16, 2014, 05:01 AM
On a side note, that Rapid Boost skill makes me much more excited to try out jet boots then before.

I just hope it actually works with Na Megid...

Aurorra
Aug 16, 2014, 05:01 AM
They don't have access to shunka for grand prix

Well that's just silly given that they nerfed it.

GHNeko
Aug 16, 2014, 05:02 AM
みんなおめたろう

Secret Phrase

Vintasticvin
Aug 16, 2014, 05:02 AM
both sides had a Ra sub, the winner had a Te/Fo while loser didn't.

Probably Shifta skills.

And people say Shifta is useless >_< I always say every bit of additional damage can make a difference.

GHNeko
Aug 16, 2014, 05:04 AM
ULTIMATE MODE CONFIRMED HOLY SHIT

oratank
Aug 16, 2014, 05:04 AM
ultimate

HeyItsTHK
Aug 16, 2014, 05:04 AM
was....was that Ultimate? o_O

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 05:05 AM
ULTIMATE MODE CONFIRMED HOLY SHIThttp://i.imgur.com/NUyttbn.gif

The 3rd coast area looks cool too.

EDIT: Also that PB boss. Are we gonna get story for that yet? Because CLEARLY there's something going on there.

GHNeko
Aug 16, 2014, 05:05 AM
MUH DICKK

HNNNGGGG

strikerhunter
Aug 16, 2014, 05:06 AM
H-O-L-Y-S-H-I-T-S WAS THAT ULTIMATE???!!!!

PSO2 just turned on the Monster Hunter switch with all those monsters and designs!!!!

Welp it's time to hibernate till the winter.

Rakurai
Aug 16, 2014, 05:07 AM
That ultimate mode area looks really trippy. Seems like it's in some part of Naberius that's been tainted by...something. Hope that means we'll have similar areas for the other planets and fields.

Lots of modified Naberius creatures, plus some completely new ones that bear a strong resemblance to the SH mode darker cores.

Vintasticvin
Aug 16, 2014, 05:08 AM
H-O-L-Y-S-H-I-T-S WAS THAT ULTIMATE???!!!!

PSO2 just turned on the Monster Hunter switch with all those monsters and designs!!!!

Yes my dear friend that was ULTIMAAAAAAAATE and yes Sega gone MH from the look of things Strika :D

Infinity Series
Aug 16, 2014, 05:08 AM
i really need to rewatch that ultimate modo

GHNeko
Aug 16, 2014, 05:09 AM
http://i.imgur.com/V3rmiPx.png


Did anyone else see the enemy mag summons!?

WAS I TRIPPING BALLS?

holy shiiiiiiit

Vintasticvin
Aug 16, 2014, 05:10 AM
Im breathing really really heavy, I came all over my bed sheets.... I should watch these more often >_<

TaigaUC
Aug 16, 2014, 05:10 AM
The whole problem with Ranger's Weak Bullet has nothing to do with Ranger being crap or good.
Especially now that Ranger is way stronger than before. I haven't had any problem playing Ranger when WB is on cooldown. I used to feel useless.
If you're complaining about Ranger strength/balance, you're probably thinking in terms of playing alone.
Weak Bullet is something that affects everyone present.

The problem is that, in terms of combat speed in a GROUP, Ranger Weak Bullet is a necessity.
It increases everyone's damage by... what was it, 300%?
Do any of the other classes have anything remotely similar? I don't think so.
It's literally impossible for any other class to match the group speed increase resulting from Weak Bullet.
Shifta is probably the closest thing, and it's nowhere near the effectiveness of Weak Bullet.
Chain Trigger is sort of similar, but still not as effective.

In order to fix the problem, every other class should have an equivalent contributing ability.
Something that assists the entire group to the point of achieving roughly the same result.
Of course, the game would then need to be rebalanced around that.
And that would probably make the game a lot harder for solo. But hey, some people like that.

musicmf
Aug 16, 2014, 05:12 AM
I'm curious on why they called it "Ultimate Quest" instead of "Ultimate Mode"... hopefully I'm worrying over nothing.

GHNeko
Aug 16, 2014, 05:13 AM
The whole problem with Ranger's Weak Bullet has nothing to do with Ranger being crap or good.
If you're complaining about Ranger strength, you're probably thinking in terms of playing alone.
Weak Bullet is something that affects everyone present.

The problem is that, in terms of combat speed in a GROUP, Ranger Weak Bullet is a necessity.
It increases everyone's damage by... what was it, 300%?
Do any of the other classes have anything remotely similar? I don't think so.
It's literally impossible for any other class to match the epeed of Weak Bullet.
Shifta is probably the closest thing, and it's nowhere near the effectiveness of Weak Bullet.

In order to fix the problem, every other class should have an equivalent contributing ability.
Something that assists all players to the point of obtaining roughly the same result.
Of course, the game would then need to be rebalanced around that.

Or you could avoid power creep and just remove the problem instead of giving everyone a means of matching the problem.


I'm curious on why they called it "Ultimate Quest" instead of "Ultimate Mode"... hopefully I'm worrying over nothing.

You need Ultimate Passes to play Ultimate Difficulty which cost Ultimate Capsules which you get by converted 20 Extreme Passes and 10 D, E, and F Advance Capsules into half an Ultimate Pass which you have to craft into a full one with Planet Crystals that you get through hunts. The planet crystal you use to craft determines where you can use Ultimate Pass i.e. if you use a Vopar crystal you can only use the Ultimate Pass for one run in Ultimate Vopar.

HeyItsTHK
Aug 16, 2014, 05:14 AM
I wouldn't be surprised if it was an EQ or an XQ type of thing instead of a straight up difficulty.

Would make sense as a XQ thing. That would be very EXTREME.

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 05:14 AM
The whole problem with Ranger's Weak Bullet has nothing to do with Ranger being crap or good.
The problem is that, in terms of combat speed, Ranger Weak Bullet is a necessity.
It increases everyone's damage by... what was it, 300%?
Do any of the other classes have anything remotely similar?
Shifta is probably the closest thing, and it's nowhere near the effectiveness of Weak Bullet.

In order to fix the problem, every other class should have an equivalent contributing ability.
Something that assists all players to the point of obtaining roughly the same result.
Of course, the game would then need to be rebalanced around that.People keep saying this kind of stuff but I honestly think weakbullet is too strong flat out. That shouldn't be the standard that everyone is used to, and the fact that it became that, and then they started balancing bosses around it is a big problem for future balancing.


I wouldn't be surprised if it was an EQ or an XQ type of thing instead of a straight up difficulty.

Would make sense as a XQ thing. That would be very EXTREME.

It might be a whole new quest type rather than a difficulty, like AQs or something. As long as it's not timegated somehow I don't really care.

musicmf
Aug 16, 2014, 05:16 AM
You need Ultimate Passes to play Ultimate Difficulty which cost Ultimate Capsules which you get by converted 20 Extreme Passes and 10 D, E, and F Advance Capsules into half an Ultimate Pass which you have to craft into a full one with Planet Crystals that you get through hunts. The planet crystal you use to craft determines where you can use Ultimate Pass i.e. if you use a Vopar crystal you can only use the Ultimate Pass for one run in Ultimate Vopar.

Sounds about right for Sega.

Aurorra
Aug 16, 2014, 05:16 AM
I'm curious on why they called it "Ultimate Quest" instead of "Ultimate Mode"... hopefully I'm worrying over nothing.

According to the road map there's a new difficulty for some EQs, no mention of a general new difficulty. Also, holy !@#$ this was long.

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 05:20 AM
Guys, there's also something about a new quest type, I doubt Ultimate is ONLY gonna be a new difficulty for EQs. Let's not forget that we're likely only getting ultimate for forest. It's probably the new quest type, not difficulty.

Kilich
Aug 16, 2014, 05:20 AM
The Ultimate world's sky looks like the dimensional crack that Xiao brought the mothership from.

HeyItsTHK
Aug 16, 2014, 05:23 AM
Messing with time and space bringing about a disaster? Sounds about right.

Maenara
Aug 16, 2014, 05:23 AM
Uh.
Forest dragon?

GHNeko
Aug 16, 2014, 05:23 AM
Yeah Ultimate is probably canon-related.

PSO1 never had a reason for Ultimate nor did it really need to explain it, but I guess here they dont have the luxury of following the PSO1 Ultimate formula of new looks and new enemies without explaing it like they did back in 2000.

HeyItsTHK
Aug 16, 2014, 05:25 AM
Uh.
Forest dragon?

Most certainly a Quartz Dragon judging by its pose, cept it looks like a phoenix peacock instead.

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 05:26 AM
Yeah Ultimate is probably canon-related.

PSO1 never had a reason for Ultimate nor did it really need to explain it, but I guess here they dont have the luxury of following the PSO1 Ultimate formula of new looks and new enemies without explaing it like they did back in 2000.To be fair they didn't explain the changed boost seeds in SH, which also look a lot like PBs.
But if Ultimate is a new quest type and not just a new difficulty then I think there'll be story related to it eventually.





I hope.

Kilich
Aug 16, 2014, 05:26 AM
Uh.
Forest dragon?
Different dimension, different rules :-?

Poyonche
Aug 16, 2014, 05:27 AM
Can someone bring Ultimate video here ? :c

1 watch wasn't enough :v

Thanks to the person who do it :3

NVM : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=__YZd1_NX1c

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 05:31 AM
I think the forest dragon thing is a reskin of Vol, not Quarts, based on it's animations.

Shinamori
Aug 16, 2014, 05:37 AM
Hmm. I knew I quit a bit too earlier, I wonder if you can go back and watch it.

landman
Aug 16, 2014, 05:40 AM
Did an ultimate rockbear launch the player with a high kick?

Poyonche
Aug 16, 2014, 05:41 AM
His horns make me think to Hildetorr :0


+Or launch you with an uppercut :3

And dat PB like ennemy, he does an Ajax-Imera like :O

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 06:02 AM
Guys... Guys... The new Vopar map... I think I know what I'm going to listen to while playing there.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jCirSTHMEEA

yoshiblue
Aug 16, 2014, 06:06 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=INvSV8JY5VM

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 06:09 AM
Windy And Ripply (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=INvSV8JY5VM)I dunno if emerald coast has the same "ruins jutting out of the water" aesthetic.

Might be good for the current coast map though. o wo

yoshiblue
Aug 16, 2014, 06:12 AM
I just like the thought of entering Area 2 and are already forced to dodge some killer whales.

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 06:14 AM
I just like the thought of entering Area 2 and are already forced to dodge some killer whales.Well having Val Rodos pop out and try to eat you is pretty close so points for that. o wo

Maenara
Aug 16, 2014, 06:14 AM
The forest dragon CAN'T be ultimate Vol Dragon though, they showed absolutely no enemies from Amduscia, and there's been data for this for a long time, and there isn't anything about Amduscia.

Xaelouse
Aug 16, 2014, 06:23 AM
You'd think the oceanid designs couldn't get any more weird looking

Rakurai
Aug 16, 2014, 06:23 AM
I get the impression that dragon monster is the mature form of that winged darker core.

Though I'm wondering if those things even are darker cores now...

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 06:26 AM
The forest dragon CAN'T be ultimate Vol Dragon though, they showed absolutely no enemies from Amduscia, and there's been data for this for a long time, and there isn't anything about Amduscia.I just meant that it's a reskin, not that it's a dragon. That roaring animation it does is the same one vol does.


I get the impression that dragon monster is the mature form of that winged darker core.

Though I'm wondering if those things even are darker cores now...I think it's just a new native that we've never seen before. It doesn't look like a darker at all.

Maenara
Aug 16, 2014, 06:27 AM
You'd think the oceanid designs couldn't get any more weird looking

Well they're all Luther's experiments anyways, the entire planet was a giant laboratory for him.

Rakurai
Aug 16, 2014, 06:28 AM
I think it's just a new native that we've never seen before. It doesn't look like a darker at all.

Those SH darker cores don't really look that darker-like, either, considering their favoring of white and purple color schemes instead of black and red.

They seem more reminiscent of photon beasts. Which makes me curious as to what their role in the story is...

Maenara
Aug 16, 2014, 06:29 AM
A) Anyone else as excited as I am to see ultimate Vardha, Tranmizer, Ringahda, and Chrome Dragon?

B) What if we get ultimate Dark Falz Elder? God knows he could use the upgrade.

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 06:34 AM
Those SH darker cores don't really look that darker-like, either, considering their favoring of white and purple color schemes instead of black and red.

They seem more reminiscent of photon beasts. Which makes me curious as to what their role in the story is...I'm the last person you need to be telling that since I've been bringing it up constantly since SH was announced. >_>
EDIT: It might be a new rare boss along the lines of Chrome.



B) What if we get ultimate Dark Falz Elder? God knows he could use the upgrade.I don't think Ultimate is gonna work like that. It's a new mission type, not a difficulty.

Rien
Aug 16, 2014, 06:37 AM
さあ踏み出せ 風を蹴散らせ 終わりなき物語へ
見たい未来 自分次第 そう、あきらめない限り
ひとりじゃない そう気さくなひ 君は強くなっていく
つないだ手の温もりを 道しるべに 歩き出すんだ

Just a preview

Maenara
Aug 16, 2014, 06:38 AM
I'm the last person you need to be telling that since I've been bringing it up constantly since SH was announced. >_>

I don't think Ultimate is gonna work like that. It's a new mission type, not a difficulty.

There's no reason for them to completely skip out on some enemies if pretty much every enemy is getting a makeover. We haven't seen any darkers yet.

Wait.

Those light cores that replace the darker cores in SH.
That mag boss.

That mag boss is an ultimate darker.

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 06:42 AM
There's no reason for them to completely skip out on some enemies if pretty much every enemy is getting a makeover. We haven't seen any darkers yet.

Wait.

Those light cores that replace the darker cores in SH.
That mag boss.

That mag boss is an ultimate darker.Err my point is that there probably won't be an ultimate falz because falz won't show up in ultimate quests.

And I don't think those things are darkers. It's possible they're related to what luther was doing though.

Maenara
Aug 16, 2014, 06:44 AM
Err my point is that there probably won't be an ultimate falz because falz won't show up in ultimate quests.

And I don't think those things are darkers. It's possible they're related to what luther was doing though.

Falz Hunar doe

The Walrus
Aug 16, 2014, 06:45 AM
Yeah Ultimate is probably canon-related.

PSO1 never had a reason for Ultimate nor did it really need to explain it, but I guess here they dont have the luxury of following the PSO1 Ultimate formula of new looks and new enemies without explaing it like they did back in 2000.

I thought Ult was explained as what happened if pioneer 2 arrived a few days/weeks later than it actually does in canon

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 06:47 AM
Falz Hunar doe
I thought you meant elder and luther. I:

Maenara
Aug 16, 2014, 06:48 AM
But Elder IS Hunar.

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 06:50 AM
But Elder IS Hunar.Yeah and he's also Gettemheart. You know what I meant. I:

Maenara
Aug 16, 2014, 06:56 AM
So, could these ultimate areas be, for example, planets that are post-Falz? Naberius should have been pretty rekt, based on what we saw at the end of MB8.

Kilich
Aug 16, 2014, 06:58 AM
So, could these ultimate areas be, for example, planets that are post-Falz? Naberius should have been pretty rekt, based on what we saw at the end of MB8.
So wrecked that its sky color and natives fully changed? That's seems unlikely.

Maenara
Aug 16, 2014, 07:01 AM
So wrecked that its sky color and natives fully changed? That's seems unlikely.

YOU go watch that cutscene and tell me what should have happened to Naberius.

Rakurai
Aug 16, 2014, 07:04 AM
Wonder if the new 12 player boss releasing in winter is another Falz. It feels terribly soon to be fighting one again.

If it is, I'm hoping it's Apprentice, not Double, considering how much more exposure she's gotten so far.

TenebriS
Aug 16, 2014, 07:05 AM
Since we have time traveling to the past, what if it is pre-sealed falz? o:

After all we learned that all the tundra didn't use to be frozen.

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 07:06 AM
If it is, I'm hoping it's Apprentice, not Double, considering how much more exposure she's gotten so far.Yeah, with all the mine defense stuff she'll probably eventually get her body back and then bam bug falz.

Kilich
Aug 16, 2014, 07:06 AM
YOU go watch that cutscene and tell me what should have happened to Naberius.
It would've had a huge crater instead of a tundra and tons of dust in the air that could turn the rest of it into tundra.

But changing sky color to yellow, different natives, no snow and even some trees? I think that being an alternate dimension Nab is more likely.

NoiseHERO
Aug 16, 2014, 07:07 AM
Obviously there's light enemies in a parallel dimension to ours, and our mags just summon them by storing enough energy to bendi time and space temporarily and unleash their hostility, and now dark weapon types will have a use endgame and everyone taking the easy route on light weapons the whole game are gonna be gimp- no wait this game is too easy for that.

But nah.

Rien
Aug 16, 2014, 07:17 AM
目を閉じれば聴こえる 鼓動に耳をすまそう
手を伸ばせばそこにある 勇気を握りめて
誰もがみな明日へと 続いてる道の途中
思い描くあの宙(そら)は まだ遠いけど
かけかえのない微笑みが 闇に灯りともすよ
離れていてもその胸を 照らしているから

さあ踏み出せ 風を蹴散らせ 終わりなき物語へ
見たい未来 自分次第 そう、あきらめない限り
ひとりじゃない そう気さくなひ 君は強くなっていく
つないだ手の温もりを 道しるべに 歩き出すんだ

見渡しても誰もいない ただ風が吹いてるだけ
でも確かに聴こえてる あたたかい声
背中で感じてる想い 君を守ってくるよ
だから振り向かずにいける まっすぐにすすめ

今始まる 胸の信号(シグナル) 果てしなき物語へ
この世界 無限大 そう共に紡いでいこう
ひとりきりで 抱(いた)くヒカリは 弱くて小さいけれど
ひとりずつつなぎ合わせ さあ大きく 輝かせよう

たったひとつの物語 誰もが英雄なんだ
顔を上げてその瞳に 奇跡が映るよ

さあ踏み出せ 風を蹴散らせ 終わりなき物語へ
見たい未来 自分次第 そう、あきらめない限り
ひとりじゃない そう気さくなひ 君は強くなっていく
つないだ手の温もりを 道しるべに 歩いていこう

行こういつか 夢見た場所へ 瞳に映る世界へ
消えないぬくもりを 道しるべに 歩いていこう

landman
Aug 16, 2014, 07:20 AM
I expected from the beginning Ultimate would have natives transformed into darkers, and in the cutscene, Falz was almost the size of the planet... if Naberius core is incandescent all the continents in the planet would have broken and moved... so yea, it seemed catastrophic enough to the point to change the sky colour.

oratank
Aug 16, 2014, 07:58 AM
from xio spoke in trailer i think df take over naberius and xio decide to use his and xion planet collide to naberius to prevent pb from awaken. so it became ultimate naberius

Kilich
Aug 16, 2014, 08:03 AM
Maybe it wasn't Elder, but Luther? I mean, ramming the mothership into a planet is an easy way to destroy it, but hopefully keep some of Xion's planet.

NoiseHERO
Aug 16, 2014, 08:03 AM
from xio spoke in trailer i think df take over naberius and xio decide to use his and xion planet collide to naberius to prevent pb from awaken. so it became ultimate naberius

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g6zqHKd265E

how to make an ultimate planet.

infiniteeverlasting
Aug 16, 2014, 08:05 AM
Can anyone post a vid clip/screenshot of the ultimate areas?

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 08:06 AM
Can anyone post a vid clip/screenshot of the ultimate areas?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=__YZd1_NX1c

Maenara
Aug 16, 2014, 08:38 AM
I really like the BGM in that trailer.

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 08:44 AM
It sounds like the base defense motif, which is weird because they usually only use that for general updates, it doesn't really make sense for it to be used when introducing a new map. ._.

Maenara
Aug 16, 2014, 08:51 AM
It sounds like the base defense motif, which is weird because they usually only use that for general updates, it doesn't really make sense for it to be used when introducing a new map. ._.

It's too calm for base defense, and too long for the interludes.

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 09:10 AM
It's too calm for base defense, and too long for the interludes.I said motif. I'm sorry for being so vague. I meant that motif is so associated with base defense that I'm not sure what that music is supposed to be for ingame or why they'd introduce a new song using it when revealing new unrelated areas.

Mega Ultra Chicken
Aug 16, 2014, 09:34 AM
A pirate ship and PSO2 actually getting the Ultimate mode makeover. I love it.

Gardios
Aug 16, 2014, 10:51 AM
Cross posting from the Bouncer thread:

Does that look right?


Aptitude Up 1 ? Step
├───────────────────┬───────────────────┐ │
│ │ 3 │ 3 │
│ Striking Up 1 Technique Up 1 Bouncer Mag Step Advance
│ │
│ │ 3
│ Striking Up 2
├───────────────────┬───────────────────┐
│ │ 1 │ 1
│ Jet Boots Gear Dual Blade Gear Step Attack
├───────────────────┬───────────────────┐
│ │ 3 │ 3
│ Elemental PP R. F Critical Field Just Reversal
│ │
│ │
│ J R. PP Recover
├───────────────────┬───────────────────────────── ──────────┬───────────────────┐
│ │ 3 │ 3 │ ?
│ Shifta Air Att. B. Deband PP Restorate Heal Share
│ │
│ │ ?
│ Heal Bonus
├───────────────────┬───────────────────┬───────── ──────────┬───────────────────┬─────────────────── ┐
│ │ 3 │ 3 │ 3 │ ? │ 3
│ Rapid Boost Elemental Burst Jet Boots Strike Photon Blade Fever Photon Blade Escape
│ │ │
│ │ 3 │ ?
│ Rapid Boost JA Bonus Photon B. Fever Up 1
├───────────────────────────────────────┐
│ 3 │ 3
Elemental Stance Break Stance
├───────────────────┐ ├───────────────────┐
│ 5 │ 3 │ 5 │ 3
Elemental S. Up 1 Elemental S CriticalBreak Stance Up 1 Break S Critical

I assume question mark is Craft Mastery or Rare Mastery, but where is the other?

Maninbluejumpsuit
Aug 16, 2014, 10:55 AM
Cross posting from the Bouncer thread:

Does that look right?


Aptitude Up 1 ? Step
├───────────────────┬───────────────────┐ │
│ │ 3 │ 3 │
│ Striking Up 1 Technique Up 1 Bouncer Mag Step Advance
│ │
│ │ 3
│ Striking Up 2
├───────────────────┬───────────────────┐
│ │ 1 │ 1
│ Jet Boots Gear Dual Blade Gear Step Attack
├───────────────────┬───────────────────┐
│ │ 3 │ 3
│ Elemental PP R. F Critical Field Just Reversal
│ │
│ │
│ J R. PP Recover
├───────────────────┬───────────────────────────── ──────────┬───────────────────┐
│ │ 3 │ 3 │ ?
│ Shifta Air Att. B. Deband PP Restorate Heal Share
│ │
│ │ ?
│ Heal Bonus
├───────────────────┬───────────────────┬───────── ──────────┬───────────────────┬─────────────────── ┐
│ │ 3 │ 3 │ 3 │ ? │ 3
│ Rapid Boost Elemental Burst Jet Boots Strike Photon Blade Fever Photon Blade Escape
│ │ │
│ │ 3 │ ?
│ Rapid Boost JA Bonus Photon B. Fever Up 1
├───────────────────────────────────────┐
│ 3 │ 3
Elemental Stance Break Stance
├───────────────────┐ ├───────────────────┐
│ 5 │ 3 │ 5 │ 3
Elemental S. Up 1 Elemental S CriticalBreak Stance Up 1 Break S Critical

I assume question mark is Craft Mastery or Rare Mastery, but where is the other?

Where's switch strike, unless that's a weapon action for some reason?

Gardios
Aug 16, 2014, 10:56 AM
I assume Jet Boots Strike is Switch Strike.

Enforcer MKV
Aug 16, 2014, 11:02 AM
I'm sorry for being so vague.

I'unno, you were pretty clear to me...

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 11:05 AM
Heal share? Is that why I saw so many green numbers in one of the videos? >_> That'll be hella useful for support builds if the range is bigger than resta's.

I'unno, you were pretty clear to me...Was I though? Motif isn't exactly a household word.

Shiyo
Aug 16, 2014, 11:07 AM
Weak bullet is fine as it is shush Rangers been getting shafted for a while its their time to shine D: Just gotta know how to play and adapt.
No. There's absolutely nothing else nice I can say to your post, sorry.

Poyonche
Aug 16, 2014, 11:27 AM
Like i said on Bouncer class talk thread, there seem to be 3 columns in the top right corner, however on your "text-tree" there are 2 columns. :3

NoiseHERO
Aug 16, 2014, 11:32 AM
Since skilltrees aren't retarded anymore, there's not really much to analyze other than skill point management and specific skill preference! : D

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 11:33 AM
Since skilltrees aren't retarded anymore, there's not really much to analyze other than skill point management and specific skill preference! : DYeah but we don't know what all the skills do so there's still plenty to speculate on.

Rien
Aug 16, 2014, 11:35 AM
We know more than half of these without the specific numbers

Shiyo
Aug 16, 2014, 11:36 AM
Why do the devs think it's ok for every melee class to be forced to spend 20 of their skill points on 100% mandatory stances(more for HU)?

Why are they even a choice if they're going to be mandatory, one or the other? If they're going to remain mandatory, why do they cost >>TWENTY<< skill points?

Blows my mind, completely baffling.

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 11:43 AM
Why do the devs think it's ok for every melee class to be forced to spend 20 of their skill points on 100% mandatory stances(more for HU)?

Why are they even a choice if they're going to be mandatory, one or the other? If they're going to remain mandatory, why do they cost >>TWENTY<< skill points?

Blows my mind, completely baffling.Errr, all the classes have things like that except maybe Techer.

WHA and/or standing snipe+Weak Bullet for rangers, ZRA and/or Perfect keeper+SR for gunners, both Tech charge advances for Forces, not to mention focusing on an element. All the katana or bow skills for Braver on top of their stances, because you can forget going hybrid nowadays. This problem isn't limited to just stances.

Call me when it's common for classes to require putting 70 of their points into what basically ammounts to one thing like hunter currently does.

LonelyGaruga
Aug 16, 2014, 12:14 PM
So, could these ultimate areas be, for example, planets that are post-Falz? Naberius should have been pretty rekt, based on what we saw at the end of MB8.

Only Naberius and Lilipa have a Falz sealed in them in the first place, and a gargantuan being using a planet as a launchpad doesn't result in lifeforms mutating, and wouldn't change the color of the sky, so this can't be it.

Why does this warrant spoilering, anyway?

Sizustar
Aug 16, 2014, 12:31 PM
Why do the devs think it's ok for every melee class to be forced to spend 20 of their skill points on 100% mandatory stances(more for HU)?

Why are they even a choice if they're going to be mandatory, one or the other? If they're going to remain mandatory, why do they cost >>TWENTY<< skill points?

Blows my mind, completely baffling.

I don't understand.
You want skills to have no effect at all, and that different skill build to all play the same?
Or that a dedicated build to be as strong as a none-dedicated build?

TaigaUC
Aug 16, 2014, 01:22 PM
Personally, I'm not a fan of systems that involve putting tons of points into tiny incremental stat/damage increases.
I recall Vindictus's skills being mostly that. Super boring.
PSO2 was kinda weird with how almost everything used to require 10 points.
Glad they are moving away from that.

Maenara
Aug 16, 2014, 01:44 PM
So did anyone else notice that the new ultimate rockbear knows fucking KARATE?!

Unnamed Player
Aug 16, 2014, 01:52 PM
Wait, is it Ultimate Mode or just Ultimate Quests(you know, like Advanced/Extreme Quests)?

strikerhunter
Aug 16, 2014, 02:00 PM
Wait, is it Ultimate Mode or just Ultimate Quests(you know, like Advanced/Extreme Quests)?

From Bumped


-New Quest Type

Also, at the beginning of one of the trailers did anyone notice the two objects colliding into one of the planet or possibly another object?
Pausing at :29 and you'll see it
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZRzJSF1AZck#t=29

Maenara
Aug 16, 2014, 02:04 PM
Could someone post the rest of the new trailers?

NoiseHERO
Aug 16, 2014, 02:10 PM
From Bumped



Also, at the beginning of one of the trailers did anyone notice the two objects colliding into one of the planet or possibly another object?
Pausing at :29 and you'll see it
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZRzJSF1AZck#t=29

Yeah it was a Chaos Dunk clashing with a Falcon Punch

Sizustar
Aug 16, 2014, 02:32 PM
Wait, is it Ultimate Mode or just Ultimate Quests(you know, like Advanced/Extreme Quests)?

Well, Yu(The new director) already hinted at Ultimate at the last fan festa.
When he stated that the current max level and 10~12* gear is enough for current SH end game content, and that if they put in 13*+, it'll be because of higher difficulity in a future update.

GHNeko
Aug 16, 2014, 02:39 PM
So why did i hear something about a Level cap raise?

Angry_Ryudo
Aug 16, 2014, 02:41 PM
Was that a Bal Rodos watering the players in the new Vopal field? o_O

The Walrus
Aug 16, 2014, 02:45 PM
Sure looked like it


So why did i hear something about a Level cap raise?

Because we're getting one before the end of the year.

Maenara
Aug 16, 2014, 02:46 PM
Was that a Bal Rodos watering the players in the new Vopal field? o_O

Yep. Might appear like that back in Coast too.

GHNeko
Aug 16, 2014, 03:05 PM
Because we're getting one before the end of the year.

Right. So if that's the case, could that implying that we're getting 13*s?

I kind of hope not... x_x

I appreciate the long standing tradition of 12* being the rarest.

That and I would prefer raw enemy strength to surpass raw player strength so that player skill is required to make up for the gap.

Maenara
Aug 16, 2014, 03:09 PM
That and I would prefer raw enemy strength to surpass raw player strength so that player skill is required to make up for the gap.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA no

GHNeko
Aug 16, 2014, 03:22 PM
Uh yeah?

If you're good at the game with average gear, then the game is like normal difficulty. Not hard but not baby-tier easy.

But if you have good gear and you're good, then the game is laughable. Regardless of builds unless it's intentionally bad in most ways possible.

I prefer games where you can minmax to hell and back, and upon doing so you find that end game enemies are equal in raw power.

Like secret optional bosses from the SMT series, or from Bravely Default, or from the Final Fantasy series.

SO that when you come across these enemies, regardless of your god-tier equipment, you still need to exploit every resource you have in order to become victorious.

If you cant win, then you need to get better as a player. YOu cant just grind and gear your way to victory.

Kikikiki
Aug 16, 2014, 03:26 PM
Like secret optional bosses from the SMT series

I still cry at Elizabeth.

Sandmind
Aug 16, 2014, 04:56 PM
Seeing how the last MB raised new questions on Persona, I could see some link with Ultimate Quest, story wise.

[SPOILER]SH darker core could be a result of time alteration like dewman were. All leading to ultimate. And Persona's goal being to prevent an even worse future that the one we were originally changing from, aka, we went too far the previous time. I would give Sega a thumbs up if they go for the butterfly effect.[/SPOILER-BOX]

Xaelouse
Aug 16, 2014, 05:25 PM
Feels as though they're gonna be lazy and only make an Ultimate Quest per planet.
If they did that though, at the very least make it have more than 3 areas each.
Also weapon latent lvl5 when

LonelyGaruga
Aug 16, 2014, 05:59 PM
Was that a Bal Rodos watering the players in the new Vopal field? o_O

Yeah, datamining indicated a "MarineOarfishII" (Bal Rodos is MarineOarfish), which should be the Bal Rodos in the new area.


HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA no

Got a good reason why it shouldn't be the case?

HeyItsTHK
Aug 16, 2014, 06:47 PM
Uh yeah?

If you're good at the game with average gear, then the game is like normal difficulty. Not hard but not baby-tier easy.

But if you have good gear and you're good, then the game is laughable. Regardless of builds unless it's intentionally bad in most ways possible.

I prefer games where you can minmax to hell and back, and upon doing so you find that end game enemies are equal in raw power.

Like secret optional bosses from the SMT series, or from Bravely Default, or from the Final Fantasy series.

SO that when you come across these enemies, regardless of your god-tier equipment, you still need to exploit every resource you have in order to become victorious.

If you cant win, then you need to get better as a player. YOu cant just grind and gear your way to victory.

Though end game stuff in mmos don't quite only test your worth, but test the worth of the entire group you're in. I've seen one, two and four man Elders, but I haven't seen a single party/pair/person handle (on SH that is), a TD, or Mothership or Loser.

I think some people solo XQs, but I dunno why you would. And you CAN solo AQs, but there's no point in doing so.


Why do the devs think it's ok for every melee class to be forced to spend 20 of their skill points on 100% mandatory stances(more for HU)?

Why are they even a choice if they're going to be mandatory, one or the other? If they're going to remain mandatory, why do they cost >>TWENTY<< skill points?

Blows my mind, completely baffling.

Can't particularly think of a game that doesn't require dumping a bunch of points into must haves.

GHNeko
Aug 16, 2014, 06:58 PM
Though end game stuff in mmos don't quite only test your worth, but test the worth of the entire group you're in. I've seen one, two and four man Elders, but I haven't seen a single party/pair/person handle (on SH that is), a TD, or Mothership or Loser.

I think some people solo XQs, but I dunno why you would. And you CAN solo AQs, but there's no point in doing so.

Yeah. My point applies to groups as well.

an mmo that has enemies/maps/bosses that are on the same level of raw power as a 4/8/12/24/etc man group and requires the group to work together to exploit everything given to them and outlast the boss is a good thing.

That's why I've respected FF11's field bosses (though that one that had players playing for like 13 hours straight was nuts)

HeyItsTHK
Aug 16, 2014, 07:05 PM
Yeah. My point applies to groups as well.

an mmo that has enemies/maps/bosses that are on the same level of raw power as a 4/8/12/24/etc man group and requires the group to work together to exploit everything given to them and outlast the boss is a good thing.

That's why I've respected FF11's field bosses (though that one that had players playing for like 13 hours straight was nuts)

That boss was never meant to be killed. Those players were nuts. :-?

GHNeko
Aug 16, 2014, 07:31 PM
Regardless, those guys needed to do everything within their power.

Having minmaxed gear was like a prereq.

Games that have bosses where grinding/gear are not even a factor and everything is just how well you can adapt and manipulate and plan and exploit, I feel are better and PSO2 could use more of that. Or just use it period.

HeyItsTHK
Aug 16, 2014, 07:42 PM
I do take some enjoyment in knowing that even though I'm decently geared, a mistake or two can ruin me.

Gardios
Aug 16, 2014, 07:43 PM
http://pso2-skill.pwnedgalaxy.net/

Close your eyes and distribute skill points randomly, because who knows what the skills do anyway.

Atmius
Aug 16, 2014, 07:49 PM
but I haven't seen a single party/pair/person handle (on SH that is), a TD, or Mothership or Loser.

There are quite a number of videos around for single/party eq's. Some of the luther ones are absurd (this (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rwx31-i4YfU) one comes to mind). TD1, at the very least, can be done by a party of 4, and there was even the lobby monitor video of a te/hu timing out waves in TD1 to complete it.

HeyItsTHK
Aug 16, 2014, 07:56 PM
There are quite a number of videos around for single/party eq's. Some of the luther ones are absurd (this (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rwx31-i4YfU) one comes to mind). TD1, at the very least, can be done by a party of 4, and there was even the lobby monitor video of a te/hu timing out waves in TD1 to complete it.

I should have specified TD2 or 3. I've done a TD1 with 5 people heh. But WOW that Luther run.

Cypher_9
Aug 16, 2014, 08:26 PM
"Braver’s Combat Escape becomes main class only."

Good, I am glad they did this; destroy the way of being a marysue on this game.... So who still want to be a FI/BR now... o 3o

But in all truth, I feel they are going to make this game the geniune difficulty it should be while people are going to have to learn about their class - which they have missed their mark from the begining. And if this one technique is 'main-classed' then the reverse is also true (eventhough I did read somewhere that Limit Break is Figther main only) - so there... I am pleased...

GHNeko
Aug 16, 2014, 08:33 PM
I mean really all this is going to do is prevent people from going BR sub when using Katana....which not a lot of people do already.

Granted this should have been the case from the start.

oratank
Aug 16, 2014, 08:43 PM
no escape or not people still use br sub to lv main class hatou supreme.

Edson Drake
Aug 16, 2014, 08:54 PM
is it really absurd a little more HP and S-ATK to warrant combat escape to main BR only?

I mean, am I missing something in here? Because that's all I see when going HU/BR and apparently FI/BR?

LonelyGaruga
Aug 16, 2014, 09:00 PM
Combat Escape is becoming a main class only skill not because of nerfing, but because Bouncer is getting a similar skill for Dual Blades (Photon Blade Escape). Presumably, that will also be main class only, so as to prevent players from using both Escape skills as a Br/Bo or Bo/Br.

GHNeko
Aug 16, 2014, 09:10 PM
is it really absurd a little more HP and S-ATK to warrant combat escape to main BR only?

I mean, am I missing something in here? Because that's all I see when going HU/BR and apparently FI/BR?

It's because combat escape is an incredibly good skill. LIke really really good.

So good that it shouldnt be in the hands of every class that isnt BR.

It's like as stupid good as element convert, which is clearly main only.

Enforcer MKV
Aug 16, 2014, 09:12 PM
who still want to be a FI/BR now.

Well, considering Violet's been FI/BR for the last several months.....

*Raises his hand*

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 09:21 PM
It's like as stupid good as element convert, which is clearly main only.
Element convert is good but I wouldn't compare it to 20 seconds of invincibility. >_>

I honestly think the only thing in the game that's more broken is weak bullet.

Skyly
Aug 16, 2014, 09:26 PM
Element convert is good but I wouldn't compare it to 20 seconds of invincibility. >_>

I honestly think the only thing in the game that's more broken is weak bullet.

Whether we like to believe it or not, we NEED weak bullet.

HeyItsTHK
Aug 16, 2014, 09:36 PM
20 seconds of raw invincibility is busted no matter which way you look at it. Don't take long for it to cool down either. Weak bullet is fine, while I agree it wasn't nerfed enough. It's nerfed for everyone else, but not rangers, heh.

Shiyo
Aug 16, 2014, 09:40 PM
So does EP3 stop this game from being an EQ simulator?

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 09:43 PM
Whether we like to believe it or not, we NEED weak bullet.
That's what makes it OP. We shouldn't NEED a single skill from a single class as the standard.

People get so used to speed clearing that it never regestered that Luther is SUPPOSED to take 20 minutes to kill. Is that bad design? Yes, but Weak bullet trivializes every boss in the game. I would rather them nerf weak bullet and luther, than buff everything else so we really do need weakbullet for everything.

I'm not saying weakbullet should be completely removed, it's a cool skill mechanically but it needs to not increase an entire MPA's damage so exponentially. Not stacking with existing weakspots would be a start.

oratank
Aug 16, 2014, 09:51 PM
10 min luther is fine but 20 min is no no. it's fucking try no fun and all

GHNeko
Aug 16, 2014, 09:51 PM
Element convert is good but I wouldn't compare it to 20 seconds of invincibility. >_>

I honestly think the only thing in the game that's more broken is weak bullet.


20 seconds of raw invincibility is busted no matter which way you look at it. Don't take long for it to cool down either. Weak bullet is fine, while I agree it wasn't nerfed enough. It's nerfed for everyone else, but not rangers, heh.

Which kinda makes my point even better.

Element Convert is class only and it's no where near the level of Combat Escape, and yet the latter is not main only?

lol i dont think CE is broken, but more so what you pay to get CE is not enough to justify the gains.

CE doesnt feel out of place in this game. It just should cost a lot more SP to get it to the level that its at. 10-15 imo.

Totori
Aug 16, 2014, 09:51 PM
We need to replace Weak bullet, or rather just make the percentage 150% extra damage, while giving the techs Zalure and Jellen back to normal usage.

oratank
Aug 16, 2014, 09:56 PM
just not multiply wb at weak point this gonna be ok

Edson Drake
Aug 16, 2014, 09:57 PM
So does EP3 stop this game from being an EQ simulator?

I think it's more like LQ/EQ which is fine on my book, of course we need more LQs as well, and rewarding ones like the current ruins going on.


It's because combat escape is an incredibly good skill. LIke really really good.

So good that it shouldnt be in the hands of every class that isnt BR.

It's like as stupid good as element convert, which is clearly main only.

I know I have a 64/70 HU/BR on the making, which I intended playing as katana Braver mainly. What I don't get is that Combat Escape only works with katana right, so, Braver gameplay with slightly higher stats. But I get it that it means everyone can use it and the nerf isn't going to affect me much, so no complains.

But to be perfectly honest, I dislike this whole "main class only" thing currently going on. Ok I get it it's to balance the game, but it's really becoming a game of specialised builds instead of free experimentation, where if you don't follow the meta, you're basically wasting a spot in an MPA. This bothers me a little.

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 09:59 PM
We need to replace Weak bullet, or rather just make the percentage 150% extra damage, while giving the techs Zalure and Jellen back to normal usage.The main reason I say weakbullet shouldn't stack with weakpoints is because that would fix it's main problem. Turning existing weakpoints into nuke zones. I think the skill was meant to be a way to turn non-weakpoints into weakpoints for quick breakoffs but since it stacks with weakpoints too you end up with like 600% damage multipliers.

Having it at 255% but not stacking with weakpoints means it'll increase the damage more for non weakpoints but less for existing weakpoints. Ragne's leggs for instance would be bale to make use of the whole bonus, but it's head would only increase by 55% for shooting weapons.


Which kinda makes my point even better.

Element Convert is class only and it's no where near the level of Combat Escape, and yet the latter is not main only?

lol i dont think CE is broken, but more so what you pay to get CE is not enough to justify the gains.

CE doesnt feel out of place in this game. It just should cost a lot more SP to get it to the level that its at. 10-15 imo.Nah, I see what you're saying now.


10 min luther is fine but 20 min is no no. it's fucking try no fun and allI already said it's bad design and that if they nerf WB further that I'd want to see luther nerfed too. >_> My point is that it was probably intended to take a while because lolfinalboss or some shit.

GHNeko
Aug 16, 2014, 10:00 PM
I think it's more like LQ/EQ which is fine on my book, of course we need more LQs as well, and rewarding ones like the current ruins going on.



I know I have a 64/70 HU/BR on the making, which I intended playing as katana Braver mainly. What I don't get is that Combat Escape only works with katana right, so, Braver gameplay with slightly higher stats. But I get it that it means everyone can use it and the nerf isn't going to affect me much, so no complains.

But to be perfectly honest, I dislike this whole "main class only" thing currently going on. Ok I get it it's to balance the game, but it's really becoming a game of specialised builds instead of free experimentation, where if you don't follow the meta, you're basically wasting a spot in an MPA. This bothers me a little.

Main Class only is perfectly fine. Asymmetrical balance is desirable and should be striven for.

Homogenization is not something that should exist on a massive scale.

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 10:03 PM
Main Class only is perfectly fine. Asymmetrical balance is desirable and should be striven for.

Homogenization is not something that should exist on a massive scale.I feel like asymmetrical ballance should be attained through something else. Especially when the main only skills for say ranger, or techer, would actually open up some interesting builds if they worked as subs.

I would have prefered it been done via weapon selection but crafting basically shattered any chance of that happening.

ShinMaruku
Aug 16, 2014, 10:04 PM
I would rather them make interrupt mechanics and stuns on certain bosses that will open them up to much increased damage rather than just weak bullet. That would help people play in ways that their class works to get into that position to getting a boss into that point. Of course that would take better design. But that's what we need. the game can do this, they just need to think smarter.
For example
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZMx8nQUxE_k

GHNeko
Aug 16, 2014, 10:09 PM
I feel like asymmetrical ballance should be attained through something else. Especially when the main only skills for say ranger, or techer, would actually open up some interesting builds if they worked as subs.

I would have prefered it been done via weapon selection but crafting basically shattered any chance of that happening.

Fair point. I could accept main class skills working as subclasses with halved effectiveness or something, or with a 50% level cap. (ie as main can level to 10, but as sub, only to 5.)

When it comes to Asymmetrical balance, various methodologies can work, its the execution that matters. At least with main class skills working at 50% effectiveness, you're allowed access to them with that class being subbed, but your encouraged to main a class for its unique skill which is what i was more so focused on.

Allowing main class skills @ 100% as sub skills will more than likely lead to optimal builds that dominate the meta more so than what you're thinking about I feel.

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 10:10 PM
I would rather them make interrupt mechanics and stuns on certain bosses that will open them up to much increased damage rather than just weak bullet. That would help people play in ways that their class works to get into that position to getting a boss into that point. Of course that would take better design. But that's what we need. the game can do this, they just need to think smarter.
For example Metal Gear Rising - Metal Gear Ray in 1:11.42 (no attack, parry only) - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZMx8nQUxE_k)
Something like Karok's grapples would be cool for hunters. Though it might have to have a cool down or something to prevent stunlocking the bosses.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oP9pmNcd2rk

I can't understand what you're trying to show with that video though, the kind of combat in metal gear rising doesn't work very well in a multiplayer game. >_>
If you're saying there should be more interesting ways to stun bosses besides break offs and status effects though, then I kind of agree but I need examples, cause nothing else comes to mind.


Fair point. I could accept main class skills working as subclasses with halved effectiveness or something, or with a 50% level cap. (ie as main can level to 10, but as sub, only to 5.)

When it comes to Asymmetrical balance, various methodologies can work, its the execution that matters. At least with main class skills working at 50% effectiveness, you're allowed access to them with that class being subbed, but your encouraged to main a class for its unique skill which is what i was more so focused on.

Allowing main class skills @ 100% as sub skills will more than likely lead to optimal builds that dominate the meta more so than what you're thinking about I feel.

If they weren't using main class only skills to fix things that should be standard (fury gear boost, element conversion, long time assist, etc...) then I'd agree with you.

Alternatively they could make skill tree changes not a cash shop thing in a skill tree based game. I: Seriously.

Shiyo
Aug 16, 2014, 10:20 PM
Ahhhhhhhhh, there's people arguing that weak bullet is fine/needed.

Please no.

ShinMaruku
Aug 16, 2014, 10:32 PM
Something like Karok's grapples would be cool for hunters. Though it might have to have a cool down or something to prevent stunlocking the bosses.
Vindictus - Karok - All Clashes - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oP9pmNcd2rk)

I can't understand what you're trying to show with that video though, the kind of combat in metal gear rising doesn't work very well in a multiplayer game. >_>
If you're saying there should be more interesting ways to stun bosses besides break offs and status effects though, then I kind of agree but I need examples, cause nothing else comes to mind.





Alternatively they could make skill tree changes not a cash shop thing in a skill tree based game. I: Seriously.
Well Anarchy Reigns kind of works with multiplayer but I don't have good vids of that to show but yeah there should be states that you have a set amounts of times where you can place a boss in where you do increased damage, there should be a set amount to stun them. A skilled player will still do enough damage to make short work of the boss before the stun is over. That would make more things accessible while encouraging skilled play.

GHNeko
Aug 16, 2014, 10:33 PM
Ahhhhhhhhh, there's people arguing that weak bullet is fine/needed.

Please no.

It's true.

As it stands right now, you kinda do need WB to get shit cleared in a reasonable amount of time.

And that in itself is a problem.

So WB needs to go or be nerfed more, and every thing balanced around it need to be fixed.

Shiyo
Aug 16, 2014, 10:39 PM
It's true.

As it stands right now, you kinda do need WB to get shit cleared in a reasonable amount of time.

And that in itself is a problem.

So WB needs to go or be nerfed more, and every thing balanced around it need to be fixed.

Exactly.

Remz69
Aug 16, 2014, 10:40 PM
combat escape change means nothing
if they wanted to kill katana as a non braver main they should have made katana combat and gear main only -Kappa-

Shiyo
Aug 16, 2014, 10:42 PM
combat escape change means nothing
if they wanted to kill katana as a non braver main they should have made katana combat and gear main only -Kappa-

Combat escape shouldn't exist in a game with action combat all about dodging and blocking.

But hey, let's add another escape to the new class too, can't have any class requiring skill, now can we?

Remz69
Aug 16, 2014, 10:45 PM
Combat escape shouldn't exist in a game with action combat all about dodging and blocking.

But hey, let's add another escape to the new class too, can't have any class requiring skill, now can we?

i agree combat escape shouldn't be a thing in the first place

LordKaiser
Aug 16, 2014, 11:08 PM
http://pso2-skill.pwnedgalaxy.net/beta/08/v2/skillcalc.php?08eUbsIkbsIkbsIkbsIkbsIkbsIkbsIkbsIk 6dt6dodBIoJ2I3I2dB0GDsSI2000000doIn0000008doib0000 006do000000lo00000007oIn0000000lbIo4SfdFbNjsNHSHx0 000jdoIb000000f

Almost 800 S attack without S-Mag for Br/Hu FemDew. Not that i will see her again anyways. I like the new skill trees.

Kondibon
Aug 16, 2014, 11:14 PM
I actually think Photon Blade escape is going to be that weird hover dash they do and will work like a cross between mirage escape and Sroll.

At least I hope, cause yeah, another long term invincibility would be lame.

EDIT: To clarify, I think this because I saw them doing normal step dashes with dual blades, and the hover dash doesn't look like a PA.

GHNeko
Aug 16, 2014, 11:30 PM
Combat escape shouldn't exist in a game with action combat all about dodging and blocking.

But hey, let's add another escape to the new class too, can't have any class requiring skill, now can we?

NEET_Class

Are you surprised?

That being said, I still dont think it needs to go. It just needs to be a very expensive skill.

Again. 15SP investment for the full 30 seconds would be magnificent.

Kondibon
Aug 17, 2014, 12:06 AM
Again. 15SP investment for the full 30 seconds would be magnificent.That doesn't really fix the problem

I'd actually prefer if it was just hyper armor or something, but still lets you take damage. I never had a problem with DYING durring katana combat, getting knocked down or something wastes the time though.

GHNeko
Aug 17, 2014, 12:09 AM
Are you considering the problem the 20 seconds of invincibility?

If so, then agree to disagree because I dont think that is a problem, I think the lack of investment in the ability is the problem.

But then again, I come from a background of invincibility abuse as a competitive smasher, so clash of perspectives could be a thing?

Kondibon
Aug 17, 2014, 12:13 AM
Are you considering the problem the 20-30 seconds of invincibility?

If so, then agree to disagree because I dont think that is a problem, I think the lack of investment in the ability is the problem.

But then again, I come from a background of invincibility abuse as a competitive smasher, so clash of perspectives could be a thing?I think any long term invincibility that still allows you to fight and has a controlable exicution is bad in a game like this.

I have no problem with things like the short invincibility you get after just guarding or stepping because they last a very short time, there are still windows to get hit inbetween, and they require you to stop what you're doing. 20 seconds is a REALLY long time to just not take any damage while also having increased mobility and building up to an AoE nuke.

GHNeko
Aug 17, 2014, 12:16 AM
Right and I feel like giving CE a high point investment for the full 20 seconds would address that issue because you would have to burn points you would otherwise invest in damage to get that 20 seconds, drastically dropping the damage you get out of the class, making CE and KC in generally worth less.

If you have to sacrifice...let's just throw around numbers for arguement's sake....20-25% of your around-the-clock damage just for 20 seconds of invincibility vs 15-20% for 10 seconds or less, then the scale is much better balanced. The AoE Nuke you get from KC is going to suffer as well. The high point investment takes away from what makes CE a problem in the first place.

Braver's Potency.

Even if CE breaks the mold a bit.

Kondibon
Aug 17, 2014, 12:28 AM
Right and I feel like giving CE a high point investment for the full 20 seconds would address that issue because you would have to burn points you would otherwise invest in damage to get that 20 seconds, drastically dropping the damage you get out of the class, making CE and KC in generally worth less.

If you have to sacrifice 10-15% of your around-the-clock damage just for 20 seconds of invincibility vs 5-10% for 10 seconds or less, then the scale is much better balanced. The AoE Nuke you get from KC is going to suffer as well. The high point investment takes away from what makes CE a problem in the first place.

Braver's Potency.

Even if CE breaks the mold a bit.
You, (and a lot of other people) severely underestimate the benifits of being able to attack unninterrupted. Why do you think stunlocking bosses is such a big deal? Increasing the point cost wouldn't limit the skill's potential, and 20 seconds of invincibility every minute is worth far more than 10-15% more damage.

GHNeko
Aug 17, 2014, 12:31 AM
Well I get what you're saying. And like I said, i was just throwing out numbers for damage reduction. It could easily be higher than that.

Having your damage gutted across the board for 20 seconds of invincibility isnt worth it. You would opt for something more reasonable.

This is the point that I'm getting at.

The investment would be so high that the full 20 seconds would not be worth the losses you would incur from not having the points invested else where.

It's not that I dont see the benefits of being unable to be fucked with for 20 seconds, I'm just saying that you can literally dull the benefits by giving it a high cost. This is how you balance extremes within games instead of reducing them and homogenizing it.

EDIT: It's like the PP Up skills.

Kondibon
Aug 17, 2014, 12:44 AM
My point is that there shouldn't extremes in the first place because that's why we have weakbullet and hunter is the best sub. I:

GHNeko
Aug 17, 2014, 12:50 AM
Fair enough.

I dont think CE is on the level of those 2 and as such should be removed, but at this point we're made both our stances clear and I dont think we're convincing each other any time soon lol.

I do concede and agree that CE is an extreme, but no so much so that can't be balance as is and left in the game.