Now that we've had time to play the classes, which do you consider to be the best?

[Mopop]

Been playing Braver, tried bouncer. Wasn't sure which one was more powerful. Kind of like playing the flavor of the month broken classes. What are the top 3 most powerful classes right now? and why so? links to builds would be awesome too :)

[Rien]

Ironically bouncers and bravers are not the strongest right now.

with the recent boost to hunters, fighters and rangers... they'd be one of the strongest.

[Sizustar]

Strongest at what?
Boss killing, Mob clearing, DPS, or simplest to play?

[wahahaha]

Nippon steel

[Sanguine2009]

ranger by far. force is second

[Xaelouse]

The only broken thing in this game is Weak Bullet. Which is on Ranger. So I guess RA/HU (or RA/BR if you want to be sub-par at clearing mobs but have the fastest boss killing speed in the game).

[Aine]

In no particular order:

RaHu (WB, Boss killing)
FoTe (Mob clearing)
FiBo (Boss killing)

Typical composition for 5-run TD1 is one RaHu, two FiBo, six FoTe, and three of anything else.

[LotusFX]

Top 3 most powerful? Not sure how to answer that but in my opinion...

Not in order too:
- Fo/Br or Fo/Te
- Fi/Br
- Ra/Hu

[Xaelouse]

Honestly if you really want to see what the real best classes are, check back in 2 1/2 weeks.

[wefwq]

I'm still sticking to Br as my main class, Bo are also good in many cases, but both class are not the strongest.

[gigawuts]

Ranger really needs a nerf. Launcher is just too OP! People aren't even getting more than one weak bullets because it's so strong!

edit: wait is it still 2012?

[Miyuki_Kamiko]

well since the post isn't asking for the best but asking which do you consider the best
i say Bow Braver ^_~

[Hobu]

Fi/Hu best class 5 ever. No other class can even come close.

[Mopop]

I guess what I would like to know is what the most broken class is :P

[Selphea]

I guess what I would like to know is what the most broken class is :P

You'll get a better idea by asking Google than asking a forum. Search for these terms:


アークス 2014本戦 or AG本戦 - That's the Arks GP 2014 Qualifier, based on Tower Defense
ナベリウスⅡ - That's the Nabelius 2 Time Attack. Sort by Date for this one and cut off at 2 months. That's when the Ep3 patch hit.


These TAs are a mix of bossing and mobbing so you'll have a good idea of what each combination can do.

Can search NicoNico too but it's more troublesome.

[Sizustar]

I guess what I would like to know is what the most broken class is :P

The hunter that Sakai play as with a custom Gunslash.

[Mopop]

You'll get a better idea by asking Google than asking a forum. Search for these terms:


アークス 2014本戦 or AG本戦 - That's the Arks GP 2014 Qualifier, based on Tower Defense
ナベリウスⅡ - That's the Nabelius 2 Time Attack. Sort by Date for this one and cut off at 2 months. That's when the Ep3 patch hit.


These TAs are a mix of bossing and mobbing so you'll have a good idea of what each combination can do.

Can search NicoNico too but it's more troublesome.


It's all in Japanese :( I wish there were better PSO2 english resources.

[Selphea]

It's all in Japanese :( I wish there were better PSO2 english resources.

Videos transcend language :p

[Mopop]

Videos transcend language :p

There are so many videos! How do I know who is good vs some random lamer streamer :P

I just miss when Braver was the most broke class!

[Selphea]

There are so many videos! How do I know who is good vs some random lamer streamer :P

I just miss when Braver was the most broke class!

If you don't know what a good time is, maybe you should learn more till you do o.o

Besides, most videos post their timings in the title.

[Mopop]

If you don't know what a good time is, maybe you should learn more till you do o.o

Besides, most videos post their timings in the title.

What do you think I'm doing here? Trying to learn about classes, sheesh no need to be rude.

[Selphea]

Never knew learning was a frowned-upon activity that connotes an insult :-?

Oh well good luck, can't help you there.

[Mopop]

Never knew learning was a frowned-upon activity that connotes an insult :-?

Oh well good luck, can't help you there.

When you tell someone you should "learn more" when they are trying to learn more it comes off very condescending.

[Sizustar]

When you tell someone you should "learn more" when they are trying to learn more it comes off very condescending.

The resource and information is all there, watch the video, and choose your favorite, that's all there is to it.

[Syklo]

When you tell someone you should "learn more" when they are trying to learn more it comes off very condescending.
That's your opinion. Ever heard of "prerequisite information"?
Also, you're asking one question in the thread title but another in the topic post, so idk which one you want answered.
The class I like best? Bouncer, because it's a much better hybrid than Techer (and I've been wanting KICKS for a looooooooooooong time since I hated knuckles back when I was a Fi/Te)
The class that *is* the best? Depends on how you use it. I could tell you that Techer is the best class out there and then you go try and learn that it isn't performing as you've hoped. Best advice is to try them all (if you haven't already).

If power is so important that gameplay doesn't matter to you though......then I suggest you go play clickerheroes.

[Edson Drake]

Most of the people always seem to go to the strongest classes in RPGs, this question is asked in every Gamefaqs-like site. "Strongest weapon?", "Strongest class?", "Best Builds?".

Considering that there is a paywall in case you screw up it's okay to seek out what it's best, and this game has a bad case of strongest flavour of the week class on the not-so-distant past. Gunners, Shunka Bravers, then Il Megid/Barta Forces, and lastly the Elysion ones come to mind.

So far the game's been balanced to the point where really, there's no strongest class, so it's best to experiment yourself and just play the one you feel most comfortable with.

[Lostbob117]

To do the most damage?

Ranger - Weakbullet
Force - Namegid
Fighter - Lots of %s

[Kondibon]

Anything that isn't gunner.

[Aquanos]

Br/Hu
Katana Braver

Although I don't think it has the potential to be good in Mining base. (At least TD3)

[SakoHaruo]

I don't know why people act like this is some sort of hidden tech.

The best classes for MPA end game content will forever and always be Force and Ranger. Force because they can hit shit from a distance and kill it. Ranger because weak bullet. Nothing more, nothing less.

The best class for TAs is all of them. The player is the one wearing a limiter.

[Sacrificial]

Ra is my fav and it will only get better. The wb nerf didnt even hit as hard as the fury nerf. ALSO Incoming lazzzoooorrrz PA launcher.

[infiniteeverlasting]

Braver because its the most well rounded, not the best in every aspect, but excels no less in all aspects, enough to make playing it easy as fuq.

[Nitro Vordex]

Give it two weeks, the bandwagon will come back around.

[Hexxy]

Ranger by itself is more versatile and powerful than most combos.

[horseship]

FO and RA are only classes I'd say are OP right now. They've been OP for a long time though.

Katana braver is above average, but I wouldn't say OP. It's only OP in the sense that it's piss easy to play: you get a lot of results for very little effort. Ranger at least has to work for those speedkills.

[Hobu]

Fighter can also clear mobs with Chaos Riser, which is probably the strongest melee AOE ingame. And it also has the Zondeel suction action, so its all good. 50-60k a pop is no joke damage. And with Meteor Cudgel, you can build gear 3 instantly for that OHKO damage. Also Surprise Dunk -> Scissor Edge -> Rumbling Moon/Acro effect (acro can leap chain to Surprise Dunk) for TAJA bonus combo.

Daggers can climb high weakpoints and continue attacking it until the boss is dead. The damage is no joke either.

Knuckles has its merits also. Backhand smash for the crazy 1 hit burst (100k without WB) and chainable to 3 times with proper PP gear. And its TAJA combo Slide Uppercut, Ducking Blow (yes I use this often and the knockup is just enough for DB to hit.), and Flicker Jab/Surprise Knuckle for filler.

And did I forget to mention that all of these can be further enhanced by PP slayer (+200 s-atk when PP is 50% below), Crazy Beat (+200 s-atk when under status ailment), and Halfline/Deadline slayer (I don't max this for heresy), and then proc it all with Limit break (+115% damage and is considered a status ailment).

Fighter is cray-cray. I nearly forgot I was a Braver.

[LonelyGaruga]

It should be incredibly clear that most people are confusing "best" for "favorite" or "one I play", so please disregard most (not all) of the posts here, OP.

Though really, asking for the "best" class is a stupid thing to do. Everything has its own merits and cons. Game's about as balanced as it's ever been so now has to be one of the worst times to ask such a question. And even if there was a concrete answer, if you, personally, suck at the class, it was pointless to ask in the first place. But if that does not deter you, the best you can do is watch videos on Nico and YT. Not ask here.

[STNFCST]

God Tier:

Fo/Te(Best in mobbing and 3nd decent in boss killing and currently use 2 weapon to remove obstacle runs such as TD yet very friendly and effective in other runs as well).
Ra/Br(Boss killer and launcher still broken)

Top tier:

Fi/Bo(No boss can handle bits and if they are boosted it means they are free).

Mid tier:

The rest.

[Dammy]

Ra/Br

[TaigaUC]

The hunter that Sakai play as with a custom Gunslash.

This.

Seriously though, current "best" from my experience:
- Ranger in general has lots of utility, hits hard.
- Fire/Ice casters seem very powerful right now.
- Bow is amazing for obliterating bosses super-quick, if you aim right.
- Partisan in general seems pretty great now.
- Katana still hits really hard, especially when using Sakura Endo.

I tried Te/Hu or Hu/Te briefly. Seems to hit very hard, but the playstyle doesn't feel like my kind of thing.
Bouncer is pretty decent, but I'm totally sick of playing them now.

Other than that, I don't really feel that any class is as OP as before.
It used to be everyone playing Braver, everyone playing Gunner, etc.
Now it's more about which playstyle you enjoy most, which is how it should be.

Playstyle-wise, I personally enjoy Ra/Br and Br/Hu the most.
Been experimenting with Fighter lately, and while I still don't like the feel of the Fighter weapon attacks, they generally seem a lot better than before.
I had to mess around with the skill tree a lot, though.

[Nitro Vordex]

Best is Hu/Bo tank.

[Mopop]

Force has always interested me...hrm any links to a good force build? or is the one on PSO World current?

[Sizustar]

Force has always interested me...hrm any links to a good force build? or is the one on PSO World current?

http://www.pso-world.com/forums/showthread.php?t=221527

[Hobu]

[spoiler-box]http://i.imgur.com/K3DGquQ.png[/spoiler-box]

[gigawuts]

[spoiler-box]http://i.imgur.com/K3DGquQ.png[/spoiler-box]

We all know shit like this is coming for Hunter now that it's in a pretty good state.

Sega has just never known when to stop and I doubt they've learned this past couple months.

[isCasted]

So, this thread is really about personal preferences. I'll try to stay objective and describe classes that have the least annoying moments:

1) Br/Hu - Katana is quick, precise, covers many situations and does decent damage. (I personally hate it, though, because it's very methodical and leaves no room for imagination when it comes to playstyle. Well, it's a beginner class, after all).

2) Fo/Fi - do what you want and things will die. Stance dancing with Force is not nearly as difficult/punshing as people think (what they think of is melee). Benefit? Crazy damage with any techs you want to use without worrying about elemental weaknesses. As for "PP problems":
- enemy spawns in regular quests can die before you even run out of PP;
- Ketos Proi recharges really fast, so you won't miss things like PP Convert.

3) Hu/Fi - keep attacking and things will die. Hunter's weapons have low precision, but they are versatile and do great damage when used right. Stance dancing can be difficult, but usually you can do so much damage that you won't even have to dance.

4) Te/Bo (unless you go solo) - no damage? Whatever, you know that people will thank you.

[Kondibon]

Best is Hu/Bo tank.I think you spelled Te/Hu wrong.
http://i.imgur.com/xqfoVXO.gif

[LonelyGaruga]

4) Te/Bo (unless you go solo) - no damage? Whatever, you know that people will thank you.

Te/Bo is terrible, none of Bouncer's support skills are remotely worthwhile. Te/Hu, Te/Fi, and Te/Br are best. Techer actually has absurd damage output, each wand hit is roughly 400 power backed by high multipliers (Techer by itself gives an 81% boost to wand melee, which is almost equal to full Fury tree, and with much less SP dumped in to get there). With Wand Reactor ensuring wands have the highest S-ATK in the game (4000+ total is quite possible), the speed of the normals, and the lack of a PP cost, the damage racks up fast. The main issue is simply the short range of the melee, which techs cover just fine. /Hu and /Br can even combo with Vol Graptor/Banish Arrow for burst damage.

And of course, Techer's support is still equally viable no matter what subclass, so you have that on top of the melee damage. Te/Bo has nothing going for it.

[Kondibon]

Te/Bo has nothing going for it.Except for FUN! As we all know fun can carry entire MPAs.

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

Well, it's a beginner class, after all


I assume by beginner class, you mean easy to pick up, play, and be effective...

I see people (or maybe just you) constantly give katana Br this flak when Bo PAs though short in number cover everything you would ever need, in less PAs + airtime combat that can more than rival twin daggers.

If you're using blades, dispersion shrike is the right choice at least 60% of the time. 30% of the time is photon blade spam with fever. Bosses that are infected/have perma-exposed weak points die to left click->shift->left click->shift->etc from a range which costs no PP. I didn't even mention they have access to anti, and megiverse. The only thing that's a chore are their conditional multipliers, but if you're willing to invest into multiple blades, or use JBs (and their dispersion shrike equivalent; moment gale) that's not even an issue anymore.

[Hobu]

Because JB use the element of the last casted Tech, Elem Stance is no longer an issue. Blades can now be synergized better with Break Stance.

Bravers aren't a beginner class, nothing is. Although I WOULD recommend beginners to try Bravers as their starter. They don't need to buy multiple weapons, just ONE katana or bow. Bravers are easy to pick up, has good dueling ability vs bosses, and can farm mobs by itself.

[Vetur]

Force will always be a personal favorite of mine, but so far I have been enjoying the dual blade bouncer ever since I learned how to throw the blades for almost-infinite PP.

I really love the dispersion strike PA.

[Arrow]

Braver is definitely easy to get into, primarily because it's really...forgiving. I mean, Just reversal can heal almost any damage you do take and then some most of the time when maxed.
Thus it allows you to pretty much practice timing.
With the melee game, mastering Just Guard/ Counter/ Parry/ etc is pretty much vital for melee classes for turning them into invincible tanks that only die when the player slips up on timing.

And not only does braver help with melee training, it has a decent range game so if you can't seem to grasp the timing and you're in the middle of a run, you can switch over to range and just sit back and snipe from relative safety.

Braver is just a good class to use to get a handle on other aspects of the game.
Is it the best? No. (Says the person that's using it as a main)

At the end of the day... nothing is really the most powerful. It just depends on your playstyle, how you set up skills, and what equipment you have.

Hunter is brute force that laughs in the face of danger
Fighter is a ninja
Force is just nuke-everything
Ranger is just WB-everything
Gunner is a few scenes from the Matrix put into physical form
Techer is the force that decided to be a melee user and use the elements that force didn't have
Braver is the love child of a strange three way with Hunter, Fighter, and Ranger.
Bouncer is a Fighter that decided to use techs.

[Selphea]

The only thing that's a chore are their conditional multipliers, but if you're willing to invest into multiple blades, or use JBs (and their dispersion shrike equivalent; moment gale) that's not even an issue anymore.

That's not even a chore in the first place. Having a rainbow set (sans Wind) is a best practice. Using a weapon with 50% in a matching attribute is a ~20-25% damage gain depending on weapon type - before Elemental Stance. Even a cheapskate 7* +10 at Ex6 with a basic potential like Discerning Eye or a stance buff is going to outdamage an unlocked Bio +11 of the wrong element.

[LonelyGaruga]

The actual gain for matching elements isn't even close to that much. Using Niren Orochi for an example, you get 108-162 more S-ATK (1.2/1.3 weakness). That's not even remotely close to 20%.

Elemental part of melee and ranged weapons goes like this.

Weapon Attack Power * Element % * Enemy Elemental Hitzone

1086 * 0.5 * 1 = 543
1086 * 0.5 * 1.2 = 651
1086 * 0.5 * 1.3 = 705

Not a big difference. Though yeah, Elemental Stance is far better for Dual Blades than Break Stance.

[Selphea]

The actual gain for matching elements isn't even close to that much. Using Niren Orochi for an example, you get 108-162 more S-ATK (1.2/1.3 weakness). That's not even remotely close to 20%.

Elemental part of melee and ranged weapons goes like this.

Weapon Attack Power * Element % * Enemy Elemental Hitzone

1086 * 0.5 * 1 = 543
1086 * 0.5 * 1.2 = 651
1086 * 0.5 * 1.3 = 705

Not a big difference. Though yeah, Elemental Stance is far better for Dual Blades than Break Stance.

Ah it's 20-25% compared to neutral rather than 50% mismatched element.

Still, 108-162 is like having an extra affixed unit or two, and a sizeable gain when when paired with racist latents.

[LonelyGaruga]

Only 1-6*s can be non-elemental right now. Still to be seen whether 13*s are actually non-elemental or that one from the trailer just happened to not have an element. That a weapon can lack an element is completely irrelevant right now.

Because the gain from the elemental part of the damage formula depends on your weapon's ATK stat, it's considerably less when you're using 10-11*s (since no 12* has a species Hunter weapon yet) than 12*s. For example, max crafted Dual Blades get 149 more S-ATK with a 1.3x matching weakness than with mismatched, as opposed to Niren Orochi's 162. Additionally, because the ATK added by element is dependent on the weapon's ATK stat, the lower the weapon's ATK is naturally (like with Twin Daggers or Katana), the less ATK gets added by element. Dual Blades have one of the higher S-ATK stats, using Lavis Blade (Twin Dagger) as an example to compare, the difference is an additional 119 S-ATK with a 1.3x weakness.

Species hunter latents don't benefit more than any other latent would with a matching element, FYI. It's just easiest to match them that way since you're already getting multiples.

[Selphea]

Only 1-6*s can be non-elemental right now. Still to be seen whether 13*s are actually non-elemental or that one from the trailer just happened to not have an element. That a weapon can lack an element is completely irrelevant right now.

Not sure how I got my hands on one of these but I do:

http://i.imgur.com/ECaYwcJ.jpg

But to clarify, I was trying to figure out where that 20-25% I read came from and it turned out it was compared to neutral weapons, not mismatched.


Species hunter latents don't benefit more than any other latent would with a matching element, FYI. It's just easiest to match them that way since you're already getting multiples.

I think that's the point. You wouldn't make a Machine Hunter with Ice, unless it's an Ice-specced Force using Vardha Bit or something.

[LonelyGaruga]

Rare weapons used to be able to drop without an element, but that was a long time ago. Sega realized this was stupid so it was changed so that rare weapons always dropped with an element attached. Pretty sure it was fixed before EP2, so it's been a while.

If the extra attack mattered to you, you'd get rainbow for non-species hunting sets too, as long as it made sense to (no sense getting a full set of elements for a rod with a specific elemental latent, for example). It's just easier for species latents. It's not more effective than setting up a rainbow anything else.

[isCasted]

That item dropped in PSO2es, most probably.

[Rien]

I'm still pissed that twin daggers, which are designed around air combat, is outdone by Jet boots. In air combat.

[Stealthcmc1974]

I'm still pissed that twin daggers, which are designed around air combat, is outdone by Jet boots. In air combat.

Well... you can double jump and chain attacks with Jet Boots. Plus, they're Jet Boots. Keyword "Jet." Isn't the whole point of them being jet boots is that they would be good in the air?

[Selphea]

I'm still pissed that twin daggers, which are designed around air combat, is outdone by Jet boots. In air combat.

Daggers are better at maintaining momentum in the air IMO. They have Facet Folia, Sarabande and Shift to handle things that get thrown your way in the air while maintaining an offense.

On the other hand with Dual Blades or Jet Boots, if something bad gets thrown at you, you lose momentum because everything that has invincible frames (Gran Wave + Shift, PB Escape, Starling Fall) requires you to change position.

[Rien]

Actually Jet Boots has the shift button, but it resets the element so it's also a bad idea. Stationary air photon blades also makes PB escape activate, so it works.

[gigawuts]

I'm still pissed that twin daggers, which are designed around air combat, is outdone by Jet boots. In air combat.

Mostly because of lessons learned with daggers, and suggestions/ideas posited after playing with them (by players, and most likely by the devs themselves).

It was a common suggestion to have a second jump for daggers as their shift action but many players were attached to the parry, and it was also a common suggestion to have the normal attack seek a target by a small amount in the air as well.

I just wish Sega would start retroactively fixing content, instead of applying lessons to new content alone and trying to tweak old content with doubled damage. Sometimes, on a rare occasion, it's great - Gimegid feels superb the way it is right now. Other times...you need to adjust hyper armor frames, iframes, hitstop timing, and in the case of daggers a whole lot more than that.

I still feel daggers should build gear with any attacks at all, and even retain it on the ground (but gradually lose it on the ground like sword gear).

[Maenara]

Twin Daggers should have a skill which makes the shift action teleport you to the current target.

[Hobu]

Twin Daggers should have a skill which makes the shift action teleport you to the current target.

I'd rather not Predicada my way out of the dagger predicament. I'm well content with my air kicking action and stabbity fillers. And shift resets my current PA command back to the first one so I can shift back to Rider Kick anytime.

[Rien]

I'd rather not Predicada my way out of the dagger predicament. I'm well content with my air kicking action and stabbity fillers. And shift resets my current PA command back to the first one so I can shift back to Rider Kick anytime.

I'm pretty sure all weapon shift actions (not JB PA shifts) return your weapon palette to the first PA.

[Gankfest]

Rangers... All Day!

[Selphea]

Actually Jet Boots has the shift button, but it resets the element so it's also a bad idea. Stationary air photon blades also makes PB escape activate, so it works.

Stationary air PB activates PB escape? My timing must be really bad, never got it to work for me although dagger shift was much easier to work with.

The thing about Jet Boots shift though, Strike Geist Shift = you are grounded and have to rejump. Gran Wave Shift = you have to reposition. Moment Gale Shift = you dodge one attack and you can't press Shift again, and it takes ages to be in a position to press Shift a second time.

[Cyron Tanryoku]

math class

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

Stationary air PB activates PB escape? My timing must be really bad, never got it to work for me although dagger shift was much easier to work with.

Last I checked, it does not. Both translations seem to be consistent with that since they both effectively say 'invincibility to movement after photon blade usage'


The thing about Jet Boots shift though, Strike Geist Shift = you are grounded and have to rejump. Gran Wave Shift = you have to reposition. Moment Gale Shift = you dodge one attack and you can't press Shift again, and it takes ages to be in a position to press Shift a second time.

DBs actually have it easier? They only need to not normal attack after photon blade movement, and have PP if they want to move around/climb with distract/heavenly respectively.

[Dycize]

Fun fact about Moment Gale's shift tornado : if you haven't used up your double jump yet, you can double-jump cancel it.

[pkemr4]

there is no best class because sega will nerf it eventually

[gigawuts]

there is no best class because sega will nerf it eventually

There is no living because you will die eventually.


math class

You understand me. <3

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

There is no living because you will die eventually.

[SPOILER-BOX]http://fc09.deviantart.net/fs71/f/2010/339/1/6/people_die_if_they_get_killed_by_raptorj-d34bauk.jpg[/SPOILER-BOX]

[Galax]

I enjoy playing BR/BO, and doing ALL THE LIMIT BREAK EVER

I tend to cycle between Katana Combat, Katana Gear, Rapid Shoot, and Photon Blade Fever on a near-constant loop. KC to build gear, then using KG, then either switch out for PBF and do some Unlimited Blade Works shenanigens or back up for some Rapid Shoot + Penetrating Arrow asskicking.

I consider "strongest" irrelevant, though if I really had to choose, I'd say RA/HU, for Weak Bullet + that last stand type skill; BR/RA for a Bow Braver destruction setup; Or BO/TE to play hard on the boosts present in TE, like the + to your max HP and the like, if possible.

...But I'd still prefer to play whatever I like. Provided I'm not majorly lacking in the damage department, I'm happy.

[Stealthcmc1974]

I enjoy playing BR/BO, and doing ALL THE LIMIT BREAK EVER

I tend to cycle between Katana Combat, Katana Gear, Rapid Shoot, and Photon Blade Fever on a near-constant loop. KC to build gear, then using KG, then either switch out for PBF and do some Unlimited Blade Works shenanigens or back up for some Rapid Shoot + Penetrating Arrow asskicking.

I consider "strongest" irrelevant, though if I really had to choose, I'd say RA/HU, for Weak Bullet + that last stand type skill; BR/RA for a Bow Braver destruction setup; Or BO/TE to play hard on the boosts present in TE, like the + to your max HP and the like, if possible.

...But I'd still prefer to play whatever I like. Provided I'm not majorly lacking in the damage department, I'm happy.

Oh my God, I can't believe I didn't notice till now how PBF is like Unlimited Blade Works. Now I wanna be Archer lol.

As for me, I also chain together all the skills in a BR/BO combo but I also use Rapid JA Boost for the Jet Boots. Considering I can craft whatever I want and still reach the 90-100% damage variance with the updates to how crafts work, I'm a happy guy.

(I only ever plan on playing BR/BO on my main character anyway :P)

[Z-0]

Not read the thread, but:

The best class, by far, is FoTe.

While Ranger and Bouncer can fill in situational niches (boss killing, mainly), nothing can currently match what FoTe is able to do, and the performance of FoTe is not really about power at this point, it's about what it can actually do (although it's definitely true that Force has some incredible power behind it too).

The addition of Jet Boots only furthered its brokenness from pre-Episode 3, as well, since Jet Boots make you think on another dimension with the double jump and float mechanic, allowing you to cut considerable corners on certain map layouts with Ilzonde (since it doesn't make you drop). It's something else when just simply moving about is better as a class, too, and not just speed-wise.

It is just a shame that Jet Boots' full potential can't really be used with how the game is setup, because what they can do is really fucking cool.

[sol_trigger]

FO is the best because no other classes can do 500k dmg easily like them FO lol
saw someone 3hits uncharged KO quartz SH which is crazy as fk

[Selphea]

Last I checked, it does not. Both translations seem to be consistent with that since they both effectively say 'invincibility to movement after photon blade usage'

DBs actually have it easier? They only need to not normal attack after photon blade movement, and have PP if they want to move around/climb with distract/heavenly respectively.

With daggers, if a boss attacks, either a) You are doing FF/Sarabande and don't need to stop attacking or b) You press Shift, dodge for a moment and go right back to attacking the boss. If the boss moves, press Shift, gap close, done.

With dual blades, if a boss attacks, you press direction + Shift because the only PA with iframes is Starling Fall which drops you to the ground, and then you have to gap close again. If the boss moves, press direction + Shift, then gap close again because direction + Shift is so imprecise, done as well, but you took a detour.

Don't get me wrong DBs are strong and PBF is higher DPS if something isn't moving or attacking, but Daggers are better at maintaining momentum in the air.

[Syklo]

Actually Jet Boots has the shift button, but it resets the element so it's also a bad idea. Stationary air photon blades also makes PB escape activate, so it works.

That's only the default shift action, when you're not in the continued PA / Normal attack states. That, and I actually like the element reset (do it everytime you cast a charged tech if you go for element burst <3).
What I don't like is that if I want to use its iFrames, I have to deal with the delay that is going through the variant actions (2nd part of PAs / the spinning attack) first, and often I can't step-cancel out the moves in the first place.
My only other option is incorporating the double jump (which is still an attack if you have enough gear charged up), but that's if I haven't double jumped already...

Then again, I'd really like to know if the spinning attack already has iFrames of its own...


Stationary air PB activates PB escape? My timing must be really bad, never got it to work for me although dagger shift was much easier to work with.

The thing about Jet Boots shift though, Strike Geist Shift = you are grounded and have to rejump. Gran Wave Shift = you have to reposition. Moment Gale Shift = you dodge one attack and you can't press Shift again, and it takes ages to be in a position to press Shift a second time.

Yeah, stationary air PB activates PB escape (and I think ground as well, but idk).
I wouldn't consider strike geist shift a problem; if anything, it adds to the vertical dynamic combat :) If only gran wave could actually aim towards the crosshair in TPS mode...like raging waltz does for daggers.
Also with gran wave shift, repositioning isn't a problem, because when you lock-on, you automatically shift towards your target with each normal attack. One attack is often enough after gran wave, and you still have the spinning attack to maintain airtime if needed.
Moment gale shift - who said you had to wait? Jump cancel, step cancel, w/e works.

Finally, shift is optional for a reason.
(Though I will ask, why would you use strike gust while already in airbourne combat outside of diving into the ground??? Uncharged strike gust isn't even worth using, and charging it forces you to fall anyway...)

[Selphea]

Yeah, stationary air PB activates PB escape (and I think ground as well, but idk).

I see two yes and one no, looks like I have to test again after patch.


I wouldn't consider strike geist shift a problem; if anything, it adds to the vertical dynamic combat :) If only gran wave could actually aim towards the crosshair in TPS mode...like raging waltz does for daggers.
Also with gran wave shift, repositioning isn't a problem, because when you lock-on, you automatically shift towards your target with each normal attack. One attack is often enough after gran wave, and you still have the spinning attack to maintain airtime if needed.
Moment gale shift - who said you had to wait? Jump cancel, step cancel, w/e works.

Finally, shift is optional for a reason.

(Though I will ask, why would you use strike gust while already in airbourne combat outside of diving into the ground??? Uncharged strike gust isn't even worth using, and charging it forces you to fall anyway...)

I was citing why I didn't like Jet Boots for air combat and you kind of echoed my points in the first part of your post:


What I don't like is that if I want to use its iFrames, I have to deal with the delay that is going through the variant actions (2nd part of PAs / the spinning attack) first, and often I can't step-cancel out the moves in the first place.
My only other option is incorporating the double jump (which is still an attack if you have enough gear charged up), but that's if I haven't double jumped already...

They are not unsolvable but you need to work around them, i.e. lose momentum.

[sol_trigger]

With daggers, if a boss attacks, either a) You are doing FF/Sarabande and don't need to stop attacking or b) You press Shift, dodge for a moment and go right back to attacking the boss. If the boss moves, press Shift, gap close, done.

With dual blades, if a boss attacks, you press direction + Shift because the only PA with iframes is Starling Fall which drops you to the ground, and then you have to gap close again. If the boss moves, press direction + Shift, then gap close again because direction + Shift is so imprecise, done as well, but you took a detour.

Don't get me wrong DBs are strong and PBF is higher DPS if something isn't moving or attacking, but Daggers are better at maintaining momentum in the air.


the DB PA which flying with swords also have iframe

[Selphea]

the DB PA which flying with swords also have iframe

Ah yea forgot about that. I always think of it as a followup to PB Escape

[sol_trigger]

i tried maxing out PB escape and tested on bosses, totally worth it, very useful

[LonelyGaruga]

I see two yes and one no, looks like I have to test again after patch.

JPN wikis say PBE only works if you move with the shift. Anything saying otherwise is inaccurate.

[KatsuraJun]

Yeah, stationary air PB activates PB escape (and I think ground as well, but idk).

I don't know about air, but ground *definitely* does not have iframes.

Too many times I've forgotten that I'm not playing Gunner and I press shift with no direction on the ground and eat an attack to the face.

[sol_trigger]

JPN wikis say PBE only works if you move with the shift. Anything saying otherwise is inaccurate.


yes, exactly.

[Syklo]

I see two yes and one no, looks like I have to test again after patch.



I was citing why I didn't like Jet Boots for air combat and you kind of echoed my points in the first part of your post:



They are not unsolvable but you need to work around them, i.e. lose momentum.
I wasn't claiming otherwise - daggers are indeed better for aerial combat (in my opinion, anyway), I was just trying to make the point that those "problems with positioning" aren't as big of an issue as you make them seem to be.

Although, I guess I like losing momentum, technically speaking, because I prefer agility, and jetboots do just that :)

As to the claim about idle PBE having iFrames, I cannot verify with 100% confidence, but it occurred onetime when I was untouched by GG's (Shironia boss) 360° attack during idle aerial PBE. And my PBE was only level 1.
Soo i dunno what happened.

[Tenlade]

Ranger really needs a nerf. Launcher is just too OP! People aren't even getting more than one weak bullets because it's so strong!

edit: wait is it still 2012?

No its 2002, I locked down every mob on the way to the boss with a frozen shooter and a spread needle, and my launcher is murdeirng de rol le. Meanwhile the force ran out of money for trifluids and stopped casting, and the hunter is just plinking away with a handgun.

ranger forever the OP class.

(but seriously with gravity bomb+launcher for mobs, and rifle+weak bullet for bosses, what more do you need?)

[Flaoc]

No its 2002, I locked down every mob on the way to the boss with a frozen shooter and a spread needle, and my launcher is murdeirng de rol le. Meanwhile the force ran out of money for trifluids and stopped casting, and the hunter is just plinking away with a handgun.

ranger forever the OP class.

(but seriously with gravity bomb+launcher for mobs, and rifle+weak bullet for bosses, what more do you need?)

dont forget ranger eventually got the heaven striker and can use the excalibur.. ranger forever OP

[Selphea]

(but seriously with gravity bomb+launcher for mobs, and rifle+weak bullet for bosses, what more do you need?)

Katana Combat Finish with First Hit and Banish-Nemesis :wacko:. My mind was blown when I saw Kee-Roc's RaBr Nab2 using KCF.

[spoiler-box]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AnouZxxJN8E"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AnouZxxJN8E[/spoiler-box]

[sol_trigger]

500k+ dmg, so OP

i wish melee classes can be OP like this...

[Fusionxglave]

wow I have definitely wasted my ranger skills I did not know I could do that with a Ranger class.

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

500k+ dmg, so OP

i wish melee classes can be OP like this...

We don't compare classes to Ra for good reason.


wow I have definitely wasted my ranger skills I did not know I could do that with a Ranger class.

WB:

http://i.ytimg.com/vi/f_SwD7RveNE/hqdefault.jpg

[STNFCST]

No its 2002, I locked down every mob on the way to the boss with a frozen shooter and a spread needle, and my launcher is murdeirng de rol le. Meanwhile the force ran out of money for trifluids and stopped casting, and the hunter is just plinking away with a handgun.

ranger forever the OP class.

(but seriously with gravity bomb+launcher for mobs, and rifle+weak bullet for bosses, what more do you need?)

RA continue OP in Episode 4. I solo Realm of War pre-nerf with RAcast using only Frozen Queen, Spread Needle, Excalibur and Guld Milla and bunch of traps.

And a RAmar being level 99 can solo West Tower all you need is good amount of ATA. Then it is steamroll time.

Last Gu/Ra going OP in ultimate no mob can touch pro air gunner with PK/SS. And bosses being farmed by merely one chain trigger 3 sec spam or a WB toss.

[Searaphim]

Why is nobody talking about WB + Chain? Especially since chains have been buffed. No one is interested in 999k damage?

[Rien]

Why is nobody talking about WB + Chain? Especially since chains have been buffed. No one is interested in 999k damage?

you can't 999k with TMG PAs, which is probably half the reason why.

[STNFCST]

Why is nobody talking about WB + Chain? Especially since chains have been buffed. No one is interested in 999k damage?

This is probably why, cause boss already got wiped out or gaining broked part before you can initial such setup.

[spoiler-box]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MvQqQEeE1o8&list=UU_4vc0OpLKOcm8yg801RWqg[/spoiler-box]

[Searaphim]

you can't 999k with TMG PAs, which is probably half the reason why.

No but you can 999k with Assault Rifle PAs, Ra/Gu, WB + Chain = 999k. You can also set and increase the chain with an assault rifle if you didn't know. (Most people seem to think Gunners don't have access to assault rifles)


This is probably why, cause boss already got wiped out or gaining broked part before you can initial such setup.


If you have 4 WBs in your gun that is not a problem. You break the part first, put another WB and chain it. (I've tried it)

[Ordy]

No but you can 999k with Assault Rifle PAs, Ra/Gu, WB + Chain = 999k. You can also set and increase the chain with an assault rifle if you didn't know. (Most people seem to think Gunners don't have access to assault rifles)


No, you can't reach a 999,999 hit with a Rifle PA. Why would you need to build chain when a sat cannon can reach 1m-1.5m damage?

+999,999 = ilbarta, banish, KCF and maybe Meteor Fist.

[Searaphim]

No, you can't reach a 999,999 hit with a Rifle PA. Why would you need to build chain when a sat cannon can reach 1m-1.5m damage?

+999,999 = ilbarta, banish, KCF and maybe Meteor Fist.

As far as I know Satellite Cannon IS a rifle PA..................

Also if you need a proof that Gu/Ra or Ra/Gu can reach 999k I can get you one....

To me it's like you're just denying cause you've never seen it nor have you tried it.

As to your why would you need to build chain when sat cannon can reach 1m-1.5m it's quite simple, What if every hit sat cannon does reach 999k? That sounds like an insta-kill for most things.

[Galax]

Why do you need to hit 999,999 or 1.5m anyway?

[Ordy]

As far as I know Satellite Cannon IS a rifle PA..................

Also if you need a proof that Gu/Ra or Ra/Gu can reach 999k I can get you one....

To me it's like you're just denying cause you've never seen it nor have you tried it.

As to your why would you need to build chain when sat cannon can reach 1m-1.5m it's quite simple, What if every hit sat cannon does reach 999k? That sounds like an insta-kill for most things.

Thanks, I know what Sat Cannon is >_>

What I meant is obviously 999,999 hits, screen numbers, not total PA damage.
I'd like to correct myself. RA PA hitting for 999,999 doesn't sound realistic, even tho mathematically, someone could reach a 999,999 damage on a rodos with a good chain, SS and ZRA.

"That sounds like an insta-kill for most things"

Sat Cannon is already an insta-kill for most things with a RaHu, so is Banish-LN as a RaBr. Loading a chain would be a waste of time.

FYI: My WB+sat cannon one shots: RB, Rodos, Gwan, Wolga, QD, Ringahda, Cata, Meduna, Rheo, Anjha, Malmoth ... euh maybe more too, or 2 hits to break parts or stun them.

[RadiantLegend]

Katana Combat Finish with First Hit and Banish-Nemesis :wacko:. My mind was blown when I saw Kee-Roc's RaBr Nab2 using KCF.

[spoiler-box]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AnouZxxJN8E[/spoiler-box]

SC killing after the first wave? Aimed on top of the hill? How is that even..

[Evangelion X.XX]

Apparently the mobs spawned from the middle of the area (same thing with 1st area of vorpar taco).

[Searaphim]

Why do you need to hit 999,999 or 1.5m anyway?

Falz Luther ? Perhaps it will also be useful for Ultimate Quests.

My point was only that Rangers along with chain can get some of the highest damage outputs in the game. It's not very quick though.

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

SC killing after the first wave? Aimed on top of the hill? How is that even..

-Good ping.

-All mobs technically spawn in the center of that room (on that hill) before they appear where they are to a player's eyes.

-Minimum amount of time is required to pass before all spawns after the first wave show up.

-Sat cannon, ilfoie, and many other PAs/techs have lingering hitboxes. As long as the damage zone lasts longer than an instant, it'll hit the next poor bastards that spawn in.

All of that put together=all mobs after first wave dying to one attack.

[infiniteeverlasting]

Katana Combat Finish with First Hit and Banish-Nemesis :wacko:. My mind was blown when I saw Kee-Roc's RaBr Nab2 using KCF.

[spoiler-box]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AnouZxxJN8E[/spoiler-box]

wtf? i cant even understand what happened... how did he kill all those gorangos at once?

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

wtf? i cant even understand what happened... how did he kill all those gorangos at once?

See above.

Er, rather my previous post.

[Rien]

Why do you need to hit 999,999 or 1.5m anyway?

Bosses simply have that much health.

[Galax]

Bosses simply have that much health.

...And you would go for a single hit of that much damage when, against a boss? It seems to me that such a setup is incredibly reliant on near-perfect timing, since you have to chain, then make sure the chain doesn't dissipate while you let off your attack, and if that attack is Sat Cannon...Well, you need someone there with you, pegging more shots in.

It seems a much better idea to play on powerful hits that don't need as much timing as using Chain Trigger sometimes does. Or Aim, for that matter. And there's the whole "if you slip at all the entire combo can fall to pieces before you get back up from being hit" issue present with using Chain Trigger & getting high chains....

...Yeah, I'll stick with "more than one attack", thanks. The only time I see that being viable is for quick attacks to begin with, and I see very little point in the setup of that.

[Ordy]

I kinda agree with Galax, tried that myself yesterday, it's seriously not viable and just for the show.

The thing is ... a RA is like .. nonexistent outside of CT+ZRA+PK. And I don't think Ult bosses will let people gently build CT while someone is standing there charging a sat cannon. One stun and it's all over.

RaHu with multi 1m damage Sat Cannon > RaGu for a "potential" 6m damage Sat Cannon and then nothing.

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

The thing is ... a RA is like .. nonexistent outside of CT+ZRA+PK.

You mean Gu.

[Selphea]

If only One More Time was actually One More Chain :p

[Ordy]

You mean Gu.

We were actually talking about a RaGu build revolving around a max CT Sat Cannon to deal damage on bosses, using Gu as a sub for the skill tree.

[Keilyn]

I actually love Fighter/Techer and what Im getting out of it.

Since its a thread about individual classes....

I think fighter has the best designed tree out there. It is a tree that in its entirety is possible to have triggered simultaneously. Every point that you put into that class, even when a player runs out and wishes for more actually can benefit end-damage.

The only thing that splits that tree are the two stances which if one could completely have the entire tree capped, would be changed on a whim.

Notice that I am not talking about Class Combinations, or pure damage skills, or orientation. The tree itself and its designed is what my focus is. The whole tree really works well...

If we look at Techer tree, we have the tree split into Four Parts....Support, Light, Dark, Wind, and even maximized one can not make it all work in one map since a map does not have all the elements there. The same is true with force, a player reaches a point where they specialize in one of three areas, and to break things you get a skill to reduce fire charge time by 50%....allowing for much better rate of fire on Fire Techs throwing in tons of damage...

If I look at Hunter, we have two opposites attracting....and getting in the way of each other.

I guess my response is a wish and desire that other trees could be as versatile and have synergy like fighter has.

[LonelyGaruga]

If we look at Techer tree, we have the tree split into Four Parts....Support, Light, Dark, Wind, and even maximized one can not make it all work in one map since a map does not have all the elements there.

Have you looked at the skill trees since EP3? Techer tree isn't like this at all anymore.

[Z-0]

Yeah, none of the tech trees are exactly "you do this with it or else" anymore. You can easily spec into all 3 elements on the FO tree now, for example. Specialization shouldn't feel required anymore unless you are trying to go for the best damages ever.

And since we're talking about Kee-Roc's 2:55 RaBr Nab2 video:

Bob's 4:23 FoBr Nab1: http://nicotter.net/watch/sm24814400
Bob's 2:37 FoBr Nab2: http://nicotter.net/watch/sm24560089
Qualy's 4:59 FoTe Lilipa: http://nicotter.net/watch/sm24560990
Rekka's 4:28 FoTe Sanctum: http://nicotter.net/watch/sm24771759 (Qualy has done 4:08 or something as RaBr, but there's no video)
Bob's 5:18 FoTe Wopal: http://nicotter.net/watch/sm24530488

There's really no comparison in PSO2 at the moment to just how versatile Force is right now. These videos reflect into the "main game" too. I'm not saying other things aren't broken and don't need nerfing, but Force easily has the highest DPS of all classes, and any situation can be dealt with accordingly, whereas a RA sort of loses it if you mess up. It's not the end of the world, no, but any RA main knows what I mean. A slight error means that you take 10 times more time, rather than just attack once more with the same thing. Yes, this is an exaggeration.

[Searaphim]

It seems to me that such a setup is incredibly reliant on near-perfect timing, since you have to chain, then make sure the chain doesn't dissipate while you let off your attack, and if that attack is Sat Cannon...Well, you need someone there with you, pegging more shots in.

Actually chain lasts longer then you might think, you do have enough time to charge a full Satellite Cannon. But you're right about timing, it has to be near-perfect and if you fail the penalty is much bigger.

But to me a ranger(support type) is supposed to rely on a group and deal some occasional retardedly heavy damage from a distance. Like an air-strike or something. So far I really like Ra/Gu played that way. It's much harder to play alone though.

[Achelousaurus]

-All mobs technically spawn in the center of that room (on that hill) before they appear where they are to a player's eyes.
Sega programming at its finest.