Categorize the 13★

[Mildora]

Simple thread I guess...People still seem confused at why this or that isn't that so great to go for far as 13★. Big Argument with some friends about this and I'd love to hear the lovely community thee PSO-Worldens have to say about it.

Just so you don't leave any weapons out heres the list.
http://puu.sh/hVAaB/9a8fbf1290.png


ARES
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-
-
-
-
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-
-
-
-
-
-
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SLAVE
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
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I hope this doesn't go to shit.

[Superia]

Ideal?

[Mildora]

Ideal?

edit

I only list these 2 because I got shit for running Naberius and not Lillipa.

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

edit

I only list these 2 because I got shit for running Naberius and not Lillipa.

wa...? Ideal is from CM... what are you saying?

[Xaeris]

I'm not sure I understand the thread, honestly.

[Bellion]

Slave
Rainbow Wands
Debatable: DBs

Ares
Everything else

We're not factoring Ideal, so oh well.

[Mildora]

wa...? Ideal is from CM... what are you saying?

Just like my Corrupted Survey thread I asked which people prefer. This time around I'd like to know why people pick this slave over that Ares vise versa.

I Didn't really list Ideals for the simple fact that its better than both Ares and Slave when its doing the proper job. or is there more to ideals i don't know about?

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

Just like my Corrupted Survey thread I asked which people prefer. This time around I'd like to know why people pick this slave over that Ares vise versa.

I Didn't really list Ideals for the simple fact that its better than both Ares and Slave when its doing the proper job. or is there more to ideals i don't know about?

Oh. Well bellion gave you the answer.


Slave
Rainbow Wands
Debatable: DBs

Ares
Everything else

We're not factoring Ideal, so oh well.

[Mildora]

thanks bellion and man in blue.

I had more questions but I think I answered them myself. I really just needed a 3rd mans opinion, the whole deal was "Ares are good but when it comes to bossing and you don't have ideals slaves are better"

[Bellion]

As soon as you use a PA that sets you below 50%, slaves are going to be outclassed by ares, period. You have 90/150PP and you use another PA that puts you at 74PP, there goes your extra 300 attack.

Wands and DBs are the only ones worth considering for slavery because of how they can regenerate their PP. Any other weapon has ways of dumping PP ridiculously fast and not regenerate well. DBs with PB Fever is generally only used on high HP single targets, not exactly that great for mobbing but it can actually work out fine for it. Except, everyone just seems to continuously spam Disperse for mobbing and gets rid of their PP asap.

A ranking between all 3 types based on how they are in terms of bossing, mobbing, and their PP regeneration:
Ideal
Rifle, Bow, DBs(bossing), Wired Lance, Partizan(bossing), Twin Daggers, Knuckles, TMGs

Ares
Launcher, Katana, Sword, Partizan(mobbing), Double Saber, DBs(mobbing), Boots, Rod, Talis, Gunslash

Slave
Wands

[Rayden]

Personally, I would always take the Ares wand over the Slave wand. It's a percentage damage bonus instead of a static stat bonus, it applies to Zanverse, and I believe it's stronger with a full PB if you have high stats. Even Techers can run low on PP, in situations where they have to spam a lot of techs, and then the Slave's bonus disappears. On the other hand, it's easy to fill the PB gauge fully after clearing just one room, so the Ares bonus should be easy to maintain.

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

Personally, I would always take the Ares wand over the Slave wand. It's a percentage damage bonus instead of a static stat bonus, it applies to Zanverse, and I believe it's stronger with a full PB if you have high stats. Even Techers can run low on PP, in situations where they have to spam a lot of techs, and then the Slave's bonus disappears. On the other hand, it's easy to fill the PB gauge fully after clearing just one room, so the Ares bonus should be easy to maintain.

I don't think ares potential applies to zanverse...

Anyway, it's not so much that you should use slave wand if you had to use a 13*. I still stand by using ideal karen because ketos proi->hatou spam is my thing, and doing it would cost me even more damage against a boss when I most need it if I used ares katana instead. The list is just a measure of how much mileage you can get from the potential. Unsurprisingly, most weapon types can't sustain their PP without intentionally doing something less than optimal by limiting output. Wands and DBs are the largest exceptions to this rule.

[Flaoc]

I don't think ares potential applies to zanverse...

Anyway, it's not so much that you should use slave wand if you had to use a 13*. I still stand by using ideal karen because ketos proi->hatou spam is my thing, and doing it would cost me even more damage against a boss when I most need it if I used ares katana instead. The list is just a measure of how much mileage you can get from the potential. Unsurprisingly, most weapon types can't sustain their PP without intentionally doing something less than optimal by limiting output. Wands and DBs are the largest exceptions to this rule.

what about the part where ares katana is anga only and no trade in option and anga is a complete douche when it comes to drops so most likely you are not getting what u wanted

[Bellion]

Ares does apply to Zanverse, fair points.
For Slave Wand my greatest consideration is in wand smashing+zondeel. If you use techs a lot with wands as a TE main, by all means go for Ares instead.

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

what about the part where ares katana is anga only and no trade in option and anga is a complete douche when it comes to drops so most likely you are not getting what u wanted

Not brought up as a factor in this discussion. If this thread was about that, then yeah, that's a given.


Ares does apply to Zanverse, fair points.

Oh


For Slave Wand my greatest consideration is in wand smashing+zondeel. If you use techs a lot with wands as a TE main, by all means go for Ares instead.

Pmuch.

[FacelessRed]

Ares does apply to Zanverse, fair points.
For Slave Wand my greatest consideration is in wand smashing+zondeel. If you use techs a lot with wands as a TE main, by all means go for Ares instead.

Am I missing something here? What has Zanverse got that makes it worth using? (Serious question) I haven't used it in over a year now... what's changed?

[Xaeris]

Zanverse deals a portion of the damage that any player standing within the field, including the caster themselves, is dealing while it is active. Used on top of a concentration of players, the caster can deal many times more damage than they could ordinarily do by themselves.

[LonelyGaruga]

More like a couple times, since it only does a small fraction of what those players do, but yeah. It's always worth using for like, Apos or Magatsu down phases. It applies wind weakness so wind weak bosses aren't a bad place to use it either.

Ares potential only adds like 1.2% actual damage though, since Zanverse is 0.2 * 1.06 = 0.212. So not a big deal.

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

More like a couple times, since it only does a small fraction of what those players do, but yeah. It's always worth using for like, Apos or Magatsu down phases. It applies wind weakness so wind weak bosses aren't a bad place to use it either.

Ares potential only adds like 1.2% actual damage though, since Zanverse is 0.2 * 1.06 = 0.212. So not a big deal.

That explains why I saw no noteable change in zanverse damage with weapon potentials to the point I didn't think they did anything for zanverse...

[milranduil]

That explains why I saw no noteable change in zanverse damage with weapon potentials to the point I didn't think they did anything for zanverse...

Best thing to use with zanverse would just be +31 windmill and craft it for say gu (gu/te zanverse op).

[Maninbluejumpsuit]

Best thing to use with zanverse would just be +31 windmill and craft it for say gu (gu/te zanverse op).

I heard of it.

[LonelyGaruga]

Perfect Keeper, High Time, and Wind Mastery skills (including potential) apply to Zanverse. 0.2 * 1.16 * 1.2 * 1.2 * 1.2 * 1.2 = 0.48. Pretty big improvement.

[Z-0]

Don't forget Shifta Strike

[Raujinn]

Maybe one day I'll get my hands on an Ares sword. I'm planning to obtain at least two of the purple sun-god weapons (whatever they're called) in part to fill out gear gaps and cause I just like their skins that much. Ares is still superior to those weapons but fuck Anga.

[LonelyGaruga]

Don't forget Shifta Strike

Oh I was just counting stuff it could do by itself, since SS is Te main only. Wasn't sure if you'd have a Techer main and a Gu/Te in the MPA for organized runs normally. 0.52 Zanverse damage with Shifta Strike, pretty good.

[Flaoc]

Not brought up as a factor in this discussion. If this thread was about that, then yeah, that's a given.

oh was just putting that as a possible reason someone would get ideal karen. i do agree with you on the can freely use pb for hatou part though.

[SlN]

imo Anything with high single target damage is good for bossing use ideal , ares for any kind of aoe mobbing, and slave is very strong when building the gauge for the ares.