Is gun-turret/chair damage fake? (New EQ & Elsewhere)

[AzureBlaze]

Nearly saw 2 guys get into a fist-fight over this the other day...
While watching them scream curses into the public chat on a packed EQ was funny, it brought up something I sorta-noticed. What's a rumor/BS & what's the real story on all turrets?

On the new EQ at ocean vs Bal Rodos:
There frequently appear standing turret things that shoot a 'beam' at enemies. Of course, I jump on one to see what it will do. Pointing it at a mob of normal enemies it seems to kill them in a usual way. Shooting it at Bal Rodos seems to do about 4240 damage per firing. SEEMS.

Guy A: The turret make Bal fall down so always shoot him with the turret
Guy B: The turret is fake, the damage number you see is a sham, it does nothing/always ignore it
Woman C: The turret damage is only fake on XH, all other diffs. it actually does damage

But then, the machinegun style turrets, based on how fast something like a Goldrada...say, dies how many "899" or whatever has to come out of him before he dies by a turret, vs how many 2k hits of whatever the FO is using? The turret DPS looks really high! Tons of numbers! But then, why does it seem faster when people kill the monster in a normal way?

Why make a fake gizmo that does no damage? Seems like a stupid mechanic.
It's not even if it does/doesn't make him fall, a melee character on a turret can do XXXX damage while the Bal is reared up/out of range to that character......which is better than nothing? It's not like you have to run 32958 miles to reach the boss when it DOES fall. Why get THAT MAD?

What is turret damage based off of, your ATK, or are they independent of people?
Are the numbers they do really fluff, and the actual damage is way lower? (If so, what's the point of writing out fake damg numbers?)
Are they a red-herring on SH & EXH meant to make players waste their time so others die?
DO they make bal rodos fall on any difficulty level in the new EQ? (I honestly couldn't tell him falling more or less depending on turret use)

Just aiming to get rid of /clear up any turret rumors because with Red Hot Valentine out (it spawns loads of turrets) the rumors & freakouts I watch take place are increasing.

[Z-0]

Turrets are independent of people and do the displayed damage, it's just that players' damage is far better than every cannon. The Photon Cannon is alright, but it's still pretty restrictive and not worth farming for in TDs that aren't 3.

[Vatallus]

On that note the cannons in Ocean EQ and Facility do make Bal Rodos fall over if you hit him in the jaw enough times.

[TheszNuts]

He's talking about the cannons used on Rodos, yes they're the only way to stun the rodos into falling down. Yes, the damage sucks on them, but thats not the point of those cannons.

[final_attack]

As for machine gun turret .....

Normally, players damage is much more superior than machine gun turret, but sometimes, it's better to spawn that machine gun turret on TD. Well, because .... you know, PUGs can have under-geared characters. And that turret can help them.

I did it once with random JP party in TD2 before ..... after someone said in he's under-geared. We spawned those turret whenever the older ones depleted, and it does help. Under-geared character can help tagging the mobs too with those turret (other people killed the mobs) or help kill the mobs when someone else draws the aggro.

Well, usually under-geared characters can help collecting crystals, but someone else in mpa seems really want to go collecting crystals, so .... ^^;

[Vatallus]

Should also note Bal Rodos' true weakpoint is his lower jaw. Stunning him with the cannons will expose it and make it very easy to hit.

[wefwq]

Water canon on facility are used to stun bal rodos, if you shot him in the mouth.
Turret damage are always shit regardless of difficulty level.

[TaigaUC]

Seems to be a common occurrence for EN people to publically argue about stuff as if it's fact, without anyone actually knowing anything about what they're talking about.

Guy A: My random assumption is true!
Guy B: You're wrong, my random assumption is truer!
Woman C: You're both wrong, my even more random assumption is the truest yet!

[Maenara]

Er, not really. It's pretty rare to see any chat going on during an EQ with randoms.

[Dnd]

Turret damage are always shit regardless of difficulty level.

Turrets in normal mode tower defenses are actually pretty overpowered
>_>
<_<

[Vatallus]

Seems to be a common occurrence for EN people to publically argue about stuff as if it's fact, without anyone actually knowing anything about what they're talking about.

Guy A: My random assumption is true!
Guy B: You're wrong, my random assumption is truer!
Woman C: You're both wrong, my even more random assumption is the truest yet!

Can't say I've seen anything like that when I've ran EQs, but noted.

[Maenara]

Take what TaigaUC says with a grain of salt, they're actually pretty racist.

[LonelyGaruga]

I've run into abysmally stupid EN players, so I find it completely believable. Paraphrasing one conversation...

Me: "Vol Graptor isn't affected by weak points or Weak Bullet"
Person: "Did you do any testing?"
Me: "No, but the Japanese did and posted their results on swiki"
Person: "You can't trust the internet! People can post anything there!"
Me: "They can't post stuff if it isn't tested"
Person: "There are infinite conditions to test under! Like terrain!"
Me: "Terrain cannot, under any circumstance, affect whether Vol Graptor applies weak points or not."
Person: "You can't know that!"

Ship 2 quality.

[Walkure]

Could've just told him to shoot Rockbear in the face with Volg Raptor and see if the resulting damage does twice what you'd normally expect.

It's not like Volg Raptor has ANY variation on expected damage; it has like three multipliers that can apply (JA, Charged, Critical Strike) and otherwise just deals exactly the sum of the damage built up.

[Z-0]

Wait, do Charges (eg: Weak Stance Charge) affect Banish / Vol Graptor or was I lied to?

[Walkure]

There's a 1.2x multiplier for charging Volg Raptor.

I don't see it mentioned in either swiki or pso2.net that Braver Stance Charge skills affect the shot directly, so I would assume that it doesn't. I'd go and test it, but I'm too busy playing MH4U.

[LonelyGaruga]

Could've just told him to shoot Rockbear in the face with Volg Raptor and see if the resulting damage does twice what you'd normally expect.

It's not like Volg Raptor has ANY variation on expected damage; it has like three multipliers that can apply (JA, Charged, Critical Strike) and otherwise just deals exactly the sum of the damage built up.

I told them later in the conversation that I have used Vol Graptor (which wasn't a lie, I did it while leveling Hunter for Te/Hu) and saw that it wasn't affected by weak points, but they stood by the whole "not enough testing" thing. Some people that overheard the conversation even jumped in to say that Vol Graptor doesn't apply weak points, but that wasn't good enough.

The same person, before we got on the topic of Vol Graptor, said that affixing more than 2s would actually make them worse players, because the lower damage forces them to be more skillful than players with better equipment, and actually dissed me for being able to flinch lock bosses, saying it means I couldn't beat the boss "fairly". I don't understand it, but it seems to me that some people are just more comfortable being mediocre players and not understanding how the game works. I kinda doubt they would even bother testing stuff for themselves because they don't want to understand how the game works.


Wait, do Charges (eg: Weak Stance Charge) affect Banish / Vol Graptor or was I lied to?

Lied to.

[Vatallus]

I told them later in the conversation that I have used Vol Graptor (which wasn't a lie, I did it while leveling Hunter for Te/Hu) and saw that it wasn't affected by weak points, but they stood by the whole "not enough testing" thing. Some people that overheard the conversation even jumped in to say that Vol Graptor doesn't apply weak points, but that wasn't good enough.

The same person, before we got on the topic of Vol Graptor, said that affixing more than 2s would actually make them worse players, because the lower damage forces them to be more skillful than players with better equipment, and actually dissed me for being able to flinch lock bosses, saying it means I couldn't beat the boss "fairly". I don't understand it, but it seems to me that some people are just more comfortable being mediocre players and not understanding how the game works. I kinda doubt they would even bother testing stuff for themselves because they don't want to understand how the game works.



Lied to.

Some people are just straight up trolls. I've ran across a handful of english players (all friends irl) that would refuse to do anything in an MPA if they deemed the MPA "sucked". The whole kicker was that they weren't good players either. Even Ship 9 has some problems with a few english players.

Though that doesn't say we dont have problems with JP players either since its mostly a JP ship.

[Dephinix]

Turrets in normal mode tower defenses are actually pretty overpowered
>_>
<_<

My lvl 4 Hunter no sub was dealing more(can't hit more than one enemy with a turret, I believe) and placed first. AIS is terribad on normal.

[schnee4]

As for machine gun turret .....

Normally, players damage is much more superior than machine gun turret, but sometimes, it's better to spawn that machine gun turret on TD. Well, because .... you know, PUGs can have under-geared characters. And that turret can help them.

I did it once with random JP party in TD2 before ..... after someone said in he's under-geared. We spawned those turret whenever the older ones depleted, and it does help. Under-geared character can help tagging the mobs too with those turret (other people killed the mobs) or help kill the mobs when someone else draws the aggro.

Well, usually under-geared characters can help collecting crystals, but someone else in mpa seems really want to go collecting crystals, so .... ^^;

yess yess all foreigner please read!
very good information!! ;-)

[Kondibon]

Just some notes from my own personal experience.

Yes the turrets deal actual damage.
Yes they're used to knock bal down, in order to do so you have to shoot him in his open mouth specifically.
Turret damage is based off difficulty as far as I know, I'm not sure if stats or skills effect it at all, but it doesn't seem like it.


The best way I've found to use the water turrets in facility is to have one, MAYBE two people on or around the turrets, preferably with ranged weapons/techs so they can hop off and fight when his mouth is closed. It takes about 4 or 5 hits in his mouth to knock him down when I'm solo, but I'm not sure if the number of nearby players affects that or not.

EDIT: To clarify, it's blatantly obvious you can deal damage because the turrets can break bal's parts. I regularly end up breaking its nose horn trying to hit its mouth.

[Macman]

I recall it taking 3 direct hits when I'm solo. It only counts if you hit him when his mouth is open from roaring or attacking.
I'm pretty sure but not positive that player count affects it.

[Kondibon]

I recall it taking 3 direct hits when I'm solo. It only counts if you hit him when his mouth is open from roaring or attacking.
I'm pretty sure but not positive that player count affects it.?I have a hard time being able to tell because sometimes his mouth is opened but doesn't count as being hit, and sometimes his bubble projectiles get in the way.

[Macman]

Well it can be difficult to tell since everything's moving around and the water turrets don't fire the speediest projectiles.
I speak from this because I've unloaded 3 round bursts real fast, overheating the turret, but had each shot hit and it downed him quickly right after he recovered from his last down.